Latest / Beyond Fulfillment Podcast / Inside the Logistics Job Market: Flexibility, AI, and the Human Touch with Charlie Saffro

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Inside the Logistics Job Market: Flexibility, AI, and the Human Touch with Charlie Saffro · Beyond Fulfillment Podcast

• 0:05
  People work for more than a paycheck and what's important to them.
• 0:09
  Flexibility.
• 0:09
  And it doesn't mean working remote, it means having trust and really, you know, autonomy to do your job and to do it with some flexibility.
• 0:21
  Today we sit down with Charlie Saffro, the founder and CEO of CS Recruiting.
• 0:27
  With over 15 years of industry experience, Charlie has become one of the most sought after and well known recruiters in logistics, building a reputation for connecting top talent with the best opportunities and offering invaluable insights into hiring trends.
• 0:44
  In this episode, we dive deep into the current state of the logistics job market, unpacking why it's become an employer's market, what companies are looking for in candidates, and what really sets the best employers apart from from the
• 0:59
  impact of AI and hybrid work trends to advice for both job seekers and employers.
• 1:04
  This episode is packed with honest, real world tips to help you navigate the rapidly changing landscape.
• 1:11
  You'll also hear Charlie's thoughts on Gen Z in the workforce and the skills that matter most right now.
• 1:17
  If you're curious about the future of logistics hiring and what it takes to stand out, you don't want to miss this conversation.
• 1:25
  As always, if you found value from this content, please like and subscribe.
• 1:30
  All right, Charlie Safro, welcome back to Beyond Fulfillment.
• 1:34
  Thanks Dave.
• 1:35
  I'm happy to be here chatting with you.
• 1:37
  Yeah, glad you could take the time.
• 1:40
  So we are doing a special edition today about the state of the job market within logistics and you are one of, if not the top recruiter within supply chain, certainly probably the most well known.
• 1:55
  So can you just, if we're recording this right now, July 2025, what is the state of the job market within logistics look like?
• 2:04
  Oh man.
• 2:05
  Well, it hasn't been the same since late 22.
• 2:10
  So just to kind of go back over the last couple years, it's been a wacky market.
• 2:16
  I really, I actually should say it hasn't been the same since 2020 because what we saw, you know, coming out of the pandemic was this great resignation where it was very clearly off balance.
• 2:26
  We had more job, job seekers and then in 22 it flipped.
• 2:32
  And that's really where we're still living today with some nuances.
• 2:36
  But the market that we're in right now in the summer of 25 is still an employer's market, meaning that there are way more job seekers than there are jobs.
• 2:47
  And once you get to a place like this where things are off balance, you know, it's like somebody's always in the driver's seat.
• 2:54
  Right now we have the employers, the hiring companies that it's, you know, they can take their time, they can be picky, they can make lowball offers because the jobs are so valuable and there's just not as many of
• 3:07
  them as there are qualified candidates and job seekers right now.
• 3:12
  So that's where we're at.
• 3:14
  I think that, you know, kind of sets the scene that we just have a lot more people actively looking for jobs, which are unemployed people, people between roles, but also a lot of people passively interested that are employed.
• 3:29
  They just are longing for something more, but they're not all going out to look for it right now.
• 3:35
  Okay.
• 3:35
  And given that state of market, you as, as the recruiter, I mean, clearly you're engaged by the employer and then you're very clearly like a people first business too.
• 3:46
  Right.
• 3:46
  So you're always looking for the positive experience.
• 3:49
  So with that type of dynamic, how do you balance that when you're dealing with these candidates, knowing that it's, it's a, it's tough out there?
• 3:58
  Yeah, that's a really great question.
• 4:01
  I appreciate you asking that because I do think a lot of people misunderstand what recruiters do, just fundamentally.
• 4:07
  And you nailed it.
• 4:08
  I mean, we are hired by a company that is looking to either replace someone, fill a vacancy, maybe add someone to their team opportunistically.
• 4:18
  We are always working for the job seeker and representing them and having an unbiased, you know, stance in the process.
• 4:27
  But we are not collecting money from job seekers and there's really only so much we can do for them.
• 4:32
  And so, you know, when we see job seekers that have talent in this industry, our instinct is to talk to them, to get to know them, to have them in our network, to have their information on our radar.
• 4:43
  But we're very honest with them right now that it's not the best market to be picky.
• 4:48
  It's not the best market to leave a job without another job lined up.
• 4:54
  However, all that said, we are such a people focused company, we recognize that, you know, people don't just work for a paycheck.
• 5:03
  And so we're also really working with our clients to educate them, to motivate them, to help them understand, you know, why candidates go to their competitor versus them or what is really going to attract the best talent for
• 5:15
  their team.
• 5:16
  Because I think when we're in a market that's lopsided like we are now, a lot of hiring companies just assume everyone's desperate.
• 5:23
  You know, we could put any offer out there and someone's going to take it.
• 5:27
  And that may or may not be true, but that's not a smart hiring strategy.
• 5:30
  Like you need to get the right person and you waste a lot of time and money and effort if you do it wrong the first time.
• 5:37
  So really just being realistic, I mean, that is, that is how we're coaching both job seekers and clients right now to make the right hire and to take the time and to be intentional about it, but to not
• 5:49
  lose sight of the human beings in the process along the way.
• 5:53
  Okay.
• 5:53
  And you know, I've heard stories too about these long interview cycles.
• 5:58
  Five, six, seven interviews and then people getting ghosted and just.
• 6:03
  Right.
• 6:04
  Sounds brutal.
• 6:05
  I mean, why are companies, from your perspective, like taking data?
• 6:09
  Is it just because they have so many options?
• 6:12
  They just, they, they're doing that because they can.
• 6:16
  Great question that I wish I had a like very firm answer to.
• 6:21
  I think it's a lot of things.
• 6:23
  Yes, it is because they can.
• 6:25
  You also have to remember that back in, you know, 22, 23, we saw a lot of companies laying off their HR teams, their in house recruiters, their talent acquisition teams.
• 6:36
  And so it's also just a mismanaged process where companies are, you know, a little bit running around with their heads cut off.
• 6:43
  And when they do need to hire, they're lean.
• 6:45
  They don't necessarily have the expert resources.
• 6:48
  So we have a lot of clients that are kind of making it up as they go along.
• 6:52
  And sometimes it's not well thought out and sometimes it's not as intentional where all of a sudden, yeah, you're on your seventh or eighth interview and you're still wondering how close you are to getting the job.
• 7:04
  So I think it's more of a lack of internal alignment.
• 7:07
  Like when I see companies that are having seven, eight interviews, especially if it's not like a key executive role, that tells me that they are just misaligned internally, that this hiring manager is not aligned with what the CEO
• 7:22
  wants, which with this hiring manager is expecting.
• 7:26
  So it's usually misalignment, but it's also taking advantage of what they perceive to be a very desperate market and being a little sloppy because they don't think there's a consequence.
• 7:38
  But I will tell you, there are consequences.
• 7:40
  You burn bridges, you rub someone the wrong way, you.
• 7:43
  It's one thing to do that in today's market, but when the market flips, that's the perception and the brand and the reputation your company has.
• 7:51
  Yeah, yeah, that the brand too.
• 7:54
  Right.
• 7:54
  Because everybody, whether or not they realize It, Everybody in every company has a, a brand, which is how they treat people.
• 8:01
  Yeah, yeah.
• 8:02
  And I mean, it's, it's interesting because when you see posts like this on LinkedIn about people, you know, going on their seventh interview or getting rejected after their ninth interview, there's a lot of rebuttals that are like, you
• 8:13
  know, doesn't it just take one interview?
• 8:16
  And like, I know you've hired people before, Dave, and as like a hiring manager, I don't think one interview is enough.
• 8:22
  Like, I've made hiring mistakes where we have been thorough and we have really vetted these people as much as we possibly can and still not gotten the right person.
• 8:31
  And I'm a recruiter and I make those mistakes too.
• 8:34
  But I think we need to really be comfortable.
• 8:37
  Like, two, three interviews is very appropriate for a hire.
• 8:41
  This is going to give the person different exposure to different roles, different people in the company, different opinions, different questions.
• 8:48
  So I'm not on the side of like, yeah, one and done should be enough, but I'm also not on.
• 8:53
  I think eight is excessive.
• 8:55
  I think like two or three to make an informed decision that hopefully you've got, you know, the right level of, of people involved and you've got the right level of information you've collected before you make a decision.
• 9:08
  Yeah, I mean, I think three is very thorough.
• 9:10
  Exactly.
• 9:11
  But you wouldn't do one unless they knocked your socks off or it was a, you know, a low risk hire.
• 9:16
  You're not going to meet someone one time and then extend them an offer unless there was a situation.
• 9:22
  Sure.
• 9:23
  Okay.
• 9:24
  All right.
• 9:25
  So, you know, clearly money is important compensation and whatnot, but beyond that, like, what are the main factors that are driving where candidates, what offers candidates are choosing to accept?
• 9:38
  So when the great resignation was in full effect, we started seeing candidates prioritizing things that had nothing to do with a paycheck or a salary in terms of what they wanted out of their employer.
• 9:53
  And those were moments where, you know, the job seekers could actually reflect.
• 9:58
  Like, I'm going to get a paycheck wherever I go to work, and I'm going to spend 40, 50, 60 hours of my week working.
• 10:06
  I can get 50,000 here, 52,000 there, 53,000 here.
• 10:10
  But is that extra two, $3,000 enough?
• 10:13
  That's going to make a difference and make me happy.
• 10:15
  And the answer is no.
• 10:17
  I mean, people work for more than a paycheck and what's important to them?
• 10:21
  Flexibility.
• 10:22
  And it doesn't mean working remote.
• 10:24
  It means having trust and really autonomy.
• 10:29
  To do your job and to do it with some flexibility.
• 10:33
  And it's, you know, having a recognition culture where people appreciate you.
• 10:37
  It's a culture of, you know, human leadership where people are collaborating and getting to know each other.
• 10:43
  So those are the types of things employees want.
• 10:45
  They want development, they want coaching, they want to know that they're going to work for a company that's actually going to invest in them, that's going to train them and set them up for success.
• 10:55
  Now in the last couple of years, all those things still matter very much.
• 10:59
  I would say the paycheck is kind of risen back up to the the top of like, I just need a job, I just need to get paid.
• 11:07
  But when the market switches and as it starts to stabilize, it's just a matter of realizing like your competitor can pay this person the same or a little more.
• 11:17
  So what is going to attract them to your company?
• 11:20
  Because I mean, if we just look at the brokerage world, Dave, like everyone wants a sales rep with a book of business and no non compete like what is going to make that person decide between brokerage a B
• 11:32
  and see if they're all offering the same salary?
• 11:34
  That's not the only thing it's about anymore.
• 11:38
  And I mean, are you seeing, because you brought up the great resignation right to where there was such a, such a monumental event, phenomenon, let's call it.
• 11:48
  I mean have you seen companies really learn from that and, and adopt like overall at large in the market, adopt that flexibility and, and really change the way they, they treat employees?
• 12:01
  Yeah, I, I have and I mean I can think of a couple clients without naming them like in particular, I mean we had a client before 2020 that was in a very remote location and I think we recruited
• 12:16
  for about eight years for them.
• 12:18
  Always looking for carrier reps.
• 12:20
  In eight years we maybe placed two or three of them.
• 12:24
  Then covet happened.
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  They went fully remote.
• 12:27
  They really started to look at like the talent versus the location of the.
• 12:32
  And I think during 21 we brought them like 15, 16 different carrier sales reps that they hired because they were looking remotely.
• 12:41
  And I mean that completely changed their business.
• 12:43
  They went from, you know, a $10 million brokerage to probably 40 or 50 million.
• 12:48
  Now they run fully remote, but they've also reopened an office recently for their local candidates and given them a hybrid option.
• 12:58
  So there's a lot of companies that are similar where you know, Covid happened the great resignation, they kind of went to extremes like what do we need to do to get the best talent?
• 13:07
  If it's our location or our compensation or our policies that are prohibiting us.
• 13:13
  And then I feel like they've kind of backed off and modified since then.
• 13:16
  So, you know, this company went from being 100% in office to 100% remote, and now they've kind of settled at this happy medium of offering hybrid.
• 13:27
  But I don't think without all these events that they would be where they are today.
• 13:31
  I actually think it's.
• 13:32
  It's been in their favor because they've pivoted so many times.
• 13:36
  Okay, and where do you see that going, too?
• 13:39
  Because we've heard so much in other industries about, like, these return to work mandates and the stats about productivity.
• 13:47
  And then, you know, some people feel this way or that way about, oh, I can be productive at home, and maybe not.
• 13:52
  Like, where do you see that going in the.
• 13:55
  In the coming years within the industry?
• 13:57
  I think the easy answer is that hybrid is going to be the most attractive and desirable option for both an employer and an employee.
• 14:10
  With a caveat that we have to recognize that if you're hybrid, there's a very good chance that you're paying rent on days nobody's using your office.
• 14:18
  And that is a luxury.
• 14:19
  And not all companies are going to take that step to invest in a space that's going to be used part of the time in our industry.
• 14:29
  I get it.
• 14:29
  Like, you know, if you're in a laptop job, sitting behind a computer all day, I would question why someone couldn't work remotely part of the time.
• 14:39
  But if you're in a facility and you're, you know, supervising packages, coming in and going out, you got to be there.
• 14:46
  And so that's where it's not about where you're working.
• 14:50
  It's about that flexibility, being able to, you know, work different shifts, being able to swap schedules.
• 14:56
  I think the most common thing that people say is, like, I just want to be able to, like, pick my kid up from school if I get a call from the nurse in the middle of the day.
• 15:04
  And sometimes we can make that happen, sometimes not.
• 15:07
  But it does go back to the company culture, the philosophy.
• 15:10
  You know, do we talk about stuff like that?
• 15:13
  Do we even know that this person has a kid?
• 15:16
  And what would we do for them on our team if they did get that call?
• 15:20
  Those are the things people want.
• 15:22
  It's not like I need to work from home five days a week.
• 15:24
  I just need to know I am trusted to do my job and live my life and get it all done with some harmony.
• 15:32
  Okay.
• 15:33
  All right.
• 15:33
  And we've Heard so much switching gears here to AI.
• 15:37
  We've heard so much about AI, the impacts.
• 15:42
  I've heard from some people that there's been mass, you know, a lot of more job loss has been reported.
• 15:48
  I mean, what within logistics specifically, how has AI impacted the industry over the past year or so?
• 15:57
  I am not sure I'm qualified to answer that because a lot of what I'm seeing is anecdotal.
• 16:07
  So I will answer it anecdotally based on what I'm hearing, what I'm seeing.
• 16:11
  But I'll be very honest, Dave.
• 16:13
  I have not seen a job description yet or talk to a client that is looking to hire in.
• 16:19
  AI is like a firm requirement or a big part of the discussion.
• 16:25
  It's more, I would say, AI.
• 16:28
  The way we're seeing it, it's being used to create efficiencies in a company.
• 16:33
  So do you know, are we seeing that someone needs to know how to be proficient in ChatGPT to get a job?
• 16:39
  No.
• 16:40
  Are we seeing a lot of fear in the market that AI is going to replace jobs?
• 16:46
  Yes.
• 16:47
  Where I met, I have not talked to a client yet that has told me that AI has replaced a department or a position or that it's on its way to.
• 16:57
  It's more about finding candidates that are agile, that are, you know, resourceful, that know how to go with change, that can adapt, and then really thinking of these technologies as making us faster, smarter, better, but not necessarily replacing
• 17:13
  a human.
• 17:14
  I hope that that is the trend in the future.
• 17:17
  I don't, I don't know, like, I don't know how far technology is going to go.
• 17:22
  I would still argue we need humans to be intuitive and creative and to have judgment, especially when we're talking about freight and some of the, the responsibilities these, you know, these employees have.
• 17:36
  I don't know.
• 17:37
  I would turn that back to you though, just like, real quick.
• 17:39
  What as an employer and you know, servicing your clients like, where, where is AI in your world right now and how much is it being, how much is it disrupting what you're doing or enhancing it?
• 17:53
  Well, I mean, we want all our people to be proficient in it just because it just.
• 17:58
  Yeah, it's just.
• 18:00
  And I, I show people how to use it.
• 18:02
  I use it all the time myself, whether for ideas or how to.
• 18:06
  How I want to say something or I mean, just to, to get information quickly.
• 18:12
  Right.
• 18:12
  So.
• 18:12
  And I'll instruct people to use it, but I haven't seen it replace anything either.
• 18:17
  And I mean, again, we're, we're a small company but we, we, we always want to use it just to be the best and most productive that we can.
• 18:24
  And it's a tool, you know, so why, why wouldn't you want to be as skilled as pot?
• 18:29
  And it's so rapidly evolving, new things are coming out all the time.
• 18:33
  I mean, why wouldn't you want to, you know, maximize that?
• 18:36
  I mean that's how I look at it.
• 18:37
  And yeah, and I would say that's kind of the basis of the conversations we're having is like, how do you use AI to make your job more efficient?
• 18:45
  Like that is how we're evaluating some of these candidates.
• 18:47
  Just understanding like are we just talking chat GPT and you've been really resourceful to aid your work or are you using an actual AI technology that another company would find those skills desirable?
• 19:03
  There's kind of like the internal piece of it.
• 19:05
  And then also a lot of companies using AI to create efficiencies internally versus it being something that customers even know about.
• 19:17
  I don't think a shipper sales rep is telling a customer we use AI and that's why you should work with us.
• 19:23
  It's more about how do we do a better job as a team, how do we collaborate more, be faster, more accurate, more efficient so we can continue to service our customers and be the best.
• 19:34
  Does that make sense like it's internal tactic right now?
• 19:38
  Yeah, absolutely, Absolutely.
• 19:40
  Okay.
• 19:41
  And as far as you know, what employers are looking for because again, it's an employer's market.
• 19:49
  Talked about the lengthy interview processes, the lowball offers and that type of thing.
• 19:54
  But I mean in terms of, I guess with all the talent out there, I mean, what are they really looking for from, from employees to make that commitment?
• 20:07
  You know, on paper a lot of them are looking for that old school profile and that is they want to see their competitor's name as previous employers.
• 20:19
  They want to see those titles that they're hiring for, you know, technologies that are being referenced and whatnot.
• 20:27
  But from a soft skill standpoint, that is like the real differentiator.
• 20:32
  And some of the things I mentioned, like people want candidates that are resourceful.
• 20:38
  If anyone listening is interviewing like ask questions.
• 20:41
  When, when an interview is closing down and the interviewer says do you have any questions for me?
• 20:46
  Like if you say no, that actually tells me that you don't really care.
• 20:51
  Like there's no way.
• 20:52
  I answered every single question you had.
• 20:54
  It tells me you didn't come in with questions, you didn't do your research, you're not like, super excited about this opportunity.
• 21:00
  And so it's being resourceful, being curious, being able to adapt.
• 21:05
  I would say those are the majority of these, like, soft skills beyond the resume that employers are looking for, because a lot of them have hired people without those skills and it's, it's catching up and they realize that.
• 21:19
  Okay, and then flip side of that question with the candidates that, that you represent, I mean, how overall, how proficient are they with these soft skills?
• 21:31
  You know, given that that's such an.
• 21:32
  Important attribute, that's a mixed bag, I'd say.
• 21:39
  And it really, like that is what the interviewing and the evaluation comes down to.
• 21:44
  Because what does it mean in your company to be agile and adaptable?
• 21:50
  Does that mean you're going, and I'm joking here, Dave, but does that mean you're going from a notepad to an Excel spreadsheet?
• 21:58
  Or does that mean you're going from TMS to a fully automated system with back office and visibility?
• 22:05
  And so I think a lot of it is like, where do you come from?
• 22:08
  What have you been exposed to?
• 22:10
  How do your systems work?
• 22:12
  And you know, what, what is this next level of automation look like for you?
• 22:16
  And are you open to it?
• 22:18
  Are you excited about it?
• 22:19
  Is do you appreciate what it's going to do for your job or are you scared of it and avoiding it?
• 22:25
  A lot of conversations around stuff like that right now.
• 22:28
  Okay, okay.
• 22:30
  All right.
• 22:31
  And with you brought up resourcefulness, right?
• 22:35
  You had a post the other day, talk about resourceful.
• 22:38
  You had an umbrella and a convertible because you got caught without the top.
• 22:41
  And right.
• 22:42
  So that, that epip.
• 22:44
  So, right.
• 22:44
  We can all appreciate things like that and that type of quality within people.
• 22:48
  So certainly, certainly something that we want to, we always appreciate as employers.
• 22:54
  Another thing I saw that I wanted to bring up that you posted on LinkedIn was about the Gen Z blank stare.
• 23:01
  So, and I'd love for you to tell that story.
• 23:03
  And then further to that, like, how do you see, like, jet, you know, Gen Z in today's market relative to what these employers want?
• 23:13
  Yeah, and I will preface that, that is, I was playing off a more trendy phenomenon, this Gen Z stare that like, is kind of circulating and in social media now.
• 23:25
  And I will start by saying we have a Gen Z employee who is amazing.
• 23:31
  And this girl just, she is, she has got a great head on her shoulder.
• 23:36
  She's all the things that we want to see.
• 23:38
  She's kind of in that bridge of growing up with technology, going to college in a very different way than at Least probably you and I did from a resources standpoint.
• 23:48
  But there is this disconnect and I will, I'll say like, I see it with my own kids.
• 23:52
  I have three teenage boys.
• 23:54
  And it's the lack of problem solving.
• 23:57
  And I think it's a much.
• 23:59
  I don't know, I don't want to say a bigger issue than we realize, but I think it can catch up with us.
• 24:03
  And, you know, when you think of our generation, Dave, like, if I had to get from A to B, I had to go on Google Maps or Yahoo.
• 24:11
  Maps or whatever.
• 24:12
  I had to look up these addresses.
• 24:14
  I had to plot my, you know, path.
• 24:16
  I had to print it out, bring it in the car.
• 24:19
  Now it's a quick, you know, click in your phone and it's going to get you there.
• 24:23
  And so it's just the way these, this new generation is being raised.
• 24:27
  They have access to so much, so much more than we ever did.
• 24:31
  Information, resources, technology, people, ideas.
• 24:35
  And unfortunately, I think they lean on that a lot and they are missing some of these, like, real life problem solving skills.
• 24:44
  So the post that I shared was about, a couple weeks ago, I went to a restaurant.
• 24:49
  We sat down, our table was like, very visibly wobbly.
• 24:53
  And the hostess that sat us, you know, I said to her, hey, can you just grab us like a napkin or a matchbook?
• 24:59
  Our table's wobbly.
• 25:00
  Like, I was willing to be the one to fix it.
• 25:02
  Our table was just bare.
• 25:04
  And she literally gave me this stare, like, as if I was speaking a totally different language and got really flustered and just like a blank stare.
• 25:13
  And she's like, as if she'd never heard of a wobbly table.
• 25:17
  And then her response was, let me go get my manager.
• 25:19
  And then she walked away and never came back.
• 25:21
  And we ended up standing up, getting our own napkin, fixing our table ourselves.
• 25:26
  And so I was really just using that as an example of what we're seeing more and more of.
• 25:30
  Like, we are seeing more and more of candidates showing up to interviews unprepared or trying to wing it or not asking questions.
• 25:39
  And it's just, I don't know, I don't, I don't want to say that this is a statement against an entire generation, but I do think we are losing our abilities to solve problems creatively as time goes on, as
• 25:52
  more technology is introduced and accessible.
• 25:56
  And this was just an example.
• 25:57
  Like, I was a server and hostess all through my high school years.
• 26:02
  If somebody would have asked me that 30 years ago, like, I either would have gotten my manager Or I would have been like, okay, let's see what you're talking about.
• 26:11
  How can we fix this?
• 26:12
  I don't know.
• 26:13
  That is just the way I was raised in a service industry is to always try and fix and serve a customer.
• 26:20
  And I feel like that's dying right now.
• 26:22
  I mean, this.
• 26:23
  I'm not generalizing a whole generation on one person's actions, but when I tell you this girl did not even understand what I needed or what I meant or why I cared that my table was wobbly, it just got
• 26:34
  me thinking, like, I just asked for a napkin.
• 26:37
  That's.
• 26:38
  That's all I asked her for was a napkin.
• 26:39
  And she panicked.
• 26:41
  So, I don't know.
• 26:42
  What do you think about it?
• 26:44
  You know, I've.
• 26:45
  I've heard so much.
• 26:46
  And listen, I have teenagers as well, and.
• 26:49
  Right.
• 26:50
  Like, they've grown up, totally different world and.
• 26:53
  Right.
• 26:54
  In theory, technology is supposed to.
• 26:56
  Right, evolve and that.
• 26:58
  That way you can.
• 26:59
  You can do so much more because you don't have to spend time doing all the manual stuff.
• 27:04
  You know, I've noticed social.
• 27:06
  It seems different socially.
• 27:07
  Right.
• 27:08
  Because they grow up with texting and social media.
• 27:11
  Right.
• 27:12
  Like, we had none of that.
• 27:14
  I'm probably the same age as you, right.
• 27:16
  So, I mean, we had no social media, no smartphones during high school.
• 27:20
  I mean, the Internet barely came out.
• 27:23
  Yeah.
• 27:24
  So I think it's a different world.
• 27:26
  But.
• 27:27
  But yet.
• 27:27
  Yeah, I still see.
• 27:29
  I feel like it's case by case because there's.
• 27:32
  There's so much.
• 27:34
  When I look at, you know, what these kids can do these days and the, how advanced the, the classes are in school relative to what we took and the athletics, how those have evolved, you know, so I see
• 27:46
  a lot of enhancements, but I just think it's just totally different.
• 27:50
  Probably primarily with the social aspect too, given it's so much.
• 27:54
  100%.
• 27:55
  Yeah.
• 27:55
  And I'm not blaming this generation.
• 27:57
  I want to be very clear, like, they are growing up in a different world.
• 28:00
  And like, just an example I can think of now is, you know, sales is all about building relationships, having rapport, banter, you know, finding things in common.
• 28:11
  Growing up, like, I had to talk to my friend's parents to get my friends on the phone.
• 28:17
  I'm sure you did too, Dave.
• 28:19
  Like, I would call a home.
• 28:20
  Home phone.
• 28:21
  Hi, Mr.
• 28:21
  Miller.
• 28:22
  Can I talk to Sarah?
• 28:24
  Like, that is a lost art that we.
• 28:27
  I don't talk to my kids friends on the phone.
• 28:29
  They text my kid directly if they want to get a hold of them.
• 28:32
  Do I have relationships with my teenagers friends, sure.
• 28:35
  But it's very different.
• 28:36
  And it's like that is one skill that we had no choice but to perfect.
• 28:41
  Like we had to make the call and get what we needed versus let me just send a text, let me avoid communicating, let me get there as the easiest way as possible.
• 28:51
  Again, it's not their generation's fault.
• 28:54
  It's a result of technology and we're just losing skills along the way that we had no choice but to develop.
• 29:03
  Yeah.
• 29:03
  And it's funny, I saw a post, this is maybe a month or two ago, about the.
• 29:09
  What was it called?
• 29:10
  It was something like phone anxiety or something to where people were like afraid to just make a phone call and book an appointment or something.
• 29:20
  And like to your point, like if you wanted to get a job back when we grew up in heist, you literally had to call or you had to go face to face.
• 29:30
  Yeah.
• 29:30
  There was no sending a resume.
• 29:33
  There was none of that.
• 29:34
  Right, exactly, exactly.
• 29:36
  And I'm not saying ever.
• 29:36
  I mean, I think of my kids, one of them would be like, sure, yeah, I'll walk in.
• 29:40
  And the other two would be like, what?
• 29:42
  I have to walk in and talk to someone.
• 29:44
  What do I say?
• 29:45
  And so again, it's not the generation, it's the result of the way we're living.
• 29:50
  And I'm sure the generation older than us can look at us and criticize a million things that we didn't learn or do the same because of different advancements that came our way, but who knows?
• 30:03
  It's just, we're losing skills that are human, skills that you just assumed would be around forever.
• 30:11
  And technology is making it too easy for humans to avoid humans.
• 30:16
  Yeah.
• 30:17
  So the message with all that for Gen Z is yeah, practice social skills, talk to people, don't lose that art.
• 30:24
  And technology is great, but don't, don't replace actual human communication with it because that, that's going to create problems.
• 30:33
  Yeah, there's, there's a very good chance that in the future you will negotiate with a human, not a bot.
• 30:39
  And so what does that human need to build the relationship and the trust?
• 30:43
  Yeah.
• 30:44
  Okay, so wrapping up.
• 30:46
  Charlie, let's just talk to the, the job seekers out there for the next half of this year.
• 30:52
  Right.
• 30:52
  Wrapping up.
• 30:53
  I mean, what, what's your message to them, given the market they're dealing with?
• 30:57
  All the things going on right now.
• 30:59
  Specific.
• 30:59
  Specifically within.
• 31:01
  In logistics.
• 31:02
  Yeah.
• 31:03
  I mean, don't get discouraged.
• 31:05
  I think that is probably my number one piece of advice.
• 31:08
  And that's for people that are employed and unemployed right now, the market will come back.
• 31:13
  It is wild.
• 31:15
  And I think anyone who has been, you know, involved in talent or hiring in the last couple years would agree that something's going to give and change, but it's been especially hard for an especially long amount of time.
• 31:28
  I think where I get really tripped up on advice is I want to tell people the truth, that, like, they deserve to be treated like a human.
• 31:36
  They deserve a job that is going to invest in them and people that are going to care about them.
• 31:41
  But I also recognize that right now people need paychecks.
• 31:44
  So I'm not going to give someone advice to like, you know, get up and leave a job without another one, because everyone has their own priorities.
• 31:53
  But there is a company that will treat you well.
• 31:58
  There is a leadership team somewhere that will develop you and you gotta be resourceful and you've got to use your network.
• 32:06
  I would say anyone who is unemployed right now, yes, keep applying to the jobs, keep searching, keep putting your resume, you know, in the applying to the right positions, but also leverage your network.
• 32:18
  Take the human route.
• 32:20
  It will always be more effective.
• 32:21
  And whether that's, you know, someone you used to work with or someone you know, or it's hiring a recruiter or aligning with someone that you met online, like, I do believe that it's who you know right now is,
• 32:34
  is really what's going to help you get in front of the right people.
• 32:37
  Absolutely.
• 32:38
  Okay.
• 32:39
  And then for the employers, the business owners out there, if they don't know who you and CS recruiting are, why should they get in touch with you if they have some hiring needs?
• 32:50
  Yeah, I mean, I think our, what sets us apart the most is our knowledge in the industry and our network.
• 32:57
  15 years working exclusively in this industry, our whole team, you know, speaks the language, if you will, but also our network, when we have a client that comes to us, I mean, they probably have tried to recruit for
• 33:09
  the position on their own, posted the job, you know, brought in different referrals.
• 33:14
  And there is a reason that we can find the right person and it's because we have a huge network and we know what the people in our network, where they work, what they want to do, what they need
• 33:25
  to make, where they want to live, what their, you know, future plans are.
• 33:29
  And I'd say that's, that's where the matchmaking and headhunting really comes in.
• 33:33
  And that's, that's what we're best at.
• 33:35
  So you can Find us on LinkedIn.
• 33:37
  We'd love to have a conversation about the hiring market, go even more in depth than what we're seeing, and hopefully help some companies find the right people if they are in a growth mode.
• 33:49
  All right.
• 33:49
  And we'll post all that for everyone in the show notes as well.
• 33:52
  Thanks, Dave.
• 33:53
  Appreciate it.
• 33:54
  All right, Charlie, thank you so much for being here and sharing all these valuable insights with our audience.
• 33:58
  We greatly appreciate it.
• 33:59
  My pleasure.