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Former Manson Girls Describe Aftermath of Murders at Spahn Ranch · Murder Files Unsealed

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  Speaker 1: Hollywood nineteen sixties, all that glitz and glamor rate but
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  something dark was brewing the Manson family murders. And today
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  we're going to look at it from a whole new angle.
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  Oh yeah, yeah, through the eyes of two women, Diane
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  Lake and Catherine Chaer, they lived with the family during
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  the murders.
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  Speaker 2: Wow, that's going to be a unique perspective.
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  Speaker 1: It really is, and it's just one layer of our
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  deep dive. Today we'll be using the Peacock docuseriies making
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  Manson it has never before heard interviews with Manson and
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  key family members.
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  Speaker 2: That's incredible access.
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  Speaker 1: So let's go back to August nineteen sixty nine. News
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  breaks about the Sharon Tate murders. Brutal and no one
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  even suspects the Manson family at first.
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  Speaker 2: Alia must have terrified.
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  Speaker 1: Oh absolutely, imagine that fear, not knowing who or why.
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  But while the public was panicking, what was happening at
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  Spawn Ranch where the family lived?
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  Speaker 2: Good question, I mean, were they celebrating hiding well?
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  Speaker 1: Diane Lake describes this chilling scene. Leslie van Houten comes
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  back immediately starts burning stuff, a purse, credit cards, even
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  a bag of coins.
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  Speaker 2: Evidence They were destroying evidence.
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  Speaker 1: Exactly, so casual though like it was nothing.
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  Speaker 2: It's disturbing, right, almost like a routine. Makes you think
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  about the mindset. Manson fostered this detachment from the horror
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  of it all.
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  Speaker 1: And as this was happening, Catherine Scherre noticed Patricia Crinwinkle
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  acting really strange, freaked out is how she put it.
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  But Patricia refused to say why, Ah.
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  Speaker 2: That's secrecy. It must have been suffocating. Manson controlled everything, information, communication,
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  just another way to manipulate them.
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  Speaker 1: So the outside world is trying to solve these seemingly
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  random murders, and within the family things are falling apart
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  in a totally different way, fueled by paranoia and these
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  whispered confessions.
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  Speaker 2: It was a ticking time bomb. And then Susan Atkins,
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  who was later convicted for her part in the murders,
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  starts confessing to other family members.
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  Speaker 1: And that's when Tex Watson arrives, frantic waiving newspapers admitting
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  he did it on Manson's orders.
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  Speaker 2: Wow, that must have been a complete shock for some
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  of them, a real gotten ourselves into moment.
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  Speaker 1: So did they all buy into Manson's justifications?
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  Speaker 2: Well, some might have been in denial. Others may he
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  felt trapped, loyal to Manson but also terrified of what
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  would happen if they spoke out.
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  Speaker 1: It's that classic cult dilemma. But with the investigation getting closer,
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  Manson moves the family to Burker Ranch and Death Valley
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  says it's for their safety.
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  Speaker 2: Uh huh sure, safety more like control. Isolate them for
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  solidify his grip, turning them into fugitives dependent on him.
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  Speaker 1: That's when it hit Diane Lake. She was trapped, couldn't
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  escape without risking her life.
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  Speaker 2: She was a teenager at that point. Imagine the fear.
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  But they all tried to cover their tracks, wiping away
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  tire tracks, living in constant fear.
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  Speaker 1: And then there's helter Skelter. Manson's twisted vision of a
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  race war.
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  Speaker 2: More than just a race war, it was his excuse
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  for power, his warped ideology, and he used it to
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  justify everything, giving them knives for protection, threatening them. Diane
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  Lake said he threatened to skin her alive.
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  Speaker 1: It seems like this is the turning point where the
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  mask truly falls off and we see the real Manson.
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  Speaker 2: Right, the charming leader gone. Now it's about power control
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  anyone who questioned him was a threat, and they were terrified,
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  trapped between a rock and a hard place.
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  Speaker 1: Terrified of the outside world, the police closing in, but
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  also terrified of Manson himself.
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  Speaker 2: And then, as fate would have it, the police raid
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  Barker Ranch. But not for the murders.
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  Speaker 1: Oh wow, ironica, they were after stolen cars.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, completely unrelated, but it was the break investigators needed.
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  Speaker 1: Diane Lake describes it as chaotic Manson hiding under a sink.
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  But even with him in custody, that fear it didn't
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  go away, did it not?
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  Speaker 2: Really, It's like the control lingers. Even when the leader
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  is gone, they're left to pick up the pieces of
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  this shattered reality.
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  Speaker 1: Diane's afraid to speak, worried about the family, while Susan
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  Atkins and jail makes a seemingly small but crucial decision
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  that she confesses to her cellmate. It was the crack
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  that broke the case open.
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  Speaker 2: Shows you how fragile Manson's hold really was. One confession
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  and it all starts to crumble.
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  Speaker 1: But even from prison, Manson's influence didn't just vanish, did it.
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  Speaker 2: Unfortunately, no threats, intimidation, He had loyal followers On the outside,
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  Catherine chair said he told Steve Grogan to tie her
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  to a car and drag her back to the ranch
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  if she tried to leave.
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  Speaker 1: It's almost hard to believe that level of control, even
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  from behind bars.
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  Speaker 2: It highlights the hold he had on them and the
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  challenges Diane Lake and Catherine Chare would face in breaking free.
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  It really is chilling. Even after the arrest, the control continues.
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  Speaker 1: It's like Manson was reaching out from behind bars, still
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  pulling the strings. Catherine Scherrer even talks about this terrifying
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  incident where Manson told Steve Grogan to tie her to
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  a car what yeah, and drag her back to the
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  ranch if she tried to leave.
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  Speaker 2: It's almost unbelievable he delegated his terror. It shows how
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  dangerous it was to even think about leaving. It wasn't
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  just walking away, it was defined Manson.
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  Speaker 1: And then during the trial, Catherine felt this pressure to
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  stand by Manson, to smile for the cameras, even to
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  say she.
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  Speaker 2: Loved him, all out of fear. It's heartbreaking. Imagine knowing
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  what you know about the crimes and still having to
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  play that role. It's like thought reform. That's what cults do.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, that systematic indoctrination. And Diane Lake, she was only
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  fourteen when she joined the family. She gets questioned by
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  the police, but she's terrified to say anything.
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  Speaker 2: Of course, she was just a kid, so vulnerable. Think
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  about it. The family became her family. She found belonging, a.
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  Speaker 1: Sense of purpose, and that's what makes it so hard
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  to break free. But both Catherine and Diane did eventually
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  find the strength to leave. How did that happen? What
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  was the turning point?
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  Speaker 2: Well, there's rarely one single moment. It's more of a
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  gradual realization. For Diane, going to college was huge. It
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  exposed her to different ideas, critical thinking, a world outside
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  Manson's control.
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  Speaker 1: It sounds like education really helped her reclaim her.
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  Speaker 2: Own mind exactly. Education could be so empowering, especially in
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  situations where someone's been brainwashed. It helps you think critically,
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  question everything you've been told.
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  Speaker 1: But even with all that, the trauma, the memories, those
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  don't just disappear. Diane even admitted she still felt connected
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  to Manson in some ways.
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  Speaker 2: Right. That's important to remember. The damage doesn't vanish overnight.
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  It takes time, often with therapy, to unpack it all
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  and truly heal.
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  Speaker 1: So the Manson story isn't just about the murders. It's
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  about the long, difficult journey of healing and reclaiming your
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  life after that kind of manipulation.
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  Speaker 2: It really shows how resilient people can be, how even
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  in the darkest situations there's always hope of breaking free
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  and starting over.
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  Speaker 1: But the fascination with Manson and the family, it's never
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  really faded. Why do you think that is Well.
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  Speaker 2: Part of it is the brutality of the crimes and
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  the mystery surrounding them, but there's also this fascination with
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  cults and the power of a figure like Manson.
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  Speaker 1: It's like we're trying to understand how ordinary people get
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  pulled into something so horrific exactly.
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  Speaker 2: And maybe those stories also force us to face our
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  own vulnerabilities, our own susceptibility to manipulation in groupthink, which is.
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  Speaker 1: A scary thought. But these stories aren't just things of
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  the past. There are echoes of Manson's tactics everywhere even today.
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  Speaker 2: That's why it's so important to be aware, to think critically,
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  to question authority, especially those who offer easy answers to
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  complex problems or demand blind loyalty.
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  Speaker 1: So it's not just about recognizing those patterns and others.
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  It's about being self aware too.
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  Speaker 2: Right, absolutely, having that healthy skepticism, questioning information, trusting your gut.
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  Those are crucial skills, especially in today's world.
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  Speaker 1: So, moving beyond the specifics of the family, what are
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  the broader lessons here or what can we learn from
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  all of this?
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  Speaker 2: I think it emphasizes the importance of individual agency, of
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  thinking for yourself. It's a reminder of how dangerous groupthink
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  can be and how seductive those charismatic leaders can.
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  Speaker 1: Be, especially when they promise easy solutions to problems that
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  are anything but easy.
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  Speaker 2: Exactly, it's all about being a critical thing, a discerning
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  consumer of information, especially in this age of information overload.
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  Speaker 1: And on that note, let's shift gears a bit. Let's
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  talk about the public perception of the Manson family. How
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  did that change over time?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's crazy. You go from this pure terror, like
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  an invisible monster, to this almost obsession.
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  Speaker 1: Like he became this pop culture icon evil. Yeah, but
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  also this weird symbol of rebellion, like counterculture gone wrong.
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  Speaker 2: And you can't underestimate the media's role in all that.
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  Those trials, the images everywhere, it was a spectacle.
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  Speaker 1: Like a real life horror movie playing out in the news.
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  Speaker 2: Exactly, And that's the danger. We get caught up in
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  the sensationalism and forget about the real people the victims.
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  Speaker 1: Right, Sharon Tate, an actress, her whole life ahead of her,
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  brutally murdered.
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  Speaker 2: Leno and Rosemary LaBianca too, just a normal couple. We
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  still don't even know why they were targeted.
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  Speaker 1: It's easy to forget that these weren't just names in
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  a story. They were real people with families, with dreams, and.
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  Speaker 2: Those families are still living with that loss. It goes
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  so much deeper than the headlines.
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  Speaker 1: It always does, and it's natural to want to understand why.
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  But is there ever a good enough reason for something
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  like this?
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  Speaker 2: That's the tough part, right, We want to make sense
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  of it, find a reason, but sometimes there isn't one.
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  Speaker 1: So what do we do then when it's just senseless,
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  random evil?
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  Speaker 2: I think we focus on the victims, learn from what happened,
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  and try to prevent it from happening again.
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  Speaker 1: Instead of getting lost in the darkness, we use it
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  to try and make things better.
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  Speaker 2: Exactly, to be more aware, more resilient, to choose compassion
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  over fear.
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  Speaker 1: So, as we wrap up our deep dive into the
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  Manson family, what's the big question we should all be
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  thinking about.
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  Speaker 2: Well, we live in a different world now, information overload,
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  charismatic figures online, all that. So how do we protect
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  ourselves from extremism from those who offer easy answers to
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  really hard problems. How do we as individuals as a
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  society stay vigilant.
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  Speaker 1: It's a question we all have to grapple with. There's
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  no easy answer.
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  Speaker 2: But it starts with thinking, critically, questioning everything, trusting your gut.
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  Speaker 1: Being aware of those red flags both in the world
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  and in ourselves exactly.
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  Speaker 2: It's about building a world that values empathy and reason
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  above all else.
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  Speaker 1: And that's our show for today. Thanks for joining us
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  for this deep dive. We'll be back next week with
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  a new topic. Until then, keep learning, keep questioning, and
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  keep diving deep.