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Ep 8 Georgiana Pittock Ruins Portland · Ruining the Workplace Podcast

• Jaden: Ask me that again. I'm Jaden and this is the Ruining the Workplace podcast. Danielle: Okay. Can I say her name? I not say? Jaden I'm not going to say her name. That's weird. Where does your daughter's curly hair come and I'm Danielle. Jaden: I think it comes from both of us because I have like the Irish girls, know, and then Ben had like super curly hair when I met him. He had like James Dean hair. ⁓ My husband had very curly hair. Yeah, I think he's her father. If I'm remembering correctly. Yeah. Danielle: Right, right. ⁓ really? My god, cute. Right. No, just Ben. Some man named Ben. Who's Ben? ⁓ god. You can verify that now. Yeah. That's the thing. It's real. Yeah. Some places require it, depending on your situation. Jaden: I can. That's a thing. There's a whole scientific process around that. Fortunately, we're not in that situation. As far as I know, maybe we are. ⁓ God. Now I'm worried. Danielle: Thank God. Yeah. Do you should we call him? Wait, how do we patch in a phone call on this? OK, can I just say, though, this is actually fun, like seeing you in the room. So we're in the room together. We're in your like office room, living room, room that you live in and hang out in and work in and play your instruments in. Jaden: Okay, so this is actually my life. So we're in room. Yeah. my. That's Danielle: Where are we? ⁓ Jaden: Could be Disney France for all you know. Disney Paris, which we didn't go to. should have. Mm-hmm. I've heard it is amazing. ⁓ Danielle: Mm hmm. I would like to go to the Tokyo one, actually. That would be really fun. And also, think that culturally, they go hard for shit like that. And it would just be cool to see all the the glam. ⁓ Jaden: Yeah, I do love a Japanese approach to life. And we went and saw the Japanese garden, which is located in the Rose Garden, which is in Portland, Oregon, which is where you are today. And so today, we're going to talk about Georgiana Burton Pittock who is wife of Henry Lewis Pittock, but not just the wife of some man. OK, I just want to be very clear. Danielle: Mm-hmm. Jaden: is the woman who monetized roses and fixed society, sort of. Yeah, so. So we are in the middle of that we're kind doing. No, we did part of it. So the rose garden up there, that's a tie-in. So I'll talk a little bit about her influence, where that came from, and what it all means for Portland. Danielle: Wait, so did we already do the field trip that we were gonna do? Jaden: So our girl Georgiana Burton was born in Clark County, Missouri. Which is in the Midwest if I'm remembering correctly. Is it? Okay. Danielle: I think that's debatable. I wouldn't debate it, but there are people who have feelings about what is the Midwest and what is not. And I feel like, I could be completely wrong, but I feel like Missouri is one of those places that people are like, no, no. Jaden: other people. I feel like I'm writing completely wrong. But I feel like this group is one of those places that we play. So what is it, I think there. Okay. So then they start with the archipelago, which is the gateway to the west. Okay, so literally it's the mid of the Midwest. Maybe. Okay. I don't think the west is there. It's not even in my notes to debate this, Maybe it's not built this way. There is, find it. Okay, so. Danielle: I think that could be the argument. But then they have the arch, which is the gateway to the West. Maybe I don't make the rules there. Where there's a will, there's a way, is what I've heard. We'll make it work. Okay, carry on. Jaden: Georgiana was born on November 14th, 1845. And she actually lived in Iowa with her parents, Elwood and Rhoda Ann, along with her two sisters. she had a very tight upbringing. She was a very headstrong, independent kid. Her parents took great care of them. They were very smart, business savvy, that kind of a thing. So she was already kind of just on the path to not a d***. difficult existence. So I'm going to skip ahead to about when she's nine years old. they were one of the families that chose to make the journey to Oregon on the Oregon Trail. Yes. And how do we? No, that was because you said Oregon. Let's be very clear. Danielle: On the trail. Wait, is this why you were being a little cagey when I asked you if there was stuff about the trail the other day? You're like, oh, sorry. My God. Jaden: So during her family's on the Oregon Trail, she was allegedly ⁓ captured by Sioux natives. Right. And it's because she was not just like kind of walking behind the family or just hiding in the wagon or kind of just like. Danielle: I love it. What was she doing? Wait, she's like nine. People are insane. Different times, but man, wow. Jaden: going along for the ride. was on her own pony. She was riding ahead of the group. She's a baddie. Well, you know, it's different times. Yeah, there was no TikTok back then. So she was on horse talk. Danielle: which is great. No, that's probably a thing though, like even now as a former horse girl, you should know. Jaden: It is. am. Yeah. So Georgiana, riding ahead alone on her own pony, she gets scooped up these two natives. ⁓ But it's kind of funny because ⁓ ⁓ were like impressed by her. They were like, ⁓ she's a formidable rider She's very independent. She's telling them what to do, basically. Yeah. So Danielle: ⁓ ⁓ ⁓ Jaden: She's very tenacious. And they were like, maybe we should keep her with us as like an asset, like a person of this tribe. She's a strong rider. We need more of those. And then they didn't, because they knew that was wrong. They were like, let's return her unharmed, which they did. But eventually, ⁓ our girl G and her family ended up in Portland, Oregon, where Papa Elwood Danielle: Wow. Jaden: left his career in flour milling So, and his dreams of becoming an architect and a contractor, which he did successfully become. ⁓ And ⁓ he actually built several of the early Portland structures. ⁓ And it's kind of cool because he was very into the style of wrought iron cast iron work in buildings. And there were some actually pretty notable buildings that were built in downtown and kind of around the city, including the original Multnomah County Courthouse. Yeah. So after the family settles in. Danielle: Love that. Cool. Jaden: Georgiana is educated at a Methodist school called the Portland Academy and Female Seminary. And it's actually located, it was located on seventh and Broadway, which is downtown, which is like a normal modern building is there now, but you can go back and look at like some of the old photos. And it's funny to see that like, it's like a schoolhouse in the middle of a field. then, ⁓ no, that's downtown Portland. So interesting. Yeah. Danielle: I love that stuff. Yeah, that's cool. Jaden: So as she got older, she was ⁓ really absorbing and being inspired by the social gospel movement, which the ethos of that is if society is broken, fix it and preferably with organization and moral convection. this was really kind of social justice in its infancy, because it was really ⁓ taking care of homeless people and taking care of women and children specifically who are less fortunate in all of this. she was really inspired by this movement. ⁓ Danielle: I love Right. Yeah. Jaden: And it's very foundational to she becomes and how she operates as she gets older. ⁓ one she has a meet-cute ⁓ with ⁓ And she's just driving her and buggy downtown past his newspaper office because Mr. Henry Lewis Pittock ⁓ Danielle: ⁓ Of course she ⁓ Jaden: eventually will be the new owner of the Oregonian. So he's into this business and he's like connected. But yeah, so they have a meet cute, fall madly in love. And you know, he's her future husband at this point. And by future, I mean immediate future because they got married in 1860. Well, she was the ripe old age of 15. And he was 25. Once again. Danielle: My god, super cute. Eww. Jaden: But that same year, he acquired the newspaper. He became the owner of the Oregonian. So at this point, we have a teenage bride, yet again, a rapidly growing empire and a little rosebud of a city called Portland, Oregon. Danielle: Well. ⁓ And so they are like people about town. Like they're of some status. ⁓ I obviously he is. And sounds like her family is as well. Jaden: Yeah. Yeah, after we're going to call them G and H, after they settle into married life, she had a few things in her favor. in, excuse me, influence, money, and time. And she used the hell out of all three. I know. I'm going go back to the topic of social gospel. Danielle: Good for her. Yeah, go for ⁓ Jaden: Georgiana applied the principles that she was learning from this movement to ⁓ extensive philanthropic work and leadership in various women's organizations around Portland. She built them, she joined them, you name it, she was doing it. ⁓ she had this really profound sense of commitment. And really anytime she had on her hands that she wasn't doing, you know, home duties or ⁓ whatever, she doing charity work, raising money ⁓ and really to support women and children who were not in the same position she was. So one of the first things that she does is co-found the Ladies Relief Society through the Unitarian Church. And they sold baby clothes, they fundraised, and they built systems that led to a baby home. OK? It's for abandoned orphan children. A baby home, yes. Like, so many orphans. that's all just Great Depression, Oregon Trail, and a lot of Danielle: ⁓ my god, a baby home. Sad. Well, yeah. Right, like how many kids just show up on their own? Jaden: parents died on the Oregon Trail? Yeah. Or are like part of other families that have been absorbed. Yeah. They all died of dysentery, their oxen broke their legs, all of the Oregon Trail challenges. Yeah, no fording the river. Anyway, yeah. So this led to some of the earliest childcare support structures, as well as like food distribution programs in Portland. so. Danielle: They couldn't do the river crossing. yeah. It's hard, It would be nice if we could still do that in an effective way. Oh my God. Too many cooks not cooking in the kitchen. Yes. Is that? Really? Oh, that's so sad. Jaden: I know. There's two me cooks in the kitchen now. Everybody's greedy. Cooks not cooking and they're all trying to steal everyone else's money. That seems to be the thing around Portland now is like nonprofit like larceny theft, all of this shit. It's so bad. Uh huh. Yeah, we've got a real issue. But anyway, this baby home eventually involved evolves into the Waverly baby home, which like became a very you know, prominent place for women, children to go and get support, live until they could find work. And they had all of the support systems that they needed to really get their lives back in order or in order. And then after that, ⁓ was the establishment of Fruit and Flower Center in 1906. And this wasn't just a charity. You're going to love this. This is so cool. Danielle: Adorable. Jaden: It's the first daycare center in Oregon for working mothers. I know. Yeah. So she helped find found this place and then she continued to fund it over the years. This is so perspective. She donated $100 a year, which is like $4,000 in today's money. Danielle: ⁓ my god, stop. That's amazing. Wow. I know, but when you just hear $100, you're like, oh, the sacrifice. I mean, that's not a lot of money, but also. Jaden: So she's out here donating of dollars a year and just basically all of her time is spent fundraising or doing work. And she ⁓ was not only able to use her wealth to advance causes, she really leveraging all of the connections she was making as well. used her connection to the Oregonian. Her husband was like, yeah, you can place ads in the paper to notify people at the daycare. ⁓ ⁓ they had nine children. five Danielle: What hmm. Holy ⁓ sad. And also five is a lot. Five is a lot of kids. I know it's a different time, but even when I hear things like that, I'm like, wow. Well, OK, so I'm assuming that they had help because they are people of means. And also, all of this sounds exhausting. Good for her. Right. Jaden: There's so many. No. Yes. it is. But they had help. They were extremely wealthy. So part of the reason that they had all this wealth early on between them is because she stayed very involved in his business stuff. And they did a lot of things together. So they really used the Oregonian as their financial foundation. But they did a lot of investing in real estate, steamboats, railroads, financial industry, silver sheep ranching, all sorts of things. And this just gave her all those resources to basically do what she was doing. then they have this huge family. They have tons of help. They have a lot of people around them. let's see. Danielle: That's cool. And was she, she was like an active player in some of those investment decisions. It wasn't just like, hey, we love steamboats now. Jaden: Yeah. I think she was an active player. Yeah, I think she was she was a loud, outspoken woman. She was very social. She was very. ⁓ hmm. Yeah. ⁓ And and Henry was all about it. He was like. Danielle: That's cool. That's awesome. Yeah. I mean, her story, I mean, like riding ahead on the pony at nine and like telling the Native Americans what's what is very cool. OK, she's taking charge. Love it. Jaden: Whatever you want to do, I will support you. I will fund you. I let you use Oregonian as an outlet. ⁓ And so I think, yes. She's just so great. But it was cool because they would put ads in Oregonian for kids who are waiting for adoption. Danielle: Amazing. Amazing. Was he just like obsessed with her? Oh my god. Right. like good thing. ⁓ Jaden: Yeah, totally. ⁓ also supported the Perry Center, which was another children's home that was being born at the same time. And that was founded in 1867 by a woman named Elizabeth Perry. That's actually still out there on Powell Boulevard. Yeah. And so she was just a huge networker. ⁓ She connected with this woman named. Danielle: ⁓ Amazing. Jaden: Anna Lewis Mann, And in 1887, she helped found the Portland Women's Union. Yeah. And so the ultimate goal with this was to help women become self-supporting. Mm hmm. So what she's also noticing at this time is all these systems are built for men. Danielle: oooo have that. Jaden: There's a real patriarchy thing happening here. like, but women are working. So we can't ignore that. And they can't not work. let's stop pretending that this isn't a thing. And let's start building systems that will allow women to work, which at that time, it was really like, ⁓ ew, you're woman who works. what's wrong with you? from social level. It was very it not great. So she used her position the P.W.U. Women's Union to play a significant role in founding what was called the Martha Washington Hotel. This was specifically designed for single working women and it was regarded as a safe, respectable, and structured place that offered opportunity ⁓ And, it was very suspicious, unsafe for a lot of women out there. If ⁓ a woman lived alone and had a was just like... Danielle: ⁓ God, yeah. Imagine like your walk home from work in the evening or something. Jaden: Yeah, and so her solution was to just create infrastructure where women can work and be respected. So is it progressive? Yeah. Is it kind of enforcing a weird like acceptable womanhood thing? A little bit, but I'd rather have safety than whatever the opposite is. Danielle: I love that. That's so great. So is it progressive? Hell yeah. Well, yes. Right. And I think in the context of the time and like what else is going on, like it's a move forward, you know. Jaden: So this was all of her very charitable, progressive forward. But all this time, ⁓ I forgot to say one thing that I really love about her. She, at this time, know, women don't have their own money. Fuck them if they have a job. She controlled her own money and had her own bank account. Danielle: Right? What? Wow. That's so cool. Jaden: Independent lady. Mm-hmm. Yeah. she, you know, because she needed a way to really be able to own this fundraising that she was doing because she, you know, to support all these various causes that she's out here, she was constantly, you know, basically generating income through organized tea parties and big sales and lectures and bazaars and, you know. All sorts of things like that to really just fund all this work. Danielle: That's awesome. And her husband was like, sure, go for it. Amazing. I love that. Jaden: She's like, get after it girl. Yeah, do it. Baddie. So, now this is where like the city of roses comes in. She was an extreme avid gardener and she loved roses. And so they ⁓ were like, okay, great. She was like, I feel like I could fund another society. Like, I could do more with this. Yeah. Yeah. So out of that, she organized and founded the Portland Rose Society. This was around 1888. Yeah. And this was just a benefit originally for the Unitarian Church. But that turned into a competition. eventually, the first formal competition was held in her front yard in 1889. And. Danielle: Why not? What's one more? What's another one? It's fine. ⁓ my God. Jaden: ⁓ It was just to basically show off the year's best homegrown roses, right? Yeah, and out of that Portland Rose Festival was born. And also we went up to Washington Park, which has the Portland Rose Garden. Portland International Rose Test Garden. Danielle: Amazing. wow. ⁓ my gosh. Jaden: is actually the full name. That was just basically to take the idea of having the best roses and then having this like wonderful place where, yeah. Danielle: That's a lot. So is it now like, listen, these are the best roses in the world. Okay, I mean, the ones that we saw were really pretty. They're not all in bloom yet, so, you know, but it's very pretty and they smelled nice. Jaden: Pretty much. It's a little early. They did. They're so lovely. she founds the Rose Society. She's hosting competitions in her yard. She turns this into like a civic event, right, which evolves into the Portland Rose Festival and eventually the International Rose Test Garden. So she takes a hobby, a social network and a fundraiser and turns it into this like identity for Portland. And Portland becomes the city of roses. Danielle: I didn't know it was known as that. That's very cool. Are you all sure? Are you affiliated with the Rose Bowl at all? Do you know what that is? Okay, I believe ⁓ it's a sport ball thing. It's like a college football thing. I feel like it happens in California, but I feel like I'm wrong. Pasadena maybe. Jaden: Well, it is. Rose City. No, no. Is that a sport ball event? I think that's right. You're like, I feel like it's California Pasadena specifically. Danielle: I'm just gonna keep rolling with this. If I sound confident, people will believe me. Okay, so you're known as like the Rose City, City of Roses. I love that. Jaden: command. So you're talking about the Rose City. Or the Rose City. But, um, this is all predicated on the fact that these people are extremely wealthy, right? But they are using their power for good. As they should and most don't. But, um, as we know, they had Danielle: as they should, right? Jaden: you know, all these different events, all over the place. And because she's such a baddie, she controls her own money. Right. And she is just just going hard on all this stuff. And then in ⁓ roughly, I know, somewhere early, early nineteen hundreds, they built the Pittock Mansion. Danielle: I love a big house. I do. Jaden: It's spectacular. It's gorgeous. And it's a 46-acre estate which overlooks Portland. It's beautiful. And there's some kind of interesting things about this house, Look out there. Danielle: Damn, that's cool. Is it haunted? ⁓ my God. I didn't know I was such a mind reader. Okay. Jaden: So the house was completed in 1914, but right before that Georgiana had a stroke and it was a pretty big one. she was born in 1845, like 60, maybe a little older than that. Yeah. Something like that. Yeah. And so she has a massive stroke and Danielle: How old is she at the time? Do we know? This is a quiz for you. How math can you math? OK, so she's older, old. OK. Jaden: she becomes disabled and limited severely in her mobility. But that's cool because there were some major innovations that they were able to do in their own home to make it accessible for her. So. Danielle: ⁓ no. ⁓ my god, I'm not gonna guess anymore. Go on. Jaden: Well, they put an elevator in the house. Yeah. And so this is like, yeah, this is new technology. Probably a lot. Much money. At least $200. Danielle: Wow. ⁓ my God. How much did that have to cost? A lot. Yeah. At least $200. Jaden: So there was some other cool stuff that they put in their house, including an intercom telephone system. And remember, this is like 1914-ish. So like, the beginning of all of that. And exactly. Hello. And then a central vacuum system. So it's like in the walls, and you hook up and. Danielle: What? Yeah, this is a big deal. Holy cow. They don't have to just ring bells for servants anymore. Wow. Right. Jaden: I don't know if it was the kind where you like sweep stuff and it just automatically does it or if it's the kind where you like hook up a hose and then you can just vacuum but that was one of the earliest like central vacuum systems. It's a thing. It was really popular too in like the mid century mid like 50s, 60s. Yeah. Danielle: GASP Oh my God. I don't even know if I knew that that was a thing. That's cool. They were really into spacey stuff. That makes sense. Wow. Wait, that should make a comeback though, because I don't like vacuuming or sweeping. What if I could just sweep it to a hole in the wall? Yes, mine does too. It's very cool. Right. Jaden: Wait, that's just maybe come back because I don't like vacuums anymore. No. Or you just leave it the whole way. That's what my hairdresser has. Yes, like this is very cool. This is a thing I need. Right. Yeah. So vacuums, they had thermostats also. So temperature control, this is new, right? They had overhead. OK. This is where it gets so serious for me because you know how I am about the big light. Danielle: Ooh, ⁓ my god. Jaden: They had overhead indirect lighting. Okay, ambient lighting. Yeah, like if that's not a modern innovation, well, we'll go see. We're gonna go see. I'm gonna take you there. Inside. I can tell you, this is, okay, so there's like, a couple things that I love to do. Danielle: Oh yeah. Whoa, wow. How? How does that even work for them in that time? Really? Jaden. Oh my God. Like to the house, to the mansion. I cannot tell you. Okay, so there's like a handful of things that I love to do when I go to places. One of them is boat rides. ⁓ The other is going to old buildings and like old mansions specifically. am obsessed. I love this. ⁓ my God. Amazing. Yeah. Now I was like, no, actually I've been guessing the whole time. what is the thing? Where is she taking me? Jaden: Oh I am I love it. Mm-hmm. I know for sure like this is kind of boring. No, I'm kidding It's gonna be a fancy really awesome ⁓ Yeah Yeah, so we're gonna go see that fancy mansion, but ⁓ it also had a walk-in freezer and I don't know why this is considered an innovation but a Turkish smoking room It's exotic doesn't feel very innovative to me Danielle: Amazing. ⁓ my God, I love it. I love it. Okay. Yay. That's very exotic. No, but maybe it was scandalous at the time. Maybe they were like, ⁓ we look at your rugs. ⁓ my. Jaden: Ooh, Uh-oh. And also, this room is spectacular. It is so cool looking. Yeah, it's like this little nook and then it's like floor to ceiling. It's just kind of like, yeah, they did like the certain style of painting on the ceiling. It's very like bougie. It feels opulence all over. Danielle: I bet it's amazing. Yeah. Does it feel like you're in like a tent almost like? Yes. ⁓ my God, I love it. ⁓ Amazing. Jaden: So they also had a music room and a library. So they really just made this place, you know, they wanted this place to feel cozy and warm and be good for their kiddos. And also, ⁓ eventually when they did well, good for their kiddos is like an understatement because this by this time their children were grown up and. Yeah. Yeah. So their two youngest daughters got married and their families ended up living in the house because it's huge. I it's a compound. Danielle: good for the grand kiddos and she can wheel around the house. Jaden: she lives this fairly short stint at the mansion. She ends up dying on June 12th, 1918. So, no, she had about four years. Danielle: ⁓ no, she didn't really get to soak up all of the amazing things in her house. Yeah. ⁓ God. Jaden: ⁓ so you asked about ghosts earlier. Yeah. ⁓ yeah. ⁓ Mm hmm. So ⁓ there are lots of ⁓ I don't know any like real But ⁓ the big thing is that it seems Georgiana may have never left. Danielle: I did. I still love a haunted house and a ghost tour. ⁓ my god. Jaden: Yeah, there are reports of people being there after hours and seeing a lady walking, a little something, yeah, and then just sort of in and out, which I'm like, she was in a wheelchair, so why should she be walking? maybe your free spirit, your unbound. Danielle: ⁓ I love that. Yes. That's a good point. Yeah, you know, maybe you get to choose in the afterlife. Like, listen, I don't want that existence. Been there, done that. Give me my legs back. Jaden: Yeah, exactly. so it's crazy because they have this four years with her, and then he didn't even last that long. He died less than year later. He got the flu and died. Yeah, 1918. I don't know if that was... Danielle: He loved her so much, his heart just gave out. Oh. Wait, is that when the? Jaden: I think it's the same time frame. I don't know that it was like totally related, like the Spanish flu thing or that outbreak. But yeah, he died in January of 1919 and he left behind the largest estate to be probated in Oregon's history, which means it just got stuck in the fucking red tape of it all. Right. And the property was valued at almost eight million dollars at that time. And in today's money, it's like one hundred and three million. Danielle: Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Right. Jaden: I Kids that were living there continued to stay until about the 1950s. And the last people to live in the home were grandchildren. Oh my god. Yeah. That's cool. Here's what's wild, though. They moved out. So this, the grandson, a grandson and his father moved out after living there. And they moved out in 1958. And they put the mansion on the market, which is crazy. know. Danielle: Oh my gosh, that's cool. Whoa. It's weird to just be like, we're selling the big fancy house. That's a historical landmark. It's fine. That's wild. Jaden: Yeah, we're just gonna get rid of it. Yeah, we don't need it. But it like didn't it didn't it didn't go anywhere. And so they left and left it abandoned for four years ish. And then it got extremely destroyed like really wrecked by this big storm the Columbus Day storm that happened on October 12 1962 is probably similar to the Halloween snowstorm. Danielle: Oh Lord. I can't. I can't. I do not care. don't. Some people are really invested in this Halloween storm and part of it is probably because what do people say it was in like 1991? So I was barely alive as you know. We were barely alive. It does not matter. Jaden: So. Danielle: OK, so the Columbus Day storm ruined this house. Jaden: OK, so we're going to take a short Yeah, so it did considerable damage and that was in 1962 and so a couple of years later it was still abandoned. It was just sitting there. And by 1964 developers were like, we should just tear this thing down. But people of Portland were like, hell no, we won't go. And they pulled together a fundraiser, bought the property and managed to save it. Danielle: ⁓ my god. Jaden: And now there is a society that like manages this thing, right? The Pittock Mansion Society was formed in 1968 they took over operating as a museum. So they refurbished it. And then they eventually turned it over to the Portland Parks and Rec. So it's now like a city five thing. ⁓ Danielle: That's really cool. Yeah. ⁓ sure. Jaden: But so back to the mansion ghosts, right? there was a few things that had happened. There was some scandal stuff, but nothing really, really terrible like murders or cheating or anything like that. It was just more business stuff. So there wasn't any amount of tragedy or notable stories that would cause like, ⁓ why is this place haunted? ⁓ because a horrific murder took place. Danielle: It's like the accountants are floating through like, these people are late on their payments, my lord, or something. Like what is a business ghost? Jaden: Yes. What is a business ghost? Tea was not hot enough. Ew. I don't know why we have accents. We're in Oregon. Danielle: The stuff of nightmares is what it is. You're right. Oh, you were late to supper again. I don't know. I don't know. Yeah, wait. Jaden: Well, ⁓ it's so being run as a museum. People are working there and staff members start to report some activity, right? Like they're in there. There's some figures maybe moving around. They're catching shadows. They're hearing voices. And they're hearing ⁓ footsteps. ⁓ And ⁓ like and on their own. Danielle: ⁓ ⁓ my God. Jaden: Yeah. So one notable story was one ⁓ late one evening, an employee was closing up the museum. And as she was on her way out the door, something really weird happened. She says that every single light in the house came back on all at once. And all of this like haunting, it's not the accountants, it's Georgiana herself. Like. Danielle: What? That's scary. Jaden: They're saying most of these stories revolve around her. It's her. Her ghost lingers near the entrance. Like, she's greeting people as they come. Yeah, and other people have seen some sort of specter of her in a window. ⁓ my god. I want it to happen so bad. Yeah. And then another regular occurrence is her walking through the rose gardens up there. Danielle: What? ⁓ welcome. Welcome to my home. ⁓ ⁓ my God, can you imagine? I know. ⁓ That makes sense. She loved that shit. Jaden: ⁓ Yeah, even if you don't see her, apparently you can tell when she's around because there is... Yeah, well and Rose sense. Danielle: We're gonna have to watch for like cold spots when we're there or something. Ooh. Okay. Jaden: Yeah, visitors have reported that like all of a sudden it just really strongly smells of roses. Just no matter where they are, not in the garden, but just like up in the house and all of sudden they're like, whoa. Yeah. And if you were ever there at night, which unfortunately I don't think that's possible, but it would be so amazing. I would love to be up there at night. It's gorgeous. But like apparently that's a very active time. So there's like shovels clinking against the ground, like landscape work. Like you can hear it. Yeah. Danielle: Oh my god. Like, wait a minute. Jaden: And this is where it gets a little sinister. They said that there's heavy footsteps of a man wearing work boots. And that only comes up at night, because of course. Danielle: Eww. But why? You're not likely to do yard work in the nighttime. Jaden: Well, he... Well, he's apparently, this is the former groundskeeper who worked at the mansion for a very long time, and he did die on the property. So ⁓ like many others who were enchanted by this lovely home, he just wanted to stay there. Just him and Georgiana hanging out. No. Nope. So. Well, I think for me, I think. Danielle: They just doesn't need to, they don't need to move on. They're like, this is it. What do you think their unfinished business is? Jaden: Georgiana is just like, love it here and I want people to be happy and taken care of. That's the vibe I get. Yeah. So there's all sorts of fun little stories about people seeing things and hearing things. I've never experienced needing myself, but I would really like to. I would love that. So ⁓ yeah. So that's sort of how it sits now. Danielle: Right. We love that. Yeah, that makes sense. And if they're not hurting anybody, like. Amazing. OK. Right. Hell, yeah. Jaden: Now the house just sits up there and the PIDOX are, you know, obviously mainstays of Portland. They're a very, very influential still story. Yeah. Danielle: Wow. Right. Yeah. ⁓ Jaden: I don't know that she necessarily ruined the workplace, but she certainly ruined it for men who didn't want women to work. enabled childcare so women could work. There was housing so women could live independently. Organizations so women could earn money. And social structures that made it all acceptable. Danielle: I mean, yeah. She was really out here ruining women's lives. Right, yeah, by making it so much better. ⁓ my God. I love that, don't know, it like, you'd mentioned. Jaden: Yeah, and mints. So. Yeah. Danielle: kind of towards the beginning of like laying the foundation or like the early work of like social justice work and like really focusing on like who truly is in need. And it doesn't seem. Jaden: is what justice work really focusing on culturally is an area that doesn't see. Danielle: like performative, you know, like I think it's easy. It's very easy to fall into that trap. And then I also think like when you see like things representing women's activism in that time period, it feels very like, well, you're just bored. You needed to do something like I'm a huge fan of the Gilded Age. Do you watch the Gilded Age? It's so good. And they all have their little charities that they do and like their little luncheons that they throw to raise money for whatever. And Jaden: like performative, you know, I think it's easy, it's very easy to draw that background. And then I also think, like when you see like things representing women's activism in that kind of area, it feels very, I'm wondering if you sort of to do something. Like I'm a teacher, I'm a teacher of what I'm a teacher of the day. But I know of it, yeah. They all have their little chairs and use them to do their little lunches that they throw at each other or whatever. Yeah. And I'm sure many of them have their own work in place. But it's also like, you were just a bunch of writers who just did that. So wouldn't that seem so to the full? yes. We're just having a little bit It's all about like, performative, like you said. Right. Yeah. But this story doesn't seem that way. We really want to pull in on all of these endeavors to truly help with it and to have Danielle: And I'm sure that like many of them have their hearts in the right place. Well, I hope anyway, but, it's also like, you are just a bunch of rich bitches who don't have anything to do. So you're like, ⁓ look at us being so kind to the poor, you know, just having a luncheon to support. Right. Yeah. But, but this story doesn't seem that way. Like she's really going all in on all of these endeavors to truly help women and Like to have her own bank account and her own funds to make that happen. It's not just her family money or her husband's money. It's like, no, I'm making business decisions with him so that we can fund these types of things and they're very important. ⁓ And I think the story of her, you know, on the Oregon Trail. Jaden: I think that's point. ⁓ the what? There you go. Yeah, yeah. And I, I don't want to understate the like influence of the social gospel movement on her because that was such a thing. But like, unlike a lot of the performativeness that you were kind of just describing, she I think she really was like, Danielle: Oregon. ⁓ It's like, I don't know, it's like a really good like, teaser into like, this is how she exists. She's like marching to the beat of her own drum. She's very independent. She knows what she wants and she goes for it. And I love that. Totally, yeah. Jaden: I have to be doing this. is my moral duty. And like as a person with privilege, wealth, access, all those things, it is literally my duty to make sure that other people have at least what they need from a base level. Yeah, yeah. This is the worst time I've ever heard of music was played off. You should all be in a great place. So this is the worst time I've ever heard that. But yeah, I love it. Danielle: Right, yeah. Right, yeah, yeah. like, this is the first time I've heard of the, what do you say it was Social Gospel? Which should also be a great band name. ⁓ But, so this is the first time that I've heard of that. like even, like I love that that was influential, because you have to get, I mean people come up with ideas just randomly, right? But like most of us are influenced by something. Jaden: This is influential because you have to get, I mean, people come up with ideas just randomly. Most of us are influenced by something, whether it's religion or our families or seeing a neighbor, hearing a family, like that all influences how you choose to show the world the pages of your life and how to make decisions about it and how not to take this layer of the right this way. So I think that we have that to guide us. Danielle: whether it's religion or our families or like seeing a thing or experiencing a thing like that all influences how you choose to show up in the world and how you choose to live your life and like helps you make decisions about like, I'm not going to be this way or I'm going to be this way. So I love that she had that like to guide her, like wake her up to these are things that are really important and that, you know, was she was able to buy into it and like use her influence and her wealth and her position to. Jaden: and wake her up to certain things that are really important and that, you know, she was able to buy into a youth-grade, know, physical health or physical positions, you contributed to the positive life. Like, you became a huge part the hospital. Yeah, we do need something that is like the great uniter. And what I think is really interesting, that's such a good point, because part of the interesting thing about the dynamic was like people that were not extremely wealthy and people that were in like Danielle: Contribute in a positive way and I feel like maybe we need a new social gospel Jaden: just working, they were in the age, the 19th century, like urban industrial boom that's happening. They were finding ways to basically express their disdain for this sort of overpopulation, the overcrowding, the inequities that were developing because of the wealth power, et cetera, gap. So one of the tools that they would use is scripture, right? And so, so. That was an immediate way for people with wealth to connect to those people because they had that in common. And so out of that was sort of this Protestant idea. And it grew out of that. And I think that they just needed more powerful voices to help uplift them, but in the way that they were familiar with. So it made sense because they could identify with that. Danielle: Yeah, right. Right. Right. Anything is possible. We have to maintain belief that anything could happen. If we lose that, it's all lost. I do believe that. Like, there has to be some kernel of hope. Jaden: To your point, what is the version of that today? Is that even possible? It feels like maybe not. Yeah. Danielle: yeah I'm very ready to go see the museum. Jaden: It's just, it's so interesting to live in the current climate that we're in right now. the things that she did, I wonder if people know about the social gospel movement. Because it does seem like that is something that we hear right now. And she's a really good person. I want to her husband. Danielle: It's just, it's so interesting like to live in like the current climate that we're in right now. And like the things that she did, or even just like, I want to read more about the social gospel movement and like, because it does seem like that is something that we need right now. And it's just, she's a really good example. And I would say her husband by, you know, proximity is a good example as well of like, using your power and your wealth for the right things, right? Like, tax the fucking rich, take care of each other and everyone, right? Like, and whether you wanna base that in your religion or just in your morals or how you exist in the world, whatever drives you, that's cool. But like, we exist on this rock together and... Jaden: Yeah. And whether you want to be a study in your religion or just in your roles or how you exist in the world, what act of your life is that cool? We exist on this path together. And we should have U.S. work deals even though American must take care of kids and kids should be able to help them. And teachers and homes. Yeah. And I love that you brought the kids up because Danielle: Women should have the ability to work and feel safe and go to work and also take care of their kids and kids should be able to have food and education and homes. Jaden: Part of the social gospel was actually the abolition of child labor. That was a big deal back then. So they had a lot of labor reforms out of this. And it included abolishing child labor, shorter work weeks, and a living wage, and regulations for factories. Because at that time, everything was just wild. And so that was kind of their core ideal set. Danielle: Yeah. ⁓ my God. Wow. Oh wow, yeah, yeah. Jaden: I think what scares me about religion is just generally like how many people take advantage of it in the wrong way? Like this is all the right way. That's how we should use religion. But then there's people out here just like thieving and grifting and scamming and conning and using it as, you know, and it's just, we need more of this kind of energy. Danielle: I'm pretty sure. Right. ⁓ for sure. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. I think we need enough people who are believers to be like, listen, God told me the way that some of you all are doing this is wrong. And actually, like, and it's pretty clear. So I am a I am a believer but not crazy. ⁓ Jaden: Mm-hmm. ⁓ Yeah. ⁓ huh. huh. Noted. Danielle: I like that's important to say. Where I have always struggled is like how people are, how mainstream Christians, I'm just gonna say it, like the church with a capital C is able to twist the message. I'm like, you guys, it's pretty fucking simple. Like Jesus made it very clear that like the most important thing for us to do is love. Jaden: Yeah ⁓ Danielle: and that shows up in our words and our deeds and how we take care of each other. I don't see how that is getting misconstrued in like greed and wealth. And like, that's not to say that like I'm a selfish person, right? Like I am. I don't, I told you the other day I don't like to share, but mostly just my food. Jaden: was up in our order and in our seats and how we take care of each other. I don't see how that is getting construed. Greed, wealth, money. Let's not say that. I myself am a person. Right? I am. I told you there's not much to share. Yeah. Relatable. But I also know that like a certain percentage of the money that I get, I'm supposed to help take care of whether it's for taxes or It's like, don't, what's my define to an extent, but also I should care for my neighbor in the ways that I'm able to, right? And that's not to say that I'm going to have to everyone to get 10 % of their rent or whatever. There's like a whole bunch of- Danielle: But I also know that like a certain percentage of the money that I get, I am supposed to help take care of whether it's through taxes or donations. Like it's I don't what's mine is mine to an extent, but also I should care for my neighbor in the way that in the ways that I am able to. Right. And that's not to say that I'm going down the road of like everyone should give 10 % of their income to whatever. Like that there's like biblical logic behind logic. quote unquote, there's things behind that, right? But like, it's just like where you are able to, you support the community that you exist in, you know, And the same time, why do we pay much in fucking taxes? ⁓ Jaden: Yeah Yeah Danielle: if we're not taking care of each other with our taxes. What? I don't mind paying it, but I also want to see the, well I do. I don't mind paying it if I can see that it's being used to support the community in the ways that it was intended to. Or if we had a choice. Yeah, right, and now, right, I'm not nearly educated enough for any of that. Jaden: I do mind paying it. Yeah, or if we had like a choice and this is our episode on tax reform I know Danielle: That topic is, I'm sure I will step in something. ⁓ Yeah, anyway. Yeah, think religion can be a really good guiding force, but it gets so abused and so misconstrued. And then you have people who will blindly follow the loudest voice or the smartiest voice ⁓ and not question or use their, you know, it's a lot like the Mormon documentary that I just watched. Jaden: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Ooh, the trust me. Yeah. ⁓ Danielle: Trust me, right? And it's actually like, trust no one, ask a lot of questions. Jaden: should we shift to our ruining the workplace tip of the week? Danielle: we shall and I actually think it ties in really well to the story today and that is to stop or don't start if you don't do this already. Apologizing for your existence. we don't need to be ⁓ sorry for being a bit late. Jaden: Sorry. Yeah, don't just say sorry after everything else you say. Me too. Danielle: I mean, don't rub it in people's faces. Like, ⁓ I'm five minutes late, deal with it. ⁓ But you don't have to be like, sorry, I was doing this or this. There's the apology and then the justification that I think we can let go of. Right. Right. And I am guilty of this as well. And I'm working on it. ⁓ but yeah, we don't need to apologize for being here for showing up to things or like having a question. ⁓ my gosh, that's the worst. ⁓ sorry, can I just say it's like, yes. And also don't apologize. for being smart, for being in the room. ⁓ Own that shit. Jaden: or like having a question, ⁓ I'm not stressed first. Sorry, I just want to ask something. Sorry, apologists, you're ruining the workplace. Danielle: Mmm. Cut it out. Just stop. Sorry. Not sorry. Okay. That's it. That's what I got. Love it. Bye. Jaden: Just stop. Sorry, not sorry. Well, that's what I got. Until next time, bye.