Latest / Ecosistemas / Ecosistema de la identidad de los caídos en Malvinas - Invitada: Gabriela Naso

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Ecosistema de la identidad de los caídos en Malvinas - Invitada: Gabriela Naso · Ecosistemas

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Hello from ecosystems. We send a fraternal greeting to all radio environment staff,
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the National Federation of Health Workers and its Secretary, Carlos Adamo, for allowing
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them to be part of this great family that is radio ecosystem environment under the
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prism of polyhedron. How today' s world works, increasingly complex, more
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uncertain, changing, seemingly chaotic, a world of all against all or all
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for all. Not one thing or the other. The world operates in a
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delicate balance of interacting ecosystems. I propose that you think together about how these
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ecosystems work. A small pocket manual, perhaps just a bunch of thoughts and
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reflections that allow us to accommodate, order, orient, understand how we work
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in these hyper- informed and communicated societies, where it is hard for us
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to discover their senses and motives every day. I invite you to listen and
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discover together these ecosystems in which we are often inserted without wanting to be part
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of them and which, however, are part of our daily struggles and disappointments
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and under the prism of polyhedron, because every ecosystem is composed of different faces
1:38
or sides, with its vertices and particularities. Unity in diversity, where the
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whole is superior to the parties, the agreement superior to the conflict the reality
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is imposed on the idea and time in space. This will allow us to
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build a sustainable world, in an environment or full of humanity, in harmony
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with the unique nature that protects our existence and the generations to come welcome.
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There are ecosystems under the prism of polyhedron When forty- two years of the
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conflict in the South Atlantic were fulfilled, we saw among the official acts that
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our President left a flower offering supposedly the unknown soldier, and I reflected and
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thought it is likely that the gestation of having crossed the Andes or of the
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wars of Independence will lead us to that still and surely for eternity we will
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have that idea of the unknown soldiers, of those forgers of our homeland,
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who crossed the Andes with San Martín, those who fought in Ayohuma, in
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the battle of Salta with Belgrano. But our Malvinas soldiers, forty- two
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years later, continued to pay a floral tribute to an unknown soldier involved for
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me a subject that is pending and that we cannot overlook. I know that
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this program is a program that is perhaps very particular for my own history,
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because I was a part of it and I am a proud part of the
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Malvin generation. If I was mobilized to the theatre of operations at that time
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and I had companions who did not return and I follow closely a little as
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these demalvinizing and malvinizing moments that we have suffered during these forty- two years
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evolve. But to think of the identity of the fallen comrades who remained there
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in Malvinas led me to be able to contact someone who in these days is
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presenting a book that is called shards in memory and that has to do precisely
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with an anthropological work, but at the same time from the perspective of human
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rights and from the struggle of the ex- combatants who returned to fulfill the
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slogan of giving name and surname to each of the comrades who remained on the
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islands. That is why it is very pleasant and I am very happy that
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Gabriela Anasso is here with us in ecosystems, in this ecosystem of the identity
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of the fallen in Malvina, for the memory of those who fought in the
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Falkland Islands. Gaby' s welcome. Thank you very much, hello,
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Luis, thank you so much for having me. We would very much like
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to enjoy this great challenge. You did a splendid job together with Torres,
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along with Victoria Torres, and you got into a very complex subject. We
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know that who we are or veterans, I' m fighters or whatever,
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because well, there are interns, there are some who blushe for more,
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others who better not that these things are known. Let' s say there
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' s a whole internal one that I' d like to light up here
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in ecosystems, right in this ecosystem. But besides, I' m fascinated
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that your youth has you. I' m not gonna tell her age,
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but you were born in' 90s. Yes, yes, you have,
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we can say the quiet age bootily, but I say the war of yours.
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It was ten years before you ever had that conscience. Yeah, yeah.
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Besides, my knowledge of the subject was limited to school events. It
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was evil in terms of gesteroic and there was no more. In my case,
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my dad didn' t do compulsory military service because he was class fifty
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- seven. Then, with the change, it was exempted and it was
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a universe that was very alien to me until I approached through journalistic research.
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And that' s where you had this worry about getting in to work together
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with the ex- combatants. I want to tell you first that Gabriela holds
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a degree in journalism from Lomas de Zamora National University, Quilmes. Yes,
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master of documentary journalism at the National University of February 3. As an investigative
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journalist and audiovisual filmmaker. He specializes in human rights issues and in Malvinas and
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is currently working on the development of a documentary film. I hope we see
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it soon on crimes of that humanity, the Malvinas war. That' s
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another one of the subjects that everyone hides because they talk about the fallen of
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the dead in combat and sometimes there are exceptional situations that occurred and many are
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no more than one. There are questions of death that are not specific to
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combat. I' m also going to use this space to confess to you
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something that has to do with what we were living at the time, but
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we' re going to do it later. For now I don' t
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want to get the focus of this on how you were impacted by Falklands and
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why you got into this dance. I put them there by the end of
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two thousand sixteen. I contacted Ernesto Alonso, Secretary of Human Rights of Sim
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La Plata, the Center for Former Combatants, precisely because I was writing an
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article on identification process and at that time I spoke to Arnesto. I spoke
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with the hieronym of Rei Iraola, the sucim' s lawyer I spoke with
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Honorma Gómez, sister of the fallen soldier Eduardo Gómez and a tireless fighter for
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the identification of the Argentine soldiers. And that' s what the article was
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like back then I was writing for the News Agency at the University of Lomas.
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Yes with all the batteries, with all the batteries and feeling that that
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agency and the approach to human rights issues were my contribution to the society to
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return, because society go with the public university. Then it was my beautiful
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contribution. And once he' s in the article, I kept in touch
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with Ernesto and he told me about the existence of the cause. One thousand
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seven hundred and seventy- seven two thousand seven who is based in the Federal
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Court of Rio Grande, in Tierra del Fuego, which investigates the torments,
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abuses and threats suffered by the conscripted soldiers, let us go from their superiors
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in the war. And from there, I got in. I went with
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that thesis subject. I presented the documentary projects that this year we will premiere
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the voices of silence, if possible in the middle of the year. And
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I got in and in and out and I stayed and embraced the Malvinas cause
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and I got into it from a human rights perspective, which is what is
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reflected in the book. And this book comes out at the beginning of two
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thousand and twenty- two. Through that simple silver, I met Victoria Torres,
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who is from another generation, is a little older. That lived and
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the CCM fighters were their neighbors. Of course, then we came to malines
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from different sides, from different generations and as we did in the importance of
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telling this story. To me it was something that I had always stayed in
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the inkwell. I devoted myself to the cause of torture, but the process
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of identification was something that I arrived at. I insist back from me and
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that fight and everything I saw later with the government of Mauricio Macrie. They
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were set aside and their struggle was set aside. Then it seemed to me,
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with Miki, that it was a contribution of the construction of collective memory,
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to rescue this story and also a demand of that struggle, because it
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is a struggle that begins at the end of the war. Of course,
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you narrate it very well in the book chapter three, specifically that it is
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the one that speaks of Darwin' s cemetery and the unknown soldier. Let
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' s say you propose that when the children who return, the soldiers who
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return, have this anxiety of power from that moment, to be able to
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give name and surname to those who had not returned and who did not know
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at that time that they had passed, because no one explained to the relatives
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where they had remained. Only they realized that one had not returned and from
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there began a search to know where he might be, in which hospital or,
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if he was detained, if he had stayed there. Let' s
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just say it was crazy. That was the armed forces, the State terrorism
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that did not take charge of notifying the families and that did not take charge
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either but to give him the necessary elements for identification in case of fall had
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no plates. Even this adds up to the idea. Nor were there plates
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like the ones we see from World War II. The chapita that is divided
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into two and that part remains in the body. There weren' t many
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who gave them the blood- group pipe and tried to record the number of
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documents. Ah, look at that Several stories come up. Wow. Wow.
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And then, besides, if you want to add something, it'
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s that they gave you a sheet, you wrote certain things that they asked
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you to write in the squadron when you came back and then you had to
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keep quiet about what was going on in Malvinas and you couldn' t spread
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it unless it was a heroic fact. That' s how the armed outbacks
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expect them to receive the soldiers. In the case of the units that were
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in Buenos Aires, in Campo de Mayo and where this recommendation card came with
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the drop Mira, what do I know, where do you live, Mira,
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I know who your parents are, who your brothers are. And under
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those conditions they wrote and some denounced very bravely and others put generalities. But,
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as you well say, it was also this reception of only we can
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talk about heroic acts and from there we begin to build this epic discourse of
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the armed forces, which is with the descent of the ex- combatants,
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which is with the media, starts a whole construction that we know that yes
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demanding in something is to revisit the bora, because that is why it makes
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me so happy that your generation is not taking this flag that later I was
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going to ask you if you are considered a toad from another well. Let
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us say but let this generation of yours relive, because it implies that war
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is alive again as we question what happened with other eyes and with another context,
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because we would have to think about what was happening at that time,
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with the context of what the armed forces were at that time and just when
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we came from a repressive state, with a high violence and a blatant action
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on each of us, because those customs that they had to mistreat, torture
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elas were a way of their own way of moving. It was not a
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naturalization of the violence in compulsory military service, beyond the fact that we find
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in a continuity in the practices of torture in clandestine centres and in the islands
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these adapted practices. I' m talking about poaching. I' m talking
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about au Helada, I' m talking about picana with three fans, campaigning,
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beatings of all kinds. It also occurs in the case of sexants who
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are killed in the Falklands. And when one reflects on why, because there
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are victims who still do not denounce similar torments, there was a naturalization of
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the violence of military service. This thing about going to do in military service,
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that you' re going to become more little man by force of blows,
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torments, look even at me happened to me. I was telling you
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that my thesis was about human rights violations. A friend I showed the material
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to a half- length film and she tells me I just realized that what
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happened to my dad in military service was torture. My dad got mugged for
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picking up food from military service. Return more the indifference of your people than
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the purest of the enemy. I wonder what was going on in the mind
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of the infamous one who is cold enough to take one out of luo s
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or some naive and forgotten pasture. They took you out of your house,
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and without a coat, they stretched you out in the warm wind. They
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gave you weapons you didn' t know, which hopefully worked every now and
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then in a hole you were in. You repeated the songs you thought you
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had forgotten, you didn' t know it was to feel so far away
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or that hunger ate your guts. There was only one brother' s gaze
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with the same uncertainty in his gaze. It' ll be less forever.
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Forever to be honored forever our heroes you weary and forever will be heroes.
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They' ll always be heroes. In case they always deny Buenos Aires currents
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and the chaco from Córdoba and Mendoza de la pampa from all the Argentine provinces,
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they took them to make a paper and courage. It was what they
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showed one, two, three, four enemies, the English who came prepared
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Frio Handre and those who Argentines gave inderible soura of that story that dreamt of
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perpetuating in the Ronnada of drinking would have been immediately other parents of the Great
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Plaza de bar Fuere forever hill, poor, premeter, zero is of Falklands
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is, by the way, to be heroes. For they are de arroro,
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for man, thou shalt not see thee evil, or return the indifference
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of thy people more than the most voracious band of the enemy. A dead
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hero shoulders on the front that on the battlefield of oblivion will already remain in
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sentinel dogs. If I give up or wait for one day if blood runs,
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go back to the white cherries to plan all those Argentine lands for siertas
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in arebes. By the way, blacksmith is forever our heroes of Malvina,
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by certain heroes forever dinnerers, forever our heroes in evil will see that by
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the way, the sa heroes of the mountains, the gazebo is, by
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the way, the locksmith is forever our heroes of Malvins, with Cirus and
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Persians to think of those heroes of Malvins we are with Gabriel Anazo in this
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ecosystem about the memory of the fallen in Malvinas and the violation of human rights
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that happened and that even today there is an open cause, as you well
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say, in a federal court in Rio Grande. Perhaps because it is in
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Rio Grande, we have no idea of this situation, but it is in
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full process, even research. I told you I wanted to confess something to
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our platoon. We were about forty, also mobilized to the south, with
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the possibility of going to the Falkland Islands. Among the soldiers, we did
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military service, hemo- accused, we had an agreement. First we were
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going to shoot our lieutenant and then we were going to shoot any Englishman that
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you wanted to attack the moment at me, but it was hard to say,
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but the deal we had, that is, the situation of abuse that
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we were living was leading us to think first about who we had, who
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was our worst enemy. That question not that about flying many is fighters.
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Who is the enemy and how many wars there are. The war against the
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British and the war against the superiors themselves. In the book of very interesting
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accounts of the former combatants of the people of the Cécito and you could go
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with each of them putting together the puzzle yes, especially the good part.
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The book begins with the battle of Mount London, Yes, one of the
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most tremendous, not one of the storms. Yes, and from that battle
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on, the British Britons thought that in two hours they would take Mount London,
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which was a strategic point, because it is the highest elevation of the
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PSI. It has a panoramic view to be able to observe Argentine port.
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Even not clear, then they thought in two hours they would take it.
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And it' s a fight that' s been going on all night.
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And from that combat, the ulteriors cease to be body to body and become
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at a distance eleven and twelve June of eighty- two. Sure, well,
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we started the afternoon of the 11th with a former fighter who' s
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in charge of a radar that' s a boy to kill that he'
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s doing. They send him to make a sweep of the ground and he
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notices because the raal had been in the same position for days and he notices
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something different on that sweep and informs his superior that the superior tells him that
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is nothing. They' re branches that move, as the superior tells you.
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No, don' t do it, don' t worry. Besides,
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there are no blue trees in Falklands. Not this one, too.
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That was the preparation, and that night the British attack. And it was
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a lot of rebuilding the puzzle of what happened tonight. Speaking of the battle
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proper and the retreat of the return to the continent, I had an advantage
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that is I know them many years ago. Then that allowed me to go
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much deeper, ask questions, go to each other. There' s some
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data to check their testimonies with the documents. It was a very, very
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crafty job. And it adds that later, when the first humanitarian journey was
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made in the ninety- one, they learn that many of the bodies that
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had been buried in Montilondon himself, let' s say, had been transferred
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to Darwin' s cemetery. Yes, they, after the battle, a
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group of survivors are taken prisoner and forced to bury their companions with the few
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forces they had. And this is not only the product of combat, but
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also of advanced malnutrition due to the food grabbing that was on the part of
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the superiors. Soldiers had to taste food, that is, hunting a sheep
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by going to the village to fetch it or taking it out of the tents
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of these superiors who seized it. And that was what, if discovered,
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caused the answer. It was torture, yes, yes, harsh sanctions.
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Then, in these conditions, they buried their companions and recently, as you
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say in the ninety- one, when the relatives travel, that many relatives
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also found out before traveling or even in the cemetery, that their children,
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that their brothers were not identified. They too begin to rebuild there with the
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family' s account, with some press release, especially when they have the
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possibility to return to the islands and visit the cemetery. In two thousand five,
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two thousand six, how the group of anthropologists of Argentina begins to play
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in this work of the International Red Cross, which is the one that promotes
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in some way as a link so that they can travel to take out the
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samples and to develop all the work, in addition to checking the DNA and
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relatives how that is given. Tell me a little good. The ELAF is
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contacted in principle at the end of the eighty- seven by the Sesen and
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La Plata. They consulted them to see what contribution forensic anthropology could make to
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identify those remains that they had buried, because until then, as we said
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a little while ago, they did not know that they had been transferred to
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cement. That is, they ask to identify those of Monte London, those
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of Monte London and those of others buried on other battlefields, but not back.
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His restlessness is constant. They feel that they have a lot to do
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with what happened to their companies and in two thousand eight they travel to the
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islands and display this flag that is the photo in the book, where they
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recognize themselves as victims of the dictatorship and what they say is there can be
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no n es. In this cemetery. Two years later, they contact Alejo
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Ramos Padilla or federal judge. Then, counsel from the Human Rights Secretariat contacted
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each other about the torture case, because they were in a critical state.
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And at that meeting, Ramás Padilla asks them, well, what other issues
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they are with and they tell them about this outstanding debt, about the identification
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of their comrades, which was a request they didn' t know how to
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deal with, because it wasn' t a request to make to the British
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state. So, well, Ramos Padilla designs the legal strategy. They travel
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to Chaco, they know relatives, because what had to be was this desire
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of relatives to know the fate of their loved ones. That' s how
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it' s like family members had ownership of the right. Yes, beyond
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the fact that there is a sense of brotherhood among the former combatants and with
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those who have fallen, they then present on August 2nd, two thousand eleven,
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an appeal for amparo in the federal justice system, asking that the Argentine
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State articulate all the necessary means to achieve identification and that same day they go
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to the courthouse and go to Casa Rosada. They present all the documentation and
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a letter addressed to Cristina Fernández de Kilchner and on April 2nd of the following
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year, this subject is taken by the President of the Nation and on April
26:38
2nd of the following year soa already announces that she sent to the International Red
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Cross in a letter asking him to intercede as an intermediary in an austral before
26:48
Great Britain. Previously there and get back to your question. There was the
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contact of the national state with the EA to see if this was possible,
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of how to order that request and the Red Cross accepts. What he asks
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is that there be a significant number of relatives who agree, who give their
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consent and adn sample So an interdisciplinary team is set up, where there was
27:12
a discussion there because there was a sector that didn' t agree very much
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that they could identify them. Yes, there was a group of relatives,
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especially linked to the Family Commission, who opposed it, who said that this
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was going to be a festival of bones, that if to the relatives that
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ran down the cemetery a river that was carried to the bones, it was
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a whole grave, that they would lose the pension? That they were going
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to lose their pension? They accept mine. I do a parenthesis here,
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because it must also be said that Argentina, in these years of democracy,
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faced with the impossibility of judging, asked justice to be in charge of being
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able to know the truth. And I think that we are also quite novel
28:04
from the legal point of view and from the memory. Let' s not
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say. It doesn' t matter if we can put someone in jail or
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not, but I want to know someone' s fate and for that I
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think it' s just and necessary to be able to know what happened to
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that person. These are the legal precedents that allow the application of amparo ajácra
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that began in the country with a view to the repression of the State at
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the time of the dictatorship, but that are also used in this case,
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that is, there are binding vessels all the time between the dictatorship. Or
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what happened to the missing and fallen in Malvinas is that Malvinas is part of
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the dictatorship. The dictatorship resorted to Malvinas with a strategy to perpetuate itself in
28:47
power. To think Malvinas in a human rights perspective is to think about it
28:52
in the context of the dictatorship and we talked about torture a while ago.
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We cannot draw these bridges between what happened in the clandestine centres on the continent
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and what happened on the islands, because they were the same armed forces.
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It is not that on April 2, the one who was a torturer in
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ESMA woke up to Malvinas hero. Gabriel Naso is with us and now Fito
29:18
Paez. The song of the soldier and Rosita. Thunder steps or shine the
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skies xut calluses far away. We got wet in the bros. We were
30:37
glorious the Pichisios. Oh, the sea that surrounds us marma, do not
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miss the free one that we went today. No one in Sama is more
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to me when I came back Rosida, I step my children among their hard
32:00
good, already unfunct to change my world. What it is or love non
32:17
if it is that the war sacenña not being love, I feel nothing.
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I want to sleep a cava that noble, not that we don' t
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want you rostao I swear that nut humb sou is ecosystem of the memory of
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the soldiers fallen in Malvinas. We are with Gabriela Naso is a pleasure the
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author of shards in memory can be obtained in bookstores. Don' t miss
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it. It' s a book full of anecdotes and people' s names.
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This isn' t so good. It is the soldier, such is
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the first person' s names told in many cases because they are the stories
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they transmitted to you. But in this I see it novel to the book,
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I see it intimate. I feel identified with what they felt, with
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what happened, with what many of the interviewees lived with. Yeah, yeah,
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it' s good. It is that on April 2 you could have
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seen most of them at the Act, in La Plata, in the Falkland
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Islands Square. And for them this book is an achievement. It is a
34:30
great achievement beyond you as authors. I believe this manifest goes beyond the authorship
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of you. It is not an interesting document to rethink it, Yes,
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for them it is important on different levels as I told you, in the
34:47
collective plane, it is a reparation of collective memory, but also in the
34:52
individual. They, when we did the Silver presentation on March 26, were
34:54
very grateful that we told this story and felt represented after they read it.
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Many said thank you. It' s the first time I feel like my
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story is told the way I lived it It' s a war book,
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not now from the cover. It' s a book that doesn' t
35:13
hide anything from you. It is showing you the cruelty of what it was
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like to live there in the Falklands, with the cold, with all that
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weather, crimitologically and, moreover, with the preparation, as you say,
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so poor, so scarce that our army had with respect to those who came
35:32
from Great Britain, preparations, house, improvisation and there is also a degree
35:38
of very great consciousness. As we tell in some accounts. They took weapons
35:43
from the continent knowing that these weapons were not walking. The soldiers who were
35:47
in the gun room told him this cannon doesn' t work. I know,
35:52
they' re in charge of that for the serial number. He'
35:55
s not going. But you have to wear it the same way. Well,
35:58
you' re taking me to an intimate story, unfortunately, and I
36:01
have to tell it the failure I had in order to point to the center,
36:07
I had to move it to one side. I had to go to
36:07
five. If I went to five, that way you could hit the fell
36:10
for why. Because good, because you had that year twisted. They had
36:15
made a repeat shot and repeated shot by many bullets. He ends up heating
36:21
the pipe and double it. And that was the misfortune I had at the
36:23
time. I knew that I had to aim half crooked, if I wanted
36:27
to hit the scepter a tremendous, but we all lived it in some way,
36:34
no, as well as in the situation that you didn' t lack
36:37
a charger or someone stole it, or there was a whole question of traffic
36:44
on the equipment, which was very complex if you had the ranch equipment,
36:47
that you didn' t lack anything, because all those things implied maybe not
36:52
only having to pay for them I wish you were, not only that,
36:57
but also sanctions or punishments. Don' t look at me you made me
37:00
agree the other day I was talking on a program about food grabbing and a
37:07
veteran told me that food came to us because of a question of blocking.
37:09
Unfortunately, I did not have the opportunity to answer that, which is in
37:15
the declassified archives since two thousand and fifteen it is seen that there was not
37:20
that question of blocking by which the food does not arrive. There was no
37:23
such thing as if there had been embarrassment on the part of the officers and
37:29
their officers, because the states of malnutrition are seen in the soldiers and not
37:31
in the superiors. And I have a story that seems very graphic to me,
37:36
which is Hugo Robert, which is one of the cases we tell in
37:39
the book. At the end of the conflict, he escapes to seek food
37:43
and meets Shoffrey, who was the commander of the tenth brigade and sees him
37:50
impolute and the superior asks him why he is so sloppy and asks him,
37:55
please, to send them food. When you ask him. Who' s
37:59
his boss, he says, says Jehfred answers well. Tell your boss Garcia
38:02
he' s gonna hear from me and Robert hopes they' re gonna send
38:07
them food. Days later comes the parcel of razor blades. If those little
38:16
razor blades came to shave because someone took them the same way, they could
38:22
have made food that was in Argentine port in the containers with which they found
38:28
themselves in the retreat. I totally don' t want to overlook a question
38:31
that might be compromised. No, but when you now hear this revival that
38:37
exists on the Malvinas issue, beyond the situation of the base that is leaving
38:42
or that it was announced that it will be built in Ushuaia, this idea
38:50
that we are going to reconnect the army or the armed forces with the people
38:53
as if there was a fight. And when there are some decorations about,
39:00
there are some among quotation marks Malvinas heroes, how you see it from your
39:05
perspective, all this that is happening now To me, but Ussa a lot
39:09
of rejection. I think it is important to move forward with the prosecution of
39:15
crimes in Malvinas and then we can talk about who participated and so on.
39:21
But first, let us move forward with the trial of those crimes, let
39:23
the truth of what happened in Malvinas be known. I think that, unfortunately,
39:29
Alvinas is again used to claim the armed forces of terrorism State and we
39:37
must not forget that thinking of Malvinas is also thinking of the military base that
39:40
is on a mountain, the base of pleasant mountain that attacks Argentina and the
39:46
region, which is a region of peace and, unfortunately, is something that
39:51
Argentines and Argentines in general do not have very much in mind. The existence
39:54
of that unclear military base and you don' t think that you were just
40:00
not contemporary to war, but many saw it as being somewhere else, in
40:05
another country, in another one, let' s say they had it out,
40:09
not as being part of their own territory. It gives me that feeling
40:13
that' s happening, too. That is not so, and it also
40:16
has to do with compensating our maritime territory. If we thought in terms of
40:24
sovereignty, our projection to Antarctica is a debt that we Argentines have. We
40:31
look to the sea of the coast from now on and think about all the
40:37
natural goods that are of the Argentines. The bad difference in the field is
40:43
not wired. And then those goods are ours. And I may have gotten
40:46
this thought because I was lucky enough to cross over is the money in my
40:53
life and think good about those natural goods, not all that fishing I know
41:00
we' re being robbed of. How could it help by having a consolidated
41:05
national fishing industry, for our feet in, the covedors, instead of eating
41:07
flours, to eat the best protein we have, which are ours, our
41:12
South Atlantic fish, our projection to Antarctica. So, I think it'
41:16
s important to think male human rights perspective, also with these eyebrows, Gaby
41:23
and among your peers in your generation see you as a toad from another well.
41:32
How you see this in your area of reference. Let' s say
41:43
and how difficult with my generation of college friends, college colleagues and they'
41:49
re half in troposo toad, but they' re all very proud and very
41:53
happy that I' ve faced this research and they' re active promoters hours
42:00
of shrapnel the master. I want you to know that I too am very
42:06
proud of this and here sitting down small ones are the one who saw us
42:24
eagle and also sparrow and do with the sylensi when you kill her how to
42:39
stop the impotence of powerless will know nothing, because wanting to kill your children
42:50
is for years to hurt the blood, yesterday for not wanting the fatria.
42:57
And now why were too many my most genocidal old ones, mabresagio for life?
43:36
Put the light full, shadows and suns suffering. I went back to
43:53
my house on my knees. From here my friends dead in one go get
44:06
sick every carot on the table we play perverse games between football and war,
44:20
blood of glory and hatred against love, gods and beasts, madness and pain.
44:30
Will I open the ropes of this void because fate throws me up old
44:45
laws more than anus, gone bad, omen for life? I' ll
45:07
insist on a couple of roses and build on ashes. I will have a
45:16
new dream in my hands and I will fight to make justice my children'
45:27
s cheeks on my lips and find in their eyes a new rest. Come
45:36
the old ones more than the ill- laced omen for life. They were
45:57
old, more queenocided, foreshadowing life. I couldn' t miss for life,
46:14
I couldn' t miss a geek lion. And this look of lighted
46:16
by the fire, that film that, surely you will have seen in a
46:21
moment and I think it was an awakening for many also that film and was
46:24
an awareness at the time about the reality of the ex- combatants. Then,
46:30
after the war, last block with Gabriela, Gabriela, people still need
46:38
to be identified. Let' s say, there are still soldiers not yet
46:45
known, only known by God, as I said, not the acronym,
46:50
yes, they still remain to be identified. The identification process. The humanitarian
46:53
project plan that was commanded by the International Red Cross allowed to return one hundred
46:59
and twenty- one fighters to him. Still in the first phase some remain
47:02
to be identified and there are families who gave their adn sample. But they
47:07
don' t match the remains exhumed here. I also think it is important
47:13
to say that the humanitarian project plan was divided into different phases, because the
47:17
two collective tombs, those of one ten, which was that of the second
47:21
phase, and the B four hundred sixteen, which is that of the third
47:23
one that is pending, were not analyzed in the first stage, because those
47:29
tombs, which originally said NN soldier in the remodeling of two thousand four made
47:36
by the Committee of Relatives, appeared nominated? Did they appear nominated without any
47:40
analysis? Specifically, without any genetic analysis, they appeared nominated and could not
47:47
be exhumed in the first phase. But the families of these exomatients whose names
47:53
appeared, gave their samples and appeared that their relatives were in the individual tombs.
48:00
That' s why they exhumed in the pandemic those who believed they were
48:05
in front of a tomb that had the remains, but they weren' t.
48:07
They weren' t. And there are relatives who traveled around before the
48:12
remodeling. They never saw that tomb and they were waiting for him to be
48:15
called. When the identification process started, they didn' t call him.
48:17
And that' s why they don' t call me if the Family Commission
48:21
has my data and they know that that also caused a lot of damage to
48:29
families and, as B four sixteen told you, it' s pending.
48:32
It was going to take two thousand twenty- three. How many bodies are
48:36
there. It is not known until it exudes itself and could not be realized
48:42
by Britain' s reluctance. Many spoke of the possibility that these bodies could
48:47
be moved to the continent. And there isn' t any of this.
48:52
It' s not like that. It' s not where I know he
48:53
always posed. Of course not, don' t do it because if not,
48:55
then they' ll be transferred. Okay. There is something very interesting
48:59
about that in the amparo remedies presented by family members of chacoles say the silver,
49:02
they specify that they will not move. The commission of relatives who then
49:09
appear in the same cause that is generated makes a very similar argument saying that
49:15
they will not move. Do not lose the transfer was not a wish of
49:19
the relatives, but then the Committee of Relatives let him say that the dotty
49:22
of the silver wanted to move the remains to the continent. They were in
49:25
the court case. They knew what the presentation was saying. They made a
49:30
minor presentation country clearly lied, lied and caused much damage to families. This
49:37
theme of search, of truth in times of poverty. How complicated now,
49:43
how useful and how necessary are jobs like yours Gabriela. Let' s just
49:51
say I can put in concrete with first name and last name, with documents
49:55
the story, just as it was and told in the first person. In
49:58
that sense, the labor was very thorough, because we worked with testimonies,
50:04
but we also worked with official documents, with documents of the armed forces,
50:09
with legal documents. This in order to contribute, as I said, the
50:15
construction of our collective memory. Some documents remain to be published. There are
50:22
secret documents about Molinas. How to open that. In two thousand and fifteen,
50:27
all the secret archives of the armed forces on the war were classified.
50:30
Previously, in two thousand and twelve the Rattnbat report had been declassified. The
50:36
team to congratulate the Ministry of Defence archive team working on declassification did an excellent
50:42
survey job. Unfortunately, it is one of the areas that are being dismantled
50:51
and let us hope that this will be revived, because they are key documents
50:57
to know the truth of what happened in Malvinas and to try the crimes that
51:00
occurred in the war conflict. Today we can say how many are missing to
51:04
know We can say there is a number that is missing to know or we
51:07
know we are still with the NN. No more soldiers who don' t
51:09
know what happened. It is that until they are exumerated, in this case
51:14
of the mass grave, it will not be known how many remains there are.
51:19
And there are families, you can tell from Britos del 7 de la
51:22
Plata, which is the one that remains to be identified, that the family
51:25
contributed is shown to N. There are also families who are no longer family
51:29
members. The parents died, there were no sisters. So it' s
51:32
also very difficult to get a DNA sample and to cross- check clearly,
51:38
of course, yes, plus, time passes. We are also becoming old
51:42
and many old, but it is indispensable. I think we' re going
51:47
back to the question at the beginning. Forty- two years later, they
51:51
' re giving flowers to an unknown soldier. Let' s say and the
51:55
first thing that the country should be if it wants to repay that thank the
52:00
services rendered to the homeland, is to give it a name and surname.
52:05
It' s an exercise of sovereignty, to make our fallen fighters an identity.
52:12
Well Gab how the documentary will be and where we can see it.
52:15
I want to see him now, and the voices of silence, let'
52:21
s hope, will open in the middle of the year. We' ll
52:22
come back when it' s stress. Yes, of course, I invite
52:24
you, you' re already invited and it just counts the struggle of a
52:30
group of ex- combatants for these crimes to be judged. It is a
52:34
documentary that works with ex- combatants who were in different military units and the
52:42
process was very enriching. It allowed me to meet people of chaco, of
52:47
currents and also to see a little back to what we said not this discourse
52:52
of the gestation of how some fighters built their life around that discourse, how
52:59
there were families in which nature also had a naturalization of violence, where there
53:05
were very large deficiencies, where they were very numerous families, where the food
53:12
was not enough, then there was also a naturalization of if, in my
53:15
case I am used to aqueas that not like then. That allowed me to
53:19
make that universe and also a previous universe that was later found with the same
53:23
situation that lived on the islands. Yes, they also knew stories of coveting
53:30
as soldiers who were working for Pawn Golondrina and were seen as a deserter.
53:35
When they were working, we were notified by people who went to war without
53:39
knowing, reading and writing, and who gave him a map to coordinate the
53:45
group, because it was the largest. Okay. I imagine that, of
53:51
course, all this impacts in some very special way, even for the new
53:54
generations, for your generations and for the younger wetters. Also Yes, in
53:59
this thing that you said not to continue working the Ra Malvina, will be
54:04
known the Falklands War. From this perspective, it extends it to us.
54:09
Gaby, thank you so much for your time, for having dedicated to you
54:14
that we can talk together and think together a hard, difficult, but necessary
54:19
topic. I believe that memory, as you well say, makes human rights
54:22
essential and identity passes through one of the principles. If we don' t
54:30
know who we are, we' re lost. Identity is also what allows
54:35
us to project who we are and why and where we are going. In
54:40
the technical operation. Gabriel Amarillo sequil Amarillo forgives the production of Mirina Reboa.
54:45
My name is Luis de Giovannino. Thank you very much for accompanying us in
54:51
this ecosystem of memory, of the identity of the fallen, in memory of
54:53
them, honor and glory to all. So so