Latest / Career Clarity with Athletes: A 2ndwind Podcast with Ryan Gonsalves / 160: Tara Arthur on Letting Go of the Athlete Identity

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160: Tara Arthur on Letting Go of the Athlete Identity · Career Clarity with Athletes: A 2ndwind Podcast with Ryan Gonsalves

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: And so for you, what was that competitive edge?
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: Where did it take you?
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: How did you feel at your proudest moment?
• 0:05
  Speaker 2: Honestly, this is a good question because my proudest moments are when I've had the opportunity to travel internationally and I was the first black black belt and some people had seen as a woman first I should say first black female woman, black belt.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: I should say first black female woman, black belt and that was really for me actually even more powerful sometimes than competitions, because you realize just how much more the sport can grow and how much more the community can grow and what it means to people.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: I still like have like this feeling of wow.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: Hi, I'm Ryan Gonsalves and welcome to a Second Wind Academy podcast, a show all about career transition through the lens of elite athletes.
• 0:56
  Speaker 3: Each week, I invite a guest to the show who shares their unique sporting story.
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: Please join me to delve into the thoughts and actions of athletes through a series of conversations.
• 1:07
  Speaker 3: Don't worry, there's plenty to learn from those of you that aren't particularly sporty.
• 1:11
  Speaker 3: Elite athletes are still people after all.
• 1:14
  Speaker 3: Let's be inspired by the stories of others.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: Tara, welcome to the show.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: Great to have you join me today.
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me.
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: It's good to meet you here.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: Yes, it is, and I'm looking forward to, you know, just simply exploring and having a great conversation with you about martial arts, security and how that has I don't know well changed your world and made you who you are today.
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely all connected together and to who I am now and partly who I've probably always been.
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: But you know, when you get to the destination, well, it's not quite the destination.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: But along this journey you learn a lot of things and you see how all your different experiences definitely kind of culminate and help you be who you are and who you're becoming as well.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, love that, love that.
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: Well, let's kick off with.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: Give me that introduction.
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: Who are you and what's your primary focus in life today?
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: Well, it's a long answer but I'll try and make it concise in a way that people can appreciate.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: So I grew up.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: I should start with saying that I am American, but I am Haitian descent and I have done martial arts my entire life and it is a big part of who I am.
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: It's a major part of my identity, all those factors coming together and being in the martial arts world.
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: You know there's a lot of different things that go into it.
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: There's, you know, the sporting side, there's also the you know values and traditions and all of those components, and so I really am a big proponent of seeing how martial arts can be a part of people's worlds.
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: And so I've done a lot, from childhood to adulthood to what I do now, to try and advocate for sports, not just for martial arts but for sports more generally, but because I saw what it did for me as a child and how it really affected my development in a really positive way, but also how the mental, spiritual and physical connection really can be transformative.
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: I've always been a huge advocate for that and because of that connection to my identity, I've competed on the international level for martial arts.
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: But what I actually would say is.
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: It's such a powerful journey.
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: There's so many connecting issues to the sports side as well as the the mind, body and spirit side that I'm very proud to see how that's come into my world in the security space and I can tell you more about that.
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: I do.
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: Officially, I held the title of Renji, but I prefer Sensei or Tara because I think being a teacher is a big part of the martial arts world and a big part of who I am and being able to teach and share and I'm happy to share more, of course.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: Wonderful.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: There's already so many interesting parts that you've covered there, and I'm going to start with the end point.
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: There you mentioned the name, but you also, sensei.
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: Now you've been doing a style of karate.
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: For what?
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: Over 20 years you've been competing?
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, way, way over.
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: Let's just go with that I'm just saying over 20, yeah, I'm not yeah yeah, yeah, that sounds good and so when you say so, you're like the teacher.
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: to me, sensei means well, it must be someone you know, who's super senior, Like this, is someone who really has a lot of students that you teach, but also instructors that you probably teach.
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: Is that a good understanding?
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: That is, and you know, it's interesting as you go through your martial arts journey and everyone has a different martial arts journey.
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: So I think, and I would say also, that there's a different type of martial art for everyone, because I would encourage every person to do martial arts, no matter who you are, of course.
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: Why would you encourage everyone to do martial art?
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: I think it's.
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: It's such a powerful mind body connection and again, like I mentioned, there's a sporting side, but there's also that kind of being really in tune with your body and the whole facets.
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: Being personally self-aware and being able to defend yourself is a core component for me.
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: I think the sporting side is really something that you're seeing more and more expansion of.
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: I remember when I was younger you didn't see as many women at different levels of martial arts, and now there's a lot more competitive martial arts styles.
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: There's different, you know, there's something for everyone, kind of in the martial arts world, I would say, and so I think it is a it's a neat way for people to be connected with their bodies but also to kind of build that self-awareness.
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: So there's multiple dimensions to what you can benefit from, whatever kind of athlete you might be or not.
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: So you started karate, we're saying over 20 years ago, but then I guess, what was your journey into karate?
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: Did you grow up in a family that was truly into, I'll say, combat sports or self-defense?
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: Was that something that an environment in which you grew up in, or was it something that occurred through a different way?
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: Good question.
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: So, actually, yes, I grew up in a family of martial arts.
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: My father is a martial artist and he's actually the founder of this group called the United Federation of Martial Arts.
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: But back in the early days he had his karate school and I would go there every day, of course, and I started off as the little toddler waddling around and then had to.
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: When you're the teacher's child, you have to behave in such a way, so I had to fall in line pretty quickly.
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: So I, at an early, very early age, have been running around the dojo and being part of the community and learning from so many incredible people from all over the world.
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: I feel very fortunate for that experience and grounding and having a family that really was instrumental in helping develop martial arts in a lot of communities and also making impact on me as their child yeah, yeah, I guess so.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: So it's like you grew up.
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: If your dad's there running the, I guess the dojo, if I saying that way in and you yeah, and, and so you were there.
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: I guess, learning, growing up in that environment, it was only natural for you to continue to, to get to a level where you could compete, and now it continues to be part of your life absolutely yeah, and that's really kind of the trajectory and I've always been, you know, passionate about representation in sport and that's partly why I was able to compete internationally and represent my heritage and that was a really powerful experience and I think that is something that you see in modern a lot of sporting communities now sport and that, the sporting community at those higher levels, but also the journey part how do you get there and what do you do after?
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: So I really, you know, appreciate the work that you do, because I think it's.
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: It is about building life, it's all about carrying legacy, it's all about shared experiences and shared communities.
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: So for me, that's all kind of built and baked into the, the practical elements of the hard training and, you know, all that kind of built and baked into the practical elements of the hard training and you know all that kind of stuff that goes into it too.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: And so at what point did you start to say to yourself hey, I really want to compete.
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: I want to represent more than just me, more than perhaps just the family.
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: When did something like that first occur to you?
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: Oh, I would say, when I was a child and it's interesting because you know, for example, karate is not in the Olympic world it was once.
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: I won't go down those roads, but I did always have kind of an aspiration to to do something on a grander scale that way.
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: But it really was more about the representation of good.
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: For me, that's always kind of been at the heart of it.
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: Not, you know, winning is great and that's an important part of the athlete condition, but I think for me it's a lot about the values and what it can represent and how it can really affect communities to bring like awareness and bring attention to things like I've always kind of.
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: That kind of always resonated with me is how do you bring opportunity through this beautiful thing?
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: And that's that I've been gifted, you know that's what it feels like.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: So how do we be?
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: transformative with it, and so I think I've always kind of felt that and so the competition in fact, I'll say not even the competition, but the development, the mastery of the martial art was, I guess, central, central to you.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: It was this, that's what really kept you going.
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: I'm fascinated, then, about this.
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: You know, you talk about the impact that it has on communities and how, I guess, it's helped you to drive that impact.
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: But I just want to ask without the Olympics, what is competition in karate?
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: What does that world look like?
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: Well, nowadays.
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: Nowadays it's a very big world and there's all kinds of.
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: There's all kind of international leagues, all kind of international associates.
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: There's a lot, and so, again, there might be something for everyone built into that.
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: You know there's different governing bodies, all kind of stuff that goes into the wider martial arts world.
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: It's not a homogeneous world by any stretch and the histories are all interwoven and all that kind of stuff.
• 10:48
  Speaker 2: But I think you know what goes into the competitive spirit.
• 10:51
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of commonality and that you know it's a drive You're pushing yourself and you want to sharpen your blade against the best.
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: So, whatever, whoever you're competing with, whatever under whoever's association, it's about improving that, that skills that you've been honing in on and really making sure that you're challenging yourself but also preparing yourself for whatever situation might come out exciting elements.
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: It can be a really a fun, fun way to, you know, explore your skills, but also an opportunity to kind of build relations and really represent yourself, represent the people that you are associated with.
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: And so for you, what was that competitive edge?
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: Where did it take you?
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: How did you feel at your proudest moment?
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: Honestly, my proudest moments are when I this is a good question, because my proudest moments are when I this is a good question, because my proudest moments are when I've had the opportunity to travel internationally and I was the first black black belt and some people had seen as a woman first, I should say first black female woman black belt and that was really for me actually even more powerful sometimes than competitions, because you realize just how much more the sport can grow and how much more the community can grow and what it means to people.
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: I still like have like this feeling of wow.
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: It was like a very strong, impactful, impactful feeling of meeting.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: This happened in a couple of places, but there was this one community.
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: It was in Africa, where it was a small town, and I remember one of the girls came to me and she was like I've, you know, she was training and she was a junior bell and she was like I just never, I've never met someone like you before and I was like wow, and it just it took me back and I've always kind of carried that with me, realizing that you know, I try, you don't take these skills for granted and you don't take working hard and you just can't take it for granted and you always remember that you, you can make an impact on someone, even in a short time, and that is something that's heavy responsibility and that, to me, is almost as good as winning any high level achievement.
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: That's actually worth more in some ways.
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah Well, you're standing for so much more.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: You know we talk so much about role models and being an example to others, and so for you to get the wonderful opportunity to compete overseas and then recognize I guess you perhaps you didn't at least initially you wouldn't really recognize the impact you were having by turning up overseas and being that one of the first black female black belts in the sport.
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: That's quite amazing.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: How do you?
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: I mean, I'm sure there's plenty out there before me.
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: Let me be clear, and there's many, many.
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: I have some that I've looked up to in my my life, but I think you know it's the access to being able to see people like you, and that's the part that's changed.
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, well, you see, and I think that's that's the bit, and yeah, I don't mean the first ever, but it as you talk about going on, that's the bit, and yeah, I don't mean the first ever, but it as you talk about going on that on the scene and that competitive scene, you're sort of creating this environment and you would still be someone who's standing out, and so you've seen more and more people looking and going, oh, wow, hey, I well, that's okay, I can keep going, I can go ahead and I can achieve that.
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: And it probably inspires not just people of color but anyone who at any point feels oh, no one else looks like me.
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: Well, she's different and she's different, he's different.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: Okay, well, that means that I can go up there and I can be different as well.
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, and you know that was part of the impetus of why I had started this group called Faces of Martial Arts was to try and broaden those perceptions of what martial arts is, who it's for, what it's all about.
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: You know, and I think there's a lot of, there's a typical thing that comes to some people's mind, at least primarily in my area of the united states.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: You know you hear often remarks of I would not expect someone like you to do martial arts and you're like, okay, I mean, why not?
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: but okay, well, that's it, and that's where you kind of get to this first or preeminent, it's being the first that many are going to see.
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: And so I'm curious then, about then this, like you said, faces of martial arts, and, as you, I guess, as one of the founders or the founder of that whole, well, I'll say movement, but correct me, tell me what is it and what sort of impact is it seeking to have?
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, is it?
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: And what is it?
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: What sort of impact is it seeking to have?
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so it is something that I have had the pleasure to work with a lot of amazing martial artists on and get their stories, and the focus of it was to gather and try and capture different story elements of martial artists at all different stages of their paths and to understand, you know, how it's affected them and their communities.
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: And we've held, we've done some different initiatives, different communities to really kind of spread martial arts love and experience, you know, positive impact, but also to understand that individual capability of what can you achieve as an individual martial artist and what does that mean for you and your journey.
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: And so sharing the stories and sharing that it's not just one atypical type of person that does martial arts.
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: It's a diverse range of people from all types of backgrounds, especially underrepresented groups, that do martial arts, and the history of martial arts is very wide and vast and it comes from so many countries and a lot of legacy, lives and is just untold of the martial arts world and we only hear just a tiny fraction of what the martial arts really means, and I think that's where I love seeing and there's a lot of other groups that are advancing martial arts in a positive way through all kinds of global places and I actually really commend the work that my dad is doing with United Federation of Martial Arts and spreading some of that as well and there's a lot of groups, like I'm saying, that are slowly, I think, helping to change that perception.
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: And I will say that you know, for me, doing this work in the martial arts and the karate space is very resonant to what I also do in my other professional work, and it's breaking barriers, and breaking sport barriers sometimes really transcends just doing the physical component, it's the life components as well, and so that's partly what was behind the impetus of doing the Faces of Martial Art project, to really show the range of what all of those facets really mean.
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: And so, which I think is noble, and I think it's so good.
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: You know you're talking about that.
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: I think it's fantastic.
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: Why is there a need for faces of martial art in?
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: the highest places and the lowest medium, however you want to call it places.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: I think we all deserve to be represented everywhere, regardless of who we are.
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: But I think you know, in the media and in a lot of the communications that people have access to you very much see a kind of a singularity type of person when you associate it with martial arts type of person.
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: When you associate it with martial arts, when if I were to ask you like, think of a martial artist, my guess is you wouldn't think of someone who looks like me no goodness, no no, because, only because you're not in karate, kid, so that's where I go.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: Did I go?
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: The wrong place.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: No, okay exactly after a decade of living in hong kong, I should really have mentioned bruce lee, but no that's usually the first go-to, you know, for a lot of people, for me, yeah, you're right in terms of you know, and as as I was looking ahead of this conversation, you see these, the different faces, the different ethnicities, the different ethnicities, the different individuals that participate in martial arts, and it is like, yeah, that makes sense, and perhaps it's as much a celebration rather than sort of this need to say, hey, look over here as well, but it's recognizing the diverse cultures that exist in sport.
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: Exactly, exactly.
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: We're not a monolith, but there is so much to celebrate, so much to exchange, so much to just learn from one another.
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: So when you were growing up, I have to assume knowing that karate is not a professional sport, right, you don't sign a 10-year $120 million contract.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: I've had the dream, but now we don't.
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, one day and it's not too late, tara, I tell you not too late.
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: So, as you were growing up and you think then okay, so karate was a fabric of your life, fabric of your identity and your community.
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: From, I'll say, a different career or professional career, what were you aspiring to as you grew up?
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: I think for me, I I've always aspired to be there for communities that are in need, and that means communities that might be suffering conflicts, suffering challenges of you know a variety of fashions, and I've always been someone that has been driven to look at root causes of challenge, and they may be affected by a variety of things, whether it's a natural disaster, human challenges and all of that, and I've always been want to want to be someone that supports those transitional points for those communities or trying to support whatever the need is there.
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: And so I've studied international development and I actually did my master's where I focused on sports, being an agency for women, looking at a lot of different ways that sport can be beneficial to communities, empowering women and giving them different ways to not only be leaders but also to be strong contributors to their communities to support the improvement of those communities all around the world, and so I looked a lot about that.
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: I've also Talk to me.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: What does that mean?
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: Cast your mind back to that, that thesis that you wrote sport as an agency or as a change agent for women.
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: What do you mean by that?
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: Or what did you find?
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's really interesting, will, because back when I did it, sport was a fairly new part of the international development space.
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: It was becoming its kind of own thing, and now it's kind of a fully fledged thing within the development and humanitarian space to large, massive issues.
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: And so if we can address some of those root causes or deescalate situations, we can have, you know, more effective communities sometimes.
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: And so for me it really was looking at that and looking at that intersection of how do we make communities improve their well-being in a holistic way, but also how do we reduce violence.
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: And I think, women having agency and access.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: We see that women are such pinnacle figures all across the world and if we can invest in women there's so much change that can happen.
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: And so for me that was a big issue that I was passionate about and because of my martial arts background, a big issue that I was passionate about and because of my martial arts background, I've seen it for my own eyes how martial arts can transform someone's experiences and and the power of being able to deescalate, but having the power to defend when you need to all of those kinds of dynamics was important to me through that process.
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: And so that's where I community development, international development, however you want to look at it.
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: I really was keen on that because it's giving people the tools to improve their mind, their body and if you can improve those factors, you're going to be at your peak to be able to be a successful contributor to your community and hopefully, therefore, everyone working in harmony to be able to support each other as they navigate improving outcomes.
• 24:06
  Speaker 2: So if you have women who are strong leaders in the community you know you have you might have investments in different parts of whether it's education or you know you're seeing improvements in transportation and roads and development All those little things that we, you know that underpin.
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: When I'm saying community or development, I'm talking about the fabrics, the intricacies that really build strong communities.
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: It's a fascinating space and I love your approach on the topic, love the your approach on on the topic and it's using well one.
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: How do you, given who you are and given what you know, how do you have the best possible impact on your surrounding or your environment and your community and your upbringing through sports and in particular, through karate and the karate school?
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: You see that from probably not an aggressive approach but, like you say, to defend the martial arts as a way to defend and as you've matured and studied and move forward, you know, I'm interested to see how that started to move towards the formation of that collective security group.
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: What was the inspiration behind that?
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: You know what's the story there.
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: It's a beautiful story, I'll be honest.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: So I have a partner me and her co-founded collective security group and what I'll tell you from my side of the journey is that, you know, my experiences as a martial artist definitely have influenced my understanding of security and safety and security is a space that comes with a lot of dimension, just like a lot of things in the world, but it's also got a lot of underrepresentation as well and a lot of areas for improved collaboration, improved exchange of how to do things and approaches.
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: And I've, having worked a lot in the humanitarian and development space, I remember and I've, having worked a lot in the humanitarian and development space, I remember and I've shared this story previously to some people where you don't realize how much the sector needs people who understand the human side of things when it comes to safety and security and how we're starting to see some transitions around the safety and security and how we're starting to see some transitions around the safety and security community.
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: And what I mean by that is there is kind of this historical trend you've seen primarily in the humanitarian development space, where it's very militant to work on security issues and it comes and it's because of the nature of the birth of that part of the sector.
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: But what you found is you didn't find as many women, you didn't find as many different experiences.
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: You found very kind of more militant or military background, law enforcement types, and there's a lot of good things about those experiences and people who come from those backgrounds that are still really, really critical to what we do in the sector today.
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: But for me, you know, through the evolution of that, without going through all of the details and all of the historical underpinnings of safety and security, to say that where I've been so fortunate to be exposed to that world from people who recognized my skill sets and said to me you know, basically this is the type of thing we need, and safety in the humanitarian, ngo, safety and security space, you're doing a lot of that and it was a nice awakening moment to be able to translate a lot of things I'm passionate about and a lot of things I've been advocating for for so many years into something that's really needed in a space that I actually also care about, and doing it in a way that can really bridge my world.
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: And so I've taken a lot of my martial arts experiences, my hands on being.
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: I've often, you know, help people through different situations when they're preparing to travel or things like that.
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: You know, how do you make sure you're self-aware?
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: That's a big part of martial arts.
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: How do you improve your surroundings, build your strength, that mind, that mental and physical awareness, and so all of that kind of feeds into my ability to translate it and help people in being safe and proactive.
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: So there's those values that I've carried through.
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: The martial arts really inform how I think about safety and security for organizations and individuals, and it also has helped me be able to respond to people in their unique, challenging moments.
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: So, working with my partner on Collective Security Group, we realized that the sector needed something new and you know there's a lot of new happening, but we wanted to do our new and and bring all of these kind of things together well, which is great.
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: so what made you?
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: What made you, why you, what made you think you?
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: What were the skills, then, that people saw to bring, to bring across into this sector, from from martial arts, into this security world?
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: Why you?
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: What skills are so valuable?
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: Well, Well, for me, I think the ability to tap into the mental and the physical is something that's really key there.
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: Ok, so when we're thinking about safety and security, there's a lot of holistic elements that go into it.
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: Especially nowadays, it's the feeling safe is so important, right, but how do you get to feel safe?
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: What gives you the sense of safety?
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: And so I carry some of those similar traits of how do you protect yourself in the martial arts sense in a way that allows people to unlock for themselves their own personal defense mechanisms, and that's something that you know.
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: I spend time talking to people about their, their specific case, and so there's a lot of work we're doing with other great groups also on things like the person centered approach in safety and security, which is a big big thing for me, and and collective security group, and and really advancing, because something we hope to see build further in the safety and security space is that understanding of individual risks, individual needs, and I have long felt that connective tissue in the martial arts side is individual needs, individual dynamics, and how do you improve your skills for yourself, and how does that translate then to you being able to interact with others and build your confidence, and so it's similar in that.
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: How do you operationally approach something like that as an organization, as individuals, and you know it's.
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of nuance and a lot of detail and I probably can't unpack it all in this, but you know, but what I'm hearing is so I now envisage you in the karate school teaching well, even the instructor.
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: So you know it's like train the trainer.
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: But so teaching instructors, teaching the, the participants, the students, on their safety, being becoming aware of their body, becoming aware of their environment and reach range, movement, things like that that could be happening around them.
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: And it sounds like what you have done or are doing is you're picking up those skills and you're translating that into everyday life.
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: So, okay, someone's dressed ready to do karate and then you, you know, sure that gets them in that mindset, but what you're now doing is picking that up and taking that across to someone who's in a T-shirt and is in a suit and says right, how does what does it mean for you to become aware, to start to sense these things, to think about your own safety?
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: That is it.
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: That's it.
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: That is a big part of it.
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: It it's giving people the tools to unlock doors for themselves and giving them the agency and the power to walk through the doors they would like to walk through and preparing them for the ones they have to walk through.
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: You know, and it's it's really helping people add to their toolbox, because even once you've got a toolbox, it's important to continue to add to them.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: I've got a bag.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: It's important to continue to add to them.
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: I've got a bag of tools.
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: Keep checking on them.
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: I've got a bag of tools.
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: I never use them.
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: That's it.
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: That's not me.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: We got to take them out sometimes.
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: That's right.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: That's what my wife does, and I wait for my boys to grow older.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: Maybe that's what they will do, so I'm very comfortable with that.
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: I'm comfortable with that, yeah.
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: Well, it is important to build legacies, so we got to pass it on to our little ones too.
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: Yes, very true.
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: And so for you, then, that toolbox, that toolkit that you give to on, you're picking up from your experience in martial arts and you're giving that to individuals and corporations to be able to set themselves up for success, meaning safety, security in that regard, I, you know, I really like that.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: It's like you've decoded one of the important aspects of martial arts and you're able to now share that with the, I'll say, the rest of the world.
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: I mean, I will not take full credit for that.
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: I love it.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: Quoted trademark.
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: This is what Tara's done.
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: The reason why it's so fascinating is a lot of what we're doing now, but also in this show, is about learning from athletes.
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: So this is about finding the steps.
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: I know it's all about career clarity and career transition, but it's picking that up from stories of people like yourself, from athletes, and sharing that with the broader population, because we know we go through it.
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: We know that we're looking to see how can our athletic skills help us in the rest of our lives and that for us it unlocks action, it brings agency, makes us do these things, and I see how that can help others.
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: I see how that can help family, my community and have such a positive impact.
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: So hence that's why I recognize it so much in what you're doing.
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: Oh, and that's why I appreciate what you do, because you know I have two daughters who are very skilled athletes and they have high ambition to make it all the way to the highest levels of their sport track and gymnastic as it stands and you know they're both highly committed and what I recognize in them and hope I'll see and I appreciate when I hear from other athletes, is that mental strength piece and being able to build that.
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: And it takes a community to do that.
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: And I think you know understanding that, like you mentioned, there are different transition points in your sporting journey and being able to appreciate that at different stages.
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: And I think something that I would just echo what I've I recognize in others and something I say for myself, is your sporting journey doesn't have to end.
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: It may, as you say, transition or translate and you then become the next generation's leader and helping them forge their future, or you translate those skills into something else.
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: I think all of that is extremely valuable and the more that we can do that, I think that creates new opportunities.
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: That that's where you start to see, you know, the pace of sports really expand.
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: It takes its own shape in a new way and I think that's a beautiful thing to hear that you're even after the highest levels of achievement.
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: There's so much more, there's still so much more.
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: You don't just get to the mountaintop, you keep climbing, you know.
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: And so, for me, I love something like this, and this is something I would encourage my kids to listen to, because I want them to recognize that, yes, I achieved the highest.
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: They want to go to the Olympics.
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: Go to the Olympics, you know, get there.
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: But when you're there and and you feel like your body is in a different place, that doesn't mean it's over, and so that's something I I definitely am a big fan of appreciating.
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: Well said, it's certainly not over.
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: It's like say, it's that next goal, that next opportunity, and it's still you.
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: What can you as a person achieve next?
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: Again, so it's super powerful.
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: You know, I like the way that you bring those two parts of your life together and that continues right, so it's not over.
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: So what's next?
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: What's that next summit for you?
• 36:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah Well, I'm so proud of the work we're doing at Collective Security Group, so very proud.
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: It's such an opportunity to bring minds together to really tap into the safety and security space build improved and strengthening our practices in that community so that we can affect other communities.
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: But I am also really proud of what that means for people in need right now, helping anyone through a challenging circumstance or situation.
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: We know that people face a variety of circumstances and being able to actively support someone through threats or other issues or help with the prevention side is our favorite part.
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: All of those things are part of my journey ahead and to continue to help people and organizations.
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: But even that, I think it's also trying to be a good, responsible sports parent.
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: Alongside the professional development, I want to keep breaking down barriers that may exist or continue to build bridges where they do exist, to help people be aware of what we can those two elements as best I can, of how do you balance being a parent and being a good leader and the professional side.
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: And so I think my summit is is never ending.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: It's gonna be a continued, continued balancing journey well, that's right.
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: And look, the earth keeps spinning.
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: So as soon as you achieve one thing, the next, the next horizon appears right in front of you.
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: And, like you said, I don I don't know when it ends or if it ends, but being blessed with children means there's even more to consider and to grow as an individual.
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: You know ourselves, nevermind them, but we keep learning as well.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: Absolutely, and I think that's the thing that gives me energy is wow, I have this huge opportunity to follow their journeys but to hopefully be, you know, a positive impact where they need it yeah so.
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: So look, tara, when you think about athletes, certainly who, when they look at the, or perhaps they're not even aware.
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: But how would you help an athlete start to recognize the impacts that they could have on their community based on coming from a love and some sense of achievement from their sport?
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: oh, I love this question because I think sometimes we miss the things that are in front of us or we're not ready to to grab them.
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: Because even myself, when I think about martial arts, and you have that thing you're good at right, or that thing that's always been a part of you.
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: So if it's basketball or soccer or whatever your thing is, or football, it is a thing that you hold and you wonder is that it?
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: I'm just good at that, and then no, and sometimes it's okay to just accept it in that time.
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: And there's a time and there's a place for when you might need to tap those things.
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: And I think I would encourage people to appreciate where you are in your journey and when you can appreciate where you are and recognize that there are different stages, that gives you that kind of anchor to keep going.
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: And I say that because when you look at something and you're like, well, I'm really good at this, but what happens if I'm injured?
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: What happens if all these things I can't control?
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: Well, what is it that you loved?
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: What was it?
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: What is the thing that drives you?
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: There's a reason you're doing it, and is that reason something that you can convert?
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: Is that thing, something you can do without doing it, and what I mean by that.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: And Marshall, as we talked about thinking without thinking, okay, and essentially it's what is that hidden drive, like, what is pushing the pedal for you?
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: And really looking into that and then maybe you're going to find that actually you can use that in other parts of your life and let the pedal, you know, you can move your little key and it opens other cars and you can drive other cars.
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: But it started from the place that you got it from and so I think it's it's understanding the little engine behind you, and for some people it's that physical.
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: You're that physical endorphin push and maybe you have to do it in a different way, but for other people it's that mental achievement and I think all of those things are okay.
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: It's just, you know, translation.
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: And for those listening, because I thought that was I like that.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: I like the concept of well, sometimes it's right in front of you and either you're too busy or perhaps you're not ready to see it, and it also gives a sense of patience by saying it will come.
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: You've got to kind of believe it.
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: You know you can play around, you can try, try different things, but there's a belief you also need that it will come again.
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: You can find that that next passion or pedal to push it's, it's so true.
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: I mean, I've had people wish things for me and I appreciate it and it stays with you when you have people cheering you on and having all these desires for you, but you have to be able to do it at your pace.
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: So when you think now, I suppose I'm curious about how.
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: What's a great way for people to follow the movement.
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: So, be it around collective security, be it around that, even the faces of martial arts, what's a great way for others to perhaps reach out or get involved?
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, people can check out collectivesecuritygroupcom.
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: People can also reach out to me on LinkedIn it's probably good or, you know, people can definitely find Faces of Martial Arts.
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: The website is facesofmartialartscom as well, and I would encourage people to take time for themselves in these moments and just really be reflective.
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: I would encourage people to consider getting into the martial arts.
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: I would encourage people, if I know you know the work that I mentioned.
• 42:18
  Speaker 2: United Federation of Martial Arts is doing some great things across the world as well, but there's a lot of great organizations operating out there and across spaces, and I would be a champion of those who are advancing good values and making good, positive impact.
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: So if people have other good examples of that, I'm always a fan of learning and hearing more too.
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: I'm very collaborative, hence Collective Security Group, me and my partner being passionate about that but I'm a big fan of how can we work together.
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: Wonderful.
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: Well, tara, I want to say thanks very much for bringing your perspective to the podcast, to the show and to this audience, and I've really enjoyed our conversation.
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: Look forward to certainly keeping in touch.
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me.
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: It's a true honor to be here with you.
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: Thank you for all you do as well.
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to the Second Win podcast.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: We hope you enjoyed hearing insights from today's athlete on transitioning out of competitive careers.
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: If you're looking for career clarity for your next step, make sure you check out secondwinio for more information or to book a consultation with me.
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: I'd like to thank Claire from Betty Brook Design, Nancy from Savvy Podcast Solutions and Cerise from Copying Content by Lola for their help in putting this podcast together.
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: That's all from me.
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: Take it easy Until next time.