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The Bus · Pittsburgh Sports Memories

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Hello and welcome to another exciting episode of Pittsburgh Sports Memories.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um I'm your co-host, Steve Wirt, and as usual, I'm joined by Um Tim Hannon.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_01: So, Tim, what are your thoughts and feelings on public transportation?
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not a fan.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: Not a fan.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: You would never ride the bus.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: I have ridden the bus.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: I used to ride the bus back when I was going to grad school at Pitt.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not an experience I enjoyed.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: Would you ride the bus to all the way to a Super Bowl win?
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_00: That I would consider.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: Well, as you can tell today we're going to be talking about one Hall of Fame career running back that is Jerome Bettis.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um He kind of really fit in well with Pittsburgh and uh just like personified like what the city likes, like smash mouth, hard-nosed football, tough, and um, you know, very gregarious, like friendly kind of guy.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: And um just, you know, eventually, you know, he he fit so much into the city and the Steelers that he just kind of became like uh almost like synonymous when you mention Jerome Bettis, you think of the Steelers.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: When you say the Steelers, you probably think of mostly the Super Bowls, but you probably think of Jerome Bettis too, I would think.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, it came off in a uh storybook ending, of course, as Super Bowl 40.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so um, we'll kind of uh relive all that and uh pray our literal uh tribute here to uh one Mr.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: Jerome Bettis.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: Hey Tim, did you know Jerome grew up in Detroit?
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I wish somebody would have taught us about that at some point because it was never mentioned during his career.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: Some you know, when they played that Super Bowl in Detroit, no one ever brought it up either.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so so he he definitely grew up in Detroit, but um fun fact, he has a extreme love of bowling, and I think that's pretty fairly well known.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: But did you know he has a uh perfect game under his belt?
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: He bowled a 300.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's impressive.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: Steve, what's the closest you ever got to a 300?
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_00: Or what's your high score for bowling?
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: I think mine I I've cracked a hundred before, and that's my that's my biggest.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: I I think my highest score is like 175.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: I'm that's impressive.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_01: That's really uh why you I mean, consider I used to bowl in like a fun league.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like it wasn't like a super competitive league, we just did it for fun, but it was like Sunday evenings and it just got old after everybody quit.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we're just like, yeah, we're done.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: But I can't make the ball curve like the pros.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_01: You ever see like the crows, like it goes to like the gutter and then curves in to what they call the pocket, but I can't I can't make I can I can throw an okay straight ball.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_01: I I'm okay with that.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: But Jerome Bettis is a very good bowler.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_01: Now I don't know if he's good enough to be professional, although they said he was being recruited, I guess, as a bowler to some schools.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_01: He he had such he was so good at it.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: Oh well.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_01: Thankfully for um all of us, and he had decided to go to Notre Dame as a running back.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_01: And um he was part of that great backfield with um Ricky Waters and Dorsey Levins, um, both of which went on to have good NFL careers.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: He played for the late, now late Lou Holtz, and I think he really liked Lou Holtz.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: Most of his players did.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so after a great career at Notre Dame, he ends up being picked 10th overall by the Los Angeles Rams.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, this this gets confusing with all the the team decided to move to Lost to St.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: Louis for a short spell and then move back to Los Angeles just because why not?
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um at the time when he got, he actually got a really good coach for him.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_01: It was a guy named Chuck Knox.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: Do you remember Chuck Knox at all, Tim?
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: I I do.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: He coached the Seahawks for a lot of years in the 80s.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: He did uh Kurt Warner, actually, the the running back Kurt Warner.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, correct.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: And that was kind of his style.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: To further buddy the waters.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_00: And that was kind of his style of coaching, right?
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: Where like run first.
• 4:13
  unknown: Yeah.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because like NFL films, you ever watch the NFL films like little, like what would you call them?
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like season like rehab.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: It would be like ground chuck.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_01: I think they used that twice.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: But um he had a great first season.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_01: He had over 1,429 yards rushing.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: And actually, I remember this.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_01: They went to the West Coast because the Steelers never did well.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_01: I remember going to the West Coast.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: And uh they lost fairly convincingly and gave up over 100 yards rushing to Jerome Bettison.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_01: What was the old stadium the Rams used to play in?
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was like an Anaheim, wasn't it, or something?
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: Because they didn't play in the Coliseum back then.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: Correct.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it wasn't the Rose Bowl.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: It was it was the um I can't remember the same stadium that the I think the Angels played in.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_00: I think you're right, yeah.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: But I don't remember the name of it.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: You're right, it was in Anaheim.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: And that's it was that game was 27 and nothing, if I remember correctly.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: It was a shutout, and and Bettis just ran all over.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: And that's when the Stewards had a really good defense.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, the defense wasn't necessarily bad, but he he got he uh he smoked us.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_01: So um, so now it fast forward a couple years, um ground Chuck is uh no longer grinding Chuck.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: He is just an average citizen, I guess.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: And in comes um Rich Brooks, who is the new coach of the Rams.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_01: And um so the Steelers at that point, um they this is 1995.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um Bam Morris decides that he uh doesn't like rushing, you know, scoring touchdowns, rushing the ball.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_01: He'd rather run do drug running.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know, maybe it was his second career.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_01: But um, he gets busted with a large amount of pot and uh you know he ends up going to jail.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_01: Actually, I think he just got off with a fine on that one.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_01: But then later, like later in his like a couple years later, he gets busted again with like a bunch of pot in his car.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: So um that was on March 26, March 22nd, 1996.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Ben Morris was released from jail.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: He had more than six pounds of marijuana in his trunk.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's interesting the timing of that too, because uh it it it the the circumstances of drone better's coming to the Steelers is fully 100% dependent on that incident happening.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: Because Ben Morris was in his second year with the Steelers.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, they had no intent to be a pretty solid running back, too.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: He was like you said, he was he was the leading rusher in the Super Bowl, he was going to be the running back to the future.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: They were kind of using him and Eric Pegrim together, and and there was definitely no intent of going out and trading for some other running back because he had Dan Morris, and that that incident happening really changes the course of Jerome Bettis's career in the course of franchise history for the Steelers.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so like I aforementioned, uh Rich Brooks is the coach, and um Jerome Bettis had a falling out with coach Rich Brooks, which I always thought like I don't know, I don't I always thought Bettis like kind of got along with most of the coaching and players he played with, so I I don't know.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_01: Jerome um credited it to um I guess there was some sort of um they were supposed to come in early for a coaching session in for training camp in LA, and the all the veterans agreed to it, and Jerome himself had agreed to it, but the um contract, his contract wasn't settled, so he had to hold out or it was either injury or some contract situation, and Rich Brooks thought that he had lied to him, so he already got off on a bad start.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then Rich Brooks wanted to move him to fullback, you know, even though they already had Tim Lester, and you know, it was basically Rich Brooks was trying to stick it to Jerome Vettes.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: People don't remember how poorly managed of a franchise the Rams were at that point.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_01: They were the you know Yeah, they were they were not well well Stan, I think Stan Cronke still owned them back then.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: No, that was that was Georgia Frontier who owned them.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, was it still him?
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's right.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Cronkey was there, but I think he was like a minority owner or something.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, her her husband had died like that.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: That was the old guy that owned the um Rosenblum.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Rosenblum owned them.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: And he died under semi-mysterious circumstances.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: Heart attack and a pull, I mean.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, I mean, uh again, the conspiracy theories abound that either way he inherits the team, right?
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: He moves it to St.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: Louis, and it was a it was a dumpster fire for a lot of years.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: They were the worst team of the nineties uh for for the entire nineties until you know, until that that year where Dick Vermil came and Kurt Warner and all that stuff happened.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: But they were just they were a dumpster fire, and Rich Brooks was part of the dumpster fire.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: Part of the dumpster fire to say it now.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_01: Well, well, that this is probably like his most egregious mistake, I would say, running off Jerome Bettis.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like, so he trades, they trade Jerome Bettis to Pittsburgh in a third round pick, which is 72nd overall, and the Steelers use that to select Steve Conley, who they ended up releasing a couple years later.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_01: And then they also, with their first pick that year, do you remember who they picked, Tim?
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_00: The Rams.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um well, I know who the Rams picked.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_01: That's even worse.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_01: We'll get to the it's actually worse.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_01: The Steelers pick somebody that's bad but in a different way.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_00: So the Stewarters picked Jermaine Stevens, who was a uh a tackle from North Carolina AT, I think is the school he went to, and and he was a project.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they they thought they needed a tackle, but not immediately.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: They could groom this guy for like you know, two seasons later.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: And at the time, I remember distinctly in that draft, my brother really wanted the Steelers to take Mike Allstadt.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he would and he would have been available later in the draft anyway.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, they they still could have picked Stevens and then gotten Mike Allstad.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I wonder, I I get the I bet that would have still worked out.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_01: I and I don't know.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_01: Mike Allstad isn't as good as Bettis.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: Mike Allstott was pretty good, though.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and and when they traded for Bettis, that that made, you know, drafting Allstatt wouldn't have made any sense at that point.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: But but that's who a lot of people were thinking because again, Van Morris was gone.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: They needed that kind of like big bruiser running back.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, but they they opted to make the trade for Bettis.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: And then do you want to talk about Stevie the Rams?
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Then yeah, well the ram well well with the with the second pick they select Ernie Conwell, and with uh with the fourth pick they got into 97, they trade to the Dolphins, and they eventually get Ryan Tucker.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: But the big running back that they pick to replace Jerome Bettis is I don't know why, if you already have a problem with Jerome Bettis, who seems like pretty clean cut and not terribly hard to get along with, I mean, more than any other player, like why do you go out and sign Lawrence Phillips from Nebraska, who at Nebraska had already had like behavior problems, like Tom Osburn had didn't he sit out like a a one of the bowl games or something?
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_01: Or like he had a lot he was in trouble with Nebraska, and that's why like he fell to the Rams at I forget what pick, but it wasn't like a it was a top ten pick, but he because and and and the answer to that question is because he was that talented.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like in Nebraska, Nebraska had won the national championship three months before that, and they had Tommy Frazier as their quarterback, but Lawrence Phillips was the star of that team, and he was that good, and so that was the era.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I guess it still happens today, but especially back then, that was the era where just teams talked themselves into because that was the same draft where Keyshawn Johnson, I think, was the number one overall pick.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, and and by the way, Ohio uh there was a competition for um getting Bettis, the Tennessee, whatever, the Titans, wherever they were at that point, Euler, Houston, Nashville, Memphis, wherever the heck they were, were looking to sign Jerome Bettis to trade for Jerome Bettis, but they ended up picking Eddie George with their first round draft pick.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: But but but the point being that just teams thought that they could, you know, okay, so these guys have behavioral problems, but we can turn them around and we can make them good.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it was just it was just typical of, again, like I said, how the Rams were run at that time, and it it turned into an absolute, like you said, that them trading Bettis so that they could go out and draft Lawrence Phillips.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: I think he lasted maybe two years with the Rams.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he he he ended up dying in prison.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yeah, very, very sad story, but what a mistake that was.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: The deal, um, the Steelers got Jerome Bettis and they got the Rams' third round pick in the 96 draft.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: The Steelers um sent the Rams the second round pick in 96 and the fourth round pick in 97, thus the pick of Ernie Conwell.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_01: So they really didn't give up much of anything.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um Ed Bouchette called it a major trade that cost them virtually nothing on what they will get on what will go down as one of their biggest draft days in history.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: Uh nothing else.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_01: He actually comments on the size of the players because Juane Stevens was 335 pounds and Jerome Battis was 250 pounds, so they you know basically drafted like a half a ton of human beings.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_00: And at the time, you know, that was also right after Neil O'Donnell had left in free agency.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: So the Steelers were trying to they they knew that they weren't quite sure who was gonna play quarterback.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: So I think the whole point of that draft was no matter who plays quarterback, we're gonna have a solid running game, right?
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna have the big bruiser back, we're gonna have this big offensive lineman tackle.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: That that was really seemed to be the theme there.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: Is if we can't, if we don't have a quarterback, then we're gonna build up a running game.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: So um, you know, like I said, Bettis had fallen out of favor.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: Rich Brooks do the holding out for two weeks from the training camp from the year before.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Bob Smyzik chimes in and says, Is Jerome Bettis a malcontent, overweight, practically over the hill running back whose career is on such a runaway downhill course that St.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_01: Louis Rams unloaded the former first round draft choice?
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_01: Or is he a misunderstood young man with the character of a saint who still has the talent of a prolong, who badly used, who was badly used by his former team and is eager and ready to please his newest employer, which as of yesterday is the Steelers.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_01: He does he does say the definitive answer on Bettis is not out, not in yet.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I was gonna say that's a nice, that's a nice journalistic trick that columnist do.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you you don't you don't say he was a malcontent, you ask the question, is he a malcontent?
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: Is he is he always hurt?
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: I mean time will tell.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: So that way, that way, you know, you don't you don't have to be proven wrong later.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you don't make a statement.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, did you know Jerome Bettis did not have the bus nickname yet?
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_01: He was called the Battering Ram.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: I remember that.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_01: I remember that from um sport like uh NFL Prime.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: It was a battering ram, they used to call him that.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but then the first preseason, um, they're playing Green Bla Green Bay, and Jay Hayes, who was a coach, had a brother that was a tight end named Jonathan Hayes, and they called him Bussy, and that was his nickname from Notre Dame.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: And Myron Cope, being Myron Cope, had overheard this and decided to go on the radio and saying, Hey, that look at that bus go.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_01: And he was calling him bus during the preseason game.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: And from there on in, thanks to Myron Cope, he was known as Jerome Bettis the bus.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_00: I yeah, I did not know that.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_00: That's pretty cool.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_01: And it didn't enhance Tim's uh love of public transportation at all, apparently.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, um, low times.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um, he had one off-the-field issue ever somebody made up a fake claim about him, and it was like literally it was in 2002, and like it was ended up being like a total scam, like by this lady's uncle, like to try and extort.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: Was the guy the guy was a professor somewhere?
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: Was that a Penn State?
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: Or it sure was.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, wow, another we are good at making stuff up.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and like Bennis totally cooperated with the police, ended up taking a lie detector past everything, and like nothing was ever nothing ever became of because there was nothing to make anything of.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: Do you remember how the guy got caught, Steve?
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: He was bragging in a bar, I think, that he was doing it.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: No, it was even better than that.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: Was it in class?
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_01: It was to his students.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: He literally bragged to his students that he was gonna set up Jerome Bettis.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: That guy, genius, man.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_01: Criminal mastermind, that guy.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I can't see why he was uh outwitted by Jerome Bettis.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so um, let's talk about injuries, Tim.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_01: Injuries are part of the game.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: And in 2000, Bettis was uh he he claims that he covered up an injury from the season before because he had gone to the doctor before the season, like I guess a non-stealer doctor, and his knee was messed up.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: And then he was like, Well, I'm gonna try and play on it.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_01: And like he went and like like the first play, like he said the second day of practice, like they finally ran like a real play, and he ran into the line and was like, Oh my knee, my knee.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_01: And it was uh yeah.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know why he even did that, because I don't think was he really that afraid that they were gonna cut him?
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I know this is like at the this is 2000, so he was getting kind of towards, but he still had good years.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: So so so if you remember the context of that, so so number one, he what he did have a he did have a bum knee.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: It was it was but he the timing of it, like you said, it was the he pretended like it happened on that play when it really had happened outside of that play.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like the year before, even or something.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_01: And he ended up playing the rest of that season on one leg and had surgery after that offseason.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't know why wouldn't the Steelers just uh let him I don't know.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: If if you remember the context of that 2000 season, we did an episode on that.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: That was Tom Donohoe, Tom Donahoe, the general manager, had you know, they had mutually kind of parted ways with Tom Donahoe.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_00: Bill Cower had almost left.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that was like the him or me thing with Tom Donohoe.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: And and the team had been really bad in '98, really, really bad in '99.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that at the time, some people thought it was a rebuild.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: They had gone out and got a new quarterback that year, the the immortal Kent Graham.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's what I thought.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: And they had Richard Huntley, who actually had a really good season in 99, as bad as they were.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think Bettis probably thought they're replacing me with this younger, cheaper guy.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: And and they were gonna replace Cordell, they were gonna replace Bettis, they were gonna, you know, again, they were they were kind of rebuilding a little bit, and so his best days might have been behind him at that point.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's probably what he thought.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly, I think that's what a lot of us as fans thought, because by that point, 2000, Steve, that would have been his he started in '93, that would have been his eighth season.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_01: Eight years in the league.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: That's a lot for a running back, especially like a big bruising running back.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: So I mean, whatever.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of like that's really the only two like off-the-field scandals, and they're really like by today's standards, quite tame.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's no compared to some of the other stuff that goes on in the NFL in general, and even with the Steelers in particular, I mean, wow, this the Drone Bettis really was never a troublemaker.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: No, not not not at all.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: Didn't you you didn't you say he had a book and you like it was like there was just he tried to like act like having the stuff book like, oh yeah, I did the and it was like, yeah, there's nothing there.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean he he talked about the um the the faking the again, not faking an injury, but faking the timing of an injury.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_00: That was probably the biggest quote unquote scandal.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_00: He talked about um yeah, I think he said like Cordell Stewart got he thought Cordell Stewart got a raw deal from the Steelers.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: I mean it wasn't it wasn't anything that was like hard hitting, but that's that's Bettis's personality is not he was never gonna be like Ryan Clark was on ESPN.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_01: He just that's he's like a jovial kind of nice guy, yeah.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_01: That's classy, yeah.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_01: So um let's flash back to 1998 since we're considering there's still low moments.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_01: At least this one's on the field, and it actually led to an NFL rule change, Tim.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_01: So let's it's uh it's Thanksgiving in 1999.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: While we're all finishing our turkey, uh, the Steelers have managed to go into overtime against the Detroit Lions and Charlie Batch.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, here's the coin toss with uh Phil Buckett and Jerome Bennett.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: Let's see what happens next.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_02: We'll have a toss to determine who receives.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_02: Who will call it from Pittsburgh?
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_02: Number 36.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_02: Collie plays in the air.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_02: Heads is the call.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_02: He said heads, it is a tails.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I guess he said tails.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_02: He did.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_02: Look at Jamone Metis.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: He's too what's going on?
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_02: Oh man.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_02: Detroit has won the toss.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, how can Phil Luckick Screw that up, Tim.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: I guess 30 years later, have you has your opinion changed?
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: Because I know at the time I just was flabbergasted that I really thought Jerome Vettis had called tails.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: But I guess I've never heard a recording where he said head tails, but they keep saying, like, that's the story the NFL says.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe he said it, maybe he didn't.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: I I don't know.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, 30 years later I still can't believe that he messed up the coin toss.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's a coin toss.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know how you mess that up.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's do you hear him say head head tails?
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think that because now the Silver Dome was loud back then, I will say that.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, I I think because that's the story, you can you can hear that if you really try to hear it.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: You know what I mean?
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: But I feel like if no one would have ever said that and like like show that somebody has no context and to ask them what they hear, yeah, I don't think they're gonna hear that.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: Does that make sense?
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes, like in a somebody hearing for the first time that is objective, like just somebody doesn't even care about football.
• 23:53
  SPEAKER_01: They're like, yeah, that's tails.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: So well, what it does do, it actually leads to a rule change, Tim.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_01: Because I don't why were they calling I never understood why did they call the coin flip in the air?
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because you could influence the how?
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like if I show you, oh Tim, here's a head.
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_00: I know, I know, but that was the idea.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_00: The idea was there there's no way you could influence it.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe you could hold it, you know, headside up, and maybe you could flip it a certain way so it landed, you know.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_00: It was it was supposed to take a post air.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_00: If you call it in the air, then gravity is the only thing that's controlling whether it's heads or tails.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: If you call it while it's in the guy's hand, then the motion of the guy's hand can technically have some kind of control over whether it's heads or tails.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_00: That was the idea behind it.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_01: What if it hits a counter on the way down?
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_01: Would that be interference like Seinfeld?
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: I think it doesn't count at that point, if I remember the Seinfeld role correctly.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_00: But but but like to your point, the the you can't really control with your hand either.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: It was it was overthinking it a little bit.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: And and the the flip side of that, no pun intended, was that now because you're calling it in the air, even though they had done thousands and thousands and thousands of coin tosses before this, including the one that gave the steel Terry Bradshaw, right?
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: No one had ever messed this up before, but on Thanksgiving Day 1998, all of a sudden now it's a problem.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, they had to change the role.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_01: And it just I remember I think it was Atlanta, one of the players came out with like it had it on a piece of paper, it said heads.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like they're like, so so like they literally in season, I think it was an in-season rule change, wasn't it?
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_00: I think it might have been.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: I I think it was.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so like they made it, and it just okay, fine.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_01: There's no controversy now.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like you said heads, that's what you said, yes, you agree to it.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: So you can't even like because like you watch that when you watch that video, you can hear them arguing with like Bill Cower and Carnell Lake's like he said, yo, tails, he that's what he said.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, uh and it doesn't even matter anymore because they've changed up overtime so much, it's like pointless.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, whatever.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: We could talk about overtime again, but we've talked about it so many times.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and that's the thing, you know, that game again the the Steelers still could have played defense, and they didn't.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_01: They couldn't stop Charlie Batch.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: You can't stop Charlie Batch, you know, you can only join them.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_01: Which is what they did eventually.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so moving on to like low points in Jerome Bethesda's career.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sure Jerome is just listening to this podcast right now and loving this this part of it.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_01: Jerome, you can fast forward a couple more minutes if you if you don't want to hear any more of this.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um lack of success in the playoffs, Tim.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_01: And it really is, there really is something to this.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_01: In 2001, uh, there's a divisional playoff game against the Ravens.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_01: Do you remember this?
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like, this was like, I remember this was like such a big game.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like it was probably almost bigger than the Super Bowl in 1995.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_01: I remember just like, oh my god, we can't lose to the Ravens in the playoffs, Tim.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_01: Oh man, this is horrible.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: And sure enough, they have Amos Zaraway and they have a pretty good team.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_01: I think they were 13-3 that year.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: That was the year they're 13-3.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: And Jerome Bettis was hurt, actually hurt this time, and went to go get a uh numbing shot to play, and they hit the wrong part of the leg, and it I think his whole leg went numb.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: So he could not play that game, but they did just fine.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_01: You know what the highlight of that divisional game against the Ravens was?
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_01: Was Dan Kreider flat pancaking Ray Lewis.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_01: Nobody uh that's never on Ray Lewis's highlight film, is it?
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_01: He got pancaked by a guy from New Hampshire.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_01: But the Steelers won.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: Amos Airway had a pretty good game, and mainly the Steelers won because was it Elvis Gerbach?
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, the quarterback for the Ravens?
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: Come on, the I don't think the Ravens were beating us with the Elvis Gerbach.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that was the year after they had won the Super Bowl and decided that, you know, thanks, thanks, thanks, but no thanks, Trent Dilfer.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: We'll we'll get Elvis Gerbach instead.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_00: And honestly.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I think they weren't wrong.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_01: I just think they selected the wrong guy.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, maybe.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I it would have it be a great what if if they would have just kept Dilfer if if that would have been a good thing.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I would have kept Dilfer and drafted somebody then or tried to trade, you know, trade for like, you know, I don't know.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know who was uh, but that didn't really happen back then.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like they're not like I said, it would be an interesting what if.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: Does does history turn out different if they keep Dilfer?
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_00: Probably not.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think that I never thought Dilfer was anything more than mediocre.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_01: He was better than Elvis Gerbach.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_01: But Elvis Gerbach was okay in Kansas City, but he was never like great.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_00: I mean Yeah, I mean Delfer, I think, yes, Dilfer was not great.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: He was a game manager.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_00: They had they won because they had that defense, but he got them through the playoff games, through the Super Bowl.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: I I I think he I think he gets a little underrated.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_00: And like I said, it would just be an interesting what is.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: I I'm not saying that they beat the stuff.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I mean, he didn't throw he was smart enough not to throw interceptions, and and when they needed a third down here and there, he could pick up enough of those to keep the defense fresh.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_01: So and that's all that team really needed.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, but they but they lost to the Steelers, and like you said, the the Bettis, that was like they they they came on the broadcast and said, hey, drone Bettis is out.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_01: And it was like a last minute, it was like, yes.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and everybody's like, wait, what?
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: And that was you know uh scary because you thought, oh no, we're not we you know against that Ravens defense.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_00: But like you said, Zeroway did pretty good.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um I'm gonna go back, jump back in time, and maybe I'm being a little unfair to Jerome Bettis here because he it and when I looked at the stats, he did have better stats than I remembered.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um the 97-98 AFC, so it would be the 98 AFC championship game or 97.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: It would be 97, yeah.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, 97, because the next year it would have played the Jets in mile high.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: Well, how do I remember that?
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um the Broncos beat the Steelers 24 to 21.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, the Steelers lose.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Bettis has 23 rushes for 123 yards.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: So I guess he didn't have a bad game.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_01: So maybe putting but I would still say this is a low point in his career because he didn't get to make the Super Bowl.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_01: It really wasn't his fault.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_01: This is kind of one of the few playoff games where he had a good game and the Steelers lost.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, unfortunately, Terrell Davis had a great, better game with 26 rushes for 139 yards, and more even more unfortunately for Jerome Bettis was Cordell Stewart through three interceptions.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_01: And there was a key, the key third down catch by Shannon Sharp and some pass interference calls that were a little dubious at the end of the half.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_01: But I don't know.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_01: Do you I I how much do you it probably unfair to really fault Bettis in this one?
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: On my I mean Oh yeah, that that was that was a team loss.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: Cordell threw two of those three interceptions were in the end zone, in the Broncos end zone.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: So that that they could at least kick the field goal.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_01: You kick two field goals there, you win the game.
• 31:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so that that was painful.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: The the Shannon Sharp catch at the end, like you said, we had Levon Kirkland on the show, and he talked about how to this day he laments not being in there to cover Shannon Sharp.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_00: They had Jason Gildon covering Shannon Sharp, and that was that was Kirkland.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: Said he you know, if he thought if he would have been in there, he would have been able to defend that pass.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: So there was just a bunch of just unfortunate things.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: Also, John Elway, you like you do have to give him credit as much as he's a Hall of Fame quarterback for a reason.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_00: And he made he made the plays in that game.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_00: He really did make plays in that game.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_00: He was that was like destiny that year.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_00: He was gonna get to the Super Bowl, he was gonna finally win it.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: Or was it the NFL script?
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the NFL script.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: Please.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, it was it was uh hey, you know, the Denver was just better.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_00: They they were just better.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_01: Well, all I have to say, Tim, is this one's for John.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_01: So after that one was for John, we'll consider we'll we'll continue on the um you know low moments, and they do get worse as we're getting progressively worse, Tim.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um the 2001 AFC Championship game against the Patriots.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_01: This one is Bettis' fault.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um nine rushes for eight yards.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: Come on, man.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_01: And this wasn't like one of those games, like the next game, I could give him a little more leeway.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_01: They were not down big in this game.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: They were in it the whole time, had a lead for a lot of the game.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I mean it's just just he eat it.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_01: They they were keen on like they were keen on stopping Jerome Bettis, and they weren't gonna let Plexigo Burris get many catches, and for some reason Cordell just would not throw in the middle of the field.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: So but Heinz Ward still had a good game that day, but it just wasn't and I I think that was the game where I remember I said that Cordell will never be a winning quarterback in the NFL just because he had the opportunity at the end of that game to drive them down and tie the game.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: I think it was a tie or win, I don't know.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_01: But he he overthrew like he uh badly threw an interception, overthrew a wide receiver, and then I think he did it again on the next drive.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_01: So that was kind of the end of Cordell's career.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_01: It it really was.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: And well, because it was just so obvious that like those guys, it wasn't like that it was a great play by the defense, it just they were wide open and he just couldn't couldn't connect on them.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I mean, and and to be fair, again, another I hate giving Bill Belichick credit, but but but the the the Patriots defense that year went on to you know in the Super Bowl stopped the the Rams who were a much much better offense than the Steelers.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, yeah.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: And and so they just they game plan the Steelers well.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_00: They they shut down Bettis.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_00: The fact that they only gave him the ball nine times, you know, uh I don't know if that was the best game plan, but he had also been injured and out of the game, like you said the week before against the Ravens, so maybe that was part of it.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe there's some hangover.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean the problem was like they stacked the box and they put two guys on Plexico and just had Ty Law cover Heinz Ward.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: And Heinz Ward did have, I think, a hundred yards receiving that game, but what you needed was you needed a a tight end down the middle to really exploit that defense, and for whatever reason, the Steelers didn't have that answer that day.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_01: Plus, like the special teams, you know.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they gave up two special teams touchdowns in that game, which is to this day still unbelievable that they in an AFC championship game they gave up two special teams touchdowns, but that's what happened.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_01: How about now?
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_01: This is probably my worst memory.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_01: The I think this is the worst loss for me as a Steeler fan.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know in Steeler history.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_01: This has got to be one of the worst losses in Steeler history.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_01: Outside maybe, maybe the Browns game a couple years ago in the playoffs where they fumbled the snap early.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_01: But I think this one was worse because I felt this team was really destined.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_01: Like you talk about a team destined to win.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_01: So the 2004 AFC Championship game against the Patriots.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um there's been a lot talked about this game because there's a lot of off-the-field stuff that we're we're not sure what happened.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_01: But um Jerome Bettis has five attempts for 16 yards.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_01: He does score a touchdown, and um, once again, Jerome was probably towards the end of his career here, and he definitely was hurt more often.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_01: But I and they were down big.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_01: So I will kind of give Jerome a pass on this this one because they weren't they the score of the game and where he was in his career kind of dictated the way his carries and the game plan went.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_01: But I will fold him for this.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um there's a play early in the game, a fourth and one, and um they they run the ball into the line and they get stuffed, and Bettis actually fumbles.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_01: And uh Mike Vrabel, ironically enough, the current coach of the New England Patriots, recovers that fumble.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot going on there.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um this day thinks that they knew what play was coming.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_01: The stolen signals.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_01: If they knew what play was coming and you knew what play, like, why didn't you are okay, we're going play action here?
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_00: Like well, they didn't know that at the time.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_00: What he would say, and I think what the some of the stewards would say is they didn't realize that until a couple years later when the whole spygate thing came out.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_01: Well, bottom line is he was not very effective in the playoffs against the Patriots, Tim.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_00: In that season, I mean they were 15 and one.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_01: That was and that team was so good.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_01: Freaking James Harrison was a backup on that team, Tim.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_01: And Willie Parker.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_01: Willie Parker was a backup, like a third string, like because they had Deu Staley.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_00: That was another so just like Richard Huntley, just like Amos Araway, they they had signed Du Staley to like supplant Bettis because it's like, okay, Bettis is Bettis is now, he's officially done.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: He's definitely done.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_00: And Deu Staley had a good first, I don't know, five season.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_01: He got hurt in the Patriots game on Halloween because one of the Patriots, Teddy Bruski, cheap shot at him in a in a pile.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_00: And so the next week they're playing the undefeated Eagles at home.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_00: What ends up happening in that so they have to start Bettis for the Eagles game.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_00: And Bettis hadn't started all year.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_00: Bettis was like the goal lineback.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I was at I was at that game, I was in the parking lot with um uh uh a guy that that would invite us over to his tailgate parties, and he did not like Bettis.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, Bettis, I can't believe we have to start Bettis.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_00: This is gonna be a disaster.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I I said, I don't think so.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: I think I said Bettis is gonna have 150 yards in this game.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I said it very, very facetiously.
• 38:19
  SPEAKER_00: I in a million years I did not think Jerome Bettis was gonna have 150 yards.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_00: Well, he ends up having 149 yards.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_01: He should have bet on it, should have bet on it, Tim.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_00: Against the undefeated Eagles that year.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_00: So so that was that was impressive because uh that's kind of the story of Bettis's career.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: Every time he got written off, whether it was by us or by somebody else, he always showed that he had plenty left in the tank.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, uh that that was a great game because we beat two undefeated teams in a row.
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we beat the Patriots and then the Eagles.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember Heinz Ward's one touchdown where he jumps into the end zone.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like it that was on the cover of Sports Illustrated and all that.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_01: That was that was a great game.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_01: So we'll go to the darkest moments with him.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_01: I would say this is his darkest moment, and we can all know what this one is.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_01: That would be the fumble in 2005.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_01: He almost was Ernest Byner.
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_01: He was this close to being Ernest Byner, or who else is like, uh, who's the guy who missed the field goal for Scott Norwood?
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_01: Or yeah, or Mike Vanderjack later in this game.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: So he he like the Steelers stopped Peyton Manning twice after the NFL scripted that Peyton Manning and Tony Dungey was supposed to win and took away an interception by Troy Palomalo.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I mean he he all he has to do is fall down.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_01: And the only reason they couldn't just kneel on the ball is because once again they had overturned that ridiculous interception.
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_01: The interception that was by Palomolo that ended up not being by Palomalo.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_01: And all Bettis has to do is fall down four times into the line of scrimmage, and they probably win even with that, even with the timeouts, they kick a field goal or something.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: And boy, that was just uh it was just a shame.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_01: He turns sideways and uh Nick Harper uh runs down the field and um you know Ben Ben saves the day.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_00: Well in one of our episodes, Steve, we were listing like the we were trying to figure out the top five like most shocking things that happen in Pittsburgh sports, and I think we talked about like Roberto Clementi's plane crashed and and the 13-9 game.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_00: That's that fumble has to be up there because Jerome Bettis, it's like we're at the one-yard line, the game's over.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_01: He made me swear in front of my mother.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_01: I called him every neighborhood.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_00: Well, at least you didn't have a heart attack like that guy at Donna Chukka's, yeah, literally gave a guy a heart attack.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: But I mean that was how shocking that was because it was Jerome Bettis.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_00: He just he was just gonna plow his way into the end zone.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_00: Or like you said, honestly, it would have been even better had he got stuffed.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_00: It was first down.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_01: I think there were what was there like a minute and some change, right?
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_01: It was under two minutes.
• 41:15
  SPEAKER_01: So you fall down three times, you kick the field goal, make it a six-point game, kick off, and okay, now you got to score a touchdown.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_00: The even better scenario would have been you stop, stop him on first down, maybe even second down, make him use a timeout, and then you score the touchdown.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_00: And now it's like over over because now it's a two-score lead.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_00: There's there's just no way they're, you know, then it's then you have a 10-point lead.
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that's but even if you score on first down with a 10-point lead, you that means the Colts have to score, get an onside kick, and score again.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_00: It basically he goes into the end zone there, whether it's first down or second down, it's over.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_00: And they were at the one-yard line, and it's Jerome Fettes.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_00: He's done this a thousand times in his career.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_00: You give him the ball in the one yard, he one yard line, he just plows into the end zone.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_00: For him to for him to get stopped would have been surprising.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_00: For him to fumble.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean he never he had very few fumbles.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_00: It was like an out-of-body experience for me when I'm watching that on TV.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_00: I remember literally like laying on the floor of my parents' living room, like felt like I was not in my body.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_00: Couldn't believe it happened.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_00: I just couldn't believe it happened.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_01: But what would be what would be his legacy if Ben doesn't make that tackle or if Fike Vanderjack doesn't miss the field goal?
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like I imagine.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_00: Could you imagine?
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, he he's he's Scott Norwood or Ernest Byner or yeah.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_00: It I think it's even worse than Ernest Biner, because when Ernest Biner fumbled, the Browns were losing that game.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_00: And that was gonna I think that was gonna tie it.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_00: But but they still LA still would have had time for to get the ball back.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_00: But they were losing.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_00: The Steelers were literally just trying to ice it.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know what it would have been more complicated.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_00: Bill Buckner?
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_00: No, Joe Fazarkek.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_01: Oh gosh.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_00: Oh wow because because the Giants that game that they that it was over, they were rolling the credits, people were leaving the stadium, like the game was over because all you had to do was take a knee, and somehow they gave the game to the Eagles.
• 43:15
  SPEAKER_00: That would have been the comparison.
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_00: And that was a like a regular season game in November when I think the Giants stunk.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_00: This was a divisional playoff game.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_00: So I yeah, I I I don't know what the legacy would have been, Steve.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_00: What do you think?
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_00: What do you like?
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_01: I think P we wouldn't be doing a podcast right now about Jerome Bettis in a positive light.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that's such a shame, isn't it?
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_00: Like that might be.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_01: We would have had to be like, oh, forgotten.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_01: He would have been like, oh, forgotten heroes that you know you think are bad but aren't really bad.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_01: He probably wouldn't have I don't know if he makes it to the Hall of Fame, Tim.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you're you're right.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_00: I think it would have been I think you're right.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_00: That would have been his because that's kind of Ernest Beiner's legacy.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_00: Like people But he won a Super Bowl with
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: Washington.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_01: Washington, yeah.
• 44:02
  SPEAKER_00: Well, and I think people over the years have well, that's another good point.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_00: That wasn't the last play of Ernest Beiner's career.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh but but but I think people over the years have, you know, gone back and said, look, Ernest Beiner was not only a really good running back, but in that game, the Browns weren't even wouldn't have even been in that position in that game had it not been for the heroics of Ernest Beiner.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: So you gotta cut Ernest Spiner some slack.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's that would have been the kind of stuff that we would have been talking about to your point, Steve.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like like a, you know, guys that you thought were were total, you know, um goats, but but really are are you know better than you thought.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: I think you're right, that is the legacy.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_01: Goat, you mean people that aren't good.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, the the old-fashioned use of the word goat, yes.
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_00: I know it means something different now.
• 44:49
  unknown: Yeah.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_01: Well, off of all that horribleness, we'll go to the memorable moments, Tim.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_01: These are much more fun.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um He had a thousand yard seasons.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_01: He had six of them, Tim.
• 45:03
  SPEAKER_01: That's which, you know, back then that was that was a lot of that was a lot of yards.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_01: Because like it was only what 14 or 16?
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_01: 16 game seasons.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_01: So it was a little tougher to get a thousand yard seasons back then.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_01: And that was from '96 to 2001.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_01: His first six seasons, he had uh over a thousand yards rushing.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, pretty impressive.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_01: In 1997, he had 1,665 yards rushing, and that was his career best.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_01: And he only did that, he did that in 15 games.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_01: So well.
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, this game I was at, the Bettis had five rushes for one yard and three touchdowns in a September 12, 2004 Raiders game.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_01: The Steelers won against the Raiders.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_01: I literally, I think, I think we should like, I wish we could post a picture of this to our podcast somehow.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like the the the stat I have the stats from the paper, and it's hilarious.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's like Staley, 24 for 91.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_01: Maddox has three rushes for 13.
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_01: Uh Haynes, Varon Haynes has one for two, and Bettis literally has five rushes for one yard, but he scored for three touchdowns.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's the maybe the craziest stat line in Steward history.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: And it's because they kept putting him in at the one-yard line, because again, like we just went back.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like he scored three of those against the Raiders, and it's like, uh, you've done this all season.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_01: He did that against, I think, Philadelphia, too.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but but I but he that was the only positive yardage he had, and then he lost some yards.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_00: So it ended up being, yeah, one yard, three touchdowns.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's pretty impressive.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, the guy averages uh more than a touchdown to foot, or whatever.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_00: I I love stats like that.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_00: There was a guy for the I think the Giants in the 60s, who for the season had one reception for 111 yards.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_00: And so you're you're like, wait, how do you have one reception for 111 yards?
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_01: It's because he must have lost yardage somewhere.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's because he he caught a pass, a long pass, and then on another play, somebody lateraled him the ball.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, geez.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_00: So they count that as receiving yards, but he didn't catch the ball.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_01: Jeez.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, I love I love goofy stats like that.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_01: Speaks to your OCD, Tim.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_01: Uh let's go on.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_01: How about the revenge game against the Rams in '96?
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_01: This was the year after you've been traded.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_01: Rich Brooks is uh in three roof stadium with uh Stan Cronkey was actually at this game, the current order of the Rams.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_01: I think he he was like a minor minority or whatever.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um Bettis has 122 yards rushing and two TDs.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_01: He has a 50-yard run for a TD.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um that was kind of like him proving a point because the Rams coaches, oh, you're not a game breaker, you're just a plotter, you get a couple yards and nothing else.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_01: And he had that big 50-yard run to prove he could.
• 48:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um Bettis actually gets mad at Bill Cower.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like, if you watch the NFL highlight, like Bill's, you know, like, oh, quit pounding me.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna tell your parents, you know, we're gonna have a parent-teacher conference, you know, this is about the rest of the season, we can't afford to get you hurt in a blowout.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_01: And uh leads to the old you're my man, and this is your town statement by Bill Cower.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_01: I was not able to find audio of that, but you've heard it before.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_00: I I remember that, and and that's yeah, he wanted to stick it to the Rams, and I don't blame him.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_01: And he did 122 yards, two rushing touchdowns, and a 50-yard run, you're good.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_01: You you you've proven your point.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think he wanted to stick it to them even more.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you know, sometimes when they say the best revenge is living well, so yeah, yeah, and he did.
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_00: And and again, it was that was maybe I I want to say like October of that 96th season, and and already by then it was very apparent that the Rams had made a mistake and that the Steelers had won that trade by two miles, and that was halfway through this first season.
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, okay, there's a game against Tampa.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_01: I just it seems like a random game, but I just remember this because Tampa's defense, oh, we're gonna stop the run, we're gonna be champion, blah, blah, blah.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_01: Bettis like totally lit them up for 46 yards, and that was like Warren Sapp and all them.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, for the game he against Tampa in 2001, he had 17 rushes for 143 yards.
• 49:38
  SPEAKER_00: He also threw a touchdown pass in that game to Jeremy Tooman.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's right.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_01: He did, yeah.
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that was the that was the paper champions game.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_00: Remember, Lee Flowers called them paper champions?
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, yeah, actually, I have a quote.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_01: It says, uh, Cower made sure to tell his players that SAP approval said the Steelers would not be able to run against the Buccaneers defense like they had against other teams.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_01: All the Steelers did was rush for 220 yards on 35 carries, their third 200-yard rushing game in a row.
• 50:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um, do you remember this game?
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_01: I I think I remember this game more for where I watched it.
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_01: I think I was in Miami at the time, and it was uh the Cardinals 20 and the Steelers 26 and 97.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_01: And like the Steelers, like I I was in Miami, so the game, I was trying to get the stupid Dolphins game over, and like people kept getting hurt, and I was like, come on, man, like wrap this up here.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_01: Wrap this up, Jimmy Johnson, or whoever was the coach, and finally they wrapped it up and they're like, Oh, we're taking you bonus coverage of the Steelers and Cardinals, and I got to watch the final overtime drive.
• 50:42
  SPEAKER_01: And do you remember that game at all, Tim?
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Jerome Bettis scores the touchdown in overtime.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he basically like runs everybody over 36 carries for 142 yards rushing.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_00: What I remember about that game is um it's the game that convinced my dad to get the Sunday ticket from direct.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_00: That was Direct TV had the Sunday ticket back then.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_00: And it's because the this the that was a that was a late game.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_00: That was a four o'clock game because it was in Arizona.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_00: And the one o'clock game was, I want to say, Jacksonville and Baltimore, which which mattered greatly to the Steelers, uh, because they were in a divisional race with Jacksonville that year.
• 51:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so we wanted to see the end of uh Jaguars Ravens to see if the Ravens, because rooting for for the Ravens to win what needed Jacksonville to lose, and they cut it off.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, Oh, we have to go to the Steeler game because contractually we have to show this.
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_00: And it wasn't even, you know, it was like them going to like the you know, the announcers talking about the game because it wasn't even starting.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_00: And my dad was like, That's it.
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_00: I I I can't stand how they you know they control what you you can see, and he decided he was gonna get the Sunday ticket, and the next season he got the Sunday ticket.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_00: So that's what I remember about that game.
• 52:05
  SPEAKER_01: Nice.
• 52:06
  SPEAKER_01: I just remember watching it from a weird play.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I didn't get to see much except for like the overtime.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_01: So but hey, I got to see it.
• 52:14
  SPEAKER_01: I know you remember this game distinctly.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_01: We've talked, I don't know if we've ever talked about this game before.
• 52:20
  SPEAKER_01: There was a Broncos game 97.
• 52:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, the Broncos came to three River Stadium, and the Steelers win 35 to 24.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Bettis has 24 carries for 125 yards.
• 52:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um, this was a huge matchup at the time.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like, because like the Steelers and Broncos were kind of battling for the number one seed in the AFC.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_01: And the Broncos were were a pretty good team.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like they had Thorrell Davis, they would go on to win the Super Bowl that year.
• 52:46
  SPEAKER_01: So um this game's probably more known for Cordell.
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_01: This was kind of like Cordell's, one of Cordell's best games as a Steeler.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_01: So unfortunately, he didn't save this for the AFC Championship game.
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that was that was a great game.
• 53:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, Bettis was great in that game.
• 53:02
  SPEAKER_00: Cordell, Yancey Thickpen had a huge game in that one.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_00: That's when you thought, like, man, this team might actually And you missed the game winning drive.
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_01: I remember that.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_01: Wasn't there like a fight in the stands, and you had to you miss it?
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_00: There was a fight in the stands, yeah.
• 53:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's right.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_00: I forgot about that.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_00: I was at that game, and that was yeah, there was a big fight right in our section.
• 53:24
  SPEAKER_00: But it was, yeah, it was a it was a heck of a game for sure.
• 53:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, how about a playoff game against the Colts?
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_01: There's a 96.
• 53:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like that was probably like one of better.
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know what do you think the 96th season was his best season?
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_01: It might have been.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_01: It it like um the Colts uh lose uh 14 in the Steel.
• 53:45
  SPEAKER_01: Colts score 14, Steelers score 42.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_01: Jim Harbaugh's at quarterback for the Colts.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think we had Mike Tomzak at this point.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_01: Um, Neil O'Donnell had gone on to fame and fortune with the New York Jets, or not.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, the Colts had actually not won a game in Pittsburgh since the Don Shula Baltimore Colts era at that point.
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_01: It was a back and forth game early.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_01: I watched some of the highlights.
• 54:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like there were there was like an interception by Tomzak that wasn't his fault.
• 54:12
  SPEAKER_01: He literally hits like I figured it was the one of our scrub tight ends back then, right in the chest, and he like bounces up and the guy for you know for the Colts grabs the pass.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_01: So it it just like the Steelers take over at the beginning, the first drive of the third quarter of the second half, and they have like this nine-minute drive, and it's capped off with Bettis getting a one-yard drive, one yard TD run, hey, another one-yard TD run.
• 54:39
  SPEAKER_01: But unfortunately, and I do remember this now too, is remember Bettis got hurt during that that game, and he actually hurt his groin.
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that affected because the next week against the Patriots, they didn't do very well, but they kind of got blown out.
• 54:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't know how I don't think Bettis played, or if he played, he didn't play very well.
• 55:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that was the Fog Bowl game that didn't turn out very well.
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, probably Jerome Bettis's most memorable and maybe one of his best performances was one of his final performances, and that would be the Bears game in 2005.
• 55:16
  SPEAKER_01: The Steelers have this three-game losing streak, and like once you said, you know, oh, everybody's writing off the Steelers, it's kind of like the they took on the personality of Jerome Bettis.
• 55:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like everybody's writing us off, nobody can count us in, you know.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_01: And they need, and it was so bad the Steelers need to win the last three games, and then I forget somebody else had to win for the Steelers to even get in the postseason.
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_01: So even if they won their last three, they could still be on the outside looking in with I think they what'd they end up going, 10-6 or 11-5.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_00: 11-5.
• 55:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they still needed help.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_01: That's right, they were 11-5.
• 55:52
  SPEAKER_01: And that like I think I remember like before that last game against Detroit, ironically enough, like they said there'd only been one other 11-5 team that had missed the playoffs, which was crazy.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_01: But the Bears game, the first half, you know, they're the weather was kind of uh, but then the snow comes in and it's a Jerome Bettis kind of day.
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_01: And there's a play where the Steelers are driving for a touchdown, and you've seen this play a million times.
• 56:19
  SPEAKER_01: They give the ball to Jerome, he runs over Brian Erlacher and the safety and scores, and that's probably like the highlight of Jerome Bettis's career.
• 56:27
  SPEAKER_01: Whenever he goes in the Hall of Fame, they show that run, and it really propels like that game, like they take over, and the Bears were pretty good that year.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't like the Bears were a bad team.
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, you know, they they they beat the Bears handily and um really really just that game like really just epitomizes Jerome Bettis in the snow, hard nose football, running over pro ball linebackers.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_01: That that was kind of Jerome Bettis's thing.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_00: If if yeah, Brian Orlacher was the defensive player of the year that year.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, he was again, if folks don't remember how good Brian Orlacher was, he he was so dominant.
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_00: And Jerome Bettis is at that point like what five, six games away from retiring.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, it was the worst kept secret.
• 57:14
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody was like, Yeah, we don't need to retire.
• 57:16
  SPEAKER_00: But I mean, but I mean Bettis was at the very, very end of his career.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_00: Brian Orlacher's in his absolute prime for Bettis to run him over.
• 57:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I think that the safety was there too.
• 57:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, yeah.
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_00: It it it's really I honestly, like you said, Steve, I think it is the signature play of his career.
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_01: And it played in the snowstorm, it just looks like football.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_01: There's like the snow's flying, it's the Bears and Steelers, like two hard-nosed teams.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_01: It just looks like football.
• 57:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, uh Super Bowl 40, I don't want to call it like a bad game, but like he didn't really do much.
• 57:51
  SPEAKER_01: He had 14 carries.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_01: He did have 14 carries for 43 yards, and he just kind of ends his career in Detroit.
• 57:58
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like it's this like fairy tale ending, but he really didn't he didn't do much in Super Bowl 40.
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_01: It really was Willie Parker and the defense and Heinz Ward that that won that game, really, quite honestly.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_00: It it was, and that's that was Bettis' role at that point.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_00: He was yeah, he was really a backup to Parker at that point.
• 58:20
  SPEAKER_00: But I think what no what people wouldn't remember, they they they run that trick play to the touchdown that Antoine Randwell threw to Heinz Ward.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_00: They they make Seattle punt, and it was so it was 21 to 10 at that point, and there were still, I want to say, like, eight minutes left in the game.
• 58:37
  SPEAKER_00: And the Steelers had a drive where they chewed up a bunch of the clock.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and that was that's where he got all his yards.
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_01: That was the drive, yeah.
• 58:47
  SPEAKER_00: Right, and so that would never show up on the stats, like you said, you know, 43 yards, but but if you look at when some of those yards came, it was it mattered because 21 to 10 with eight or eight seven eight minutes.
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_01: They're still gonna get the ball.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, they're still gonna get the ball twice.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_00: Right, and because of of Bettis on that drive, they they by the time they got the ball back, it was pretty much over.
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_00: And and like I said, that's one of those things that would never show up because it's not the 75-yard run by Willie Parker.
• 59:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's not you know, it's not a a bunch of big plays, just a bunch of little grinder grinding out yard plays, but it mattered.
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, and like Ben wasn't that great, so you really there isn't like the only flashy play is that reverse pass by Hunts Wartz.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, but but e even Ben.
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_00: Ben Ben you know made a few plays in that game too that mattered.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_00: It it's it wasn't a pretty game.
• 59:41
  SPEAKER_00: I I've always said of all the games, like I was fortunate enough to go to that game.
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_00: Of all the games I've been to over the years, it's one of the worst football games I've ever like watched in terms of a football game, but it's also the greatest football game I've ever been to because Yeah, they finally get over the hump.
• 59:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was such a big thing for that team and Jerome Bettis.
• 1:00:00
  SPEAKER_01: And like from '96 when he traded here, him and Cower are like looking for this Super Bowl win.
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_01: And that was really the coronation of his career.
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_01: And it happened in his hometown, and everybody in Detroit kind of adopted the Steelers as the hometown team.
• 1:00:16
  SPEAKER_01: And it was just great.
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: It was great.
• 1:00:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I I I listed the next part as like the beloved moments, and there are there, it just just shows to like drone bettis was such a key part.
• 1:00:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I I think the team at some point did kind of take on his personality.
• 1:00:30
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, Bettis before the game in Detroit, like we sarcastically said about drone being from Detroit, because it just got so blown up, like, oh, Jerome Bettis from Detroit.
• 1:00:41
  SPEAKER_01: It was just it was such an overhyped storyline.
• 1:00:45
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, he did receive the key to Detroit from a Super Bowl, I think it was Kwame Patrick for Patrick or something.
• 1:00:51
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
• 1:00:51
  SPEAKER_01: That guy later got indicted on something, and but he gave a key to Jerome Vettis.
• 1:00:56
  SPEAKER_01: So um, do you remember uh when Troy Palomalo had to wear a Notre Dame jersey?
• 1:01:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because like Joey Porter, like you know, the to show some respect to Jerome Bett, they all had him wear the green number, was it number six?
• 1:01:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Jerome Vettis jerseys, so and that was like a obviously a tribute to Jerome Betts' Notre Dame career in college.
• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_01: So um, in the aftermath of the 2004 AFC Championship game, which is I mean, it was devastating for me as a fan.
• 1:01:28
  SPEAKER_01: I can only I can't imagine what it was like for the players, and you could see it like in the aftermath, and we've covered this before, where the whole team was just so let down, and it wasn't like like it's such a difference from like when the triplets took over, when Bell and Brown and all them.
• 1:01:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like these guys wanted to win for each other, like and Heinz Ward comes out and says, Oh, uh, and he cries on camera, literally cries on camera, said, You know, I I I'm just so disappointed that you know not I wanted to win it more for Jerome than even myself.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_01: And that that really shows how close that team had become and how tight-knit they were.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, and the Ben, of course, being the rookie he is, promises Bettis a Super Bowl if he returns.
• 1:02:17
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, you know, and Ben, you know, like a true Hall of Famer gets it done.
• 1:02:22
  SPEAKER_01: So um he has a great induction to the Hall of Fame, great speech.
• 1:02:26
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we'll have links to all this.
• 1:02:28
  SPEAKER_01: And it here's something kind of scary, Tim.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_01: He finished, I remember he finished like what fifth or sixth all time when he finished.
• 1:02:36
  SPEAKER_01: Retired, yeah.
• 1:02:37
  SPEAKER_01: So it took him five years to get in the hall of fame.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_01: Is that is that kind of crazy?
• 1:02:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I after after what happened with Belichick not being in the Hall of Fame, I I don't I can't explain the logic that goes into the Hall of Fame voting at this point.
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_00: It makes very little sense.
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_01: Well, they that was before the change.
• 1:02:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like they made some change where you can only put in so many people, so I don't know.
• 1:03:06
  SPEAKER_01: It just like and if you watch that speech, his Hall of Fame, he like thanks everybody.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_01: He even thanks Ben and says, Oh, thanks for making that tackle.
• 1:03:14
  SPEAKER_01: I wouldn't be here if you wouldn't have made that tackle on Dick Harper.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_01: So, like, you know, Jerome Bennett's really just just a really classy guy, really classy guy.
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, he ends up with um did it did it did it 13,662 yards, rushing, 91 rush rushing touchdowns.
• 1:03:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that was fifth all time at his retirement.
• 1:03:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um I mean I still think that's pretty good considering he never really played like like Franco and the other guys, they played with like a really great quarterback.
• 1:03:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like Drome never really had a Hall of Fame quarterback until his last two seasons.
• 1:03:51
  SPEAKER_01: So I mean, what what is his legacy?
• 1:03:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um his best season 96, 97, I don't know, 97 had 1,600 yards, 96 had 1900, 96, almost 2,000.
• 1:04:04
  SPEAKER_01: Oh no, no, he had 1400.
• 1:04:06
  SPEAKER_01: I'm misreading it.
• 1:04:08
  SPEAKER_01: My brain's getting goofy, and 11 touchdowns.
• 1:04:10
  SPEAKER_01: So the nine statistically, the 97 is your best season.
• 1:04:15
  SPEAKER_01: 96 is the second best, but I think 96 he was a little more impactful maybe than 97.
• 1:04:21
  SPEAKER_00: But I I agree because in 96 that was that was the Mike Tomzek year.
• 1:04:26
  SPEAKER_00: They they switched from Jim Miller to Mike Tomzek.
• 1:04:29
  SPEAKER_00: I think in 97 they were they had a little bit more of a passing game with Cordell in there, and and then Cordell could run.
• 1:04:36
  SPEAKER_00: 96.
• 1:04:38
  SPEAKER_00: He was the he was the offense.
• 1:04:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:04:40
  SPEAKER_00: And and teams were stacking guys in the box to stop him, uh, and he still had a great season.
• 1:04:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, all right, uh all-time Steeler running backs for 100, Tim.
• 1:04:52
  SPEAKER_01: Uh where does he rank?
• 1:04:53
  SPEAKER_01: I got Franco, Rocky, Jerome, Willie Parker, and I threw John Henry Johnson just for old timey sake.
• 1:05:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um I think he fits somewhere between Franco and Willie Parker.
• 1:05:06
  SPEAKER_00: That would be I I'd I'd put I'd put him second behind Franco, honestly.
• 1:05:11
  SPEAKER_01: I I think he was Yeah, that's I say I yeah, that's what I meant.
• 1:05:15
  SPEAKER_01: Sank and behind Franco.
• 1:05:16
  SPEAKER_01: That's what I'm saying.
• 1:05:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I I think that's where I'd put him.
• 1:05:19
  SPEAKER_00: And and I know you're gonna uh you're you're gonna wince at this, but I honestly would put Le'Veon Bell on that list somewhere too.
• 1:05:27
  SPEAKER_00: Why?
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_00: Because he was that good.
• 1:05:30
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever.
• 1:05:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like I said, I knew you were gonna wince at that.
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_00: Uh he's yeah.
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_00: If you can take if you can take the who Le'Veon Bell was off the fire out of it.
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_01: He never i I'll just gonna stick with on the field.
• 1:05:42
  SPEAKER_01: He never won anything, couldn't do anything in the playoffs.
• 1:05:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:05:46
  SPEAKER_00: Fair fair.
• 1:05:47
  SPEAKER_00: Fairest thing.
• 1:05:47
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, whatever never paid, never I mean, Jerome Bettis is sitting here getting shot up, getting messed up shots.
• 1:05:54
  SPEAKER_01: He got shots for broken ribs and tried to play.
• 1:05:57
  SPEAKER_01: Le'Veon Bell, ah my you know, I'm a little messed up today.
• 1:06:01
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not going to play in this AFC championship game.
• 1:06:03
  SPEAKER_00: Well and that speaks to your point earlier about, you know, what if Bettis fumbles in that playoff game and doesn't win the Super Bowl then?
• 1:06:10
  SPEAKER_00: I wonder if we're still putting him second behind Franco.
• 1:06:13
  SPEAKER_01: Well I mean the stats, I mean it yeah I I I don't know.
• 1:06:19
  SPEAKER_01: I mean Franco's still the best.
• 1:06:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's tough to argue it.
• 1:06:23
  SPEAKER_01: Willie Parker just didn't have enough longevity.
• 1:06:27
  SPEAKER_01: It was a different type of running back.
• 1:06:29
  SPEAKER_01: He was not not big but Fettis averaged 3.9 yards per carry which isn't great.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_01: I mean it's good but I I don't know Tim well that's it for Jerome.
• 1:06:45
  SPEAKER_01: I mean I I think like we said he definitely slots in right behind Franco and right ahead of Willie and I don't really I don't think Le'Veon Bell maybe maybe makes the top ten I I guess if we have to sure well John Henry Johnson I think that's that's a guy that's another guy you mentioned him you know that was before all of our time.
• 1:07:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah he wasn't here for a long time.
• 1:07:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right he yeah so so there was that too he's I guess neither I mean how many years was Bell here like five four how many years was Willie Parker running backs don't play that long I think that's the other thing about both Franco and Bettis they had really long careers.
• 1:07:25
  SPEAKER_00: They had really long careers they they they were both you know Bettis was a decade as a stealer and then a couple years as a Rams.
• 1:07:33
  SPEAKER_00: Franco was what 14 14 seasons as a stealer so or 13 I can't remember but yeah 72 to when did they come 83 so 12 12 seasons as a stealer but but but nevertheless yeah you don't see running backs play that long so when you're evaluating a running back you really are evaluating them on a short period of time uh but they're those guys were the exceptions yeah yeah so I it it's nice to have like the two classier guys at the top of the list it is it is it is nice to have that and and like you said the the the average maybe being lower some of that is playing that long but yeah I mean that's going to hurt your average when you played that many years and and again Bettis late in his career was used in those short yardage situations so it's only natural that his average is going to come down a little bit yeah I I just can't I don't know I that just like annoyed me so much when Bell did not play in that boy uh yards per attempt I would have never known that yeah LeVeon Bell averaged not four point yards per attempt I don't know if they're adding in the pass rush yards on that and he you know Bell also caught a lot of balls out of the backfield I mean that's the other thing that made him dangerous so yeah well Bettis was never much of a pass catcher.
• 1:08:59
  SPEAKER_01: No no he wasn't goodness gracious he played like a bunch more years after that contract dispute not not quality years but yes he did 2019 to 21 I guess not as a bunch but that's two or three years or more.
• 1:09:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well that's enough uh well I I like Jerome Vettis if you like drilletis see us on Facebook tell us about all your great Jerome Vettis stories eight no head of let us go instead and thanks for listening uh give us a great rating on whatever podcast errors you listen to with us and uh check us out on Facebook and as always the Tim's favorite website is uh Fitzburstworth Memory at week.com we'll see you next time and uh I hope to catch you next time on Fitzburst Works Memory