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Why Emotional IQ Beats Technical Skills in Hybrid Teams · Speak In Flow

• 0:02
  Melinda Lee: Welcome. Dear listeners, to the speak and flow, podcast where we dive into unique stories to help you and your team achieve maximum potential and flow even when there's pressure and the stakes are high.
• 0:18
  Melinda Lee: I have the exact leader person to help you through this. He's inspiration he has a Phd. In physics. He is the product performance manager for Asml he's from Central. He is originally from Central Africa, and now here in the United States his name is Mohsen Elmick, Hi Mohsen.
• 0:43
  Mohsen: Hello!
• 0:44
  Melinda Lee: Welcome to the show.
• 0:47
  Mohsen: Thank you.
• 0:48
  Melinda Lee: I'm so glad you're here today. Can you share with the audience a bit about what you do and what makes you excited today? What makes you happy.
• 0:59
  Mohsen: Yeah, thank you. Thank you very much.
• 1:02
  Mohsen: For for this opportunity, it's nice to be here.
• 1:08
  Mohsen: And this is actually my, my, let's say my 1st show, so
• 1:17
  Mohsen: I want to make it an experience and and then
• 1:24
  Mohsen: probably will do that together with all of you.
• 1:27
  Mohsen: So my name is.
• 1:29
  Mohsen: I've done Mercenal Malik so, but I
• 1:32
  Mohsen: my family, everybody around me call me Marcin. This is like half of half of the name.
• 1:38
  Melinda Lee: So I'm originally from Sudan.
• 1:40
  Mohsen: Middle East of Africa.
• 1:43
  Mohsen: So I I've been around and and worked
• 1:49
  Mohsen: and learn a lot in 3 different continents.
• 1:53
  Mohsen: Seen. I left Sudan is somewhere in 2,000,
• 2:01
  Mohsen: I believe, around 2,005, 2,006.
• 2:04
  Mohsen: So A journey took me through to many, many locations.
• 2:13
  Mohsen: I started as a physics graduate
• 2:17
  Mohsen: from Sudan University of Science and Technology, then joined another university across the street.
• 2:27
  Mohsen: And in any university at that time I worked there
• 2:30
  Mohsen: and then from there I start to think about how
• 2:36
  Mohsen: I wanted my feature to be
• 2:38
  Mohsen: so. I had one belief at that time was a very strong belief at that time is that
• 2:45
  Mohsen: I want to do a higher education with a high quality.
• 2:50
  Mohsen: because I was involved in science and technology, physics.
• 2:56
  Mohsen: And and you know, so basically those kind of things, the the infrastructure, the system, the equipment.
• 3:07
  Mohsen: the knowledge. It's it's in the developing country. So
• 3:13
  Mohsen: so I had. I was strongly believe that.
• 3:18
  Mohsen: If I have. If I wanted to do a meaningful research at the Phd. Level, I have to
• 3:28
  Mohsen: have to go somewhere in Europe or or United States.
• 3:32
  Mohsen: So that actually leave.
• 3:37
  Mohsen: That was the start of my journey.
• 3:39
  Melinda Lee: How did she?
• 3:40
  Melinda Lee: You didn't have the resources or.
• 3:43
  Mohsen: Exactly.
• 3:44
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, what was happening like you didn't. How did you do that? What was? Ha! What was the limitation around you at that time?
• 3:51
  Mohsen: So so basically,
• 3:54
  Mohsen: basically, at that time, what there was, there was a there was a limit, a lot of limitation.
• 4:00
  Mohsen: I think the the biggest is that
• 4:03
  Mohsen: at that time there was a little bit of
• 4:08
  Mohsen: let's call it an unique situation for Sudan itself, as a country was a little isolated
• 4:17
  Mohsen: at that time. So it's not easy to
• 4:21
  Mohsen: basically to get to just travel and to just basically decide and travel, to go where you want.
• 4:27
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 4:27
  Mohsen: Was, that was not. That was not easy. But of course, also.
• 4:31
  Mohsen: if you want to to go somewhere and study
• 4:36
  Mohsen: you have to be accepted and accepted in a level of. Because it's a professional career. It's in a
• 4:43
  Mohsen: it's. It's an education need need requirements. You have to meet certain standards.
• 4:50
  Mohsen: So when I was thinking about that, I didn't, I don't believe I was actually even meeting that standards. I think the only thing I had in my mind is my belief so, or my you know.
• 5:04
  Mohsen: ambition or motivation, the thing I need to achieve.
• 5:08
  Mohsen: So that's actually drive to overcome, to overcome many, many other challenges.
• 5:14
  Melinda Lee: Did you feel like when you started? Did you want to give up.
• 5:19
  Mohsen: yeah. Well, at that time it was actually
• 5:25
  Mohsen: you know, you get lots of setbacks right? So and then one of them is, you see, people around you is basically moving forward.
• 5:34
  Melinda Lee: Yes.
• 5:35
  Mohsen: But I think what what kept it, you know, but what the thing that kept me on track is that
• 5:43
  Mohsen: I think that my belief was stronger than my doubts.
• 5:47
  Melinda Lee: Nice.
• 5:48
  Melinda Lee: Nice.
• 5:50
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 5:50
  Mohsen: Right.
• 5:51
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, I mean, you have you holding on to that? You're stronger your belief than that overpower you. You kept on that focus.
• 5:59
  Mohsen: Exactly.
• 6:00
  Melinda Lee: We'll keep on focusing on the doubt.
• 6:02
  Mohsen: Exactly.
• 6:03
  Melinda Lee: And the belief, even though you have setbacks.
• 6:07
  Mohsen: Yes. So yeah. So basically.
• 6:11
  Mohsen: if if I want to just mention some of this, the the challenges is basically
• 6:17
  Mohsen: obviously the 1st challenge will be the language. So you're not equipped with a language that meet
• 6:24
  Mohsen: the standard. So and that is also something because of the way of
• 6:34
  Mohsen: education system at that time in Sudan.
• 6:37
  Mohsen: So plus also the foundation. If you actually want to go to
• 6:46
  Mohsen: to to an advanced universities at that time.
• 6:51
  Mohsen: So you you have to have a very strong foundation.
• 6:55
  Mohsen: So plus also network and connection. So everything works works that way.
• 7:04
  Mohsen: And
• 7:08
  Mohsen: Last, but not least, is the financial support.
• 7:12
  Mohsen: So you also have to have a very strong financial support
• 7:16
  Mohsen: because of the living expenses, and all are very different from
• 7:21
  Mohsen: from where you are, where you basically living with your family, you get lots of support and all those kind of thing.
• 7:28
  Melinda Lee: wow, and then, what would you say? Helped you to navigate those challenges.
• 7:37
  Mohsen: Yeah, I think that the I think the 1st thing is basically and
• 7:43
  Mohsen: the thing that you want to achieve.
• 7:45
  Melinda Lee: So imagining that, okay, I want to achieve this because.
• 7:49
  Mohsen: I think at that time, if if I I still remember that correctly, it's that my.
• 7:59
  Mohsen: the the desire you have for having a quality of education
• 8:05
  Mohsen: were just like satisfactory kind of, you know, feeling
• 8:10
  Mohsen: I was not. Basically I I don't think it was like
• 8:15
  Mohsen: to achieve any kind of status or anything. It's just like basically something that I wanted.
• 8:20
  Melinda Lee: No, it's true, because a lot of times, even myself, I always consider. Should I get my Phd. Is it going to really help me in my profession because I start to think.
• 8:31
  Melinda Lee: how is it going to have the Roi like?
• 8:34
  Melinda Lee: Yes.
• 8:35
  Melinda Lee: I love what I do. But then it's like, is the Phd. Really going to support me? But for you, you're saying that you just want you to have that motivation, that desire to do it, and that's.
• 8:45
  Mohsen: Exactly exactly.
• 8:46
  Mohsen: but from another perspective, because I was working in academia. So it's something essentially, you need to have.
• 8:52
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, if you want.
• 8:53
  Mohsen: To grow in academia. You have to. You have to. You have to. You have to have a Phd. But also looking looking at at.
• 9:03
  Mohsen: I did at that time, because I was working in academia
• 9:08
  Mohsen: and I didn't know I'm gonna go to industry at that moment. So
• 9:14
  Mohsen: basically, it's an it's essential to have it or to to get that degree.
• 9:21
  Mohsen: But the other thing is basically.
• 9:25
  Mohsen: And after that, it's it's basically how other people benefit
• 9:30
  Mohsen: from you when you get that, because.
• 9:33
  Mohsen: the the way you study. If you if you manage to study abroad, then you actually have a quality of education, but that is also come with many other things, skills network. So
• 9:47
  Mohsen: the the benefit?
• 9:50
  Mohsen: I I believe it will be much higher
• 9:55
  Mohsen: to to the people. So it's like an investment. The return of the investment will be big.
• 10:01
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 10:01
  Mohsen: Because because you are actually open up a new window for many others.
• 10:06
  Melinda Lee: Oh, it's beautiful, right?
• 10:11
  Melinda Lee: You're you're supporting others. You're benefiting other people, other people in your community and in the industry, wherever you may be, you're gonna yeah benefit from that perspective.
• 10:24
  Mohsen: Yes, definitely. Yeah, yeah, that'll learn.
• 10:27
  Melinda Lee: So you had that belief, and you continued on to pursue the Phd. In Sudan.
• 10:35
  Mohsen: Yes, I I had that. I had that strong belief, and I
• 10:40
  Mohsen: I push for it, and I even remember I had to wait couple of years where
• 10:46
  Mohsen: other other colleagues at that time they were already advancing in their in their career.
• 10:53
  Mohsen: But that's did not discourage me. So.
• 10:57
  Mohsen: that. That's how I started. That's that's how I get to the
• 11:01
  Mohsen: that's high. How I get to
• 11:04
  Mohsen: to go to the Netherlands and then
• 11:07
  Mohsen: and then finish my study there and then.
• 11:12
  Mohsen: To being where we? Where I where I'm at here. But but the challenge is.
• 11:17
  Mohsen: the challenge is always they. They won't stop, you know, every single.
• 11:25
  Mohsen: every single stop, or every single step of your journey.
• 11:32
  Mohsen: It's a story and a challenge.
• 11:35
  Mohsen: you know, that's this, basically.
• 11:40
  Mohsen: I was also, you know, part of it. It's
• 11:45
  Mohsen: there is also the the. You'll be lucky. I was lucky, you know, at some. At some point I was surrounded by people that's actually supporting them.
• 11:57
  Mohsen: The thing that I believe on, and also
• 12:01
  Mohsen: where I work, I actually
• 12:05
  Mohsen: manage to to. Oh, that's actually allow me to meet people.
• 12:11
  Mohsen: facilitate part of the the or make the bridge. How I can. I can go to the
• 12:18
  Mohsen: to the Netherlands. There was a Dutch professor at that time. He used to visit Sudan
• 12:25
  Mohsen: since the seventies because he had a Sudanese student.
• 12:30
  Mohsen: He was
• 12:32
  Mohsen: He did his Phd. With him.
• 12:34
  Mohsen: For some reason he fell in love with Sudan. So, and he
• 12:42
  Mohsen: he started visiting Sudan from that time until he passed away.
• 12:47
  Mohsen: I was lucky actually to to meet him.
• 12:51
  Mohsen: and he is the the, you know. He is the very 1st reason for and
• 13:01
  Mohsen: for the journey in the Netherlands to happen.
• 13:03
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 13:04
  Mohsen: Yeah.
• 13:05
  Melinda Lee: Wow! I mean, you are a great leader. I can see it in your eyes. The courage that it took for you to go through so much, and but then you you have this spark of positivity.
• 13:16
  Melinda Lee: You have a smile on your face, and that's.
• 13:22
  Mohsen: Yeah. So so so it's, you know, the
• 13:30
  Mohsen: the belief is not enough. Right? So of course, it's it's an internal drive. That's a very important thing, actually, even for leaders.
• 13:41
  Mohsen: And you need to believe on.
• 13:43
  Mohsen: You need to believe in your in your vision. Or also, you need sometimes to have a purpose.
• 13:50
  Melinda Lee: Having a purpose is is very important in life. Right.
• 13:54
  Mohsen: Even in, in, in any spec, in, in any areas or any field having a purpose is is very important.
• 14:02
  Mohsen: So
• 14:03
  Mohsen: yes, so but purpose and drive all that. Those those are the things actually keep you going so and along the way along your journey you will acquire
• 14:16
  Mohsen: other things, your knowledge skills.
• 14:20
  Melinda Lee: Yes.
• 14:21
  Mohsen: But that is also that is, that is, that is something. It's basically your personality or background.
• 14:36
  Mohsen: especially, I believe, I strongly believe, especially when you basically experience multicultural, multicultural
• 14:49
  Mohsen: you know, areas deal or work or study in different places.
• 14:57
  Mohsen: Coming from different background fitting on all those areas.
• 15:02
  Mohsen: It's it will. It will give you a lots of, and knowledge will also ship.
• 15:12
  Mohsen: It will shape you because there is not one. Culture is perfect.
• 15:17
  Mohsen: There is always, you know, and
• 15:22
  Mohsen: a kind of you know,
• 15:31
  Mohsen: inspiration. So you know you, you've been inspired by by other things that you. You don't know. And also sometimes you
• 15:41
  Mohsen: you you learn that that the that's a complementary for
• 15:48
  Mohsen: certain things will be complementary to you, or sometimes also, you learn that you need to.
• 15:58
  Mohsen: you need to. You need to adapt.
• 16:01
  Mohsen: So all those, I think those kind of things, especially in the Us.
• 16:06
  Mohsen: For example, in the Bay Area especially, it's a multicultural place where I think, leaders to that type of
• 16:18
  Mohsen: sense.
• 16:20
  Melinda Lee: Right? Right? Right? Right? I love that. I love what you said. I mean that's the 1st time, I actually heard, I love what you said have a vision for your life and purpose, but then also you have to have the drive. You know the drive, take action, the drive to continue to get data, get information, build your skills. Build your communication, be adaptable, like as you're fulfilling your your journey toward your vision and purpose. When you know different people, you're gonna
• 16:49
  Melinda Lee: be adapt need to be adaptable. And that's a part of another strong set of skill sets to, especially if you go to different cultures all over, that all builds ourselves up as leaders.
• 17:01
  Mohsen: Yeah, yeah, definitely. And then and then and then sometimes you learn those things the hard way when it's what they call the culture shock. You know.
• 17:08
  Mohsen: shock is also it's also a lesson that you can actually learn from a lot.
• 17:14
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, yeah.
• 17:15
  Mohsen: Basically tell you, improve your adaptability to the, to the new situations and to the new culture.
• 17:22
  Mohsen: It's but but it's also it's
• 17:27
  Mohsen: I think i 1 of the thing actually helps me that the strong human connection, you know, when when you
• 17:36
  Mohsen: when you basically experience all those different different type of places and different type of
• 17:42
  Mohsen: languages, and even weathers So
• 17:48
  Mohsen: from a very warm place to a cold place, raining dark all the time to
• 17:54
  Mohsen: another sunny place, you know.
• 17:58
  Mohsen: They reflect on, on, on actually lots of things.
• 18:04
  Melinda Lee: Bye.
• 18:05
  Mohsen: To fit the mood, you know.
• 18:06
  Mohsen: So so all those kind of things, how you can actually utilize and use.
• 18:15
  Mohsen: I believe the strongest part of it is the human connection.
• 18:19
  Mohsen: So human connection always about, you know.
• 18:25
  Mohsen: Common stories, common experience.
• 18:30
  Mohsen: emotional experience. And that is also beneficial. For for example, for leader, that's that's
• 18:40
  Mohsen: That's a very that's a very. That's a very beneficial factor, because most most of the time we see in the communication
• 18:50
  Mohsen: that there is an emotional disconnect.
• 18:54
  Mohsen: Emotional disconnect is is something that happens a lot.
• 18:59
  Mohsen: And and that is actually something.
• 19:02
  Mohsen: and and normally happens on the high hybrid environment where you have multicultural people. So that is that's a big factor need to be taken into account. If you
• 19:18
  Mohsen: if you want to drive your team if you want to.
• 19:24
  Mohsen: Boss on and influence people with your vision
• 19:30
  Mohsen: and bring people around you. I think that is also something very important to.
• 19:35
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, I love it.
• 19:36
  Mohsen: And for.
• 19:37
  Melinda Lee: I think it's so important. The connection as a leader and I love everything that you said was so important. And so what I'd like to close with one more last
• 19:49
  Melinda Lee: going into leadership. We're thinking about leadership. Think about that leader that's out there that might feel like there's a lot of limitations around them. Maybe they don't have the resources. They don't have the support. What is that one takeaway that you want them to remember?
• 20:06
  Mohsen: Yeah, so it, it's it's
• 20:10
  Mohsen: It's not a secret formula. It's a it's it's. It's a very simple formula. Is that
• 20:21
  Mohsen: lots of things drive us is our beliefs. And also
• 20:26
  Mohsen: what's motivate us is basically that how sometimes you you you make a difference.
• 20:37
  Mohsen: So when you make a difference? Is that something? Give you a loss of motivation.
• 20:42
  Mohsen: and also encourage you to
• 20:46
  Mohsen: to do more. But more importantly, is that the learning is, and a non-stop journey.
• 20:56
  Mohsen: So wherever you go, you learn, you learn something new.
• 21:01
  Mohsen: And that is also basically that that does something makes
• 21:05
  Mohsen: a great leader is that they always need to learn, always need to adapt improve communication.
• 21:15
  Mohsen: add humanity to communication, have emotional connection.
• 21:22
  Mohsen: That is actually something that we're missing a lot.
• 21:28
  Melinda Lee: But that is actually the the things that sometimes
• 21:32
  Mohsen: Make the difference.
• 21:34
  Melinda Lee: Oh, yeah, yeah, because we're not alone. It reminds us that we're not alone on this challenging journey.
• 21:41
  Mohsen: Yeah, definitely definitely.
• 21:42
  Melinda Lee: Yeah. Oh, thank you, Mohsen. It was so good to to hear your journey. Thank you for your continued courage. Inspiration. I'm so glad you're at a really, you know, you come out from so much. And now you're here in the States, making a difference supporting your family, and I'm very grateful for you and for taking the time to share.
• 22:07
  Mohsen: Thank you very much. Thank you for the opportunity for the chance talking to you. And I wish you all the best.
• 22:15
  Melinda Lee: Thank you.
• 22:16
  Mohsen: Care.
• 22:17
  Melinda Lee: Thank you and to listeners. Thank you so much for joining us on this episode. I trust that you got your golden takeaway.
• 22:25
  Melinda Lee: And remember anytime you have a chance to communicate. You're also connecting and having an opportunity to make a difference in the world a positive difference until next time. I'm your sister-in-flow. Thank you so much. Take care, bye, bye.
• 22:43
  Mohsen: Right.
• 22:45
  Melinda Lee: Bye.