Latest / Learned the Hard Way with Kier Gaines / EP 8: Are You Living… Or Just Performing Survival? ft Dustin Ross

Transcript

EP 8: Are You Living… Or Just Performing Survival? ft Dustin Ross · Learned the Hard Way with Kier Gaines

• 0:06
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Learn the hard Way. My name is Kiyanes.
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: We talk about purpose, we talk about pressure, we talk
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: about what it actually takes become a full comprehensive man. Hey,
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: welcome to well going to Learn the hard Way. I'm
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: your host, ki Yes. I am a husband, I'm a father,
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: I'm a speaker, I'm a damn what am I? I'm
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: a homeowner. I'm a cousin. I'm a friend. I'm just
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: a boy sometimes. Man, I'm a sports fan and I
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: am a licensed therapist. It is my pleasure to be
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: your host. And on today's episode, if you looked at
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: the title, you know what we're talking about. You know
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: who we're talking to. But you know, I gotta get y'all.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: We got to take care of some business first. I
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: gotta set the can. I set the mood a little bit.
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: Man, it's your house. Man, I'm a guess. You know
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying. You ain't got to tell me to
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: take my shoes off.
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: I was anyway. You such a guest, bro, I'm not
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: telling you where the place and stuff, and you go
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: get your own water. Thank you.
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: That's what I've seen where you went to get it. Yeah,
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: I don't really do it when you left the room anyway.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: Oh, for so long as you pep game exactly. Nah,
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: I hate that have the entertaining bamage and you just
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: make yourself at home, all right. So there's something I've
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: been thinking about a lot, and I want to bring
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: it to the pod. And it's just about I heard
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: somebody on uh on on TikTok say, man men, we
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: losing our whimsy. Bro ain't got no whimsy, noing. And
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: there's something very unique about manhood. And I tell all
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: my homies who are moms, especially single moms, the little boys,
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: don't try to rush him in the manhood, because manhood
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: will come for that boy like a thief in the night.
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: It will drag him to the woods and you'll never
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: see him again. Yes it will. And when we talk
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: about just manhood in general, we don't we when we
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: talk about aging men and being in an Asian body,
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: I'm forty, and when we talk about men who are
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: over forty, we talk about two things. You talk about
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: a rectile dysfunction and we talk about muscle building. And
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: there's a whole world that's not physical for us that
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: still exists. Those things are important, don't get me wrong,
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: But there's more important things sometimes, like your ability to dream,
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: your ability to capture your wonder, to capture your whimsy.
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: My boy, you know you remember that joint where men
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: was just frolicking in the fields. Yeah, I remember that. Man.
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: I was there last weekend. You was frolicking. I was.
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: I was like, dog, call me next time. I need
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: a frolic so bad. These big cooking me life is
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: just cooking me. But we're gonna part in a second.
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: Let me get this intro out of the way real quick.
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: You know, sometimes when I go and I speak to
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: young men or even older men, sometimes I'll ask them
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: what do you want to do for a living? Like
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: what do you want to be? What do you want
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: to do? And sometimes it feels like they're trapped in
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: an old dream. Like you know, I set out when
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: I was eighteen nineteen to be a doctor, and now
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: you know, I'm a resident and I'm doing my thing.
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: Let's not even take it that big. You know, I
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: set out to just make sure that I could be
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: the man in the house and I can pay the
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: bills and I could take care of everything. It's like,
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: all right, but what do you want to be? Not
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: just want to take care of the bills and I
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: just want to make sure everybody good. Yeah, yeh, yeah yeah.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: But what do you want to be though, bro? And
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: he can't tell me because one of my homies said
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: it best. He said, manhood has more rules than a
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: strip club in Utah. And they can't do shit, can't
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: do Nathan. And one of the rules of manhood is
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: that you can't pivot and you can't dream because your
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: job is to be utility. Your job is to provide
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: in nothing else. So that's one of the things I
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: want to talk about today. There's an expectation about men
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: that at a certain age, we just got to have
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: it all together. You know, you even see it from
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: a man not to comfort nobody, but not to not
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: comfort nobody. These male relationship gurules. A real man knows,
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: a real man is gonna be certain, a real man
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: has all this stuff together. You'll see the girlies on TikTok.
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: If you broke it, you still broke. You can't date.
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: And there's this myth of certainty with men, like being
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: born with a Jimmy gives you an innate and intrinsic
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: ability to just be certain about stuff. And it does
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: not work that way. So when I was, now that
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: I'm forty, I'm in a different space. When I was
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: in my twenties, I was chasing women. I ain't gonna
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: chasing women. When I was in my thirties, I was
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: chasing money, and now in my forties, I'm chasing time
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: and peace. Uh So, a lot of people get on
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: one track and that's just what they do. But some
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: people pivot. Some men do one thing their whole lives
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: and decide, you know what, this ain't this, ain't this
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: ain't working. I want to do something different. And today
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: my guests did that. He was doing one thing and say,
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: you know what, Nah, I think I'm gonna do something different.
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: I'm going left. Nah, I think I'm gonna go right.
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: I think I'm gona think I'm gonna mix this thing up.
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: And it's really working for me. And I want him
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: to give all of us some game, not just y'all,
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: me included. So stay tould, we're gonna get into it.
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna let him introduce itself to yye and it's
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: gonna be a good episode. Let's grow. My name is
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: Dustin Ross.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: I am the person who invented the fry season and
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: a checkers.
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: That was really my claim to fame. From there, I started.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: Doing hair and then I also patented my smoke turkey
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: neckbone recipe as well is delicious. Thank you, yeah, thank
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: you believing. Okay, I'm in the book now. But my
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: name is Dustin Ross. I'm a host, I'm a writer,
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: i am a producer, I'm a comedian, and I'm just
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: im mediate personality man. And yeah, I love what I do.
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: I'm grateful to do what I do. And I took
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: a lot of turns to get where I am now.
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna take a whole lot of turns after this.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: So I'm excited to talk about the pivot. Yeah, yeah,
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: the pivot isn't important. I pivoted too, And I think
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: a common misconception is that the pivot is.
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: Easy or that it feels good. It's not, Man, it's not.
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: That's how you know you're talking to the wrong person
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: when people start saying shit like that to you.
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: Oh, it's so easy, you'll be fine. No I won't.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: That's how I know I need to do something different.
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: So I already know you're lying. You're not the person
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: for me to talk to nah. That's big facts.
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: I always say, oversimplification doesn't make the problem easier, just
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: you less prepared.
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yep. And it's all about preparation and strategy, man.
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: So I like to be in that seat. I like
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: to be in the seat of preparedness. You know what
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: I'm saying. That's best I can. It's best I can.
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: It's the key. Yeah, I'll be trying to be prepared.
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: But sometimes sometimes you crank that soldier boy. Yeah, sometimes
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: that's soldier.
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: Sometimes that's your preparation. You know what I'm saying. You
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: go through something and figure it out on the way. Oh,
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: let me do it this way right now. So it's
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: not always a plan, but you got to start somewhere.
• 6:36
  Speaker 2: You potting, bro, Yeah, you potting because Kat Williams got this, uh,
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: this famous line that I use in my speeches sometimes
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: I tell men all the time, like, bro, you gotta
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: practice being bad at stuff.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: You just gotta practice, and kept william saying you have
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: to do something. You be trash it and tryingsh tryingsh
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: it and it don't work. Trysh tryingsh it, trash and
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: it don't work. And I'm like, that's success. Yep. That's
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: it for real. That's it. That's it, man, that's it
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: who you do all. We know you as a host,
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: we know you as a podcast host, as this multi
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: hyphened personality. I love when black men have dimension and diversity.
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: We're not just one thing. But you did make this
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: pivot to comedy and you're doing really well. So my
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: first question is who you rocking with? Comedia like comediateally?
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: Who who? What kind of commedially is that a word? Comedia?
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: This is gonna be today? If that, if the other
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: guy could say that collector.
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: Or whatever he said.
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: West right, he ain't giving us a portal to walk
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: through verbally, right, because I feel like I can just
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: put the words together now and get to my point.
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: Jesse Jackson was the original though, yes he was man.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: Push you know what I'm saying, Push Jesse Jackson. Man,
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: Jesse wanted us to get money. But that's a whole
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: other comments. We're talking about that later. You know, that
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: was one of the first get money niggas.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: I knew of Jesse Jackson one thousand percent. He was
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: multi dimensional. Man, you're going don't don't do really because
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: that was also my frat brother man. Yeah, he was
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: on stage at my graduation and we members of Omegasif
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: Fire forty and he threw up the hooks to me,
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: beautiful man. It was. It was such a moment. Dog
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: who you rocking with?
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: Comic wise though, you know, like I'm traditional bro like
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: old school deaf comedy, Jam Martin Lawrence, Eddie Murphy. You
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: know what I'm saying, All the Gretes, Red Fox, you
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: know what I'm saying, even some of some more.
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying.
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: I love some early Monique man like that's that's really
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: like my pocket Bruce, Bruce, Patrese O'Neill.
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, rest in peace, But I
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: like that land. I'm very.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: Very black in my humor and my lens and through
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: black life experiences. You know, it kind of shapes some
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: of my perspectives on things, and it has been highly
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: influential to my style. So I like to laugh. We're
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: gonna say some cuss words, you know what I'm saying. Yeah,
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: it might be a few. You know what I'm saying.
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: We're gonna go past the shipping damn line over into
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: the motherfucker.
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: Area and we're going to the bad. Yeah, we're going
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: in there, but just listen. It's all about laughing.
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: It's all about relatability, and there's always got to be
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: a service piece for me because I think mans when
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: you tell jokes and you make people laugh, you gotta
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: make them think.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: So if I have your attention for ninety minutes and
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: I'm on this stage, we're gonna talk about some important issues.
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: We're gonna laugh about them, but we're gonna be encouraged
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: to think about them through laughing.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: That's the service piece, you know what I'm saying. That's
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: important to me.
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: A lot of people just like to talk shit, say
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: shocking stuff, which I love doing that too.
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: That's the fun part.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: But to me, I always have to make sure my
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: audience leaves with something or their move to think, you know.
• 9:39
  Speaker 1: What I'm saying one way or the other.
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: I got on stage in Atlanta and told a joke
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: about Donald Trump kids looking like the white people in centers,
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying, And there were some white
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: guests and the audience that walked out and I couldn't
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: see nothing from the stage because that light it's like
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: you're in the dentist's office.
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: It's bright. Yeah, it's still all the way your face,
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: and I gotta si, I'm definitely not okay, So you
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: don't know which way you're looking at that time. But
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: they left.
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: There was two heterosexual white couples, guys and girls, and
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: you know, my blood cousins was in the audience, and
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: of course they was watching the audience, not me, and
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: so they told me that the women were visibly uncomfortable
• 10:19
  Speaker 2: with my jokes and the guys that they were with
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: were laughing. But ultimately they you know, encouraged them to leave. Now,
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: you know, if I would have seen them walking out,
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: I would have gave them a doggie bag from that stage.
• 10:29
  Speaker 1: Would have got something to take with them.
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: But I say that and share that to say, there's
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: a service there, you know what I'm saying, because even
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: through their joke, I encourage people kind of look at
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: what's going on right now, you know what I'm saying,
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: look at it, and so much so to the point
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: where people were visibly moved and physically moved to get the.
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: Fuck out of the room. I was proud of that.
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: I was proud of that. You're talking about some shit now,
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: because comedy does more than just make people laugh. Comedy
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: it gives you medicine inside of like a fruit roll lover.
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: It's something that's more tasting, salable. And one of the
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: things that happens is when atrocities happened in the world
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: and people are suffering, folks have the privilege of not
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: looking at it. Yeah, and comedy holds up that mirror
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: and it makes you laugh. But when it's too when
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: it cut too close to the bone, ha ha ha
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: ha ha, it ain't as funny no more. And now
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: you're left with the reality of what's being said and
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: what exists. Yeah, girl, So yeah, that is a service piece.
• 11:28
  Speaker 3: Man.
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: I never I guess I never thought about it as
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: service because I'm too busy laughing my ass yeh, which
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: is good. Yeah, which is good.
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: But to me, that's our privilege, it's our responsibility, and
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: it's a privilege. You got a room full of However,
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: many people are in the room, right but you got
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: their attention for an hour and a half. What you're
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: talking about, especially now with all this shit going on,
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: what are you talking about?
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: You got to make it count. To make it count,
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: I don't like wasting time. Two of my favorite comedians
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: right now, because I'm a comedy head. Okay, Ryan Davis,
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: that's my dog in real life. Okay, he's a fool man.
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: He get on my nerves, but that's that's my man.
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: He's brilliant and alis hilarious man, brilliant story. Just just
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: I mean, he gonna he gonna slow burn you though.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: You gotta be patient, but it always pays off in
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: its so good at that when you talk about all
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: the things you do, I ain't gonna lie, bro, your
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: resume is kind of crazy. That's like a CVS receipt,
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: Like I do this and this and this and this
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: and this, this and this, but did Sometimes when you
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: do a lot of things, it's hard to figure out
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: what the one thing you do is what your special
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: sauce is. And I know when people ask me about
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: my future, I'm not always certain because I ain't think
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: I lived to be forty. I thought i'd die in
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: the streets is twenty one like all my homies and
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: they big brothers. So I find myself in a place
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: where I kind of OutKick my coverage. But with everything
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: that you do, now is this did you set this
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: path for yourself? Like did you say all right, I'm
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: gonna do this and this and this and this and
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: this or was this like a spiral pass from ten
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: yall line is telling the brand basket and you took
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: it to the end very much like that. I got
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: it across the finish line. Man.
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: I was originally working in labor relations in Michigan.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: What the fuckus that?
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I was working with the United Auto Workers, so
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: like the labor unions that further people.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: And yes, I worked with the.
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: Organization of the unionization of the group of people, so
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: like we man sure they had proper benefits or negotiated
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: health care for them, things like that on a national
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: level for like the companies that we were associated with.
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: That was stressful, man, because I was working with a
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: bunch of people who had gotten hired into their positions
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: at eighteen, nineteen years old and been making six figures.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: This is twenty years ago, you know, fifteen years ago
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: making six figures. You know what I'm saying. No furthering
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: of their education, no encouragement.
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: To do so.
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: They was just straight raise their family, sent their kids
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: to college. Like they didn't want to hear what somebody
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: younger had to say.
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: They came in. So that was high stress.
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: We were working with people in rural parts of the
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: state of Michigan, building labor unions for the childcare providers,
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: knocking on doors, getting called, you know, horrible names and shit,
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: and I was calling them back. If I'm gonna get
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: fired for something, it's gonna be for cutting your ass.
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: Fuck back out because your mama won you know what
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: I'm saying. But I had to deal with that and
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: it was very highly stressful. I needed to change in
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: my environment. Man, and I'm from Michigan. My parents been
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: married for over fifty years. My father and mother encouraged
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: us to like take care of ourselves and be responsible
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: and pursue some sort of stability, but there really wasn't
• 14:39
  Speaker 2: an awareness of fulfillment beyond stability and security, you know
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying.
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: That's such a good point, Yeah, yeah, because there's so
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: much more than just that. That should be a baseline,
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: not a ceiling, you know what I'm saying. Yeah, And
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: sometimes when that is your ceiling, you can impart that
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: on your children where they can see everything that they
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: could possibly be because you you can only take them
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: as far as you can go. God bless you. But
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: if you never saw the vision for yourself, how can
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: you see it for your.
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: Children exactly, and a lot of people just doing the
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: best they can and so, but I knew it was
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: more for me because fuck that, you know what I'm saying. So,
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: after I got exhausted from doing their work and being
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: in such high stress environments, my sister was living in
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: New York City and she was able to help me
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: find a place for me to stay, like my own place,
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: and I moved to New York to try to act.
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: I was like, fuck it, I'm moved to New York
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: and just be an actor. I want to do that,
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: like on your busting tables. In the daytime, I.
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: Was taking all kinds of jobs I worked at, like
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: an insurance company. I quit trying to have a traditional
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: nine to five that would consume so much of my time.
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: Started working an overnight job and auditioning for shit during
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: the day.
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: No sleep.
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: Didn't know what I was doing, got in a bunch
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: of acting classes and just started pounding the pavement. But
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: in six months I booked an independent film right called
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: The Skinny that took off and became like this cut
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: classic and garnered a lot of exposure. At the time,
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: I recognized the value in the Q and a space
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: when we were screening the film. I felt like that
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: was a good way for me to show some depth
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: or show that I had a little bit more to
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: offer than just what they saw on the screen.
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: So I did it.
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: I capitalized on every Q and A session we had
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: with the audience that watched our film, And somebody was
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: in the audience watching the film and saw me doing
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: that and offered me a guest spot on a podcast.
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: That turned into an offer to have my own show,
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: which turned into a show that I co host with
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: two of my close friends called The friend Zone. That's
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: over ten years. We made ten years last year, okay,
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: and that opened the door to several other opportunities and
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: it's just been one thing after another from there.
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: That's crazy. Yeah, let me jump in my therapist bag
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: for one second, so if I hear you correctly, you know,
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: we gotta say that type you started in one way,
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: and what it sounds like to me is you kind
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: of sifted through. You took a chance, You didn't really
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: know exactly how it was going to end, but you
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: put yourself in a position to make the next step
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: make sense. And I think a lot of times when
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: I be talking to people they got these dreams, like
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: they're gonna do the Britney Spears shit where you sleep
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: in your car and then you an overnight celebrity, and
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: then they're like, bro, yeah, you know that to be
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: Britney Spears story because Brittany made it. For every Brittany Spears,
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: there's forty thousand people who are probably almost as talented
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: as her, who you will never know the names of.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: Because you can't just put all your eggs in one
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: basket and then like just just hope and dream and
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: fall off a cliff. I hope somebody catches you. You
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: gotta climb down that joint, rock by rock until you
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: get to the bottom.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: Man, and you know nothing at the beginning of your journey. No,
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: you think that you know where your destination is. You
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: think that you know what it is that you want.
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: But my goals have evolved so much as my exposure
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: has grown, as I've seen how.
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: Other people live, being different places.
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: Man, my desires and the things that the ship I
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: want to do has changed, and it's things that I
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: never would have even thought of when I first moved
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: to New York fifteen years ago. You know what I'm saying,
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: so it's just a it's a path. But to answer
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: your question, yes, mine was definitely spiral. It was not
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: a straight path to where we are today.
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: Man. That that just makes me think because I get
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: this question all the time, like where do you want
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: to be and what do you want to do? Where
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: do you see yourself in ten years? Like I don't fucking.
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, shut up, shut the fuck up. Man away from
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: you with these stupid ask questions. That's why I want
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: to But you know what I meant it.
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: I think it's a projection because a lot of people
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: are uncertain about what their next steps are. You're kind
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: of looking for you to be the light how And
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: it's like, nah, bro, I don't always know what's going
• 19:02
  Speaker 1: to happen next. But I know that I'm always put
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: myself in a position to be the wrong person to
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: give an opportunity to because I'm exploit that joint. I'm
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: taking it and running.
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: You understand me, man, I'm getting I'm getting down the field.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean?
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: Because I know that I want I know I know
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: the area that I want to land. You know what
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: I'm saying. I know I know in general that I
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: want success.
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: I want to.
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: I don't have children, so I want to My legacy
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: is really important to me. With like the work that
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: I do, I want to leave a trail of impactful projects.
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: I want to encourage other people that have similar life
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: experiences and shit to me to try and take chances.
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: So it's just a lot of things I want to
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: do that have materialized into different paths, different you know, areas.
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: Let's let's go with that. Let's lead into that you
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: talk about impactful work and that you do in a legacy.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: You have a podcast that's been going for ten years. Yes,
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: most people can't get three years out of the pop up.
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: And I'm sure you get recognized and you get the
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: love and you get the admiration from people who are
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: on the streets. But I want you to talk a
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: little bit about like the longevity of it though, because
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: you could do anything well, but to do something well
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: for a long time it's a completely different animal. Yeah, So,
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: like what goes into that, Like when you see people
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: as their love, are you on the right side of
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: the internet, what does that feel like? And does that
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: contribute to how you keep this joint going? Yeah?
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: Man, to me, it's all about authenticity, right, when you're
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: in the mounds of people and connecting with people, right
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: when we create projects that have to be consumed by people.
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: And the only thing that makes me connect to people
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: is if our peep that they're authentic. Right, if I
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: feel like we can sit down and you actually present
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: you respecting me, I'm respecting you, and I can tell
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: you not trying to bullshit me. I'm gonna like you,
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying, and I'm gonna be more
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: interested in you in what you have going on.
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: That's just a people rule.
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: And that same logic or approach applies in the business
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: that I'm in. You know, I'm in the business of
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: opinion and commentary. I have conversations for a living, and
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: there's trust involved in that. So I just try to
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: show up as myself, be honest about my feelings about
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: my experiences, both positive and negative, and I try to
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: be a good person here.
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying.
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: I try to show up in a way that people
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: will respect me after I leave, you know, because they
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: can see a quality that makes them want to connect.
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: And that's important to me. Man sincerity and authenticity. So
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: I feel like that's the through line you know what
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: I mean, and I get love. Some of the times
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: people ain't happyeople what I have to say, But I
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: don't give a fuck. You know what I'm saying, I
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: could get good. I hope it burnt when I said it.
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: I hope you felt hot somewhere. You know what I'm saying.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: I'm glad it made you mad. I don't care about that.
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: I'm more interested in the people who may even disagree
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: with me. But I appreciative of having a conversation.
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: Yea, you just burn through about eight months of therapy
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: for real, man. Yeah. Yeah, that's a lot of what
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: it is, especially when I talk to creators because and
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: somebody got into a fight with me on threat, Well
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: they got into a fight. I didn't into a fight.
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: I didn't care, but they were talking. I say, I
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: think authenticity is the next wave, because you know, I
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: can't escape the fact that I'm also on influencer. Influencers
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: had this moment right after the pandemic with everyone's like,
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: oh my god, guys, I have this new product to
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: show you.
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: Hey guys, yeah, all that finger tapping exactly.
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: Man, I'm like, hey, I think the world is changing.
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: That shit looks fake. I think they needed to be
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: more themselves and people was mad that I said that.
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: I said, I think brands are looking for authenticity. You
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: have to be yourself. People aren't looking for the life
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: they want to have. They're looking for a reflection of
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: the life that they have and the people that they
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: bang with. Sincerely, my thing is this, what is that?
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: That's how I see When I have experiences like that,
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: I feel like that's not my audience. Because what you
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: just shared was advice you gave people of gems right,
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: what is that to take umbridge where they get mad about?
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: But that's because you're the type of person you are,
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: bro not everybody. Remember we just talked about the mirror
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: in comedy. Sometimes your truth reveals the truth to somebody
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: that's living and they hiding self a part that they
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: tuck deep away so nobody else will see. And some
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: people don't know how to be authentic on camera because
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: they don't know how to be authentic in their real lives.
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: If you don't practice that shit every day, you can't
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: cut a camera on it. Just be that. So when
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: you sit in here and you're talking to me about authenticity,
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: I'm vibing with you. Doug, because if I can smell
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: somebody bullshitting me a mile away, a mile away, and automatically,
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: it makes me think like you got an angle the
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: point of view. Trust you. I can't trust you. I
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: don't know what's in front of me. Brouh and humans
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: you take away, the shoes, you take away, the clothes,
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: you take away, the lights and electricity, the internet, the
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: cause of chat GPT, and we're just animals and what
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: do humans look for? And the most animalistic, the most
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: animalistic part of our existence. Connection And if you can't connect,
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: you ain't got nothing. My homie Frank, when I was
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: in grad school, he's a great therapist. Man. My homie
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: Frank was we had this crazy internship and afterwards we
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: was riding a train home and we was just talking
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: about therapy and how we going to be therapists. One
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: day and he said, man, you know you can read
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: all these books and shit. You can know all the modalities.
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: You will know what the axis one and two diagnosis is.
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: You can look at somebody and say, oh, that's biopolar
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: type one with schizophrenia. And you can do all of that.
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: But if you can't sit in a room across from
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: another human being and feel yourself, feel your way around
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: that person. You never be an effective therapist, and that
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: translates to everything, especially comedy. If you can't feel your
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: way around an audience, feel your way around the room.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: So if you out there, man, that resonated with you,
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: If that's resonant, if you think that makes sense, I
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: just want you to take a moment, don't judge yourself
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: for and say, oh, I'm not there authentic. Ask the question,
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: what is the blockade between me and true authenticity? Yeah?
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: What are you afraid? The man?
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: You know, we black men, So we already walking into
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: the world with a necessary defense right right, because of
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: what we're facing anyone.
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: So I think that that kind of.
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: Emboldens us sometimes and makes us more able to understand
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: challenges and able to understand, you know, things not maybe
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: going the easiest. Sometimes we overidentify with that. Sometimes you
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: know what I'm saying, But there's a strength in that.
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying, That is inherent and it's automatic,
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: almost right, because we got to get up and do
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: what the fuck we gotta do. And I lean on that.
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: Man.
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: When I first started working in media and then entertainment,
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: I would be in a lot of rooms with people
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: who I felt were more prepared for the opportunity than me.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: But I knew the only way I would be prepared
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: is through experience, you know what I mean. So I
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: would have to just lean into whatever makes me confident,
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: whatever I feel the strongest ing, whatever I feel you know,
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: I've mastered and I can lean on that. And so
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: that's what carried me through a lot of spaces. Now,
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: I don't give a fuck. I'll sit next to any
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: damn by almost anybody. But I'll sit next to almost
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: anybody now and talk to you and get whatever I
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: need to get done, or connect or just have a
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: good conversation, whatever it is.
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: I think that's what makes you special, bro, Because Freddy
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: Gibbs got the song called Jesus. Yeah, it's my favorite
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: Freddy gibbs on at the end he was like, what's
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: up with you? Bro? You covered in other people? You're
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: looking up what other people got? Yeah, pull me over.
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: There can sell dope real good, but that's not your lane.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: God gave you hands, brother, You a chef. Boys and
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: Barry krim brew late for real spatchcock, that chicken. That's
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: what you need. To be doing.
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: Man, Yeah, you gotta pull that backbone out there, motherfucker.
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: I don't even know what spatchcock means. Where you said it,
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: I know exactly what it means.
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: You ever see a chicken look like it's getting arrested.
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: The chicken just be flat like this, laid on the
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: damn bottom of the thing. It's been spatchcocked. They put
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: a backbone out that.
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: Mother. Oh when that joint flat on both sides. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: like hands up that. You know what I'm saying.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm gonna use that to sound smart around see
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: see we helping each other, man, You know what I'm saying.
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: Mutually beneficial man. Oh yeah, that's spatchcock is crazy. Nah,
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: that's that's that's that's valuable insight man. Yeah. And whenever
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: I'm talking to people in the world, because even most
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: of my clients aren't black men, but my black men clients,
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: I lean into him and I always say, you gotta
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: find out who you are and who you're comfortable being,
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: and lean into it. Bro God, lean into it. It's
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: gonna be parts of yourself that you may not like. Yeah,
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: you may not like necessarily get familiar with it. You
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: don't have to like it, but you gotta acknowledge that
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: it is, because you gotta understand it. You know, I
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: ain't gonna go crazy for nobody. Man, I ain't worth it, bro,
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: I'm not.
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: I like my mind. I like knowing what shit is.
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying. I like I like a
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: mastery of my space. I'm not losing it for nobody.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: I like to know where I am exactly physically and
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: where I'm going. Yeah, definitely where I'm going, at least
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: where I'm on the way to. Man, you know what
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: I'm saying. So I like, I just refuse to allow
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: myself to be susceptible to any sort of unnecessary negative
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: forces when it comes to my mere existence. You know
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying. I'm a black man. You know what
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: I'm saying. I practice homosexuality on the weekend. So like,
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying. So like, I ain't got time.
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: I got a lot of shit against me working against
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: me just walking out into the world. Yeah, so I refuse,
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: you know to I have a lot more respect for myself.
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: I feel like I deserve certain shit, man. I feel
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: like I deserve happiness. I deserve to feel what it
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: feels like to be fulfilled. You know what I'm saying
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: after doing something you proud of. I deserve to be happy.
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: I deserve to be to be to feel joy and shit.
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: I deserve to celebrate my milestones all that shit. And
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: so just because a person might not like something about
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: me or my life, I just have been. I've created
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: a life where I'm determined to not be affected by that,
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: whatever that means. You know what I'm saying, You might
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: have to put your elbow on the bridge, as somebody
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: knows a time or two. You know what I'm saying,
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: You might have to you might have to throw them,
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying, Like like you're out there
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: with uh at the palace back, yeah, you know with Indiana,
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: And you know, I don't want to let the moment
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: pass man, because I think it is something even in
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: you referenceing just this being a black male space, and
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: I feel like in black male spaces won't make room
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: for like even black any.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: Type of queer identity. Yeah. And oh and sometimes when
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: I'm talking, I'll say things and I'd be like, you know,
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: whoever your partner is, because I'm like everybody in the
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: room dog, I grow up. Every dude in the room
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: don't necessarily like girls. But these men still need to
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: be able to navigate relationships in a healthy way. Man
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: they do.
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: Man's think about it like walking around with a holding
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: a secret like that. Man not to eat a motherfucker alive,
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: especially something connected to your identity or self worth, if
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: your value in the world. People telling you you're not
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: good enough, or you don't count or because you that
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: you less than or whatever like that shit can really
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: really put a person in a state of mental turmoil.
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: Bro.
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: And we've seen a lot of bad, worst case scenario
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: endings with people who have struggled with For sure, that's
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: certain internal conflict. You know what I'm saying to me personally,
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna whoop your ass for I deal with that.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying from Flint, Michigan, Bro. And
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: the insult is an insult to me. You just insulted me.
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: So we're gonna handle that. But that comes with a
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: lot of time, a lot of lived experience, and a
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: lot of just forced decision making because of your the
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: external factors that are impacting your life. You forced to
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: decide how you're gonna view yourself.
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: And I would imagine in that situation. Man, A lot
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: of times the world tells you who you are before
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: you have a chance to figure it out, bro, and
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: we look it shows up differently, you know what I'm saying.
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: I have so much respect for the strength of the
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: queer community right because people think that it's just a
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: choice people make to get attention or whatever, but it's not.
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: Some people are just more expressive.
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: And it's niggas who ain't even gay that's expressive and
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: they're aesthetic or whatever that are getting ostracized and harassed
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: and shit that don't deserve it, you know what I mean.
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: I think there's a strength in that when you decide
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: you just don't give a fuck and you're who you
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: are without causing harm to other people. But you will
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: cause harm to other people. I think that that's beautiful,
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: and I think that that's a story that is not
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: told enough. I think we need to talk more about
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: the strength a strong game. You got to be strong
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: to be gay. You know how they in.
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: My neighborhood you gotta be always fighting. They always gotta fight,
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: And that's that's not the dude, you want to fight
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: because even fighting since he with seven and everybody.
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: It ain't no tough guy act like, ain't nobody trying
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: to be big dog or whatever. But it's a lot
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: of people that's not going to tolerate that level of
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: disrespect because it hits different you and me based on
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: like who I am as a person. Shit, I can't
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: change you know what I'm saying. And so for somebody
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: to attack that, it's the meaning in a way that is,
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: it's angering at a level that is higher than typical
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: disrespect or typical conflict. You know, you feel like you.
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: Have to like that, Bro, that's a reality that I
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: never had the experience, you know. So then that I
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: got a question, man, Okay, Like this is the people
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: at this point we're talking about attacking who you are
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: and your identity. And when you talk about any type
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: of queer identity, you get in it. And like any
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: type of space like a barbershop space with men, you
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: getting it in your religious spaces for sure, and your family,
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: Like how do you what do you draw on in
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: order to move through the world with confidence? Knowing that
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: these people have conceptions about you, misconceptions about you. You
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: know what it does?
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: Man, At least for me, I speak for myself. It
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: made me a thousand times more appreciative for the people
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: that show up in my life and are genuine in
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: that way.
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: You love me for real, you know what I'm saying.
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: You fuck with me for real.
• 33:38
  Speaker 2: Take the sexuality out of it, but just you. Because
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: you experienced hardship on that level of you experience shunning,
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: or you experience you know, just just people not being
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: able to get with the program of just respecting you
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: in general. You be angry with those people, but you
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: also The weirdest thing happens because you become so much
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: more appreciative of the people that are in your life
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: and you lean into the good. You're much more aware
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: of how you show up in other people's lives. You
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: become the best friend to everybody you can. You become
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: the best uncle, you become the best coworker. You just
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: focus more on people having a good experience of you
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: and you having one of them than you do the
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: negative shit. It makes you so much more appreciative. Man
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: like my friends and shit, my friends know that I
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: love them, and I know they love me. My brother,
• 34:28
  Speaker 2: I talked to my brother twice already today. We had
• 34:30
  Speaker 2: to be here at nine thirty. My brother is eight
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: and a half years older than me, and my brother
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: don't play about me never have. You know what I'm saying.
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: It cuss me out when the gay shit came out,
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: not because I was gay, but because I didn't tell him.
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: When did it happen? When all that comes, I was
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: like twenty five.
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: My parents know I started fucking niggas when I was
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: like two thosese, but I was like twenty It was
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: fun and taboo, you know what I'm saying.
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: Was talking about it, I was like, oh, it's a shit,
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: it's a secret. Hell yeah, and it feels good right,
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: you know.
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: But once like my family found out, and shit like
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: my sister found out and my cousin, my dad, you know,
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: my mom, my brother. But me and my brother are
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: so close and my sister are so close. I was
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: terrified in them finding out because I didn't want our
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: relationship to change.
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: And both of them cuts me out, like yo, don't
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: ever disregard me.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: I don't give a fuck about who you laying up
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: with nigga like brough you Hell yeah. And my family
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: go hard. They support me. They come to my shit
• 35:25
  Speaker 2: like I just had. I'm from Michigan. I just had
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: to sold out showing Detroit back in December. My mama
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: was there, like my cousins, everybody my family supports me,
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying in that way, And it's
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: weird because a lot of my family are Jehovah's witnesses,
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying. So there's a there's another
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: layer there, right of we can just that's a whole
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: nother I'll be back for episode two with that.
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: Oh, we definitely want to. I just I share all
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: that to.
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: Say that when it's a lot of things working against
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: you and against the way that you value yourself and
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: how you look at yourself and the worth that you see,
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: the value you see, it just makes you so much
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: more appreciative of the goodness, and that makes you want
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: to lean into that. It makes you want to say, well,
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: you know what y'all said that I'm not good enough
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: for I'm not supposed to even be here, I'm gonna
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: die because you know I'm a homosexual or whatever.
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: Then let me make my life and my time.
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: Here so fucking impactful and so good and so valuable,
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: so full of goodness that it trumps all that other shit,
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: y'all talking, damn bro, because I ain't finna die for y'all.
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying. I ain't gonna say that,
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: but I'm finna die for y'all. You know I'm not.
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna be happy and I'm gonna get everything I
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: deserve out of life, and I don't care who don't
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: like it. Man, I rather lean into being a good
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: person to the motherfuckers that do.
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: I think. First off, Man, I appreciate you even sharing
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: that with me. Man, that's special to me because I
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: think oftentimes when I'm in spaces with man, it's changed
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: a lot, at least to my side, it's changed a
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: lot where you know, the homophobic shit, it's not as
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: prevalent like niggas. After a while, I was like, all right, bro,
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: wrap that ship up, you know, but it's still very
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: much like they masculinity and I used to be one
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: of the dudes. It was a threat to my existence man,
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: until I had my first gay coworker, and Man, to
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: this day, I love that dude so for you, and
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: it made it real. I got a chance to see
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: the human beyond presentation, beyond anything. I got a chance
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: to see him and he's still to this day. Man.
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: He one of the realist dudes I've ever met in
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: my life. He asked me to call him Strawberry. I'm
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: never calling him strawberry.
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: He would be you cut anybody out asked you to
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: call you strawberry.
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: You're six feet forty years old. He probably quite thirty seven.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: But I love him so much magazine. He don't play
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: about his name. He got strawberry blonde head. Everybody in
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: DC gonna know who he is. When I say he
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: don't play, shout out Strawberry. That's that's my dog man.
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: But it allowed me to humanize that man.
• 37:59
  Speaker 2: That's what it It takes you seeing people. It takes
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: you seeing people have life and human experiences that darn
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: have nothing to do with their sexuality. You said you
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: met him, he was your gay coworker.
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: Y'all got close. You say he's my friend, he's your friend.
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: You saw him going through life. Shit.
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: They didn't have nothing to do with him being gay.
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: You got to know him as a person. It made
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: that real for you. It made you understand that these
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: are real people who have real feelings going through the
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: same challenges were going through in life, the same shit.
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: It's not even in a different font, it's literally the
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: same shit.
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: There's another layer there because they're facing challenges based on
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: that too. So on top of all that shit that's
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: fucked up and tough about life, you think I'm about
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: to be sitting here stressed out worrying about whether you
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: don't like me or not because you know I'm gay.
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: I'm already a black man. I'm playing this shit on
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: all mad my, nigga, then you're gonna take that, You're
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: gonna blindfold my. So that's why for me, it's just
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: a full stop when it comes to the homophobia shit.
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: To disrespect all of that just I don't tolerate none
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: of that. Ship.
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: So I'm already going through enough, and you got the
• 39:04
  Speaker 2: gall to think that your view is that important to
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: like do what to me? It'll funk about you. I'm
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: gonna talk about your daughter here. You know what I'm
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: saying in the back. You feel me, not you, you know,
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: I know what you said. I just thought about that way.
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: He got a doctor, I know, I know, but then
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: motherfuckers hell yeah, not me, but fuck them though.
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, bro, it's just about respect man. General. Bro, if
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: you listen to this joint. This was not the way
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: that we were talking about pivoted. Pivoted to something that's
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: still very important, man, because a part of your identity,
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: no matter where it falls, that ship is important he
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: being man. When I had my first few gay clients,
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: I had to break down in sessions like hey, can
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: you explain that to me? Understand? And it just it
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: just made me see everything a different way. It made
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: me see the integration of black queer culture. Come on,
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: black queer culture. Drives didn't know, Yeah, I didn't know,
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: especially like anything that you see with black women like
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: no tea all that, that's all black queer.
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: Let's break that down to the reason that those words
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: were even created. And then that language, that vernacular was created.
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: That was a safety thing.
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: Hm.
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: Queer people had to be able to have a conversation
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: in front of people and communicate things to each other
• 40:33
  Speaker 2: to stay safe without other people knowing what they was
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: talking about. So while it's cool and it's slang and shit,
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: that shit was birth from a place of staying safe.
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: And that's why I have a lot of respect for it.
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: I don't even use a lot of words and a
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: lot of gay lingo and shit just because it ain't
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: the way I talk.
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: I would sound stupid.
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: I don't like sounding stupid, you know what I'm saying,
• 40:51
  Speaker 2: So I don't use it because it's not natural for me.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: But I think it's fast.
• 40:55
  Speaker 2: I think it's fascinating when people do, and I think
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: it's something that deserves a lot of respect. You gotta
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: respect the history of that ship because it was rooted
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: in keeping people safe when they couldn't have open communication
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: about certain.
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: Ship, which is the genesis of Black Coach.
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: Come on, so you see the tie is it's really
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: super interconnected.
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: Day you get it? Damn, bro, thank you for trusting
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: me with that, man, show Man. That's that's take that lightly. Yeah.
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: Man.
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: When I first walked in, I was like, he talking
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: about me and one of one of my one of
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: my motions, like one of the illest dudes I know,
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: probably one of the most dangerous dudes I know. He
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: is street street dude, through and through. Hit me on
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: one days, like, Bro, I saw I started watching this
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: new show. I was like, okay, and he wanted to
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: talk about the more and I was like, and he
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: just started talking like what show is? He said, posed
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: them stories got He was like just watching it was like,
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: all right, I think I was like an episode for him,
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: like they was going through they was trying to survive. Man,
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: I had no idea. I didn't even know, man, that
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: that show was amazing. His stories is human experiences, and
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: that's what people got to get over. Man.
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: Just because somebody gay, don't mean they want your ass,
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying. So you ain't got nothing
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: to worry about unless they tell you they want your ass.
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: Then that you know, you take that up with anybody
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: to say that to you.
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: But it's just shared human experiences, man, that make a
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: lot of U especially I'm gonna speak as a black
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: person right now, when it comes to the black shit.
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: We really got to get past the whole divide of
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: the queer community versus the rest of us. We all black,
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: my nigga, and I know so many queer people who
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: are on the front lines doing real work to advance
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: Black people in this country.
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: Always has been that way, bro, Always has been that way.
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: It always has been that way. You know. For the
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: first time in my life, I actually think that that's possible. Yeah,
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: because now we got a bigger common enemy. Yeah, and
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: there's no bigger galvanizer than the common enemy.
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: We say that, but then shit happens, like, look what
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: happens with the Dwight Howard. Shit with Dwight Howard's wife
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: Amy making them allegations about his drug use and shit.
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: And abuse in their home.
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: The first thing, let me fill you in, bro, first
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: thing people started doing was talking about the rumors and
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: the allegations that were made against.
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: The white Howard and his past, which is true.
• 43:13
  Speaker 2: Whatever the fuck this woman is sitting here telling you
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: about abuse in the home. You know what I'm saying.
• 43:19
  Speaker 2: And the first thing the comments focused on is all
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: he gave. They say, he gave all the allegations and shit,
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: ignoring all of these this cry for help that this
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: woman just literally put out, and y'all focus on that.
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: So that's the work that I feel like we gotta do. Man,
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: We got to get past that being like a block
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: for every fucking thing else.
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: Fuck it, we here, let's talk about it. I think
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: in order for that to happen, I think that we
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: need to have more humanistic acceptance in our pillars of
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: the black community. In one of the pillars that's going
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: to be the toughest hill to.
• 43:59
  Speaker 2: Climb, A the church. The church, you can't call it.
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: Say nothing about me being gay. You got on the
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: floor length rod go trim and trinkets and adornment. Is
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: that a Paisley Because at that point, you know what
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: I'm saying, they are slatch.
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: We're talking about presentation. You know what I'm saying. I
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: don't know. You're about to give me in trouble. Hold on,
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: first off, your identity is more than what you were in.
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah right, you ain't gonna get me cooked. You got
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: you got you in the cooking. I'm not invited to
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: that cookout you're about to give me canceled. Nah, but no,
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: I feel you, man, And you know I've I've always
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: just still with the principal that you know that the
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: tenants of whatever you practice need to exist regardless of race, color, creed.
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: And this ain't like I don't see color. It's not that.
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: But who's the person? What's the through line? How good
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: is the person? Are you good because and not a
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: dip in a religious bag? Are you good because you
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: find it important to be a good person while you
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: hear on earth? Are you a good person because you're
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: afraid that you spend an eternity somewhere uncomfortable because that's
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: two different intentions, absolutely, and that's two different levels of trust.
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: For me, I don't want nobody around me that's scared
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: to break the rule. I want you to just really
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: be a good person in your heart air yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: because when they get rough you you always revert back
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: to who you are instead of what you believe or
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: what you think needs to be true or order. That's
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: this moment. Are you part of? Man?
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: And that's the real pivot, right because that's what we're
• 45:36
  Speaker 2: talking about. The real pivot is bring it back, man,
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: get back, gonna do this. You know what I'm saying,
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: But what do you pivot back to? And it's time
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: to get back to who you really are? When it's
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: time to make a decision, what do you pivot back to?
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: What's your base? You know what I'm saying, Like, what
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: are you working with? That's the pivot that people need
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: to focus on when shit gets rough, when you face
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: with a choice, when it's time to make decision, when
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: ethics are involved and whatever, your personal ethics aren't shit,
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: whatever it's important to you and your integrity, what do
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: you pivot back to it? At that point that's what
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: people need to focus on and going back to what
• 46:13
  Speaker 2: we said earlier. That's why it's important to know who
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: you are. That's what you pivot back to. That's your
• 46:17
  Speaker 2: that's your default setting.
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah. When you do the hard reset and all your
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: apps and shit disappeared, Yeah, that's what you are. I
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: don't want, man. I come from a lot the niggas
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: in my family's players.
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: They work hard. You know what I'm saying, good today women,
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying.
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: Like.
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: I come from a line of GE's You know what
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: I'm saying Like, I would rather have Detroit players straight up, man,
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: I would rather have shit go smooth. I would rather
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: like be happy. I'd rather be laughing, vibing with you.
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: I rather should just be good than bad to me.
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: You gotta.
• 46:49
  Speaker 2: We really at a time where like good versus evil
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: is coming into play. Oh man, we are man like
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: at the end of the day right now, so much
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: shit going on.
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: Like what side of that are you go on? What
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: are your intentions? Man?
• 47:02
  Speaker 2: I sleep so good at night knowing what's that. I
• 47:04
  Speaker 2: ain't trying to hurt nobody. If anything, I'm trying to
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: help motherfuckers. You know what I'm saying, I want to
• 47:08
  Speaker 2: help you, so you can stop asking me questions.
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: That's enough motivation right there. I want to help, so
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: I just leave it the fuck alone. Yeah there, man, Nah,
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: that's I'm damn man. That's uh. Just take a moment
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: and just if you could just reflect on everything he
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: said and try to find if you are somebody who
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: is uncomfortable with any type of sexual identity that's not yours.
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: I want you to take a moment and think about
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: what he said that you can identify with, like how
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: does that bounce in your life? What do those pieces
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: make sense with? What's going on for you? Where's the
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: connective tissue right there? Like this is this is a
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: dope opportunity to look past how you feel immediately about
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: somebody or about the way they live their life, the
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: way they they're oriented, and they in they mind, body spirits,
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: sold all that and just figure out, like, man, where's
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: the commonality because that's that's that's like the crust of
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: crux of human existence right there.
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: Man.
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: I think we're hitting on something here when you talk
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: about good versus evil, and what I notice is that
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: in some people's lives they could be good people that
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: grew up in an environment that feed them garbage, and
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: they can believe things about the world and believe things
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: about themselves that are not true. And they are these
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: unhealthy tenants that just like they like pillars that hold
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: up these people's lives. So like, what what do you
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: do when you want to be a good person or
• 48:34
  Speaker 1: you want to move on the straight and narrow, but
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: all the shit you've been fed throughout your life does
• 48:39
  Speaker 1: not allowed that to be? So like, how does that
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: person move and operate well? Two ways? If other people
• 48:45
  Speaker 1: are involved? You think about empathy, right, you put yourself
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: in other people's shoes. When you get ready to judge
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: somebody or or be disrespectful.
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: In that way, or have a bias or whatever, put
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: yourself in the other person's shoes. You know it'll make
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: you start thinking about that shit differently. Imagine if your
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: mama was going through that circumstance. Would you want somebody
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: to treat your mama like that? You know, that's a
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: meter that you can use and then man other than that, like,
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: instinctually we have a way to determine whether something is
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: good or bad in its nature. We know even if
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: you're able to determine that the shit you come from
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: was not healthy and you need to do something else.
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: That's your answer right there. That's how you know that
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: that's not the best path for you, and maybe you
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: need to make yourself aware of some other choices or
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: other options.
• 49:37
  Speaker 1: Right. A lot of times we just lack information and
• 49:40
  Speaker 1: it's no shame in that. It's nothing, and.
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: We have to remove that shame, like be willing to
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: be a pupil, be willing to be a student and
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: learn about different things so that you can come to
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: a conclusion about your feelings, your thoughts.
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: So there's humility. Yeah, yeah, I can tell.
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: I can tell. I think for me it's similar but
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: a little different. I think that it's definitely empathy. I'm
• 50:09
  Speaker 1: definitely putting yourself in other people's shoes. But I think
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: there's also it's a matter of like really identifying what
• 50:17
  Speaker 1: you're motivated by. What are you motivated by? If you're
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: motivated by money? Always I need if you listening to
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: this bro or even if you're not a man, sis, whatever,
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: ma'am me, lady however you like to be called, whoever
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: she needs to listen to. Yeah, man, it's the generational
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: thing is crazy. What are you motivated by? Because if
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: you're motivated by something by money, sometimes you run a
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: lot of stop signs, and when you run stop signs,
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: you hit pedestrians because you're not worried about what's in
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: front of you, worried about where you're going. And what
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: are you motivated by? Are you motivated by success? All right, cool,
• 50:56
  Speaker 1: let's take it down one. What is that success motivated
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: by the desire to be seen? Let's take that down.
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: What is your desire to seem motivated by or your
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: desire to be seen? What is it motivated by? A
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: desire to feel love wanted recognized? Oh okay, so you
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: want love, Well, you want love, but you're chasing money.
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: If I'm thirsty, I'm not going to grab me a
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: can of gummy worms. That's not going to satisfy that.
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: And sometimes when you've realized what you're motivated by, you
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: can break it down to the point where you see
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: that the things that you're doing are not going to
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: get you the things that you want.
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: You can't be afraid of that either, man, you can't
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: be that's the mirror again, right, you can't be afraid.
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: I won't I want to I'm like Michael Jackson. I'm
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: starting with the man in the mirror, you know what
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: I'm saying, because I want to know. I'm wanted them there.
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: I would rather know than not me too, you know
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: what I mean. Yeah, give it to me up front,
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: shive it to me straight like I and I respect
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: that and I can handle that. So I'm one of
• 51:51
  Speaker 2: those people, man, I would rather know and have that clarity.
• 51:53
  Speaker 2: So inner work when it comes to self reflecting, when
• 51:56
  Speaker 2: it comes to thinking about and identifying patterns and shit
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: it that don't need to continue when it comes to
• 52:03
  Speaker 2: all of that kind of stuff. Man, it's just important
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: to me. I done got old. You know what I'm saying.
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: I'm over forty, so I'll be thinking about shit like Yeah,
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: once you cross the forty threshold, your mind, Yeah.
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: It just changes. Now you start thinking about what's really important.
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: And that don't mean you have to be boring or
• 52:18
  Speaker 2: a person that is not exciting anymore, but you do
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: start thinking about yeah, but that really don't feel right. Yeah,
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: that really don't serve me.
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: And you listen to it now instead of just running
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: the stop something. You listen to it now because you
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: can feel your back at forty, I feel my mortality
• 52:34
  Speaker 1: different now and it ain't a rolling stop either the
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: metal one of them, Electric Vigic, Wayne Mold.
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: But hell yeah, man, it's like that when you have
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: experiences and let's not even start on a grief piece,
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: you start losing people and shit, man like life just
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: becomes real in a way that is scary but also
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: makes you hopeful.
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. All in one, feel sweet
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: all in one, all in one. You're right, it's both.
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: It's the sweetheart, yeah, yeah, exact, you get both in one.
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, And it sounds like you have a mindset
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: where you can lean into the sweet need it you're
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: saying on the weekends, Like I told you, that's crazy.
• 53:27
  Speaker 1: That's the clip. That's that's the one.
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: It was funny is even though yourself my head, I
• 53:34
  Speaker 3: don't know you can my producer laughing in the background,
• 53:38
  Speaker 3: that can't. He helped it so both other h nah
• 53:42
  Speaker 3: think that. I'm glad you brought that here, man, Glad
• 53:45
  Speaker 3: you brought that here fearlessly too.
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I respect you for that for sure. Man.
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: Thank you for providing the space to even because we
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: weren't even supposed to go there. Really we was talking
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: about something else but space. You know what I'm saying
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: for for to nurture comesations like that, and that's important authenticity,
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: right yeah, hell yeah, how we're gonna put that up there,
• 54:05
  Speaker 2: we don't actually follow through with the actions.
• 54:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, okay, yeah, I see what you got going
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: on here. So in in psychology, there's this thing called
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: external locus of control, and it's basically where you're you're
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: looking for all of your validation from the outside. You know.
• 54:26
  Speaker 1: It's kind of like if you, I guess what's an
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: equivalent I can throw up there, Like if you're a comedian,
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: maybe sometimes if you're telling jokes and people in the
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: audience that doing this, you know you're doing a good job.
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah. If you're doing and people giving you the
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: stink face, you know, you can either bravely Marsteward, or
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: you can allow that to completely derail you. Man. And
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: sometimes that shift it comes from the people who close
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: us to us. A lot of men build their entire
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: careers looking for the external validation. A lot of us
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: are just little boys. Little boys love to please.
• 54:56
  Speaker 3: Man.
• 54:57
  Speaker 1: Look, mammy, look what I did. Look at Look at me? Hey,
• 55:00
  Speaker 1: look hey, look look, look, look, look, And I don't
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: think we changed from that. We just killed that part
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: of ourselves to know that we can't get that no more.
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: You know, I want you to just talk about like
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: how brutal stand up comedy can be, and how you
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: brave that, like you kind of talked about in your
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: personal life, how you do that and how you've done
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: that traditionally, which I think is fied but I can't.
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: I can imagine it be different when you're standing on
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: stage and you're trying to get a mix of storytelling
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: and timing and good elements and momentum and delivering it
• 55:34
  Speaker 1: all at once. How do you navigate being confident on
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: the inside with the job that you're doing, versus needing
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: that validation on the outside that reassure you that you're
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: doing that? Damn? Thank for real, you know what? Man?
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: So thankfully because of my history and my work in
• 55:50
  Speaker 2: podcasts scene, right, I had we had done like live
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: shows for my podcast to friends on large rooms. You know,
• 55:58
  Speaker 2: so I was used to being on stage age in
• 56:01
  Speaker 2: front of a large crowd or whatever. I grew up
• 56:04
  Speaker 2: with Jehovah's witness, So knocking on doors, you know what
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: I'm saying talking to strangers cold cold call the coldest
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: stuff called oh yes, Shelley.
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: He was in Michigan.
• 56:13
  Speaker 2: But but you know, so that experience was not foreign
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: to me.
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: And honestly, man Kire, I just really wanted to do it. Bro.
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: I had been working on so many collaborative projects over
• 56:24
  Speaker 2: the years, and my contribution was often like rooted or
• 56:28
  Speaker 2: based in comedy. I loved Comic View and Deaf Comedy
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: Jam and all of the all. I loved that shit
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: and I always wanted to do it. And so I
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: was sitting in my apartment on Thanksgiving one year and
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: I literally called my manager Alex and was like, Yo,
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: I want to do my stand up show.
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: And she's like, let's just pick a day.
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: She's very you know, idea like Alex be like, Yo,
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: we're fucking doing it. And I love her for that.
• 56:55
  Speaker 2: She's my friend and she's my manager. But Alex was like,
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: let's do it. Let's just pick a date. I had
• 57:02
  Speaker 2: gotten into a fistfight years ago in a club on St.
• 57:06
  Speaker 2: Patrick's Day called the Old Chilelee. Now, why was I
• 57:09
  Speaker 2: even at somewhere called the Old Chile with a clover
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: on the sign?
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: I have no business.
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: You get the Shepherd Pie Yeah, where they got on
• 57:18
  Speaker 2: hats with beer company.
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 57:20
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying, Like, I ain't need to
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: be in there, but I was, and I got into
• 57:23
  Speaker 2: a fight, and so I hated Saint Patrick's Day. So
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: I did the show on Saint Patrick's Day and called
• 57:28
  Speaker 2: it FSPD fuck Saint Patrick's Day and told the story
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: of the fight. I built a lot of built jokes
• 57:36
  Speaker 2: around it, studied how to format a show, did some
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: open mic nights and clubs where I didn't know nobody
• 57:42
  Speaker 2: to test my jokes and shit, I felt an obligation
• 57:47
  Speaker 2: to really make sure that my audience had a good
• 57:51
  Speaker 2: time because these were people who have been fucking with
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: me from friend zone, from Holding Court. Shout out to
• 57:56
  Speaker 2: super producer, actually haves She's incredible work Holding Court, She's amazing.
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: But because of those audiences, those people trusted me to
• 58:06
  Speaker 2: be funny on that stage. And so while I found
• 58:09
  Speaker 2: comfort in that, that was also a lot of pressure
• 58:12
  Speaker 2: oh for show because I couldn't fuck up. And the
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: first show sold out so fast we put a second
• 58:18
  Speaker 2: show the same night, so I had two shows. The
• 58:21
  Speaker 2: first time I ever did a long form set like
• 58:24
  Speaker 2: that in front of an audience. Oka my brother was here.
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: I told you. My brother was ight and a half right,
• 58:31
  Speaker 2: always right by me. He had flew in, him and
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: his wife. Me and him were standing outside city right
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: in and he was like, Dee, what's up? Like you
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: seem a little off. I'm like, Nigga, I just can't
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: fuck this up. He was like, You're not gonna fuck up.
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: He was like, you ready.
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: As soon as he said that, I was like, I
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: am ready. This shit is actually funny. I'm confident that
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: they were going into the a and they came here
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: to support me because they believe that I'm gonna be funny.
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: All I needed for them was to believe that I
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: could be funny.
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: That's an amazing point. And they did.
• 59:00
  Speaker 2: And so once I thought about that piece, I was like,
• 59:02
  Speaker 2: I got it from there because I trusted my work.
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: I knew I had written some funny shit, and I
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: wrote some funny shit. So I did the show. It
• 59:11
  Speaker 2: went off very very well. Of course, there were kinks
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: and shit that you know, I identified along the way,
• 59:16
  Speaker 2: but I felt confident that first time being up there,
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: and so I just leaned into that.
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: I was like, I know what I'm doing. I know
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: how to tell a joke.
• 59:24
  Speaker 2: I know about timing and cadence and about callbacks, and.
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: I know how to do this.
• 59:30
  Speaker 2: So since I know that I know how to do it,
• 59:32
  Speaker 2: I'm about to just get up here and do it.
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: And I kept doing it so I found the strength.
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: That's what you have to a lot of times people
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: get consumed and the feeling or the moment instead of
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: finding a solution for things. Sometimes I'm a solutions type person,
• 59:47
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean. I was like, Okay, what
• 59:48
  Speaker 2: can I do to make me feel confident in what
• 59:52
  Speaker 2: I'm about to do? And I knew my shit was
• 59:54
  Speaker 2: funny here, and I'm like, that's the one thing I know.
• 59:57
  Speaker 2: I know these jokes funny. So I'm a lean into that.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 2: I got up on that stage and handle my business,
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: and I'm about to get back up on the motherfucker Tuesday.
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. Now you got inertia, Now
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 1: you got you got the force of not only that
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: external you just the external validation wasn't like some missing,
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: some huge missing chunk out of your psyche. Bro It
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: was just the little push that you needed it.
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: And it has to be in a healthy way, of course,
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 2: because people will celebrate you and clap for you and
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 2: all that shit, but you can't get, you can't find,
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 2: you can't place your self worth, and it can't be
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: contingent upon that that type of external validation. And that's
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: something that I had to do a lot of work
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 2: through in therapy, bro because I told you, I grew
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 2: up as a Jehovah's witness and that gay shit ain't
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: part of the program. It's a lot of things that's
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: not a part of the program. But being told that
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: I'm not worthy to serve God in a certain way
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: made me be determined to be successful and find validation
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: through that. If I'm not good enough to do this,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: watch me be good at this and excel this way.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: And I went through a lot of therapy to make
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 2: sure that that was a process that was healthy. It
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 2: was a healthy seeking a validation for me, and not
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 2: something that wasn't. I just put it like that, So
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 2: I had to work hard to find that balance, you
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: know what I'm saying, like to not get I never want,
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 2: wanted or was I never sought that sort of validation.
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: I never cared about none of that.
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: I just wanted to be successful and like I told you,
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 2: have worked that I could look back and be.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 1: Proud of you. Know what I'm saying. I want to
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: be able to look back and feel good about what
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: I did. That's it, because every I got a type
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: of mentality where if I do something, everybody in the
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 1: world can be clapping me out of the building. If
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 1: I look at it and I'm not satisfied with.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: It, it is the worst feeling.
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: It ever worked for me, ain't gonna work for up,
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 1: ain't gonna work for me. And man, your therapist, I
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: don't know if it's one or many did a really
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 1: good job with you, because what you're doing is what
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: I call don't don't supplant supplement, and sometimes people the
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 1: external validation. They supplant whatever they're supposed to create themselves
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: with what they get from the outside world. You see
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: it on social media all the time, especially if everyone's
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 1: calling you funny, or everyone's calling you pretty, or everyone
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: is giving you these compliments. Sometimes you don't develop the
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 1: internal mechanism, You don't build that joint out, so everything
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 1: that exists that makes you feel good about yourself is
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: being held up on the hands of other people.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 2: That's not good Man, that's supplant, and it's not sustainable.
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 1: It's definitely not sustainable. But when you supplement, when people
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 1: give you that, it's adding to what you already had.
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. Somebody giving you a dollar
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: when you got a hunter, it's like, okay, take that.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 1: It's might give you a dollar when you ain't got
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: nothing you can Oh, thank god. You know what I'm saying.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: That'spiration mode, you know, supplement not supplant. That's That's a
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 1: huge thing that I teach in therapy, and they take
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: some people years to understand that. That's a tattoo. Man, supplement,
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: that's a plan. Yeah, don't be stealing. Don't be stealing
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: my stuff, therapist out there. If you do, cite your
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: damn sources APR style.
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 2: Okay, that's good though, man, that's that's real too.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Man, I just let me take a break real
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: quick because I know that y'all been rocking with me
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 1: in this podcast and we have been building this community
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: from the ground up. I always say, break by brickshitning,
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: break by brickshn. I'm sure if you listen to this episode,
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 1: you got a lot of questions. You probably got a
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 1: lot of comments. You got a lot of thoughts, and
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 1: we welcome all I loved. I love that type of thing,
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 1: even if it's challenging. Some things come challenge. Man, you
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 1: get better when you get challenged. So hit me with
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: your questions, your thoughts and all that your feedback. Ir My, brother,
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 1: do some rapid fire questions. Do it and you answer me,
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 1: And I'm gonna answer something to I. Okay. So, if
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: a man your age is listening to this pod, you
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 1: few years older than me, you forty, I'll be forty four,
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 1: forty four four years older than me. So if a
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: man your age is listening to this pod and something
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: has been you know, something he's been sitting on, or
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: a thing that he hasn't really allowed himself to want
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: out loud, because you know, sometimes black men aren't allowed
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: to desire, not allowed to want, You're not allowed to
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 1: chase your dreams. You can't decide you want to do
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: something different than forty because you got responsibilities that kill
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 1: your whimsy. You know what I'm saying. I don't believe
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: in that, but I understand why it's a thing he
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 1: hasn't let himself want out loud. What would you tell him?
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: And I don't want the inspirational version. I want the
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 1: real version, which I don't. I don't have to convince
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 1: you to get. What I would tell him is to
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 1: get real with himself and do it anyway, you know
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: what I'm saying. Sometimes I read a book.
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 2: By bb Moore Campbell years ago where one of the
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 2: characters named Franklin went through some shit on his job,
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: and she said that he had reached the point of
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: the fuckets he just didn't care about nothing.
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. Scary place to be, Man,
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 1: it's a scary place to be, but it can be
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 1: just the portal into clarity, you know what I'm saying.
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: When you feel like you have exhausted all your options
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: otherwise you've done everything except try that idea or try
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: to start that new thing. That that's how you know
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 1: it's time to do it. When you've exhausted everything else
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 1: you have, you've done everything in the world except try that,
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 1: That's how you know that's the thing you need to do.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 2: So you got to believe in it. In order for
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: you to believe in it, you need to be well
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 2: prepared and confident in it. So if it's a new
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 2: idea that you have educate yourself and prepare yourself as
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 2: much as you can for the moment so that you
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 2: feel confident enough to take the risk.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: That's really good. Yeah, you know, I think my answer
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 1: would be I said it a lot, and I'm gonna
• 1:05:52
  Speaker 1: keep saying it because I feel like the boys stole
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 1: whimsy and we can taking it. Get your whimsy back, bro,
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: And don't be afraid to have hobbies and try things
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 1: because I think sometimes we don't try stuff just kind
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: of piggybacking off what you said, we're afraid to try
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 1: things sometimes because we're scared to be bad at stuff. Man,
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 1: And I said, like, Bro, you don't have to be
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 1: good at your hobbies. You just have to enjoy them.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 1: That's it. So if you've been sitting on something or
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 1: you've been pondering, you've been you've been chewing on it, Like,
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 1: just practice being bad at it. Start a little bit
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: by a little bit. You take an hour out of
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 1: your day and just read up on it, watch a
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 1: YouTube video about it. You know, do your research. You
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 1: don't have to jump off the porch off the jump, nah,
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 1: you can. You can take your time and figure out
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 1: what it is you like. But you don't have to
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 1: live a life of utility where I'm the protective, the
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: provider person. And I realized since we're talking about being old,
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: I thought I was like the medium old. But now
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: NFL players be dming me. They call me unk and
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: old old. That's that's offensive.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 2: You have to swallow the sign. Somebody says that that's up. Hung,
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 2: I can't do it. Hello, you know what I was like, Damn, Like, no,
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 2: it's it's care bro. Yeah, you goddamn uncle.
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 1: I don't even know your mama, and I'm from and
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: I was born in eighty six, So it means that
• 1:07:15
  Speaker 1: you are an abuser of illicit substances. Oh see, I
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 1: see that's a different Yeah. Yeah, different terms mean thing.
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 1: Words mean things.
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 2: Bro.
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 1: I'm feeling where you're at. Like that too much. But
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 1: I came to the understanding that in a hundred years,
• 1:07:31
  Speaker 1: you know, and this is not original thought that people
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 1: people say this all the time, and then a hundred years,
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: somebody else is going to be living in my house
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: who's not me? You know, one hundred years, everybody I
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 1: know it is going to be dead. Yeah, in three
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 1: hundred years, my name would be forgotten. Probably. I don't
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 1: want to wait until the end of my life to
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: enjoy anything. I don't want to wait for him a
• 1:07:52
  Speaker 1: gift in the afterlife. It's not fair to man, it's
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 1: not fair. I need, I need. It's my money and
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 1: I want it now. That's right, that's right. I want
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: it now, bro. I want joy in my life now.
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 1: I'm the breadwinner in my family. As you know. For
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 1: my wife, she's amazing. She quit her job to help
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 1: fold into the family and she does amazing. That's not
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: my supporting it that whole polg. She is the best
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 1: person I've ever met in my life. Though. Oh man,
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 1: my wife is amazing. Bro. I miss her so much,
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 1: only been gone a day. But you know what, just
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 1: I can't She even tells me this all the time.
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: I can't just be the one to get the money
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 1: and protect everybody when alarm go off at three am.
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: I can't just be that. I deserve to be more, Bro,
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: you do. I can be happy, you know. I can
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: take care of myself. I can I can enjoy life.
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 1: I can have love in my life. I can have
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 1: light in my eyes and warmth in my heart and
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: a song in my mind like it's it's you can
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: be joyful man, So that that would be my thing,
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 1: bro like leaning to it. And now you're a father, Yeah,
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: I know what I'm saying. I gotta tell you account
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: tell me her real man like.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 2: So you you finding that joy and making sure that
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 2: you're taking care of yourself in that way that's important.
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: It is. I'm so glad that you said, because sometimes
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 1: we get so wrapped up in fatherhood. Yeah. I live
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 1: for my kids. I do not live for my kids, right,
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 1: I live and my kids live too. You're with you, Yeah,
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: I don't. I don't live for them, bamas. They parenthood
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: has the right to all of my money, all the
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 1: right to my time. It don't have the right to
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 1: all of my identity. There you go. Nah, there you go, man,
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 1: I ain't doing that all right. Our second question is
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 1: what does success look like for you in this chapter?
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: Not famous comedian success, your individual success. What does winning
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: actually feel like for you right now?
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 2: Being a creator in a way that being that creator
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 2: creating something that Okay, so let me zoom out. Like
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 2: the friend Zone term which is my podcast and I
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 2: co host with a sciente and friend from Hey friend Hey.
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: Two of my best Hey friend Hay is one of
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 2: the that's just a dope stage, she and it fits her.
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: Y're funny, Thank you, bro.
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 2: But that show when we started touring and when we
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 2: had our first live show right at in New York
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 2: City at the at the New School, right hundreds of
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 2: people in there. When I saw that ship and saw
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 2: like physically the joy that that show was bringing to people,
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 2: I found like a purpose sort of.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying.
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: So, making people emote, making people really feel joy, making
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 2: people really like just be inspired and ship, that is
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 2: what success looks like to me now, and reconfiguring that
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 2: in different ways, constantly reinventing that that service again.
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: Making people feel something.
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: That's why comedy is so important to me, Because I
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 2: make people feel good. You're gonna forget about all that
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 2: shit that's making you sad for a brief moment. Yeah,
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 2: And to me, that is that is immeasurable in value.
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: I would agree you feel and so and I'm so
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 2: grateful and humble and honored to be able to do
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 2: that for people, and that sort of legacy. That's why again, legacy,
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying, That's why that's important to me.
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 2: So success for me looks like a legacy that I
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 2: can be proud of.
• 1:11:16
  Speaker 1: Oh that's so good. Change my answer now, Damn No,
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 1: that's that's a legacy I could be proud of. Yeah,
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: I think I'm gonna switch my answer because I'm inspired
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: by that. I think for me, success pivot. You already know,
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: you already know. I think for me, success looks like
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 1: squeezing every drop out of this life. Man. Yes, just
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: I want to die empty, Broye. I want to die
• 1:11:46
  Speaker 1: with a smile on my face. Regress. I might not
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 1: have finished that itinerary, but I got the most that
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 1: I could possibly get out of it. I feel you, man.
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: I want to die like Aretha Franklin.
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 2: Did you know she had her whole casket was open
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 2: and she had her feet crossed at the ankle in
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 2: front of that motherfucker. She had like a four door casket. Man,
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: I ain't never seen no ship like that. I ain't
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 2: never seen nothing like that. I want to die like that.
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 2: That's yeah, I'm done here, Okay. My TMS is like this, and.
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 1: Not to cross boneless fresh wheat, just like this. That's
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 1: what I want, man.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 2: I just want to die happy and feeling like I
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 2: left behind something that made other people's lives. But it's
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 2: all I want to do. Man, me too, Man, And
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 2: I want to die knowing that.
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 1: And I'm it's not it's not morbidity me, It's not
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: morbid It's just like I want to leave the earth
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 1: and I want to be able to say that I
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 1: contributed to something bigger than me. But it wasn't about me.
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 1: I was just a vessel. Man. I think I think
• 1:12:49
  Speaker 1: that's the best way to be a servant to your
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 1: own calls. You need to, Man, I'm gonna hunt some
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 1: motherfuckers too. After I go there's a few people. Man
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 1: right over there. Oh, bro, this's place is I can't do.
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna throw a couple of things across a couple
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 1: of living rooms.
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 2: I'm okay, off your arm, open and slamer door. You
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 2: know what I'm saying. Make motherfucker's nervous. That deserve it
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 2: being big spooky all right. Last question, I just want
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: you to let you it's not a question.
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 1: I just want you to let people know where they
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 1: can follow you what you got going on, because sure,
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: a lot of people who knew you probably I'm more
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 1: dear to you now after this episode. And also, people
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: never heard of you before.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 2: Well, what's up, y'all. You know what I'm saying. If
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 2: you knew here, what's happening to get comfortable? Thank you
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 2: again for providing the space, bro, my incredible show.
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a great conversation. Man, I really enjoyed this.
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 2: You can find me on all social media platforms that
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 2: look at Dustin that's my social media handle. That's the
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 2: best place to find everything that's going on with me.
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 2: You can find all my comedy touring information at Dustin
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 2: rosslive dot com. We'll have information for all the venues
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 2: and all the tickets, direct links for all of that.
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 1: There. It's just a central home and stay tuned and friends.
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 2: On pot every Wednesday, Monday Night Live with my boy
• 1:14:09
  Speaker 2: Carlos King, Claudia and my girl Blue every Monday on YouTube.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 1: This's just a lot of stuff going on. I told
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 1: you made your resume like a cvle. I appreciate that. Bro.
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 2: I'm like kinda I work hard, you know what I say,
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 2: Like tiny friend work hard.
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 1: So you know, some of y'all might not get that.
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 1: We ain't judging you. It's okay, it's okay, it's okay.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: All or welcome here, no matter what your knowledge stuff
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 1: is like. But yeah, I I appreciate you sliding through man,
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 1: and even just being open with the conversation. I think
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 1: you can do me to think about things in a
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 1: different way. I appreciate Yeah. And I think that to me,
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 1: that's the biggest compliment that you can give someone. This man.
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 1: You made me see shit different. Thank you many, Thank
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 1: you man.
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, real, I appreciate that you made me see which
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: supplant supplement not supplant, Yeah, supplement, that's a plant.
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 1: Take that, Thank you boy? Taking it.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm gonna give it where it go. But you
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: know what I'm saying, taking that with me?
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 1: That's not mine, man, that's for the world. Bro. Were
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 1: here to help people healing, Yeah, healing, reveal bro, and
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: be better at your world. So yeah, take that with you, bro.
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 1: Thank you. Probably be a blessing to somebody else. I
• 1:15:14
  Speaker 1: appreciate it. Man, you out there who's listening to this,
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 1: I want you to know something. If you are a
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 1: man who is creeping and down the road to forty
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: and forty is knocking your door down, or whether you
• 1:15:27
  Speaker 1: already pass forty and you still trying to figure things out,
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 1: I want to let you know that the men who
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 1: are the most successful after forty They're not successful because
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 1: they lack fear. No, they are successful because they still
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 1: fear right in the face and they decide that in
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 1: order to go to it, I gotta go through it,
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 1: damn right. It ain't no other way, bro. So if
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 1: you are afraid, that's okay. It don't make you less
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 1: of a man. It makes you more of a human.
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 1: Thank you for joining me on today's episode. This was dope.
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 1: I just I think I'm gonna need like twenty minutes
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 1: to process because a lot of gems. Job, but this
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 1: is learned the Hardway. Today's episode lived up to the title,
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 1: and I want you to make sure that y'all come
• 1:16:10
  Speaker 1: back for future episodes. Take everything you said with you,
• 1:16:14
  Speaker 1: chew on it, ponder on it, apply to your life.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 1: Have a great one, not just today, but all the
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 1: days for the next time. Job will done. Y'all be good, Peace,
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 1: Learn the Hard Way. As a production of iHeart Podcasts,
• 1:16:28
  Speaker 1: I'm your host Ker Gaines. We're produced by Courtney Deans
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 1: and Cason Alexander Ashley. J. Hobbs is our senior producer.
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 1: Our executive producers A Will Packer, doctor Joey hard And Bradford,
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: Alex Balden and Carla will Maris