Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / The Big Issues 2 December 2020

Transcript

The Big Issues 2 December 2020 · 360 with Katie Woolf

0:00
Speaker 1: It is, of course Wednesday morning time for the Big Issues.
0:04
Speaker 1: It is brought to you by Simon Watt's from Real
0:06
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Speaker 1: your home within well within those thirty days or within
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Speaker 1: refund one hundred percent of all your marketing costs. I
0:18
Speaker 1: was just about giving him a new tagline there, but no.
0:21
Speaker 2: It is with him within five Sorry, Simon, We're not
0:28
Speaker 2: putting any rest of there.
0:29
Speaker 3: On you at the moment he's in the box.
0:31
Speaker 1: Scene is it's a good time.
0:33
Speaker 4: It's what.
0:36
Speaker 2: Simon that comes. If you haven't noticed, it is the
0:43
Speaker 2: big Issues.
0:44
Speaker 1: And Dave Tolder and Matt Cunningham are in the studio
0:46
Speaker 1: with us this morning.
0:47
Speaker 4: Good with Good to be with Maddy too.
0:49
Speaker 2: I know you haven't seen him for a few weeks.
0:52
Speaker 4: Big times.
0:54
Speaker 5: Last time we were here, he was knocking us. He
0:56
Speaker 5: was right in to us.
0:57
Speaker 2: He told us we were journalists. I took it as
1:06
Speaker 2: a bit of a compliment, to be honest.
1:10
Speaker 1: Now let's talk firstly about this Territory Economic Reconstruction Commission report.
1:15
Speaker 2: We have been covering it off quite extensively. This morning, I.
1:18
Speaker 1: Spoke to the Deputy the Deputy Chief Minister earlier, Nicole Madison.
1:24
Speaker 1: They've set themselves or there's certainly a fairly ambitious goal
1:27
Speaker 1: of making the territory a forty billion dollar economy by
1:30
Speaker 1: twenty thirty. The Commission has identified priority industries that are
1:35
Speaker 1: critical to grow the economy and attract private investment and
1:38
Speaker 1: create jobs, including energy, renewables and gas for manufacturing, as
1:43
Speaker 1: well as resources and agribusiness, tourism, defense and maritime, and
1:47
Speaker 1: digital and space industries.
1:50
Speaker 2: From the outset, it does seem to.
1:52
Speaker 1: Be a good road map, a good you know, giving
1:55
Speaker 1: the government a good matt Ford of how they need
1:59
Speaker 1: to do things. If not, Guiarro pointed out very early
2:01
Speaker 1: this morning that there's no sort of KPIs or benchmarks
2:05
Speaker 1: that have been set. So how are we able to
2:07
Speaker 1: you know, to really cross reference how well it is
2:10
Speaker 1: or isn't going well?
2:13
Speaker 4: Katie looked. I mean, firstly, you've got to you know,
2:16
Speaker 4: I think you've got to pay tribute to Andrew Liveris.
2:18
Speaker 4: You can see his fingerprints all over this document and
2:21
Speaker 4: the fact he's Andrew Liveris is probably one of the
2:23
Speaker 4: greatest people that the territory has produced. He's you know,
2:28
Speaker 4: he's done some amazing things, he said on Barack Obama's
2:31
Speaker 4: Business round Table, Donald's Donald Trump's Business round Table. I
2:34
Speaker 4: think more than twenty years he was a managing director
2:38
Speaker 4: of Dow Chemicals. You know, he's an impressive human being.
2:41
Speaker 4: And you meet the guy made you've met him. I
2:44
Speaker 4: think on a few occasions you'd have to agree there
2:45
Speaker 4: seems to be an aura around the mean, a seriously
2:49
Speaker 4: impressive guy. But having said that, you know, I think
2:53
Speaker 4: in this turf report, there's not too much that sort
2:57
Speaker 4: of leaps out of his you is something new. It's
2:59
Speaker 4: just basically telling everybody what the reality is and this
3:03
Speaker 4: is what you need to do to sort it out.
3:05
Speaker 4: The big problem, of course, is I don't think it's
3:07
Speaker 4: in the government's DNA to actually do anything that. They're
3:12
Speaker 4: not pro business. They've got no interest in the budget
3:17
Speaker 4: or reducing our debt. It's just, you know, I just
3:22
Speaker 4: can't see where this document's going to go.
3:25
Speaker 1: Well.
3:26
Speaker 3: I have met Andrew Liveris a couple of times.
3:29
Speaker 5: In fact, I hosted a forum with him just a
3:32
Speaker 5: couple of weeks ago when he was in town. And
3:34
Speaker 5: I think Dave's right he's a really impressive individual. I
3:38
Speaker 5: think he's also right when he says that nothing here
3:40
Speaker 5: is new what the report. Just to sum up the report, basically,
3:43
Speaker 5: it's saying we need to change the Northern Territory from
3:45
Speaker 5: a place where it's really difficult to do business to
3:48
Speaker 5: make it the place where it's the easiest place in
3:50
Speaker 5: the country to do business. And that was the gist
3:52
Speaker 5: of what Andrew Liveris was saying when he was here.
3:55
Speaker 5: And one thing that struck me about him was he
3:58
Speaker 5: was able to sort of art articulate an argument for
4:03
Speaker 5: the gas industry, for the mining industry, for development that
4:06
Speaker 5: I never hear the government articulate well. That I never
4:10
Speaker 5: even hear the industry here articulate well. And I think
4:12
Speaker 5: that's part of what needs to shift. You almost need
4:15
Speaker 5: to win, you know, the battle of hearts and minds
4:18
Speaker 5: as much as anything, to get the public on site
4:20
Speaker 5: as to why we need to head in this direction,
4:22
Speaker 5: why we need to have private investment, why we need
4:24
Speaker 5: to create well paid jobs here, because if we don't,
4:28
Speaker 5: I mean, you look at the two pages I'm looking
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Speaker 5: at now in the NT News, page eight and page nine. Well,
4:32
Speaker 5: page nine says you know this is the good news
4:34
Speaker 5: story about what could be on the horizon, and on
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Speaker 5: the left hand page, it's like, you know, debt could
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Speaker 5: reach sixteen billion dollars now, if dick keeps going up
4:42
Speaker 5: and up and up, we can't just keep paying the
4:43
Speaker 5: public service if our de's going to hit sixteen billion dollars.
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Speaker 4: And be else is one of the things, Maddie. I'll
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Speaker 4: give you a little anecdote. You know, four year ago
4:51
Speaker 4: I was walking past Ducks Ducks. That's a deck bar,
4:57
Speaker 4: and there was a couple of staffer sitting there having
4:59
Speaker 4: a cool drink later on in the afternoon, and one
5:04
Speaker 4: of them yelled out to me. I won't say who
5:05
Speaker 4: it was, but you know, a senior person in government,
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Speaker 4: well known by most people. It turned out to be
5:10
Speaker 4: working for the treasure at the time.
5:12
Speaker 2: So I said, this was in the Labor government.
5:14
Speaker 4: This is in the Labor about four years ago, not
5:17
Speaker 4: long after we left government. It was just after the budget.
5:19
Speaker 4: This fellow says to me, well, what did you think
5:21
Speaker 4: of the budget? And I said I didn't think it
5:26
Speaker 4: was too bad. He says, you didn't mind it? I said, well,
5:29
Speaker 4: if you'd ignore the debt and deficit in the budget,
5:33
Speaker 4: he said. I said, you know, I can't see too
5:35
Speaker 4: many problems with it. He looked at me and he says, well,
5:37
Speaker 4: that's the difference between you a lot and our lot.
5:40
Speaker 4: I said, what's that? He says, well, your mob care
5:43
Speaker 4: about that sort of crap. And I was honest, but
5:49
Speaker 4: I say that because I felt like i'd just been belted,
5:52
Speaker 4: like in the face, punched in the face, and I thought, gee,
5:55
Speaker 4: wish you know, you've got a senior person in the
5:57
Speaker 4: labor government, a senior adviser in the labor government, saying this,
6:00
Speaker 4: and you know, we don't care about it, but you
6:02
Speaker 4: sort of look at it. Now four years down the track,
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Speaker 4: it's become pretty well patently obvious that they don't care
6:08
Speaker 4: about debt and deficits. When you put out a budget
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Speaker 4: that every year you've got a one billion or one
6:13
Speaker 4: excess of one billion dollar deficit, you have to ask
6:17
Speaker 4: questions saying, is are this mob serious about cleaning up
6:21
Speaker 4: our finances? And there's no sign of that whatsoever. And similarly,
6:26
Speaker 4: when you sit there and you say, oh, we're now
6:28
Speaker 4: open for business and we're going to embrace a new
6:31
Speaker 4: type of enterprise, and you know, we're looking at the
6:35
Speaker 4: private sector. And then the very next breath they knock
6:38
Speaker 4: back a subdivision in Alice Springs, completely privately funded. They
6:42
Speaker 4: knocked back developments in daw And completely fine, you know,
6:45
Speaker 4: privately funded. It's a bit hard to say that, Yeah, well,
6:49
Speaker 4: these guys are serious, and I can't, for the life
6:51
Speaker 4: of me imagine them kicking off industry anywhere.
6:54
Speaker 1: Look, one of the things that Andrew Liver said to
6:56
Speaker 1: me on the show a couple of weeks ago is
6:58
Speaker 1: that there's got to be a real change in mindset,
7:00
Speaker 1: and that there's got to be a change in mindset
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Speaker 1: obviously from everybody, not just you know, us as territories
7:05
Speaker 1: believing in the territory, but the public service as well,
7:08
Speaker 1: and the way in which and the speed at which
7:10
Speaker 1: things are approved and how quickly those you know, whether
7:14
Speaker 1: you're talking whatever development you're talking about or whatever kind
7:17
Speaker 1: of project you're talking about, there's got to be a
7:19
Speaker 1: change in mindset from small business right up to the
7:22
Speaker 1: larger stuff. You know, we can no longer look at
7:24
Speaker 1: different people trying to come to the territory and do
7:27
Speaker 1: business and give them hurdles that they've got to jump over.
7:30
Speaker 1: We've got to think about how we can make it
7:32
Speaker 1: more attractive within reason of course, and making sure that
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Speaker 1: they're you know, the types of things that we want
7:38
Speaker 1: happening in the territory, but make it more attractive for
7:41
Speaker 1: people come to come to the territory and do business.
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Speaker 2: And the thing that you know.
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Speaker 1: Is not lost on me is that every economy around
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Speaker 1: the world at the moment, every other state is in
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Speaker 1: the same situation that we're in in terms of trying
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Speaker 1: to attract investment.
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Speaker 2: So we've got to be really bloody attracted.
7:58
Speaker 3: And we're in competition with them.
8:00
Speaker 5: And there was a great example put forward by a
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Speaker 5: mining company whose name escapes me at the moment earlier
8:05
Speaker 5: this year in a release to the Stock Exchange where
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Speaker 5: they compared what it was like doing business in the
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Speaker 5: Northern Territory with Western Australia, and they're basically saying that,
8:13
Speaker 5: you know, the approval time in Western Australia was about
8:16
Speaker 5: one hundred days for exactly the same thing in the
8:18
Speaker 5: Northern Territory it was about four hundred days. I mean,
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Speaker 5: that's what you've got to fix. You've got to get
8:22
Speaker 5: to a point where it's years. Was it four years
8:25
Speaker 5: four years.
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Speaker 4: Days in WA and four years in the Northern Territory,
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Speaker 4: so that, I mean.
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Speaker 5: That highlights the problem, doesn't it. So we've got to
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Speaker 5: make it so it's one hundred days in Western Australia,
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Speaker 5: we've got to make.
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Speaker 3: It ninety days in the Northern Territory, you know.
8:40
Speaker 5: And sure there are regulations that need to be put
8:43
Speaker 5: in place, there are things that need to be considered.
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Speaker 5: It's not that you should just sort of throw environmental
8:48
Speaker 5: concerns or everything else out in the window. But you
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Speaker 5: can't tell me that if WA can get it done
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Speaker 5: in one hundred days, it should take four years to
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Speaker 5: get the same thing done.
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Speaker 2: That's right, and that's such a good point.
8:58
Speaker 4: One of the things that I was disappointed in, and
9:01
Speaker 4: I'm disappointed in constantly in the territory, is in this
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Speaker 4: report was the scant focus on Aboriginal land. There was
9:12
Speaker 4: a bit of lip service paid there saying we've got
9:14
Speaker 4: to do more to create economic opportunities in the bush.
9:17
Speaker 4: But that was about the end of that. It didn't
9:20
Speaker 4: sort of lay out any raid map at all as
9:22
Speaker 4: to how to change the nature of things. I mean,
9:26
Speaker 4: you look at any average of land across the territory,
9:28
Speaker 4: it's highlighted by the lack of private investment, the lack
9:32
Speaker 4: of private enterprise. You know, it's not impossible to set
9:37
Speaker 4: up a business anywhere in the Northern Territory. And it's
9:40
Speaker 4: probably the greatest welfare sinkhole in the country is the
9:45
Speaker 4: average of land in the Northern Territory. You look at
9:47
Speaker 4: the billions of dollars that are poured in there every year,
9:50
Speaker 4: and the need only increases, it never decreases. You look
9:54
Speaker 4: at places like Kakadou. You know, the mining company leaves,
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Speaker 4: the Commonwealth government, a liberal government gives them two hundred
10:01
Speaker 4: million dollars like as a reward for booting the mining
10:04
Speaker 4: company out. You know, all of these things sort of
10:07
Speaker 4: fly in the face of reason in my view.
10:10
Speaker 5: Well, I think that's a really good point that Dave
10:12
Speaker 5: makes about Kakadoo, and I think there is a crisis
10:15
Speaker 5: coming both at Jaboru and further down the tracking normal
10:18
Speaker 5: boy when the mining companies move out, as to what
10:21
Speaker 5: happens to these places. So you know, when ERA moves
10:24
Speaker 5: out of Kakadoo, I think the operations finished up next
10:29
Speaker 5: year and then there's a clean up process for a
10:30
Speaker 5: few years.
10:31
Speaker 3: But you look at the town of Jabaru.
10:34
Speaker 5: You know, most of the signs in that town are
10:36
Speaker 5: still from nineteen eighty one when the mining company creates.
10:39
Speaker 4: In my view, it's been a major mistake for Michael
10:43
Speaker 4: Gunner to step into Jabbaru and commit territory resources there.
10:47
Speaker 4: The fact is that that is a national park controlled
10:51
Speaker 4: by the conwealth, owned by Aboriginal landowners, with a mining
10:55
Speaker 4: company in the middle of it. It has no it
10:57
Speaker 4: had no relationship whatsoever with Northern Territory government. There's now
11:01
Speaker 4: a whole heap of bills. Everybody's stepping back, and all
11:05
Speaker 4: of a sudden, Michael Ganna puts his hand up and says, oh, yeah,
11:08
Speaker 4: well we'll have part of the of the efforts to
11:11
Speaker 4: sort of keep Jabbaru going. You sort of think, hang on,
11:14
Speaker 4: these people created the problem. Why are you buying into
11:17
Speaker 4: a problem of their making.
11:19
Speaker 1: I want to I do just want to touch on
11:21
Speaker 1: as well, you know, not only as part of this
11:23
Speaker 1: Turk report, but I guess more generally around the territory
11:26
Speaker 1: at the moment. You know, from what I hear on
11:29
Speaker 1: our phone lines and certainly through our listeners, is that
11:32
Speaker 1: there's a real sense right now that there's a divide
11:34
Speaker 1: between the public sector and the private sector.
11:37
Speaker 2: Now we know.
11:38
Speaker 1: That, you know, you know, we're really sort of calling
11:40
Speaker 1: on the private sector to be forging ahead and trying
11:44
Speaker 1: to lead us to our economic recovery. Now, on Friday,
11:48
Speaker 1: we found out that there would be that additional public
11:50
Speaker 1: holiday which was announced by the Chief Minister. From a
11:53
Speaker 1: lot of you know, from a lot of smaller businesses
11:55
Speaker 1: and even larger ones that I've spoken to, they felt
11:58
Speaker 1: that it's been quite a kick in the guts.
12:00
Speaker 2: And you know, I did.
12:01
Speaker 4: Point that, and it'll lead to other things. Katie. Just
12:04
Speaker 4: wait for the teachers, because they're going to complain and
12:07
Speaker 4: say that everybody else got a public holiday in Christmas
12:10
Speaker 4: time and they were already on holidays. Where's our holiday
12:13
Speaker 4: during the year. I mean, these things just lead on.
12:16
Speaker 1: Look, I think the thing that sort of concerned me
12:17
Speaker 1: a little bit more though this morning as well, is
12:19
Speaker 1: then when I had the Deputy Chief Minister on and
12:21
Speaker 1: I and you know, I put those like I sort
12:24
Speaker 1: of put that to her that there is that divide.
12:26
Speaker 2: How do you bridge that?
12:28
Speaker 1: And you know, I said that it had like that
12:30
Speaker 1: there's been a few things happened, and she said, like what,
12:33
Speaker 1: And I thought, well, it's pretty obvious to me, if
12:35
Speaker 1: you've gone through a year where you've taken a pay
12:37
Speaker 1: cut and where you've had your wages decreased, it's pretty
12:40
Speaker 1: bloody obvious if you work for the private sector what
12:43
Speaker 1: the issues are right now when you see public servants
12:45
Speaker 1: taking a pay increase, and obviously then you know, looking
12:49
Speaker 1: at those.
12:50
Speaker 4: Most people are desperate to get back to work. You
12:52
Speaker 4: know they've just had all this time working from home,
12:55
Speaker 4: all of that sort of stuff. We're just getting back
12:57
Speaker 4: into a little bit of normality, and the government says
12:59
Speaker 4: I will go again.
13:01
Speaker 5: You know, just.
13:04
Speaker 1: When I worked in retail, I would have been very
13:07
Speaker 1: happy with the additional public holiday.
13:09
Speaker 2: When I was a nineteen year old and you know.
13:11
Speaker 4: At a retail store that you were at, decided they
13:14
Speaker 4: couldn't stay open for that day because they couldn't afford the.
13:16
Speaker 2: Wage is again some of the messages we're getting through it.
13:19
Speaker 5: And the question also has to be you know whether
13:21
Speaker 5: your beer or your chicken parmer is going to cost
13:24
Speaker 5: more on that day now because of the increased waging bill.
13:28
Speaker 5: I think it's pretty obvious what's happened in the case
13:30
Speaker 5: of this public holiday the same thing that happened when
13:33
Speaker 5: they surprised us with the half day public holiday straight
13:35
Speaker 5: after they won the election in twenty sixteen. This is
13:37
Speaker 5: a deal that's been done with the SDA, which is
13:40
Speaker 5: the main backer of Michael Garner and Nicole Madison and
13:42
Speaker 5: a heap of other members.
13:45
Speaker 4: You laid that I got to say they'd been at war,
13:47
Speaker 4: you know, with the CFMU up from queens and I
13:50
Speaker 4: reckon if you wanted the SDA run on the show
13:52
Speaker 4: to be far better than having the c FMBU run
13:55
Speaker 4: on the show. But that's what they're battling internally, with
14:01
Speaker 4: the internal battles of the Labor Party.
14:03
Speaker 1: But on the same we don't have buddy, have Damien
14:07
Speaker 1: here this morning.
14:10
Speaker 4: To Harley. You know, I don't want to put words
14:12
Speaker 4: in these math because I reckon Harley would be the
14:16
Speaker 4: first one to jump up and say these brat bags
14:19
Speaker 4: out of Queensland coming up here are in the wrong.
14:22
Speaker 2: Well to ask him.
14:24
Speaker 5: On the broader point though, I mean, you look, we
14:27
Speaker 5: talk about the report that the Turk Report, and we say, okay,
14:31
Speaker 5: here's the report.
14:32
Speaker 3: We have to make sure it's implemented.
14:34
Speaker 4: Right.
14:34
Speaker 5: Well, there's another report that the government released almost two
14:37
Speaker 5: years ago now that also has to be implemented to
14:39
Speaker 5: save our bacon.
14:40
Speaker 3: And that is the Langland Report, right.
14:42
Speaker 5: And if you look at the Langland Reporter, it indicates
14:45
Speaker 5: really clearly the problem you're talking about, and that is
14:48
Speaker 5: that public sector wages are growing at a rate that
14:51
Speaker 5: is far higher than private sector wages and that is
14:54
Speaker 5: making it more and more difficult for the private sector
14:57
Speaker 5: to both attract and retain staff.
15:00
Speaker 3: Right.
15:00
Speaker 5: And one of the key recommendations was this thousand dollars
15:03
Speaker 5: cap on public service wages that the Chief Minister has,
15:06
Speaker 5: to his credit, said he will implement now and has
15:09
Speaker 5: even gone a step further and said that that thousand
15:11
Speaker 5: dollars is only a bonus.
15:12
Speaker 3: You're not even guaranteed it, right. What?
15:14
Speaker 2: What?
15:14
Speaker 3: What? Just left me flabbergasted in that whole deal.
15:19
Speaker 5: It was not only that the union straight out came
15:21
Speaker 5: out and attacked the government over that, so did the CLP.
15:24
Speaker 3: The came out and said, oh, you know, how could
15:27
Speaker 3: you do this? You know you're still signing on fature
15:33
Speaker 3: you talk about you want to fix this problem.
15:35
Speaker 2: This is a real problem.
15:36
Speaker 3: This time you've got to fix it. What I hope
15:38
Speaker 3: have you got to fixing it?
15:41
Speaker 5: Can't come out and even support the government when they
15:44
Speaker 5: want to do that.
15:45
Speaker 3: It's a lost court.
15:46
Speaker 1: You are listening to the big issues and where you
15:49
Speaker 1: can sell your home in five weeks with Simon Watt's
15:51
Speaker 1: Real Estate Central.
15:52
Speaker 2: Oh hang on, everyone's giving it much.
15:54
Speaker 1: Here will refund one hundred percent of all your marketing courts.
15:59
Speaker 1: In the studio with us this morning, Dave Tolner and
16:01
Speaker 1: Matt Cunningham, and I believed Amien Hale's out bush. I
16:05
Speaker 1: think he might be a man Ingreena gets around.
16:09
Speaker 4: What's a big fellow.
16:10
Speaker 2: Living the dream, living the dream.
16:13
Speaker 1: I do want to talk about Australia's relationship with China.
16:16
Speaker 1: It appears to have reached boiling point this week with
16:20
Speaker 1: that tweet that everybody's been talking about. And I know
16:23
Speaker 1: that the Prime Minister, Scott Morrison came out and said
16:26
Speaker 1: that it was repugnant. I believe his words were, We're
16:29
Speaker 1: in a very interesting situation at the moment with China
16:31
Speaker 1: to say the last.
16:32
Speaker 2: Aren't we.
16:33
Speaker 4: I just find the whole thing incredibly distressing. You know,
16:38
Speaker 4: we're all jumping at shadows now. Everybody seems to be
16:41
Speaker 4: jumping at shadows. And meanwhile, our relationship with our biggest
16:45
Speaker 4: trading partner's going down the gurgle?
16:47
Speaker 2: Do we let him bullyus?
16:48
Speaker 4: Dave? I mean, but you know, this is sort of
16:52
Speaker 4: to me. I mean, you know, we're talking about a
16:55
Speaker 4: doctored picture, not very nice, done by a junior member
16:59
Speaker 4: of the Chinese diplomat.
17:01
Speaker 3: Probably on instruction from some people.
17:04
Speaker 4: Possibly, But in any case, it's a poke in the eye,
17:07
Speaker 4: isn't it. It's definitely a poke in the eye, a
17:09
Speaker 4: diplomatic poke in the eye. But you can't say we
17:12
Speaker 4: haven't done a couple of them ourselves.
17:16
Speaker 3: We asked for an investigation into where the virus.
17:19
Speaker 4: Came from a well where we did ask for an
17:21
Speaker 4: investigation where the virus came from, you know, and that
17:24
Speaker 4: was responded to with a I think a reduction in
17:27
Speaker 4: Bali exports and a reduction. And now they've had a
17:31
Speaker 4: little crack at the wine industry, a little crack.
17:34
Speaker 1: I think we've got some businesses who are like, we
17:36
Speaker 1: are not able to keep going.
17:37
Speaker 4: I tell you what I reckon. There's a few people
17:39
Speaker 4: run around go and thinking, rubbing their hands together, thinking
17:41
Speaker 4: finally we can afford to buy Australian wine. The price
17:46
Speaker 4: might drop.
17:47
Speaker 2: I thought, you know, the real fear of course, it
17:50
Speaker 2: was really like you, come on, it does seem like
17:53
Speaker 2: we're being.
17:54
Speaker 4: But yeah, but the real fear, of course, is when
17:56
Speaker 4: you've got sixty ships sitting in harbors loaded up with
17:59
Speaker 4: coal in China, or if there's any threat to our
18:02
Speaker 4: iron or exports. That really is what gems Australia right
18:06
Speaker 4: in the heart. And you know, I don't think we've
18:10
Speaker 4: seen economic pain until we start losing some of those markets,
18:13
Speaker 4: and that is the big fear. And somewhere rather along
18:17
Speaker 4: the line, we do have to turn down the retoric
18:19
Speaker 4: and not.
18:21
Speaker 2: Like you know, you can't just give in.
18:24
Speaker 4: Of course, you can't just give him. But at the
18:25
Speaker 4: end of the day, you've got to remember they're our
18:28
Speaker 4: largest single trading partner. So much of Australia's wealth has
18:33
Speaker 4: come from China and it's kept us economically strong through
18:37
Speaker 4: a whole lot of financial problems in the past.
18:41
Speaker 1: Is it time for us to start looking at some
18:42
Speaker 1: other trading partners.
18:45
Speaker 4: I don't know that Sleepy Joe is going to have
18:47
Speaker 4: the same sort of fight that Donald Trump was with China,
18:52
Speaker 4: and we may well find ourselves sitting out in the
18:54
Speaker 4: cold when it comes to arguments with China and look,
18:59
Speaker 4: let's face the facts. Every time we lose market to China,
19:04
Speaker 4: you know, they go and buy this stuff from the US.
19:08
Speaker 3: We backed the wrong horse in this Well, I.
19:10
Speaker 4: Don't know whether we've backed the wrong horse, but I
19:12
Speaker 4: think we've We've probably not played the played the game
19:16
Speaker 4: particularly well. In my view. It's you know, maybe I'm
19:19
Speaker 4: a little bit more focused on trade and the economy
19:22
Speaker 4: and these sorts of things.
19:23
Speaker 5: You've done the ideal with China before. How would you
19:26
Speaker 5: handle this situation from here?
19:28
Speaker 4: Well, I got to say, and every I mean, the
19:30
Speaker 4: world has changed enormously in the last four years, you know,
19:34
Speaker 4: and when we were doing stuff with China, the relationship
19:37
Speaker 4: could not have been stronger or better. You know, we
19:41
Speaker 4: had a lot of interest in the territory coming from China.
19:44
Speaker 4: We had a lot of interest in China from the territory.
19:47
Speaker 4: You know, it's a two way street. But that has
19:51
Speaker 4: come to a pretty abrupt end.
19:55
Speaker 5: Where does the current situation with the trade war and
19:58
Speaker 5: the security issues, where does.
19:59
Speaker 4: The But Matt, you wouldn't want to You wouldn't want
20:03
Speaker 4: to be a politician today doing a trade exbo in China.
20:09
Speaker 2: I don't think you'd.
20:11
Speaker 4: But I mean, if you could do it. I mean,
20:13
Speaker 4: you'd be absolutely shot to pieces by people in Australia
20:17
Speaker 4: for even daring to go over there where four year ago,
20:20
Speaker 4: it was almost an expectation that we get around the
20:23
Speaker 4: world and we try and drum up business for territory
20:26
Speaker 4: businesses and Australian businesses. But if you did that today,
20:29
Speaker 4: I think you'd find a much different reception that you
20:32
Speaker 4: would have in Australia four year ago.
20:34
Speaker 5: Are there any implications for the port deal with what's
20:37
Speaker 5: happening now, Well.
20:38
Speaker 4: It's hard to sort of see. I mean, at the
20:40
Speaker 4: end of the day, it'll be popular view. I mean,
20:44
Speaker 4: if if people start buring up so much about the port,
20:47
Speaker 4: it's not hard to imagine that the governmentould be looking
20:50
Speaker 4: for ways to try and extricate itself from that. But
20:54
Speaker 4: you know, I couldn't imagine a government in the territory
20:56
Speaker 4: wanting to extricate themselves from that deal.
20:58
Speaker 2: I think they can at the moment.
21:02
Speaker 4: It'll cost him a billion dollars to get out of.
21:05
Speaker 4: I mean not that that worries. They seem to be
21:09
Speaker 4: able to conjure money from nowhere at the moment, so
21:12
Speaker 4: what's another billion? But you know, more to the point
21:16
Speaker 4: is the maintenance and the ongoing viability of that port
21:20
Speaker 4: if you were to get rid of that organization that's
21:23
Speaker 4: currently the.
21:24
Speaker 1: Well, look we are going to have to wrap it up.
21:26
Speaker 1: And he's just a couple of minutes away from eleven o'clock.
21:28
Speaker 1: Great to have you both in the studio with us
21:30
Speaker 1: this morning for the big issues Star.
21:32
Speaker 4: Great to be with your Kadie, and I've got to
21:33
Speaker 4: say great to be with Maddie. I got to well
21:37
Speaker 4: the first time round. I think a borg is both
21:39
Speaker 4: to death with hydrogen.
21:44
Speaker 5: Listeners, the listeners, the listeners to get outrated by the
21:48
Speaker 5: A D seven.
21:49
Speaker 4: For the first time in the last one.
21:51
Speaker 2: I left on such a high.
21:52
Speaker 4: I left on such a high. I thought Orange Jesus
21:56
Speaker 4: had been elected in the landslide until a day later
22:01
Speaker 4: that afternoon when it sort of started to look a
22:03
Speaker 4: little bit dodgy, and now all of a sudden it
22:06
Speaker 4: looks unlikely.
22:07
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right.
22:09
Speaker 1: Well, look, we always enjoy your company. Dave Tolna, thank
22:13
Speaker 1: you very.
22:13
Speaker 4: Much, believe it.
22:16
Speaker 1: And Matt coming home. We'll catch you again very soon.
22:19
Speaker 1: Thank you both for your time today. You are listening
22:22
Speaker 1: to Mix one O four point nine three sixty.
22:25
Speaker 2: It was the big issues