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Episode 5: Bosses and Boundaries: Are You and Your Dentist Aligned? · Back in 10

• 0:02
  Jennifer Steadman: Back in 10 is a podcast for dental leaders who do it
• 0:05
  all and need 10 minutes to themselves.
• 0:07
  Savanah Carlson: It's about real conversations, not curated ones the
• 0:10
  kind that happen off the clock behind closed doors, and between the chaos of
• 0:14
  running a practice and running life.
• 0:17
  Jennifer Steadman: Hosted by Savanah Carlson and Jen Steadman, two women who've
• 0:21
  led, learned, and laughed through it all.
• 0:24
  Savanah Carlson: This show brings honest stories, leadership truths, and
• 0:27
  the occasional sassy take on what it really means to lead in dentistry today,
• 0:31
  Jennifer Steadman: because sometimes the best leadership happens when
• 0:34
  you step away for 10 minutes.
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  Savanah Carlson: This is back in 10.
• 0:44
  Hello everyone.
• 0:46
  Welcome to back in 10.
• 0:48
  I'm Savannah.
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  And I'm Jen.
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  And on today's episode, we are gonna talk about the leader relationship, so the
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  owner dentist, and the practice manager relationship and the communication
• 1:02
  that needs to come with that.
• 1:05
  Uh, Jen, any initial feelings and thoughts on that relationship?
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  Jennifer Steadman: Oh goodness.
• 1:10
  There's a lot that we're gonna unpack in the next 10 minutes,
• 1:12
  so get your coffee real quick.
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  Everyone get to a safe place and, uh, let's do it.
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  Let's do it.
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  Savanah Carlson: I did have the privilege of working with the owner
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  dentist at my last practice, and I can honestly say communication is
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  the absolute most important thing when you're the practice manager and.
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  Having it be honest communication.
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  You know, in our last episode we talk about honesty and integrity and ensuring
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  that you and your dentist align in both of those values is crucial to
• 1:49
  running a very successful practice.
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  Jennifer Steadman: Yeah, absolutely.
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  And I think I've been in that position too, where I've been fortunate
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  to work with the owner dentist.
• 2:00
  It gets very complex when you start adding layers to that.
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  So the first thing in that relationship is making sure that you're always,
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  when you go to the team, that you're in a united front, right?
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  Right.
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  Like you guys are on the same page.
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  Your team knows that.
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  You've already communicated that whatever you're bringing to the team is.
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  Is stone, I'll say, right?
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  Mm-hmm.
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  There's always wiggle room because nothing is black and white.
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  In dentistry, there is many different shades, right?
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  But it is so important that you are a united front when you come
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  together and that you're not also playing the parents, right?
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  You don't want the team to be able to play the parent, so you
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  need to be united in that front.
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  Savanah Carlson: Mm-hmm.
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  To create that unison it.
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  You have your weekly meetings and the topics of those meetings will change, but
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  you should also have daily check-ins too.
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  The, check-ins with your team.
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  Crucial, but daily check-ins with your owner dentist.
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  Even more crucial.
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  Yeah, even more al whether that's, reviewing your financials, reviewing the
• 3:09
  previous day and the ongoings of that day.
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  Whether you're looking at the, the team team relationships and what
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  other topics do you put at the forefront of these daily check-ins?
• 3:25
  Jennifer Steadman: Yeah.
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  Is there any initiatives that you're working on?
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  Are there any, like, what is the pulse of your team?
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  You know, we, we, a lot of the times leaders will focus on
• 3:36
  KPIs that are measured with dollar signs in front of them.
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  But you really wanna know what the pulse of the team is.
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  Is something going on, someone have a big family event or a different, anything
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  in their personal life that could also affect something in the practice or affect
• 3:51
  their performance or anything that you know that the other leader might not.
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  And sometimes there are some things that we keep to ourselves as leaders
• 3:58
  too, because we need to, right?
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  It's, if a team comes to us, they're comfortable, but you need to let.
• 4:03
  Your owner, doctor, or your, your just your, your doctor, no, the
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  other leaders in the practice.
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  If there's something going on, you need to keep that communication open.
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  Anything that could create a potential challenge or something that you also
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  want to share with them, that's exciting.
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  Right.
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  It doesn't always have to be a challenge.
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  It can also just be like, oh my gosh, did you know they got engaged or.
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  They're celebrating their child just got, is up into the new grade or,
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  or whatever it could be reminding
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  Savanah Carlson: them of team celebrations.
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  Yes, it's, yeah, it is.
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  It is.
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  Danielle's birthday tomorrow.
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  Am I going to have a celebration for her or did you wanna plan something?
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  Do you want to, this was a big one.
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  Do you want to write the card for your.
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  Employee or should I write the card?
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  I was always a big proponent of, you know, it would hold more weight
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  coming from you, so you need me to, to invent the messaging forward.
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  And then you just, you write it and sign the card.
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  Awesome.
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  But having that involvement, it means a lot to the team.
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  Jennifer Steadman: Yeah.
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  Or how about, it's my birthday tomorrow.
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  How do you wanna celebrate me?
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  No, I'm just,
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  Chris Stone: wait Jen, I almost Jen when you said that it's the wizard.
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  Yeah.
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  I almost came in to start singing Happy birthday, knowing if
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  tomorrow was really your birthday.
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  Jennifer Steadman: So it's not, it's not, but okay.
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  There are times that I've had to make that friendly reminder that it's also my
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  birthday and I celebrate your birthday.
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  And every other special day that we possibly could, but it's my birthday
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  too and I wanna be celebrated.
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  Everyone does, right?
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  Savanah Carlson: There have been times where the dentist has forgot
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  very important milestone dates.
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  Jennifer Steadman: My, I'm just gonna say this and I'm sure that my former.
• 6:03
  Lovely employer will watch this.
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  Hi, Dr. Nick.
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  Love you dearly.
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  He called me up this past September and said, happy anniversary
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  of our work anniversary.
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  Man, you never even said that when we were working together.
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  How rude Nick.
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  I know.
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  Savanah Carlson: How exciting!
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  That was very nice of him.
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  Jennifer Steadman: It was very nice of him.
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  So I'm like, he is a great guy.
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  Appreciate him dearly.
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  Gave me amazing opportunities so, so, so fortunate.
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  But I was like, thank you for that.
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  And.
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  You could have remembered when we were together too.
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  And I said that to him.
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  So it's not a surprise.
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  Love you bud.
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  Chris Stone: So you know, it's, it's interesting ladies, you
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  talk about daily check-ins.
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  I also think part of a daily check-in should be daily product
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  placement and shameless plugs.
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  Savanah Carlson: Oh yeah.
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  Logo and brand is so important.
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  I feel like I.
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  You know what?
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  Maybe I should take some extra notes.
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  Chris Stone: Love it.
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  Savanah Carlson: Wow.
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  We are goobers.
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  Jennifer Steadman: You know what?
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  But we are, you are comic relief and we're a little spicy today, so let's have at it.
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  Savanah Carlson: It's been a day.
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  Jennifer Steadman: Again, so, so important and I think.
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  In that leadership relationship too.
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  One of the things that I know that I really worked on with my
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  doctor was making sure that team couldn't play the parent, right?
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  So if they went to him and said, Hey, 'cause this happened, I'm
• 7:42
  gonna take a week off of PTO, and he's like, yeah, yeah, sure.
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  In between stuff.
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  And then I would find out the morning of that the hygienist took a week
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  off of PTO and I never knew about it.
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  All the patients are in the schedule, and I'm calling her to figure out
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  what if she's okay, and I find out that she's on PTO all week.
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  So we worked through some things and learned a very powerful phrase that said,
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  you need to go to Jen with that, or.
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  Did you talk to Jen about that?
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  And we did coaching with the amazing Judy k Mossoff, and we worked through
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  a lot of those things together.
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  But that was a very powerful phrase that he learned was,
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  you need to go to Jennifer.
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  That because he was the practice owner and he also led the practice for many years.
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  So I was his first office manager in that position.
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  So there's also a change in the dynamic in the authority and
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  who the team goes to and it.
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  Creature of habit.
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  So completely understandable, but that was a very powerful
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  phrase for him and for the team.
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  I've still had
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  team members, even with the knowledge that they need to go to me to ask for time
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  off, other than putting it in the system and me approving it or asking further
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  questions, still continue to go to the dentist and sway the dentist, and then.
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  Also having to look like the bad cop.
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  Doc did you say the coaching that we've agreed upon, and furthermore, did you
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  say, you know, that you have to go to speak to Savannah to do this, right?
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  Mm-hmm.
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  Ask them that question.
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  Mm-hmm.
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  So you can, it, it helps to get them to further understand and.
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  Follow the follow protocol.
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  And look, there's sometimes, look, there's certain things in
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  everyone's position that we can relinquish and ask for support with.
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  I could never drill and fill.
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  That's not, I'm a hygienist, that's as high up as I can go.
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  However, I'm here to support the practice and support the
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  team and all of those things.
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  So.
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  I will let you know if there's something that comes up that I need your help
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  with or that the team needs help with.
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  But there's a lot of things that I can handle and I can do on
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  my own, and that that dentist needs to know that you can do it.
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  So you also need to show and prove that you are capable and
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  that you're trustworthy and really work on that relationship.
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  So then there isn't as much going back and forth.
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  I think that's a huge part of it too, and it's.
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  Savanah Carlson: Have the conversation with your dentist about what your
• 10:32
  position really entails and what the success of your position is.
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  Jennifer Steadman: Awesome.
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  Savanah Carlson: Having that clarity is for both of you and then
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  Jennifer Steadman: relaying that to the team.
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  And also having the dentist be the one to say, I'm gonna pretend I'm
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  the dentist right now, and say, team.
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  I want you to know that I completely trust Savannah and her capabilities
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  and that anything that she is going to roll out or any initiatives that
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  she's trying to support you with and get completed, her and I have already
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  talked through it, so I need you to know that if she's asking you to do
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  something, that's also coming from me too.
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  That is huge.
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  Savanah Carlson: I have been in that situation where I have not felt supported.
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  And it mm-hmm.
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  It's so defeating and deflating.
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  Jennifer Steadman: Yeah.
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  Savanah Carlson: You put your, you know, you've put a lot of hard work
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  into an initiative, and then you don't have that backup from your dentist.
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  It's sad.
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  It's so sad that there are dentists that don't really offer that support.
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  Jennifer Steadman: Yeah.
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  And honestly too, I think when it's private practice
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  it's, it's very difficult.
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  Especially 'cause you're right there when you get into multi-locations
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  or DSOs, it is a whole other animal.
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  So I always had the support of my doctor.
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  Always had the support.
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  I didn't always have the support of others.
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  Mm-hmm.
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  Which makes it very complicated.
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  Right.
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  So.
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  It's a completely different level of understanding and frustration
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  and it's a whole other animal.
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  And so just really important that you have that foundation that you can
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  communicate that with your team and communicate that with the leaders in the
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  practice, like you need to be able to go to them for anything and everything.
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  Savanah Carlson: So let's explore, um, for a moment that a dental
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  office manager doesn't have that support of their owner dentist.
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  Mm-hmm.
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  And has maybe approached them and said, Hey Doc, are you open to some feedback?
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  Are you open for coaching?
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  Yeah.
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  And what if they get No.
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  There are, there, there are many, many dental office managers
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  who don't have that support.
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  From their owner dentist or from even from their executive leadership.
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  So what would they do in that situation?
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  So other than maybe find a new job.
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  No.
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  Jennifer Steadman: So I, I will say this, you can go and you can
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  ask, you can ask for that support.
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  You can, you have to give it the good college try, I'll say, right?
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  Um.
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  It gets to a point where it's okay if your values and your, it's okay
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  if you don't align anymore, right?
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  Everyone grows and if your values no longer align, that's okay.
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  Find somewhere that does.
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  Savanah Carlson: Along those lines as well are the boundaries, but
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  the relationship boundaries between office manager and dentist owner.
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  Many of us have been put in that situation where we feel like the superhero and
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  we have to do everything all the time.
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  There needs to be a strong conversation regarding your personal boundaries
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  when you clock out for the day.
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  Clock out for the day.
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  There needs to be conversations around that more often, I feel within the
• 14:27
  practice, and that's even between practice administrators and the team.
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  We should not be texting our team after hours regarding something that
• 14:37
  happened on hours the dentist should not be communicating regarding,
• 14:43
  jamie's five o'clock appointment.
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  What?
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  What was I supposed to actually bill out that should not be a conversation
• 14:50
  that happens off the clock.
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  Those things you think have been on the clock and I, and boundaries are mm-hmm.
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  Are big topic.
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  Jennifer Steadman: Yeah.
• 14:59
  And to go with that too, I've coached a lot of leaders to say, you know what?
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  They'll come to me and say, oh my gosh, my team texts me all the
• 15:09
  time, and they'll text me on the weekends or text me on vacation.
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  And my first question is, well, do you do that to them?
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  You can't expect something of your team that you're not
• 15:20
  willing to do yourself, right?
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  So if you're texting them on their vacation and you're texting them off
• 15:26
  hours, they're gonna do the same to you.
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  So you know, it's.
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  You need to make sure that you have those boundaries set.
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  I will say for myself, as my position grew, I found it increasing, challenging
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  to be able to do that, and just the sheer volume, like I had over 200 team
• 15:46
  members and leadership and a lot of people and vendors and everything.
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  It got increasingly challenging.
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  So for the sanity of myself and.
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  My family and to be mindful of my family time, and I'm not saying everyone could
• 16:04
  do this or everyone wants to do this, like I, I have two phones, I have two.
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  This is my personal phone.
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  This is my work phone, and my work phone stays on my desk flipped
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  over when I'm done for the night, it's flipped over and it's done.
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  Yeah, I do not look at it until the next morning.
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  I might peek at it real quick, like before I'm getting ready just to see if something
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  crazy happened that's done, it's off.
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  And the other main leader of of the group would have my personal cell in case
• 16:39
  there was a fire or something happened.
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  Exactly.
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  Savanah Carlson: Mm-hmm.
• 16:44
  But other than that, defining what an emergency is.
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  Oh Lord.
• 16:52
  Uh, yes.
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  An emergency is, oh my God, the bathroom flooded overnight if it's in the morning.
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  Jennifer Steadman: Yes.
• 17:02
  The emergency is, well, how much do the bathroom flood though?
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  I want you to be really specific.
• 17:07
  There is there a small pool of water on the floor that you can pick up with a mop?
• 17:11
  That's fine.
• 17:12
  Yeah.
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  Is it leaking down into, into equipment?
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  I need to know.
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  Yep.
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  If it.
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  Flooded the basement that happened before there was a pipe that just like burst.
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  It was, it flooded the entire basement.
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  I need to know, I need to be able to be there, but like look, if the
• 17:34
  seal is broken on the toilet and I can come in with a wax ring and
• 17:37
  replace it tomorrow morning myself.
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  You don't need to call me right now.
• 17:42
  It's fine.
• 17:44
  Savanah Carlson: Yeah.
• 17:44
  And or okay.
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  Also illnesses.
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  This was, a conversation that I had to have with my team.
• 17:51
  If you wake up in the middle of the night and you are very ill and you
• 17:55
  know you're not coming into work, I requested that, set an alarm for
• 18:00
  6:00 AM and notify me at that point.
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  There's nothing I can do at three 30 in the morning to.
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  Help you or adjust the schedule.
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  All it's going to do is create immense anxiety for the next three
• 18:15
  and a half hours and I can't sleep.
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  So there's nothing that can be achieved in those early am hours of knowing you're
• 18:22
  not gonna be in so kindly just notify me at 6:00 AM Like that's the earliest I
• 18:28
  wanted to be notified when I was managing.
• 18:32
  Jennifer Steadman: There's other different things you can do
• 18:33
  with different phones, right?
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  Like if you have an iPhone, you can, and I know leaders that have done this, they
• 18:37
  would change the tone of the ring tone of anyone on their team to be something else.
• 18:43
  So they knew if it was work or if it was personal.
• 18:46
  Mm-hmm.
• 18:46
  Also set different focus times so that way certain phone calls
• 18:50
  or text messages don't come in.
• 18:51
  So there's things that you can do if you're tech savvy.
• 18:54
  But again, having those boundaries and understanding the expectations in
• 18:58
  general, whatever the case may be, yeah.
• 19:01
  Is really important.
• 19:03
  Savanah Carlson: Yeah, totally agree.
• 19:05
  Yeah, totally agree.
• 19:07
  On that note, I think I'm, uh, ready to clock out.
• 19:10
  Are you ready to clock out, Jen?
• 19:12
  Jennifer Steadman: Yeah, and I'm not gonna talk to you after this because
• 19:14
  I'm gonna respect your boundaries.
• 19:16
  Savanah Carlson: That's fine.
• 19:17
  I'll journal about it in my notebook.
• 19:21
  Bye everyone.
• 19:21
  Have a great day.
• 19:23
  Take your break, set a boundary.
• 19:28
  Thanks for spending a few minutes with us on back in 10.
• 19:31
  Jennifer Steadman: If something made you laugh, nod or feel a little more
• 19:33
  human, share it with a friend and make sure that you're subscribed.
• 19:37
  Savanah Carlson: You can also follow us on Instagram at Back in
• 19:40
  10 Pod for more behind the scenes updates and probably a little chaos.
• 19:45
  Jennifer Steadman: We're not here to have it all figured out.
• 19:47
  We are just here to tell you the things that we wish someone had told us
• 19:52
  Savanah Carlson: and remind you that leadership doesn't
• 19:54
  have to be perfect, just real.
• 19:57
  Both: We'll be back in 10, back in 10.