Latest / Just Heal with Dr Jay / Anger Is Really Unhealed Pain with Michael Jai White

Transcript

Anger Is Really Unhealed Pain with Michael Jai White · Just Heal with Dr Jay

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Welcome to jess Hell with Doctor j a production of
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: the Black Effect Podcast Network and iHeartRadio.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: What's up, good people.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: I am Doctor Jay and we're back for another episode
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: with just Here with Doctor J Burnett. And today I
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: am blessed with the opportunity to sit down with a legend,
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: a hero to me personally because I grew up watching Spawn.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: So we have actor, writer, director, and we all know
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: man his work in the martial art world. I mean, listen, listen.
• 0:30
  Speaker 3: Some of y'all was old Steven Seagard, I was all
• 0:32
  Speaker 3: Michael John White Man, So, my brother, I am so
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: happy to have today our guest, Michael John White starring
• 0:40
  Speaker 3: in the film The Secret Between Us Man.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: My brother, welcome, thanks for having me. Listen. You guys
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: shut your hand. Look, I'm like, man, please don't cut
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: right of chip.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: No man, brother, listen, Man as somebody man who loves
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: the movie Spawn. Man, that's when I came to know
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: you as a young team. And you watched that film
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: in college all the time it was on DVD and Walmart.
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: Walmart used to do the two for twenty DVDs, and
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: so I wouldn't there grabbed that man, And they're so
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: A huge fan of your work, man, but even more
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: a huge fan of the life that.
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: You lead outside of your heart.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: And so watching your podcast and then just watching you
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: do interviews, man, and so it's a blessing to have you.
• 1:27
  Speaker 4: Man, I'm supremely blessed because you know, I had a
• 1:33
  Speaker 4: life that it could have gotten the other direction, Yes, sir, Yeah, so.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: When you when you think about that, a life that
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: could have gone in a direction. I know we were
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: just kind of talking earlier and you said a seed.
• 1:45
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, someone came along. I spoke at my high
• 1:49
  Speaker 4: school kind of planning the seed. It was a guy
• 1:52
  Speaker 4: who was a lawyer, and he said something about he
• 1:54
  Speaker 4: earned his walk and there's something kind of connected with me,
• 1:58
  Speaker 4: and then planning the seed that made me think, you know,
• 2:00
  Speaker 4: he could do it.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: I could do it. You know.
• 2:02
  Speaker 4: I knew I had street skills and I could probably
• 2:05
  Speaker 4: survive off of those like a lot of people. But
• 2:07
  Speaker 4: I thought there was something more, and it was a
• 2:10
  Speaker 4: there was a something to why I was so angry
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: and volatile, And what it was is because there was
• 2:17
  Speaker 4: images that I wanted to be that I hadn't seen,
• 2:20
  Speaker 4: you know. So another scene was when I saw a
• 2:23
  Speaker 4: young black, attractive couple moving into a big, old house.
• 2:27
  Speaker 4: And I said, ah, that's what I want, that's what
• 2:30
  Speaker 4: I want. I know, education got them that, you know,
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: and nobody was gonna come repossess that house, you know.
• 2:38
  Speaker 4: And those images, just those images alone changed my life.
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 2:44
  Speaker 4: I overnight I started doing my schoolwork. Uh, put myself
• 2:52
  Speaker 4: up in a higher grade. Uh you know, the kind
• 2:56
  Speaker 4: of the gifted class, you know, you know, the uh
• 3:01
  Speaker 4: what do you call them? The advisors was like, no,
• 3:04
  Speaker 4: you can't do this or whatever. But I'd forge my parents'
• 3:08
  Speaker 4: signature that you know, that whole thing. And you know,
• 3:11
  Speaker 4: I ended up having more over one hundred average.
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: I would do my.
• 3:17
  Speaker 4: Work plus extra credit, just to prove that I could
• 3:21
  Speaker 4: do it. And my life changed. And later on I
• 3:25
  Speaker 4: became a teacher at that school before I was an actor. Yeah,
• 3:28
  Speaker 4: but you know, and I received an award and all
• 3:32
  Speaker 4: this kind of stuff and kind of a scholarship and
• 3:36
  Speaker 4: I got this award as this most self improved And
• 3:40
  Speaker 4: I'll tell you, like, I probably had about twelve to
• 3:44
  Speaker 4: fifteen shootouts before that, you know. And so my life,
• 3:50
  Speaker 4: you know, one of the things I say was my
• 3:52
  Speaker 4: one of my real jobs is going back and planning.
• 3:55
  Speaker 4: Seems like it was planning for me because I believe
• 3:58
  Speaker 4: if that man didn't come to my scho cool.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: I wouldn't be sitting here right now.
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And so here I am returning to West Dallas
• 4:05
  Speaker 4: in South oak Cliffe when I would come and over years,
• 4:11
  Speaker 4: you know, we'd come and speak in those places, and
• 4:14
  Speaker 4: I've watched things change and get better. The Community Center
• 4:18
  Speaker 4: in South oak Cliffe, I've watched that develop into something else.
• 4:21
  Speaker 4: And actually, one of one of the greatest things I
• 4:24
  Speaker 4: ever really experienced is that a young man that was
• 4:30
  Speaker 4: at my first speaking.
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: At in South oak Cliffe.
• 4:38
  Speaker 4: Came back and was an advisor like a counselor, which
• 4:45
  Speaker 4: was something like twelve years later.
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 4:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah, And that was one of the things that told
• 4:49
  Speaker 4: me I'm doing the right thing.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: Let me ask you this two days, I'll go back
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: to the angle part. But before we go back to that,
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: how did that feel for you? For that young man,
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: this is your first speaking engagement and to think that
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: what was done to you was happening for someone else,
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: how did that make you feel?
• 5:09
  Speaker 4: Yeah? It made me feel amazing, because I mean when
• 5:12
  Speaker 4: I came back was several years later with the help
• 5:16
  Speaker 4: of I was more established in everything. And Tony White,
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: who's a good friend and producer here and Dallas. He's
• 5:25
  Speaker 4: done a lot of faith based type of movies. He
• 5:29
  Speaker 4: helped organize this, you know, this tour I was doing,
• 5:35
  Speaker 4: and a young man in the parking lot seemed to
• 5:39
  Speaker 4: have like this little secret he was holding. Like I
• 5:41
  Speaker 4: was wondering, what's over with him? What do you want
• 5:43
  Speaker 4: to tell me? But he was just kind of saying
• 5:46
  Speaker 4: tight lipped about it. And after I spoke to the kids,
• 5:50
  Speaker 4: that's when he told me. He says that first time
• 5:53
  Speaker 4: he was here, I was one of those kids, And
• 5:57
  Speaker 4: I said, well, thank you for telling me now, because
• 5:59
  Speaker 4: if you told me that before I walked in there,
• 6:02
  Speaker 4: I don't know if I was that you kept it together.
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: Man.
• 6:05
  Speaker 4: That got so emotional behind that, because he was confirmation
• 6:09
  Speaker 4: that I was doing the right thing, and that was
• 6:10
  Speaker 4: the thing. I mean, you know, that whole thing if
• 6:13
  Speaker 4: you if you reach one and I see that thing
• 6:16
  Speaker 4: reciprocated that it affected him enough that it changed his
• 6:21
  Speaker 4: life and he came back just like I did, you know,
• 6:25
  Speaker 4: becoming a teacher in the same place where the seed
• 6:29
  Speaker 4: was planning for me. That that man, I was kind
• 6:33
  Speaker 4: of through for yeah a while, man, Yeah.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: I love that because you know, I love how the
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: Bible speaks about one plants one waters that gives the
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: ultimate increase, right, somebody will plant the seed and someone
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: else will come along the water. But what I also
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: love about that for you was that there's a story
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: with Jesus held the ten Leffords and one returned back
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: to say thank you. I think for us as men,
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: it's important for us to hear to know when we've
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: had an impact on someone's life.
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: I think it does something to.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: Your spirit, man, I think it does something to your
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: heart and your soul because to think about a young
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: black boy growing up in New York and dealing with anger.
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: As I would say from the mental health space, the
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: majority of black boys have anger issues, and not anger
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: issues because they're inherently angry, but either something has gone
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: wrong from.
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: A lack thereof, not enough of.
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: And and I love that for you because sometimes I
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: feel like, you know, you know, there's a lot of
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: great men that have left this.
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: World and then the change that they made.
• 8:02
  Speaker 4: Oh boy, yeah, definitely that's an understatement, but I mean
• 8:05
  Speaker 4: you talk about black men in general, I mean nowadays Okay,
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: everybody's become sophisticated. You know, if you if you speak
• 8:15
  Speaker 4: harshly toward child, how that may affect that child later?
• 8:19
  Speaker 4: And you know that trauma was you know, show shows,
• 8:23
  Speaker 4: what about generations of trauma? Come on, Hold on general,
• 8:29
  Speaker 4: is there a black man or black human being that
• 8:33
  Speaker 4: ancestors didn't didn't experience trauma? That's an understatement. And when
• 8:39
  Speaker 4: we can talk about nowadays how receptive we are to
• 8:44
  Speaker 4: those things, those so where there's been such a lineage
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: of black trauma and we to even pretend that we've
• 8:57
  Speaker 4: navigated around that is ridiculous.
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: It's ridiculous.
• 9:02
  Speaker 4: Yeah, So, I mean, yeah, we've all experienced trauma, whether
• 9:07
  Speaker 4: you recognize it or not, because I mean, you know,
• 9:11
  Speaker 4: our parents where they came from, and their parents had
• 9:15
  Speaker 4: it worse than them, you know, so and so you know,
• 9:19
  Speaker 4: we come from a thing where I knew growing up
• 9:22
  Speaker 4: you can blame your father or blame your mother for
• 9:26
  Speaker 4: anything creative with it, and everybody's gonna pat you on
• 9:29
  Speaker 4: the back. And because you know, it was kind of
• 9:32
  Speaker 4: like it kind of created this generation of folks who
• 9:37
  Speaker 4: basically we can scapegoat things and we're not looking at
• 9:41
  Speaker 4: ourselves and saying, okay, let's forgive our parents.
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: Let's forgive because we don't.
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: Realize what they they were up against, which was crazy
• 9:54
  Speaker 4: in comparison.
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: Right, So.
• 9:57
  Speaker 4: Let's you know, because sometimes we attribute blame and figure
• 10:01
  Speaker 4: that's all the work we have to do, and it's not,
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: you know. So like me and my brothers. My brother
• 10:08
  Speaker 4: was an engineer, things rolled off his back.
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: Me.
• 10:13
  Speaker 4: I didn't know I was an artist, but I do
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: know I was volatile and something affected me. I was
• 10:19
  Speaker 4: ready to tear your head off. I didn't know I
• 10:22
  Speaker 4: was a director, actor writer. Underneath, all I know is
• 10:27
  Speaker 4: I was a crazy one in the family who felt
• 10:29
  Speaker 4: things stronger than anyone.
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: Else, you know.
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: And when you were that sensitive in a harsh area,
• 10:35
  Speaker 4: what you do with any do this, like with anything
• 10:38
  Speaker 4: that's fragile. If you got something valuable is fragile, what
• 10:43
  Speaker 4: you do You protect it. You put it in a
• 10:45
  Speaker 4: safe right, So I, like so many other men, became
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: the safe. I build myself up. I'm ready to destroy
• 10:56
  Speaker 4: anything that threatens anything I care about, right, and I
• 11:04
  Speaker 4: accept the moniker of the monster, you know, And all
• 11:09
  Speaker 4: of that is because I'm protecting what's fragile. Really, so
• 11:14
  Speaker 4: you know just like Okay, I was to portray Mike Tyson. Right,
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: let's look at Mike Tyson for the baddest cats on
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: the planet. But he's one of the first people that
• 11:24
  Speaker 4: will go into tears on camera. So that's those are
• 11:30
  Speaker 4: two sides of the same coin. And so why would
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: he build this fortress if it wasn't to protect something
• 11:37
  Speaker 4: that was inside? And that is indicative of so many
• 11:41
  Speaker 4: men and people I grew up with, and I knew
• 11:45
  Speaker 4: the predators, and it's one of the roughest people, the
• 11:50
  Speaker 4: toughest cats you ever want to meet.
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: A lot of.
• 11:52
  Speaker 4: Times they harbor the heart of an artists. They could drawn,
• 11:57
  Speaker 4: they have creativity, and like I said, very much like myself.
• 12:03
  Speaker 4: It was two sides of the same coin. Right, look
• 12:07
  Speaker 4: at our young men. You want to take the moniker
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: of monster. Yeah, I'm just that whatever, you know, the
• 12:14
  Speaker 4: wrap we grab on to our youth and when we
• 12:22
  Speaker 4: were our most volatile and impressionable because that anger, it
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: gives us an outlet for that, right, and yeah, I
• 12:32
  Speaker 4: want to be I'm a monster. I'll cure you. No,
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: you're not know you are not what it is. And
• 12:39
  Speaker 4: it's like you say, you're hard you're a monster. You
• 12:42
  Speaker 4: do all that stuff, but yet you are willing to
• 12:46
  Speaker 4: die for your homeboy, for your block, your limited piece
• 12:51
  Speaker 4: of real estate you don't even own, because that's all
• 12:55
  Speaker 4: this love that you have in your heart and no
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: place to put it.
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: You gotta hold that bro. No place to put it, Yeah,
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: no place to put it. And I would even go
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: follow brother dad. Most of us who would gifted, particularly
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: have experienced the most abuse, rejection, abandonment, neglect, every predator,
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: every person that is someone Uh, it's the bully, right.
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: And I often tell people like when I when I
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: first started as a as a therapist, I work with
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: a lot of kids that were, you know, being bullied,
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: all those different things. And what you realize is that
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: the bully is being bullied, but he can't fight back
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: at home to whoever is bullying, especially kids who had
• 13:50
  Speaker 1: him Dad that was a bully or that was abuse it.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: I can't fight Dad back, So I'm gonna go find
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: someone lesson.
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: Or you.
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: And so when you think about that, it goes back
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: to what you're saying. None of us are really what
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: we are portraying. It's really this mechanism that let me
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: armor up as we call it a maladaptera prosona let
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: me put on this persona to protect what I'm really
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: afraid and fearful of. And so I grabbed a gun
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: because I'm really scared. Yeah, oh yeah, can you talk
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: about that?
• 14:31
  Speaker 4: Oh?
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: Absolutely? Yeah.
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: Pretty much everything that traumatizes us or is connected to
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: fear and then in the tools that we're given.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 14:45
  Speaker 4: I remember one time I was speaking to I was
• 14:49
  Speaker 4: a speed I think it was in East Saint Louis,
• 14:52
  Speaker 4: and there was some administrators at this place. I was
• 14:58
  Speaker 4: talking at a facility that I was like basically almost
• 15:02
  Speaker 4: like a young prison type of thing, and somebody, one
• 15:06
  Speaker 4: of the facilitators was bold enough to ask me why
• 15:11
  Speaker 4: I thought young black men were so violent, and the
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: way they framed it was kind of interesting. But I
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: asked them and just like I will put this out
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: right now. Well, you know, violence is is introduced when
• 15:27
  Speaker 4: you're young most of the time as a tool, right,
• 15:31
  Speaker 4: And I would say, and like I said to this man,
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: what do you think black parents came up with the
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: idea to grab a leather belt and whip their children,
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: not only that, counting out the lashes. Where do you
• 15:48
  Speaker 4: think that came from? Africa. Oh no, it did not.
• 15:53
  Speaker 4: It was introduced, was it not. It was introduced in
• 15:56
  Speaker 4: such a way that you know, it's a tool. So
• 16:00
  Speaker 4: instead of other ways of dealing with stress or whatever,
• 16:06
  Speaker 4: it was taught to use violence as a tool as
• 16:13
  Speaker 4: you know, a certain language, you know, so we clearly
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: know where that's coming from.
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 16:24
  Speaker 4: So yeah, so looking at that, I mean, we can
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: decide when you make yourself knowledgeable of that, do we
• 16:32
  Speaker 4: want to keep that tradition on? Who's traditional?
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: We following? You know?
• 16:39
  Speaker 4: So this is I mean, you know, we got the
• 16:46
  Speaker 4: tools that we've been given, and a lot of times
• 16:49
  Speaker 4: we we attribute that to love because those who loved
• 16:54
  Speaker 4: us did this and so and not only that. A
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: bigger issue I consider that this choice of that I think
• 17:03
  Speaker 4: it needs to be talked about more these days, is
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: that we are familiar with this whole we keep each
• 17:11
  Speaker 4: other down thing. And a lot of people will agree
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: with that, would you not? You know, we keep each
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: other down. Soon as one chize arise, we pull each
• 17:21
  Speaker 4: other down. But the thing that I think we need
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: to understand is that that whole act came from love.
• 17:29
  Speaker 4: I'll explain generation as a goal. There were kids who
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: wanted to evolve, who wanted to learn, They wanted to
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: learn how to read the folks that loved them. The
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: other folks said, no, you ain't nothing better. In word,
• 17:47
  Speaker 4: you ain't no better than nobody else. And they did
• 17:49
  Speaker 4: that why to keep them alive? Because too many of
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: those kids wound up hanging from a tree. So what
• 17:57
  Speaker 4: are you going to do? You've seen countless people say
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna look this white man in the eye. I
• 18:04
  Speaker 4: want better for myself, And so did all of these
• 18:07
  Speaker 4: people that those old folks see their friends meet that
• 18:13
  Speaker 4: demise just because they wanted something more in their life.
• 18:17
  Speaker 4: And now those those old folks go to their graves.
• 18:21
  Speaker 4: But what's left behind. What's left behind is the tendency
• 18:29
  Speaker 4: to make sure nobody rises. You know, they say, no, no, no,
• 18:35
  Speaker 4: you ain't no better you you bring you come back
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: down here. So we do the act without understanding where.
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: It came from.
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, because you know, they couldn't explain where it came from.
• 18:47
  Speaker 4: They had to tell you, no, you don't. And then
• 18:51
  Speaker 4: the village says, oh, he's trying to ascend, nah ah,
• 18:55
  Speaker 4: And the knee jerk reaction is to pull him back down.
• 18:59
  Speaker 4: But where to come from. It came from love, It
• 19:02
  Speaker 4: came from keeping you alive. You know, we know emmet
• 19:05
  Speaker 4: till that story. Now, what do you think those folks,
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: what is the over line you know message on that? No, no, no,
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: don't you don't you talk to this white woman. And
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: there's too many immatils out there, right, So we're coming
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: from that, and we're mistaking it as our nature to
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: hate each other and to pull each other down because
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: young folks are not going to know the difference of
• 19:34
  Speaker 4: where it's coming from, right, They're not gonna know. They
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: just see it happen and they go, Okay, this person's ascending.
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: Let me pull them back down and then wonder why
• 19:45
  Speaker 4: they have trauma because that's not really where our hearts
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: are because we love each other, because we've been talking
• 19:51
  Speaker 4: to love our oppressors. I mean, where what people on
• 19:56
  Speaker 4: this planets has shown that degree of love if not us?
• 20:04
  Speaker 4: And so of course there is a conflict, you know,
• 20:09
  Speaker 4: you know, as you understand cognitive dissidence. So yes, of
• 20:15
  Speaker 4: course we're gonna be fighting with two different things because
• 20:19
  Speaker 4: they don't belong together. Because when we say brother, we
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: mean it, right, we do. And then we got to
• 20:27
  Speaker 4: juxtapose that with this this trigger of pulling each other
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: down and thinking that's what we're supposed to do. But
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: you know, and I know, and I was frustrated with
• 20:38
  Speaker 4: myself when there was I mean years.
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: Ago when like another.
• 20:46
  Speaker 4: Uh peer of mine who was an actor met with
• 20:50
  Speaker 4: a certain demise and I felt satisfied. And I looked
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: at myself and that whoa wait wait wait wait, why
• 20:58
  Speaker 4: do I feel better?
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: Oh?
• 21:00
  Speaker 4: And I'm like, no, no, no, no, this is not right.
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: There needs to be I need to reckon with this.
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: And I had this was something deep down the side,
• 21:12
  Speaker 4: and I'm like, I got to exercise this out of
• 21:15
  Speaker 4: me because I know this ain't This ain't right. I
• 21:19
  Speaker 4: never want to feel like that again. And I don't
• 21:22
  Speaker 4: care what conditioning it is.
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: No.
• 21:24
  Speaker 4: See, I'm not going to live with this, this disease.
• 21:32
  Speaker 4: It ain't no. And so I want to deal with
• 21:37
  Speaker 4: it at the source. How on that world am I
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: feeling better about somebody else who's trying to do what
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: I'm doing? How they get brought down and I feel
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: satisfied with that result? And yet another white appeer I
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: wouldn't feel that way about. Oh when you set with
• 22:04
  Speaker 4: that and you begin to reckon with it. What was
• 22:09
  Speaker 4: the route I founded me because because of that conditioning, man,
• 22:16
  Speaker 4: I'm like it worked on me.
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: So you felt like there was some part of you
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: that was like.
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: That was satisfying with another brother who was trying to
• 22:27
  Speaker 4: do what I was doing, like my competition. I don't care.
• 22:30
  Speaker 4: I don't look at this not But at the time,
• 22:34
  Speaker 4: I did not like that. That was not what I
• 22:38
  Speaker 4: believe as a black man in this struggle. And I
• 22:42
  Speaker 4: know how we've been taught to you know that divide
• 22:46
  Speaker 4: and conquered. I know I know too well about that
• 22:48
  Speaker 4: to be part of that, to be on that side
• 22:51
  Speaker 4: of it. No, No, that I don't want to go
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: around and hate my damnself, you know. So that was
• 23:02
  Speaker 4: that was something that I'm going No, I don't care
• 23:06
  Speaker 4: what is forever someone else. I can't have that in
• 23:09
  Speaker 4: my life. And so so you know, but yeah, any
• 23:15
  Speaker 4: white counterpop part I wouldn't have felt the same way.
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: But I was satisfied that this this actor had, you know, misfortune. No,
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: I didn't.
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: I did not like that feeling. I do.
• 23:34
  Speaker 4: I never feel that way anything since then, you know,
• 23:37
  Speaker 4: deep down now, when somebody is hurt, I feel the
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: way I should feel. That's me, he's that I feel
• 23:52
  Speaker 4: I feel connected to that.
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: You know that this is so powerful, Michael, because all
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: and say that because I have been and am a
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: therapist for many people from all walks of life, entertainers, actors, athletes,
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: and all those different things. And someone was asking me, sorry,
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: why don't you do response videos? And I said I can't.
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: I said, I come from a family where we were
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: never allowed to put our mouths on people when they
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: were having or experiencing misfortune.
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: My mother would say, maybe pray for them. People. Don't
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: put your mouth on those people.
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: And what I'm hearing from what you're saying is that
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: I think there's a part of us when you talk
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: about the disease. The disease that we have is because
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: this ideology that I don't want my brother, I don't
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: want my sister to succeed or to excel and to
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: a sin above me. Now I have this dissonance, this
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: lack of agreement with then myself. That it's not that
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: I'm just divided internally. Now my division permeates to where
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: I feel I feel good, well, he should because he
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: don't deserve that, or she should, and I love that
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: you're talking about this because I say this often when
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: somebody says, well, how can you just walk up to
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: a black man you don't know and said that you
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: love him, I said, because of the work that I've
• 25:24
  Speaker 1: done internally that to tell him I love you black man,
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: is me telling me I love you black man, and.
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: I love that you are are are sharing that because.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: There has been You know that there's been much work
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: that has been strategically done systemically on us as a people.
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: This is why I tell people I feel like God
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: placed me in this space, because if you can get
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: your mind right, you can get your life right.
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: And if you can get this right, you can change
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: your perception.
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: Because also one of the great neurologists, doctor Oliver Sachs,
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: He was a pioneer and in neurology, and he often
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: would say that you don't just see what your eyes,
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: you also see what your brains. And then he would yeah,
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: And then he had this idea that perception was a
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: form of art that was also attached to an act
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: of creation. So every time you remember or have a memory,
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: it is reconstructed every time you remember remember it, and
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: so there's much of our memories that we recall and
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: I'm not going to say that it's all accurately, but
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: a lot of it is also colored in the way
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: that we perceive life, which is why I say he'll
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: I see different because I can look at someone's brokenness
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: and there is the heal part of me that understands
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: how to empathize with my brother. And I like how
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: you said that it's not about competition, because we're all
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: on the same fight. With that result and with whould
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: you become an as an artist? How parallel argutu from
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: who Michael is as the artist and who Michael is
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: as a man, Like, how do you combine them with
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: the reconciliation that you have within yourself on certain things
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: that as a black man.
• 27:36
  Speaker 4: Well, I put a lot of this in my art,
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: and I wrote, I wrote and directed and started a
• 27:45
  Speaker 4: movie Western called Outlaw Johnny Black, which I get a
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: chance to put things that I mean, I have a
• 27:54
  Speaker 4: you know, I have a movie about forgiveness and redemption
• 27:57
  Speaker 4: disguised as a revenged movie. And you know, I get
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: a chance to put some of my heart into these things. Yeah,
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: I'm blessed to be able to do my own projects
• 28:12
  Speaker 4: now and you know, you I'll have the body counting,
• 28:16
  Speaker 4: the action and fighting, but I'll sneak in a whole
• 28:19
  Speaker 4: bunch of other stuff that if you're percepted, you'll get
• 28:23
  Speaker 4: the messages. Yeah. So I combine those two and you know,
• 28:30
  Speaker 4: luckily I can start doing films that where I can
• 28:35
  Speaker 4: play more of who I am and present those nuances
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: like the movie that brings Me here, the secret between
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: us and I get to play a husband and father
• 28:49
  Speaker 4: and play those nuances that I live, right, but then
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: also show that the flaws, you know, and hopefully within
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: that people see something they recognizing themselves and you know,
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: have these family dramas and what have you. I'll still
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: keep doing the kick butt stuff.
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, we gotta have that. Yeah but yeah,
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: but yeah.
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: So I've been very blessed and I'm and like I said,
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: where I came from, I wasn't supposed to be here. Yeah, right,
• 29:21
  Speaker 4: So this is just you know, this is like I'm
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: playing with house money right now.
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: I love to say that every day I wake up
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: up something playing louse money because I think there's such
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: a My mentors to say it's a privilege to fight.
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: And he said every day that you open your eyes.
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: Man, It's just this, you know, he was so and
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: it wasn't this mindset of this optimism you know people
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: always like, but it was always this honoring that he
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: saw life. He has such an honor still living, but
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: he has such an honor to how he saw life.
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: And and I can appreciate that when you say I'm
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: playing with house money, because you now get to do
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: the things that you want to do and create in
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: the way that you want to create. No.
• 30:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean we can't hide from who we really are.
• 30:17
  Speaker 4: And I know what I'm capable of, right, and if
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: I do less than that, I'm not going to be
• 30:22
  Speaker 4: a happy person, you know. So I get a chance
• 30:24
  Speaker 4: to operate at my maximum capacity. So it's one of
• 30:31
  Speaker 4: those things that takes care of itself. And it's not
• 30:34
  Speaker 4: for any competition or just to try to get into
• 30:38
  Speaker 4: any type of status. Just me doing what I feel
• 30:42
  Speaker 4: like I'm supposed to do and be the servant I'm
• 30:46
  Speaker 4: supposed to be so I can live honestly, you know,
• 30:52
  Speaker 4: because if I did less than that, I would not
• 30:55
  Speaker 4: be balanced or.
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: Happy, you know when you talk by balance, right.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: That was something I noticed in the film, the segrete
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: between us the character.
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: Jack that you play. Uh, when he returns home. Uh,
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: you know you don't see him ever go back to
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: work again. Yeah. And and and what.
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: What I gather from that, because I'm always conceptualizing thing.
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: When I gather from that that home became more important
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: than work? Oh yeah, oh yeah. And when you think
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: about the state of the family and as a husband,
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: how important for men to not just be home but
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: you see Jack now has to be emotionally present. How
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: important is it for a father, husband and a man
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: to be emotionally present at home?
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: You know?
• 31:56
  Speaker 4: In that case? Uh, like in the movie, it's the
• 32:01
  Speaker 4: nature of a man. You you, I mean, like our superpower,
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: I always say, is securing the home, protecting our family.
• 32:11
  Speaker 4: And where in the movie, prior to that that looked
• 32:16
  Speaker 4: like providing financially and what have you. Well, he's gotten
• 32:23
  Speaker 4: to a place where providing and you know, taking care
• 32:27
  Speaker 4: of the family became being present. And it's just the
• 32:33
  Speaker 4: nature and what we're supposed to do. Okay, it might
• 32:36
  Speaker 4: look different at different times, So that leadership had to
• 32:40
  Speaker 4: be you know, within the walls of the home at
• 32:44
  Speaker 4: that time. And you know, I feel like that's that's
• 32:48
  Speaker 4: what you you know that's how we operate in our
• 32:51
  Speaker 4: best capacity.
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: We you know, uh, you know he you know, he's
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: home and now he's deal with this issue. You and
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: you're talking about this.
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: Uh. You know what I love about the film. There
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: was so many stories being told in more it was
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: emotional for me to watch it, if I'm honest, because
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: I know what it's like to go through a miscarriage
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: and uh, that loss, uh sometimes isn't greed for men.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: And the part where Jack is really been open about
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: how we don't get that as men. Right Usually when
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: there's loss, it's all the attention is, rightfully so given
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: to the woman. Yes, yes, and and man, And I'm
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: just being honest. I was sitting up in my bed
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: watching on my laptop and when you went into that
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: that just you know, I lost too.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Mm hmm. Oh.
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: Man, I had to pause it to wipe my eyes
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: because I work with.
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: A lot of brothers.
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah that often say, man, she's going through this, and
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: she went through that.
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: But brother I was in it too.
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: And then there's a lot of men who you know,
• 34:21
  Speaker 4: we got big shows for a reason, and that rightly,
• 34:23
  Speaker 4: so we're supposed to put ourselves second. I think the
• 34:28
  Speaker 4: in a lot of the cases, of course, because our children,
• 34:33
  Speaker 4: our wives, you know, especially our wives. I say this,
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: there's super hero quality. There's superpower is love and nurturing.
• 34:43
  Speaker 4: And you know they're emotional, just as our kids are.
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: And when you are an emotional person and that's what
• 34:49
  Speaker 4: you used to be, we have to listen on another
• 34:54
  Speaker 4: level beyond our egos and what have you, not the surface,
• 34:59
  Speaker 4: but what's really being said, because anybody under a strong
• 35:04
  Speaker 4: emotion should be given that grace to not say the
• 35:09
  Speaker 4: perfect thing, not say it perfectly. They're supposed to be demonstrative.
• 35:15
  Speaker 4: They're supposed to exaggerate, and you, as a man, should
• 35:21
  Speaker 4: know better than to listen to the exaggeration. Wanting to
• 35:25
  Speaker 4: be right.
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: Now that's wisdom, Yeah, that's wisdom, not not. Yeah.
• 35:31
  Speaker 4: So no, I know what you mean. You're gonna say
• 35:35
  Speaker 4: you always did. And if I'm sitting there thinking about
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: the time that I you know I didn't, or trying
• 35:42
  Speaker 4: to find a flaw in your no, I'm not doing
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: my I'm not doing my job. I should be listening,
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: you know, if somebody's traumatic, if they're going through something,
• 35:52
  Speaker 4: you got to listen harder. You can't be thinking about
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: when I'm going to jump in, you.
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: Know and be right.
• 35:57
  Speaker 4: Nah, don't be right, you know. I mean my thing
• 36:00
  Speaker 4: is I'm going to prove you right before proving you wrong.
• 36:04
  Speaker 4: So I want to listen and know, Okay, that's what
• 36:07
  Speaker 4: you mean. You know, that's what you mean.
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: I'm hearing you.
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: There's somebody's going to be watching that and saying, brother, wife,
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: you're fifty eight and you got a lot of years
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: of experience to make that conceptualization. Right to listen because well,
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: as you were talking here, you said, well, our shoulders
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: are broad for a reason. We're supposed to be second.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: But what do you do when you are putting yourself
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: second or the first to her?
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 36:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, so yeah, let me continue with that thought. Yeah,
• 36:47
  Speaker 4: like we're supposed to do that, right. But the trick
• 36:50
  Speaker 4: is knowing that if we if we take on this
• 36:58
  Speaker 4: trauma and not find the balance of expressing ourselves, we're
• 37:05
  Speaker 4: going to be less than as being providers of security
• 37:12
  Speaker 4: and and you know, uh, the leadership in our family
• 37:16
  Speaker 4: because we're we're traumatized and we're you know, we're hurting.
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: But that's the trick, is Okay, you don't you if
• 37:29
  Speaker 4: if this discussion is going on, you shut up, listen,
• 37:35
  Speaker 4: and you pick a time that you have to now
• 37:39
  Speaker 4: when you come with your your concern, be wise and
• 37:45
  Speaker 4: know when to do that right and how to Uh.
• 37:50
  Speaker 4: You don't expect somebody to understand when they're bringing you
• 37:54
  Speaker 4: with their trauma. That's not the time, right, you know,
• 37:58
  Speaker 4: you sit down and say, baby, this is important to me.
• 38:02
  Speaker 4: You can't when she's in the listening mode, you know,
• 38:05
  Speaker 4: And that's that's.
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: Not that's not now my for this third this this
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: audience up because most brothers are saying, when it is
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: my turn to share my grievance and to share whatever
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: bothers me, I am now burden after I share to
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: console her about what I share because how it made
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: her feel. So, I mean, I know, but but what
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: would you say to the brothers who are saying, brother,
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: I am going.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: To her to share what my traumas or what my
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: burden is.
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: But by the time I get through, I now having
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: to deal with the emotions of what she feels about
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: what I share.
• 38:58
  Speaker 4: What it is it I feel like this it's it's
• 39:05
  Speaker 4: like it's a it feels cutting dry to me. Because
• 39:09
  Speaker 4: if you're not able to hear me I'm gonna stop right, Uh,
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: and you got to really be able to I mean,
• 39:18
  Speaker 4: yeah here, yeah, big shoulders for a reason. And and
• 39:23
  Speaker 4: sometimes you're gonna have to be able to know how
• 39:26
  Speaker 4: to uh, how to express this and avoid the landmines.
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: You ain't got no choice. I'm sorry, there's no choice.
• 39:37
  Speaker 4: So you either, I mean, I'm I'm I'm concerned. I'm
• 39:44
  Speaker 4: like very uh mission oriented. The mission is for you
• 39:50
  Speaker 4: to hear what I'm saying. If you don't hear what
• 39:53
  Speaker 4: I'm saying, there's a problem here, okay. And you know
• 39:59
  Speaker 4: if somebody's saying, oh, she ain't here some kind of way,
• 40:02
  Speaker 4: you're treading the emotional part. And so it's I can't
• 40:10
  Speaker 4: I you know, I don't know if I've I gotta say.
• 40:14
  Speaker 4: I know I've had to be able to do that.
• 40:19
  Speaker 4: What we got like for you, I'll say it. I
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: like your parriage. Well, but this way, I know my
• 40:24
  Speaker 4: wife for twenty nine years, and we've had all but
• 40:28
  Speaker 4: three or maybe four arguments. Pauls I'm not playing she
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: right there? Paul's am I lying? Is she here? She's sleep?
• 40:42
  Speaker 4: She went to sleep, and you know you don't say that,
• 40:44
  Speaker 4: so she he ain't she didn't result.
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: So so, so that's thirty almost thirty years. Yeah, arguments, okay,
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: but you get as a young man today. Give me
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: the formula.
• 40:59
  Speaker 4: I'm telling you that only the times we had the
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: arguments is when we both were emotional, and those things
• 41:06
  Speaker 4: might have lasted about half an hour because I was
• 41:09
  Speaker 4: I was emotional, she was emotional. We were both in
• 41:12
  Speaker 4: and at the same time. I couldn't hear each other.
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: Right, But I.
• 41:18
  Speaker 4: Exercise this with friends everything else. And if I get
• 41:22
  Speaker 4: to a point where this person can't really hear me,
• 41:24
  Speaker 4: my thing is okay, if you become emotional, you lost already.
• 41:29
  Speaker 4: So as the man, don't become emotional, you just can't
• 41:32
  Speaker 4: do it because I can tell I can tell you that,
• 41:35
  Speaker 4: can you you know, can you please pass me the salt?
• 41:38
  Speaker 4: But I can say could you please pass me the salt?
• 41:41
  Speaker 4: Or that's that's Oh. All I did was ask me
• 41:43
  Speaker 4: you pass me the salt. But I'm not realizing the
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: emotion underneath it. Right, if something says under a high emotion,
• 41:50
  Speaker 4: just like the same way, I gotta listen when she goes.
• 41:53
  Speaker 4: You never say that, you never am like she don't
• 41:56
  Speaker 4: mean that she means often I do this often.
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: I do you know right.
• 42:00
  Speaker 4: Now, if her mind is you know, it's here, like,
• 42:04
  Speaker 4: I baby, you're okay, Yeah, I'm fine. Yeah, I'm gonna
• 42:09
  Speaker 4: fall for that. No, I know she ain't fine. I'm
• 42:12
  Speaker 4: not gonna say, well, you don't sound like you know.
• 42:14
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna I'm gonna sneak around the back door and
• 42:17
  Speaker 4: be like, oh, so you talked to mom today, Yeah
• 42:20
  Speaker 4: she was, I'm gonna do my detail.
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: My brother, brother, my brother. That's wisdom. That's wisdom.
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: So you're putting it in the palm of your hand,
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: carefully holding it.
• 42:31
  Speaker 4: Yes, Hey, like I said, we got big shoulders. We
• 42:33
  Speaker 4: know we could do better. We could do like, shame
• 42:37
  Speaker 4: on you if you didn't know how to circumvent. You're
• 42:41
  Speaker 4: a lady and explain, Hey baby, I need you to
• 42:45
  Speaker 4: understand this, okay. And even right there if it's like okay, oh,
• 42:52
  Speaker 4: this ain't the time. This ain't the time, because if
• 42:57
  Speaker 4: if emotion is rearing its head, it ain't gonna get
• 42:59
  Speaker 4: no better. So I'm I'm like, no, we're gonna talk
• 43:03
  Speaker 4: about this and oh no, okay, okay, I listen, you're ready,
• 43:07
  Speaker 4: you know, don't take it so serious, you know, So
• 43:10
  Speaker 4: there's all these different things, all these nuances. But shame
• 43:14
  Speaker 4: on you if you don't know you're a woman better
• 43:17
  Speaker 4: than to know when to bring something to it.
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: Now I'm looking at my camera, you looking yours. Now,
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: y'all heard what he said? Same old you, good brother. Yeah,
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna say, shame old you. Good system. If y'all
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: don't know each other. And I think that is the
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: biggest dilemma that we have today, may relationship.
• 43:36
  Speaker 4: We grow up with so much game, fellas, we grow
• 43:39
  Speaker 4: up with so much game that it's shame on you.
• 43:44
  Speaker 4: If you don't know how and when to express yourself
• 43:49
  Speaker 4: to your woman without triggering something. You know, then you
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: got to work on your game.
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 43:56
  Speaker 5: It's it's we're gonna bow on this because hey, we
• 44:00
  Speaker 5: all have We all had mothers right, and we knew,
• 44:04
  Speaker 5: we knew how to We knew how to work our
• 44:06
  Speaker 5: mothers like where we couldn't work our fathers that way.
• 44:11
  Speaker 4: We knew how to work our mothers. Okay, we knew.
• 44:15
  Speaker 4: Come on now, So but if it's not in your
• 44:19
  Speaker 4: goal to be right or whatever, and you if your
• 44:24
  Speaker 4: goal is listen, I need you to understand this. You know,
• 44:28
  Speaker 4: here's how I'm feeling. So I want that grace that
• 44:31
  Speaker 4: I give you to listen, just I want you to
• 44:36
  Speaker 4: feel a lot of the time, a lot of times
• 44:39
  Speaker 4: the woman doesn't want logic from you. They want you
• 44:42
  Speaker 4: to listen, right, say that. A lot of times the
• 44:48
  Speaker 4: women don't want logic from you. They want you to listen.
• 44:51
  Speaker 4: That's it, right, that's so ven They should understand when
• 44:55
  Speaker 4: you honored them and respect your relationship well enough that
• 45:00
  Speaker 4: you took the time which is a thing, a very
• 45:03
  Speaker 4: feminine thing to do, to say listen, I want you
• 45:06
  Speaker 4: to hear me. They can recognize that effort because that's
• 45:10
  Speaker 4: in their wheelhouse.
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 45:13
  Speaker 4: So when you do that and say, hey, you know,
• 45:17
  Speaker 4: I just you know, I want to go. I don't
• 45:20
  Speaker 4: want to feel like I have to edit myself. I
• 45:22
  Speaker 4: want you to know the true me I want. This
• 45:24
  Speaker 4: is for the sake of our relationship whatever. And before
• 45:28
  Speaker 4: it was not the time for me to do this
• 45:31
  Speaker 4: because I was listening to you. But I need you
• 45:33
  Speaker 4: to hear me. Okay, there's you gotta do. You do
• 45:38
  Speaker 4: you gotta do that without hitting the land mines. You
• 45:43
  Speaker 4: know what I mean basically, And shame on you if
• 45:46
  Speaker 4: you don't know how to do that?
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: Man, I have two more questions to end with because
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: I know you have a busy day, man, but this
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: is the man you're giving out some wisdom that this
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: is insight, because this is also what a lot of
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: men don't get. And I think when we as men
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: begin to understand that we're just as emotional as our
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: counterpart women. But it's the way that we express it
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: and manage it and understand it. And and I tell man,
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: when you learn how to regulate your emotions, I can't
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: stand what people said, Well, you know, don't match brothers.
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: I'm telling you, no match a woman's energy. It is temporary.
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: Don't match it. Let her come down and then you
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: can talk. But you're right though, when but when, but
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: when you both escually.
• 46:45
  Speaker 4: No, forget it, forget it. You gotta stop. But I got,
• 46:49
  Speaker 4: I gotta, I gotta keep it a hundred. I will
• 46:52
  Speaker 4: never say we're just as emotional as a woman.
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: No, man, no, give me, give me your logic.
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: Okay, you have to play a board game, or you
• 47:04
  Speaker 4: played taboo or trip men versus the women women's term.
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: Men.
• 47:14
  Speaker 4: It's like we calm with it, right, We're not emotional
• 47:20
  Speaker 4: like the emotional. Look at just look at the world.
• 47:23
  Speaker 4: Look look at our entertainment world. Look at everything that's
• 47:26
  Speaker 4: exposed to us. Look at basketball, look at every look
• 47:29
  Speaker 4: at everything. You know, we are more meticulous and thinking
• 47:35
  Speaker 4: about these things because we have to be in war
• 47:39
  Speaker 4: and everything else. You have to not be the most emotional.
• 47:43
  Speaker 4: Men that we know in society are considered what crazy
• 47:52
  Speaker 4: because because logic is the opposite of crazy. Right, So
• 48:02
  Speaker 4: it's like a lot of people say, here's a little
• 48:05
  Speaker 4: little tid if you want to win or if you
• 48:07
  Speaker 4: want to talk about this, and it's kind of controversial
• 48:10
  Speaker 4: when you say we are all women have some crazy
• 48:13
  Speaker 4: in them, right, That might ruffle some feathers. But then
• 48:17
  Speaker 4: when you ask them and okay, think about your friend group.
• 48:22
  Speaker 4: Is your friends? What you say your friends are crazy?
• 48:25
  Speaker 4: A lot of women will go, yeah, I've seen my friend,
• 48:28
  Speaker 4: each one of my friends be a little craziert. How
• 48:31
  Speaker 4: about your moms? Everybody that the mother? Have you seen
• 48:34
  Speaker 4: your mother be crazy?
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 48:36
  Speaker 4: But then you say about the father. When you say
• 48:38
  Speaker 4: about your your male friends, there's a lot of men
• 48:42
  Speaker 4: that are so logical they're boring. So we can't start
• 48:46
  Speaker 4: saying the majority of men are crazy or just or emotional.
• 48:54
  Speaker 4: I'm just saying the emotional men, most of them. Emotional
• 49:00
  Speaker 4: men are kind of.
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna say this is emotional men are very violent, dude.
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: It's crazy. Emotional men are very violent. So I'm gonna
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: say this. From working with a lot of men in
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: the penal system and watching young black boys who struggle
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: to regulate their emotions, what you see is that your
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: inability to regulate your emotions will always warrant a reaction
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: versus a response. The reaction is knee jerk, and the
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: response is I'm able to process it says now, I
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: done stepped on Michael J. White shoe. Okay, I've stepped
• 49:50
  Speaker 1: on micro'shoe. I am not a martial art expert. I
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: don't And the process is like, let me apologize to
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: this good brother because I don't have I don't have
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: time to be in the hospital.
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: The reaction is.
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: Oh, you're still on my shoot the emotions and I
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: see so many men and going back to what we
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: were speaking about earlier, so many men in ability. For example,
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: you see this in the film. His emotions drove him
• 50:26
  Speaker 1: without thinking, I'm much just pop up oh yeah, yeah,
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: with no thought, with the exception. I mean, with the
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: expectation of you with open arms and so uh and
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: and again and and and this makes a great conversation. Look,
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: I know we run out of time, but this, this
• 50:48
  Speaker 1: last question I want to ask you when you think
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: about the film the secret between us, there's forgiveness, there's infidelity,
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: there's reconciliation.
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: Uh, there's anger, there's a resientment. What what do you hope.
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: And the caregiver man was, oh, she's my favorite.
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: And I can't feel my weight, but she is my
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: favorite because of to me she was glued. Yes, yeah,
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: what do you want people to get out of this field? Man?
• 51:26
  Speaker 4: I so want them to see see they're themselves in it.
• 51:34
  Speaker 4: I want them to understand the power of forgiveness and.
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: And how.
• 51:44
  Speaker 4: You know, you see people trying to get better, you know,
• 51:48
  Speaker 4: and and hold on to family and really what really matters.
• 51:56
  Speaker 4: And I don't want to give away too much, but
• 51:59
  Speaker 4: you see the power that Lisa Arundelle shows in that
• 52:08
  Speaker 4: a lot of times, especially in these days, social media
• 52:17
  Speaker 4: is encouraging you to default to the most negative reactions
• 52:22
  Speaker 4: to things, and you're not seeing enough things that say no, no, no,
• 52:28
  Speaker 4: fighting for family and love is the deeper meaning instead
• 52:38
  Speaker 4: of saying, you know, I'm done with this. A lot
• 52:43
  Speaker 4: of us who grew up with this dysfunction knew this.
• 52:50
  Speaker 4: I'm done, I'm cutting out. It's a lot of our
• 52:55
  Speaker 4: broken homes came from that. But again they came from
• 53:00
  Speaker 4: people who've had just such a history of trauma. Right,
• 53:08
  Speaker 4: and again, us embracing tearing each other down, and then
• 53:19
  Speaker 4: society embracing beating up on the man, you know, kind
• 53:27
  Speaker 4: of like so many things have a narrative of woman good,
• 53:30
  Speaker 4: man bad, you know, and that's become very traveling and
• 53:39
  Speaker 4: in vogue to just beat up on man. And you know,
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: I would love here. Of course, in the music industry
• 53:51
  Speaker 4: and everything else, and in movies, and yeah, it's easy
• 53:57
  Speaker 4: to to hit on negative stuff because people respond, you know,
• 54:08
  Speaker 4: it's very easy. It's cheap.
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: It's cheap.
• 54:12
  Speaker 4: I'm gonna have a show about bickering, and so people
• 54:15
  Speaker 4: can just you know, kind of live. I can't see
• 54:17
  Speaker 4: through that bicker, bigger bicker. And then when you talk
• 54:21
  Speaker 4: about us loving each other beyond that, yeah, people are
• 54:27
  Speaker 4: not in conditioned to embrace that as much as which
• 54:32
  Speaker 4: is a problem because we've had quite enough of that. Yeah,
• 54:40
  Speaker 4: breaking us down, dividing and concer it's enough of that,
• 54:46
  Speaker 4: you know, and deep down we talk about how can
• 54:50
  Speaker 4: this is? We are suffering from those things because deep
• 54:56
  Speaker 4: down in our hearts, like I was talking about, young
• 55:00
  Speaker 4: men dying for each other because they have this love
• 55:04
  Speaker 4: that they can express it in other ways, you know,
• 55:10
  Speaker 4: dying for their block, dying for their their set. You know,
• 55:17
  Speaker 4: we're we're constantly running into this imbalance and we when
• 55:23
  Speaker 4: we are the people who have shown love unparalleled in
• 55:28
  Speaker 4: this world over and over and talk to hate each
• 55:33
  Speaker 4: other and the media trying to do that, you know.
• 55:37
  Speaker 4: So I want I want people to look at this
• 55:41
  Speaker 4: and start seeing the truth of what we are and
• 55:43
  Speaker 4: who we are and who we want to be.
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: That's what I want.
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: When you think about to close out, when you think
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: about I asked every guests this question. Ah, you know
• 55:57
  Speaker 1: this podcast is centered around healing. When you think about
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: that word healing, you think about to make better, to
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: restore the renew.
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: For you. You had a journey.
• 56:10
  Speaker 1: From coming from New York and now you are, you know,
• 56:15
  Speaker 1: just a legend. And I'm sure that your journey to
• 56:19
  Speaker 1: getting here was a journey. When you think about healing,
• 56:24
  Speaker 1: what does that mean for you?
• 56:28
  Speaker 4: This means stepping into who you are meant to be
• 56:33
  Speaker 4: and shedding those negative things that you're you are conditioned
• 56:39
  Speaker 4: to grab onto and then start to break down.
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: If I feel bad?
• 56:47
  Speaker 4: Why you know, as a a black community, we're not
• 56:51
  Speaker 4: taught to reach out to get help, therapeutic help. You know,
• 56:58
  Speaker 4: if your eyesight goes bad, where do you go? You
• 57:01
  Speaker 4: go to an optometrist. Ears go bad, ears, nose and throat.
• 57:06
  Speaker 4: If your spirit is bad, if you are having mental
• 57:11
  Speaker 4: issues problems, well go to somebody who specializes in that.
• 57:17
  Speaker 4: If not, you know, at least go to folks like yourself,
• 57:23
  Speaker 4: because that's what we're here for, you know. And you
• 57:27
  Speaker 4: know my thing is I feel like you know when
• 57:31
  Speaker 4: you just there's one thing I lean with you which
• 57:35
  Speaker 4: helps me and change a lot in my life. And
• 57:40
  Speaker 4: I say this, any trauma, any anger, any emotion is triggered,
• 57:49
  Speaker 4: and the first thing happens is you're going to ask
• 57:52
  Speaker 4: a question what, when?
• 57:54
  Speaker 2: Why? How? Right?
• 57:56
  Speaker 4: And so if you're in a traffic jam, you're angry
• 58:01
  Speaker 4: because you don't know, You're like, why is? And then
• 58:05
  Speaker 4: you get up ahead and you see there was a
• 58:06
  Speaker 4: car accident and you're not angry anymore. Right, Well, you
• 58:11
  Speaker 4: can get in a traffic jam today and you have
• 58:16
  Speaker 4: a choice to be angry or not. But there's a
• 58:18
  Speaker 4: certain point where you go, this is not a conspiracy
• 58:20
  Speaker 4: against me. Then it's gotta a logical answer. And when
• 58:27
  Speaker 4: you get a frustrated and you go, what, let me
• 58:32
  Speaker 4: concern myself with what the fact is? This is a
• 58:37
  Speaker 4: logical answer. I just don't know what it is. Right.
• 58:40
  Speaker 4: And every time you are angry and you ask yourself why, stop,
• 58:46
  Speaker 4: don't be emotional and concern yourself with the reason why,
• 58:51
  Speaker 4: because you probably know it. But of course, like I say,
• 58:55
  Speaker 4: you're gonna be in thousands of traffic jams and feel
• 58:58
  Speaker 4: the same way and get mad every time. That's your decision.
• 59:01
  Speaker 4: But you start asking yourself, why am I feeling this? Why?
• 59:07
  Speaker 4: What is making me upset? What is making me discontent?
• 59:12
  Speaker 4: And you stop and go now, let me try to
• 59:15
  Speaker 4: concentrate on the answer to that. And I think that
• 59:19
  Speaker 4: is the thing that's going to possibly lead you to
• 59:25
  Speaker 4: healthier way of being.
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: My brother, I don't really state you man, Listen, guys
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: legend Michael John White.
• 59:38
  Speaker 1: The movie new movie he has coming out, The Secret
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: between Us, very powerful movie. Very powerful message on forgiveness,
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: very powerful movie on restoration. I truly think that we're
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: in the season in today's society where we need films
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: to speak to where we are, films.
• 59:59
  Speaker 2: That are healing.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: As I watched this film, it's definitely healing, very cautharitic,
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 1: and I think we need more messages. As he shared,
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 1: that also allows us to see more love and also
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: to see what does grace looks like in real time.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: None of us are perfect. We're all on this journey
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: and we're all healing some parts of us, making new
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: some part of you. And maybe that's therapy for some
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: of you. Maybe that's getting counseling, coaching for some of you.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: You know, there's so many different healing modalities that you
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 1: can use. But I encourage you to please go see
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 1: this film. This is April third. April third is in
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 1: theaters everywhere. April third, The Secret between Starr and Michael
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: John White.
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: I'm telling you this is this listen. I'm not shamed
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 2: to say it.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: I was in tears because of the message that would
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: so deeply carried out by the characters and and uh
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 1: and and it's just a real message that we need today.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 1: On what does it look like to keep the family
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 1: together when uncertainty happens. Listen, you guys know this healing
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: conversation can always continue. Subscribe, like, share, and again, remember,
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 1: healing is a journey. Some of you are just starting out.
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: Some of you have been on the journey for a while.
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 1: Remember it's not long, it's not short. It's necessary. I
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: will say that if you want to become better, because
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: they said it's about shedding, and hopefully we can continue
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 1: to shed to become more of who God created us
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: to be. Healing is a journey and wholeness is a destination.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: Until next time, I'm doctor J. And this has been
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: another episode of Just Here with Doctor J. Just Here
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 1: with Doctor J, a production of the Black Effect Podcast Network.
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: or wherever.
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 2: You listen to your favorite shows. And you can follow
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: me at King J.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: Barnett on Instagram and x and follow us on YouTube.
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 2: Just Here, Doctor J.