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What Actually Forces Companies to Protect the Ocean? · How To Protect The Ocean

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  What does it actually take for a company to stop harming the Ocean?
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  Because despite all the promises, sustainability reports, and polished
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  marketing campaigns, most companies do not change just because people care.
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  They change when we hit a tipping point.
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  This is the How to Protect the Ocean Podcast, your weekday Ocean news update.
• 0:18
  If you care about staying informed about the Ocean every weekday, hit that
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  follow button right now so you don't miss tomorrow's story, which we're
• 0:26
  gonna be talking to Sarah Federman.
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  It's gonna be a lot of fun.
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  We're gonna be talking about all the stuff that we talked about today.
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  I've mentioned to her in a bunch of these episodes.
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  It's all about Ocean Week today.
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  We are talking about all the real reasons companies change, why awareness
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  alone is not enough, and what actually works if you want to protect the Ocean.
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  Now, a lot of us grow up believing that if companies knew the damage they were
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  causing, they would do the right thing.
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  That's a very scientific way of thinking.
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  And what I mean by that, I don't mean any harm or disrespect, is like when
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  scientists are taught how to communicate.
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  We are taught to communicate by logic.
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  Everything we do is math based.
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  Everything we do is logic based.
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  So when we're doing a study, we're trying to look for a
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  trend, we use math to find it.
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  It's either yes or no, or we make a hypothesis.
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  Is our hypothesis falsified?
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  Like does it actually work out or not?
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  What happens, we get a result and we communicate it in a scientific publication
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  that's peer reviewed by a number of editors and we go back and forth.
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  And once it's published, it's published to a community, a community of
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  academics where logic feeds on logic.
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  So we go to the brain, as Randy Olson says with his book Don't be such a Scientist.
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  Scientists feed to the brain.
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  We talk to the brain.
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  That's what we love to do.
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  'Cause if we say, Hey, you know what?
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  Climate change is happening and we need to lower our climate open, our greenhouse
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  gases, then people should change, right?
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  Yeah.
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  It doesn't work all that way.
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  We have to hit people in the emotional gut.
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  Where they're happy, sad, crying, angry, whatever that might be,
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  you need to hit them there.
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  You need to hit 'em emotionally.
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  That's the Science Communication 101 from Randy Olson.
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  And so when we talk about logic, we say, Hey, you know what?
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  If businesses knew their packaging was polluting beaches,
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  they would probably stop.
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  That's what we're thinking.
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  That's the scientific way of thinking.
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  The logical way of thinking.
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  If the businesses knew supply chains were harming communities, they would fix it.
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  If they knew emissions were harming the Ocean, they would act.
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  But history shows us that that is not how change usually happens.
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  Most organizations are built to preserve momentum.
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  They protect quarterly profits, existing systems, investor
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  confidence, all that mumbo jumbo.
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  It's whatever's convenient to make the most money.
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  Even good people inside those companies often work within the
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  systems designed to resist the change.
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  That does not mean change is impossible.
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  It means change needs pressure.
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  I think it's really important when we start to say things publicly
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  but we move slowly privately.
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  A lot of times, like you look at something like Starbucks.
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  I always use Starbucks as an example 'cause it's a perfect example.
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  When Starbucks first came out, it was the ethical brand.
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  Not only did they show that coffee can be hoi toi.
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  You could feel great about yourself.
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  You're paying more for coffee.
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  It's a different experience and not just in a local coffee shop.
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  You are in some, like an establishment that serves coffee and it serves
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  great coffee and that's what you want.
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  So you go after.
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  But when they first came out, they were also all about the environment.
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  They had it in their values.
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  And then all of a sudden they took it up.
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  At first when they had their values and they wanted to reduce their
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  impact on the environment, they were talking about moving away from
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  plastic and all this kinda stuff.
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  And then all of a sudden they took it out.
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  Because it was gonna affect their bottom line.
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  And it doesn't necessarily mean, and now they're fully plastic, like they
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  said, or they came out, it was like, oh yeah, we don't like plastic straws.
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  We're not gonna have plastic straws.
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  We're gonna make a top that's plastic and we're gonna serve that.
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  And that continues.
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  And it's really hard to recycle.
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  So that's not fun.
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  That's not fun at all.
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  That's not what we need.
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  And according to the interview where we talked to Sarah Federman, companies
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  reach tipping points in different ways.
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  Sometimes they start losing business.
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  Sometimes public pressure becomes too visible to ignore.
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  You see campaigns all the time where people are like, I don't like this
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  business 'cause they didn't treat me well.
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  Or, I don't like this business because it's not ethical, or,
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  I don't like this business.
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  And they come up with evidence and people like it.
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  And sometimes there's a movement behind it.
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  Sometimes someone from inside the company has a moral awakening and
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  they start to reveal what's happening.
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  Sometimes a personal moment changes everything.
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  You see it all the time.
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  But that is important because it means that there is no single magical tactic.
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  Different companies respond to different pressure points, and sometimes
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  companies don't respond to anything.
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  It all depends on the environment they're surrounded.
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  But some care about reputation, some care about revenue, some
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  care about the regulation.
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  Some care when employees starts pushing internally.
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  Some only move when the next generation asks hard questions.
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  Cause sometimes like what we think is normal in generation, like I'm Generation
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  X. Sometimes what we think is normal.
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  The millennials and Gen Z start pushing back and be like, Hey, you know what?
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  Actually that's not very good.
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  We should be asking for better.
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  And environmental movement is key to that.
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  The key is figuring out what matters most to those companies.
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  Let's talk about Patagonia as an example.
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  Patagonia became known for shifting its mission beyond selling clothing.
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  The company openly acknowledged that business cannot
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  thrive on a damaged planet.
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  That's a huge mindset shift.
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  Instead of asking, how do we grow no matter what, the question became, how do
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  we operate in service of something bigger?
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  Not every company will be Patagonia.
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  We know that for sure.
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  Let's be realistic.
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  But it proves that business models can evolve when leadership decides
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  purpose is not separate from profit.
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  The B Corps is a huge program, B corporations that really
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  measure on employees, on social and environmental change.
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  It's an audit that companies go through.
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  They pay to go through this audit because it's important to their values.
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  They may sell anything.
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  I have one guy that I had on the podcast who was an insurance salesman.
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  He owned an insurance brokerage, but he went through the B Corp
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  process 'cause he wanted to be on it 'cause he wanted his values
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  and the people that work there want to go through and want to
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  have an ethical company, not only from a social standpoint, but also
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  from an environmental standpoint.
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  And he sells insurance.
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  It's not an environmental brand.
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  He sells insurance.
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  His team building was to go out and help rebuild salmon and habitat.
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  That's pretty cool.
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  But it doesn't necessarily mean that you have to be an environmental company.
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  It doesn't mean that your product has to benefit the environment right directly.
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  Your values can benefit.
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  I think that's an important point.
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  Let's look, got another case study like innovation from necessity.
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  Another example that we talked with Sarah Wi Jo Hill tomorrow was a carpet
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  tile company facing the loss of a client because of environmental concerns.
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  That threat created urgency, like the company changed materials,
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  rethought its design and it innovated because staying the same became
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  more expensive than changing.
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  That's what they cared about.
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  That is the lesson many Ocean advocates miss.
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  We often ask companies to change because it is right, but many
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  change when it becomes necessary.
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  So if you are a buyer, a company that buys say, these tiles, well, you're
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  not gonna buy it from this tile company because they don't use the right
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  tiles because they're not sustainable.
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  They're actually bad for the environment.
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  Well, they're not gonna change because, oh, yeah, well,
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  they're bad for the environment.
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  They're gonna change because they're losing business.
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  I think that's an important part of looking at how we can
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  be environmentally friendly.
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  Necessary can mean financial risk.
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  Necessary can mean customer loss.
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  Necessary can mean legal exposure.
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  It could also mean talent refusing to work there because
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  of bad environmental practices.
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  It could mean public trust collapsing.
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  It could mean a number of different things.
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  I think it's interesting when people boycott.
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  Like one person quietly switching brands.
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  It'll rarely change a multinational corporation.
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  Like if you drink Coke and you all of a sudden you find out Coke is very bad
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  for water practices and you go to Pepsi.
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  They're not gonna notice one person just changing.
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  That's just the reality of the situation.
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  But a coordinated pressure can do make a difference.
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  So like if thousands, if not millions of customers leave and
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  tell the company why, that matters.
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  If investors ask questions, that matters.
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  If media covers the issue, that also matters.
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  If employees organize internally, or even if regulators respond, they all matter.
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  It just depends on what you, as one of those types of people decide what to do
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  with your money, with where you consume things, with where you purchase things,
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  and how you're gonna purchase things.
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  Like the individual access is not useless.
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  It becomes powerful when connected to others.
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  And we talked about that on Monday's episode.
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  It is true for everything.
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  It's true for plastic pollution, seafood sourcing, destructive coastal development,
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  and even Ocean climate policy.
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  I think people need to really understand that adding pressure to
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  a company can change their behavior.
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  There aren't many examples I can think of off the top of my head
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  other than the one that we talked about with this tile company
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  where a tile company changed their practices, what tiles they use
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  because the purchaser wants something more environmentally friendly.
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  There was one guy I interviewed.
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  He created an environmentally friendly cement that you can put underwater and you
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  can build reefs off of it in restoration projects that are happening everywhere.
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  They're happening all around the world.
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  But that doesn't happen because like when people are just buying regular concrete
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  and putting in the water and then they're like, well this doesn't really work.
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  Or people are like, why would you buy that when you have this other
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  environmentally friendly concrete
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  that's made in a better way and it's better for the reefs when we rebuild.
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  Why would I buy this bad one when I can buy this one that works just as well?
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  People coming up with these types of innovations really help.
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  If a company is harming the Ocean, ask yourself like, what
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  is their tipping point?
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  Is it customer trust?
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  Is it brand image?
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  Is it losing contracts?
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  Is it recruiting talent?
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  Maybe the regulation.
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  Is it pressure from investors or shareholders?
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  Once you know that, your advocacy becomes smarter.
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  That's what a lot of these organizations are looking for.
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  They're getting inside the businesses.
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  They're getting inside, like what happens against inside their head,
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  like what matters most to them.
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  So instead of just saying, Hey, you need to do better, you gotta
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  target the thing that actually moves 'em, that actually matters to them.
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  This is how you beat frustration.
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  That's the strategy.
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  You gotta look at what matters most.
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  So here are three practical moves you can do today.
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  You can be specific.
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  You can tell companies exactly what you want changed.
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  You can do it as a collective, like be collective.
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  Join campaigns, organizations, or community efforts instead of acting alone.
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  And you can be persistent.
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  One message may be ignored.
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  But if you sustain pressure, that changes the timeline, especially
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  if you do it in a collective voice.
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  You don't need to be louder.
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  You need to be more strategic.
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  You need to think like a notion organization, like a
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  nonprofit organization and like an advocacy organization.
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  So companies don't change usually because they suddenly care.
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  That's made in the movies.
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  They change when enough people, enough pressure, enough risk,
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  and/or enough vision or all of those makes staying the same, impossible.
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  And when that moment comes, everything can change fast.
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  Like it could come from the billionaire who made money off of Patagonia is all
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  of a sudden saying, Hey, you know what?
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  The way we make clothes is really wasteful.
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  We need to change our practices.
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  We need to give all of our profits from now on to someone else
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  'cause I've made enough money.
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  We've all made enough money.
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  So the question is not whether change is actually possible.
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  The question is how do we help create the tipping point for
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  businesses to make that change?
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  I would love to hear your thoughts on this.
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  You can hit me up on Speak Up for blue.com/feedback.
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  I'd love to hear either voicemail or you can type in your information.
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  I'd love to get back to you 'cause this is the start of a conversation.
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  I am trying to inspire you to think about what change looks like and how we can
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  protect our planet during this Earth Week.
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  Because right now there are thousands of people who are gathering in a
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  conference room at EARTHx to talk about this as businesses, individuals,
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  nonprofit organizations, for-profit organizations, projects, academics.
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  They're all gathering and trying to figure out, what's everybody's tipping point?
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  How are we gonna change this thing?
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  How are we gonna help the earth?
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  How are we gonna help the planet?
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  How are we gonna fight against like these government rollbacks?
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  How are we gonna build leaders for the future to make sure that these
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  government rollbacks never happen again and we make these regulations
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  stronger so that they can't be changed.
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  It's not just by executive order of a president or a prime minister or whoever.
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  How do we make sure that environment is on the tip of everybody's
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  tongues and on their minds?
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  ' cause that's what's really important.
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  That's what people are doing at EARTHx.
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  I want you to do the same thing after you listen to this or while you're
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  listening to this podcast, and I'd love to hear about it 'cause this is
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  the start of a conversation I would love
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  for you to continue it back at me 'cause that's why I started
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  this podcast in the first place.
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  And this is the How To Protect the Ocean Podcast.
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  And I'm your host Andrew Lewin.
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  I wanna thank you so much for joining us today.
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  Have a great day.
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  Can't wait to hear from you and happy conservation.