Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / Northern Land Council CEO Marion Scrymgour

Transcript

Northern Land Council CEO Marion Scrymgour · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Three sixties mailbox. Get in contact at Mixed one O
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: four nine dot com dot Au thanks to Keres MT
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: and the care Gateway supporting carers across the Northern Territory.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: And if you do want to send us an email,
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: you most certainly can three point sixty at Mix one
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: O four nine dot com dot Au. Now, as you've
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: just heard, fishows are going to have to register to
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: fish along more than three thousand kilometers of the Northern
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Territory coast. The move has been announced by the Northern
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: Land Council and joining me in the studio is the
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: CEO of the Northern Land Council, Marion Scrimjaw.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: Good morning, Good morning Katie.
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: Now, Marian, can you talk me through what exactly has
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: been decided?
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: Katie.
• 0:41
  Speaker 3: Look, we've, after long consultation and communication with traditional owners,
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: looked at what is the best process moving forward so
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: that we can put a balance between the needs and
• 0:57
  Speaker 3: concerns of traditional owners, also making sure that we can
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: give fishermen access to some of those areas a registration
• 1:07
  Speaker 3: system and I've heard a fan saying that it's not
• 1:11
  Speaker 3: a legal document, it is part of our system. And
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: if the Northern Lane council chooses to put in place
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: a registration process rather than a permit system, well, then
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: that is a progress that can be done through the
• 1:27
  Speaker 3: Northern Lane Council's framework. We don't and we have never
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: said at any time that we would put a permit
• 1:37
  Speaker 3: system in place, but a simple registration process one off
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: that will enable a fisherman to have two years permit
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: free access to over three thousand square kilometers of sea
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: country is actually a win for fishermen.
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: Marion. Why has it been decided to do this registration
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: process rather than the permit.
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: Because if people go in via you know, travel into
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: the intertitle zone on their boat, then they don't need
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: it or don't require a permit, Katie. So to try
• 2:16
  Speaker 3: and work the best that we can, we thought a
• 2:19
  Speaker 3: registration process that could you know, allow traditional owners some
• 2:26
  Speaker 3: you know process to be able to to monitor and
• 2:30
  Speaker 3: make sure that everyone does the right thing when they're fishing,
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: that we can we can all work together to make
• 2:39
  Speaker 3: it happen. A permit system. I think everyone gets caught
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: up that a permit system is you know, going to
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: be onerous, and it's and it's and it's you know,
• 2:50
  Speaker 3: people are just not happy with that. So with the registration,
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: people will sign a code of you know what will
• 2:58
  Speaker 3: get printed out from as a kind of con do
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: the right thing and everyone will have access to that water,
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: which is a good thing.
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: Now, is that system ready to go? Is that website
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: ready to go where people can jump on there and
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: start registering from today?
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: Yes they can.
• 3:15
  Speaker 3: And I got a text to say that David Kerravolof
• 3:19
  Speaker 3: and Afant has jumped on and registered himself, so he's
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: got a register.
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: So he's also.
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: Gone online and registered and got himself registered. So at
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: the moment, I think we've had about fifty people.
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: That have gone on. I will get confirmation.
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: From you know, from our staff, but I think we've
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: had about fifty confirmed registrations on there all ready today.
• 3:50
  Speaker 3: Ready today, Look, I urge everybody too. It's a it's
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: a simple, free process. It's not onerous. And I think
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: that David and others who have gone on, they've logged on,
• 4:05
  Speaker 3: they've they've got this registration process will attest that it
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: is simple, it's seamless, and they've received their receipt to
• 4:13
  Speaker 3: so that they've got two years free access into this area.
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: Marion. How will people know where they can and cannot.
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: Fish if they When they go on to that website,
• 4:25
  Speaker 3: they can also look at the maps so that it
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: will provide them with maps which they will be able
• 4:31
  Speaker 3: to download and have easy access to which areas they
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: can and cannot go. I've heard this morning people saying
• 4:40
  Speaker 3: that they can't go into the Finnis River. That's not true.
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: You can go into the Finnis River. There is one
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: side of the bank that is, you know where We've
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: got to still continue and finalize our consultation where traditional
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: owners on that side have said no. For the time being,
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: we will canntinue that consultation. The same with the Mini
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: Mini system. We're about to undertake over the next couple
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: of weeks consultation with all the different groups up there
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: to allow fishing to happen in the Mini Mini.
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: Okay, So just to clarify that, because I know that
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: that was one of the concerns that had been raised
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: with us, that people couldn't go fishing in the Finnis
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: and couldn't go fishing in the mini river systems.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: But that's not exactly the case.
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Look, the Finnis was always I mean, if you
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: look at the map and anyone can zoom into our
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: maps at any time on the left side or the
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: side which abuts the past release.
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: There is nothing stopping and the river is free. Noah.
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: Anyone has access into the Finnis River can go. There
• 5:48
  Speaker 3: is an existing closure line though up that river which
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: then goes into land Trust land. Now we've been told
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: very clearly by Mark Mcmadonongu and the Delizable Abridge and
• 6:00
  Speaker 3: land Trust members. So Wadjik and kyeok all the different groups,
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: we want further consultation. We want to know what does
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: this mean for us. So it is up to the
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: Northern Land Council to start doing some and continuing those consults.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: Katie.
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: At the moment, you can't go right up the river,
• 6:17
  Speaker 3: but there is nothing stopping people from fishing the Finnis
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: River up to that closure line.
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: Okay, Marion, how is this all going to be managed?
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: Are there going to be people on the water checking
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: the registration.
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: Not on the water, Katie, But we're having we are
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: when we do have ranges out in some of these areas.
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: I just want to stress to people that the law
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: of the land, even though it's land Trust land and
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: we're talking about some remote areas here, everyone just needs
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: to do the right thing. I mean, water safety is
• 6:49
  Speaker 3: paramount and I know that a lot of fishermen that
• 6:53
  Speaker 3: go out do the right thing. And that's what we
• 6:55
  Speaker 3: have to remember here is that people do do the
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: right thing. So our ranges where they can, and in
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: some of those hot spot areas where fishermen do go,
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: we will have people out there. They won't be checking everyone, Katie.
• 7:10
  Speaker 3: It's common sense needs to be applied here. But if
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: people are doing the wrong thing, certainly, and if it
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: gets if we get evidence of that, we will act.
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: But I know that most people do the right thing.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: I've just got a message from one of our listeners.
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: It says, good morning, Katie. Can you please ask the
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: NLC if registered fishing groups hang on, just let me
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: try and open this. If registered fishing groups need to
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: submit a permit or is it just individual anglers? So
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: I guess if it's a whole group, do they have
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: to each individually do one or does the whole group?
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: Do not know? So we've signed so these there were
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: through this process of negotiation, Katie. We've signed an agreement
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: with the Northern Territory Seafood Council because there are commercial
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: imperatives here, and we've also had an agreement are in
• 8:01
  Speaker 3: place with the Northern Territory Fishing guided tour Operators so
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: they will submit on block a registration so through their process,
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: we will work through that registration process for them for
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: the people that they have on board.
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: But people don't have to do individual ones.
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: It's only individual fish shows that are going into that
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: three thousand kilometers of water to fish will require the
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: one off.
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: It is one off.
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: People don't have to go on all the time. Once
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: they're registered, that's it for two years.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: Marion, what's the well, why has this decision been made?
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: You know, why was it deemed that this is the
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: best approach at this point in time.
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: I think we've had a look at all of these.
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: Issues.
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: Kie, There's been long consultation and discussion with traditional owners
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: since two thousand and eight when the federal court case
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: came in play and Blue Mud Bay and the intertitle
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: zone was ruled in favor of tradition owners. It would
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: have been easier for the Northern Land CANCIL just to
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: say anyone coming into the intertitle zone will be required
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: to get a permit. That would have inflamed the situation
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: and traditional owners. They want people to continue to come
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: into their waters and to have the recreational activities that
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: have happened. At the same time, they want to be
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: able to capitalize on their livelihoods and to look at
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: commercial opportunities that they may want to put in place
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: for themselves and for their children and for their communities.
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: This has been lost in this whole process that Aboriginal
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: people have been most generous. This has taken a long
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: time to reach this point, Katie. A lot of discussion,
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: particularly over the last twelve months with traditional owners. Our
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: staff have done a lot of work, and I know
• 9:56
  Speaker 3: I applaud my staff who have been out there. They've
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: had a lot of rejections, but they've gone back. We've taken,
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: you know, the consults. We've had a c Country working
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: Group which has been made up of Council members. So
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: we've looked at this issue the nearly three years I've
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: been at the Lane Council, We've been having a lot
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: of negotiations and consultations about this. So this hasn't we
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: haven't reached this point in a knee jerk way.
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: This has come after much negotiation.
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: Has it been quite a difficult process to get to
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: this point where you've been able to come to this agreement.
• 10:33
  Speaker 3: Oh, look, it has and I think for the Northern
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: Lane Council at the end of our you know, at
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: the forefront of all of our discussions is that we
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: have to represent the traditional Aboriginal owners and we have
• 10:46
  Speaker 3: to make sure that their country and their rights are
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: paramount to this. So and for traditional owners, they've also
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: accommodated a lot of fishermen in this process. So we've
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: been able to well, we thought and we think that
• 11:06
  Speaker 3: we have balanced this right. We've struck the right balance.
• 11:10
  Speaker 3: We just all need to work together to try and
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: make it work. Katie, I know that any system will
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: have its issues and its problems, but we just need
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: to work together to try and get a good outcome.
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: Are you concerned about the impact that it might have
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: on the broader fishing community or do you feel as
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: though this is going to be the right approach?
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: Now, look, I think this will be the right approach.
• 11:33
  Speaker 3: Of course, people are going to growl and people are
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: going to feel that their rights have been impacted on,
• 11:39
  Speaker 3: But as much as we can, I think if we
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: continue the communications, we continue to work together, if there's
• 11:46
  Speaker 3: any concerns, people can ring the Northern Lane Council and
• 11:50
  Speaker 3: we can help people to work through that.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: I keep saying.
• 11:55
  Speaker 3: The registration is simple, it's free, and it gives everybody
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: two years open access to those waters.
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: So this agreement's in place, by the sounds of it,
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: for the next two years. I guess some will be
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: wondering in the community right now whether this means that
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: once that two year period is over, whether they're going
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: to need permits, or whether it's going to have to
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: sort of start all from scratch again. What do your
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: reckon's going to happen?
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: Look, I think that Cardian, I'm not going to crystal
• 12:23
  Speaker 3: ball gaze here, but I you know, I'm hoping that
• 12:28
  Speaker 3: as we work through this, if this system works and
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: everyone's doing the right thing, there is nothing stopping that
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: system from staying in place. We just all need to
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: work together to have a look at how is this
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: going to work. Yes, Northern Land Council needs to collect
• 12:44
  Speaker 3: that data and look at some of those hotspot areas.
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: Do we need to get better infrastructure. Do we need
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: to make sure telecommunications are here so if someone goes
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: into difficulty. There's a lot of unknowns out there, and
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: we need to put this in place that we can
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: address at least some of those unknowns, so that people's safety,
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: particularly going into some of these areas is paramount.
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: Now.
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: Just on those areas that we've spoken about a little
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: earlier are the Pinnis and the Mini Midy River systems.
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: I know you said that it's not correct that the
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: Finis can no longer be fished, but with those areas
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: where parts of it, you know, there's still negotiation underway
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: in terms of fishermen being able to go into that area.
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: How far off do you reckon you are in terms
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: of those negotiations people potentially being able to still fish
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: in those spots that are currently off limits. Yeah.
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: Look, we're continuing those consultations and communications, Katie. Look, I
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: can't give a definitive answer when that'll finish, but we
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: have been pulling a lot of those communities and traditional
• 13:51
  Speaker 3: owners together. Bear in mind, we're talking about one hundred
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: and eighty communities, so it's and we've got four staff
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: doing this, so there's a lot of work. We've just
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: finished all of the consultations. For example, along the Roper,
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: which is you know, one of the areas that a
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: lot of fishermen go to, and the roper, you know,
• 14:14
  Speaker 3: the consultations have turned out to be quite positive and
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: the traditional owners have given the tick to the roper
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: with the finness.
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: And I'll leave this map for you, Katie.
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: It clearly shows that the river is free, so people
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: can go up the river, people can fish on that
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: side of the river. We need to talk to traditional
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: owners on the other side the delizable wogg Eyed Land
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: Trust boundary, and those communications are happening over the next
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: couple of weeks to try and clarify some of those areas.
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: Marion.
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: Some people listening right now might be thinking to themselves, well,
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: if it is you know, if it is free, if
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: you don't require a permit, and if there's sort of
• 14:58
  Speaker 2: you know, nothing that happened to really, I suppose prompt
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: these changes. Why do we now have to register to
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: fish in those areas?
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: The registration process allows us to put in place rather
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: than a permit process, because that's what would have happened
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: to Katie. We would have anyone going into the intertitle
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: zone would have required a permit under the Aboriginal Land
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: Act and under the Averagin Land Rights Act. Traditional owners
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: could have and would have enforced a permit system. We've
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: had a lot of consultation to say, look, let's look
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: at another way in which we can accommodate both your
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: need and the need of fishermen. And that's when we
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: looked at and we've gone around and around with our
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: lawyers and other people. A registration process is a legal document.
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: We can enforce it.
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: So reckon, do you reckon?
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: This is you know, realistic, This is traditional owners actually
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: saying to territories, we want you to still be able
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: to fish, but we want you to just make sure
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: that you're doing the right thing.
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And look, I think absolutely, Katie, and I think
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: you know everybody, and I'm not saying you know everyone
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: does the wrong thing. There's a lot of fishermen who
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: do the right thing, and the law of the land
• 16:29
  Speaker 3: still applies regardless of where you're fishing. And I think
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: most fishers will do the right thing, and traditional owners
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: want people to do the right thing.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: So I think together all of.
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: Us have just got to work together to get the
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: best outcome, traditional owners, fishermen, everybody. And look, I think
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: that at the end of the day, storm in a
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: teacup let's all just work together and make sure that
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: people can continue to go to their favorite fishing spot
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: and fish well.
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: CEO of the Northern Land Council, Marion Scrimjaw, always appreciate
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: your time.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: Thanks very much for coming in. Thank you, thank you,