Latest / Beyond the Facade with Choose Recovery Services and Blueprint Institute / 66: Free Will in Addiction Recovery

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66: Free Will in Addiction Recovery · Beyond the Facade with Choose Recovery Services and Blueprint Institute

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  Here's a question I have for you.
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  Do I actually have free will or is everything I do already
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  determined by my past, by my trauma or my brain chemistry,
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  call it whatever it is. So that's what we're going to
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  get into today. Welcome to Beyond the Facade
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  podcast. I'm your host, Luke Gordon, and
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  I'm thrilled to have you join me in the space today.
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  What we're going to be doing is diving deep into the trials and
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  triumphs and truths of seeking authenticity.
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  Becoming your true self isn't about a single action or a
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  moment. It's a relentless pursuit, a
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  commitment to self that reveals the rich connection and meaning
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  that our life has to offer. So whether this is your first
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  time tuning in or you're a regular listener, know this.
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  What you're building here goes beyond a conversation.
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  You're here to challenge, to change, and to celebrate the
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  incredible journey of becoming your authentic self.
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  Because when you dare to show up fully, the rewards are
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  immeasurable. So welcome to Beyond the Facade.
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  Let's get started. I just want to say I'm going to
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  completely let go of the outcome of this podcast.
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  There's a part of me saying that this could be like any other
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  podcast and just be regular or this could trigger the heck out
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  of some people. And I'm not just talking even
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  betrayed partners. I'm talking about guys in
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  recovery or people in recovery, I should say.
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  I know I would have had strong feelings about it to begin with.
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  I would have had what I believed and I would have challenged some
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  maybe some things that I believe.
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  So just notice what comes up for you.
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  And if you have things you further want to know, just shoot
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  us a note and say, Hey, talk about this some more or feel
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  free to challenge if you want challenge.
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  That's a, that's a perfectly acceptable thing to be doing.
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  And I also want to just say that for myself, I'm working through
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  this myself. So this concept for me, it feels
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  like it really matters. In fact, the reason I'm
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  recording this podcast is I just got done with one of my men's
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  groups and one of the participants brought this
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  concept up and, and they were talking about it with their
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  therapist. And I just think it's valid and
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  it matters and there can be stuff that comes up with it.
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  OK, let me just dig into it. I just put the asterisks with
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  it. There's AI think this podcast
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  for me is often feels very unscripted.
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  Not a lot of editing happens here.
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  And the kind of feels like that's the way it needs to be
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  because it is called beyond the facade.
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  So if there's a lot of script and a lot of editing and it's
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  kind of like feels like it did lose the purpose.
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  So anyway, I'll let go of the outcome.
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  Here we go. All right, so here's the thought
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  that I have for you. Like if you've been stuck in
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  like recovery or stuck in like addiction or compulsive
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  behavior, and you've wondered why, why you keep repeating the
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  same behavior, Like why do I keep doing this?
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  And your partner's asking you questions like, do you love me?
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  Or how, why in the hell would you do this?
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  What were you thinking? How could you do this?
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  You're not alone. So in in this episode today,
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  we're going to explore like this word, if you've never heard of
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  it, these words, what free will really is.
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  So I'm going to define it and we're going to talk why some
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  people believe in it and why other people don't, and the
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  extremes in both cases and what it has to be in place, what has
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  to be in place for free will, true choice to even be possible.
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  And I think this can be the most transformational part.
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  And maybe maybe that'll just be for me, like how important it
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  feels. You can decide what that looks
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  like for you and also how this all connects to like a
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  compulsive behavior, the diction healing transformation.
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  OK, so let's dive into it. Let's start with these two
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  terms, free will and determinism.
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  OK, so let's define it or give you, yeah, give you the
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  definitions. So free will is the belief that
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  we can make real choices, not just reactions, not just like
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  habits, but we have the capacity to pause, to reflect and to go
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  in a different way, Determinism and we can go really extreme
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  with either of these free will, just complete choice, the
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  ability. And then determinism, on the
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  other hand, says everything we do is caused by something else,
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  like whether it's trauma or environments or brain chemistry,
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  the things that happened generational before this, our
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  genetics, this thing that were handed down to us like just
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  again, environment I want to highlight.
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  And so from like that view of determinism, like addiction or
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  compulsive behavior, that can make a lot of sense.
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  Somebody might say it's not weak, it's the results of what
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  happened to you. And this is where I think the
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  triggers can come up. They're going to feel like a
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  loss anyway. I'm not going to go there for a
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  moment. So some, some people live in
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  like 1 camp versus the other. Some people are like really far
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  One Direction and really far the other way, which is, you know,
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  no, you have choice. Like you have choice right now,
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  just make it right. Like you are a completely
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  controlled and the other ones are like, no, I don't have
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  control. It is determined based upon all
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  these things that are going on. We can live in tension between
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  the two of this is something that we've been around a while
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  for. We can live in the middle.
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  So let's talk about why people disagree.
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  So if you believe in free will, like recovery becomes like a
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  call to action and you might be finding yourself saying I can
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  make better choices. I do have the power.
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  But why other people disagree is is it can also come from like
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  shame when you don't have that. So you might be saying, if I
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  could choose, why do I keep messing up?
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  So if you don't believe in free will, you, you lean towards like
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  determinism, then recovery becomes more of act of
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  compassion. So of course I'm here, of course
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  I've struggled, but it can also slide into like hopelessness.
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  So if I didn't choose this, maybe I can't change it either.
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  And that's why there's a lot of people, especially those of us
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  who are working in like trauma informed care land in the
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  middle. You were shaped by your past and
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  you can shape your future. So I'm just going to, I kind of
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  like highlighted that for just a second, those extremes.
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  And I did like really fast. So let me slow it down.
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  So there's this disagreement. I think early on I was talking
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  about my own journey, whether it was faith-based, whether it was
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  culture, It really felt like the free will experience.
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  Like Luke, you're just not making a choice right now.
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  I don't know if you would say get like, get your crap
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  together, just try harder. Like you do have a choice.
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  But then I did find myself floating to this, like this
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  place of like, why am I acting like feeling like in those
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  moments? And we talk about it all the
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  time, like leaving their values based part of our brain into our
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  survival part of our brain. I'm not going to use that
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  language right now, but getting to the very end of the other
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  side of the spectrum, which is like, shoot, maybe I don't have
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  a choice. I've been trying this for a long
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  time. And is this predetermined?
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  Why do I keep struggling? Why do I keep messing up?
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  Doctor Lemke talks about the broken hinge, like maybe my
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  brain doesn't work the way it's supposed to work and why?
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  And I just I guess I want to validate and have you notice if
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  it was zero to 10 zero. I believe in free will, 10
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  determinism. Like I don't have a choice.
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  Everything's predetermined by my experiences, by my trauma, by my
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  genetics, by my environment. Like what's going to happen not
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  is going to happen. Just make sense.
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  Make space for the in between here for a second.
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  But what I find to be interesting is if we talk about
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  what has to be in place for free will to exist, This is the part
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  that I love the most. If I want to believe and if I
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  choose to believe that free will is set, if I do have choice
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  there, there's a number of things that have to be in place
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  for that to exist because free will isn't automatic.
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  This is what I believe. It has requirements.
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  So if that's what I want to live in, right, If I do have choice,
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  we can't negotiate with this part, right?
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  So here's the things that have to exist.
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  One, awareness. You can't choose what you can't
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  see. So addiction narrows like or
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  composed, We have narrows the minds.
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  Recovery expands awareness, right?
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  So you can actually see options. And that's only through
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  awareness. That's why denial is the first
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  part. First phase of the journey is
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  coming out of denial. It's not just coming out of
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  denial. It's coming into awareness,
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  seeing things that I've never seen before, and obviously shame
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  gets in the way of that. The more focus we are on other
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  people and what they care about, what they think, we can't be an
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  awareness, can't really learn about ourselves.
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  OK, so awareness has to happen for free will to exist.
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  The second thing that has to happen is a regulation.
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  So like emotional regulation. So if you're emotionally
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  flooded, you're overwhelmed, you're triggered, you're
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  thinking, you're thinking, brain shuts down.
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  When our body in those moments and it's in survival mode,
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  there's no space for choice until regulation happens.
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  And you'll just notice as I bring these in, one awareness 2
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  regulation, I'll keep going here.
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  Just notice like the very beginning, I wanted to say free
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  will is what I want my world to consist of, that I do have
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  choice, but I was lacking what recovery actually is.
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  And I'm going through those awareness regulation.
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  Here's the third one. It's understanding.
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  So you need information, real honest understanding of what I'm
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  going to call consequences, of how your behavior effects people
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  and effects you effects other people, but not in a shaming
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  way. I have to be educated and come
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  in and understanding about what's actually happening and
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  what's going on. Different than awareness, OK,
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  Different than awareness. Understanding is really more
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  about consequences because this is going to play into #5 and I
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  have no idea whether I'm going too fast or not, whether you
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  guys are mopping what I'm spilling right now or what's
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  coming up for you. So you can give me that feedback
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  some point. Here's the 4th one.
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  For free will to exist, I'm going to call this.
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  I don't feel like it's completely right.
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  I don't like the wording on this so much, but freedom from
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  coercion. So no one makes good decisions
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  underneath pressure. OK, That includes internal
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  coercion, like the voices that say you'll never be good enough,
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  you're never going to get your crap together.
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  So I'm not going to focus so much on the external voice.
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  I'm going to focus on the internal voices, coercion, and
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  you don't have choices. OK, so #5 and it kind of
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  technically plays in the floor. Probably should keep these
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  together. But anyway, that is what it is.
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  There has to be a want to compared to I have to or I'm
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  being forced to because that's why humans do what they do.
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  Really, it's two pieces of this. It's I want to do it or I'm
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  being made to do it. That's how we operate, right?
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  And there has to be that want to in order for this to work.
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  So when we say free will, we're not talking about forcing
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  somebody to do better. We're talking about creating
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  conditions where like real values align, choices become
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  possible, right? That's what has to happen for
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  free will. And I guess I want to just say
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  when I sit with the betrayed partners, like whether it's in
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  an intensive or when I get a chance to be a guest in a group
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  and talk to them and they're asking questions about their
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  betraying partner. Why did he do what he did?
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  And they're saying, what brings me comfort, what brings me
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  peace. I find it so interesting that
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  what they're asking for is their partner to come into awareness,
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  be able to emotionally regulate, being able to understand
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  consequences. I think this freedom, concord
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  and a little bit interesting because I think this is around
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  the trauma brain, the traumatized brain that they
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  there can't be the pressure to focus on somebody else.
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  I recognize that's a little bit nuanced, but this desire, this
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  want to is what makes it sustainable.
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  Even though for a period of time I have to or I'm being forced to
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  can work. The desire really is the place
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  the free will thrives, my ability to make a choice.
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  So I'm just giving you some reframes with this.
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  Recovery reframes with free will.
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  If this is hitting for you here, here's what I I, I want to be
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  able to get out of this and maybe I want it for you.
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  I don't know. So recovery isn't about
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  pretending you had control. It's about restoring your
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  ability to be able to choose. You don't get to choose what
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  you've gone through. You don't get to pick your
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  previous experiences, even generational past the stuff that
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  was handed down to you, like about what you were taught or
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  genetically. You don't get to choose that
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  stuff right. You don't technically choose to
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  numb out at age 12 because you didn't have the awareness of
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  running out of that was going to impact you.
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  You didn't have the knowledge. You didn't choose to internalize
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  that you were unworthy, you were broken or dangerous.
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  But here's what you can choose. Here's what you can choose to
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  kind of move into that direction.
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  You can get curious and you can pause before reacting.
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  You can do these things to create those five pieces that
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  allow free will to exist. My ability to be able to choose.
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  But it doesn't just happen. Like it doesn't just happen,
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  right? So yeah, I think there's a part
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  of me that really wants to know for you how this hits.
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  So hopefully I get a chance to in some way or another.
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  And I just want to say thank you for those of you who get a
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  chance to weigh in on these podcasts and say, hey, this is
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  how this impacted me, good or bad or ugly.
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  I'm really enjoying the fact that we get people to say, hey,
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  elaborate on this. So I find that to be rewarding.
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  So thank you for those those pieces and just excited and have
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  dialogue with you more about this.
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  Let me know if there's just something more that you want to
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  go through on this would be important to take the
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  conversation further. OK, so let me just give you some
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  questions before I leave you with this.
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  So let me ask you a few questions you can sit with
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  today. Do you believe in free will?
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  Why or why not? Are you more determinism?
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  Here's another prompt for you to just kind of noodle on.
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  Can you noodle? Let's think about it.
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  Some people I found out in different parts of country,
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  that's not the verbage they use. Here's the next prompt.
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  Can you remember a moment when it didn't feel like you had a
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  choice? OK.
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  Can you remember a moment in your recovery when you did
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  choose something different? And what was the environment
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  that made that happen? So the point of today's episode
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  isn't necessarily that like want to land on a debate with this,
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  if it would even create one, is the more open up to new thought
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  and more dialogue around this. So anyway, thank you for
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  spending time with me and looking forward to see what
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  comes with it. Take care.
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  Hey, thanks for joining us today.
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  If this is something that you connected with, I'd love to meet
• 14:42
  with you more and talk about it. So what you can do is go to
• 14:45
  chooserecoveryservices.com or check the show notes and there
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  what we can do is set up a quick conversation meeting.
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  Thanks so much for listening to Beyond the Facade where we
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  unmask the authentic self.