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Episode 3: St. Paul Landmarks · Being Minnesotan

• Bryan Clapper: So Brian, our last episode, we interviewed Julie Blaha at an event that featured crop art. Yes. Now, Julie sent me home with a with a project. With homework. With homework. Yes. Can I show you what I make? Absolutely. Crop art button. That's amazing. I'm so proud of it. Welcome to Being Minnesotan, the official pod show for the Marnie Gellner fan club and the keepers of Paul Allen's deep dark secret. In this episode, we're talking about St. Paul landmarks with the state capitol's biggest fan, seeing the city from the top of one of its most iconic buildings, and being serenaded in St. Paul's favorite park. With some apologies to our audio-only listeners, this episode is heavy on the visuals, so you may want to check out the YouTube version. This is episode 3 with your hosts Emeline Childs and Brian Clapper. We join them now on the Sky Glider at the Minnesota State Fair. Okay, so what are we doing today? ⁓ we're here to talk about landmarks. Okay, I think we picked an appropriate place. I think so too. If the fair was going, we had this this is a landmark. Well, I mean right there is the grandstand. That's no landmark. That is iconic. Yes. ⁓ one thing that's in front of us is the giant Ferris wheel that I think has become a huge symbol of the fair. Yes, although this year it's changed somewhat controversially. It's changed, we don't need to talk about it. Yeah, okay. But you can see the Minneapolis skyline from here, which is also iconic, although this week we're talking about St. Paul. We are, and if you look in the other direction, you can see St. Paul. This is true, you can. Although I can I think it's over there. No, it's back behind us to the right. You think I know after all these years. I should know. I was born in St. Paul, which is why I have a soft spot in my heart for it. Yep. Okay. ⁓ and growing up, my mom worked at children's hospital. Yes. ⁓ and so I remember going to daycare in downtown St. Paul and like this is the early eighties. So walking up the hill to the cathedral from downtown St. Paul with like twenty kids and two adults. Because it was the eighties and they just like. Yeah. And then my dad was the manager of the St. Paul tape plant for 3M, so that was another like sort of Saint Paul icon until it was torn down. Yeah. I just you know, and my my grandfather worked in the first national bank building, so just a lot of special places for me in St. Paul. Yeah. And I'm excited to talk about it. I think so many people talk know Minneapolis more than Saint Paul, but Saint Paul really has the mo I think the iconic landmarks. Yeah, I mean the ⁓ nothing wrong with Minneapolis, but we're blessed with like, you know, two cities that have really their own character and their own identity and Their own sets of landmarks, so it's pretty cool. Yeah, it is. Brian, what makes a landmark? It's a good question. I'm sure there's some like technical definition that I don't know. Yeah. Or can't think of at the moment, but to me it's it's if you can describe a building and say it's, you know, the first national bank building or it's the capital, and like just in one word and people know what it means, to me that means it's a landmark. I agree, and I think people think of Empire State Building and the Eiffel Tower or the Coliseum. But it's also like your neighbor's mailbox that fell over a few years ago and they never fixed it. Take a ride at the mailbox that fell on the ground. It in my neighborhood I'm the yellow mailbox, so we probably tell people we're the house with the yellow mailbox. You that landmark. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's so it's a place that people recognize. It's something that's interesting that grabs attention, I think. Sure. ⁓ and I think it's extra fun when there's a landmark that you've seen on TV. or in movies or on a postcard and then you get to see it in real life. You get to see it IRL and you're like, it's real. ⁓ my gosh. Can I I'm trying to think now that we're talking about landmarks and specifically in Saint Paul and you mentioned movies. Yep. I'm trying to remember any specific movies that have Saint Paul icons or landmarks that you remember. Well I can think of the Mighty Ducks. Okay. Having basically every single one of the landmarks. Yes. They're at Mickey's Diner. Yep. They're at the Mall of America. Yep. They are going through downtown Saint Paul. I don't remember downtown Saint Paul. I remember is it Baker Square they were going through or was it I now it now I have to watch the movie again. I think that's a good reason to watch it. You don't need a good reason to watch Mighty Ducks. Come on. No, you don't. You can watch it any day. Right. It holds up. It's always good. I'm I'm thinking of the Arnold Schwarzenegger movie. The Christmas one. Shingle All the Way. Shingle All the Way. Where he has to push his car from the Hennepin Avenue Bridge all the way to Mickey's Diner in Saint Paul. It's like, you know, I don't know, like almost ten miles. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally feasible. Like the totally feasible artificial stitching together of landmarks when nobody outside of Minnesota knows that those are landmarks. Right. They just randomly picked Yeah, it's just a city. He had a push car down a road. Yeah. I wonder how weird we look to people coming the other direction that were both just like sitting casually holding microphones. I think by weird you meant incredibly cool. Yes. And important. ⁓ you know I probably should have asked before we started this, are you afraid of heights? No. Okay, good. No. Good. I'm afraid of dropping. ⁓ Fair, that's fair. I'm not so much afraid of the heights. I'm afraid of the gap between where we are and the ground. No, I'm really not. We have decided for this episode to focus on Saint Paul. Yes. But as we know, there are endless landmarks across Minnesota. ⁓ absolutely. That's why we can only like rather than trying to say we're just gonna call it landmarks and do like I I don't want people to feel like it needs to be exhaustive. Right. So this one we're doing Saint Paul, we'll do Minneapolis eventually. I think you had mentioned a different city to do. Duluth. Yes, absolutely. Duluth Yep. Or the North Shore. There's just so much to see up there. I think the North Shore, yeah, definitely. Split Rock Lighthouse, the lift break the North Shore warrants its own episode, as does Duluth and yeah these people are looking at us like we're completely nice. I know. 'Cause we are a little bit, I think. I think so. Have you found like You had to come out of your shell a little bit in making content and just not care that people were watching you be silly in front of your camera. Yeah, thankfully I got over that years ago. Yeah. ⁓ I have no problem with it. I'm just now getting over it. Yeah. Like even a couple months ago I would like hide in a corner to do stuff and today, like, no problem, I'll stand in front of the dairy case and do a stand up. Absolutely. I do try to get out of people's way. Yeah. ⁓ but I have no problem filming in front of people anymore. How's it going? I know we look silly as hell. So Brian, we're back on solid ground. Yes. I kinda like it in the air better. Yeah, it was fun. I think the view is better. I think we looked I like I said, we look really silly riding the sky glider with our microphones. No, you we did a survey, you asked somebody and they said that we did not look silly. All right. So I stand by that. We looked very cool and important. ⁓ yes, very cool and important is right. But our view now is a parking lot. So I think I preferred the skyliner around. Yeah, me too. ⁓ behind us is the space Tower? I was gonna call it the space needle. The space tower. Do you ever go on the space thingy? Years and years ago I did. you know it was closed down for so long. I think I fell out of love with that. You're right. It makes you kind of like, ⁓ I could go without that. But then one of my favorite buildings is right behind that, which is the horticulture building. Yes. Because it feels like Like every other building I I should say not every, but most of the other buildings feel like they've changed, they've updated. Yeah. ⁓ that one feels like it did probably in the nineteen forties when my grandparents would go through it. The lettering on the walls, all of it is the same. I guess I don't look at the floor, but it's probably like asbestos flooring. It's probably, you know, and and I can confirm that the urinals are probably from the forties too. ⁓ for sure those bathrooms have not been touched. But I think also, you know, kind of coming back to being Minnesotan The Ag Hort Building as I call it, ⁓ is I think one of the more special ones to me because there's the flowers and the vegetables and the fruits and then there's always the art in the center and like so many things come together and of course the crop art, ⁓ but so many things come together in that building. I just think it's just like the creative activities building, it feels like the fair. Like it feels like nothing is out of place where I feel like some of the other buildings it's like, well do they we really have to have this booth for like rope licorice or whatever. But there it's all fair related stuff. It is. You know, we talk so much about food and all of the new things and but but it's the classics that really keep me coming back at least. Me too. Yeah. So ⁓ I think that we have a really exciting episode coming up. Like we said, this is going to focus on Saint Paul. Yes. ⁓ but we have so much more of Minnesota to explore. And we we will before everybody makes nasty comments, we will get to the other cities. Yes, we will. We're just picking Saint Paul first because it's the best. That was Brian's words. No. Not mine. Well, should we get to it? Yes, let's go. Let's do it. The Minnesota State Capitol Building in St. Paul has been the seat of our government for more than 120 years, opening in 1905 after a nine-year construction. It was designed by local architect Cass Gilbert and underwent a $300 million restoration ten years ago. And when we decided to include it in an episode about St. Paul landmarks, We could think of no one better to show us around than Mary Lehammer, a longtime political reporter and producer for Minnesota PBS and co-host of the Spin Sisters podcast. Mary has won more than a dozen regional Emmys, been named one of the best Capitol Reporters in America by the Washington Post, and you can catch her on Almanac on Minnesota PBS every Friday evening. Welcome to my house. No, it's the people's house. But I think you are the best choice to show us around here because legislators come and go, governors come and go. You've been here how long? My whole life and I'm not gonna tell you how old I am, but I grew up here. My dad was a political reporter before me, so I've been running around. The joke is that maybe I took my first steps like in the press alcos on the house floor with him. Yeah. Nice. But ⁓ how long have you been working here as a Okay, that part I'll tell you. I I I'm coming up almost on thirty years working for public television here, yeah. And what are your earliest memories of this building? I sent a story on the AP wire at two years old. I sat down on like a teletype and sent it out on the wire. And the story is that my dad wasn't mad. He was actually like kinda happy. I banged it out. There were no like words or a good lead or anything. It was not A P style. But all I've ever wanted to do since I could like walk, talk, breathe, was to be a political reporter here. See, and I find that interesting because often when you're forced to be somewhere as a kid, you kind of resent it and yet here you are, thriving. So tell us a little bit about like what keeps you going, what you find so interesting. look up. This is the most beautiful building in the Definitely in Minnesota, maybe America to work in. So I fell in love at first sight here and still pinch myself every day that I get to go to work here. It's slightly different than my ⁓ at home office. I will tell you that. Yes. So it sounds like maybe the building draws you back to the work more so than the politics? I still really like the politics. I'm strange and optimistic and just weird that way. There are really good, interesting people who still work in Minnesota politics and the characters. I love the characters that voters keep sending here. Yes. Yes. It really is representative of all of us right here in this building. No one's turned away. Everyone's welcome to be here. And then the stories that we get as a result are incredible. Especially like the governors. I mean, the first governor I remember as a kid was the dentist from Hibbing, Rudy Purpich, my dad covered. Then the first governor I covered professionally was A professional wrestler. ⁓ Jesse the body Ventura. I mean it's incredible. Jackal, it is a jackal badge and I do have it. And at the time my photographer was offered five hundred bucks on the street for it. They were collectors items. ⁓ what do you think it'd be worth today? Not much. No, okay. No. I I never got one, but a reporter who worked for me covered A a fishing opener, a governor's fishing opener, and she got an official jackal badge. That's right, because you are still kind of a jackal or a former jackal. Former jackal. Okay. Yeah, yeah. So you're gonna show us around a little bit. are you gonna do you wanna surprise us later or would you share what your favorite part of the Capitol is? My favorite thing about the Capitol is the stories about it. So the architect Cass Gilbert grew up here. He is from St. Paul. He grew up playing on this field. This was the destiny of his life. He restored homes in the area. He built his resume. He was not even chosen the first kind of round. So a second round went in. And I told you he's in the building. And he is. I'll show you where he is hidden, the architect. And then he went on to become one of the most famous architects in America. He went on to do the U.S. Supreme Court building. He assembled all the best muralists in America. There is a statistic that if you took all of the art in this building and rated it Per square foot, what it would sell for, that there is a billion dollars worth of art. And we almost lost it. ⁓ so this restoration that went on about a decade ago now, top to bottom $300 million restoration, which we got to document in our documentary, which we spent 10 years on documentary. There was a four-year restoration. Look up, those paintings were falling. A chunk of one of those delaminated. They're all canvas. They're not painted on the walls. They're painted on canvas. Adhered to the plaster. And because the exterior of the building is marble, marble is porous, marble leaks. Yeah. It fell off. ⁓ to the ground. We nearly lost. Many of these had big slices through them, had horrific restoration. They were crumbling. The building was crumbling. There was scaffolding. In order to walk up to the building, You had to go underneath scaffolding so that chunks that marble didn't fall off and kill or maim you. That's what was happening. Is I had no idea that it was that bad. It was that bad. And lawmakers didn't want to spend money on themselves because they used to office in this building. The state senate used to be in this building. Now they have their own new building across the hall there, across the street there. And House members have their new expansive building going, because one senator's got a new one, now the House members need one. So they kicked the senators out. And lawmakers wouldn't approve all that new spending for themselves. So there was like a biblical act of God that happened during session when they were refusing to spend the money, even while the building was crumbling and paintings were falling and marble was falling. There was a flood. ⁓ Literal, like yes, act of biblical flood. Biblical portions. There was a flood in the building during session and then suddenly all the money went through. So you know, it's actually sounds like all the rest of us homeowners that we don't want to spend the money on all the little things until it's too late. What what year did the restoration start? So it finished in 2017 and then it started the four years prior to that. Okay. Can you tell us a little bit more about your documentary? What's it called? Where can people find it? And tell us a little bit about it. They can find it on the Minnesota PBS website. It's calling called Restoring the People's House. And the most fun part was climbing the scaffolding. My amazing photographer Scott Trotman and I got to climb about 10, 12 times, about a dozen times. All the way to the tippy top of the dome, up there with the electro leer. Inside and outside, we climbed to the top of the dome outside and to the top of the dome inside. And this chandelier look up there. How tall do you think that is? It's like tall. Taller than a human, six, seven feet tall for the record. ⁓ sorry. The actual little chandelier is taller than a human. You could fit inside and there isn't a door big enough to take it out. So during the restoration, they just wrapped it. and they kept it inside because they they literally bubble wrapped it. So we went up there many, many times. And it is so important because this was the first public electrified building in the state. So when Minnesotans came here in nineteen ⁓ five when it opened, it was almost a scary experience to see electricity. Sure. If you can think and go back in their shoes, and that was probably the first electric chandelier. most Minnesotans had ever seen. So cool. And all these lights are still the original lights that people saw for the first time. Beautiful. At the turn of the century. Was that like a drawing point? Did people come to see that? Or was it just like we're here what is going on? And the Civil War. If you look around you, these are all Civil War veterans and heroes. So the Civil War veterans were passing away at the time. So this is very much a memorial to them. And we were very proud we had the first Minnesota The first volunteers in the Civil War, we like to think that we kind of saved the Union. And if you look behind you, what president is there? That would be old Abe Lincoln. Yeah, that's who our governor volunteered the first Minnesota troops to. So Abe Lincoln, and that is considered one of the best portraits of Abe. So if you had ⁓ 30 seconds in an elevator with somebody and you had to tell them why the Minnesota State Capitol is the best in the nation, what would you say? Architecturally, it is the second largest self-supporting marble dome in the world. Only Rome has a better dome and that one belongs to the Pope. This one belongs to all of us. I almost don't believe that. Like that seems so wild that that is right here in St. Paul. That a kid who grew up in Saint Paul came up with the idea to make this here. Yeah. I mean, ugh, it's incredible. Like we always say, Vinnesotans aren't very good about bragging about ourselves. I think in other states this would like everybody would know that. If it was New York, they would have it Billboards about It's right now. And one more factoid, when you come up, and we talked about the gold, the quadriga that you see out front, the gold statue, the horses, that was done by probably the best sculptor in American history, Daniel Chester French, who did the Lincoln Memorial. So the best of the best, the best muralists did all of the art inside, and the best person who did all the most important statues in American history also did ours. I mean, this place. So your your dad was he worked for AP and Star Tribune? Yes, yeah, and New York Times too. New York Times. So what years was he here? Well, forever. So he he actually worked for the AP fifty years in total because he's like a mathematical genius and he was the guy who called all the races for the AP every election night. Ooh, big job. Never got a race wrong his whole life. So every time you hear the AP has called the race for Jesse Ventura. That was his job. Amazing. Yeah. That is incre I've I've always thought that. Who's making that call? Now I know. I'm just trying to d to determine like has there been a gap in a La Hammer working at the Capitol? There has not. We actually overlapped one year. When I was an intern for Almanac at Public T V, it was his last full year, full time here for the Associated Press. So we overlapped one year. Okay, so probably since The six is when we overlapped. We started in the late sixties. Yeah, but I'm not gonna let you date me. You keep trying to figure out how old I am. Never ask a lady that long. I have an I mean, I'm just this I just think it's really cool that a member of your family has been covering the Capitol that long. Well over half a century, I'll give you that much. That's great. We'll return to the Capitol for more with Mary La Hammer, but first let's jog across downtown. In a city full of iconic buildings, the State Capitol, the Cathedral, Summit Avenue Mansions, there's even a building called the Landmark Center. Perhaps no single building can claim the title of St. Paul's most iconic more appropriately than this one. And the flashing red first symbol is a not-so-subtle clue. So we're talking about landmarks in this episode. And as I'm thinking of landmarks in St. Paul, is there any that tops this? What we like to think there isn't. ⁓ so the number one sign behind us is we feel the most identifiable icon for downtown city. And the number one is maybe like a dead giveaway. It is a dead giveaway. That's Rick Rossi, the general manager of the first national bank building. He's worked here in every capacity imaginable since the nineteen eighties. To follow him around the building is to see what forty years of accumulated knowledge about one single city block looks like. So here's a drop box that was available from street level for if you were customer of the bank, the bank and the security and the structure. If you're familiar with some of the history of St. Paul, so there was it had quite a a gangster reputation. And so these were actually used in in the field to put up the West Tower. in the 30s, ⁓ or late twenties and early 30s when they were working on it. Of course was the fact that they were armed and consequently they had to qualify for to prove that they could handle their weapons, I believe their pistols and Thomson machine guns. And this was the area where we where they had done that practicing and how many keys do you have there, Rick? Obviously too many. The first National Bank building was built in three phases: a sixteen-story East Tower built in nineteen fourteen, the thirty-two-story West Tower built in nineteen thirty-one, and a seven-story North Tower built in nineteen seventy-one. Inside you'll find a time capsule of nineteen thirties art deco, especially in its grand lobby and skyway levels. But it's most recognizable for the 50-foot tall three-sided red first sign constructed in the early 1930s, illuminated for all to see apart from a decade during the 1970s energy crisis, and until 2024, when defrayed maintenance caught up with the then owners of the building and forced them to turn the sign off. However, a seven million dollar investment by the new owners, the Downtown Revival Trust, included upgrading the sign, and it was turned on again August 6th. The sign was a Great representation of I I feel ⁓ the current condition of St. Paul in many regards and the fact that it's relit and and and now well maintained again is is a great ⁓ hallmark to what's happening in downtown in general. But there's more to the building than just its iconic topper. There's also the first modern skyway in the midwest connecting the seventeenth floor of the West Tower to the sixteenth floor of the East Tower. And there are remnants of the building's start as a bank headquarters as well. Including multiple huge vaults in the basement, even a shooting range for the now defunct First National Bank Police Force, which is actually underneath the sidewalk on 4th Street. The First National Bank building was the tallest in St. Paul from 1931 until 1986, and is now just the third tallest. But for many St. Paul natives, it will always be number one. Alright, we're gonna get back to Mary Le Hammer in a second, but first we're gonna quiz Emiline on her knowledge of St. Paul landmarks. I'm very excited. I love trivia. I I need to be clear, just because I love it doesn't mean I'm good at it. I'm just gonna set expectations. Okay, first question. What is the oldest commercial building in St. Paul that is still standing? Commercial building. Mm-hmm. The landmark center. It's not the oldest. ⁓ but it but it was a commercial building? Yes, but it's not the type of building you think. It it is Waldman Brewery, which was opened in eighteen fifty seven. It's just a small little shack of a place. Cool. What is the tallest building in Saint Paul? The Eco Lab building. You're close. It's the Wells Fargo Place. Four hundred and seventy one feet. Cool. Followed by Jackson Tower and First National Bank at four hundred and two. All right. What is the largest residential home in Saint Paul? ⁓ I'm between two. Okay. I'm going to go James J. Hill. You are correct mostly. Okay. What's the mostly? Well, because it is the largest residence, it's thirty six thousand square feet, but it's not really a residence anymore. It's a museum at most place now. That's why I was questioning. I was going to say the governor's mansion. No. Okay. Well I I did do some quick searching though. ⁓ the largest home sold in St. Paul so far in 2026 was 8,500 square feet, which is tiny compared to the 36,000 square foot James J. Hill house. And the largest sold in the last ten years was 15,500 square feet. These houses are just out there. People are buying ⁓ What do you do for a living? Let me know. Give us your t your tips and tricks. All right, what is ⁓ what is Summit Avenue known for? They're mansions. But like there's there's some definitive way that Saint Paul brags about Summit Avenue as being ⁓ the most historic registry of mansions? You're close. It's the longest continuous stretch of preserved Victorian era residential architecture in the United States. Yeah, it's like I just know it as I go I go I drive down it and my jaw's on the floor is is how I think of Summit. Yep. Okay, final final question here. The ⁓ traditional definition of a skyscraper is a building over three hundred feet tall. How many of those exist in Saint Paul? Seven. Almost there. Fourteen. Inc including the Cathedral of Saint Paul, which was the city's tallest building from nineteen fifteen to nineteen thirty-one. And the tallest building before that was the first one sort of called a skyscraper in Saint Paul, even though it's not three hundred feet. ⁓ do you know which building that was? Absolutely no clue. Okay, the pioneer building. Which is part of what is now the Pioneer Endicott building. But the Pioneer Building was only 226 feet, so we wouldn't even really call it a skyscraper anymore. Nah, just a tiny little building. Okay. Well let's go back to the Capitol with Mary. One of my favorite little tidbits in a mural. If you look up here, do you see the woman? And by the way, they're mostly naked. There's a lot of skin because this is classical, beautiful art formed. But the woman here in the middle, do you see what she's holding? She's the Capitol in her arms inside the Capitol. That is a perfect model of the state capitol, this capital inside the Capitol. ⁓ my gosh. Do you see her up there in the middle? Yes. Yeah, so I love that little detail. Yeah. And there was like a huge like slit and crack, and so all of this was restored. And then above that, above the windows, there are 12 lunettes up there, and those are the 12 zodiac signs. And every single one of those beautiful little angelic cherubs has a unique face and they're all gazing in a different direction. Amazing. So it's just a fun tidbit here. ⁓ super cool. And then also stars are everywhere. So down here you can see how many stars there are in brass, in glass, in marble, in stone. That's a fun game to play with kids. If you come here with kids, I always would have kids count how many stars because Le Trois du Nord, Star of the North, is our motto. And you will see stars everywhere. And ⁓ the star in our flag was inspired by this, wasn't it? Yes. Yes. Yeah. Don't believe the conspiracy theories. This is the inspiration. Yes, you can't look at it and think any different. Absolutely. It's so beautiful. And these are all these Civil War veterans. Remember, I told you about this is like a monument to the Civil War. There's a brigadier general from the Civil War. And all their toes are kind of worn down because it's good luck to rub their toes. Your bills might pass if you rub their toes, all the brass. But the historical society doesn't want me to tell you that. So why can you see more beautiful? Do you know where the marble, granite, what is this? Marble? So some of it came from France, but some of it in the middle, the granite actually came from Minnesota. ⁓ good. Because Cass Gilbert was getting some heat that he was importing too much stuff from Europe, from out east, so then he had to bring in some Minnesota materials. So in the center, those are Minnesota materials. But a lot of it was France, because of course all the best design stuff comes from France. He kind of knew what he was doing there. In the Senate. Chamber. They're up there. But if you scooch, so if you come here, you have to stand right here. And if you stand right there and if you look up in the left hand corner, maybe you stand there and see if you can see. Two and Brian, can you see two men who look completely out of place because they are the profiles of turn of the century figures? That's Cass Gilbert. ⁓ I thought maybe you meant like physically his body was buried somewhere. Well I had to tease. It's called a tease until He had himself depicted in the building. Of course. Very cool. Yes. Why wouldn't you? And that next to him is Channing Seabury who got him the commission. So that was a thank you for giving me the job. And here I am. So those two dudes are hidden in that piece of art. So there's Cass Gilbert. Not his body. No. But his face. I'm a little disappointed it's not. I know, I know. I did that to you on purpose. And when you come during session, this is super fun because it's packed with like lobbyists. I've ever seen it. Yeah, it's It's so quiet right now. The energy is amazing during session. So one really fun thing that we discovered during the restoration up here, you see these lovely female forms. At one point in history, people decided we didn't want to look at that much skin and it had been painted over and we shrouded the female form and they discovered during the restoration the goal was to take it back to its original. So now we get to see those lovely ladies. And that's a lot I mean it's the same you hear a lot of that happening in Rome and in Italy. Yep. So that is the original form, not the covered ⁓ female form. The other thing you'll notice here is the legislative body in the state senate. Overlooking and balancing power out is our Supreme Court. So this is the literal balance of power depicted in architecture, which I think is so cool. Here's the check and balance. Yeah. Right there. So our state Supreme Court, they also have their own building, but they do meet here on occasion. Is this more like the ceremonial meeting place? Ceremonial, but they do actually hear arguments and hold session here. I don't So if you look in the artwork is pretty incredible. And the people depicted, it's just Moses, Confucius, Socrates, yes, all the basis of laws. And all of this art had been completely shrouded under dirt, varnish, and smoke. You didn't even know that these colors were this vibrant. ⁓ It's just beautiful. And these, again, the best muralists in American history did these. Do you know any background on how the murals were decided? Cass Gilbert hired the best, most expensive. 7% of the original budget went to art, which is unheard of right now. It sounds like maybe he was able to make a lot of decisions, like less of a decision by committee that we might expect today. Yes. Do you think that helped with sort of the overall vision of the building being? We've seen his letters and his writing. And yes, how almost dictatorial he was about this is the vision, even to these very high falluting artists. Yeah, and some of them were at the end of their career, they were already the most famous sculptors and the most famous painter in America. And some of these were like their magnum opus in the end of their careers in their 70s. And some of them were saying to Cass Gilbert, you know, boy, young man, don't tell me what to do. And he he did. Yeah, some of them. communication is pretty harsh. I I just wonder if if if you know we we're talking about the sort of ⁓ revamp of the office building and I'm sure a lot more committees are going to be involved in that than the design of this. I wonder if it's going to feel as grand and opulent and sort of singular in its vision. It it won't because nothing will be this expensive and this grand ever again. But architecturally it has to fit in because this set the bar high and nothing can look awful next to the Capitol. Right. But nothing Will ever be this grand and beautiful again. Yeah. It's impossible. Yeah. Como Park sits on more than 700 acres on the northern border of St. Paul, and the park itself, as well as the zoo and the Marjorie McNeely Conservatory, are destinations for residents and tourists alike. Nearly 2 million people visit the park each year, many making a stop in the conservatory, which was built in 1913 and added to the National Register of Historic Places in 1974. It's the perfect place to catch up with Eli Gardner, a Minneapolis based singer songwriter. Whose latest EP Sliver was released in March. He's played hundreds of live shows and been featured on backroads on PBS as well as local radio. You can learn more online at elygardner.com. Well, I'm originally from the UP of Michigan. And I moved here to the Twin Cities ⁓ about eight years ago and kind of just jumped right in, started meeting people, put out an album in 2020 called The Fire in the Medicine, and that was kind my statement would be like hey here I am I'm and ⁓ this is what I do. And why did you choose the Twin Cities over say like Chicago or somewhere else? ⁓ just kind of work reasons. It worked out. But then I I love it's Twin Cities has has everything I like to do. I'm I'm a former ⁓ hockey player, play junior hockey and I love playing music and I I think the ⁓ music scene in Twin Cities is just amazing. You live in Minneapolis now? Yes. What are some landmarks that stand out to you about the Saint Paul side of the river? Have you spent much time over here? Yeah, yeah, I've been through Saint Paul. right off the bat, just the river itself running right downtown and then the many bridges that are over there. I think that's a very unique feature. What are some of your musical influences? ⁓ early on, stuff like Bob Dylan, N Neil Young. Yep. ⁓ I grew up listening to Jim Croce. Okay. ⁓ James Taylor, that kind of stuff. Very nice. Very nice. And what inspires you as a songwriter? To me, I'm always trying to capture a mood, trying to capture ⁓ a feeling. And so I've kind of learned as I've done this to recognize those things. So the biggest thing is getting it down in its truest form. Yeah. ⁓ And like the song American Hypocrisy comes from a frustration. You know, I wrote it this past winter, you know, when the ice occupation was happening. And so that kind of thing I think helps to f first first of all helps me personally deal with whatever's going on. Sure. And then hopefully, you know, because of the music I like, hopefully other people can can kind of, you know, see that and and learn. know, feel inspired or just feel of some sort of ⁓ you know, help. Sure with whatever they're going through. Pull the trigger I can see your eyes. The gun in your hand amplifies your lies. The color of my skin, the narrative device. Don't pull the trigger. Pull the trigger, the red, white, and blue. Everything you decide is from what you deem is true. Your tears of gold, they say you're right in everything you do. So don't pull the trigger. Street but don't believe what you see the escalation of atrocity, call it tradition the ordinary, call it the American hypocrisy, call it the American hypocrisy. Pull the trigger, don't you look away, don't even pretend you know how to pray. Cradle my body just for today. Pull the trigger. Street, but don't believe what you see, it's the escalation of atrocity. Call it tradition, the ordinary, call it the American hypocrisy, it's the American hypocrisy. The trigger, look towards the love, look up in the sky, the eagle can fly with the dove. We all have scars, I know you've had enough. So don't pull the trigger. the trigger. As someone who was born in Minneapolis and didn't spend a ton of time in Saint Paul until I got a little older, I fall more and more in love with it. What is the superior city? You you keep saying that. Trying to get us cancel over. I love, love, love so many different areas of the Twin Cities, but ⁓ there really are a lot of treasures in Saint Paul. I think it's a bit underrated. No, ⁓ absolutely and I think we we've gotta come back and do the cathedral, we've gotta come back. ⁓ you know, and and even the ra have you been inside the Ramsey County Courthouse? I don't think I have. It is one of the coolest buildings I've ever seen. Like the inside is so like Art Deco, Art Nouveau, it's so cool. So we'll definitely have been in Saint Paul. Yeah, absolutely. we we should probably say thank you to ⁓ Mary La Hammer for Dragging us around the Capitol and pointing out all the cool stuff. That was a lot of fun though. Yes, it was. Yeah, you did a lot of heavy lifting this week. I well, just it it is what it is. Rick Rossi ⁓ First National Bank Building, big thanks to him. Big thanks to Eli Gardner for ⁓ braving the elements to stand out in front of total strangers in the middle of the sun, ⁓ in front of Como Conservatory and and and plays a guitar. It was really, you know, it it's not a easy place to play to be literally standing in a sidewalk with a camera in front of you and microphones in front of you and he did a great job. So I was really appreciative of that. I love that. That's great. We love our nat natural studios originally. Yes. Well, I don't how do we end this without like standing up and I was gonna say was stand up and leave. Is there a Minnesota goodbye equivalent for like a a zoom meeting like you're on I you wave and then you just like keep smiling and wave. You smiling until the the host pushes the end meeting for all, so you're not the rude person leaving early. Yeah. Okay. Right. Great. Okay, fine. And I'll end it there.