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The Part of Menopause We Never Expected · Conversations Beyond Borders

• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: Hello, I'm Susan.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm Laura.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to Conversations Beyond Borders.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, welcome back to our fifth episode of the second season already.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: That is crazy.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: That is absolutely crazy.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_00: But we are thrilled that you're with us.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: And we are talking today about a very important topic.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: A topic that maybe years ago wasn't discussed.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: But it's the part of menopause that maybe we never expected.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think I don't know about you, Laura, but um my impression of menopause when I was younger was kind of one-sided.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that's because it was this image of my mom and aunts and any woman that I know using these fans all the time, right?
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: Just this somehow I, you know, I was going to have a an increase in body temperature.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: And for me, that was a welcome thing because I'm like always cold.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_00: So I thought, well, great, if that's what's going to happen, maybe I'll be the happiest person in menopause.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: But I I think I think today, and our discussion, Laura, preparing for this, is that there's a lot more than just the physical changes.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: And it's really important to discuss, I think, the overall impact that menopause may have on midlife women.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_00: And those are the emotional ones, the mental ones, even the identity shifts that um happen in menopause, because it, you know, it's simply something, it's not just simply something our bodies are experiencing.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: Agree, agree.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: It it maybe for the first time, maybe for the first time after our conversation, you might you might see yourself differently and hopefully feel supported.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and and understood.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: Because for me, information is power.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: And the more that we can discuss something, even if it's sometimes uncomfortable, um, I think it's important that we we, yeah.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: So let's discuss the first thing.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: What would we, what we thought menopause would be?
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: What was your impression growing up?
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh boy.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: So in my 30s and 40s, my mother was going through it.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_01: So um I figured it was going to be hot flashes.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: I figured it was going to be night sweats because I heard many times about how, you know, waking up in a pool of sweat and you know, waking up and changing the sheets at you know, two o'clock in the morning.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_01: And um, and I figured it was going to be also a little bit um of a time period when when we become a little bit um oh I don't know, psychotic.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, things get a little emotional.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, growing up, obviously as a female, I think a lot of anytime we get emotional, it all goes back to our hormones.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: And men and everybody else, well, not everybody else, but men like to blame, you know, our moods on hormones.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: It has nothing to do with the fact that we keep tripping over their shoes and we're just tired of it.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's all about the hormones.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_01: Amen.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: So I figured, I figured it was gonna be um, yeah, just a lot of, like you said, a lot of body heat and and a lot of crazy.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: Well crazy.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: It I don't know uh, you know how you thought, but I think there were times even when I when I think women carried a lot of shame.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: That it was something that you're right, maybe maybe you were short-tempered, you know, maybe you had no sleep.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but somehow it was something not discussed, right, and something that, you know, that was almost hid.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and I think too, that goes back to previous generations and how there wasn't only a lack of information, there wasn't a lack of awareness, also a lack of awareness, but there was a level of shame for anything that happened in our vaginal area.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like, I'm sorry, we bleed, and that's just the way God made us.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: But for whatever reason, um, you know, that there was a lot of shame around that.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_00: I think, I think I don't know about you, but I I I believed probably that that women some time ago were were seen as yes, we were we were the childbearers.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: We were the ones that that was our role.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_00: And any suffering around that, whether it be breastfeeding, whether it be anything that you're right, that we deliver babies through our vaginas.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um men didn't even go into um the delivery room.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_00: They weren't, yeah, they weren't allowed to be able to right about it.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: It was this secret place that um you stayed quiet about, and certainly men didn't talk about.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, yeah.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: So let's move on to maybe some of the other surprises that happened to our bodies that maybe go beyond the physical.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: We know, you know, we're looking in the mirror and we're not recognizing ourselves, we know the wrinkles are appearing, we know the gray hair is thinning, we feel less energetic.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: Doesn't this all sound wonderful?
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, yeah.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: Great time, grand time, grand time.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but but menopause goes well beyond that.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so let's talk a little bit about maybe some of those emotional changes that we may not have been prepared for or even understand that that would be a part of menopause.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_01: No, for sure, for sure.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: I will say that, you know, again, going back to the physical stuff, you know, you we heard about the hot flashes, we heard about the night sweats, yeah, and we heard about the you know, estrogen levels, you're gonna get a little crazy.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but it and and to give you know our parents' generation a little bit of credit, I'm guessing the reason we didn't hear about some of these things isn't necessarily shrouded in shame, like the physical piece um could have been, but I think it has to do with just a lack of awareness.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_01: And so for me, there was a level of grief that I did not expect.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_01: And and when you you sit and think about it just in a very basic manner, anytime there is a loss of anything within your life, um, there's gonna be some level of grief.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: You know, and it doesn't have to be the loss of a loved one, you know, it doesn't have to be the loss of a pet to throw you in grief.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's just a loss of something that was meaningful, right?
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: Sure, sure.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: When we're, you know, when we're losing our mental sharpness or we are having these mood swings or losing our confidence socially as well, um, feeling less resilient, we are really feeling very much like a different person.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: Correct.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that would catch most people by surprise.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: I think there are the things that wouldn't, like, I think I don't know, in your women's circles, but we always chat um about the fact that you know, someone's got to finish our sentence or somebody better remember the name I'm trying to come up with.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um you know, I think perhaps our generation, um I didn't I did not anticipate having the memory issues so soon.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I think we are hypersensitive um because of the prevalence of dementia um and Alzheimer's.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: I think we really begin to worry is this menopause or is it something else?
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, I as long as I feel the same way.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_01: First of all, I have to say I feel the same way.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: Uh paranoid about about memory issues for sure.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I have nothing to base that on.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: I have got to say I have nothing to base that on.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: I do not have a family history of it.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um Ditto.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: Same.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: But it's still there, right?
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_01: And but so what I do when I try to when when I start to get a little insecure about it, it's like, okay, is this short-term memory?
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_01: Did I just randomly walk into a room and then just totally forget?
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes, or is it long-term memory, right?
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_01: So if it's short-term memory, not a problem, you know, overcommitted, trying to do too many things, too many things on my mind, you know.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, and maybe that's where our short-term memory does come as an issue in menopause because there is so much that we're trying to manage right now with aging parents or parents who who who've passed recently or you know, kids moving out, you know, because unfortunately for us, as we're going through menopause, we are the same age as all these things that are usually happening, you know, including we could be retiring or looking at a job change.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_01: And that's a lot of loss.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_01: That is a lot of loss.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of loss.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: And so trying to manage all of that grief and trying to manage all of those details and trying to manage all of our emotions around all of that.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_01: I I think I think we can give ourselves a little bit of break.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_01: And it's okay if we walk into the kitchen and forgot that we went there for a bottle of water.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: Well, let's get into the grief part of it.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because I don't think that that word is typically associated with menopause.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: I think it is this grin and barrett kind of philosophy.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but the word grief, as you have described, you're right.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: It it we haven't lost a person, but we've lost something.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: We've lost something.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um our bodies no longer feel feel familiar.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um but I know that we want to discuss something that happened pretty recently with you.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um and again, because I'm just a little bit older than you, um you reminded me of of of feeling the same way.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I I think it's important to discuss um one aspect of that grief.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: So do you want to fill us in?
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: And also, you know, to point out that our journeys here are different, also just because of the physical differences and how our bodies have what the things we've had to do, right?
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: Like I had to have a hysterectomy.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_00: So a lot of those um signs and symptoms of menopause were really confusing for me.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I know that, yeah, you're right.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: Your journey is much, much, much more different.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that our audience would really benefit from you um talking about that, if you don't mind.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_01: No, not at all, not at all.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_01: So um I had to have a intervaginal, no, trans, transvaginal ultrasound.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: That's a good time, let me tell you.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_01: But but I will say it was really cool to be able to see, you know, they put a monitor up and you got to see, you know, all of your insides.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_01: It was in the grayscale, but it was still kind of cool.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, never actually saw, you know, what the inside looks like without having a baby in there.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: So um, so I found that to be actually really, really cool.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: But um, but a little bit of history on why, because I think it's also important for the listeners for their own awareness, because I would hate to have somebody else go through this.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um about a year ago, uh different doctor put me on estrogen without pedestrone.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: And estrogen encourages our bodies to, you know, create a and prepare, right?
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, prepare.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: Estrogen prepares the body to bear a child.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: So so the uterus is then encouraged to get thicker.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_01: Well, then the progesterone is what comes in that actually, you know, decreases that and keeps that from happening.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_01: So, because I was on estrogen for uh for a year without pedesterone, um, we have and and and not informed essence.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, not informed at all.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: No, no.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: So I will say to my doctor's credit, um, she did try to put me on progesterone.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_01: I had a reaction to it, but there was never a further discussion on of why, right?
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, that I need this, this is why I need this.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: Let's try something else.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so fast forward a year, and uh, we have found that um my uterus is now three times thicker than what it's supposed to be.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_01: I know that is scary to hear.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_01: Well, it is it's a little odd to think that something like that is growing in your body.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: Data doesn't lie, right?
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: We're we're supposed to be looking at the normal numbers, and then we get numbers like that.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: And you can't help but be alarmed.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't necessarily have to mean that you know, really bad things are going to happen, but I'm just thrilled that your new doctor caught this and you're yeah, exploring it.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, me too, me too.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_01: And and I've done my own research.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, everything, chances are everything's gonna be fine.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: They'll end up putting me on a protocol will figure it out.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_01: But but the grief piece, going back to the grief, the grief piece.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: So have the ultrasound, get the radiologist report back.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_01: And on the report, it said, right ovary not visualized.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like what?
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I had to sit in that for a minute.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, at first I was thinking, oh, it's just because of the ultrasound.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: Because they did an external one first, right?
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm like, it's like, Oh, like not being able to find out if it's a girl or a boy.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: The boy part just can't be found.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_01: It flipped.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm thinking at first, I'm thinking, well, maybe they just didn't take the little thing and like move it over to that side far enough.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: And and so then doing my research, um I see this is common after menopause.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like that the ovaries are no longer visible because they shrink.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: Shrink so much.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: And and realizing and and again, you know, I am I am, I don't even remember how old I am.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: How old am I?
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: I'm 58, right?
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm 58.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I do not want to start over.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_01: I do not desire to have any more children.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_01: Of course not.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_01: I want to be free and and and enjoy life in the regards of being able to travel and pick up and go and all the things, right?
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but the thought of the finality and the fact that I have had this little ovary hanging out in my body, you know, since I was born, you know, and now it's no longer there.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_01: There was some there was a very weird remote.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: You had a tough week, right?
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: You had a tough week.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it just kind of threw me into a funk.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: And the I again, I think those are the parts that we don't necessarily talk about.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we don't talk about the fact that um, yeah, we have a uh obviously a fertile period, and and there are lots of options associated that, depending on what your journey looks like.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: And you and you're right, it's not like you want to expand your family, but it's it's like something is taken away permanently.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I think there that is a grief, that is a loss.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: And I'd be really interested to hear from our audience um about women's experiences like this.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like what are what are your surprises that you've learned, whether it it, you know, you knew about it or not.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we all have different bodies and we all have different experiences.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's important to share and to talk about and to normalize uh this conversation so that women are not hiding in the corner trying to figure out why they feel a certain way and and not feel alone, you know.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's like, you know, don't don't feel alone, don't like because like you said, I mean it's I still think there's a little bit of apprehension.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm not gonna say shame because I think that's a little too heavy.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_01: And there may be for some people um shame talking about it, but the only way we're gonna get rid of the shame is to, like you said, start normalizing the conversations.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_01: Because at the end of the day, this is normal.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody goes through it, every woman goes through it to some level, somehow.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: The journey may look different, but but it it we're still going through it, right?
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and we should never feel alone for something that every other female is going through.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: Well, well, we certainly know men aren't very good at this conversation, even though, even though the change that they identified many years ago, um men do go through a period themselves of change and reckoning that looks very different than who they might identify themselves.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, they may, they you may call it something different.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: They're going out and buying the red corvette and they're right, they're they're they're trying to make sure they're not losing the youthfulness that they once had.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: So, so much better that men even be a part of this conversation so so they can support each other, they can support females in their lives, mothers, sisters, wives.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_00: And by normalizing it, and the other aspect of this, even when you and I talked, is that we don't like to talk about sort of the negative parts of midlife.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: We talk we talk about the realities for sure, right?
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: But we realized even in menopause, there was something that it was giving us.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: That there are there are great things that happen in conjunction with this time of life.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, for sure, for sure.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I would say, I would say, I don't know about you, but I would say for me, there's a level of self-confidence.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: And with that level of self-confidence, I have definitely noticed that I also have embraced a level of I don't care.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: You know, agree.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't, and when I say that, it's like, of course, I'm always gonna have compassion for people I care about.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: Of course.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I'm not talking about big things, I'm talking about if I have to run to the grocery store and I've been working remotely all day and I'm in pajama pants, a baggy t-shirt, and my hair up in a messy bun.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: I don't care.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think we are we are consumed about what society thinks of us.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: Now I think I think we're gonna talk, um, we're gonna talk in this season about the no more glow-up because I think society tries to play games with us and convince us that we should be addressing the wrinkles and the and all of the things.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I think this this time of life could be such a time of freedom for sure.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and last week we talked about you know, like no more production and having the confidence to say the thing to decide what your day looks like or your month looks like, and and be okay with that.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: And of course, that's gonna be something that I'm working on.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_00: But I think you're right.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's not about caring less about people, it's caring less about what they think of us.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly, exactly.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's finally releasing the societal norms.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_01: And and if you want to buy the bubblegum pink couch, buy the bubblegum pink couch, you know.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, whatever makes you happy.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_01: And and just truly embracing that joy.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_01: And and the other thing I think we get to do it at this season, and and I think it also has to do with the fact that our time's freed up a little bit, you know, as unless we're caregivers for aging parents.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: I know we've got a set of people out there that that definitely have to manage that.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: That includes me.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_01: But but with with having a little more freedom of your time, we we can get back in those play states, right?
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_01: We can get back and we can we can pick up that hobby that we we had to put aside when we had, you know, three or four kids running around and We were driving them all over the place, you know?
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_01: Nice to be spontaneous, wouldn't it?
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: To be spontaneous.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: And the logistics are so much easier when you're only buying two plane tickets.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's like where's everybody to sit on the plane?
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_00: You don't have to worry about everybody else.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: You don't have to worry about else.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: I I I like I like talking about this new sense of freedom that we we can find in midlife.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: Because again, if if we don't talk about sort of the silver lining, if we don't encourage women to be sensitive, to be looking for the things that we talked about, it doesn't mean we ignore the physical and you know, maybe socially we're feeling a little more isolated.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we don't ignore, you know, that it's time to to you know maybe tell someone that mental your mental health isn't where it needs to be.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: And seeking out a therapist or speaking to, you know, a friend about all of this is a great way towards um empowering yourself.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: Agree, agree.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: Agree.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_00: Now, one thing I wanted to end with because you said something that really caught my attention when we were building this episode, and that was I wanted you to tell our audience about menopause and emotions.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_00: Menopause emotions.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_00: What you talked about the fact that menopause doesn't cause oh, right, right, right, right, right, right.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: I know what you're talking about.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, yep, yep.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_01: It has to do with the hormones and it has to do with the shift of hormones.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, kind of going back to how men like to blame our hysteria.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we're hysterics.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um blame our hysterias um on our hormones and the fluctuation of hormones.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: So I did do a little bit of research and I did start running down that path a little bit.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: And and what I found was what the science shows is that hormones don't drive emotions.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's more accurate to reframe this as they influence how our brains experience, regulate, and recover from emotions.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_01: Because as we lose, as our body loses the ability to produce the the estrogen, we start to lose um levels of serotonin and dopamines and noreepinephrines that are all of these feel-good hormones up in our brain.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so so it's not they don't create our emotions, but they influence our brain's experiences.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's valid.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: That was a really good clarifying.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe maybe women shouldn't like blame themselves and we should offer each each other a little bit of grace and and recognize um, yeah, pointing fingers and blaming um doesn't help anyone, doesn't help any any relationships at all.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: So we know this season can be uncomfortable, it can be even painful, right?
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: But it also leads to a stronger, more authentic sense of self.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what I think we need to hang on to.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: Agree, agree.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_01: If if we we uh we ride the ride, if if we're nimble, ride or die.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_01: No, absolutely, if we're nimble and we, you know, and get a good support system, right?
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: Have a good support system.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: Don't be so hard on yourself.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it will get better.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but yeah, yeah, I think I think it can be it can be an amazing time if we can get to a point where we can embrace the the good things that come out of it.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: And you wanted to end um the episode with asking our audience a question.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_01: Can you remember?
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: I have it right here.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: Wait, well, wait.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_01: No, I don't have it here.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: What is the question?
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: Because it was a really good one.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_00: You said what if we're what if what we're grieving isn't just menopause, but the version of ourselves we always expected would still be here.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_00: And just think about that.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_00: That opens the door to have this honest conversation that take a look, you know, reflect, be curious about how you're feeling.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we've talked about a gratitude practice, we've talked about journaling in the past.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there's a multitude of experts out there to process, and I think that's really important.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_01: No, agree, agree.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: And do you have anything else to add before we let our audience go this time?
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um just to let you know that with everything you're feeling, um, with all of you know anything about about the grief or any of the rest of it, you know, you you may be irritable, you may be feeling like you're falling apart.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but but just keep in mind that you're not falling apart.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_01: It it might be just grieving parts of your life that are changing.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: And and again, you know, that's a piece that at least for myself, um, no, nobody ever prepared me for.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody ever prepared me for.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: Truth.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: So that door opens, you know, that opens the door to an honor conversation that validates the losses, but also explores what might be waiting on the other side.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so on that note, um, we want to encourage you to continue to listen to our season two.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_00: You can find us on Facebook under Conversations Beyond Borders with you.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we are on all the social platforms, and we look forward to any dialogue that you might want to have on this subject because, again, that's where where I think we can support each other.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, agree, agree.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_01: And we are on all your favorite listening platforms.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: And don't forget to like and subscribe uh to help uh help push us closer to the top of people's uh people's searches.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's true.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it really helps us out a lot if you uh follow us and like our podcast.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it will help us to spread the word.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_00: So so glad you're a part of this conversation and see you next time.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_00: I don't remember.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_00: And glad you're in it.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: Bye.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: Bye.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: See you next time.