Latest / Edan Haddock - Total Talent / The More We Automate, The More Human We Need To Become

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The More We Automate, The More Human We Need To Become · Edan Haddock - Total Talent

• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to Eden Haddock Total Talent.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: I am your host, Eden Haddock, Head of Talent and People Experience at November.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: And this is a slightly different episode.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: Actually, the format isn't different at all.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: No guests, no sponsors, no paid promotions.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: Just me behind a microphone, talking about talent, people, work, and where I think our profession is heading.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: But this episode marks the beginning of something pretty bloody big.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_00: Thirty days, thirty brand new episodes.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: But one mission.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: Throughout November, I am releasing an episode of Eden Haddock Total Talent every single day to raise money for November and help change the face of men's health.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: And I need your help.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, of course, I would absolutely love you to donate.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: But I also want you to share these episodes.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: Share the campaign.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: Post it on LinkedIn, put it in your team chat.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: Because you might not be able to donate, but somebody in your network might.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: And if we can use conversations about the future of our profession to start conversations about men's health while raising some serious money along the way, then this crazy idea of recording 30 podcast episodes in 30 days will be absolutely worth it.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: So, day one, let's get into it.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to start with something that I think sits right at the heart of Workforce 5.0.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: The more we ought to make work, the more human we need to become.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I know that sounds like a contradiction, but stick with me.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think we might be approaching HR technology from completely the wrong direction.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: We'll start with we keep digitizing the work.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: That's where we'll start.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: Think about what we've done with HR technology over the last couple of decades.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_00: We've digitized the employee record.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: We digitized payroll.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: We digitized recruitment.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: We digitized onboarding.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: We digitized performance reviews.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: We digitized engagement surveys.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_00: We digitized learning.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: We digitized workforce planning.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: And then automation came along and we started connecting all of those things.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: Now AI has arrived and we're accelerating it again.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: And don't misunderstand me, I bloody love this stuff.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: I use AI extensively in my own work.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: I'm fascinated by augmented teams.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: I'm fascinated by what happens when humans and technology genuinely start working alongside each other rather than technology simply being another system that we log into.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: But there is a problem.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_00: For all the technology we've thrown at work, work still comes down to humans.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_00: A manager giving somebody feedback.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: A recruiter trying to understand a candidate.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: A new employee meeting their manager for the first time.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: Two colleagues trying to work through a disagreement.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: Somebody trying to pitch an idea.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_00: Somebody trying to understand why a member of their team has suddenly disengaged.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: A leader trying to have a difficult conversation.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_00: They're human moments.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: And we can build the most sophisticated technology ecosystem in the world.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: But eventually, two humans still have to understand each other.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: That's what got me interested in today's topic.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: So meet Tally.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_00: As part of this 30-day project, I've been spending time with some of the organizations building technology and services that I think talent professionals should at least know about.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody is paying to appear here.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: Nobody has bought this episode.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: And you're not about to hear an advertisement.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: What I'm doing is getting under the bonnet.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: I'm meeting the people building this stuff.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'm asking them what problem they're trying to solve.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: I'm looking at what they've built.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: And then I'm coming back here and giving you my perspective.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: For this episode, I spent some time with Peter Trelaw from Tally.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I already knew Peter, and I had actually seen an earlier version of Tally.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: But I hadn't seen where they'd taken it recently.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: And it has changed a lot.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: At its foundation, Tally is a personality platform.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I'll come to the technology in a minute.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: Because weirdly, the technology wasn't actually the thing that interested me the most.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_00: It was the philosophy underneath it.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: Peter's argument was essentially this.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: We have spent enormous amounts of time designing processes around humans while perhaps not spending enough time actually understanding the humans themselves.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: And that got my attention.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: Now personality profiling has a problem.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about personality profiling for a second.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: Because it isn't new at all.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_00: Most of us who have been around HR for long enough have encountered some version of it.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_00: You fill in an assessment, you get your profile, you discover you're a color or a combination of letters, or you sit somewhere on a particular scale.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody goes away for a team day.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_00: There are sandwiches.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: Somebody explains everybody's personality.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_00: You have a laugh about Steve being very Steve, right?
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_00: And then nothing.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_00: Six months later, someone finds their personality profile underneath a pile of papers.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: Now that's obviously a massive generalization.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: There are organizations using psychometrics incredibly well.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_00: There are highly sophisticated organizational psychologists doing really valuable work.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: But the question Peter raised with me was a good one.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_00: If personality influences how we communicate, collaborate, respond to change, receive feedback and work with others, why would we use that information once?
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: Why wouldn't it become something that lives alongside the employee?
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: And more importantly, why should the manager need to become an expert in psychometrics to actually use it?
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's really interesting.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think about it with the phrase, don't teach me the data, help me use it.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: Tally's profiling is based around established personality science, including the big five model, with additional dimensions around risk behavior and emotional intelligence.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not going to spend this episode teaching you the big five.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: Because interestingly, Peter doesn't think you should have to learn it either.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_00: That was one of the comments from our conversation that really landed with me.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: The manager doesn't necessarily care what a particular score means academically.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_00: They're running a team.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: They've got a job to do.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: What they actually want to know is, I've got a difficult conversation with Eden in ten minutes.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: How should I approach it?
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: You see, that becomes a completely different proposition.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: And this is where Tally has built something I hadn't seen the last time I looked at the platform.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's called Ask Tally.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: Essentially, they've taken the personality data and placed an AI layer over it.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_00: Peter describes it as an AI organizational psychologist.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: Now that's Tally's description, and I want to be clear about that.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_00: But the concept is fascinating.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: Instead of giving a leader a report and expecting them to interpret it, the leader can ask a question.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_00: I'm about to give this person feedback.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: What should I consider?
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: How might this person respond to change?
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: What could motivate this individual?
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: What are some potential blind spots?
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: How might these two people work together?
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: I'm interviewing this candidate.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: What questions might I explore further?
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: Suddenly, the personality data stops being a report.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_00: It becomes usable intelligence.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: And that is the bit I think talent leaders need to pay attention to.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: Not necessarily tally specifically, the bigger movement.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: We're moving from systems of record to systems of workflow to systems of intelligence.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: HR tech as an intelligence layer.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: Peter used this expression during our conversation that I've been thinking about ever since.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_00: An intelligence layer.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_00: We've already got plenty.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_00: The opportunity now is technology that gives someone useful intelligence at that moment that they need it.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_00: And Tally gave me a really simple example.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_00: Imagine you're a manager.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: You've got a feedback conversation coming up.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: Instead of logging into another HR platform, finding someone's profile, downloading a PDF, interpreting the PDF, and then working out what to do with it, you could potentially ask the question from within something like Teams or Slack.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: You're already there.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: And the intelligence comes to you.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: Then five minutes later, you walk into the conversation slightly better prepared.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_00: Now that's interesting.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: Because we're no longer talking about automating the human interaction.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: We're using technology to potentially improve the human interaction.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: That distinction is enormous.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: This is augmentation, not replacement.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: And this is exactly why I keep banging on about augmented teams.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: The conversation about AI replacing humans is becoming incredibly boring.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: Will AI replace some tasks?
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_00: Will some roles disappear?
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_00: Almost certainly.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_00: Will new roles emerge?
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: Of course.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: But I think the more interesting question is what can humans do better because AI exists?
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: Take the feedback example.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: The technology isn't giving the feedback.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: The manager still has to sit across from another human and have the conversation.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: The manager still needs empathy.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: They still need judgment.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: They still need emotional intelligence.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: They still need to listen.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: They still need to respond to what happens in the room.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: AI hasn't removed the human skill.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: If anything, it has increased the expectation that the human uses that skill well.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_00: The technology has simply given them better preparation.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: That is augmentation.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: And that's Workforce 5.0.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: Humans and technology working together, with each doing the bit they're actually good at.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: Then I saw the recruitment application.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously, I'm a talent practitioner.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: So when Peter started showing me the recruitment side, well, my ears pricked up.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: And there was something here that I liked.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_00: A candidate completes their profile.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: The hiring manager can have a profile.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: Potentially members of the existing team have profiles.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_00: The position description can sit within that project.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_00: And rather than simply giving you a personality score for the candidate, the platform can help explore the relationships between those different pieces of information?
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_00: How might this person work with the manager?
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: How might they complement the existing team?
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: Where might there be tension?
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: What could I explore further?
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: An interview.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_00: How do these two shortlisted candidates differ?
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: Now, huge flashing warning sign here.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_00: This should not mean computer says no.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_00: And this is incredibly important.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_00: I would feel deeply uncomfortable with personality data becoming a blunt instrument for excluding candidates.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: We don't need another magical score deciding who gets a job.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: And Peter was clear on this point during the demonstration, too.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: The information isn't supposed to make the decision.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: It's supposed to give you additional insight to make a better decision.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: And that's a philosophy I can get behind.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: If the system tells me a candidate and hiring manager might have very different working styles, that doesn't mean I reject the candidate.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: Blood, maybe that's exactly what the team needs.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: But now I know.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: Now I can explore it.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: Now I can ask better questions.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: And if we hire them, maybe I can help both people navigate that relationship from day one.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_00: Which brings me to what I actually thought was the strongest part of the whole demonstration.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: Don't throw away the data after hiring.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_00: This is where I think traditional recruitment assessment can be incredibly wasteful.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: We collect enormous amounts of information about somebody during recruitment, interviews, assessments, references, work samples, personality data, career history, motivations.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: Then we hire them.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly, we throw half of it in the bin.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: Congratulations.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: Here's your laptop.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the intranet.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: Here's your manager.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: Good luck.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_00: Why?
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: If we've learned something meaningful about a human during recruitment, surely that information becomes more useful once they join us.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_00: This is the idea within Tally that I probably liked most.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_00: The data travels.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_00: Recruitment becomes onboarding.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: Onboarding becomes development.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: Development becomes performance.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: Performance becomes career conversations.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_00: Potentially it becomes succession.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_00: It can inform coaching.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: It can inform team development.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_00: The profile isn't an assessment event.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_00: It becomes a layer of information across the employee experience.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: That makes a lot of sense to me.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because talent shouldn't end when someone signs a contract.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: The first week matters.
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_00: It really does.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: Peter shared a customer story with me that I loved.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: A manager used one of the onboarding insights for a new employee.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_00: And nothing enormous, no six-month transformation program, no expensive offsite.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_00: Just a relatively small piece of information about how that individual might respond best.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: The manager used it.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: And according to Peter, the employee noticed.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: They recognized that their manager had actually tried to tailor their approach to them as an individual.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: That's such a small thing.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: But think about the signal it sends.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_00: I've seen you.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: I've thought about you.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not simply running the same onboarding playbook I've run with the previous fifteen.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: People.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_00: And Peter made another point I completely agree with.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: Day one is basically peak engagement.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: Have a think about that.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_00: Someone has resigned from their previous organization.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: They've survived a recruitment process.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_00: They've accepted your offer.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: They've probably told their family and friends.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: They've bought something new to wear.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: They turn up on day one thinking, this is going to be brilliant.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_00: And then organizations spend the next two years slowly chipping away at that enthusiasm.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_00: Until eventually we've hit that engagement cliff and we wonder why they're looking elsewhere.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe personalization doesn't need to be enormous.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe it's lots of tiny moments when someone thinks they actually understand me here.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_00: But of course, there is a bigger question.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_00: This is where I want to move away from Tally for a minute.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_00: Because the bigger question is incredibly interesting.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: What happens to human understanding as AI becomes more capable?
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_00: My view it becomes more valuable.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because think about what AI is starting to commoditize.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: Information, administration, content, analysis, scheduling, basic research, process, potentially significant components of recruitment.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: Potentially significant components of HR operations.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_00: So thinking about that, what becomes scarce are trust, judgment, connection, influence, creativity, empathy, curiosity, courage, the ability to have a difficult conversation, the ability to bring people together, the ability to understand another human.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_00: That's the irony.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: The more technology becomes sophisticated, the greater the premium might become on genuinely human capability.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_00: Genuine human capability.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: And we might eventually hire humans, not jobs.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_00: Peter and I went slightly into another territory towards the end of our conversation, but I love that.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: This is usually where the interesting stuff happens.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: We started talking about where talent might eventually go.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I shared something I've talked about on this podcast before.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: I wonder whether eventually we stop hiring positions.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe not in five years, maybe ten.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: But who bloody knows at the speed that things are moving?
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_00: But I think rigid job architecture is going to come under enormous pressure.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: Because work is changing too quickly.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_00: Tasks are changing.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_00: Technology is changing.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_00: Skills are changing.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: Teams are becoming fluid.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_00: Humans and technology are working together.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe eventually we don't say we need a software engineer level two.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe we say we need SARA.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: Because Sarah brings these capabilities, this way of thinking, these relationships, this creativity, this judgment, this ability to work with this particular group of humans and technologies.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: That's a very different way of thinking about talent.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_00: And if we head anywhere close to that world, understanding humans becomes incredibly important.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: So not reducing them to personality scores, but understanding them.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_00: So there's a massive difference.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: One size fits all, it's dying.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: And perhaps that's my biggest takeaway from spending time with Tally.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: The future of work cannot be hyperpersonalized for customers and completely standardized for employees.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: Think about the absurdity of that.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_00: Marketing teams are trying to understand everything about us.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: What we click, what we buy, what we watch, what time we engage, what message resonates, everything gets personalized.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_00: Then we arrive at work and it's here's the standard onboarding program.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the standard performance review.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the standard leadership framework.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the standard career pathway.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the standard feedback model.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_00: Why?
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: Our people aren't standard.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_00: And AI potentially gives us an opportunity to personalize work at scale without creating an impossible administrative burden.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's exciting.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: But of course, there's also responsibility attached.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_00: The guardrails matter, right?
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: I want to finish the technology conversation here because this part matters enormously.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: If we're combining AI with psychological or behavioral information about employees, we need to be bloody careful.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: Peter talked me through the guardrails Tally has built around Ask Tally, including consent, ethics, and restrictions around inappropriate use of the information.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: Good.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: Because this cannot become how do I manipulate Eden into agreeing with me?
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: How do I exploit this person's personality?
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_00: How do I identify someone's vulnerabilities?
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's not leadership intelligence.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_00: That's creepy.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_00: And the more powerful our people technology becomes, the more seriously we need to take governance, consent, transparency, and ethics.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_00: We shouldn't be asking only, can technology doing this?
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: We should be asking, should it?
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: And under what conditions?
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_00: That conversation is going to become increasingly important as AI moves deeper into people and talent.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_00: Now my take.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: So would I put Tally on the radar of talent leaders?
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: Particularly if you're already thinking beyond personality profiling as a one-off assessment.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_00: What interested me isn't simply the profile, it's the attempt to turn behavioral data into usable intelligence in the flow of work.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_00: I like the idea of information collected during recruitment continuing into onboarding.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: I like the idea of helping managers prepare for individual conversations.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: I like the move away from teaching every leader how to interpret complex profiling data and instead helping them apply the insight.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I particularly like technology being used to make a human interaction better rather than replacing the interaction entirely.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_00: Would I still want strong governance around how the data is used?
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_00: Would I ever want personality data making hiring decisions for me?
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_00: But as another source of insight, as something that helps me ask a better question, as something that helps a manager understand someone a little better, that's interesting.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why I wanted to talk about it.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_00: A huge thank you to Peter Trelaw from Tally for opening up the platform, giving me a proper look under the bonnet, answering all of my questions, and contributing to this fundraising project.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: No script from Tally, no sponsorship, just access to an interesting idea and technology, and then my perspective on what I saw.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly how Eden Haddock Total Talent will remain.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_00: Thirty days, thirty episodes, one mission.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_00: And that brings us back to why I'm doing this.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_00: This is episode one, we've got twenty nine to go.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_00: Thirty consecutive days of Eden Haddock Total Talent.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: Thirty completely new episodes.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: And hopefully a bloody big amount of money raised for Movember.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_00: Because behind all the conversations we're going to have this month about AI, talent, leadership, technology, and the future of work is something considerably more important.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: Men's health.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: Prostate cancer, testicular cancer, mental health, suicide prevention.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_00: That's why I'm doing this.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_00: So here's what I need from you.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_00: If you enjoyed this episode, please donate to my Movember campaign if you can.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_00: Share this episode.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_00: Because your share might reach somebody that I can't.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_00: Send it to your talent team.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_00: Share it on LinkedIn.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_00: Send it to someone who might find the conversation interesting.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_00: And when you share it, tell them why we're doing this.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_00: And ask them to donate to.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_00: Because that's how this gets bigger than a podcast.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_00: And Peter, this applies to you and the Tally crew as well.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for contributing to this series.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's see what your network can do.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_00: Share the episode, share the campaign, get behind November.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_00: And let's see how much money this community can raise together.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_00: Tomorrow we go again, another episode, another idea, another part of the talent industry worth exploring.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_00: 30 days, 30 episodes, one mission.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_00: Let's change the men's health.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm Eden Haddock.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_00: This is Eden Haddock, Total Talent, and I'll see you tomorrow.