Latest / History Harpies: Pop Culture, Past and Present / Yes, He Is Eddie Murphy, Dammit! (Ft. Boomerang, Bowfinger, and Dolemite Is My Name)

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Yes, He Is Eddie Murphy, Dammit! (Ft. Boomerang, Bowfinger, and Dolemite Is My Name) · History Harpies: Pop Culture, Past and Present

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They say we're loud, opinionated, afraid Telling
0:05
us to hush, dim our historical light But darlings,
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we're the Harpies, sharp and keen Unveiling the
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truth behind the silver screen History Harpies
0:17
hear us roar And this is our 21st episode. And
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it's going to be a short one, Lauren. I hate
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to say it. No, it's going to be a short one,
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but we want to give our listeners what they want,
0:44
which is us more frequently than not. And so
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today we are going to talk about the amazing
0:53
Eddie Murphy. And you might say, Eddie Murphy.
0:56
Eddie Murphy. Why? Why Eddie Murphy? The answer
1:00
is, well, Christine watched a documentary and
1:04
told me that I needed to watch the documentary.
1:07
And then we got to talking about Eddie Murphy
1:09
and his versatile career and all the movies that
1:13
we love. And we said, well, we should just do
1:15
a pod on Eddie Murphy. And so that's where we
1:18
are. That's where we are. And certainly we have
1:21
to appreciate these. decades of, again, as you
1:25
say, very diverse roles. And one of the other
1:28
reasons I think it makes sense for us to be doing
1:29
this pod, Lauren, about Eddie Murphy is that,
1:32
you know, our listeners may remember that you
1:35
are a specialist in modern American popular culture.
1:41
And certainly one of the things that is really
1:43
interesting to think about when we think about
1:44
the career of Eddie Murphy is sort of changes
1:48
in kind of African -American actors and American
1:51
popular culture from when he starts in the early
1:53
1980s, early to today, sort of his place among
1:58
actors in general, comedians in general, stand
2:00
-up comedy, and all of the different things that
2:02
he's done, how he's supported black actors, how
2:05
he's worked with a lot of different kinds of
2:07
actors and creatives. And you of course have,
2:11
Lauren, the historical context. The historical
2:14
context. And I now realize also that I hadn't
2:17
really thought about it this way, but that some
2:19
of my teaching is actually through the lens of
2:21
Eddie Murphy. And again, most of my classes start
2:25
in the early 19th century, so they were not all
2:28
that way, but. Eddie Murphy is very close to
2:32
my heart in terms of thinking about comedy and
2:35
humor, but also thinking about somebody who has
2:38
crafted his own career, who makes all kinds of
2:41
interesting choices, who has, um, again, tried
2:45
to reinvent genres and who, who uses physicality
2:49
in a way that we don't see a lot of people doing
2:52
that anymore, at least in terms of playing characters
2:56
of all. Races, ethnicities, body shapes, and
3:01
being himself, not himself. He's so interested
3:05
in getting into makeup and transforming himself.
3:09
And that's another thing that I think we can
3:11
think about. Yes, and he has done so sometimes
3:14
for good and sometimes for evil. So it has not
3:17
always worked out. And so I guess, and of course,
3:20
we've already talked about Eddie Murphy in the
3:22
pod, because we talked about Trading Places,
3:24
a movie that you love. Love. And that I enjoy,
3:28
certainly, but I, of course, could not enjoy
3:30
as much as you do as a Philly girl. But I'm going
3:33
to ask you, because I remember this so strongly,
3:36
so I'm going to ask you, when did Eddie Murphy
3:38
first show up on your radar? Oh, Delirious. Oh,
3:42
interesting. Absolutely. Here's why. When we
3:48
got HBO in our house, and there was the cable
3:50
box, and it was a new thing, a new invention
3:54
to have HBO, the Eddie Murphy specials were one
3:59
of the first things on HBO. And so Delirious
4:03
was probably one of the first HBO things, texts,
4:08
that I became consumed with. And if you grew
4:10
up in suburban Philadelphia, you knew Delirious
4:13
by heart. And people will people always say to
4:16
me, Lauren, you know, why do you know These Eddie
4:19
Murphy quotes, which I still quote. Okay. And
4:22
it is because they were canonical. Okay. When
4:26
I was growing up in terms of thinking about,
4:28
you know, GI Joe and thinking about you ain't
4:30
got no ice cream and all that was part of my
4:34
childhood. A huge part. So my encounter with
4:37
Eddie Murphy was as a standup comedian. And of
4:39
course I saw many, many times Delirious. And
4:42
then when Raw came out and saw that. And then,
4:44
and then of course the films and Trading Places
4:46
was so important. in terms of both not Philly,
4:50
but Philly, but also SNL and then all the...
4:55
trending places, adjacent films that came out,
4:58
both starring Dan Aykroyd, but also, of course,
5:01
then starring Eddie Murphy. So how about you?
5:04
What was your first encounter? So my first encounter
5:06
was actually watching Saturday Night Live. And
5:09
it very much was a thing for me when I guess
5:11
I was in maybe seventh grade. I started staying
5:14
up to watch Saturday Night Live long after my
5:16
parents had gone to bed. And of course, sometimes
5:18
my dad was at work. And it was so absolutely,
5:21
I just thought he was the most exciting performer
5:23
and just so thrilling. And I absolutely loved
5:26
sort of Mr. Robinson's Neighborhood. And of course,
5:29
I think about that now and the Velvet Jones School
5:32
of Technology where he's the pimp. And it's very
5:35
strange to me because of course, as you know,
5:37
I mean, my sort of experience with black culture
5:40
growing up in Maine in the 1970s and 1980s was
5:42
almost non -existent, you know, other than say,
5:44
you know, Michael Jackson or whatever, or watching
5:46
television shows, you know, something like Good
5:48
Times or What's Happening. And it was so interesting
5:51
that I really responded basically to his... his
5:56
everything he did on Saturday Night Live. I just
5:57
thought again, he was such a genius. He was so
5:59
excited. And of course, I couldn't appreciate
6:01
how young he was. So young. Right. And like everyone
6:05
else. 19 years old. 19. I mean, just so again,
6:07
like completely electric. And I did have some
6:10
knowledge of sort of the kind of original cast
6:12
of Saturday Night Live. And so it's not that
6:14
I had no experience with the show. Right. You
6:16
know, it was very much like stay up, you know,
6:18
and sleep over kind of thing. but I just, again,
6:20
thought he was electric, and so I loved Beverly
6:23
Hills Cop, and I actually, I might not have told
6:25
you this before, I saw Eddie Murphy live on the
6:29
Raw tour. My high school friend, Harding Lee Smith,
6:33
who's now a restaurateur in Portland, Maine,
6:35
he got tickets to Raw, and we went, and it was
6:38
so funny. I can't believe I didn't tell you this,
6:40
because Eddie Murphy, right, those of course
6:42
is in the Cumberland County Civic Center in Portland,
6:44
Maine. Eddie Murphy looks out over the crowd
6:47
and he pauses and he's like, “Do any black people
6:50
live in Maine?" And some guy, I always remember
6:52
this, some guy like in the back yells out, "a
6:54
dozen!" Which was a generous number, I have to
6:58
say, at the time. But yeah, but certainly then,
7:01
I think as we have to acknowledge, right, Eddie
7:03
has his dips and valleys sort of in. Not all
7:08
Eddie Murphy movies are equal or performances
7:11
are equal. They are not. Yeah, yeah. So, okay,
7:15
so we've talked about Trading Places and I guess
7:19
we, it's not that we're going to go over all
7:22
his movies. No, impossible. That would take too
7:24
long and we don't have the time or the bandwidth
7:28
for it. But we did both watch. Boomerang, and
7:35
was Christine hated, I guess. And we both watched...
7:42
Dolomite is My Name. I did not watch that. Oh,
7:44
you didn't. Okay. I did watch Dolomite is my
7:45
name. And we both watched Bowfinger. Bowfinger,
7:49
yes. And we both watched the documentary. We
7:52
both watched the documentary. And of course,
7:53
those are three kind of random choices because
7:56
they're not necessarily the movies he's really
7:58
known for. You know, we could spend all this
8:01
time talking about those other movies, which
8:03
you all have probably seen anyway. But I do think
8:05
in some ways they're interesting choices because
8:08
they do kind of in some ways fall outside his
8:10
niche, right? They're not 48 hours. They're not
8:13
coming to America. They're not. And then things
8:16
like The Nutty Professor and then they're not
8:19
Norbit. Right. They're not body. I'm dressing
8:23
up in drag or whatever as an obese person or
8:26
whatever. Yes. Right. But I think they're interesting
8:30
choices. And I will say the rewatch for me of
8:33
Boomerang was a little different than when I
8:36
watched it in college. But there are some moments
8:39
in Boomerang that I just find so funny for whatever
8:42
reason that maybe that's why I love it so much.
8:45
I'm so eager to hear this. Okay. All right. So
8:47
if you don't know, Boomerang, which I don't know
8:49
what it came out, it came out in 1992. So this
8:53
is Eddie Murphy's. Eddie Murphy produced it.
8:56
I think he wrote it. This is his attempt to make
8:59
a rom -com. An all -black rom -com with the biggest
9:04
stars of the day. So you have him, of course.
9:08
You have David Alan Grier. Martin Lawrence.
9:11
You have Chris Rock. You have Tisha Campbell.
9:16
Robin Givens. Halle Berry. Pretty much anyone
9:20
who was a Grace Jones and Eartha Kitt. Eartha
9:24
Kitt looks amazing. Eartha Kitt, yeah, yeah.
9:28
So anyone who was kind of a big star, I mean,
9:31
Arsenio Hall's not in it, but he could have been.
9:34
Anyway. The guy from the 7 Up commercial. So
9:42
boomerang is an attempt, an attempt to create
9:46
this world of like this marketing firm that's
9:49
marketing these beauty products. And it's the
9:52
story of this player who total womanizer and
9:56
he's, he's amazing with the ladies and everyone's
9:59
in love with him. And then he meets his match,
10:02
uh, in Robin Givens who kind of strings them
10:05
along for awhile. And then finally they get together.
10:08
And then she tells him to basically, you know,
10:11
that he's like her fuckboy. Puts him on ice.
10:13
Right. Right. Puts him on ice and I'll call,
10:16
you know, don't call me. I'll call you. And then
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he and his loneliness. uh, gets together with,
10:22
uh, Halle Berry, who is this art director, and
10:26
they - Who's supposed to be the unattractive
10:29
one. Right, right. She is supposed to - Which
10:31
is hilarious. Which is hilarious. Which is hilarious.
10:34
She is a goddess. She is a goddess, but also
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Robin Givens is - Robin Givens is - Unbelievable.
10:40
Robin Givens is a goddess as well. She is, yeah.
10:42
She was absolutely stunning in this movie. Yes,
10:44
yes. So, but it is funny that Halle Berry is
10:47
supposed to be like the... The plain one. Yeah,
10:49
the plain one, right. She's the Mare Winningham
10:51
of the film. Anyway, and so in the end, he does
10:56
get together with Halle Berry and who's the sort
10:58
of wholesome, you know, girl with a golden heart.
11:00
Sweet, teaching... Children are after school.
11:04
Okay. So what I, what I love and my, my friend
11:08
Allison, and if you're listening to this, Allison,
11:11
you will, you know Boomerang. Okay. And we used
11:13
to quote Boomerang all the time. Okay. There
11:17
are some moments. I'm sorry. I'm afraid I can't
11:19
do that. There are moments in Boomerang when.
11:24
I mean, you just, I don't know, for whatever
11:27
reason, they just catch me. So when the three
11:28
guys are together, I am there, okay? I'm there.
11:32
I'm there for the way that they are. Their interchange.
11:38
I am there for the Martin Lawrence racial stuff
11:42
and the asparagus spears. And I am mostly there,
11:46
okay? Probably my favorite scene in the whole
11:49
movie, which I actually watch. It's when David
11:53
Alan Grier's parents come and he's got the
11:58
mushroom shirt and the mushroom belt and the
12:01
mushroom jacket and that for me is the best and
12:09
again those scenes are so funny and when they
12:12
came out okay I couldn't stop laughing because
12:15
they were so funny. Were you high at the time?
12:21
No. Had you been drinking? Maybe, but maybe.
12:25
I did see it in college, but we watched it so
12:29
many times, and then I just thought it was so
12:33
funny. And when he says, first come off your
12:36
coat and you need to make some earrings. It's
12:39
just so stupid. It's so funny. And again, the
12:44
rest of it is like, you know, the love part,
12:47
all that, whatever. But there are some scenes
12:50
in it that I just think are so funny and that
12:53
I'm going to stick with it. It's funny in the
12:57
cheesiest, dumbest sense, but it is so funny.
13:02
And some of it too reminds me, it has that kind
13:05
of... Billy Ray Valentine quality to it. Okay.
13:10
Like, I mean, if you're going from the Billy
13:12
Ray Valentine stuff to Eddie with Martin Lawrence
13:16
and David Alan Grier and them just talking about
13:19
like when they're going in by the suit and they're
13:22
like, you know, what are you gonna lay away?
13:23
Like, I mean, to me, I'm just like, they're at
13:26
their best when they're doing that. I'm not saying
13:28
it's the best thing ever, but it always makes
13:31
me laugh. And I love all those actors and comedians.
13:39
I thought it was the most unfunny thing I've
13:43
maybe ever seen. I actually think the real sort
13:45
of like... Star of it is David Alan Grier. I
13:49
mean, he was just, he really sort of surprised
13:51
me. And not that, I mean, I know he's so talented,
13:53
but like that particular, he in some ways seemed
13:55
like he had the most to do. Here's the thing
13:57
with it, is that of course, in the documentary
13:59
that we watched, and as you pointed out, the
14:02
documentary in a lot of ways is kind of a vanity
14:04
project for Eddie. And there's a lot of excuse
14:07
making in the documentary for Eddie's failures.
14:10
I think that's right. Despite his fantastic house.
14:13
Yes. With the beautiful atrium. Like 17. He supposedly
14:18
has an Elvis room, actually. They don't talk
14:20
about that in the documentary, but I've read
14:21
that elsewhere. Anyway, and so in the documentary,
14:25
the reason that is given for why Boomerang was
14:28
a failure is because white audiences were not
14:30
prepared to see an all -black rom-com. But what
14:35
I would say about it as a rom -com, okay, tell
14:38
me if you agree with this or not. I was like,
14:40
okay, it's obviously not a rom-com in that...
14:44
Okay, it's rated R, right? It has sex scenes,
14:49
right? Including a really weird one where the
14:52
camera, for reasons I don't understand, was super
14:55
focused on Robin Givens' ass. Like, you know,
14:59
with the shit over it, but like, you know, pumping
15:01
around. And I was like, I just kind of don't
15:02
understand that, Reginald Hudlin. But, so it's
15:06
not a sort of classic rom -com in that way, right?
15:10
But... but it also was not a super kind of dirty
15:14
sex comedy like American Pie. Or like Porky's.
15:18
Or Porky's, right? And so to me, it fell into
15:20
this really awkward middle ground where I'm like,
15:25
okay, like when the parents that you mentioned,
15:29
right? When the dad is like, "whip the pussy,
15:31
whip the pussy" at Thanksgiving dinner. I'm like,
15:35
okay, but that's not funny to me. It is, it's
15:38
funny to me. But it would have been funny. in
15:40
a film like, right, again, sort of American Pie or
15:44
even 40 Year Old Virgin, which is about older
15:46
people in a sex comedy. And so that's the thing
15:48
is I was like, OK, you know, in some ways you're
15:50
going to you're going to hate this. But it kept
15:53
reminding me. of Tim Gunn on Project Runway,
15:57
when he would say about some particular designs,
16:00
he would say, "it's not a talent issue, it's a
16:02
taste issue." Do you remember? And so to me, I
16:05
was like, I appreciate that Eddie at the time,
16:07
right? He was flying high in terms of like, I
16:09
can do anything. But I'm like, again, it's not
16:12
rom -com. And of course we have our episode about
16:14
rom -coms. But again, it's also not hard R sex
16:18
comedy. To me, that middle ground look. awkward.
16:23
To me, it just did not work. To me, it works.
16:25
It works. Okay, and when you've got Grace Jones,
16:29
right, "so when are we going to fuck, right?" And
16:33
then she's in a restaurant, she's literally like
16:37
showing everyone her vagina. And I'm like, that's
16:41
just gross. It's not funny, it's gross. Yeah,
16:44
well. No, because again, I was like, there's
16:46
a way to do, and that's the thing is I feel like
16:49
Eddie Murphy thought again. You agree with him.
16:52
I agree with Eddie. Showing her vagina to all
16:58
of these men and women in a restaurant. I'm like,
17:01
that's just gross. I mean, it just, whatever
17:04
he had in mind, right? In terms of like that
17:06
being funny. I'm down with Strangé. I'm down
17:08
with Strangé. Oh my God. I just thought it
17:10
was so... I was so down with Strangé. Yeah.
17:13
I mean, the whole - And granted, Grace Jones,
17:15
again, she looked incredible. She does look incredible.
17:17
But to me, like so much of it was just like,
17:19
again, would you want to sit down at like Thanksgiving
17:21
dinner? Right. And have basically like - Those
17:23
people there? Yeah. Yeah. But saying like, "whip
17:26
the pussy?" Again? Yeah, but I mean, but it's
17:30
in the context. We already know that those parents
17:32
are like completely inappropriate. They're completely
17:35
embarrassing to David Alan Grier. David Alan
17:37
Grier is so embarrassed by his parents, and now
17:41
we know why. They have sex in the bathroom during
17:44
Thanksgiving dinner, and his dad is like, you
17:47
know... Completely inappropriate and and but
17:51
he is so embarrassed and in a lot of ways to
17:53
me it explains why David Alan Greer is so kind
17:57
of mild -mannered and shy and and he is not a
18:02
Obviously, he's not a Marcus and he's also not
18:04
he's not the Martin Lawrence character He is
18:07
so kind of reserved and it's because these parents
18:10
are like, you know out of control and that's
18:12
the way I took it But I also was just like, it's
18:16
one, it's a bit, right? It's like Eddie Murphy
18:18
could have played those parents himself. And
18:20
he probably wanted to. Well, it might have been
18:22
funnier if he did. No, but do you know what I
18:26
mean? It's neither fish nor fowl. To me, the
18:30
parents are like more characters from Coming
18:33
to America barbershop. Like the father could
18:35
have, the whip the pussy guy could have easily
18:37
been in the Coming to America barbershop. But
18:40
see, but that's the other thing is that I feel
18:42
like the fact that that Eddie understood it and
18:46
presented it as a rom -com. And maybe it's just
18:50
again, thinking back, obviously again, we talked
18:51
about it happened one night. And the idea that
18:55
it's just the wrong kind of vulgarity. It needed
19:00
to be either super more vulgar, crazy vulgar,
19:04
but to me it just didn't, I don't know. Again,
19:07
it wasn't rom-com and it wasn't super hard,
19:10
our sex comedy. It really was as if all of a
19:13
sudden, right? And I don't know, it happened
19:15
one night that Claudette Colbert is like, okay,
19:17
I'm going to blow Clark Gable. Seriously,
19:20
right? I want to see Claudette Colbert's ass,
19:23
you know, pumping with like a sheet over it.
19:25
I'm like, why are we getting this camera angle?
19:28
Why? You know? Well, again, if like Clark Gable's
19:32
like, you know, "look at that snatch." Look, I
19:38
loved it. I loved it. And there were parts of
19:43
it when I watched it this time, of course, they're
19:44
a little more cringe. But on the whole, I just
19:47
think of those couple vignettes with those couple
19:50
characters that are so funny to me and that,
19:52
you know, they fit into the, you know, into the
19:56
bit, right? And so that's why I love Boomerang.
20:00
I think the one other thing I will say. is that
20:03
to me also, I feel like Eddie Murphy himself
20:06
did not seem comfortable in that kind of role
20:09
as like basically what's fundamentally a romantic
20:12
lead. And it is interesting to think sort of
20:14
how few films, right, he has been a kind of romantic
20:17
lead. I mean, I can't really think of... Another
20:21
one? Well, in the Nutty Professor, on the other,
20:23
he is... Oh, of course, of course. But again,
20:26
but that's of course a really like broad comedy.
20:29
Yes, yes, yes. And so that's what, and this kind
20:30
of like, it seemed to me like he just was kind
20:34
of embodying space that felt uncomfortable. And
20:36
in Coming to America, he is too. That's true,
20:39
that's true. To me, Coming to America is a rom
20:42
-com. It is. That's the rom -com. It is. In Coming
20:45
to America. It is. And so to me, again... But
20:48
he's also not playing... himself. Yes. Right.
20:52
Whereas in coming to America. Yes. One could
20:54
argue. Right. Again, these are the moments which
21:01
make me laugh. I mean, to think about James Earl
21:04
Jones wearing that lion's head, right? That's
21:08
the first image that comes to my mind coming
21:10
to America. And yeah, I mean, he's just. And
21:15
again, that barbershop scene, which is so genius
21:17
and is one of the most amazing scenes ever. That
21:21
one person is playing those, you know, however
21:24
many hands. I don't think I knew until a handful
21:26
of people. The documentary that Rick Baker did
21:29
the makeup for that. I mean, I don't know. I
21:31
mean, obviously it makes sense. Rick Baker did
21:32
all the great makeup for everything. But anyway,
21:35
so OK. But we both did rewatch Bowfinger, which
21:40
at the first, it's funny. My first watch of Bowfinger
21:42
was, I guess neither here nor there, that I was
21:45
just kind of, I liked it, but I wasn't like running
21:48
to see it again. And I probably. Honestly have
21:51
only have only seen it now twice the first time
21:53
I saw it and this time and this time and this
21:55
time But I did appreciate it in a lot of ways
21:57
partly because I didn't remember all the people
21:59
that were in it Yeah, and I forgot Heather Graham
22:02
and I had forgotten Christine Baranski and even
22:04
Robert Downey Jr. Who's not in it that much but
22:07
forgot about him and and Heather Graham is great
22:10
in she in both anger and It's it is it is really
22:15
funny and and again I as a huge Steve Martin
22:18
fan and this isn't my first favorite Steve Martin
22:20
movie, but you know, every time we watch Steve
22:23
Martin, it's like the two of them together and
22:25
it's just wonderful. And you know, I love Steve
22:31
Martin and I love Eddie Murphy, so it's just
22:33
that coupling again together that is awesome.
22:37
And again, in very, very interesting ways because
22:40
Steve Martin is so... No holds barred. We're
22:45
gonna do whatever here. And so the premise of
22:48
Bowfinger, for those of you who either don't remember
22:50
or haven't seen it, sort of down on his luck
22:53
filmmaker who's completely run out of money,
22:56
who's trying to kind of get back in the scene.
22:59
The fringes of Hollywood. Right. And then there's
23:02
this major movie star actor, Eddie Murphy. Kit
23:07
Ramsey. Kit Ramsey, who can make any movie he
23:10
wants, has any pick of the litter, whatever.
23:14
And Steve Martin comes up with the idea that
23:17
he's going to make a Kit Ramsey movie without
23:19
Kit Ramsey actually knowing about it. And they're
23:23
just kind of stalking him and then midway through
23:29
the movie he actually finds a guy who looks just
23:32
like Kit Ramsey but has a mustache and glasses
23:37
and braces and a super dorky and he convinces
23:40
this guy to... basically make Kit Ramsey stand
23:44
in. Yes, and later finds out that it is in fact
23:46
Kit Ramsey's brother. Right. Which he does not
23:48
know initially. Right. So of course we have Eddie
23:51
Murphy playing both of these characters, very,
23:54
very different. Very well. And it just happens
23:56
that Kit Ramsey is under the sway of basically
23:59
what is supposed to be Scientology, this movement
24:01
called Mind Head, and he is already paranoid,
24:04
which then the fact that he is being stalked
24:05
by these people filming him and talking about
24:07
aliens. Who are filming an alien movie. An alien
24:08
movie makes him even more paranoid. And so you
24:11
have very, very different characters. And Eddie
24:14
Murphy, of course, is completely believable as
24:17
both of them. Yes, he is. Equally. The sort of
24:18
super dorky, glasses wearing, braces wearing,
24:21
sort of hanger on. But then also the superstar
24:25
who is confident. Confident, but before he delves
24:28
into paranoia and hates the Laker girls. So one
24:31
of the reasons why I actually, I wish you would
24:34
watch Dolomite, is that Dolomite is My Name.
24:38
basically share so much DNA with Bowfinger. Because
24:41
this is the true story of Rudy Ray, whose last
24:44
name I'm now blanking, the true story of this
24:46
guy who was kind of working in this record store
24:48
in the early 1970s. And again, fringes of Hollywood,
24:51
wants to be a star, can't figure out how to become
24:53
a star, and he became a, he did a comedy album
24:57
with a hilariously vulgar title, Eat Out More
25:01
Often. See, that's something I laugh every time
25:04
I think of it. But then he basically started
25:06
making blaxploitation films. And it really is
25:10
very similar to Bowfinger in that when he makes
25:12
his first film, Dolemite is my name, he basically
25:16
has no money, right? He's trying to be sort of
25:18
scrounging around. He finds all of these people.
25:20
And of course, in the film... Eddie Murphy plays
25:23
this real -life actor, Rudy Ray, whatever, who
25:26
did the development films. And so it is very
25:27
similar to Bowfinger, sort of this kind of scrappy,
25:30
almost like Ed Wood style, where we're kind of
25:33
getting together and making this film. So, what
25:36
can we say about Bowfinger, in terms of Eddie,
25:38
in terms of sort of... African -American culture
25:41
in terms of film because it is very much this
25:44
sense It's yet another say a film like the player,
25:47
right? We've talked about films about Hollywood
25:48
where Hollywood loves to talk about itself But
25:51
also in terms of again Dolemite in terms of this
25:55
very much this idea of like people who want to
25:57
break into the business But they can't Or they'll
26:00
do anything, or the business is so ridiculous
26:02
that they're willing to do just about anything
26:05
and it's going to work. And it's going to work.
26:07
Because the Steve Martin character and all of
26:10
the things that he is willing to do to, I mean,
26:13
when he gets, what is the name of the Eddie,
26:16
of the, not Kit Ramsey, but the brother? It's
26:20
Jif. Jif. I think that's it. It's Jif. Well,
26:23
when he gets dorky Eddie Murphy, let's just say,
26:26
to run across the highway, okay? To run into
26:31
oncoming traffic and to convince him that those
26:34
are stunt drivers, okay? I mean, it is so funny.
26:40
there are so many moments where they are just
26:44
running after this guy and where he can, I mean,
26:48
again, Steve Martin is just so good in convincing
26:52
people. And then the, I love when, the Heather
26:56
Graham character, when he finally realizes that
26:59
she's been with everybody and then he steals
27:01
her credit card and buys all the film and funds
27:05
the rest of the movie. Because she also is this
27:08
character, right? The classic sort of ingenue
27:10
who we see her showing up in Hollywood on the
27:12
bus and then just basically keeps sleeping with
27:14
sort of like higher and higher up people on the
27:16
film until she's with a lesbian Hollywood executive
27:19
at the end. And so very much kind of her happy
27:22
ending. So we do have, I mean, with this... With
27:25
Bowfinger, we absolutely have this kind of physicality,
27:28
right? That Eddie Murphy is so good at. Yes.
27:30
And the fact that it really is just what? Braces.
27:33
I mean, it's not one of these sort of body suits,
27:36
make up, you know, the sort of thing we see.
27:39
No. You know it's Eddie Murphy, but you kind
27:42
of don't. But you buy that it's not. Yes. You
27:46
buy that this is a guy who looks exactly like
27:49
Eddie Murphy. But. acts completely differently
27:52
and you can buy that this is this he loves to
27:55
run errands he wants to go to Starbucks that's
27:58
his goal in life that's his dream and on the
28:00
side he's also going to do these action scenes
28:04
and fill in for when kit Ramsey is is it the
28:07
rehab center or whatever the therapy center the
28:10
scientology celebrity center the celebrity center
28:13
right So anyway, it's and it's also this sort
28:17
of moment in time. I feel like with Bowfinger
28:20
that the kind of racial dynamics are in this
28:25
very, very precise moment. Yes. Yes, I agree.
28:30
I don't know if we'd make Bowinger today.
28:34
But it is this moment where there's this kind
28:37
of comedy, there's this kind of talk about race
28:41
in the film, but not as explicitly as there is
28:45
in, of course, Boomerang. Yes. But there's this
28:50
recognition still. Yeah, and it's not, I mean,
28:53
it's definitely not the case, right? We're not
28:55
supposed to think that Kit Ramsey is kind of
28:57
like a quote unquote "black actor," you know, as
28:59
Dave Chappelle would say, right? "Black actors
29:00
have to stick together." So there's not, there's
29:02
not that. And I mean, certainly one thing that
29:05
did not age particularly well, right, is sort
29:08
of going to the, what? border and kind of gathering
29:11
all of these Hispanic men who are illegally immigrating,
29:15
right? But then who are, who become part of the
29:18
troupe. Right. In very much the sense that this
29:20
is kind of this scrappy little company, right?
29:22
Working together where they're all collaborating
29:24
and they all then become these like camera geeks,
29:27
right? Sort of knowing the perfect lenses and
29:29
stuff. Yeah. I mean, between that not aging very
29:32
well and all of the homophobia in Boomerang.
29:35
And there was a lot. And there's a lot. There's
29:38
a lot. Which is also pretty interesting in the
29:42
sense of just that's part of the bro code in
29:47
a lot of ways between these guys. Yeah, absolutely,
29:50
absolutely. And it's interesting. Not in a good
29:53
way necessarily, but doesn't age well, let's
29:55
just say. Yes. Well, you know, one thing, I mean,
29:57
I did want to make sure, even though we're having
29:59
a little bit of a shorter episode today, One
30:01
thing that I did want to come out is something
30:04
you and I discussed briefly from the documentary,
30:07
where, and again, as we said earlier, the documentary
30:10
makes a lot of excuses for Eddie's failures.
30:12
And one of the most important ones is when he
30:16
excuses not winning the best supporting actor
30:19
Oscar for Dreamgirls because Norbit had come
30:21
out. And everyone hated it and thought it was
30:23
ridiculous and awful. And that influenced Academy
30:26
voters. Who knows? But one thing that you and
30:28
I did talk about is And I think both of us found
30:31
it not super persuasive when Eddie tries to argue
30:35
that there really could only be one kind of black
30:38
actor at a time. Right. And that this is, and
30:41
in a sense, I mean, he... It doesn't work out
30:44
very right. He doesn't spend time describing
30:45
why he thinks that, but he basically just say,
30:48
right? Well, okay, there's me, but then I have
30:50
to go away if there's going to be Will Smith,
30:52
right? Right. You can't occupy the same space,
30:54
right? And again, I didn't even all the people
30:56
he inspires, all the people he inspires, Chris
30:58
Rock, Kevin Hart, Chappelle who do have all the
31:02
people that have huge film careers that are that
31:05
are. Martin, of course, and Arsenio. I mean,
31:09
list goes on. All the people that he has inspired
31:11
but also co -starred with. Yes. And so, I mean,
31:14
what did you think about that when he makes that
31:17
argument? I mean, did you see it as just, again,
31:19
him trying to save face for kind of that lull
31:21
he experienced, say, in the 1990s? I mean, I
31:25
remember Bowfinger as being kind of not quite
31:29
a comeback, but that he was kind of a second
31:32
billing role in that film because it was after
31:36
kind of a lull in his career. And I might just
31:38
be misremembering that, but certainly that. Seemed
31:42
to be with the documentary was saying right that
31:44
he had to kind of fall and Wasn't popular with
31:48
audiences in effect because Will Smith sort of
31:50
occupied that single space, which again. I didn't
31:53
think was persuasive I'll say it again, but I
31:55
don't know what it so what did you think of when
31:57
he said that? I mean taking sort of a longer
31:58
Well, I think the longer view and of course,
32:00
he does talk a lot about Richard Pryor as everyone
32:04
in the film I mean, yes, Chappelle and rest all
32:07
talk about Richard Pryor and as I told you the
32:10
biggest hole in the documentary is Bill Cosby
32:15
and and now of course he talks about his own
32:17
impressions of Bill Cosby But for maybe legal
32:20
reasons or because the documentary came out what
32:23
like a year ago or something like that But it's
32:25
a recent documentary and the you know Transgressions
32:29
of Bill Cosby are known at the time that he who
32:33
makes the documentary. So he doesn't want to
32:35
talk about the huge career of Bill Cosby, which
32:39
again, it's hard to make an argument that there
32:42
are no big black stars or shows with black cast
32:47
when you have the Cosby show on and the longer
32:50
career of Bill Cosby as long as you do. But he
32:53
doesn't want to talk about that. Yeah, actually,
32:56
if I can jump in for one second, what was interesting
32:57
to me is that when he says, you know, when he's
33:00
what, maybe like, I don't know, early 60s, from
33:03
the mid -60s, but when he said, Oh, well, I never
33:05
saw a black actor on TV growing up. But of course,
33:08
Bill Cosby was in I Spy, sort of, in what, the
33:11
late 60s. And so I was like, oh, that is interesting,
33:15
because yes, he would have seen Bill Cosby in
33:17
TV. In Long Island, in the milieu that he was
33:21
in, and also in the kind of family history that
33:25
he has. And he's somebody who's into imagination
33:28
and characters. I mean, Bill Cosby, more so than
33:31
Richard Pryor, even, as somebody who has the
33:33
voices, who does the impressions, who, Fat Albert,
33:36
right, he's voice, I mean, he has that kind of
33:38
versatility in a lot of ways, I mean, that Eddie
33:41
Murphy does. And again, Richard Pryor, as funny
33:46
as Richard Pryor is, and of course he has this
33:48
interesting film career, movies with Gene Wilder,
33:50
and then, of course, all kinds of other things,
33:53
but I would put... In terms of just career -wise,
33:57
the versatility is more similar to Bill Cosby.
34:01
Yeah, I think that's a good point. Because, again,
34:03
he had done the I Spy, he had done the Fat Albert,
34:07
he had done the Cosby show, and then he did other
34:10
stand -up things. And, of course, Bill Cosby
34:14
comes off very differently than Eddie Murphy
34:16
does, but he does have that kind of chameleon
34:19
-like sense to himself, even though everyone
34:21
knows what Bill Cosby sounds like. And he also
34:24
has this very identifiable voice. Eddie Murphy
34:27
talks about his laugh and how he had to sort
34:29
of change his laugh, things like that. So the
34:32
other thing that he mentioned, which he didn't
34:34
really expand upon, was he did say, well, there
34:37
could only be one of me. But he's like, but also
34:39
there was Oprah. Also there was Whitney. Also
34:41
there was Michael. And you're like, well, OK.
34:44
I understand they're all not comedians, but they're
34:47
all super famous. And they're all selling out
34:52
everything they do. And they're the most famous.
34:54
I mean, Michael Jackson is the most famous. performer,
34:58
period, okay? And so what does that say, right?
35:02
What does that say? Well, in some ways, I wonder
35:05
if maybe a kind of a better example that he didn't
35:08
really dwell on was Garrett Morris, right? Garrett
35:11
Morris, who is sort of the, quote unquote, “the,"
35:13
right, black actor on Saturday Night Live, who
35:16
then, in effect, sort of gets, is never, you
35:18
know, complains justifiably that he didn't get
35:21
a lot of screen time in the original cast, that
35:23
he wasn't sort of a breakout star, and that would
35:26
make more sense right that then Eddie Murphy
35:28
sort of occupies this quote -unquote role and
35:30
so that to me was a better you know sort of a
35:33
smaller example smaller example right but a better
35:35
one right no I for sure and I don't mean to suggest
35:40
in any way that there were tons and tons and
35:43
tons of roles for black actors of the time no
35:44
way but he he did have a a kind of entourage
35:49
of people that he was around, right? He talks
35:52
about James Brown, who's of course of an older
35:53
generation. But there were also some of these
35:57
younger actors and people he was coming up with.
35:59
And then you see them in his material, right?
36:02
I mean, you see, of course, Chris Rock is in
36:04
the is in Boomarang. And we see other other actors
36:07
who admired him, who then he employs or works
36:10
with or collaborates with. And then we have something
36:13
also like like Comic Relief on HBO. And we have
36:18
Whoopi Goldberg, right? And that's really important.
36:21
And this whole world of comedy and stand -up
36:23
comedy that is so important to HBO in the 80s,
36:27
where there's all these stand -up comics. Just
36:29
like Dave Chappelle is for Netflix now. That's
36:31
right. That's right. And so he's he's he's not
36:34
just coming into a moment in terms of an opening
36:36
for black performers. He's also coming into an
36:40
opening for comedy and for a certain stripe of
36:44
comedy that in some ways he may have pioneered
36:47
at that moment in the 80s. Right. But that also.
36:51
you know, it was very profitable and enjoyable
36:54
and that people loved it. And as you said, you
36:57
saw him live, right? So, and there are other
36:59
people too that were touring around this time
37:02
and sort of Gary Shandlings, right? The people
37:05
of that ilk who weren't as famous as Eddie Murphy,
37:07
but still stand -up comedy was a thing. Yes.
37:11
And again, the Dan Akroyds, the Steve Martins,
37:14
that whole generation of comedians, the Chevy
37:17
Chases, the, you know, all of those comedians
37:20
also had stand -up venues that you know that
37:25
actually reminds me that one thing that I mean
37:27
I didn't watch it again but the you know Jerry
37:29
Seinfeld has that show Comedians in Cars Getting
37:31
Coffee right there is an Eddie Murphy episode
37:33
oh really interesting yeah in part because I
37:36
mean he does seem to be as you know I've read
37:39
elsewhere that he's very shy right and sort of
37:41
very insecure you are right and then very
37:44
introverted and so he really does sort of seem
37:47
seemed uncomfortable with himself, which is,
37:50
you know, and then of course you can argue, right,
37:51
this is one of the things that makes him a fantastic
37:53
performer. But I have to say, I just, before
37:55
we have to, since we have to end quickly, Dolomite
37:57
is My Name was fantastic. I really, really loved
38:01
it. And it was much like Boomerang in that basically
38:04
all of these actors, right, that he had worked
38:06
with, you know, that are recognizable, but it
38:08
was just, it was such a fantastic, I think you
38:11
would really love it. as a story about blaxploitation
38:14
as a genre. Again, it's a biopic. It is an actual
38:18
biopic about this Rudy Ray, whose last name I'm
38:21
blanking on, but just sort of the building of
38:23
that career and how blaxploitation, how his films
38:27
first not picked up by anyone, then they get
38:30
picked up by a distributor played by Bob Odenkirk,
38:33
who's like, this is it. We're going to do midnight
38:35
shows. It's going to be grassroots promotion.
38:37
And it was just wonderful. Eddie Murphy is fantastic
38:41
in it. He's absolutely great. And I think you
38:43
would really love it. Well, I'm going to watch
38:45
it. I have been not to pivot too much, but I
38:48
have been just consumed with other media. And
38:52
I know you have to go and pick up your kid. You
38:57
can watch Dolomite and we can have a part two.
38:59
We can. But we also have to talk about The Drama.
39:04
Yes, we do. Hopefully, next time, we will talk
39:08
about the drama and the drama of The Drama. The
39:10
drama of the drama. I will look forward to it.
39:13
But until then. Until then. Harpies out. Harpies
39:15
out.