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Series preview: Astros at Cardinals · Cardinal Territory: A St. Louis Cardinals Podcast

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: A very special crossover episode of Cardinal Territory and Crush
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: City Territory. I am so excited. My name's Katie we
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: I'm the host of the Cardinal Territory here with Chandler
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Roman Tyler Stafford, co host of Crushed City Territory, both
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: presented by Vowel Territory. Guys. How are you so nice
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: to see you?
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: I'm doing great, Katie. I highly recommend taking an airplane
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: with no air condition for two hours to Saint Louis.
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: It was a really it was a really revealing and
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: an uplifting experience that I had to get into your
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: city this afternoon.
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: Are you so excited to be in Saint Louis? Though?
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: When was the last time you were here?
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: So the last time I was here? And I think, Tyler,
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: can we'll remember this this sequence. I remember the last
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: time I was here because Tony Kemp got DFA and
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: it was the like it was a bad day for
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: Astro's Twitter, which Tyler is part of. Tony Kemp was
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: the ViBe's guy. He was he created like a whole
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: like T shirt for hugging guys at the home runs.
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: But like it was I think it was right after
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: the deadline, and they had a lot of roster just
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: he got squeezed off the roster and he got DFAD
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: here and I and this is not an exaggeration, I
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: walked in the visiting clubhouse at Bush Stadium and it
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: felt like a morgue because he was that loved in there.
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: Like I mean, you hear it all the time that
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: there's glue guys and there's guys that are indispensable, like Tyler.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: You know, Tony Kemp was that guy. So that was
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: the last time I was here, was in twenty nineteen
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: when Tony, Yeah, Tony Kemp ruled.
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: He was on the hooks when I worked there, and
• 1:38
  Speaker 3: he was so fun and he's the only player. I
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: don't know if they do this a lot, I would
• 1:42
  Speaker 3: imagine no. But he got a day off for maybe
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: even two days off in the middle of the season
• 1:49
  Speaker 3: because somehow, while still playing minor league baseball, he finished
• 1:53
  Speaker 3: his degree from Vanderbilt and he got to go back
• 1:56
  Speaker 3: to the graduation ceremony and so that was a big deal.
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: But yeah, Tony camp rules. That's that's a terrible memory.
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: How dare you bring that up?
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: I remember Ryan Presley blew as say, I do remember
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: Ryan Presley blew a save and blew us off in
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: the clubhouse unduly. The other thing I remember about being
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: a bus shame. So I haven't been here in a while, Katie.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: Do they still like have the horses come out and
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: like run around the run around the warning track every game?
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: No, just on opening day, but it is like the
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: highlight of the season. I mean, expectations were low coming
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: into the year, but they have the Clydesdale's for opening Day.
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: I'll make sure. I'll do my best to make sure
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: that your trip to Saint Louis goes better than my
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: trip to Houston last year when my suitcase never arrived
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: and I had to get three days worth of clothes
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: at Target and I showed up to then minute made
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: Park with a Target shopping bag as my backpack. And
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: I just didn't have a computer, I didn't have my credentials.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: I just had my iPad. So that was such such
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: a great trip. I really enjoyed Houston.
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: You did. You did introduce me to Jim Edmonds on
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: that trip, And I mean, full disclosure, I was a
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: Cardinals fan growing up because I Mark Maguire was my
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: favorite player growing up, and so I just became a
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: Cardinals fan, and meeting Jim Edmonds was was I'm not
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: gonna sit here and say one of the coolest things ever,
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: but just seeing a guy that I watched so much
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: in my childhood that was very Thank you for introducing
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: me to Jim.
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: You're so welcome. I tried to t heelp my friends
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: out when I can no. This is an exciting series
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: for me. It's always fun when your friends are at
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: the ballpark. Cardinals Astros one time division fos, now not
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: so much, but a lot of history between these two clubs.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: The Astros are coming off their fresh Office series win
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: over the Angels Cardinals fresh Office series win over the Phillies. Guys,
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: what was your big takeaway from the weekend matchup against Anaheim?
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: They're always going to be Anaheim to me.
• 3:45
  Speaker 3: They remembered how to hit, which was nice. It's been
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: a little while since the Astros remembered that they were
• 3:52
  Speaker 3: allowed to hit, and so they had a big old
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: fourteen run game. They did immediately forget to hit, after
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: which Chandler, I feel like all of my Astro's friends,
• 4:06
  Speaker 3: you've rubbed off on them too much because it's great.
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: As soon as they scored fourteen. I was at a
• 4:12
  Speaker 3: one year old birthday party and my friend Matt was like, yeah,
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: I mean, they scored so much yesterday, they're gonna get
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: shut out today. And I'm like, come on, man like,
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: and so I was thinking of him the whole time
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: until Dashers broke up the shutout in the eighth inning
• 4:28
  Speaker 3: or whatever of that game. But yeah, they look they
• 4:31
  Speaker 3: look good over the weekend, and it was there, you know,
• 4:34
  Speaker 3: the back end of the rotation too. So to be
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: able to win a series with you know, the three
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: guys that you have the biggest question marks, I mean,
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: especially with Ryan Gesso going and being a spot starter,
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: I thought they looked really good over the weekend.
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I thought it was you know, two outlier games
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: and then a game that's gonna be kind of how
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: they have to do things. You know, the fourteen run game,
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: sixteen hits, that's an outlier game. They just they got
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: it going. They had they had their best offensive night
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: of the year, and that's just gonna happen some days.
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: And then the next day they just they got shut
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: down by a by a crafty Tyler Anderson that has
• 5:10
  Speaker 2: given them, who has given them fits in the past.
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: He's a guy that they have not seen well before
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: and kind of knew it was coming. Joe spot have
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: played the infield in with two on and no out
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: in the first inning of that game, which should have
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: told you that they did not think they were going
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: to score many runs, and he was prophetic. They did not.
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: They scored one run. I think today's game on we're
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: recording this on Sunday. I think Sunday's game was probably
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: kind of more of what this team is. They it
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: was five singles and an estoc paratus three run homer.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: This is a team that is still not slugging a lot.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: But the one thing they are doing and Tyler, I
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: mean from watching them last year, this year, they're at
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: bats look night days as far as like taking pitches,
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: like walking, they're striking out too much, but they're seeing
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: like a ton of pitches. Like the bats look so
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: much better this year than they did at any point
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: last year, and like at some point it's going to
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: translate into runs. But like right now, it's they're putting
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: all these good at bats together and they're just not
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: getting a ton of slug ton of big hits and
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: Paradis had one of the Crawford boxes, Tyler, he may
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: hit like if they played one hundred and sixty two
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: games in the Crawford Boxes and in dyke In Park,
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: he would hit fifty five home runs Like, Yeah, it's incredible.
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: And forty eight of them would be home runs in
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: like three ballparks. Uh so, Yeah, he's definitely making the
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: most of the Crawford boxes.
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Shout out to Matt Kawahara. The Houston Chronically pointed
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: out this stat It's publicly available, but he's the first
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: one to find it. Estcoc Paradis is three homers in
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: this series, all three of them would have all been
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: homers and only two ballparks in the Major Leagues. Yeah,
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: dyke In Park and Fenway Park. So estcoc Paratus is
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: perfect for Dyke and Park. He's going to pull a
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: ton of balls into the Crawford Box. He's going to
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: see a lot of pitches. He just keeps, he keeps improving.
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: The plate discipline is obviously there, and he keeps looking
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: better and better. As Katie, he is the Astros third
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: basement that could have been another person at some point
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: this winter.
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, as you were describing his swing. I
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: was thinking, I know someone who's being profile marrors that
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: and was maybe almost an astro. But well, we'll get
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: into all of the Nolan Arnata discourse because there's a
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: lot to talk about, and you know, for a long
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: time over the off season, I thought this series would
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: have a lot more meaning than just your typical early
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: April matchup between an interleague series, because I really thought
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: that at one point Nolan Arnada was going to be
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: an astro, and so did so many other people. So
• 7:39
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• 8:44
  Speaker 1: All right, guys, let's just get into it. Nolan Arnado
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: is the third basement for the Saint Louis Cardinals. Still,
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: it was a long discourse chandlers, you and I both
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: know on top of that story pretty much was the
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: topic of our entire off seasons. You at least had
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: some actual news. I did not. My biggest story of
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: the off season was a trade that never happened. And
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: I think Nolan and the Cardinals deserves some credit here
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: because this easily could have been a situation in spring
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: where's it's an ordeal and it's problematic you have a
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: player who the organization was not shy about wanting to
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: trade still coming to your organization on when you know
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: position players report, And I think both the team and
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: the player have did a nice job of putting this
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: behind him. But of course this series is going to
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: raise some questions. But it's looking at the Astros right now.
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: I mean, did they really need him?
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: Well, the thing that is a little misleading is they
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: would heavy stocked Paradis no matter what, because the plan
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: was to acquire Nolan Arnado and Moveeesock Paradus to first base,
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: and Nolan Arnado would have played third base. They have
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: Christian Walker because they don't have Nolan Arnado, and Christian Walker,
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: as Tyler knows, has been pretty awful. It's been fifteen games,
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: but he is not He has not acquitted himself well
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: his first fifteen games as an Astro. He's chasing a
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: lot out of the strike zone. He just hasn't produced,
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: and he's in the cleanup spot every day. So it
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: is a little kind of misleading that that it would
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: be a different setup in that way. They still have
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: Esak paratus. But you know, I think the Astros were
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: intrigued by First of all, Nolan Arnado is, if not
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: the best defensive third basement of his generation, right up
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: there with with Matt Chapman. They were intrigued by the
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: defense because their priority all winter was to get their
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: infield defense better. It's why jose Al tuovays in the
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: left field. It's why Christian Walker they pivoted to Christian Walker,
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: who was a three time goal Glove winner at first base.
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: Their priority was defending on the infield better, and that
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: was what Nolan Arnado was going to help them do.
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: I do know that in Katie, you can speak to
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: this more than I can, because you're around him more.
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: But there was a lot of intrigue about Nolan plays
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: with an edge. He plays with He's got a tenacity
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: and kind of an edge about him that I think
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: there some people in the Ashers organization that that thought
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: that this clubhouse needed, that they needed a different kind
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: of edge, a different kind of you know, almost arrogance.
• 11:10
  Speaker 2: I'm not again, I've never met Nolan arnauda, so I
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: don't want to call him arrogant by any means, but
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: he just he's got some swag and he's got some
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: aura about him and Alex Bregman was a lot of
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: those things too, and they knew in the back of
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: their mind they were never bringing Bregman back, so they
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: needed somebody to kind of replace that, and Nolan, to
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: them looked like the guy that could provide that. And
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: as Katie, as you and I both know, the trade
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: was pretty much on the one yard line. It just
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: needed that one little thing to happen. He needed Nolan
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: Arnatto to say yes. He did not.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: He did not say yes. I agree with you. He's
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: he definitely has an edge. The word that I used
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: to describe Nolan Arnatto is intense, and that can come off,
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: maybe from an outside perspective as a negative perception, but
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: it's really not. I think it's a testament to just
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: how locked in he is, how committed he is ensuring
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: that he is at the highest level. Every day the
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: student takes no days off, no plays off. He's constantly
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: mimicking his swing any time of the day, whether it's
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: I've seen it, whether it's five hours before game time.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: He's alread's taking VP after the games like a true
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: baseball sicko. He's mimicking his stance in his hotel room
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: at two am, He's sending video to his teammates about
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: his swing, like, Hey, what do you think? What can
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: I do better? Here? He just I think lives and
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: breeds baseball, and that comes across in his play. I'm
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: not saying that he's like the warmest teammate, but I
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: think as he gets a little older, he turns thirty
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: four this Wednesday, and he kind of sees where the
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: Cardinals are at and they're weird transition development period. He's
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: kind of had to embrace the leadership role, although he
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: leads differently than your typical like gung ho. Hey, guys,
• 12:46
  Speaker 1: everyone's that, that's not Nolan. Nolan's like, hey, play better
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: than I got you. So I think you would have
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: fit in fine on an Astros club because of their
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: championship pedigree. They are winning ball club. We already talked
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: about the swing. I thought the Astros really represented a
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: lot of what Nolan was looking for. But as we know,
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: the unclarity about Alex Bagman attorney and Kyle Tucker being
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: traded days before did not help the situation. I know
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: we've said this before. You guys have said it on
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: your podcast, I've said it on mine. Nolan never said
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: no to the Astros. He just said not right now.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: But of course Houston has every right to say, we
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: can't wait on you. We're going to go sign Christian Walker.
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: And now here we are. We'll see how how he
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: does against what could have been his organization, his new team.
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: Tyler, It's it's interesting to have all the what ifs.
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: What would you have like if Nolan Arnod would have
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: said yes, Like, how much different do you think this team?
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's fifteen games. We can't really like extrapolate
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: a ton of what we've seen, But how do you
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: think the complexion of this team would have looked differently
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: if Nolan Arnott would have said yes.
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: I mean, from a long term standpoint, I think the
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: Astros are better off having you know, Issa Prates and
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: Christian Walker locked up in the corner for you know,
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: three or four more years. I think, you know, like
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: we said, it's been fifteen games, but I think if
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: you extrapolate over the next three or four years, that
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: probably puts them in a little bit more of a
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: flexible and consistent place. But I mean, Nolan Ernauto is
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: so much fun to watch, like, you know, like that
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: he's one of those guys that we talked about with
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: Kyle Tucker two that like rewards you for watching every day,
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: you know, like every at bat or you know, every
• 14:35
  Speaker 3: ground or at a third you are rewarded for watching.
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: And there's something to be said about having those guys
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: on your team. But I do think the way that
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: it shook out, it ended up probably being better off
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: for the Astros that it it didn't end up happening.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: You know, there's another member of the Cardinals clubhouse that
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: could have been an Astro and this one, Tyler, this
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: is gonna be kind of a deep cut that we
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: need to talk about.
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: I got a deeper cut for you after you do
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: this one.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: Oh wow, I.
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: Have no idea where we're going. I'm scared you.
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: Do you remember when Jim Crane and Dusty Baker just said,
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: now we don't want Wilson Contreras for jose Raketty.
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I sure do remember that.
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: So in response to that, James Klick had to pivot
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: and trade for Christian Vasquez from the Boston Red Sox,
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: who Christian Vasquez caught a no hitter in the World Series. Like,
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: let's let's first state that that like he was a
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: massive part of the Astros twenty twenty two Championship World
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: Series title. Like you can argue whether they win it
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: without him or not, but he was a huge part
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: of that. The two prospects that they gave up for
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: two months of Christian Vasquez were Emanuel Valdez and Will
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: You're a bray You Will You're a bray You who
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: won a Gold Glove and right field last year who
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: looks like the next among a very large contingent of
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: young players in Boston, and that him bloom Uh found
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: a way to get We've got so many tentacles here.
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: Will You're a braid You would be this team starting
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: right fielder right now, without a shadow of a doubt
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: if he were still an Astro. And you kind of
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: think back to, well, if they if they just get
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: Wilson Contraras at the deadline, they giveaway Jose Orchiti, who
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: we now know is often injured getting non tendered. It's
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: one of those kind of what if moments, Tyler, that
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: makes you think, like, how much would this team look
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: so much different? Like we've we spent a whole winter
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: talking about how this team has no outfielders. They have
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: two infielders playing outfield right now, if that trade goes differently,
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: they have a bona fide right fielder. Will You're a
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: bray You that's winning a Gold Glove and that's putting
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: up huge numbers.
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: You probably have Jiner at first, too, right, like you
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: know you're you're moving people around or Wilson.
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, now you sign a catcher for eighty seven point
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: five million dollars for five years, and then after two
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: years you're like just kidding, not tracking anymore. Only in
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: Saint Louis.
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: Guy, Yeah, okay, so here's my deeper cut. I don't
• 17:03
  Speaker 3: even think you were around for this, Chandler, But in
• 17:06
  Speaker 3: twenty seventeen, every single person on the internet wanted the
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: Astros to trade for Sonny Gray, and that was a
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: big rumor at the time. You know, all of the
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: different fake trade scenarios. And then I feel like it
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: happened in several more times. But there was like a
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: two or three year stretch where it seemed like anytime
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: someone in the Astro's rotation was struggling, I was like, well,
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: why don't you trade for Sunny Gray? Why don't you
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: sign him? So, for whatever reason, I will always think
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: of Sonny Gray as an almost astro, even though nothing
• 17:41
  Speaker 3: I don't think was ever close to that.
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: Well, I saw Willia Bray you beat up on the
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: Cardinals last weekend in Boston, can confirm he is a
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: legit talent. And you guys will see Sonny Gray tomorrow
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: against Branbarvaldez. So I don't know, it's weird. I guess
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: I didn't realize how many connections were between Houston and
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: Saint Louis, and we didn't even talk to the best
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: or talk about the best one, Phil Mayton. What a
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: pit of that has been. I'm so serious. Look, it's
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: not like the Cardinals made a ton of free agent signings.
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: They made literally one, and it was Phil Maton. But
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: if you're gonna make one signing, make it a good one.
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: And two weeks in he has absolutely solidified that. Back
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: into the bullpen, the Cardinals already have Ryan Helsley, one
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: of the best closers in the game. They tell me,
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: if you heard this before, the Cardinals really love their veterans,
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: and they really like having that veteran presence in the bullpen,
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: and they just really felt like they should go get one,
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: and they chose wisely with Phil Maeton, he's fit right in.
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: I know, Chandler, you know Phil. Well, he's done a
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: nice job in that setup man role, usually in the
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: seventh or eighth depending on the opposed handedness of the
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: team that he will be facing. But so far, so
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: good for Mayton, and he definitely looks like he's fitting in.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and he does it very differently, which I think
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: it takes a lot of people to get used to that.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: He barely throws ninety that it's you know, a lot
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: of spin. One of my favorite memories with Phil is
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: they he legitimately had an argument to be MVP of
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: the twenty twenty one World Series if the Ashers would
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: have won it because none of their guys hit and
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: he got like every massive out. Like he was incredible
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: in the twenty twenty one World Series, to the point
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: where like he came to one of the pregame press
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: like you're supposed to send like a notable player up
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: to the pregame press conference in the World Series, they
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: sent Phil Maton up. And Phil his nickname on Baseball
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: Reference is spin rate, And so I asked him, I
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: was like, Phil, does anyone call you spin rate? And
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: he was like, no, when players So remember players Weekend,
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: When players Weekend used to exist. I think it still
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: does exist, but when it was cool and they could
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: all put the nicknames on the back of their jersey.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: He was a rookie in San Diego and he didn't
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: get to choose his nickname because the nickname on the
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: back of his jersey was spin Rate, and Baseball Reference
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: took that to be his nickname. So but yeah, it's
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: Phil does it. It was actually pretty funny. Dana Brown
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: actually unprompted. I was talking to him for a story
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: in spring training and I ended up writing this that
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: you know. I was asking Dana, like, what's been the
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: biggest adjustment from going from a very much a scouting
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: lean that he has he came up as a scout
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: to being in a GM role in a hybrid and
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: kind of an organization. It's very analytically forwardly thinking. And
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: he said, you know, film Aton is the best example,
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: because like I watched him pitch and I didn't know
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: how this guy got anyone out. And then I had
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: to go ask all the R and D guys and
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: all like the advanced guys, and they showed me like, oh,
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: it's the spin rate, it's the extension. It's all the
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: stuff that you don't think about, and Dana Brown said,
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: So from that ment and on, I started calling film
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: Aton the magic Man.
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: Because oh, that's way better than spin.
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: Rate, right, so maybe he should be the mad Maybe
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: spin Rate should should be the magic Man. But yeah,
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: film Aton sneaky good pick up. I cannot believe he
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: did not have a job until like March.
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: If I were, if I were a GM, every off season,
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: I would just sign film Aton and Charlie Morton to
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: a one year deal and then I would go into
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: the Hall of Fame for being the best gem of
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: all time. I don't know why no one has figured out.
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: Just give those guys money every year and it'll probably
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: work out.
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: What's crazy about Mayton as The Cardinals signed him on
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: like March thirteenth, and he had maybe a two week
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: runway to get ready and fully ramped up for the
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: season because they were planning for him to be in
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: that setup man role come opening day. And Phil's like, oh, yeah,
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: I'll be fine, I won't need much. And he threw
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: on the backfields twice, appeared in one spring training game,
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: and then came out for I believe the eighth inning
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: on opening day and was great, and I was like,
• 21:30
  Speaker 1: all right, yeah this, you know, this is not how
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: I would recommend necessarily navigating an off season. But again,
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: if you're gonna make one signing, you better nail it.
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: And so far, so good for Film Mayton, who is
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: a big fan of Chandlers as I didn't know how
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: to introduce myself, so my name dropped you. Oh oh,
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: my friend Chandler.
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: You gotta be careful with that. It worked out with
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: philm Aton, but yeah, they door.
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: Now still plenty to talk about. And I'm interested to
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: see you on your your guys' perspective on what the
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: heck the Cardinals are doing, because I'm sure it doesn't
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: make a lot of sense from an outsider perspective. But first,
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: let's hear from our pals. Fandel Sports Network take me
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: out to my.
• 22:11
  Speaker 3: Band sports Now work.
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Blatch.
• 22:15
  Speaker 6: These big I cannot be I I'm just glad they
• 22:18
  Speaker 6: am the.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: Fore roo for the Cardinals.
• 22:26
  Speaker 3: Sports Now Cardinals.
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: That was That was a.
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: Legit ad that that was real. That's FANDL money right there.
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: I think I could write the astros one Chandler. I'm
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: a musician. So I feel like, if they need one,
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: hit me up, I'm ready to go.
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: You gotta get FanDuel to buy them first and the
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: deal that hears that?
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: All right, Gus, what do you think about the Chandler?
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: We spent all spring training new their ASTs and Cardinals
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: very close out in Florida. But I'm mentioned to see
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: your guys' take on what the heck the Cardinals are
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: doing because for so long they've been one of the
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: premier teams in the National League. Of course, it hasn't
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: been that way over the last five years. Their player
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: development system has kind of fallen through the cracks, which
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: is crazy to think about because for so long the
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: Cardinals exemplified what it means to be a draft and
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: development club and then succeed at it. But now they're
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: kind of like walking the middle. They still want to win,
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: but they're not spending a lot of money, and they
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: well they are. They're just relocating it to the minor league,
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: so they're not spending a lot on their major league
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: pay roll. I should clarify. They can kind of get
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: away with this plan because they play in the NL Central,
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: but it's just not something you see a lot their
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: transition plan with the longtime president of baseball operations John Mozelak.
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: He's stepping down, Heim Bloom taking over. It just seems
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: like an organization that's kind of stuck and doesn't know
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: which direction. It knows which direction it should go, but
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: doesn't really want to go there yet because it doesn't
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: want to pivot on winning. As you can tell, not
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: a lot makes sense. It is confusing to you, as
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: it is maybe to other people who are not around
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: the Cardinals every.
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: Day a little bit. But you know, I cover an
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: organization that fired a World Series winning general manager and
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: let its owner run baseball operations for three months. So
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: like I'm used, weird, but I still can't get over that.
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: Like John Mozelak, did they fire him or are they
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: just not getting his His contracts just not being renewed
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: right now.
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: They offered him extension after the twenty twenty two season,
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: it was the first week of spring training in twenty
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: twenty three, and his current deal expires after twenty twenty five,
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: and I think he's been looking at stepping down for
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: a while. He's it's popular to dunk on mo right
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: now because the team is not good, but his job
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: at the end of the day, was to make his bosses,
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: the DeWitt family, a lot of money, and he definitely
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: did that. You can absolutely take exception to where the
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: team is right now, because it's not in a great place.
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: But Moe has been here for so long and I
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: think he was looking to step down in the near future,
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: and the kind of collapse of this team in twenty
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: three and the subsequent collapse of their player development over
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: the last few years just kind of made this an
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: easier transition. So he was not fired. He was never
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: going to be fired. It was always he was always
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: gonna kind of have the ability to go down on
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: his own terms.
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: Okay, so I'm still confused as to why he's still
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: running the offs. Like they had a huge thing to
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: do this offseason that was to trade Nolan Arnatto and
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: then possibly trade other high priced veterans on their roster.
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: I'm unclear why they let a Lane Duck Baseball Ops
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: employee try to do that when high and Bloom is
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: here and like can could have helped, could have had
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: input like that to me is unclear. But but I
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: also like I'm wondering too, Like, you know, we've talked
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: about all these Astros connections that they have. Like let's
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: not forget that Jeff Luno and Michael Oyis and Sigmatete
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: all like started their tenures in Saint Louis before they
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: all came to Houston, So like you did all kind
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: of fall apart, like when they all like did start
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: to erode, like once they left and came to Houston
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: and like instituted what they did and to like build
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: a dynasty, Like did they just like kind of was
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: it an inertia thing where they just kind of presume
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: that like whoever was coming behind them would just sustain
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: what they had done and it just didn't happen that way.
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: It's a great question. Here we are again with the
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: Cardinals Astros crossover. There's so many hidden links between these
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: two organizations. The Cardinals in the early twenty tens were
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: like the textbook of player billing your club out of
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: player development and being successful at it, and a lot
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: of those people you just mentioned were instrumental in that process,
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: but then went to Houston and started their own and
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: the Cardinals kind of lost all of that, and essentially
• 26:36
  Speaker 1: there weren't talented people in the organization, but the backbone
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: that foundation that was supposed to work alongside MO to
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: ensuring that this player development factory kept turning out talent
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: kind of split up all over the place. So I
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: think the Cardinals always had the resources, but then they
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: started trying to invest more in their major league club
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: because they were having trouble staying up with, you know,
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: the Phillies, the Dodgers, Padres, the Mets because they aren't
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: in markets like that Saint louis Is, though the fans
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: are rampant and it is a baseball town, it's small market.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: So they felt like they had to redirect all of
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: their money to free agency and supplementing the club, and
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: they essentially drained player development dry. They cut positions, they
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: lacked adequate technology, adequate staffing. And I think if those
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: people that you mentioned were still in the organization under
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: you know, didn't go to under Lunau to the Astros,
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: or again if you're micaelast and Sig to the Orioles eventually,
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: I don't know if they would have allowed that to happen,
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: then maybe that's not fair. I think there was definitely
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: pushback from MO about, hey, we need to keep investing
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: in player development, but not nearly enough, Otherwise the Cardinals
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: wouldn't be here. But it is interesting to see the
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: parallels between where the Cardinals are and where the Astros are,
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: their differences in their farm systems. You can definitely see
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: the impact of Saint Louis in Houston, though I think
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: it's fair to say that Houston has excelled much more
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: than the Cardinals have in the last ten years.
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: Is this a safe space to say somebody needs to
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: tell Dana Brown to change his passwords after this series?
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: Is? Where's Chris Correa?
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: Now?
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: I wonder David Eckstein too, Whatever it was.
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: David Freeze four, I'm so glad that was before my time.
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: Oh, I'm so glad I didn't have to touch that.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: I'll know that would not. Can you imagine you and
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: I working on that together.
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: No, I don't even want to think about that.
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: For ye, you mentioned the Cardinals being in kind of
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: a weird place. As a thirty something guy who grew
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: up in Houston, I don't believe the Cardinals are dead
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: until they are buried in the ground. They're is strong
• 28:47
  Speaker 3: devil magic that they use to sneak into the playoffs
• 28:51
  Speaker 3: and then magically be good. So I don't. I'm not
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: I'm not buying any of this about the Cardinals not
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: being good until I see it in Game one sixty two,
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: because I've seen it too many times growing up here
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: to believe anything else.
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Katie, you just said like they're they're they play
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: in a bad division. I mean the Cubs are. Yeah,
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: the Cubs are pretty good, but like Justin Steele Blue
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: is on, that's not great, Like the Brewers are gonna
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: mess around and win eighty five games somehow, Like if
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: this team is like within four or five games of
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: first play, like if if they can somehow be in
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: contention at the deadline, like are they gonna add? Like
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: like what like how is this gonna go? If like
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: they do, because they've played pretty well to start this season.
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: It's and like you look at the roster like this
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: is not like a team of nobodies like I mean
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: Wilson Contraras, Nolan Arnatto, like Sonny Gray, Ryan Helsley, like
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: and there's good players here, Like what happens if they're
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: Like if you get to June or July and this
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: team's like sort of in it, Like are they gonna
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: add at the deadline? Or is this like a total
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: punt here.
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: No one has said this in the organization at least,
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: but I know I feel it in my heart and soul.
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: If the Cardinals just hover around five hundred coming into
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: the trade deadline, being around five hundred is very much
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: a contention in this division. I mean, you said it, Cubs,
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: they're good, but they had some key losses, the Brewers
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: or the Brewers, I know, the Cardinals just lost a
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: series to the Pirates or whatever. And you can't convince
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: me on the Reds. Every year people try to convince
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: me that the Reds are it, and every year I'm like,
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: not really. So if you're five hundred and you're the
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: same loss Cardinals coming into July, coming into right around
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: the trade deadline, I firmly believe they're adding, not to
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: the extent where it's going to derail their youth booment
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: plans or it's gonna put hein Boom in somewhat of
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: a bad spot. But you think John Mozelok's going to
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: go out like this, You think he's gonna go out
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: getting booed at opening Day where his legacy is like, oh,
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: this guy ran the Cardinals in the ground, which is
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: unfair but this is a what have you done for
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: me now? Industry. No, if there's any chance that the
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: Cardinals can compete in the second half of the season,
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: for whether that be for a wild card birth or
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: a division title, the organization is going to go for
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: it in the most cardinal way possible, the same way
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: they've done the last couple of trade deadlines when they
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: were in it. They're going to incrementally, like marginally improved
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: and worked for them in twenty twenty two when they
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: traded Harrison Baider for Jordan Montgomery and then got Jordan
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: Kintana or jose Kntana from the Pirates didn't really work
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: for them. In twenty twenty four when they traded Tommy Edmund,
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: known power hitter Tommy Edmund by the Way, for Eric
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: Betty and three weeks of Tommy fam that was a
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: fun experience for me. But that's how the Cardinals buy
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: at the deadline, and to an extent, I get it,
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: because if you're the Saint Louis Cardinals, you should never
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: punt on a season. I commend them for not totally rebuilding,
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: though I agree with you Chandler. I think the way
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: that they're operating right now is peculiar. But my concern is,
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: how did the Cardinals get like stay five hundred, and
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: if they do, how would that impact him's plan because
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: I'm sure what he envisions for the organization is not
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: the same as what Moe is currently envisioning, and it's
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: not supposed to be.
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I just I can't fathom, Like, and
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: you've and you've written this in kron and talked about this,
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: like the attendance is down to it no one's going
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: one of these games either, and like it's when you
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: can't get fans in Saint Louis to go out to games,
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: like that's a pretty dire indictment of what's going on.
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: But like you just said, like if this team is
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: around five hundred and June or like, and if they
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: start playing well, like fans will come back. And then
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: it's like, what are you going to reward these people
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: with at July? On July thirty first, if like you're
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: in striking distance, you're gonna stand pat or go like
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: get a sixth inning reliever, like and that's gonna be
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: your only addition, Like I don't know, Like, I mean, hell,
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: you may see the best rental starter available at the
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: deadline pitch at Bush Stadium on Monday. If the Ashers
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: aren't in it, if they're out of it. Fromber Valdez
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: is right up there with Sandy al Contra on the
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: on the deadline, you know, sweep Steak. I think the
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: Ashros will be in it. So I don't think Fromber
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: will be dangled in trades. But like you look at that,
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's what they would go after, like the
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: most enviable rentals, right to not put to to try
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: to go in on this season and to not put
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: Home in a bad spot next year, and to still
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: have some roster space available for this quote unquote youth
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: movement that they can't do because they didn't trade anybody
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: this offseason.
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: Correct, Yeah, make it makes sense. I don't, although I
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: we'll say, just playing devil's advocate here, maybe some of
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: the reason why Moe did or did not make these
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: trades is because given what Heim did in Boston trading
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: Mookie Bets, maybe the Cardinals didn't want that to be
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: Hime's first move is coming over and then blowing it
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: up trading Ronado Hellesley. I think if there was a
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: different president of Baseball Operations would have been gone, considering
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: ninety five percent of the industry. Was very surprised when
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: the Cardinals said at the GM meetings in November that
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: they would not be trading Hellsley. Everyone myself included, kind
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: of figured he'd be a no brainer trade candidate, and
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: Hellesley felt the same way, and most hands were tied
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: a little bit sunny gray full no trade cause Wilson
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: Contraria's same thing, Miles Michael the same thing, and then
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: Nolan Arnatto would have waived it for about four to
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: five teams and ended up not so.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: Weird was wouldn't wait for We know that, we.
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: Know there was definitely one. We'll get into a little
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: bit more of the next three days to come, but
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: we need to do a segment, a Player to Watch
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: segment presented by FanDuel Sports Network, And to me, it's
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: pretty obvious who my player to watch is. It's Nolan Arnado.
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: So he doubled today, first extra base hit in a
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: while to start the season, though after fifteen games he's
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: played in fourteen of them, he is hitting two eighty
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: three with an eight h two OPS. He hit a
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: home run opening day, got a curtain call that was
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: a cool moment for Nolan, I think, just given what
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: he went through over the off season, but he's a
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: queen of pitter. His swing looks a lot better. He's
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: never gonna be satisfied with where he's at. But this
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: is a guy that I'm watching because with the Cardinals
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: down Yvon Herrera, who was their best hitter to start
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: the year, Wilson Contraras is slowly but surely coming out
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: of that slump. They need some thumb from the right side,
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: and I think Nolan and I was gonna bring it.
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: So that's my player to watch. Do you guys have
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: one in this.
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna say Hunter Brown because I just really like
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: watching Hunder Brown, pitch Man.
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: You should watch Hunter Brown. That's the player to watch.
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: He'll start the middle game, He'll start on Tuesday. And
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: I mean, I don't think the entire industry or the
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: entire like sport as a whole, like Acknowledge is like
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: this is he is probably the best or second or
• 35:22
  Speaker 2: third best like young starting pitcher that no one's talking
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: about right now like he is. He was incredible last year.
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: You know, from May fifth through the end of last season,
• 35:33
  Speaker 2: only Chris Saale and Paul Skeens had a lower era
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: than Hunter Brown. He had at he had a lower
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: RA and Trek Scooble, who won the American Leagues I
• 35:41
  Speaker 2: Young Award unanimously. He's now sitting ninety eight pretty regularly
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: in his first three starts. I wrote about that on
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: The Athletic this week, that he didn't necessarily go into
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: the off season trying to increase his velocity, but wanted
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: to get more mobile, wanted to get more flexible, And
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: because he just focused on his mobility and his flexibility
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: so much, He's now thrown five pitches this year, ninety
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: nine miles an hour harder he had thrown seven in
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: his first three years in the Big leagues combined. He
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: is sitting like ninety seven and a half and maintaining
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: it throughout all these games. His sinker is me six now.
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: His breaking balls are legit. Like. He is really really
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: fun to watch. I'm not saying he's appointment television yet.
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: This isn't like a clear your schedule. We got to
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: watch Hunter Brown pitch, but he's getting there like this,
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: He is really really fun to watch. Tyler. Do you
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: have someone that is just as fun to watch?
• 36:33
  Speaker 4: Well?
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: My first would be the ghost of Bud Norris growing up.
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: That was Bud Norris just owned the Cardinals growing and
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: you know, he was he was okay, but for whatever reason,
• 36:44
  Speaker 3: he turned into Roger Clemens against the Cardinals. Anytime I
• 36:47
  Speaker 3: see the Astros and Cardinals play, that's who I am
• 36:50
  Speaker 3: thinking of personally. That's the kind of analysis I bring
• 36:54
  Speaker 3: to this podcast. But I mean, the Astros line really
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: seemed to be heating up over the weekend, and Chandler,
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: you mentioned Christian Walker has gotten off their really rough start,
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: but he did draw what four or five walks after
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: having none, you know, through the first part of the season.
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: He's still hitting the ball hard, and so it feels
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: like that kind of initial breakout is coming for him.
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: And I think if that domino can fall, I think
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: the Astros lineup gets significantly better because of the pressure
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: it takes off of all of the other hitters. And
• 37:33
  Speaker 3: so that's that's who I'm really paying attention to right now.
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Christian Walker went forty seven straight played appearances that
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: a walk, finally got one in Seattle, and he's looked better.
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: But I would also offer that they're not paying him
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: twenty million dollars a year to draw walks. They would
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: like him to hit the ball in the gap. They
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: would like him hit the ball out of the ballpark.
• 37:54
  Speaker 2: And he should do that pretty quickly, because if he does,
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: like you said, Tyler, the entire complexion of this lineup changes.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: If they can get Christian Walker going.
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: Has Walker homeward yet this year he has.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: He destroyed a hanging breaking ball from I believe Joe
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: Ryan in Minneapolis hit it off the second deck and
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: you kind of thought that was gonna be kind of
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: the X. Heale, like, all right, he's back. And then
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: after that it looked even worse. Honestly, after that home run,
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: so you know, again the bats look better, but it's
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: they You remember the scene, Katie, have you seen a
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: Little Big League?
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: No? You know, I'm bad at movies, Tyler, have you
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: seen a Little Big League?
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: It was like the second podcast in a row, you
• 38:32
  Speaker 3: brought up Little big League?
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: Hit me, I'm big League? Okay. So premise to the
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: store premise of the movie, I'm not gonna get all
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: into it, but a kid becomes the manager of the twins.
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: And when the kid is managing the twins, there's a
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: there's a veteran player that was his favorite player growing up.
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: His name was Jerry. I forgot his last name, but
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: Jerry was his favorite player growing up. Obviously old veteran
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: player in Decline and they're playing together. There's a scene
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: where they're they're in a game and Jerry gets a
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: seeing Eye single, just bounces the ball through the right side,
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: and Billy Haywood, the manager, leaps off the bench and
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: starts so excited, and he's got this crusty veteran old
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: bench coach that's helping him out. And the bench coach
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: taps and he goes, kid, don't you think it says
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: a lot when you're that excited about a CEINGI single.
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: Then they release and then they release Jerry the next day.
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: No, not Jerry.
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: So I'm not trying to say Christian Walker is in
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: Jerry spot. But the fact that we're sitting here like
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: grasping it shes like, oh, he's drawing walks. Yeah. It
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: sounds like we were what we were doing with Jose
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: Brady a couple of years ago and was like, oh
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: he hit a ball ninety eight miles an hour on
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: a line. Yay. Now like you're making twenty million dollars,
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: like you better be doing more than drawn walks. So, yeah,
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: they need The moral of the story is he needs
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: to produce. But it's fifteen games. He'll he'll probably be fine.
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: By the end of the season, all right, so our
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: players to watch. Let me just make sure I have
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: this straight. Nolanado cut a brown Christian Walker and the
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: ghost of Bud Norris.
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: And Jerry from Little Big League, A Little.
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: Big Way perfect. Okay. Well, in case you guys miss it,
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: you can now stream the Cardinals games through FanDuel Sports
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: Network and if you use the promo code Baseball thirty,
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: you can start it off with a thirty day extended
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: free trial at fanduelsportsnetwork dot com slash packages. The steel
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: expires May second, twenty twenty five, nineteen ninety nine, a
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: month after your free trial. Cancel during your free trial
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: to avoid charges. Eligibility restrictions apply. Visit fanduelsportsnetwork dot com
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: for details. Two things that you guys mentioned speed and
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: young starters, and that's not something that the astros. We'll
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: see for their next three days, Cardinals are throwing out
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: the veterans. They'll have Sunny Grand Monday, Eric Betty on Tuesday,
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: and Stephen Mattz will make his first start of the
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: season on Wednesday in the series finale. The Cardinals are
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: going to a six man rotation on Wednesday. It's been
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: their plan since the season opened. They are entering a stretch.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: They are three games in now to a stretch from
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: April eleventh to May seventh. They have one scheduled off day,
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: so they're going to deploy the six man rotation. Matts
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: has been fine and long relief. He actually had a
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: really solid spring, but we'll see how he does in
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: his first start. Again, these are not guys that necessarily
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: throw a lot of bilo at you. Sonny grays Vila
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: was down most of spring but looks to be a
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: little bit better now. They're contact guys. Sonny has swing
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: and this, of course, but yeah, you're not going to
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: see youth. Then you're not going to see ninety seven
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: from your starters.
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: I know that Steven Mattz throws at his left hand, right, Yes, okay, Well,
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: the Astros have taken are going to be confused. Yes,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: the Astres have taken the fewest at bats against left
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: handed pitching of any team in baseball. And like the
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: next like the twenty ninth fewest is like thirty plate
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: appearances ahead of them, because the Astros have one left
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: handed hitter on their entire roster, and it is Jordan
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: albare It's Jordan Alvarez, who's very good. But yeah, they
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: are all. That's such a right handed lineup that no
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: manager in his right mind is going to go out
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: of his way to throw a left handed starter against them.
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: Now it's going to line up in rotations. Well, it's
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: gonna line up in rotations.
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: See the San Louis Cardinal.
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: But I mean, yeah, facing the left handed starter is
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: that's a big deal for an Ashers team that uh
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: that And you said, look, you said that, and Tyler
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: you had you have to have noticed this throughout the
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: first fifteen games, like they won't see a ton of vello.
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: This team has seen nothing but like sinkers and just
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: not junk. I don't want to, I don't want to
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: dismiss like pitchers that are that do it a little differently,
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: but like the Ashers have just seen like Kyle, they
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: saw Kyle HENDRICKX today, they saw Tyler Anderson yesterday like that,
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: They've all they've seen are just like a lot of sinkers.
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: In on their right, in on their hands, and a
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: lot of just junk, and they haven't really seen a
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: ton of vilo and I think that honestly has contributed
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: a little bit to to to their offensive malaise, because
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: like they've just seen such unorthodox kind of pitching to
• 42:46
  Speaker 2: start this season that I think they'd welcome at this point,
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: like just a normal like four seam and then curveball
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: change up, like they'd welcome like a traditional kind of starter.
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure. They They have definitely seen some interesting
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: pitching and the lefties that they have seen all have
• 43:02
  Speaker 3: reverse splits, so they have not faced like a real
• 43:06
  Speaker 3: true lefty this season, So I'm sure they'll be excited
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: about that. One final cross pollination here you mentioned not
• 43:15
  Speaker 3: having a ton of youth, you do have former Astros
• 43:19
  Speaker 3: draft pick and TCU legend Luke and Baker on the team.
• 43:24
  Speaker 3: So he was drafted by the Astros in twenty fifteen
• 43:27
  Speaker 3: after winning a Gatorade Player of the Year. This is
• 43:31
  Speaker 3: while I was still at Texas A and M covering sports,
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: and it was a very big deal that Luke and
• 43:37
  Speaker 3: Baker chose TCU over A and M. So you got
• 43:41
  Speaker 3: him too. So we got all kinds of connections for
• 43:44
  Speaker 3: the series.
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: And then and then, hold on, Katie, you mentioned youth.
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: We have a weird thing on our pod. We are
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: contractually obligated, mentioned Cam Smith.
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it took forty three minutes, almost forty four minutes
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: up Camps.
• 43:59
  Speaker 2: I gotta put my chain. That's why Tyler's so antsy.
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: Tyler is the president of the camp Smith fan.
• 44:04
  Speaker 3: Club, the conductor of the hype train.
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: Yes, the conductor of the hype train. This is us
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: mentioning Cam Smith to fulfill our contractual obligations.
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: He did you see he hit a home run?
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: Channeler, that was what I did. I did he hit
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: a pull side home run. He finally didn't hit something
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: the other way. Hey, but Tyler, I mean, let's be real,
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: like real quick, like forty five seconds to himnute, like
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: he did look better. He looked this series against the Angels,
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: like you could tell like it looks better. I don't.
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: He's still got some growing pains in there, but he's
• 44:32
  Speaker 2: looking better.
• 44:33
  Speaker 3: Yeah, he looks like a major league hitter. He's also
• 44:37
  Speaker 3: good at right field, which is stupid. That's dumb. Like
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: he was playing third base for Florida State last year.
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: It's insane that he's good at right field and he
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: just is like he he looks like he's done that
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: his whole life. He's way faster than he should be
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: for the giant that he is. And uh, you know,
• 44:59
  Speaker 3: we we've mentioned the ashst plate appearance is looking a
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: lot better. Camp Smith is another one. He every plate appearance.
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: You know, he might ground it and you know, into
• 45:08
  Speaker 3: the dirt to second base, but he takes pitches really well.
• 45:13
  Speaker 3: He's drawing walks, he's patient, and uh yeah, Cardinals fans
• 45:19
  Speaker 3: get to see two fun corner outfielders for the first
• 45:22
  Speaker 3: time with with Hosel TV playing left field. Hopefully we'll
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: see I don't know, does he get to play it
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: Fromervel doesn't. Yeah, She's they're gonna stick him in the
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: left field and he's not gonna have anything to do.
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: He's gonna they're gonna put a hammock out there for him, body.
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: His nails for eight innings, like he's gonna have nothing
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: to do the first two games.
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: Okay, So Tyler is very similar to uh camp Smith
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: as I am to Jordan Walker. So I get it.
• 45:48
  Speaker 3: I yeah, I got my chain on just for him.
• 45:52
  Speaker 3: Come on, I.
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: Can't have the chain. But on this podcast, this is
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: Jordan Walker Truther podcast, I respect it. I respect that you, guys.
• 46:00
  Speaker 3: Chandler is a hater, but somebody's got to play the
• 46:02
  Speaker 3: other side.
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: It's impressing in.
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: Every podcast, and I'm not surprised Chandler's bad cop.
• 46:07
  Speaker 3: I was gonna say, would you believe that Chandler did
• 46:10
  Speaker 3: not have just fettered joy about someone in baseball?
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: Uh? I believe that's textbook Chandler. I love that.
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: That'll be on my tombstone. That'll be the first line
• 46:22
  Speaker 2: of first line of my obituary.
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: Chandler, room with obituary unless I go down with you,
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: which is.
• 46:29
  Speaker 2: Possible, very possible this week.
• 46:31
  Speaker 1: I know. I can't wait. I love when my friends
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: are in town. No one ever comes and visits me
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: in Saint Louis. But I would have murdered you if
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: you didn't so super excited for this. Cardinals Astros, serious, guys,
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: this was fun. This was Cardinal Territory's first crossover episode,
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: and honestly, I didn't think I did too bad with
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: the producing. Long time listeners, loyal listeners know that this
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: is a this is a fault of mine. I'm not
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: exactly the best at the ad reads, but a lot
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: of pressure with Crush City on, so I thought I
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: brought my game.
• 46:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, thanks for having us.
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: You were better than the Cubs. Guys. Mmm, don't They
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: will tell the hot of the mooney that I'm telling them.
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: All right, guys, thanks for listening. As always, you can
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: follow Chandler at the Athletic on Twitter at Chandler realm
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: Tyler at Tyler see Stafford. I'm on the Athletic as
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: well at Katie j. Wu on Twitter. Uh. Yeah, should
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: be a fun series with these Cardinals and Astros and
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: we're ready to break it down from both sides for
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: the boys, I'm Katie Wou. Thanks for watching.
• 47:27
  Speaker 3: Bye,