Latest / Tracks To Success / Kathy Seegebrecht

Transcript

Kathy Seegebrecht · Tracks To Success

0:00
SPEAKER_00: Hi there, everybody.
0:01
SPEAKER_00: I'm Craig Cann.
0:02
SPEAKER_00: Right now on this edition of Tracks to Success.
0:07
SPEAKER_00: What happens when a career built around growth, leadership, and global impact reaches its final corporate chapter?
0:14
SPEAKER_00: Do you simply look back at everything you accomplished, or can it be a new beginning of impact?
0:20
SPEAKER_00: She spent four decades building her career in sales, marketing, and executive leadership, a journey that included global leadership roles at BP and Navistar before she joined UL Solutions and helped transform its marketing organization and global brand.
0:38
SPEAKER_00: As chief marketing officer, she led the repositioning of an iconic company around a powerful idea.
0:46
SPEAKER_00: The World Runs on Trust.
0:49
SPEAKER_00: Now, after a career spent building brands, developing people, and leading through change, she's beginning a brand new chapter.
0:58
SPEAKER_00: Meet Kathy Siegabrecht.
1:00
SPEAKER_00: Her inspiring story of success starts now.
1:06
SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Tracks to Success, the podcast that introduces you to inspiring people with inspiring stories.
1:14
SPEAKER_01: It's your chance to hear from top leaders, entrepreneurs, visionaries, and change makers as they share how they found their way to the top and how their journey can help you find your own.
1:26
SPEAKER_01: And now here's your host, former network broadcaster, C-suite executive, best-selling author, and keynote speaker, Craig Kahn.
1:36
SPEAKER_00: Matthew, I'm thrilled to be able to have a conversation with you.
1:39
SPEAKER_00: Not that we haven't done this before, but it's been a few years.
1:43
SPEAKER_00: Our time together, when you were at UL, I was at the LPGA, and we were trying to build the brand of a big, big time golf tournament.
1:50
SPEAKER_00: How are you doing?
1:51
SPEAKER_00: It's great to see you.
1:52
SPEAKER_02: I'm doing great, Craig.
1:53
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
1:54
SPEAKER_02: So awesome to reconnect with you again.
1:55
SPEAKER_02: Pleased to do that.
1:56
SPEAKER_02: I've changed a bit since we saw each other last.
1:59
SPEAKER_02: I retired just this February.
2:00
SPEAKER_02: So big change.
2:02
SPEAKER_02: Um, but really excited to talk to you and appreciate the opportunity.
2:05
SPEAKER_02: So thank you.
2:06
SPEAKER_00: Well, I I love trying to select who I can bring on to this program.
2:11
SPEAKER_00: And I look for people who've had really interesting careers, journeys, but more than anything, to be able to not just share your story, but help other people with their journey as well.
2:21
SPEAKER_00: And I think that's what we're going to do.
2:23
SPEAKER_00: Um, an extraordinary career across sales, marketing, executive leadership.
2:27
SPEAKER_00: That's impressive.
2:28
SPEAKER_00: Global roles, BP, Navastar, UL Solutions.
2:32
SPEAKER_00: I mean, those are big power brands.
2:34
SPEAKER_00: So obviously, I'm glad to have you.
2:36
SPEAKER_00: Did you always see yourself in a leadership role?
2:39
SPEAKER_00: Like if we were going back into your high school days or your college days or whatever, did you see that path for you?
2:47
SPEAKER_02: No, absolutely not.
2:48
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely not.
2:49
SPEAKER_02: And you'd laugh if I went back and told I'll tell you a little bit about my journey.
2:53
SPEAKER_02: So um, I was definitely not a born leader from day one ever.
2:59
SPEAKER_02: I was not top of my class.
3:01
SPEAKER_02: I didn't go to prestigious schools.
3:02
SPEAKER_02: You know, I grew up in the small town.
3:04
SPEAKER_02: I'm the youngest of seven.
3:05
SPEAKER_02: Uh, my dad was a farmer.
3:06
SPEAKER_02: My mom didn't work till I went away to kindergarten.
3:09
SPEAKER_02: So nothing super interesting there.
3:11
SPEAKER_02: I uh I paid for my own high school.
3:12
SPEAKER_02: I paid work three jobs in college to pay my own college, and I had no idea even what to major in uh in college.
3:20
SPEAKER_02: One time I was at a holiday and swimming pool, and some gentleman there suggested I major in marketing.
3:25
SPEAKER_02: I didn't even know what it was, no idea, but it stuck with me, and that's what I majored in.
3:31
SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
3:32
SPEAKER_02: Did that, and then you know, you get out of college, and I absolutely did not want to be in sales, but sales jobs were easier to get and they paid more money.
3:40
SPEAKER_02: So I took a sales job selling steel.
3:42
SPEAKER_02: So certainly never saw myself doing that, nor did my parents in Chicago and not in great neighborhoods.
3:48
SPEAKER_02: And I went from selling steel to selling office supplies to selling diesel fuel, so all very sexy industries and sexy jobs, but made a lot of money and had a lot of fun and learned a lot.
3:59
SPEAKER_02: You know, those industries were hard.
4:01
SPEAKER_02: So I did learn a lot, and it wasn't uh until after I went back and got my MBA, it was 10 years uh until I got my first marketing job.
4:12
SPEAKER_02: Uh, and that was I was working at Amico at the time, and I got a job as an assistant brand manager for AMICO Ultimate.
4:18
SPEAKER_02: You know, so from there it was really a lot of small um lateral steps.
4:23
SPEAKER_02: Um and it took a while before I got some really big strategic moves in my career.
4:27
SPEAKER_02: And I'll say even mid-career.
4:29
SPEAKER_02: I never really envisioned being chief marketing officer.
4:31
SPEAKER_02: That was never on my list on the wall, you know, like never my career path.
4:34
SPEAKER_02: I wasn't one of those people who charted, you know, in this by this year, I want to be chief marketing officer.
4:40
SPEAKER_02: So, but I always had a really good work ethic.
4:42
SPEAKER_02: Um, I did good work.
4:43
SPEAKER_02: I was really good at relationship building.
4:46
SPEAKER_02: And so I guess I would just say, you know, I did it the old-fashioned way.
4:49
SPEAKER_00: Were were you a good marketer of ideas, though?
4:52
SPEAKER_00: You know, I mean, you you gotta have an idea first.
4:55
SPEAKER_00: And you didn't have one that you wanted to be in marketing, but once you started down that path, did you feel like, hey, I can take an idea and I can turn it into something?
5:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's it was an interesting conversation I have with people all the time, especially when I had bosses early in my career.
5:10
SPEAKER_02: I think one in particular who hired me, goes, Well, you're in marketing, you should be creative.
5:15
SPEAKER_02: Really big difference between marketing and creative.
5:19
SPEAKER_02: So creatives are often, you know, in your your graphic design team, they're writing content.
5:24
SPEAKER_02: They're creative.
5:24
SPEAKER_02: I am not creative.
5:26
SPEAKER_02: So, yes and no to your answer.
5:28
SPEAKER_02: Um, I I get the um certainly knew well the function of marketing and and it changed.
5:35
SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh, the change over my 40-year career.
5:37
SPEAKER_02: So you got to keep learning.
5:38
SPEAKER_02: But I'm I was never been a creative person.
5:41
SPEAKER_02: No, you know, but I was a good storyteller.
5:43
SPEAKER_02: I could tell my story, I could help tell a story.
5:46
SPEAKER_02: And then I had the benefit as time went on of having supporting uh materials from our creative team who are, you know, over the years fantastic.
5:55
SPEAKER_02: But um, I think that storytelling is kind of the thread through my career.
5:59
SPEAKER_02: So as a salesperson, you got to be able to tell a story.
6:02
SPEAKER_02: Why should they buy from you?
6:03
SPEAKER_02: Why should they let you in the door?
6:05
SPEAKER_02: Why should they buy your product when you're in marketing?
6:07
SPEAKER_02: Why should they buy what you're selling?
6:09
SPEAKER_02: Why should you know the leadership team, you know, buy your idea for selling something, but it's not necessarily the creative.
6:15
SPEAKER_02: And then even when you get into leadership, you know, it's the why.
6:19
SPEAKER_02: Why should people follow you?
6:20
SPEAKER_02: Um, they should understand why the company's going, what direction they're going in, and why is it important.
6:26
SPEAKER_02: So I think what I've been good at all along through it is storytelling.
6:30
SPEAKER_02: So being able to articulate that story, um, but less about, you know, kind of big creative ideas.
6:36
SPEAKER_00: Relevance is a really big thing to me as well.
6:39
SPEAKER_00: And and I want to tag on to the storytelling thing.
6:41
SPEAKER_00: So in my workshops that I do with with corporate leaders and groups, uh, even keynotes, I will bring somebody up there at the beginning of the day and I will say, look, here's your audience.
6:51
SPEAKER_00: Don't know how many people are in the room.
6:52
SPEAKER_00: It could be 20, it could be 200, okay.
6:55
SPEAKER_00: And it's who are you?
6:57
SPEAKER_00: Tell everybody who you are and why we should care.
6:59
SPEAKER_00: Why should we pay attention?
7:01
SPEAKER_00: And most people aren't conditioned to be able to tell that story or have it on speed dial or feel comfortable enough to see value in their own story because ultimately that's what makes us lean in and people come before products.
7:16
SPEAKER_00: Uh, is that something that you found?
7:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know, and I think it I also think it's something you talk about a lot in your workshop.
7:22
SPEAKER_02: I think a big part of that is being really clear on your personal brand.
7:26
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
7:27
SPEAKER_02: You know, what are your strengths?
7:28
SPEAKER_02: So, as teams, we always did Clifton strengths.
7:31
SPEAKER_02: I think that's a really good basic thing.
7:32
SPEAKER_02: Like, what are my strengths and what are the team strengths, and how do you meld that?
7:36
SPEAKER_02: That's really important.
7:37
SPEAKER_02: But that personal brand um was always really a clarity thing for me.
7:42
SPEAKER_02: So then I could make sure that that came across to people.
7:45
SPEAKER_02: What do I consistently want to portray?
7:49
SPEAKER_02: And what do I want people to see about me?
7:51
SPEAKER_02: So my personal brand statement didn't change for, I would say, at least the last 10, 15 years of my career.
7:57
SPEAKER_02: Now, I guess I should revisit it now that I'm retired, but it was the same.
8:01
SPEAKER_02: And so, yeah, that was really important to me to know who I was and what I wanted to convey.
8:05
SPEAKER_02: I never said those words out loud ever.
8:08
SPEAKER_02: You never said the words, but you knew what you wanted to convey.
8:11
SPEAKER_02: And I do think that's really important.
8:12
SPEAKER_02: You got to have that introspective time and do the hard work to be really clear about what it is that you do and what sets you apart.
8:20
SPEAKER_00: Kathy, did you ever have like, like, what do you want people to say about you?
8:25
SPEAKER_00: Did you think about that?
8:26
SPEAKER_00: Did you think about brand in that regard?
8:28
SPEAKER_00: Of all right, I know people are gonna walk out of the room after one of my meetings.
8:31
SPEAKER_00: I know after we have a brain, you know, dump of great ideas and all that sort of stuff, people are gonna walk out, they're gonna say something about that.
8:38
SPEAKER_00: What did you ever have in your head about this is what I want people to think of me and my brand?
8:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I certainly wanted to think um, obviously that I'm passionate.
8:47
SPEAKER_02: I think that came away all the time.
8:48
SPEAKER_02: Passionate about my team, passionate about, you know, whatever company or product I worked for, um, passionate about my colleagues, always passionate about the cause, whatever I was selling, whatever I was doing.
8:59
SPEAKER_02: I think that's the number one thing.
9:00
SPEAKER_02: And that it really cared.
9:02
SPEAKER_02: Um, I think what mattered to me, and that was part of my brand statement, is how we get things done matters as much to me as getting the results, but never wanted to lose sight of the results really matter.
9:13
SPEAKER_02: I think that's can often get lost with um what people who are not marketers think about marketing.
9:19
SPEAKER_02: You know, old school, especially, they think, you know, marketing is just fluff, but it's absolutely about results, right?
9:25
SPEAKER_02: Results driven.
9:26
SPEAKER_02: And now there's so much with you can measure with digital marketing and metrics.
9:30
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, we're almost there to the holy grail to be able to tie marketing to, you know, income.
9:35
SPEAKER_02: And you can do it in so many ways.
9:37
SPEAKER_02: So it's come a long way.
9:39
SPEAKER_02: Um, and so I always wanted to get that across too is that marketing is a true discipline, and we are focused on results.
9:46
SPEAKER_02: You may see great creative and great content, but it's about getting those results.
9:50
SPEAKER_02: So I think those would be the things I would say is that passionate, care about it, results driven.
9:57
SPEAKER_00: I've seen it, I've lived it.
9:59
SPEAKER_00: Folks, uh I've been around her.
10:00
SPEAKER_00: It's true.
10:01
SPEAKER_00: When I talk about brand to organizations and help them kind of craft their story, who are we?
10:06
SPEAKER_00: What do we do?
10:07
SPEAKER_00: Why do we do what we do?
10:09
SPEAKER_00: But the most important thing is how do we do it differently?
10:13
SPEAKER_00: What's our differentiator?
10:15
SPEAKER_00: What's our set apart?
10:16
SPEAKER_00: All that.
10:16
SPEAKER_00: And that goes for individuals as well.
10:18
SPEAKER_00: Like there are a lot of people that are chief marketing officers.
10:21
SPEAKER_00: What stands out about you?
10:22
SPEAKER_00: What stands out about you as a salesperson?
10:24
SPEAKER_00: What stands out?
10:25
SPEAKER_00: You got to figure that out.
10:26
SPEAKER_00: Now, one of the things I know that's important to you and that stood out to you, maybe it is part of your brand.
10:31
SPEAKER_00: Um, one of your earliest lessons, I've done a little research on you.
10:35
SPEAKER_00: It's about listening.
10:37
SPEAKER_00: Listening is a big thing.
10:39
SPEAKER_00: And I want to dive into that a little bit uh because listen first was a lesson, was it not?
10:45
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it certainly wasn't.
10:47
SPEAKER_02: I think you take it a step further.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: Listen with intent to learn.
10:52
SPEAKER_02: Right.
10:53
SPEAKER_02: So if I think about my my biggest career mistake or learning, um, came before I got to UL.
11:01
SPEAKER_02: So the company will remain nameless, but I really pushed a campaign that I was desperate.
11:06
SPEAKER_02: I was excited about the creative.
11:08
SPEAKER_02: I was excited about this idea, and I really wanted to make a difference.
11:12
SPEAKER_02: I wanted to make my mark.
11:13
SPEAKER_02: I was so excited about it.
11:15
SPEAKER_02: I was new to this company, and this was really exciting to me.
11:18
SPEAKER_02: And I listened to the creative agency.
11:21
SPEAKER_02: Maybe not.
11:22
SPEAKER_02: Maybe should have tempered who I listened to, but I didn't listen to my audience, which was, you know, management on my side, the dealer network.
11:31
SPEAKER_02: Um, I didn't listen necessarily to the right people and temper who I was listening to.
11:35
SPEAKER_02: So I pushed this campaign through, and it truly could have been career-ending uh at that side.
11:40
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I didn't, I didn't know enough about the business.
11:43
SPEAKER_02: I didn't have enough credibility at this point to sell the idea.
11:47
SPEAKER_02: And I'll tell you, my leadership at the time were actually being nice to me, which is such a big mistake in and of itself, because I was new.
11:54
SPEAKER_02: So they allowed me to push this through, but I didn't listen to that feedback.
11:58
SPEAKER_02: I was in love with the idea.
11:59
SPEAKER_02: So so many learnings in retrospect, going back, you know, about doing the right thing and um how I would do it all over again is so different.
12:08
SPEAKER_02: But I just didn't listen with intent to learn.
12:11
SPEAKER_02: I listened, I had it come in one ear and let it go out the other because I wanted this campaign and it fell so flat.
12:18
SPEAKER_02: We did get a lot of media attention, I will tell you, because the creative was fun and it was different, but it didn't drive sales and our dealer network was not barred in.
12:26
SPEAKER_02: And we really had an egg on our face.
12:28
SPEAKER_02: So it took quite some time to rebuild that credibility.
12:32
SPEAKER_02: So um I think listening is so important, but listening with intent to learn.
12:37
SPEAKER_00: Tracks to Success is proud to be sponsored by Ahead, a company that's been shaking things up for more than 30 years.
12:45
SPEAKER_00: From premium golf headwear to standout apparel and accessories, Ahead has built its reputation on quality, creativity, fast delivery, and taking care of its customers.
12:56
SPEAKER_00: They've never been content to follow trends.
12:59
SPEAKER_00: They've built a brand by setting them.
13:02
SPEAKER_00: If you're looking for gear that helps you look your best on and off the golf course, visit AheadUSAShop.com and don't forget to use the code TTS30.
13:14
SPEAKER_00: That's TTS30 to receive 30% off your personal order.
13:20
SPEAKER_00: Ahead, premium headwear, apparel, and accessories, and the official headwear of the Tracks to Success podcast.
13:29
SPEAKER_00: We're talking with Kathy Siegabrecht, chief marketing officer in her career, global leader, inspirational.
13:35
SPEAKER_00: I can definitely say that because I've lived it in our time working together a few years back.
13:40
SPEAKER_00: I won't tell people how far back.
13:44
SPEAKER_00: Let's get back to marketing.
13:46
SPEAKER_00: Uh, just a quick question on marketing.
13:49
SPEAKER_00: Ultimately, is it about, in your mind, promoting something or understanding or making people understand why it will matter to them?
14:01
SPEAKER_02: Um, so it's both.
14:02
SPEAKER_02: You first have to understand why it matters to them.
14:04
SPEAKER_02: You have to understand, you know, your product or your service and what your differentiator is.
14:09
SPEAKER_02: Uh, you know, at UL, we were all about safety science, and we were so different than our competitors uh in so many ways.
14:15
SPEAKER_02: So it's about defining that, you know, getting on paper, getting it clear in all of your employees' uh minds first, and then writing that messaging and that content, uh, and then getting that across to customers through promotion.
14:28
SPEAKER_02: So then you've got to get it out in a variety of ways, whether that's at events or that's in social media, um, but you're messaging and actually promoting that via your message.
14:36
SPEAKER_02: So I think you got to have the understanding first uh and then promoting it.
14:39
SPEAKER_02: And how you promote it is really an art.
14:42
SPEAKER_02: You got to understand who your audience is, how you're reaching them, and how that message resonates with them.
14:48
SPEAKER_00: You made the comment earlier about passion, that you're a passionate person.
14:52
SPEAKER_00: People asked me what my role was when I was at LPGA.
14:56
SPEAKER_00: And I used to say, Yeah, my title says chief communications officer, but I'm really a passion promoter.
15:02
SPEAKER_00: Like I want people to see passion from me.
15:05
SPEAKER_00: I want them to be passionate about our brand, our athletes, our organization, all it has to offer, etc.
15:13
SPEAKER_00: Your career is really impressive to me.
15:16
SPEAKER_00: Um, global leadership roles, I'm gonna rattle off the companies that just, you know, there's probably something else that I'm missing, but BP, Navistar, and then UL.
15:24
SPEAKER_00: And those experiences are across very different cultures and very different companies.
15:31
SPEAKER_00: When you were working in those roles and you're climbing this ladder, if you will, did you ever have a moment when you thought, oh my gosh, my responsibility is a little bit intimidating to me?
15:43
SPEAKER_00: Like I've got this big, big responsibility.
15:47
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I know I had several, several moments like that.
15:51
SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, the most recent ones that come to mind were at UL and then UL solutions for sure.
15:56
SPEAKER_02: You know, when I went from a team when I started of 10 people and then suddenly I've got a team of 225 people and a seriously big budget.
16:05
SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, that's a big responsibility and the responsibility that you feel for those fantastic employees.
16:12
SPEAKER_02: And then, you know, the responsibility that you feel now reporting to a CEO.
16:16
SPEAKER_02: So always felt that.
16:17
SPEAKER_02: And certainly you have I talked about before too, this imposter syndrome.
16:21
SPEAKER_02: First time I sit in a board meeting, I'm thinking, why am I here?
16:25
SPEAKER_02: I'm along here.
16:26
SPEAKER_02: Now it was so fun.
16:27
SPEAKER_02: And I was all I could think to myself is, gosh, I want this for my kids.
16:31
SPEAKER_02: They need to, they need to do this when they grow up.
16:33
SPEAKER_02: So it was really cool.
16:34
SPEAKER_02: But you know, always felt this, you know, um, it's very overwhelming.
16:37
SPEAKER_02: I think my first big job at BP um that I got was uh supporting uh a global vice president, uh GVP of marketing, and it was an expat role.
16:49
SPEAKER_02: So I had moved from the US to um to London.
16:52
SPEAKER_02: I had I was working part-time before I went.
16:55
SPEAKER_02: I had just come back from having my second son and uh was super fortunate to get this job as a as a they called them EAs, um, but they were chief of staff roles, and they actually called them turtles, like from teenage Newton teenage mutant ninja turtles because burnout was so high, and you're like, you just had to do a lot of stuff.
17:14
SPEAKER_02: And there were short jobs, 18-month jobs.
17:17
SPEAKER_02: And when I arrived in London, I was just scared to death.
17:20
SPEAKER_02: I just looked around.
17:21
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I'm BP's global headquarters, you know.
17:23
SPEAKER_02: At the time, I think it was something like a$200 billion company with a hundred thousand employees, and I'm on the executive floor of headquarters in London, you know, two weeks before I was a part-time mom at home in Naperville, Illinois, and here I am.
17:39
SPEAKER_02: And so I've had that feeling so many times.
17:41
SPEAKER_02: And you've just got to, you know, what do you learn about yourself as a leader?
17:45
SPEAKER_02: You've got to learn to trust yourself.
17:47
SPEAKER_02: You got here for some reason, right?
17:49
SPEAKER_02: You did the work, you're smart, you did things right.
17:52
SPEAKER_02: So you've got to trust your intrinsic, you've got to trust yourself, and you've got to go back and find that confidence because nobody wants to see somebody who's who's insecure.
18:01
SPEAKER_02: They gave you this job for a reason, and you've really got to just find your confidence and go do the job they hired you for.
18:08
SPEAKER_02: So I've found myself in that position many, many times.
18:11
SPEAKER_02: And looking back, it seems funny, and I can smile about it, but at the time it was terrifying.
18:16
SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
18:17
SPEAKER_00: I I'm gonna throw myself uh in vulnerability land right now and tell a quick story.
18:22
SPEAKER_00: Like when I was at the LPGA, obviously I had 25 years on TV and media, all of that, and then I go become chief communications officer.
18:29
SPEAKER_00: I'm sitting in this big office, right?
18:31
SPEAKER_00: I'm I've gone from a cube to a big office, and it was about four or five months in.
18:37
SPEAKER_00: Mike Wan, commissioner at the time, comes into my office and goes, How you doing?
18:42
SPEAKER_00: And I said to him, I have no idea.
18:46
SPEAKER_00: How am I doing?
18:48
SPEAKER_00: And um, I always remember that because he said, just let it ride.
18:51
SPEAKER_00: You know, you're in a learning phase and so on and so forth.
18:54
SPEAKER_00: And I do remember, you know, one of the things he said, listen, learn, then lead.
18:58
SPEAKER_00: And I I had to absorb a lot of different things, but I I do remember some aha moments of like, wow, there is some enormity here, and I was learning a new role.
19:08
SPEAKER_00: So I want to go back to keeping it on storytelling, um, you and UL, because that's a that's a big, obviously, it's a big global brand.
19:20
SPEAKER_00: But if I think if we're being honest, like a lot of people take UL for granted.
19:25
SPEAKER_00: They know they've heard it, but they don't necessarily know what it means.
19:28
SPEAKER_00: And so telling them, um, did you enjoy trying to figure out how do I how do I introduce this brand to people and take it to another level?
19:37
SPEAKER_02: Oh, for sure.
19:37
SPEAKER_02: But I'm not sure we've still cracked that nut, right?
19:40
SPEAKER_02: It's it's um, it's a difficult, it's a difficult situation.
19:44
SPEAKER_02: It's it's a wonderful brand, um, very powerful, but understated, right?
19:49
SPEAKER_02: A modest brand.
19:50
SPEAKER_02: And and certainly our former CEO always took that position, Keith, who you know well.
19:55
SPEAKER_02: Um, and that's why he thought it partnered so well with the M LPGA.
19:58
SPEAKER_02: There was so much synergy there.
20:00
SPEAKER_02: Um, and didn't think we needed to do, you know, a lot of mass marketing.
20:04
SPEAKER_02: We needed to understand how to build the brand and how to you know support customers, but mass marketing wasn't part of the equation.
20:10
SPEAKER_02: And we often uh equated ourselves, and I'm sure they still do, uh, with Intel, like the Intel Inside campaign.
20:17
SPEAKER_02: So many electrical products, for example, can't reach market without UL listed components inside your computer or UL certified products.
20:25
SPEAKER_02: But most people don't even understand that, right?
20:27
SPEAKER_02: I know they see the UL and circle and products, but don't understand.
20:31
SPEAKER_02: And over the past 10 years, the depth and breadth of the services that we offer have gone so far beyond electrical products.
20:39
SPEAKER_02: It's amazing, you know, into AI and cybersecurity.
20:42
SPEAKER_02: And you know, you know, so has innovation gone, so has UL gone.
20:46
SPEAKER_02: So it's so difficult to explain the depth and breadth of the services that we offer and put that all under the UL brand.
20:54
SPEAKER_02: So it's a great challenge for marketers and for our brand team there, but um, certainly always enjoyed it.
21:01
SPEAKER_02: And I would say one of the biggest challenges that we have was even just our name.
21:06
SPEAKER_02: So UL, that was actually the legal name for the for-profit company, but we had the uh nonprofit company was underwriters laboratories.
21:14
SPEAKER_02: And that was our original name.
21:15
SPEAKER_02: You know, going, we're back uh what 132-year-old company now.
21:19
SPEAKER_02: That was the original name of the company.
21:20
SPEAKER_02: So most people know us as underwriters laboratories and they don't understand the difference between underwriters laboratories and UL.
21:26
SPEAKER_02: So you'd always explain it by when you say UL, they're like, What's that?
21:30
SPEAKER_02: You say underwriters laboratories, but it's really not the same thing.
21:33
SPEAKER_02: And then you say that and people still don't understand it.
21:35
SPEAKER_02: So you have to explain it, you know, the the red circle inside.
21:38
SPEAKER_02: Um, so you know, as a B2B company, we couldn't always get the budget size that we would like to promote the brand, you know, like CPG companies do.
21:47
SPEAKER_02: So yeah, it's it's was a journey, um, still is a journey.
21:50
SPEAKER_02: I think they've made huge headway.
21:52
SPEAKER_02: Um, the testing, inspection, and certification industry is not the most well known.
21:57
SPEAKER_02: Um it's not a consumer industry.
22:00
SPEAKER_02: They use all the consumers use all the products.
22:02
SPEAKER_02: Right.
22:02
SPEAKER_02: But it's not like a you know a soap or a detergent that you see advertised on TV all the time.
22:07
SPEAKER_02: So challenge.
22:09
SPEAKER_02: I don't think anybody's cracked it completely, but I think we made great progress.
22:13
SPEAKER_00: I love having people get up and try to share the story of an organization.
22:17
SPEAKER_00: Now, having said that, if if the CEO, as you will, uh the chief marketing officer, chief communicator are the only ones that know the story, then the company really doesn't have one.
22:25
SPEAKER_00: I'm a big believer that across the board, everybody's got to kind of know the story.
22:30
SPEAKER_00: What are we selling?
22:30
SPEAKER_00: What are we telling?
22:31
SPEAKER_00: All that sort of stuff.
22:33
SPEAKER_00: Um, and somebody says, Craig, tell me about your workshop.
22:36
SPEAKER_00: I'll say, okay, in short, one of the biggest things we do is we we create great messages as a collective group, and we create great messengers because I think it's really important to be able to do both those things.
22:48
SPEAKER_00: And marketing is a big part of that.
22:49
SPEAKER_00: It ties to communications.
22:51
SPEAKER_00: So, how important for you is it for employees to understand this is important, believe and trust the company story that you're oh, I think it's so important.
23:02
SPEAKER_02: And I will tell you that that comes naturally.
23:05
SPEAKER_02: Um, when people join the company, they love that we are owned by a nonprofit, they love the history, they love the background.
23:12
SPEAKER_02: So many, even young people, they say that's why they join the organization.
23:15
SPEAKER_02: And when we landed on the term to describe what we do as safety science, it really helped catapult the understanding across the organization.
23:25
SPEAKER_02: So even as we get into AI and cybersecurity, it's about the same thing.
23:29
SPEAKER_02: There's science behind all of it, different kinds of science.
23:33
SPEAKER_02: And it's all about keeping the public safe.
23:36
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, safety science, explaining what we do is say really helps employees understand what we do.
23:43
SPEAKER_02: And I think it's critical that they understand what we do.
23:45
SPEAKER_02: And most of them will tell you that mission, we're still a mission-driven company.
23:50
SPEAKER_02: Um, and that drives employees to join the company and it drives them to stay.
23:53
SPEAKER_02: And we still have employees that have been with the company over 40 years.
23:57
SPEAKER_02: Uh, it's just unheard of, just unheard of.
23:59
SPEAKER_02: Uh, great place to work, great people who work there, and really smart people.
24:05
SPEAKER_01: In addition to hosting this podcast, Craig leads the Cannes Advisory Group, empowering companies and individuals to elevate communication and build brand awareness with bold ideas, lasting impact, and his signature green shoe style.
24:21
SPEAKER_01: From company consulting and team workshops to one-on-one coaching and transformational virtual programs, Can Advisory guides people to communicate with greater clarity, confidence, and impact.
24:35
SPEAKER_01: So whether you're a leader looking to give your team a game-changing one-day experience, or an individual who wants to become a speaker and presenter, people remember, visit CanAdvisory.com.
24:47
SPEAKER_01: And when you connect, mention the Tracks to Success podcast to receive a special discount on Can Advisory Services.
24:55
SPEAKER_01: That's CanAdvisory.com.
24:57
SPEAKER_01: Now, back to the interview.
24:59
SPEAKER_00: Kathy Siegerbrecht is my guest on Tracks to Success, uh, Chief Marketing Officer, sales, global leader, phenomenal storyteller.
25:10
SPEAKER_00: I've already learned that.
25:11
SPEAKER_00: Now, um, you made a little pivot, a little transition within, or or a big promotion from chief marketing officer into leading the Americas.
25:19
SPEAKER_00: Like that, that's a pretty big, that's a pretty big deal.
25:23
SPEAKER_00: I think um sometimes people they they see money and they go, okay, I I gotta take this job, it's a great thing.
25:30
SPEAKER_00: But this was a big opportunity.
25:32
SPEAKER_00: What did you see in the opportunity?
25:34
SPEAKER_00: And and what would you tell people about making big steps like that, big giant steps in your career?
25:41
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so I mean, the full reality was the change was predicated by a change in structure at UL.
25:47
SPEAKER_02: So the CMO position was eliminated.
25:50
SPEAKER_02: Um, it was rolled in completely under the chief commercial officer.
25:53
SPEAKER_03: Okay.
25:53
SPEAKER_02: So it was what else is there to do?
25:56
SPEAKER_02: Um, so working with our chief human resources archives officer and a CEO, this America's role was available.
26:02
SPEAKER_02: And I'll tell you, it's it's intimidating.
26:04
SPEAKER_02: Um, all of the we had an America's leader, a European leader, and an Asia leader, and they are big roles.
26:10
SPEAKER_02: So big teams, all the sites that are in that region you're responsible for.
26:14
SPEAKER_02: I think we have 52 sites when I took it over at the time.
26:17
SPEAKER_02: Um, it's a lot of responsibility, the safety of all those sites, all the things that go into it.
26:21
SPEAKER_02: And of course, you know, supporting all the businesses and their PL and really learning about each individual country in those regions.
26:29
SPEAKER_02: So it was a big job.
26:30
SPEAKER_02: Um, and I just thought, I'm ready for a new challenge.
26:33
SPEAKER_02: I had been in marketing at UL for for eight years, um, almost eight years.
26:38
SPEAKER_02: And I was I was excited about the opportunity to do something different and just expand my own knowledge and learn.
26:44
SPEAKER_02: So it was great to take on a whole new team.
26:47
SPEAKER_02: It was hard to take off my my brand new marketing hat.
26:50
SPEAKER_02: In many ways, I got to keep it on because I always got asked things and I was always prepared to talk about the company.
26:56
SPEAKER_02: So that part really helped transition into this role.
26:59
SPEAKER_02: Um, but really under learning the business side at a deeper level.
27:04
SPEAKER_02: Um, it was a challenge.
27:05
SPEAKER_02: So it was a little bit scary again.
27:07
SPEAKER_02: But but uh I decided uh at my age, I'm like, I can do it.
27:10
SPEAKER_02: You know, you can still teach an old dog a new trick.
27:13
SPEAKER_02: So it was it was really exciting and I enjoyed doing it.
27:15
SPEAKER_02: Did it for almost three years, felt like I got the team to a really good place.
27:20
SPEAKER_02: Um, and then my husband retired last fall and had the opportunity to retire.
27:24
SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, let's enjoy life while I still can.
27:27
SPEAKER_00: Well, that probably gives you a lot of time for reflection.
27:30
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
27:31
SPEAKER_00: So I'm gonna kind of take us uh back to brand and you and all of that as you're as you're climbing, you know, through these different roles.
27:39
SPEAKER_00: Marketing, uh the role you had in marketing, I think prepares somebody to be a great leader for multiple different reasons.
27:47
SPEAKER_00: But um could you identify in your own mind a superpower or something that you feel about yourself that really resonated within an organization or helped you to climb the ladder to greater success in your career as you look back?
28:05
SPEAKER_02: I think I got really good at building teams, um, finding the right talent and putting them together.
28:12
SPEAKER_02: And I, you know, I think about a couple instances where I found the right talent, the functional leaders for the teams on marketing, but they didn't necessarily mesh.
28:20
SPEAKER_02: And that comes the real challenge of leadership, you know, working through the Clifton strengths, working through the personal brands and and doing the hard work of getting leaders to see the value of each other and and how they work together.
28:32
SPEAKER_02: So never was it easy.
28:34
SPEAKER_02: You didn't just hire great people and they loved each other and worked well together.
28:38
SPEAKER_02: But I think that was what I would say that if I look back over all those three companies that you mentioned, I got really good at building teams.
28:46
SPEAKER_00: Did you let me let me interrupt you for a quick second?
28:48
SPEAKER_00: Pardon me.
28:49
SPEAKER_00: Um, did you try to hire the best talent and then plug and play and figure out how you were gonna put the chess pieces together?
28:55
SPEAKER_00: Or did you say, all right, I'm gonna, I'm gonna take this.
28:59
SPEAKER_00: This is what I have.
29:00
SPEAKER_00: I've got these five roles, and I'm gonna find the best person for each of these roles.
29:04
SPEAKER_00: You know what I'm saying?
29:05
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's the latter.
29:07
SPEAKER_02: Certainly later, it's it's the latter because marketing has gotten so specialized.
29:11
SPEAKER_02: So if you're looking for somebody to run digital or you're looking for somebody to run brand, or you're looking for somebody to run content, they are very different people.
29:18
SPEAKER_02: Um, and that's that's you know, kind of the beauty of marketing is it's it's so there's so much depth and it's really fun.
29:25
SPEAKER_02: But yes, people are very specialized.
29:27
SPEAKER_02: And I will say that something else um as a leader is that you've got to continue to learn.
29:32
SPEAKER_02: I was continually challenged as a marketing leader to keep up with all the changes in marketing, you know, with with AI and large language learning models and so much to learn.
29:42
SPEAKER_02: You know, I went online and started taking Stanford offers free courses in AI.
29:46
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, I've got to keep up on this stuff.
29:48
SPEAKER_02: It was hard to keep up with the young people on my team who knew so much more than me, but I'd sit down and talk to them and listen and really try and learn because you can't, you can't not know some of the function.
29:59
SPEAKER_02: You can't know all the detail that all these young people know coming out of a college and MBAs.
30:04
SPEAKER_02: Um, but it was very specialized.
30:06
SPEAKER_02: So I would hire somebody who had that specialty, but then trying to get them to really work together as a team was was the hard work.
30:13
SPEAKER_00: Can a leader be confident in their their talents, which I think you are for sure, but also allow themselves to be vulnerable?
30:22
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think so.
30:23
SPEAKER_02: I I think my my team would would tell you if you went back and asked them about me, um, that's one of the things they would say about me is that I was I was very vulnerable.
30:32
SPEAKER_02: They saw the real me a lot, um, and I didn't hide it.
30:36
SPEAKER_02: I was very transparent, sometimes to a fault, because you know you got to balance that being really strong with just being really honest.
30:44
SPEAKER_02: You know, when you come out of a meeting and something was said and it really hurt, um, or you you just failed.
30:50
SPEAKER_02: You didn't get your point across.
30:52
SPEAKER_02: Um, and just telling the team, maybe so they can help you the next time you go in to tell that story stronger.
30:56
SPEAKER_02: So I definitely um showed my vulnerabilities to my team.
31:00
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, in hindsight, there's probably some times when I took it too far because the team wants to be confident in you.
31:06
SPEAKER_02: But I think finding the right balance is the real trick.
31:09
SPEAKER_02: Most of the time, you know, 80-20 rule, I say 80% of the time I got it right, and it benefited me for them to see the vulnerability.
31:16
SPEAKER_02: And 20% of the time, maybe showed showed my cards a little too much.
31:20
SPEAKER_00: All right, let's have fun with this question then.
31:22
SPEAKER_00: Um, maybe maybe this makes us both more vulnerable, but I think it was a success for sure.
31:27
SPEAKER_00: Uh, UL partners with the LPGA, really partners with global golf, women's golf, which is going to tie me into to where I want to go with this afterwards.
31:36
SPEAKER_00: But um, the UL International Crown team event, eight countries, you know, four players per country.
31:43
SPEAKER_00: I I still remember all the message points.
31:44
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
31:45
SPEAKER_00: You and I did it together for, you know, what, two years as we built toward the first one in 2017.
31:51
SPEAKER_00: So, did you have fun with that?
31:52
SPEAKER_00: Was that like something steering different that UL might not have done before?
31:57
SPEAKER_00: What was your take on that whole thing?
31:58
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it was so fun.
31:59
SPEAKER_02: I mean, definitely the highlight of a career to do something that was so fun yet so impactful.
32:05
SPEAKER_02: Um, I think the biggest takeaway I from that is the experiences we created for customers were just unmatchable, amazing.
32:15
SPEAKER_02: Customers talked about that for years.
32:17
SPEAKER_02: You know, that was 2018.
32:19
SPEAKER_02: I only left in 2026.
32:21
SPEAKER_02: I heard about it every time I talked to a customer who was at that event.
32:24
SPEAKER_02: So creating those customer experiences was really what was most important.
32:28
SPEAKER_02: But we were trying to build our brand globally, right?
32:32
SPEAKER_02: We were growing in Asia and women's golf was big in Asia.
32:35
SPEAKER_02: And so we wanted to share our expertise and safety science and partner with that LPGA brand, which I mentioned earlier was there's such great synergies.
32:44
SPEAKER_02: Um, and and you know, they they love women's golf in Asia and they have they love the LPGA.
32:48
SPEAKER_02: And so we wanted to piggyback on that and and have them learn more about UL and uh and love us too.
32:54
SPEAKER_02: But absolutely, I mean, the possibilities that it brought for our brand and the opportunities to get our message out were fantastic, and it was it was so fun.
33:03
SPEAKER_02: I'll I'll just never forget that.
33:04
SPEAKER_02: I mean, it culminates in a week, but building up to it was was just fantastic.
33:10
SPEAKER_02: I mean, that event in Korea was was wonderful.
33:14
SPEAKER_01: Looking for a guest speaker for your next event or annual conference, Craig brings an inspiring and empowering message your audience won't soon forget.
33:23
SPEAKER_01: Visit Craigcanspeak.com to learn more and hear what audiences are saying about the green shoe experience making an impact at events across the country.
33:33
SPEAKER_01: That's Craigcanspeak.com.
33:36
SPEAKER_01: And when you connect, mention the Tracks to Success podcast to receive a special discount on your event with Craig.
33:42
SPEAKER_01: Now, back to the show.
33:45
SPEAKER_00: Kathy Siegerbrecht, she's my guest, Tracks to Success.
33:48
SPEAKER_00: I want to piggyback off what we were just talking about.
33:51
SPEAKER_00: Um we talked about athletic leaders globally on the female side.
33:56
SPEAKER_00: And I want to talk about you as a corporate leader on the female side.
34:00
SPEAKER_00: Were there ever moments in your career climbing as you did, where you felt you had to work harder, have a louder voice, or watch your steps, any of that sort of stuff?
34:16
SPEAKER_02: I don't think watch my step.
34:18
SPEAKER_02: Um, and I don't think necessarily work harder, but I always worked in male-dominated industries.
34:25
SPEAKER_02: So I think it was different.
34:27
SPEAKER_02: I think, especially starting out in the steel industry, I learned really quickly how to accept the wrong type of comments and not overreact.
34:37
SPEAKER_02: So have very calculated responses and reactions, you know, at BP, a very global company, very, you know, cutting edge.
34:46
SPEAKER_02: So there's there was no no challenge there.
34:48
SPEAKER_02: And and UL is a fantastic company.
34:50
SPEAKER_02: So I wouldn't say necessarily being female, I had to do anything different.
34:54
SPEAKER_02: It was more about myself.
34:56
SPEAKER_02: Um, and I do not want to equate myself to all females, but I would say, like my biggest lesson, um, if I look back all the times that that maybe I I failed or didn't do as well as I could have, it was because I was too nice.
35:09
SPEAKER_02: I was too Kathy female, not everybody else female.
35:13
SPEAKER_02: You know, I think about one project in particular where I had just so many setbacks because the partner that I had on the project, who was supposed to be, you know, working on my behalf with the other organization that we were working with, just didn't do his job.
35:28
SPEAKER_02: Just did not do his job.
35:29
SPEAKER_02: And he did it intentionally because it was hard.
35:32
SPEAKER_02: And I would be the one that would take the brunt on phone calls and I'd be like, what?
35:36
SPEAKER_02: You don't know what?
35:37
SPEAKER_02: Because this person didn't do their job.
35:39
SPEAKER_02: And I never called him out on it.
35:41
SPEAKER_02: And I never went back and you know, told his leader, you know, I took the my, you know, my credibility took the hit for it over and over.
35:48
SPEAKER_02: And there were a lot of those examples.
35:49
SPEAKER_02: So um I think standing up for myself is something that that I should have done more of and could have done differently, nothing huge and overly significant, but that was my my female side coming out.
36:02
SPEAKER_02: And again, I don't equate that with all women.
36:04
SPEAKER_02: So that's just me.
36:06
SPEAKER_00: Well, I've got two fantastic daughters.
36:08
SPEAKER_00: So these types of conversations I think are are very real and um and things that can help people moving forward because there are so many opportunities and so many impressive young ladies out there.
36:20
SPEAKER_00: So I think giving some advice is great.
36:22
SPEAKER_00: Aside from kind of being yourself, what advice would you give for somebody who has aspirations?
36:29
SPEAKER_00: You didn't know you did when you first started, but has aspirations or or see themselves starting to climb to reach the executive level?
36:37
SPEAKER_02: Um, so if you go back to the women aspect of it, I would say actually, you know, for sure, find women's networks.
36:45
SPEAKER_02: It's always interesting, right, that there's not necessarily men's networks, there's women's networks.
36:49
SPEAKER_02: But, you know, when I became uh CMO, there's a women's network in Chicago called the Chicago Network.
36:55
SPEAKER_02: And you have to be C-suite, you have to report to CEO, and it's a women's network, and it's just phenomenal.
37:01
SPEAKER_02: The camaraderie that you get and the support that you get and the learnings that you get that I got from that women's group, like never ending.
37:09
SPEAKER_02: I mean, helped me get my first board position, helped me prepare for my first board position.
37:14
SPEAKER_02: And um, there's so much that you get from women supporting women.
37:17
SPEAKER_02: So finding women's network, I think for women as we move up in organizations, um, are really, really, really important.
37:25
SPEAKER_02: Um, I think, you know, your network would be the next, and it's kind of piggybacks off that, but I think the network is the most important thing you can do.
37:32
SPEAKER_02: Consciously think every week, every month, how am I building my network?
37:37
SPEAKER_02: And that's for everybody.
37:39
SPEAKER_02: Because it's work, right?
37:40
SPEAKER_02: You get caught up in your job.
37:41
SPEAKER_02: You love your job, and then when you leave your job, you're caught up in your personal life.
37:45
SPEAKER_02: But you should conscientiously think about there should be a list, whether it's written down or not, your networking list, and you should keep up with those people.
37:53
SPEAKER_02: Um, I tell that to my sons all the time.
37:55
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, have you caught up with so-and-so?
37:57
SPEAKER_02: And he was a great, you know, resource for you.
37:59
SPEAKER_02: Don't lose touch with that network.
38:02
SPEAKER_02: You know, if if I go back and think about, you know, what powered my career, you know, it's that network.
38:07
SPEAKER_02: And I've got an amazing electronic role uh rollodeck.
38:11
SPEAKER_02: So I think network is probably one of the more important things I would say, you know, connect, connect, connect, and stay in touch with that network.
38:18
SPEAKER_00: Bob Bodeen was a guest on this program, executive search firm Eastman and Bodeen.
38:23
SPEAKER_00: He was phenomenal.
38:24
SPEAKER_00: He's written two books.
38:25
SPEAKER_00: One of them is called The Power of Who.
38:27
SPEAKER_00: And he basically says, you know, all the people you need in your network.
38:31
SPEAKER_00: You just have to use them.
38:32
SPEAKER_00: And by and large, most people are very excited to help.
38:35
SPEAKER_00: You need to use the word help over, could you do a favor?
38:38
SPEAKER_00: It's different.
38:39
SPEAKER_00: And there's a mindset attached to that.
38:41
SPEAKER_00: I think that that's really important.
38:43
SPEAKER_00: And I I actually spend time with up and coming TV personalities, talent, etc.
38:49
SPEAKER_00: And I always say, All right, if you want to get to the network, you got to network your way to the network, stay in touch with people.
38:55
SPEAKER_00: It's a very small industry, and all industries are small.
38:58
SPEAKER_00: So you you've described yourself as a lifelong learner.
39:02
SPEAKER_00: I think we all learn things over time.
39:05
SPEAKER_00: How did you you just said you were like trying to learn AI.
39:09
SPEAKER_00: So do you still keep trying to learn, even though you're retired?
39:13
SPEAKER_00: I mean, how do you keep learning along the way when you're so busy with your job?
39:17
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um, you find the time.
39:20
SPEAKER_02: So I make the time.
39:21
SPEAKER_02: And then I did have courses I was looking at.
39:24
SPEAKER_02: I never got to them, but towards the end, especially, I was looking at courses at a junior college.
39:29
SPEAKER_02: But um, through that Chicago network that I mentioned, I did a lot of learning through that group.
39:35
SPEAKER_02: They would have events and you would learn about different things.
39:37
SPEAKER_02: You would learn about different people's career, um, learn about board opportunities.
39:42
SPEAKER_02: So that network especially enabled me the opportunity to keep learning, but it's through the network.
39:47
SPEAKER_02: You know, you keep talking to people and you're informally learning.
39:50
SPEAKER_02: So you're having lunch with somebody or having dinner or drinks with somebody or learning about their job and the challenges they face in the marketplace, and you ultimately learn something.
39:58
SPEAKER_02: Um, so I think it's about looking at every opportunity when you talk to someone in your network.
40:03
SPEAKER_02: What can you learn from that and reflecting on it?
40:07
SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, one of the things that I took as a practice every week was to set aside a few hours at the end of the week.
40:13
SPEAKER_02: Now, of course, you missed a week here and there, but a few hours at the end of Friday.
40:17
SPEAKER_02: And if the week ended on Thursday, it was the end of Thursday to really reflect on the week and and what when you know what the actions you had or the simple thing, right?
40:25
SPEAKER_02: What did you need to follow up on?
40:27
SPEAKER_02: But but what did you learn and what are you going to do with that?
40:30
SPEAKER_02: So, did you learn something about a person that you can move forward?
40:34
SPEAKER_02: Do they need some help with something?
40:36
SPEAKER_02: Um, are they a good candidate for a job that might be open?
40:39
SPEAKER_02: What did you learn?
40:40
SPEAKER_02: Is there a problem in the company, you know, an employee satisfaction thing that you need to act upon and move forward?
40:46
SPEAKER_02: So I always did have that lens of what did I learn this week on behalf of the company that I need to do something with?
40:53
SPEAKER_00: You and I are on the same page on so many different things because at the end of the week at four o'clock, not five, I spend an hour and I look back.
41:01
SPEAKER_00: Did I accomplish the things I set out to accomplish Sunday night?
41:04
SPEAKER_00: Not Monday morning, Sunday night.
41:05
SPEAKER_00: Right.
41:06
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
41:06
SPEAKER_00: What are my successes this week?
41:08
SPEAKER_00: What can I be proud of as I go to happy hour or go hang out with my friends or whatever I do on the weekend?
41:13
SPEAKER_00: I think that's really important.
41:15
SPEAKER_00: So let's wrap it up with a couple of final questions.
41:18
SPEAKER_00: And and one of them being a look back.
41:20
SPEAKER_00: Um, after four decades, you're basically, you know, calling it quits.
41:26
SPEAKER_00: But I I think I know you to know you're you probably aren't going to call it quits, and I'll get to that in a second.
41:30
SPEAKER_00: But maybe not.
41:31
SPEAKER_00: How did you know it was officially the right time to close the corporate chapter?
41:36
SPEAKER_02: It was a really difficult decision.
41:39
SPEAKER_02: Um, I didn't know it was the right time.
41:42
SPEAKER_02: I had no idea.
41:42
SPEAKER_02: They just, you know, you all had the opportunity for early retirement.
41:46
SPEAKER_02: And I went, hmm, interesting.
41:49
SPEAKER_02: And a bell just went off.
41:51
SPEAKER_02: And I came home and I asked my husband, and he said, Yeah, let's do it.
41:55
SPEAKER_02: It was, it was simple, weird and simple.
41:58
SPEAKER_02: The day before, nope, going strong, got all kinds of meetings planned.
42:02
SPEAKER_02: All things we had a meeting coming up in California, my presentation already.
42:06
SPEAKER_02: And and something just went off.
42:07
SPEAKER_02: And I said, you know what?
42:08
SPEAKER_02: Life is short.
42:10
SPEAKER_02: You never know what you got coming your way.
42:11
SPEAKER_02: I called the financial planner, said, Does this work?
42:14
SPEAKER_02: I said, If I re I was actually going to retire next year anyway.
42:17
SPEAKER_02: And I said, if I retire a year early, do I have to die a year early?
42:20
SPEAKER_02: Do I have enough money?
42:22
SPEAKER_02: And he said, It works, you're good.
42:23
SPEAKER_02: And I don't, there was just something, I don't know, maybe you know, Laura will tell me something in a few years that there was a reason I retired early.
42:30
SPEAKER_02: But I went in the next day and made the decision, and I was literally gone in a couple of weeks.
42:34
SPEAKER_02: It was so simple.
42:36
SPEAKER_02: So I can't really explain it to you.
42:37
SPEAKER_02: Intuition of some sort, divine intervention.
42:40
SPEAKER_02: But the opportunity presented itself and I took it and I've never looked back.
42:45
SPEAKER_02: And I told myself I'm not going to do anything until the fall.
42:48
SPEAKER_02: So we have a lake house and we did some remodeling at our house up there and enjoying the lake.
42:52
SPEAKER_02: And uh, and my youngest son's getting married next spring, and so doing some things, but in the fall, I'll think about if there's there's something new um that I want to do or how I'm gonna keep myself busy.
43:02
SPEAKER_00: Oh well, maybe I can find a way to give you I got a couple ideas already.
43:07
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
43:08
SPEAKER_00: Um, what do you miss most?
43:10
SPEAKER_00: And what would you tell people that they need to enjoy more while they are working?
43:18
SPEAKER_02: Um, I miss that, you know, when you I've heard you talk on your other shows about defining success.
43:24
SPEAKER_02: So I was thinking about how I define success, and it's it's this ability to have an impact.
43:30
SPEAKER_02: Um, and that's what I miss.
43:31
SPEAKER_02: I mean, I know I have an impact at home, you know, with my friends and my family, but I miss those results.
43:37
SPEAKER_02: I miss having an impact.
43:39
SPEAKER_02: And I miss the people that I worked with, walking down the hall saying hello to everybody, seeing so many people.
43:44
SPEAKER_02: Now I do have a great friend network and a big family.
43:47
SPEAKER_02: So I see people all the time.
43:49
SPEAKER_02: Um, but having those different kinds of conversations about work and business, I miss that a little bit of that intellectual stimulation on a different level.
43:59
SPEAKER_02: But I I think the most I miss um I miss making a difference.
44:03
SPEAKER_02: I really enjoyed that.
44:04
SPEAKER_02: And it was it was very gratifying.
44:06
SPEAKER_02: I woke up every day, you know, with something I a purpose that I knew I was gonna fulfill.
44:11
SPEAKER_02: And I worked hard to do that.
44:12
SPEAKER_02: And I came home gratified, you know, for what I accomplished.
44:15
SPEAKER_02: So it's a bit of a, you know, it just has a gap.
44:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
44:19
SPEAKER_00: Success is is like defined differently by a lot of different people.
44:22
SPEAKER_00: And I think impact is is one of the biggest things.
44:25
SPEAKER_00: And you just talked about it.
44:26
SPEAKER_00: And you actually said it early on when we started this conversation.
44:29
SPEAKER_00: So I'm gonna leave everybody with this kind of final question that I think you can really leave a mark with people.
44:35
SPEAKER_00: Um for somebody who wants to advance, has big aspirations, but feels overlooked, right?
44:44
SPEAKER_00: How do they get there?
44:47
SPEAKER_00: What would you tell them that would inspire them to keep going when they feel like nobody's noticing them?
44:55
SPEAKER_02: So I can I can think of somebody I mentored that felt that exact way.
44:58
SPEAKER_02: So it's back to defining your personal brand, understanding your strengths, and decide what you do with those.
45:05
SPEAKER_02: How do you get that message out?
45:06
SPEAKER_02: And it's networking.
45:08
SPEAKER_02: Um, and this person is doing a great job of networking and asking everybody they network with to help them connect.
45:14
SPEAKER_02: But in this case, you know, then you need to know what it is you're trying to get to.
45:18
SPEAKER_02: So you want to get noticed.
45:19
SPEAKER_02: Is it that you want to get noticed for a certain job?
45:22
SPEAKER_02: Um, and in many cases, you have to leave the company to get noticed and get promoted.
45:27
SPEAKER_02: Um, and I think many people find that in most companies, fortunate or unfortunate.
45:31
SPEAKER_02: And at UL, we find a lot of people come back.
45:34
SPEAKER_02: So they left for a title somewhere else and they come back because they love it.
45:37
SPEAKER_02: So we have a lot of boomerangers.
45:39
SPEAKER_02: But so I think getting noticed is about being really clear who you are and that what you bring as a differentiator and starting to network who needs to know about your differentiator and what do you want to do with it?
45:51
SPEAKER_02: Is it a job that you're trying to get to?
45:52
SPEAKER_02: I think what's frustrating the most as a leader when somebody tells you they want a title.
45:57
SPEAKER_02: I want a director job.
45:58
SPEAKER_02: To what end?
45:59
SPEAKER_02: Why do you want a director job?
46:01
SPEAKER_02: It's not about director title, it's about what you want to do.
46:04
SPEAKER_02: It's back to having that impact.
46:06
SPEAKER_02: You know, what's the legacy that you want to leave?
46:08
SPEAKER_02: So it's not easy.
46:09
SPEAKER_02: And I think the answer is different for everyone.
46:11
SPEAKER_02: So I'm not sure that I answered it succinctly, but it's certainly about introspection, and then it's about doing the hard work, having a plan and doing the hard work.
46:20
SPEAKER_00: Well, all these things are so valuable to people.
46:23
SPEAKER_00: I I knew this was going to be this way when I said, Hey, Kathy, I know you got a little time.
46:29
SPEAKER_00: Could you carve out an hour?
46:30
SPEAKER_00: Could you carve out a half hour, whatever?
46:32
SPEAKER_00: Um, I'm really thrilled we got to spend the time together.
46:35
SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much for all the insight, the storytelling, and you made a big impact on me in a short time.
46:41
SPEAKER_00: And I'm glad we're still connected.
46:43
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
46:43
SPEAKER_02: Thrilled to do it.
46:44
SPEAKER_02: My pleasure to talk to you.
46:45
SPEAKER_02: I love your show.
46:46
SPEAKER_02: I follow it all the time.
46:47
SPEAKER_02: And you're a great leader and very inspirational.
46:50
SPEAKER_02: And I'm happy to have a little bit of time with you.
46:51
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
46:52
SPEAKER_00: Thanks, Kathy.
46:54
SPEAKER_00: One last segment I call Getting Ahead, which is focused on you and your own Tracks to Success.
47:02
SPEAKER_00: It's brought to you by Ahead, the finest in headwear and the official headwear of the Tracks to Success podcast.
47:09
SPEAKER_00: Available at AheadUSAShop.com.
47:13
SPEAKER_00: For listeners of this show, Ahead is giving one of its biggest discounts ever.
47:18
SPEAKER_00: Visit AheadUSAShop.com now and use the code TTS30.
47:24
SPEAKER_00: That's TTS30 and receive not 20% off your purchase, but 30% ahead.
47:32
SPEAKER_00: They don't follow the trends.
47:34
SPEAKER_00: For more than 30 years, they've been setting them.
47:37
SPEAKER_00: Hope you enjoyed the conversation with Kathy.
47:40
SPEAKER_00: Um, you heard her story, four decades of growth, global leadership, powerful brands, countless people.
47:48
SPEAKER_00: She had the opportunity to lead, mentor, and support.
47:52
SPEAKER_00: But one of the most important lessons of her career actually came at the very beginning.
47:58
SPEAKER_00: Listen first.
47:59
SPEAKER_00: Yes, listen first.
48:02
SPEAKER_00: And it's a lesson that every leader can actually use because we often believe that leadership starts with having all the answers.
48:09
SPEAKER_00: And that's not necessarily the case.
48:11
SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it starts with asking a better question.
48:15
SPEAKER_00: We think influence comes from speaking.
48:18
SPEAKER_00: Well, sometimes it comes from making another person feel heard.
48:22
SPEAKER_00: And we believe trust is built through a great message, but often trust is built around something before the message, through curiosity, empathy, and genuine interest in somebody else.
48:36
SPEAKER_00: So here's something to think about as you look to get ahead.
48:40
SPEAKER_00: Are you listening to understand or simply waiting for your turn to speak?
48:45
SPEAKER_00: Because the best leaders don't enter every conversation trying to prove how much they know.
48:51
SPEAKER_00: They enter first, ready to discover what they don't know.
48:55
SPEAKER_00: So listen first, learn something, build the relationship, and then use what you've heard to help somebody else move forward.
49:03
SPEAKER_00: That's how you build trust, that's how you build impact.
49:06
SPEAKER_00: Do that, and your tracks to success will be a whole lot easier.
49:11
SPEAKER_00: Hope you enjoyed the interview.
49:12
SPEAKER_00: I'm Craig Cann.
49:14
SPEAKER_00: Until next time, take care.
49:17
SPEAKER_01: Don't forget to subscribe for more great interviews and Craig's insights on reaching your highest personal and professional summit.
49:24
SPEAKER_01: Listen to Tracks to Success on all the top podcast platforms.
49:29
SPEAKER_01: Watch it on the Craig Cannes YouTube channel and visit CraigCanspeak.com to learn more about Craig as your next speaker.