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The Murder of Jamie Carroll in Glitterball City · Legally Brunette

0:01
Speaker 1: Hi, guys, Welcome to a new episode of Legally Brunette.
0:04
Speaker 1: I will be your host Emily Simpson with my co
0:08
Speaker 1: host Shane. Okay, first of all, I just want to
0:10
Speaker 1: thank whoever. There were several people that recommended this. This
0:14
Speaker 1: is an HBO documentary that we're going to talk about.
0:16
Speaker 1: It's called The Murder and glitter Ball City, and several
0:20
Speaker 1: people had reached out to me through DMS on Instagram
0:23
Speaker 1: and had recommended it. It took me a little while
0:26
Speaker 1: to get to it, but I did finally watch it.
0:29
Speaker 1: It's two parts, and I have to tell you that
0:32
Speaker 1: when it comes to crime documentaries, murders all the things,
0:36
Speaker 1: it has every possible element you could want. If there
0:40
Speaker 1: is the term stranger than fiction that could apply to
0:44
Speaker 1: a murder documentary, this is it.
0:46
Speaker 2: It just has confusing.
0:48
Speaker 1: It has the love triangle, revenge murder, a spooky old mansion,
0:53
Speaker 1: kinky sex drugs. I mean, it has it all. So
0:57
Speaker 1: we're going to get into it all right. So it's
1:01
Speaker 1: called The Murder and glitter Ball City. First of all,
1:03
Speaker 1: let's just say, let's just get down to Glitterball City
1:06
Speaker 1: refers to Louisville, Kentucky. So apparently the person who invented
1:13
Speaker 1: what we know as the disco ball lived in Louisville,
1:18
Speaker 1: and originally it was called a glitter ball, not a
1:21
Speaker 1: disco ball.
1:23
Speaker 2: So interesting because okay, you're like, well that's.
1:27
Speaker 1: What we call it now. Yeah, but I guess in
1:31
Speaker 1: the beginning it was called a glitter ball, and it
1:33
Speaker 1: was invented by someone in Louisville, Kentucky. So geographically we
1:37
Speaker 1: are in Louisville, Kentucky. And I would love to add
1:40
Speaker 1: this to the legally brunette tour someday when we when
1:44
Speaker 1: we go around, because I want to visit the spooky
1:47
Speaker 1: old mansion that we're about to talk about.
1:49
Speaker 2: I want to go to the glitterball Museum.
1:51
Speaker 1: Do you think there's a glitter ball museum. I can't
1:53
Speaker 1: imagine that. There's a lot of artifacts in the glitter
1:55
Speaker 1: ball museum. All right, So the murder a lot.
1:58
Speaker 2: Of prototypes, a lot of prototypes. It's like cube that's
2:01
Speaker 2: not working, so well, try a different.
2:02
Speaker 1: Shape, triangle? Yeah, no, all right, so we went with
2:06
Speaker 1: glitter ball. Yes, it's sphear right, Okay, the Murder and
2:11
Speaker 1: glitter Ball city centers on a toxic Let's just do
2:14
Speaker 1: a little synopsis of it before we get into the
2:17
Speaker 1: nitty gritty details. It centers around a toxic drug fueled
2:23
Speaker 1: relationship between Joey Bannis and Jeffrey Munt that ultimately leads
2:28
Speaker 1: to the murder of Jamie Carroll. Now, all these are
2:31
Speaker 1: the three key players, but their names all start with Jay,
2:33
Speaker 1: so it's hard for me. I was kind of all
2:37
Speaker 1: over the place watching it idded, like sometimes right down
2:40
Speaker 1: and like keep track.
2:42
Speaker 2: Okay, So Jamie's the murdered, so right.
2:48
Speaker 1: So it's Jeff and Joey that are in a relationship.
2:51
Speaker 1: But Joey refers to Jeff as Jace, so there's just
2:54
Speaker 1: and then Jamie.
2:55
Speaker 2: Jeff and Joey killed Jamie. Right, Is that pretty much
2:59
Speaker 2: what it is?
2:59
Speaker 1: Yes?
3:00
Speaker 2: So allegedly yes.
3:02
Speaker 1: So this relationship ultimately leads to the murder of Jamie
3:04
Speaker 1: Carroll in Old Louisville, Kentucky. Police discover Jamie's remains hidden
3:09
Speaker 1: under the dirt and Jeffrey's basement six months after he
3:13
Speaker 1: was killed. The case gained major attention during two separate
3:16
Speaker 1: trials in twenty thirteen. Even years later, conflicting accounts and
3:22
Speaker 1: new claims, especially from Joey, leave lingering uncertainty about what
3:27
Speaker 1: truly happened that night and who was ultimately responsible. That's
3:30
Speaker 1: another thing that makes this story so interesting. As I
3:33
Speaker 1: watched the two parts, I did further research. I read
3:35
Speaker 1: as many articles as I could. At the end of
3:38
Speaker 1: the day, I still can't decipher who is actually the guilty.
3:44
Speaker 1: They be guilty, they can be, but ultimately they both aren't,
3:48
Speaker 1: and we're going to get into that.
3:50
Speaker 2: So legally they aren't.
3:52
Speaker 1: Legally no. So the HBO docu series is called Murder
3:54
Speaker 1: and glitter Ball City and it is based on this case.
3:57
Speaker 1: Let's start with a little bit a background in this case.
4:00
Speaker 1: First of all, when I first started watching this documentary,
4:02
Speaker 1: they spend a lot of time talking about this community.
4:07
Speaker 1: I guess it's an old part of Louisville. They're the
4:10
Speaker 1: Victorian style mansions, and it's in a very eccentric community.
4:15
Speaker 1: I feel like I had. And then they interviewed a
4:17
Speaker 1: lot of people within the community, and I think they
4:20
Speaker 1: wanted the viewer to get a sense of just how
4:23
Speaker 1: interesting this community is, how eccentric it is.
4:26
Speaker 2: I mean, that's why we got the disco ball right,
4:29
Speaker 2: and just.
4:30
Speaker 1: The characters around this neighborhood. Several locals describe Old Louisville
4:35
Speaker 1: as a tight knit, protective neighborhood with porch parties and
4:38
Speaker 1: a strong LGBTQ plus community. Old Louisville is renowned for
4:43
Speaker 1: having the largest concentration of restored Victorian area homes in
4:47
Speaker 1: the US. So in the documentary We Meet This is
4:52
Speaker 1: a character named David Dominie or dominate. I'm not sure
4:55
Speaker 1: exactly how to say his last name, but David. We'll
4:57
Speaker 1: just call him David. David works as a tour guide
4:59
Speaker 1: and it's books about Louisville, Kentucky, especially the ghosts and
5:03
Speaker 1: hauntings that are there. I guess also this neighborhood because
5:05
Speaker 1: these homes were built in eighteen hundreds and they're Victorian
5:08
Speaker 1: style homes. There's all these I think they do they
5:10
Speaker 1: do a ghost tour, and there's all these stories about
5:12
Speaker 1: ghosts in the homes.
5:14
Speaker 2: We should do a ghost tour in our town and.
5:17
Speaker 1: That, Yeah, you want to do a ghost tour in
5:19
Speaker 1: our neighborhood.
5:19
Speaker 2: This songe was built in twenty twenty. The owner died
5:22
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty one and he's been haunting it ever since.
5:25
Speaker 1: Are there hauntings in present day? I always wonder that
5:27
Speaker 1: I feel like every time someone talks about a ghost
5:29
Speaker 1: story or a haunting, it's always someone in some Victorian
5:32
Speaker 1: error era.
5:33
Speaker 2: I don't know you're the expert on ghosts.
5:35
Speaker 1: I'm not an expert on ghosts, but I just believe
5:38
Speaker 1: in ghosts, if that's what you mean by expert. David
5:49
Speaker 1: wrote a book about Jamie Carroll's murder, and the book
5:51
Speaker 1: was called A Dark Room in Glitterball City, Murder, Secrets
5:54
Speaker 1: and Scandal and Old Louisville. So throughout the documentary, it's
5:58
Speaker 1: actually interesting is they take excerpts of his book that
6:01
Speaker 1: he wrote about this murder, and it's read during a
6:04
Speaker 1: lot of the scenes, and even some of the characters
6:06
Speaker 1: that live in this neighborhood read excerpts from the book
6:10
Speaker 1: about themselves. So if you're interested in the book, that's
6:14
Speaker 1: what it is. Now let's get to Joey Bannis, who
6:18
Speaker 1: is one of the key players. He's in the relationship
6:20
Speaker 1: with Jeff. Joey works at a bar connected to the
6:22
Speaker 1: gay community. He had a criminal record that included felony
6:25
Speaker 1: convictions in prison time, and he was also reportedly addicted
6:28
Speaker 1: to methamphenamine. He is known as an intense cleaner, that
6:32
Speaker 1: could just be the methan finamine. They talk about how
6:34
Speaker 1: he worked at the gay club, but then when the
6:35
Speaker 1: club closed at night, he was like ocd about cleaning
6:39
Speaker 1: the club. Probably well, no, I mean, I'm just saying
6:44
Speaker 1: he ingested. He took a lot of drugs. So maybe
6:46
Speaker 1: it was the drugs that made him like so intense
6:49
Speaker 1: about scrubbing the floor and scrubbing every little I don't know.
6:52
Speaker 2: I never heard of that. So drug use makes someone clean.
6:55
Speaker 1: Well, I think that that's what happened with him. I
6:57
Speaker 1: don't know why, but I think it made him very
7:00
Speaker 1: tens like ideas for Annabel and kids do chores. Yeah,
7:04
Speaker 1: let's give him drugs, a little bit of meth. So
7:08
Speaker 1: then Joey goes on he's working at this club and
7:11
Speaker 1: they start noticing that things are disappearing from the club.
7:14
Speaker 1: There's money that disappears, the speakers off the wall disappear. Yeah,
7:19
Speaker 1: and then he so happens to open his own club,
7:22
Speaker 1: which then has all the same liquor they used to
7:25
Speaker 1: have and the same speakers.
7:27
Speaker 2: On the wall. He just like crossed the name out
7:29
Speaker 2: of the Napkins. Yeah, it's his own club name. On
7:31
Speaker 2: the Napkins cups. How does a methew is a meth user? Yeah,
7:36
Speaker 2: how does he savvy enough to open up a club?
7:39
Speaker 1: Well, when you steal everything you need from another club.
7:42
Speaker 2: Still savvy. He's like he had a plan, that was
7:44
Speaker 2: his business plan. Well, it may take their stuff and
7:46
Speaker 2: then open up a.
7:47
Speaker 1: Club, right, Well, I don't know. It seems like if
7:49
Speaker 1: you never get caught, it's a good business.
7:51
Speaker 2: That makes you feel like a bomb. Well, it's like
7:54
Speaker 2: I'm not on meth and I didn't like open up
7:56
Speaker 2: a club or start a business. Well, like you should
7:58
Speaker 2: steal either, Like you.
7:59
Speaker 1: Should go to home Depot and to steal everything and
8:01
Speaker 1: then open up a heart and.
8:02
Speaker 2: Go to home Depot and get a lot of projects done.
8:07
Speaker 1: All right, So Joey ends up opening his own nightclub,
8:10
Speaker 1: and Glow opens on New Year's of two thousand and six.
8:13
Speaker 1: Some stolen items from Joey's previous bar are allegedly found there.
8:17
Speaker 1: I think they actually the owners of the other bar
8:20
Speaker 1: see his new bar, or maybe they even saw videos
8:22
Speaker 1: of his new bar and they're like, wait, those are
8:24
Speaker 1: hor speakers that are missing. Look at all the top
8:27
Speaker 1: shelf liquor. I feel like that's everything that was stolen
8:30
Speaker 1: from us.
8:30
Speaker 2: It's like employee of the month, plaque is on the wall. Story.
8:34
Speaker 2: They're like, wait what.
8:37
Speaker 1: Joey is often unreliable about paying employees. Well, there you go.
8:40
Speaker 1: There's the downfall of being a mathe addict and then
8:43
Speaker 1: opening a business side, right, But he is generous with
8:46
Speaker 1: his drugs. He's like, I can't pay you in cash.
8:52
Speaker 2: Meth is not a currency.
8:53
Speaker 1: No. Around this time a case is being built against
8:56
Speaker 1: him involving theft drugs and alcohol. And then in two thousand,
9:00
Speaker 1: now we move on to Jeffrey Month. This is the
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Speaker 1: other guy in the relationship. Jeffrey worked as a project
9:05
Speaker 1: director at Northwestern University in Chicago. Former co workers describe
9:10
Speaker 1: him as believing he was the smartest person in the room.
9:14
Speaker 1: I can't.
9:15
Speaker 2: I wait what room is he in?
9:18
Speaker 1: I don't know, but any room is.
9:19
Speaker 2: Then he thinks he's the smartest.
9:23
Speaker 1: He's the smartest person in any room. He goes into
9:25
Speaker 1: actually later on in the documentary when he is at
9:30
Speaker 1: the trial, the first trial, and he is testifying against
9:36
Speaker 1: the other guy, Bannis, Joey Bannis. He's so condescending on
9:41
Speaker 1: the stand. I can't. I just can't. I don't like him.
9:45
Speaker 1: I don't well, I don't like either one of them,
9:47
Speaker 1: but I especially don't like him. He also has these dead,
9:50
Speaker 1: beady eyes that just when you watch him talk and
9:54
Speaker 1: you look at him, you can tell there's just no
9:57
Speaker 1: soul inside of him. Jeffrey is described as well dressed
10:02
Speaker 1: and extremely materialistic. He speaks in a British accent because
10:05
Speaker 1: he thinks people will respect him more. I thought that
10:08
Speaker 1: was interesting when they interview some co workers, and one
10:11
Speaker 1: of his co workers says he would always speak in.
10:13
Speaker 2: A broch accent, have a monocle and a cane around
10:16
Speaker 2: with the top hat.
10:17
Speaker 1: Yes. He later moves back to Old Louisville and he
10:21
Speaker 1: buys one of these Victorian mansions on four Street and
10:24
Speaker 1: aims to restore it and turn it into a bed
10:27
Speaker 1: and breakfast. They mentioned that a couple of times that
10:29
Speaker 1: he built that he bought this Victorian mansion in this
10:33
Speaker 1: eccentric neighborhood because he wants to turn it into a
10:35
Speaker 1: bed and breakfast. But every time they show any video
10:37
Speaker 1: footage of like the two of them inside of his house,
10:40
Speaker 1: it's just foul and disgusting, and there's just drugs everywhere,
10:45
Speaker 1: and there's no I mean there's he's not doing anything.
10:48
Speaker 2: So basically the breakfast serve meth. Yes.
10:54
Speaker 1: So then Joey and Jeffrey meet on a website called
10:56
Speaker 1: Adam for Adam. This is in October of two thousand
10:59
Speaker 1: and nine. Jeffrey is working as a tech consultant for
11:02
Speaker 1: the University of Louisville. Well, it's well, Adam would be
11:06
Speaker 1: a man. It's a it's a dating website. Met you
11:11
Speaker 1: like Adam Adam? I'm sure there's an maybe? Now are you?
11:20
Speaker 1: Are you go? Is Adam for Adam? Jeffrey works as
11:27
Speaker 1: a tech consultant for the University of Louisville. And then
11:30
Speaker 1: Joey has a very bad boy look. He's got like
11:33
Speaker 1: the dyed hair, the tattoos, he has a criminal record.
11:36
Speaker 1: They end up spending Thanksgiving together and began talking about
11:39
Speaker 1: a long term relationship. Let's talk about the victim. So
11:44
Speaker 1: we've got we've given you a background on Joey, who
11:47
Speaker 1: is the bad boy type. We've got Jeffrey who is
11:50
Speaker 1: the it. No, he does know he's into kinky sacks
11:55
Speaker 1: and drugs and all the things, but he he presents
11:57
Speaker 1: himself as like a very educated, you know it guy,
12:01
Speaker 1: dressed well, got himself together. Then he goes home to
12:03
Speaker 1: his Victorian mansion that's disgusting and has myth everywhere. Jamie Carroll,
12:09
Speaker 1: this is the victim. Grew up in Martin, Kentucky, in
12:12
Speaker 1: a small religious town. As a child, Jamie ran away
12:15
Speaker 1: from home and lived at his elementary school. His father
12:19
Speaker 1: allegedly beat him many times because he was gay. Jamie
12:22
Speaker 1: later went on to go to beauty school and then
12:25
Speaker 1: opened up his own salon called Illusions. He also performed
12:29
Speaker 1: in drag under the name Ronica Reed, and he often
12:32
Speaker 1: drove to Louisville to perform as Ronica in the city.
12:37
Speaker 1: Jamie is described as someone who he was a drug dealer,
12:40
Speaker 1: not only a drug user, and he ended up becoming
12:43
Speaker 1: addicted to crack. After he became addicted to crack, he
12:46
Speaker 1: ends up losing his salon and then later moved on
12:49
Speaker 1: to using meth. Louisville has a major crystal meth problem,
12:54
Speaker 1: and meth was referred to as Tina. And they talk
12:58
Speaker 1: about their inner viewing some of these drag queens that
13:02
Speaker 1: were within this that knew Jamie, that were you know,
13:05
Speaker 1: in Louisville, and they one of them said that it
13:10
Speaker 1: was called Tina. Because you know, when Tina Turner performs, like,
13:14
Speaker 1: she's very animated and she like jerks a lot when
13:17
Speaker 1: she's performing. So they referred to Crystal meth as Tina
13:21
Speaker 1: because I guess people when they're on meth they become
13:23
Speaker 1: very like tweaky. They call them tweakers, and they like
13:26
Speaker 1: jerk and stuff. That's why it was called Tina in
13:29
Speaker 1: that type of community. Okay, and Joey and Jeffrey discussed
13:32
Speaker 1: doing drugs together and then they end up finding well,
13:35
Speaker 1: I guess Joey had a relationship with Jamie at one time,
13:39
Speaker 1: so that's how Jamie kind of comes into the picture.
13:42
Speaker 2: Later and Jamie as a couple, well, no, I don't know.
13:45
Speaker 1: If they were a couple. It's Joey and Jeffrey are
13:47
Speaker 1: a couple, and then Jamie is the one who's the victim.
13:51
Speaker 1: But he had had some prior relationships with Joey at
13:55
Speaker 1: some point, like they I think they had met on
13:57
Speaker 1: Adam for Adam or something at some point and had
14:00
Speaker 1: hooked up and had gotten to know each other and anyway,
14:03
Speaker 1: so we'll get we'll get into that more in April
14:06
Speaker 1: tenth and twenty ten. This is Joey and Jeffrey's first arrest.
14:10
Speaker 1: So Joey and jeff go to Chicago to turn counterfeit
14:13
Speaker 1: money into real money. This is another scheme that they
14:16
Speaker 1: had going on it with.
14:17
Speaker 2: How do they turn it into real money?
14:19
Speaker 1: I think they were because they were printing counterfeit money,
14:23
Speaker 1: and I guess Jeff was like working on it over
14:26
Speaker 1: and over to like get it to look correct.
14:28
Speaker 2: What do you mean change it for real money because
14:30
Speaker 2: they were going.
14:30
Speaker 1: To spend it. And I guess when you get then,
14:33
Speaker 1: like if you give someone one hundred dollars and you
14:34
Speaker 1: spent ten, you get ninety back in real money. Right,
14:37
Speaker 1: That's where I.
14:37
Speaker 2: Think people go wrong because then you get caught. But
14:40
Speaker 2: you will get caught eventually. Yeah, Like why wouldn't you
14:43
Speaker 2: like go buy something off Craigslist for like ye know,
14:46
Speaker 2: because no one's going to check that. You go to
14:47
Speaker 2: their home and you buy a couch or whatever for
14:50
Speaker 2: his bed and breakfast and you pay a thousand bucks
14:52
Speaker 2: in counterfeit money. They'll never trace that to you.
14:54
Speaker 1: I think because they were trying to get cash back.
14:57
Speaker 1: I think they're trying to turn the counterfeit money into
15:00
Speaker 1: use the cash for what, just to have real money.
15:03
Speaker 1: I don't to buy drugs.
15:04
Speaker 2: Oh okay, but I'm just saying, well, then use your
15:06
Speaker 2: real money. This is what I'm just saying in crying.
15:08
Speaker 2: This is where people go wrong. If you have fake money,
15:11
Speaker 2: use it in places where no one's really going to
15:13
Speaker 2: detect it. Don't go to the store and buy like
15:16
Speaker 2: a lollipop for a dollar, Give them one hundred dollars
15:18
Speaker 2: bill and you want nine nine dollars back. That's what
15:21
Speaker 2: they do. Yeah, well, I would think they should use
15:24
Speaker 2: it for like personal transactions, well, like drugs.
15:30
Speaker 1: Right, but no, but you can't use counterfeit money with
15:32
Speaker 1: your drug dealer.
15:33
Speaker 2: They should is not print counterfeit money and not do drugs.
15:36
Speaker 2: That's really what it comes down to.
15:38
Speaker 1: So they go to Chicago to turn counterfeit money into
15:40
Speaker 1: real money. Their drug addiction was getting out of hand
15:42
Speaker 1: and they needed more money to support it. They are
15:45
Speaker 1: caught and arrested with fifty thousand dollars in counterfeit bills
15:48
Speaker 1: and their possession. They're also found having weapons, fake IDs,
15:53
Speaker 1: and date rape drugs. Joey's bail is higher than Jeffrey's
15:57
Speaker 1: bail because, if you remember, Joey was a felon, he
16:00
Speaker 1: already had some criminal history. Jeffrey pays his twenty thousand
16:05
Speaker 1: dollars bond and his release with real money. Yeah. I
16:09
Speaker 1: don't know where he got the money, but I don't know.
16:12
Speaker 1: Maybe he sold some things in his mansion at home.
16:15
Speaker 1: June seventeenth of twenty ten is the nine one one call. Now,
16:19
Speaker 1: the actual the documentary starts out kind of not only
16:23
Speaker 1: with this neighborhood and how eccentric it is and all
16:25
Speaker 1: the players within this neighborhood and an introduction, but then
16:28
Speaker 1: they also play this nine to one one call. So
16:30
Speaker 1: Jeffrey calls nine one one and claims his ex boyfriend
16:33
Speaker 1: Joey is trying to attack him, and you can hear
16:36
Speaker 1: him in the nine one one call, and then you
16:38
Speaker 1: can hear like some pounding in the background, like Joey's
16:41
Speaker 1: trying to get through the door, and he claims that
16:43
Speaker 1: he's scared and he's locked himself in the bedroom. Joey
16:47
Speaker 1: locked Jeffrey locked hisself in the bedroom while the dispatcher
16:50
Speaker 1: hears wood breaking on the door. This is in the
16:52
Speaker 1: background on the phone call. Police arrive and they end
16:56
Speaker 1: up arresting Joey on the way to the police station,
17:00
Speaker 1: and this is very important. On the way to the
17:02
Speaker 1: police station because Joey's now arrested for you know, because
17:05
Speaker 1: of the nine one one call, Joey tells officers that
17:08
Speaker 1: he has witnessed a murder.
17:10
Speaker 2: He says, I want to hear something interesting off.
17:14
Speaker 1: Right. He says that the there is a body buried
17:19
Speaker 1: in the basement of the house where he was arrested.
17:23
Speaker 1: Joey claims that jeff Munt is the person who did it.
17:27
Speaker 1: The homicide unit begins questioning Joey. And also what's also
17:31
Speaker 1: interesting is while the police are questioning Joey, forty eight
17:35
Speaker 1: hours just coincidentally happens to be filming in Louisville, Kentucky,
17:40
Speaker 1: at this police station, and they're there with their cameras.
17:43
Speaker 2: Forty eight hours. You have to explain what kind of
17:45
Speaker 2: show that that's a true it's a true crime show,
17:48
Speaker 2: because when they say you have to find him within
17:50
Speaker 2: forty eight hours, otherwise the odds of finding the murder
17:55
Speaker 2: like significantly decline.
17:56
Speaker 1: Right, right. So there's a camera crew from the first
17:59
Speaker 1: forty eight hours there and they start filming the investigation.
18:03
Speaker 1: So June eighteenth, twenty ten, the police returned to Jeffrey's
18:08
Speaker 1: house on Fourth Street to search the home. Detectives feel
18:12
Speaker 1: extra pressure because there is a The first forty eight
18:16
Speaker 1: hours is filming everything they do.
18:17
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah.
18:20
Speaker 1: Jeffrey convinces people he is in an abusive relationship with Joey.
18:25
Speaker 1: Police search the basement and find a body buried six
18:28
Speaker 1: to eight feet deep and a rubber maid container exactly
18:32
Speaker 1: where Joey said it would.
18:33
Speaker 2: Be, well six to eight feet deep.
18:35
Speaker 1: It was so deep. No, it wasn't a shallow grave,
18:38
Speaker 1: it was it was very deep. And also, first of all,
18:41
Speaker 1: he looked up this house on Zillo and there are
18:43
Speaker 1: no there are like twenty something photos of this house
18:46
Speaker 1: on Zillo. There are no photos. No, there are no
18:48
Speaker 1: photos of the basement. Just to let everyone know. Also,
18:52
Speaker 1: the basement was dirt, so it's truly truly just a
18:57
Speaker 1: dirt floor in the basement, and they dug six to
19:02
Speaker 1: eight feet deep down, put this guy in one of
19:05
Speaker 1: those big, huge rubber made containers, and buried him. That
19:09
Speaker 1: same day, they continue to interrogate. The police interrogate both
19:13
Speaker 1: of these guys. Detectives tell Joey and Jeffrey separately that
19:17
Speaker 1: they found the body. Jeffrey is asked to take a polygraph.
19:21
Speaker 1: At this time he agrees and on the way to
19:24
Speaker 1: the test he is seen smiling. They actually show this
19:27
Speaker 1: is why this guy, this guy is just a psychopath.
19:30
Speaker 1: They show him walk past, you know, the detectives to
19:33
Speaker 1: go into the room to go take the polygraph, and
19:36
Speaker 1: they kind of slow motion it and this is.
19:37
Speaker 2: The guy that initiated the look like.
19:40
Speaker 1: He's the one that called nine to one one and
19:42
Speaker 1: claimed that Joey was trying to, you know, tear his
19:46
Speaker 1: door down to get to him and attack him. Jeffrey
19:50
Speaker 1: eventually admits that he does know about the murder. Joey
19:53
Speaker 1: and Jeffrey give nearly identical stories but blame each other.
19:57
Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting they asked the prosecutor or the
20:00
Speaker 1: Coecutter says in this documentary that she wanted them to
20:05
Speaker 1: be able to show their testimony about what happened during
20:09
Speaker 1: this this murder kind of side by side, or she
20:12
Speaker 1: wanted them try it at the same time, but they weren't.
20:14
Speaker 1: They end up having separate trials. But then what the
20:17
Speaker 1: show did this documentary did was they actually lined them
20:21
Speaker 1: up simultaneously and showed jeff talking Jeffrey mont talking about
20:27
Speaker 1: what happened while he's testifying against Joey, and then they
20:32
Speaker 1: showed Joey talking about what happened that night while he's testifying.
20:36
Speaker 1: Their stories are completely identical as to I don't know.
20:43
Speaker 1: To me, it felt like the truth identical until you
20:47
Speaker 1: get to the park.
20:48
Speaker 2: What was atway Holen? How was he murdered?
20:51
Speaker 1: Well, he was stabbed and he was shot.
20:53
Speaker 2: Okay, so is one claiming the other stabbed and shot
20:56
Speaker 2: and then the other one's claiming, no, he stabbed and shot.
20:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it so it's when they lie these stories
21:00
Speaker 1: up and they're telling about what happened that night, it's
21:02
Speaker 1: very identical. It's like the three of them got together.
21:05
Speaker 1: They were all naked in bed together, they're all messing around,
21:08
Speaker 1: they're all doing drugs, they're all having a good time,
21:10
Speaker 1: and like their stories line up. I think at first
21:14
Speaker 1: they were having a good time, and then when it
21:17
Speaker 1: gets to the point of like this guy is going
21:20
Speaker 1: to be murdered, they just invert each other's name into
21:23
Speaker 1: it's like there's a struggle. But Joey blames Jeff, Jeff
21:27
Speaker 1: blames Joey, and then he gets stabbed in the neck Jamie,
21:30
Speaker 1: and it's like they blame each other, and then you know,
21:33
Speaker 1: Jeff says that Joey reached for a gun. Joey says
21:36
Speaker 1: Jeff reach for a gun.
21:37
Speaker 2: So that just makes it more confusing.
21:39
Speaker 1: It is more confusing because it's identical stories.
21:42
Speaker 2: If they had different stories, different versions, then maybe you
21:44
Speaker 2: could try to find the truth somewhere in it, right.
21:47
Speaker 1: But it's very difficult to decipher when both of them
21:50
Speaker 1: are telling the exact same.
21:52
Speaker 2: Because at the end of the day, it's just he
21:53
Speaker 2: pulled the trigger. No, he pulled the trigger exactly, No,
21:55
Speaker 2: he pulled.
21:55
Speaker 1: The ur right, That's why it's so frustrating. And you're right,
21:58
Speaker 1: if they had completely different versions, then maybe you could
22:00
Speaker 1: actually get to the truth based upon the forensics maybe
22:03
Speaker 1: and the body and autopsy and all those things. But
22:05
Speaker 1: because it's just the slight difference as to who actually
22:09
Speaker 1: stabbed him with the knife and who actually pulled.
22:11
Speaker 2: The long before this was he murdered, do we know
22:13
Speaker 2: how long before what? Like, how long had he been dead?
22:17
Speaker 1: He was in the basement six months?
22:19
Speaker 2: Six months?
22:19
Speaker 1: Yes, they lived in the house together and.
22:22
Speaker 2: Can't tell me they wanted it buried really deep, Yeah.
22:24
Speaker 1: And continue to do drugs and live their normal life with.
22:27
Speaker 2: This man pursuing the bed and breakfast.
22:30
Speaker 1: I'm sure they still talked about it. I think at
22:34
Speaker 1: this point they were just they were making counterfeit money
22:36
Speaker 1: at that point, I'm sure.
22:37
Speaker 2: But I've had a better business plan.
22:40
Speaker 1: Yeah, let's just print money, print money. Why try to?
22:43
Speaker 1: Why try to?
22:44
Speaker 2: There's no customer feedback, there's no concerns. We don't have
22:48
Speaker 2: to report the earnings.
22:49
Speaker 1: Right, they did, just to let you know, they did
22:52
Speaker 1: put lime over the top of the body so that
22:55
Speaker 1: it would help with the you know.
22:58
Speaker 2: That's what's funny is they worked really hard to bear
23:00
Speaker 2: as deep as they did. Yes, and then they do
23:02
Speaker 2: the lime or whatever, right.
23:04
Speaker 1: Not limes like not like the fruit that what is it?
23:07
Speaker 1: Then it's limestone, limestone, right, Well, they sprinkle it on there,
23:11
Speaker 1: they Yeah, you sprinkle it over the top in it.
23:14
Speaker 1: It helps with the smell, you know, because decaying flesh reeks.
23:21
Speaker 2: Yeah.
23:22
Speaker 1: So you know, they bury someone in their basement. They
23:24
Speaker 1: don't want their house to smell like dead bodies.
23:26
Speaker 2: Sure their house smelled bad as it is, I'm sure
23:29
Speaker 2: it didn't. Oh wait, you described it, and from their livestyle.
23:31
Speaker 1: I'm sure it did.
23:32
Speaker 2: Six months six months they buried him six to eight
23:35
Speaker 2: feet deep. They did the lime thing. Well, yeah, they
23:40
Speaker 2: lived there for six They planned it, They plan to
23:42
Speaker 2: bury this guy and be done with yeah, only to
23:45
Speaker 2: just tattletale and say, oh, there's a body over there.
23:48
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, well we hit it. And how we got
23:49
Speaker 2: away with it for six months and no one knew anything.
23:51
Speaker 1: Well, here's the thing that's interesting, And I had to
23:53
Speaker 1: look this up because I wanted to be sure. During
23:55
Speaker 1: that six months that Jamie Carroll is buried in the basement,
23:59
Speaker 1: no one ever reports him missing. He's never reported missing,
24:02
Speaker 1: No one's looking for him.
24:04
Speaker 2: Well, that's sad.
24:07
Speaker 1: It is sad. And the only thing I could think
24:09
Speaker 1: is that I'm sure because of how he's in this
24:12
Speaker 1: meth world and he does.
24:14
Speaker 2: Drugs, they had any close family connection.
24:16
Speaker 1: Yeah, I assume that because of what he was involved
24:20
Speaker 1: in that no one was looking for.
24:22
Speaker 2: I had no pattern, no day job, or no anything
24:24
Speaker 2: where it's like always missing.
24:25
Speaker 1: Right, So then he's buried in a basement for a.
24:28
Speaker 2: Seconds, it's not going to like report him as like, hey,
24:30
Speaker 2: can you do welfare check on't he hasn't.
24:32
Speaker 1: Bought drugs in a while, yeah, right, so no one's
24:34
Speaker 1: reporting him missing. February fifteenth, twenty thirteen, starts Joey's trial.
24:40
Speaker 1: Here's where this whole situation goes wrong. I feel like
24:44
Speaker 1: they should have been tried together at the same time.
24:46
Speaker 2: I don't know how that works, though, Like, what is
24:49
Speaker 2: the why Why do you think they should have been
24:52
Speaker 2: tried at the same time.
24:53
Speaker 1: I think they should have been tried at the same
24:54
Speaker 1: time because when they do two separate trials, they put
24:57
Speaker 1: Joey on trial first, and then Jeffrey. He's the star
25:00
Speaker 1: witness who testifies against him, and I feel like it
25:04
Speaker 1: was detrimental to Joey that he went first, and that
25:08
Speaker 1: Jeffrey takes a plea deal and is the star witness
25:11
Speaker 1: and testifies against him, and then that jury finds him guilty,
25:15
Speaker 1: and then by the time jeff goes on trial, I
25:17
Speaker 1: feel like it's like they already figured it out.
25:20
Speaker 2: Well, no, not necessarily. I know that they when they've
25:22
Speaker 2: done separate trials, like you just said, sometimes they don't
25:26
Speaker 2: read the verdict until the second trial is done, also
25:31
Speaker 2: so that way you don't taint anything. I've seen that before,
25:34
Speaker 2: and they literally will read the verdicts at the same time.
25:38
Speaker 1: No, this was I don't know yeah, what I'm saying.
25:40
Speaker 2: Sometimes they've done that to not do as you suggested,
25:44
Speaker 2: which is kind of expose everything, kind of spoil the
25:48
Speaker 2: you know, spoil alerts kind of thing.
25:51
Speaker 1: I don't know. I just to me, I felt like
25:53
Speaker 1: they should have just been tried at the same time.
25:54
Speaker 1: I feel like they were both there, they both were
25:57
Speaker 1: involved in it. I feel like they should have just
25:59
Speaker 1: been let the jury decide the culpability on both of them.
26:03
Speaker 1: The same jury decide.
26:04
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, separate juris could find them both guilty, which
26:08
Speaker 2: could be could be conflicting if it's like no saying
26:11
Speaker 2: they both pulled the trigger.
26:20
Speaker 1: So in February fifteenth, the twenty thirteen Joey Bannis' trial
26:24
Speaker 1: begins and becomes a major local news story. Jeffrey testifies
26:28
Speaker 1: against him at his trial, saying that Joey killed Jamie
26:31
Speaker 1: and threatened him into helping him bury the body. Jeffrey,
26:35
Speaker 1: I don't like watching him talk or testify. He's described
26:38
Speaker 1: as cold, emotionless, condescending, and a psychopath. He appears to
26:43
Speaker 1: try to control the narrative during Jeff's Jeffrey's cross examination
26:48
Speaker 1: with the defense and online profile listing his turn ons
26:52
Speaker 1: causes everyone to question whether he was living out a fantasy.
26:55
Speaker 2: Oh, that's right, it's not his trial.
26:57
Speaker 1: It's not his trial, right. Joey's defense is cross examining
27:01
Speaker 1: him because he's testifying as a witness, and they bring
27:05
Speaker 1: up this like online profile of all these like crazy
27:09
Speaker 1: sex fetish things he's into. I didn't even know what
27:11
Speaker 1: these things were. I mean I I and they're asking
27:15
Speaker 1: him about it in court. First of all, it's very uncomfortable.
27:17
Speaker 1: I can't imagine like sitting up there and being like, yes,
27:20
Speaker 1: I do like to wear latex and plastic and do
27:24
Speaker 1: all these weird things. And then they were talking about
27:26
Speaker 1: something they had to do with like some kind of
27:28
Speaker 1: sex thing called water something, and then they asked him
27:30
Speaker 1: what that was, and he's like, well, that's that's when
27:33
Speaker 1: you pee. It's urine. I don't know. It was like crazy.
27:36
Speaker 1: This isn't just like like if there's kinky sex, then
27:40
Speaker 1: this is like, like, I don't know, crazy, Like off
27:44
Speaker 1: the charge, I had no idea. I never heard of
27:46
Speaker 1: it in my life kind of thing. No, not so much. No,
27:49
Speaker 1: I just felt very ugh, I felt very uncomfortable. Then
27:54
Speaker 1: a contractor testifies during the trial, Kenny Robertson is a contractor,
27:58
Speaker 1: and he says that Jeffrey and quiet about pouring concrete
28:01
Speaker 1: in the basement. Of course, what would be the next step, right,
28:06
Speaker 1: He says Jeffrey acted strange and would not go into the.
28:11
Speaker 2: For this concrete job.
28:12
Speaker 1: He says that Jeffrey acted strange and would not go
28:15
Speaker 1: into the room that needed to have the concrete. He's like,
28:18
Speaker 1: it's in there, it's over there. It's like, I don't
28:20
Speaker 1: want to go ahead, butt, it's over there. Just pour
28:21
Speaker 1: concrete in that room over there, the one that smells
28:24
Speaker 1: like dead decaying. Flush that way. Joey's attorneys struggle because
28:29
Speaker 1: making Jeffrey look guilty does not automatically make Joey look innocent,
28:33
Speaker 1: and Joey does not testify, even though he was set
28:36
Speaker 1: to at the beginning. He changes his mind, does not testify.
28:39
Speaker 1: He doesn't go on the stand. They do some interview
28:41
Speaker 1: of this guy named Kevin, who is Joey's ex boyfriend,
28:44
Speaker 1: probably just to get more of a in depth kind
28:47
Speaker 1: of dynamic as to who he is as a person.
28:52
Speaker 1: He tells the story that they moved in together in
28:54
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety two. He did not testify at Joey's trial.
28:57
Speaker 1: He only interviewed for this HBO series. One night, the
29:01
Speaker 1: couple took LSD and Joey became angry, broke glass and
29:06
Speaker 1: then picked up a piece of the glass and stabbed
29:09
Speaker 1: Kevin in the arm with it. Kevin called the police
29:11
Speaker 1: and kicked Joey out, but Joey moved in next door
29:14
Speaker 1: to him.
29:15
Speaker 2: It's very stressful living, I know, you know what.
29:17
Speaker 1: I feel like they included that because I was kind
29:19
Speaker 1: of like, why are they including this? And I think
29:22
Speaker 1: it was because they were trying to give I think
29:24
Speaker 1: because there's certain times when you're watching it where you
29:27
Speaker 1: feel badly for Joey because you think Jeffrey is the
29:30
Speaker 1: mastermind and everything and that he's the one controlling the
29:32
Speaker 1: relationship and that he's the one that probably pulled the
29:36
Speaker 1: trigger and killed the guy and got Joey to help
29:38
Speaker 1: him bury him in the basement. So then I think
29:41
Speaker 1: they show you this alternative side to Joey, with this
29:44
Speaker 1: history he has with Kevin, where he's violent, where he's
29:48
Speaker 1: doing drugs, he does LSD, he breaks the bottle, he
29:50
Speaker 1: picks up a piece of glass and he stabs Kevin
29:52
Speaker 1: with it. Because then it shifts you back to Okay, Well,
29:55
Speaker 1: maybe Joey is the violent one in the relationship, maybe
29:59
Speaker 1: he was the one that stabbed and shot Jamie Carroll.
30:04
Speaker 2: But are they're both guilty in the At the end
30:06
Speaker 2: of the day, they both like like, it's a technicality, right,
30:10
Speaker 2: It's like who actually did the stabbing, but they both
30:13
Speaker 2: were in on the killing. Put them both in jail.
30:16
Speaker 1: I agree, one hundred percent. But that's not what happens, all.
30:18
Speaker 2: Right, So Joee split the sentencing.
30:20
Speaker 1: Joey is found guilty by the jury. He is convicted
30:23
Speaker 1: of complicity to murder, robbery, and tampering with evidence. He
30:27
Speaker 1: reached a plea agreement to avoid the death penalty. However,
30:30
Speaker 1: he was sentenced to life in prison.
30:32
Speaker 2: How did the murder happen? Like, what's the story?
30:34
Speaker 1: They wanted to do drugs and watch porn and have
30:37
Speaker 1: like a sex orgy. So I believe it was Joey
30:40
Speaker 1: or Jeffrey. I don't remember. I think maybe it was
30:42
Speaker 1: Jeffrey that reached out to this guy named Jamie Carroll
30:45
Speaker 1: and said, Hey, why don't you come over and bring
30:47
Speaker 1: drugs and we'll, you know, hook up and do all
30:49
Speaker 1: these things. So I think they had a crazy drug
30:53
Speaker 1: filled night with all three of them being on drugs,
30:56
Speaker 1: and then they ended up in bed together and did
30:59
Speaker 1: all these sexual things together. And then I don't know
31:02
Speaker 1: what happened, but something happened where this guy got stabbed
31:05
Speaker 1: in the neck multiple times and shot, and I don't
31:09
Speaker 1: know what escalated it to that, and they each blame
31:12
Speaker 1: each other, and they don't talk about their gunshot. He
31:16
Speaker 1: got stabbed and a gunshot.
31:18
Speaker 2: I have any murder weapons, right, there's no like crime
31:22
Speaker 2: scene right, Because now it's six months later, I'm guessing
31:25
Speaker 2: there's not really anything.
31:26
Speaker 1: Right, you know, I don't know because they didn't go
31:29
Speaker 1: into that in the documentary. I don't know if they
31:30
Speaker 1: you know, sprayed luminol or tried to do any kind of.
31:33
Speaker 2: Red to the documentary. It's just testimonial.
31:36
Speaker 1: It's testimonial. I mean, they both admitted to their being
31:39
Speaker 1: a dead body, and they both admitted to being involved
31:43
Speaker 1: in burying the dead body. But at the end of
31:45
Speaker 1: the day, they both just point the finger at the
31:47
Speaker 1: other person. So basically it comes down to, from my
31:51
Speaker 1: point of view, if I was on the on the jury,
31:53
Speaker 1: this is why I wish they were tried together. I
31:54
Speaker 1: would have been like, you're just both equally guilty. Neither
31:57
Speaker 1: one of you cared about this guy's life. You buried
31:59
Speaker 1: him in the basement. You didn't tell anyone, all right.
32:02
Speaker 2: I only told someone because he got arrested, and you
32:04
Speaker 2: were probably trying to rat the other person out right exactly,
32:07
Speaker 2: lure them into the system.
32:10
Speaker 1: So Joey gets life in prison. Then on May thirteenth
32:13
Speaker 1: of twenty thirteen, this is when Jeffrey's trial begins. When
32:19
Speaker 1: Jeffrey's trial begins, Joey has already been found guilty of
32:22
Speaker 1: Jamie's murder. Jeffrey's defense attorney, Steve Romanz, is described as
32:27
Speaker 1: successful and well paid. The defense begins by playing a
32:32
Speaker 1: video of Joey admitting to the murder and claiming he's
32:35
Speaker 1: going to commit suicide. Okay, this video evidence is very
32:38
Speaker 1: interesting because they show this video in the beginning of
32:40
Speaker 1: the documentary.
32:41
Speaker 2: It's like the interrogation room or something.
32:43
Speaker 1: No, this is a self made selfie video of Joey
32:48
Speaker 1: sitting in front of the camera saying confessing to the
32:53
Speaker 1: murder and saying that he was the one that killed.
32:55
Speaker 1: I don't know if he uses Jamie Carroll's name at all.
32:59
Speaker 1: I don't think he uses his name. I think he
33:01
Speaker 1: just says, you know, I committed the murder and no
33:03
Speaker 1: one else had anything to do with it.
33:04
Speaker 2: This was video was made prior to the police getting
33:07
Speaker 2: involved or after.
33:08
Speaker 1: Prior wow, And they also showed that video at the
33:11
Speaker 1: beginning of the documentary. So in my mind, I'm thinking, well,
33:16
Speaker 1: we all solved, we know who did it, right. However,
33:22
Speaker 1: then the prosecution, the prosecution gets livid and she wants
33:25
Speaker 1: like a sidebar, and she goes up and they do
33:28
Speaker 1: a sidebar with the judge and everything, and she's the
33:31
Speaker 1: prosecutor's like, well, there's that's not the only video. So
33:35
Speaker 1: this video is kind of divided clip.
33:37
Speaker 2: So she's acting like it's a clip, right, and it's
33:39
Speaker 2: out of context.
33:41
Speaker 1: Right, And so the defense argues, we didn't alter it
33:43
Speaker 1: in any way or clip it in any way, and
33:45
Speaker 1: they didn't. But what happened is there were three video
33:49
Speaker 1: clips that were all made simultaneously.
33:51
Speaker 2: Like a snapshot of the text messaging. Right, there is
33:55
Speaker 2: a before.
33:55
Speaker 1: And after, and like what is the contexts?
33:58
Speaker 2: It's out of context and sometimes you can stand on
33:59
Speaker 2: the right.
34:00
Speaker 1: So then when they show when you're watching the.
34:03
Speaker 2: Documentary, so you saw the video. It's in the documentary.
34:06
Speaker 2: It's in the documentary, like smart allarchy about it? Is
34:09
Speaker 2: he smug? Is he sad?
34:13
Speaker 1: He seems sad? He points the camera.
34:15
Speaker 2: So when you it's almost like a like a he's
34:19
Speaker 2: like a vlog, like he's just kind of telling what happened.
34:21
Speaker 1: Well because he's because the point is he's saying he's
34:24
Speaker 1: going to commit suicide. It's a suicide video.
34:27
Speaker 2: It's almost a confession.
34:28
Speaker 1: It's like a confession, but then he's saying it was
34:31
Speaker 1: solely me. I'm the one who killed him, and like
34:33
Speaker 1: nobody else had anything to do with it. However, there
34:36
Speaker 1: are there is a beginning video clip that's a couple
34:39
Speaker 1: of seconds, there's the middle video clip, which is the confession,
34:41
Speaker 1: and then he kept the camera rolling a little bit
34:44
Speaker 1: at the end. So then when you watch all three
34:46
Speaker 1: parts together, the first video clip shows him with Jeffrey
34:51
Speaker 1: and Jeffrey's sitting on the bed and he's like setting
34:53
Speaker 1: up the camera. Then the middle confession, which is the longest,
34:57
Speaker 1: the longest video clip is him and saying that he
34:59
Speaker 1: did it nobody else. Then the third video clip, which
35:02
Speaker 1: the defense didn't show but the prosecution wanted in right
35:06
Speaker 1: is him saying after he does this confession, he says
35:10
Speaker 1: to Jeffrey, did I say everything he wanted me to say?
35:13
Speaker 1: Did I do it right? I hope, I like something
35:15
Speaker 1: to the effect of, like, did I say what you
35:18
Speaker 1: wanted me to say? So to me again, every time
35:21
Speaker 1: you think that you know what's going on and who
35:25
Speaker 1: is to blame or culpable in this case, something else
35:29
Speaker 1: happens where it puts you right back at square one,
35:31
Speaker 1: where you're like, again, I don't know, because when I
35:34
Speaker 1: watched the full video clips, all of them together, it
35:38
Speaker 1: really looks like Jeffrey is directing him and writing out
35:43
Speaker 1: and telling him what to say. Because also what he
35:46
Speaker 1: says is very it's a very legal jargon. So Jeffrey's
35:51
Speaker 1: very educated. He works in it, he's worked at colleges.
35:54
Speaker 1: He thinks he's the smartest person in the room. He's
35:56
Speaker 1: very condescending. So to me, that does not seem like
35:59
Speaker 1: language that Joey would use. You know, he's the bad boy.
36:03
Speaker 2: That you know, always the one that made the confession, right.
36:05
Speaker 1: But Joey's the one that made the confession. But I'm
36:07
Speaker 1: telling you the language he.
36:08
Speaker 2: Uses is doesn't It doesn't seem fitting to write his
36:11
Speaker 2: manner of speech.
36:12
Speaker 1: Right, it seems fitting to someone who's highly educated, who
36:16
Speaker 1: knows what legal verbiage to use. So to me, it
36:21
Speaker 1: felt as if he drafted it and somehow coerced him
36:24
Speaker 1: into reading it and making the video.
36:27
Speaker 2: That's what you would think based on that statement, right,
36:29
Speaker 2: And they're like, you, I'd like to admit the evidence
36:33
Speaker 2: of the que cards as written by Jeffrey.
36:35
Speaker 1: Right, So Joey agrees to testify against Jeffrey during Jeffrey's trial.
36:41
Speaker 1: He claims Jeffrey wanted Jamie gone so that they could
36:45
Speaker 1: take his drugs. I don't know why. I mean, I
36:47
Speaker 1: don't know.
36:48
Speaker 2: A handful of drugs.
36:49
Speaker 1: I know that part doesn't make sense.
36:50
Speaker 2: I'm like, dig a hole. That's a lot of work.
36:52
Speaker 1: I mean, that is a lot of work to murder
36:54
Speaker 1: someone just so you can like take their drugs. That
36:56
Speaker 1: made no sense to me.
36:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, like, come do drugs with right. Then they're like,
37:01
Speaker 2: don't use our drugs.
37:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, Okay, then this is the most uncomfortable thing I've
37:06
Speaker 1: ever seen in my entire life. Oh, I don't know
37:09
Speaker 1: if I want to hear The prosecution wants to play
37:13
Speaker 1: a sex video of the two of them, Joey and
37:17
Speaker 1: Jeffrey having sex. I believe the purpose is to show
37:22
Speaker 1: that Jeffrey is the dominant one in the relationship.
37:26
Speaker 2: That's a theory I never heard of.
37:28
Speaker 1: I think he's a top and Joey is a bottom,
37:33
Speaker 1: and this video of them having sex depicts Jeffrey as
37:38
Speaker 1: being very dominant and controlling.
37:42
Speaker 2: So they play that's the only thing they could do
37:44
Speaker 2: to bring in that he wears the pants in the family.
37:47
Speaker 2: That's the only thing they could do is show that
37:49
Speaker 2: sex video. I'm telling you, I have never find text
37:52
Speaker 2: messages or emails.
37:54
Speaker 1: I don't know for other videos. I cannot explain to
37:57
Speaker 1: you how out of.
37:58
Speaker 2: Showed the video and you watched it, Yes, dominating.
38:05
Speaker 1: It was so I have never been so uncomfortable in
38:09
Speaker 1: my entire life. I because, first of all, I'm putting
38:11
Speaker 1: myself not just sitting in my bedroom at night watching it,
38:14
Speaker 1: but they play it in open court, and I mean
38:16
Speaker 1: the jury is sitting there, the prosecution that I mean,
38:19
Speaker 1: the guy Jeffrey, he has to sit there while there's
38:21
Speaker 1: a video plate of him having sex with his boyfriend.
38:24
Speaker 1: And he's very verbal during this video.
38:26
Speaker 2: He's like, you're the dominating part. Guy.
38:28
Speaker 1: He's like, you're a bad boy, and you bad I mean,
38:32
Speaker 1: it's just I was like cringing, cringing, and I just
38:38
Speaker 1: kept thinking. And the judge, the judge, even.
38:41
Speaker 2: When the video was judge mail or female.
38:43
Speaker 1: It was a male judge. And when the video was done,
38:44
Speaker 1: he was like, I think we need to take a recess.
38:46
Speaker 2: And I was like, maybe he got excited recess.
38:50
Speaker 1: And then the prosecutor was saying that it was like
38:53
Speaker 1: the whole building, not just that I guess they were
38:57
Speaker 1: in Division III is where this trial was taking place.
38:59
Speaker 2: Did everyone have their ears against the wall?
39:01
Speaker 1: Yes, she was saying, like everybody was texting like they're
39:03
Speaker 1: playing porn and Division III and so like everybody's like
39:07
Speaker 1: coming in.
39:07
Speaker 2: And wait, okay, So who prosecutor wanted this edge?
39:12
Speaker 1: The prosecutor yeah, and the judge allowed it. And it
39:16
Speaker 1: was I can't even explain to you how uncomfortable and
39:23
Speaker 1: just how uncomfortable. I can't imagine just being like where
39:26
Speaker 1: do you look? I mean, do you watch? Do you
39:29
Speaker 1: look away? Do you do you.
39:30
Speaker 2: Look to then you can get be like your honor.
39:33
Speaker 2: The jury did not look at the screen during the
39:35
Speaker 2: entire video. They clearly can't make a judgment.
39:39
Speaker 1: I think they were also trying to show that jeff
39:41
Speaker 1: the prosecution was trying to show that Jeffrey was the
39:43
Speaker 1: dominant one, meaning that he would be the one that
39:45
Speaker 1: would murder someone and kill right, Jeffrey is found not
39:50
Speaker 1: guilty of murder. I don't even understand that. I don't
39:53
Speaker 1: understand what happened with the jury came back with their decision.
39:55
Speaker 1: They said not guilty. This is why I felt like
39:57
Speaker 1: they should have been tried together, because you're telling me
40:00
Speaker 1: that this guy, these two guys together have this this
40:04
Speaker 1: Jamie Carroll over and do this whole sex orgy with
40:07
Speaker 1: drugs and all the things, and then this guy ends
40:09
Speaker 1: up dead and buried in the basement. Also, by the way,
40:13
Speaker 1: they in order to fit him into the rubber made
40:16
Speaker 1: tub to bury him in the basement, they had to
40:19
Speaker 1: use a sledgehammer to break his knees so that his
40:23
Speaker 1: legs would bend backwards.
40:25
Speaker 2: Well, what how else would you suggest that I.
40:27
Speaker 1: Don't know, I didn't know that. I didn't know that
40:29
Speaker 1: was just common knowledge that you just know how to
40:32
Speaker 1: do that, Oh sledgehammer.
40:34
Speaker 2: Huh.
40:34
Speaker 1: So why would one person be found not guilty and
40:39
Speaker 1: any other way.
40:40
Speaker 2: Putting in the tub, in the tub, Why didn't they
40:42
Speaker 2: didn't throw it in the hole, you know, I don't know.
40:45
Speaker 2: All of a sudden they're like, oh, proper burial.
40:47
Speaker 1: I don't know why they felt like they needed to
40:49
Speaker 1: put him in a rubber mad tub. I don't understand
40:51
Speaker 1: that either. I felt like, if you're just gonna bury
40:52
Speaker 1: him in the dirt and you're gonna put limestone over
40:54
Speaker 1: the top of, like, why not just bury him? I know,
40:56
Speaker 1: I thought the same thing. I didn't get that either.
40:57
Speaker 1: I guess I don't know, but they did. They the
41:00
Speaker 1: rubber maids tub, and I believe the prosecution brought the
41:03
Speaker 1: rubber maid tub in or a similar one and like
41:07
Speaker 1: brought it in and put it in front of the
41:08
Speaker 1: jury as like a visual to be dramatic show.
41:11
Speaker 2: Like they squished him in here. Yeah, she brought a sledgehammer.
41:15
Speaker 1: So Jeffrey's found not guilty of murder. He is found
41:18
Speaker 1: guilty of stealing and tampering with evidence, and he receives
41:22
Speaker 1: eight years with parole. He serves only four years out
41:26
Speaker 1: of his eight year sentence, and then after being paroled,
41:30
Speaker 1: Jeffrey disappears from Kentucky and nobody knows where he is.
41:33
Speaker 1: And I even googled this to try to find out
41:35
Speaker 1: if there's been updates. Nobody knows where he is. He's
41:37
Speaker 1: like disappeared. If anyone knows where Jeffrey Munt is currently,
41:42
Speaker 1: please dm me because I would like to know. I
41:45
Speaker 1: assume he changed his name. I'm sure he's like changed
41:48
Speaker 1: his name after Here's why he disappeared, because they showed
41:51
Speaker 1: that video in court and he's mortified and he cannot
41:53
Speaker 1: go back to Louisville, and just he doesn't care about
41:56
Speaker 1: the murder. Be dead you think, I don't know. I
41:58
Speaker 1: don't think he's dead. He was released and then his
42:01
Speaker 1: friends that they interview said that they they heard that
42:04
Speaker 1: he was in Baltimore and that he worked at like
42:05
Speaker 1: a movie theater.
42:06
Speaker 2: He's kind of off the grid in the uh, in
42:09
Speaker 2: the drug world way, like where he's just kind of
42:12
Speaker 2: probably you know, under the table jobs, sleeping around different
42:17
Speaker 2: places and well, if any I mean kind of kind
42:19
Speaker 2: of like a day to day life like.
42:20
Speaker 1: That, well, I think he probably changed his name. He's
42:23
Speaker 1: probably living under an alias. No one wants to have
42:25
Speaker 1: the name Jeffrey Mont because you google that and yeah, anyway,
42:30
Speaker 1: if anyone knows where he is, please DM me. I
42:32
Speaker 1: would like to know where Jeffrey Mont is currently. I
42:34
Speaker 1: have not checked Instagram.
42:36
Speaker 2: We see the Instagram handle Jeffreymont. Yeah, okay, official, Jeffrey official.
42:44
Speaker 1: Right so blue check. So there's some more details that
42:48
Speaker 1: have come out. Joey claims that he was asleep when
42:52
Speaker 1: jeff said he was breaking down the door. This is
42:54
Speaker 1: in the original nine to one one call. That was
42:56
Speaker 1: their downfall, you know, those two dummies, by the way,
43:00
Speaker 1: I mean not that I want them to not receive justice.
43:04
Speaker 1: There was no justice perceived as far as Jeffreymont. He
43:06
Speaker 1: should have spent life in prison too. It bothers me
43:09
Speaker 1: that one of them is spending life in prison and
43:11
Speaker 1: Jeffreymont was out within a couple of years, and who
43:13
Speaker 1: knows where he is. But he's alive and well and living,
43:16
Speaker 1: I'm sure. So that bothers me. Don't you feel I mean,
43:19
Speaker 1: don't you feel like he should have received more time?
43:22
Speaker 1: I mean he was whether whoever plug?
43:25
Speaker 2: I don't like he gets two years and he gets
43:27
Speaker 2: out in four yeah, well eight years. It should be
43:29
Speaker 2: eight years. I mean, I know there's more to it
43:30
Speaker 2: than that. With population and good behavior. But he's in
43:34
Speaker 2: there for eight years. He's assigned to eight years. He
43:36
Speaker 2: should serve eight years. No, didn't even do that, I know.
43:40
Speaker 1: But my point is, regardless of who shot Jamie Carroll
43:44
Speaker 1: or who stabbed Jamie Carroll, both of them were there
43:47
Speaker 1: that night, both of them saw it happen. I don't
43:49
Speaker 1: know who was the one that actually killed him. Either
43:52
Speaker 1: one of them had the ability to turn the other
43:54
Speaker 1: one in and do the right thing, but they didn't.
43:56
Speaker 1: They crushed his kneecaps, ben put him in a rubber
44:01
Speaker 1: made tub, buried him below the house, put limestone, no.
44:04
Speaker 2: Intention of ever reporting anything exactly.
44:07
Speaker 1: So the fact to me they're both equally guilty. I
44:11
Speaker 1: don't know at this point, Like I don't care.
44:12
Speaker 2: It's the technicality of who pulled the trigger exactly.
44:15
Speaker 1: They both deserve life.
44:16
Speaker 2: And in conspiracies, when they find it to be a conspiracy,
44:21
Speaker 2: meaning they both agreed to commit the crime, right, then
44:24
Speaker 2: the person that pulled the trigger is no. Well, the
44:27
Speaker 2: person that didn't pull the trigger is just as liable
44:29
Speaker 2: as the person that pulled the trigger. So there's a
44:30
Speaker 2: conspiracy in like a bank robbery, right, and I'm the
44:33
Speaker 2: driver and all I do is drive up and you
44:35
Speaker 2: run out, rob the bank, get back in the car,
44:37
Speaker 2: and we drive off. I am just as guilty. I
44:40
Speaker 2: played an equal part in having that carried out exactly.
44:44
Speaker 2: So obviously I don't know the trial. We didn't, we
44:46
Speaker 2: weren't there for it. But they didn't find it to
44:48
Speaker 2: be a conspiracy.
44:49
Speaker 1: No, I guess because with a conspiracy, they would have
44:51
Speaker 1: had to have been some type of pre planning or
44:53
Speaker 1: a meeting of the minds that they were all had
44:55
Speaker 1: a joint What is it like you have to you're
44:57
Speaker 1: all working together towards us.
44:58
Speaker 2: And I'm guessing there's no probably never been a court
45:02
Speaker 2: case where there was a conspiracy amongst Matthewsers, because they're
45:07
Speaker 2: probably not organized enough to actually carry out a plant.
45:11
Speaker 2: All right.
45:11
Speaker 1: So Joey again, this is the details that have come
45:14
Speaker 1: out recently. I said. He claims that he was asleep
45:17
Speaker 1: when jeff called nine one one and said he was
45:19
Speaker 1: breaking down the door. He claims that Jeffrey had a
45:22
Speaker 1: hammer and was just banging on the door himself. But
45:24
Speaker 1: this is where these guys, this is the downfall, when
45:27
Speaker 1: they start calling nine one one on each other.
45:29
Speaker 2: I know it's so mistink because you know, there's kind
45:32
Speaker 2: of been drugs in the house too. Well, there's a
45:34
Speaker 2: dead body.
45:35
Speaker 1: There's a dead body in the house. So why they
45:38
Speaker 1: were calling nine one one on each other to.
45:41
Speaker 2: Their friends and they're like, it's been called over to
45:42
Speaker 2: solve our problems.
45:44
Speaker 1: Joey also claims that Jeffrey stabbed Jamie in the neck,
45:47
Speaker 1: but Jeffrey said that Joey sliced Jamie's neck. Now that
45:51
Speaker 1: is a small discrepancy. However, the injuries, according to the
45:55
Speaker 1: medical Examiner, are described as stab wounds and not slices,
46:00
Speaker 1: which matches up more with Joey's version of events. I
46:03
Speaker 1: don't know. I'll tell you if I had to pick
46:05
Speaker 1: one that actually pulled the trigger or actually did the
46:08
Speaker 1: stabbing or slicing or whatever of the knife, I would
46:10
Speaker 1: say it was Jeffrey Monty.
46:12
Speaker 2: I think he's a psychopath, which is why he was
46:15
Speaker 2: like the was he cunning and charming and yeah, I
46:18
Speaker 2: mean I know you didn't like that rubbed you the
46:19
Speaker 2: wrong way, but maybe, yeah, maybe he's more of a
46:22
Speaker 2: leader that way, right, Yeah, manipulative.
46:24
Speaker 1: Right. So then in February of twenty twenty four, so
46:28
Speaker 1: this was just pretty recently Joey gives a little bit
46:31
Speaker 1: of a new version of events. He claims that Jeffrey
46:38
Speaker 1: killed Jamie because he was jealous that Joey and Jamie
46:42
Speaker 1: continued being intimate while Jeffrey had to go to sleep
46:45
Speaker 1: and go to work the next morning.
46:47
Speaker 2: He's like, do you know how hard I work? Right?
46:49
Speaker 2: I'd pay these.
46:50
Speaker 1: Bills right, all right, thank you guys for listening. As always,
46:54
Speaker 1: if you have other recommendations, this was recommended to me,
46:57
Speaker 1: and I thought it was great. I thought it was
46:58
Speaker 1: very interesting. It had all the silly things that you
47:00
Speaker 1: can imagine. And I tell you, I tell you, I'm
47:04
Speaker 1: scarred for life. I have PTSD. I don't know if
47:06
Speaker 1: I will ever get over that court scene. So if
47:09
Speaker 1: you have any interest in watching the HBO series and
47:12
Speaker 1: you just want to watch that, just go ahead and
47:14
Speaker 1: go to part two, just kind of fast forward to
47:17
Speaker 1: the last you know, twenty minutes of the episode you
47:19
Speaker 1: get to see porn played during a court trial. Yes,
47:25
Speaker 1: it's very interesting. As always, please follow legally, Brunette, tell
47:29
Speaker 1: your friends and family, and if you have other cases
47:31
Speaker 1: that you would like us to discuss, please find me
47:34
Speaker 1: on Instagram and send me a DM because we love
47:36
Speaker 1: your recommendations, and thank you so much for listening