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Chris Fabry Live - Heaven for Today · The Word On Demand

0:05
S1: How does the reality of heaven but the struggles of
0:09
S1: your life today in perspective, if you really grab hold
0:13
S1: of the biblical concept of heaven, would that change the
0:17
S1: way you think and live and act right now? Jennifer
0:21
S1: Rothschild believes heaven is not some celestial event we wait for.
0:26
S1: It can change how you and I live right here,
0:30
S1: right now. You're going to hear about that straight ahead
0:32
S1: on the program. From the heart to the heart for
0:34
S1: the heart. Thanks for joining us for Chris Fabry live
0:37
S1: online at Chris fabry.org. Thanks to our team, Ryan McConaughey
0:41
S1: doing all things technical. Trish is our producer. Lisa's in
0:44
S1: the chair today. Josh will be answering your calls. And
0:48
S1: I want to pause here as we begin for just
0:50
S1: a moment, because I want to thank those of you
0:52
S1: who heard and responded to our share event last week.
0:56
S1: We had an overwhelming amount of support and the stories
1:00
S1: people shared with us during those four and a half
1:02
S1: days were so encouraging. And it makes me think, maybe
1:06
S1: today you're going to hear something that will change the
1:08
S1: trajectory of your life. That's why we do what we
1:12
S1: do each day with the conversations here. So if you
1:15
S1: did not hear that last week, you can become a
1:17
S1: friend or partner here in October. I'm calling it Christmas
1:20
S1: in October because our Thank you this month is the
1:23
S1: beautiful book by Nancy DeMoss, Wolgemuth Considered Jesus. It's a
1:27
S1: 31 day advent devotional that I want to get to
1:31
S1: you before December begins. Thus, this is why I chose October.
1:35
S1: So give a gift of any size will send it
1:37
S1: to you. You can become a partner. Give a gift
1:40
S1: each month. Just call the number 8669538669532279 or go to kris.org.
1:50
S1: Scroll down. You'll see how you can support us and
1:53
S1: get a copy of that book by Nancy right there.
1:56
S1: Chris Fabry live.org. And thank you for your your real encouragement,
2:01
S1: your support of the Radio Backyard fence. I've seen this
2:06
S1: idea about heaven that almost marginalizes it in the sweet.
2:11
S1: By and by we will meet on that beautiful shore.
2:14
S1: Nothing wrong with that lyric. Everything right with it. Except
2:17
S1: that some say if you think about heaven too much,
2:20
S1: you'll be too heavenly minded to be any earthly good.
2:23
S1: You've heard that before. Jennifer Rothschild is pushing back against
2:27
S1: that misconception with all her might. In her new book,
2:32
S1: Heaven for today 60 devotions on How the Life to
2:36
S1: Come Changes Your Life Right Now. She's a speaker, host
2:41
S1: of the 413 podcast, author of a number of books
2:44
S1: and Bible studies. She's been blind since age 15 and
2:48
S1: says the greatest lesson she's learned in the dark is
2:51
S1: that it doesn't have to be well with your circumstances
2:54
S1: to be well with your soul. Jennifer Rothschild, welcome back.
2:58
S1: How are you doing today?
3:00
S2: Oh I'm great. Better now. I love talking to you
3:03
S2: and all your people.
3:04
S1: Same here. Uh, okay. So why why do people say that?
3:09
S1: You know, heavenly minded, earthly good. Why do we marginalize heaven? Uh,
3:15
S1: sometimes even in the church.
3:18
S2: Well, you know, it's interesting. C.S. Lewis, I'm not going
3:20
S2: to quote him directly, but he basically said, the people
3:23
S2: who do the most for this earth are the ones
3:25
S2: who have the most, the most heaven on their mind, basically.
3:29
S2: And I think the reason we, um, we don't recognize
3:33
S2: the impact of focusing on heaven and how it can
3:37
S2: change today is we really don't understand that Jesus died
3:42
S2: not just to bring us to heaven someday, but to
3:45
S2: bring heaven to us and through us on this day.
3:49
S2: And when we recognize Chris that we're made for eternity,
3:53
S2: like this is just part of the whole story. But
3:56
S2: it's not the story. And it's not like, well, this
3:58
S2: once this ends, then real life begins. No, all of
4:01
S2: this is the life that God has intended for us.
4:04
S2: It's just that as we live this day with that
4:08
S2: day in mind, it allows us to live all the
4:11
S2: promises of heaven even now and and man. Can that
4:14
S2: change things with your hope, with feeling grounded, with having optimism,
4:18
S2: with an eternal perspective? I mean, it is just such
4:22
S2: a powerful way to live.
4:24
S1: But it's not, um, it's, it's not pushing aside the
4:28
S1: reality that I'm facing here and now, you know, somebody
4:32
S1: listening today. There's financial struggle, there's relational struggle, there's, you know,
4:37
S1: job loss, loss of job, whatever it is that has
4:40
S1: come into your life. You're not saying, okay, just concentrate,
4:45
S1: think about heaven as a la la la la la.
4:49
S2: So.
4:49
S1: That.
4:49
S2: You don't feel.
4:50
S1: This. Yeah. No, that's not it.
4:53
S2: No. But what it does help us do is give
4:56
S2: our feelings a biblical place to land. Okay. Because life
5:02
S2: is complicated. Life is hard. I just had a dear friend.
5:06
S2: We prayed she would not die from her cancer. And
5:08
S2: she stepped into what I call the gain. She stepped
5:11
S2: into heaven. She died. She is no longer alive on
5:14
S2: this earth where we can touch her and hug her.
5:17
S2: My mom is real sick right now. I've been blind
5:20
S2: since I was 15. All this stuff is very hard
5:24
S2: earth stuff. But what heaven does, it doesn't diminish it.
5:28
S2: And nor should we. This is true suffering that Jesus experienced.
5:32
S2: We experience and. And there's an there is a, there
5:36
S2: is a, um, identification with Christ. When we allow ourselves
5:40
S2: to really understand what this suffering is doing to us, right?
5:44
S2: But when we understand the promise of heaven, it gives
5:48
S2: us a place to put these feelings. When my friend
5:51
S2: Whitney died of cancer. Knowing that heaven is real gave
5:55
S2: me a safe place to put my feelings of loss
5:57
S2: and grief. It's like the hands of heaven held it tenderly, saying,
6:01
S2: this is not the end of Whitney's story, nor is
6:04
S2: it the end of yours. Well, my worst days with blindness.
6:07
S2: When I'm so tired, when I'm so frustrated, when I
6:09
S2: just wish I could drive to the store or see
6:12
S2: my grandbabies face. It's like heaven has this safe place
6:16
S2: that it lets me hold those feelings of recognizing that
6:20
S2: there will come a day when I will see. And
6:23
S2: in fact, no one will need light, because the light
6:25
S2: of the Lamb will be our light. So if that
6:27
S2: is true for that day, then how can that promise
6:31
S2: bui me on this day? Well, it can give me
6:33
S2: a perspective that lets me see beyond my sorrow, beyond
6:37
S2: my suffering. And so when I feel the loss here,
6:40
S2: it becomes an opportunity to point to this deeper and
6:44
S2: greater and more lasting gain.
6:47
S1: There is the Whitney you just mentioned. Is that Whitney cap?
6:52
S2: Oh, yes, Whitney Caps, great Bible teacher, one of the most, uh,
6:56
S2: speaker author full of joy. Absolutely. Till her final breath.
7:02
S2: You talk about someone who teaches us that verse in
7:06
S2: Nehemiah where it says, the joy of the Lord is
7:08
S2: my strength. Her strength made no sense until you saw
7:12
S2: the joy of the Lord in her. And you're like,
7:14
S2: that is what? That's what happened. So yeah, it is
7:17
S2: our loss. It is heaven's gain. And it's hard to
7:20
S2: say it because we love earth and we love Whitney.
7:22
S2: But it's Whitney's gain also that she has stepped into
7:25
S2: forever life with Jesus.
7:28
S1: Um, we had reached out to her. She wrote a book,
7:31
S1: a Bible study, the melody of Grace. And we had
7:34
S1: reached out to her earlier in September, and it didn't
7:38
S1: work out for the date that we had chosen. And so,
7:41
S1: you know, we sent some other dates. And then very
7:44
S1: quickly she went downhill and then then passed away not
7:49
S1: long after that. So that you mentioned her that that
7:52
S1: puts everything in perspective. Just, you know, her life, the
7:56
S1: impression that she made on you, the words that she
7:59
S1: leaves behind in these, you know, the books that she's written,
8:02
S1: the studies as well as in the lives of the
8:05
S1: people that she touched, her family members, of course, and
8:08
S1: other people. Right?
8:09
S2: Yeah, yeah. And, you know, Whitney, if she were here
8:14
S2: sitting next to me, she'd say, but that's not just
8:16
S2: my story. That can be all of our stories, because
8:19
S2: the lives that we live here, they really are an investment.
8:23
S2: They're an investment in the kingdom. They're an investment in
8:26
S2: other people. And, you know, I don't think I know.
8:29
S2: I know that Whitney did not live for legacy. She
8:32
S2: lived for Jesus. But in inadvertently, we're all going to
8:36
S2: leave a legacy, whether for good, for life, for whatever
8:40
S2: it is. Whitney did not live to leave a legacy.
8:43
S2: But Whitney has left a legacy because she lived for Jesus.
8:47
S2: She's out living her life because she spent it, she
8:50
S2: gave it. And so I can't imagine, Chris, the joy
8:56
S2: that she is experiencing right now, fully alive in the
8:59
S2: presence of God in heaven. Yet what a gift, because
9:03
S2: she is in Christ that her life is still being
9:06
S2: lived out here through the life that she really spent
9:10
S2: so well. It was a well squandered life. That's how
9:12
S2: I'll put it. She lived a well squandered life.
9:15
S1: We just I mentioned we went through had this fundraiser
9:18
S1: last week, and it was the first time in 20
9:21
S1: some years that our friend Colin Lambert wasn't there because
9:25
S1: he passed away a few weeks ago. And several times
9:28
S1: we brought his name up because Colin was, Colin was
9:32
S1: if he was on with me, he was always the
9:34
S1: one who could keep these figures in his head. You know,
9:37
S1: he could do it very, very quickly. And he could explain,
9:40
S1: give a kind of a broad view of, you know,
9:43
S1: this is what we're going for, and this is what
9:44
S1: our goal is this hour, etcetera, etcetera. As well As
9:47
S1: you know, this is why funding Moody Radio is a good,
9:51
S1: good idea. But several times we mentioned Collins name, and
9:55
S1: every time somebody brought up the fact that we would
9:57
S1: not want him back here, he would not want to come,
10:00
S1: come back and be a part of this, not because
10:03
S1: he didn't want, but because of what he's experiencing right now.
10:07
S1: And that helps frame it doesn't take away the grief
10:11
S1: that when the loss that we feel and his family,
10:14
S1: but it kind of reframes what we're talking about. And
10:17
S1: so I'm going to take a break. I'm going to
10:19
S1: give you the phone number, uh, (877) 548-3675. How would you
10:25
S1: answer that question? How does the reality of heaven put
10:30
S1: the struggle that you're facing in your life today in perspective?
10:34
S1: Not that it moves it off of the, the stage
10:38
S1: of your life, but how does it help you gain
10:41
S1: better perspective? Some folks on Facebook have answered that question.
10:45
S1: I'd like to hear from you at (877) 548-3675. Jennifer Rothschild
10:52
S1: is with us. Heaven for today 60 devotions on how
10:56
S1: the life to come Changes Your Life right Now is
10:59
S1: our featured resource at Chris Fabry live.org. Chris Fabry live
11:03
S1: dot ORG. More straight ahead on Moody Radio. How does
11:18
S1: the reality of heaven put your life? The struggles, the tension,
11:23
S1: the anxiety, the worry, whatever it is you're facing? How
11:27
S1: does the reality of heaven put your life in perspective?
11:31
S1: That's the question for today's program. And John says this
11:34
S1: on Facebook. The inconvenience that I let bother me is
11:39
S1: nothing when compared to the reality of heaven. And that's interesting.
11:45
S1: The way that you put that the inconvenience that I
11:48
S1: let bother me is nothing. So that's, that's the whole
11:53
S1: perspective I want to hear from you. (877) 548-3675. Jennifer Rothschild
11:58
S1: is with us today on the at the backyard fence.
12:02
S1: And the book that is our featured resource is Heaven
12:05
S1: for today 60 devotions on how the life to come
12:08
S1: Changes Your life. Right now we have it linked right there.
12:11
S1: Chris Fabry live.org. And I think it's interesting that a
12:14
S1: person who hasn't seen anything since you were 15 is
12:18
S1: trying to help us see the reality of heaven. Talk about.
12:21
S2: That. Yeah. Isn't that interesting? Well, the bottom line is,
12:26
S2: I think losing my sight so young in life. And
12:29
S2: so I've lived in blindness, in physical darkness longer than
12:32
S2: I ever lived in physical light. So honestly, Chris, it's
12:36
S2: made my longing for heaven so much sweeter. Because remember
12:41
S2: Paul in second Corinthians, he actually says that all of
12:44
S2: us right now, we. We see through a glass dimly.
12:48
S2: But soon on that day, we will see face to face.
12:52
S2: And so one of the things I think blindness has
12:55
S2: helped me do, it's helped me, um, tune my spiritual
12:59
S2: vision toward an eternal perspective because I don't have the
13:05
S2: luxury of being distracted, but by what I see here.
13:09
S2: So it has caused me to cast my gaze on
13:11
S2: a reality that I can't see. I mean, that's what
13:13
S2: faith is. But here's the thing, Chris. It's in those
13:17
S2: deeper moments of longing, of longing for sight, longing to
13:21
S2: be able to have the independence and agency that site
13:25
S2: would allow. It's in those moments of longing that I
13:28
S2: think I've been able to shift from, um, understanding what
13:32
S2: I'm really longing for. And here's what I mean. So
13:35
S2: I used to think, oh, I just, I can't wait
13:37
S2: to go to heaven because heaven is relief. Heaven means
13:41
S2: no blindness. Heaven means I'm reunited with my daddy. Heaven
13:45
S2: is all that. And what I began to realize. All
13:48
S2: those things are good longings. And those are going to
13:50
S2: be part of the benefits of heaven. But what they
13:52
S2: really represent is the deepest longing my soul was made for.
13:57
S2: And that's to see Jesus. That's to be united fully
14:02
S2: with the one who saved me and gave himself for me.
14:05
S2: That's what it means. I think that right now we
14:07
S2: see through this veil dimly, whether we're blind or we
14:10
S2: have 2020 vision. We see, we see through a glass dimly.
14:14
S2: But on that day, we're going to see face to face.
14:16
S2: We're truly going to know to the degree that we
14:19
S2: have been known. That is a satisfaction that is deeper
14:22
S2: than earthly sight.
14:24
S1: You talk about in one of the devotions, you talk
14:27
S1: about not being able to remember the face of your
14:30
S1: mother and some of the things that you saw before
14:35
S1: the blindness came. And so I was going to ask,
14:39
S1: you know, who are you looking forward to seeing other
14:41
S1: than Jesus, you know, and your your dad. Um.
14:44
S2: My dad. Well, can I say C.S. Lewis also, though,
14:46
S2: can we add him? I'd like to see his face. Okay.
14:48
S2: Thank you.
14:49
S1: Well, you've had his head every day when you sit down.
14:51
S2: To.
14:51
S1: Write. I do, right?
14:52
S2: I do pat his head. I have a little statue
14:54
S2: of C.S. Lewis, and I pat his head every morning. Yes.
14:57
S1: And that's good. That's that's just one of the. It
14:59
S1: gets you in the writing mood, right?
15:01
S2: It does. It does. I need a little C.S. Lewis
15:04
S2: in my writing and in my life and in my perspective.
15:07
S2: But you know what, um, one of the things about blindness, Chris,
15:10
S2: my disease, um, what's so interesting is I did once
15:14
S2: see all my people's faces, I saw my sweet daddy's
15:16
S2: face and my mom, I've never been able to see
15:18
S2: my husband or my kids, but at one point I
15:21
S2: did see my brothers and my dad and my mom.
15:24
S2: But with blindness being so long in darkness, um, I
15:28
S2: guess those facial features are more visually reinforced, so I
15:32
S2: really can't conjure up a memory of them any longer.
15:35
S2: Which early on, that was such a deeper hurt, you know,
15:39
S2: to lose the ability to see them, but then to
15:41
S2: lose the memory of those faces. And I've heard that
15:43
S2: happens too, when we lose a loved one, that sometimes
15:46
S2: it gets harder to remember their voice or their faces.
15:49
S2: But I think that's one of the treasures of heaven,
15:52
S2: that there will be no forgetting, there will be no loss,
15:55
S2: and there will be instant recognition even of the face
15:58
S2: of Jesus, whose we've never seen before, even of every saint,
16:01
S2: because we will know and. And the sweet blessing of
16:05
S2: our forever heaven of the new earth is that we
16:08
S2: will be every tongue, every tribe, all there. For one
16:11
S2: reason at the marriage supper of the Lamb, enjoying fellowship
16:14
S2: with each other forever. I just I that makes this loss,
16:18
S2: this Romans 818 situation. You know that we will consider
16:23
S2: that this suffering that we deal with right now, it's
16:25
S2: hard and there's loss, but it does not compare to
16:29
S2: the eternal glory that we're going to experience someday.
16:32
S1: Isn't that part of what you're trying to do? Open
16:35
S1: the eyes of my heart. We sing that. You see
16:37
S1: it in Scripture. The eyes of your heart. If you
16:40
S1: can see well, then it almost keeps holds you back
16:46
S1: from seeing further. The way that you're talking about being
16:51
S1: able to see with your heart rather than just your,
16:54
S1: you know, earthly vision.
16:56
S2: Yeah. You get, you get stuck. You get distracted on
16:59
S2: that which you can see here. But I think one
17:02
S2: of the ways we can really, truly live heaven today,
17:05
S2: live it right now, Chris, is by enjoying the beautiful
17:09
S2: things of this earth. God made this beautiful earth. Yes,
17:12
S2: someday it will be restored and redeemed and according to
17:14
S2: its Edenic intent, when we're on the forever heaven of
17:17
S2: the New Earth. But even so, even though the beauty
17:20
S2: right now is groaning, it's still beautiful. I touch the
17:23
S2: petals of a blue hydrangea, and it's almost like my
17:26
S2: eyes can see the intricacy and the beauty. So we
17:30
S2: should never shun or or think that it is unspiritual
17:35
S2: to enjoy the beauty of this earth, the beauty of
17:38
S2: what God made, the giggle in a child, the babbling
17:41
S2: sound of a river. But but what we do is
17:44
S2: we use those as opportunities. We don't gaze at them.
17:47
S2: We use them as glimpses. In other words, they're not
17:49
S2: the point. Oh, isn't this beautiful? And that's a period
17:52
S2: at the end of our sentence. No, it's those are pointers.
17:56
S2: The beauty that we feel, the longing, the ache, everything
17:59
S2: about the beauty and even the sorrow on this earth
18:03
S2: that cause us to feel that distraction should actually become
18:07
S2: what I call a pointer. It points us to the
18:10
S2: greater reality to come to our eternal reality to come.
18:14
S2: Because there is a greater point. There's an exclamation point.
18:17
S2: It's Jesus, our forever heaven of the new earth. So yeah,
18:21
S2: live here. Well, feel what you feel here, but don't
18:25
S2: assume that's the point. Look at everything here as a pointer,
18:29
S2: a little slice of eternity that allows you to see
18:33
S2: beyond it and through it to the greater and forever
18:36
S2: reality of heaven.
18:38
S1: I like that a slice of eternity. That's what these
18:41
S1: devotionals are. It's time for you to consider heaven, contemplate
18:45
S1: the reality of heaven, and then be comforted by it.
18:49
S1: Right now, with whatever you're going through. And if you
18:53
S1: go to Chris Fabry live.org, you'll see that Heaven for
18:56
S1: today by Jennifer Rothschild. (877) 548-3675. Gary is on the line
19:04
S1: from Georgia. Hi, Gary. Go right ahead.
19:07
S3: Hey, I just wanted to tell you guys how encouraging, uh,
19:14
S3: the show is today. We lost our 15 year old.
19:27
S3: A month ago, and, uh, the kids are. But. We
19:36
S3: have a great team. Because ever since his diagnosis in
19:45
S3: June of last year, he just let his light shine
19:49
S3: for Jesus. And he has such wisdom that he would
20:00
S3: excuse me. He would tell my wife. He would say,
20:03
S3: you know, if you're a Christian, you never really know.
20:08
S3: And he. He would say, you don't start really living
20:16
S3: until you die. And you know, his that that faith
20:20
S3: and knowing where he is in his health. And I
20:26
S3: apologize for carrying on.
20:28
S1: Don't you you're not carrying on. This is great to hear, Gary,
20:33
S1: how your process. It's only been a month and what
20:36
S1: you've been through. Tell me your son's name.
20:39
S3: His name was Roy.
20:41
S1: Roy.
20:42
S3: Well. And Roy, I'll tell you a funny story. His
20:45
S3: name was. His God given name is Rory. And in
20:48
S3: January of. We found out his diagnosis in June of
20:51
S3: last year. But in January of last year, he and
20:55
S3: his twin brother and I were in, uh, at Starbucks
20:59
S3: and they would get a hot chocolate and they, they
21:01
S3: couldn't hear the Rory. So they wrote they, they heard
21:04
S3: Roy and he said, you know what, I like that
21:07
S3: I want to be called Roy from that song.
21:12
S4: Oh, I love it.
21:14
S1: Because I heard I heard Roy, but now I can
21:16
S1: hear Rory too. Yeah. Okay. Don't don't go anywhere, Gary.
21:21
S1: Don't you go anywhere. Gary. I want to come back
21:23
S1: to you. But, Jennifer, you're you're feeling this the same
21:26
S1: way I am.
21:27
S2: Oh my goodness. Well, first of all, Gary, I think
21:30
S2: we're all honored. Yeah, this is hard. I think we're
21:35
S2: all honored that you would share this story with us
21:38
S2: and share the beauty of your son's life with us.
21:40
S2: Thank you. Gary. Um, for your stewardship of his story
21:44
S2: and your story. We're all so deeply touched by it.
21:48
S2: And may I say, may we all live and die
21:52
S2: like Roy because Roy got something that we don't understand
21:56
S2: and that is, we don't die. Death dies. I mean,
21:59
S2: that's what the promise of First Corinthians 15 is, is
22:02
S2: that death has no sting. The grave has no victory.
22:06
S2: And you know what I was thinking of? Um, Gary,
22:10
S2: when when I miss somebody I love so much and I,
22:13
S2: and I pray this for you and your wife, you know,
22:16
S2: Sunday or whenever it is you're next in church and
22:19
S2: or just worshiping. I don't know that we are ever
22:22
S2: more close to the loved ones who have already stepped
22:25
S2: into the gain and moved to heaven. I don't know
22:27
S2: that we're ever closer to them than when we worship.
22:31
S2: Because that's exactly what your boy is doing right now
22:35
S2: in front of the throne, fully alive, worshiping. And so
22:39
S2: when you worship Gary, you're as close to him as
22:42
S2: you'll ever be until you're with him some day in heaven.
22:47
S2: That's the gift of the gospel. That's the beauty of
22:49
S2: the promise of heaven. We're honored to share your story
22:52
S2: with us, brother.
22:53
S1: Uh, Gary, you mentioned his brother and the hot chocolate.
22:57
S1: How's his brother taking all this?
22:59
S2: Yeah.
23:00
S3: It's been an interesting, um, it's been an interesting road. Um,
23:05
S3: as twins growing up, they were, you know, hooked at
23:09
S3: the hip. Um. And so anyway, when we found out
23:15
S3: he had a brain tumor, you know, and he was at,
23:19
S3: in the hospital for a month before we went to
23:22
S3: Saint Jude for about three months. And then we got
23:25
S3: to Saint Jude. He really started secluding himself from his
23:29
S3: brother due to a large degree, because I guess that
23:35
S3: was his way of coping. So he's doing okay. You know,
23:39
S3: I tell people he's he's got he loves Broadway, so
23:42
S3: he's always got a song in his heart. And he's
23:47
S3: adjusting just like all of us. So we're, you know. Constantly,
23:52
S3: you know, spending time with him and, you know, praying
23:54
S3: with him and just, you know, it's, it's, you can never,
24:00
S3: you know, none of this is the same for anybody
24:02
S3: in any kind of loss. So it's just, you know,
24:05
S3: trusting God in it. And, you know, I think it's
24:08
S3: brought us closer to God as a family. It's really
24:11
S3: weird how it takes something like this to do it.
24:14
S3: But our faith has grown. You know, I, I've never
24:19
S3: questioned of people saying, do you ever question, you know what?
24:23
S3: You know why God, why me? Or why my son?
24:27
S3: I never have asked that because this is easy. Had
24:30
S3: hits about 300 kids a year and it's a death sentence.
24:34
S3: There's no cure. And I thought, and I think, why
24:37
S3: not me? You know, why not? Why not always shine
24:41
S3: and shine is so why should I put that on
24:46
S3: somebody else's child or somebody else's family? You know God,
24:51
S3: God didn't give this to us. It happened. And what
24:55
S3: we did with it is, you know, the best that
24:58
S3: we can do to, you know, to show him and
25:00
S3: to show the way, you know, the way to heaven.
25:03
S3: So anyway.
25:05
S1: I, I go back to what I said at the
25:07
S1: beginning of the quote. It's, uh, from Jennifer, you know,
25:11
S1: blind since 15. But the greatest lesson is not in
25:16
S1: the dark. It doesn't have to be well with your
25:18
S1: circumstances to be well with your soul. And that's what
25:21
S1: it sounds like. Gary. It is with you and your
25:24
S1: family as much as you can be with this huge
25:27
S1: gaping hole in your heart. So I want you to
25:30
S1: hang on. I want to send a copy of this
25:32
S1: book to you, Heaven for today. And I hope his brother,
25:37
S1: the twin, will be able to to get into some
25:40
S1: of these devotions on how the life to come changes
25:43
S1: your life right now. So hang on, Gary, we'll get
25:45
S1: your information. Jennifer Rothschild is with us. (877) 548-3675 is our number.
25:53
S1: More straight ahead. A song with Jennifer in the break.
26:05
S1: And we really believe that there's somebody listening right now
26:08
S1: who needed to hear Gary's open, honest story about his
26:14
S1: son who passed away. Roy. And this has encouraged you today,
26:19
S1: and I hope his what Gary just exhibited here of
26:23
S1: being faithful, a faithful steward of the pain and the
26:26
S1: struggle in his own life has helped somebody else today.
26:29
S1: I really believe that can happen when we're faithful with
26:33
S1: that pain and with that struggle. And that's really what
26:36
S1: Jennifer has done with all of her writing, with all
26:38
S1: of her Bible studies, with her voice that she speaks
26:41
S1: around the country. She has that 413 podcast, and her
26:45
S1: latest book is Heaven for today 60 Devotions on How
26:48
S1: the Life to Come Changes Your Life Right Now. Featured resource@kris.org.
26:55
S1: Kris fabric.org. Isn't it interesting that we you mentioned Whitney
27:00
S1: Camp and her death, and then Gary mentions Roy's death.
27:06
S1: And it just brings us even in the conversation that
27:08
S1: we're having, it brings a sense of a sense of gravity,
27:12
S1: a groundedness to the conversation. But at the same time,
27:16
S1: there's this smile that we can have through the tears, right?
27:21
S2: Wow. It's such a hard juxtaposition, Chris, isn't it because
27:25
S2: there's loss, but there's hope. I mean, and this is,
27:28
S2: I think, a great picture of what Paul was talking
27:31
S2: about in, in second Thessalonians when he said, when we grieve,
27:34
S2: we don't grieve like those who have no hope. And
27:39
S2: I think one of the things about heaven that we
27:42
S2: all hesitate to linger on or talk about, one of
27:45
S2: the reasons is because you got to die to get there.
27:49
S2: And sometimes we're not so afraid of death itself. My
27:54
S2: mom was just even telling me this recently. It's the process.
27:57
S2: What's it going to feel like? Or the pain or
28:00
S2: the loss of control? What is that transition? I mean,
28:03
S2: there's just so many, so many things that are uncertain
28:06
S2: about the process of death. But when we hear stories
28:09
S2: like Roy's or Whitney Capps, we realize like death is
28:14
S2: not the period at the end of our stories. It's
28:18
S2: like this comma that transitions us into the forever story
28:23
S2: of our life. And, you know, I heard someone one
28:26
S2: time they were talking about dying. And when we got
28:28
S2: into a conversation, I said, you know, I wonder if
28:31
S2: death is like a birth. And maybe this was on
28:34
S2: my mind because my daughter in law was pregnant and
28:36
S2: there was a she was very pregnant. It was almost
28:38
S2: time for her to deliver. And you could touch her
28:40
S2: little her belly and feel a little elbow poke out.
28:43
S2: And she was expecting a baby girl. And you know,
28:46
S2: I felt her belly. And that skin is so tight
28:49
S2: and it feels like that little girl is just busting
28:51
S2: to come out. And I was thinking, that baby, that's
28:55
S2: the world. She knows the safety of her mama's womb.
28:58
S2: That's all she knows. But someday, when it was time
29:03
S2: for her to be delivered, she was going to be
29:05
S2: born into the world that she was actually made for
29:09
S2: in the womb. She thought she had freedom and life
29:12
S2: and air and light, until she passed through that birth
29:16
S2: canal and was born into the world she was made for,
29:19
S2: where she really began to understand what light and air
29:23
S2: and freedom felt like. I think that's the combination. That's
29:26
S2: the picture of what it feels like to live here
29:29
S2: on earth. And we're so afraid to die because we
29:32
S2: think right here, this is it. This is freedom. This
29:34
S2: is air. This is light. But someday, for lack of
29:37
S2: a better term, we're going to pass through that birth
29:39
S2: canal from death to life into our forever life, where
29:44
S2: we're really going to understand what Roy understands right now,
29:46
S2: what Whitney understands right now, that that's life. That's freedom.
29:51
S2: That's the true light we were made for.
29:54
S1: And I think just going through this and hearing you
29:57
S1: talk about that and thinking again of heaven, it checks
30:01
S1: our faith in what we really believe in about the
30:05
S1: sovereignty of God, about his control over our lives, what
30:09
S1: he allows us to go through for our good and
30:13
S1: his glory. That doesn't feel like it at the time.
30:16
S1: It feels like it's rough. You know, the the birth thing.
30:19
S1: The only difference in the analogy and the reality of
30:22
S1: heaven is there's nobody waiting on the other side of
30:24
S1: heaven to spank you, spank you with a mask, you know,
30:27
S1: to get you to cry.
30:28
S2: And you don't cry, you know?
30:29
S1: Exactly.
30:30
S4: Yeah. But it is a, it is a.
30:32
S1: Waking up, in a sense, to who, who he is
30:37
S1: and who we are. Right?
30:39
S2: Yeah. Who we were made to be. Right. Because in
30:42
S2: many ways, if you think about it, when that beautiful
30:45
S2: first Garden of Eden before sin entered, that was God's
30:49
S2: intent for humanity, where he walked with us every day, where,
30:53
S2: where there was just a beauty and relationship, no sin
30:56
S2: to drain us and stain relationships and everything we touch.
31:00
S2: Someday this earth will be restored. We will be in
31:04
S2: the forever heaven of the new earth, and there will
31:07
S2: be holiness. But you know, on this side it is hard.
31:10
S2: I mean, sometimes I just really have to ponder and
31:13
S2: quote and preach to my own soul in the middle
31:16
S2: of blindness. Second Corinthians 416. That I'm not going to
31:20
S2: lose heart, though outwardly we're wasting away, but inwardly, daily
31:27
S2: we're being renewed and these light and temporary troubles. And
31:32
S2: I'm going to pause right there because, Chris, they don't
31:34
S2: feel light, right? They don't feel temporary. Look how Roy's
31:37
S2: earthly life ended. It's not temporary. And so these light
31:41
S2: and temporary troubles, though they they are working in us
31:44
S2: a far greater weight of glory. So we fix our
31:46
S2: eyes not on what we can see, because what we
31:49
S2: can see, whether it's the most beautiful or the most difficult.
31:53
S2: What we can see is temporary, but what is unseen
31:58
S2: is eternal. And so I think there's a gift in
32:01
S2: having to feel the angst of the struggle here, because
32:05
S2: it helps us to long for and fix our eyes
32:07
S2: on that which is unseen, which is our true reality.
32:11
S2: So we feel it here, but we fix our gaze.
32:13
S2: We fix our hope on what is to come. I
32:16
S2: think that's what we heard in Gary's voice today when
32:19
S2: he was talking about his son.
32:21
S1: Yeah. And it's echoed when John, I read the inconvenience
32:25
S1: that I let bother me. It's fixing your gaze is
32:29
S1: not letting this thing right here. You know, I got
32:32
S1: to deal with. But not letting that steal what is
32:37
S1: what God is doing and is bringing me to and through. Uh,
32:42
S1: let me go to Heather. Heather, why did you call today?
32:46
S5: Um, the reason I called it. Well, one reason, um,
32:49
S5: we're actually doing heaven, uh, your book study for our
32:53
S5: women's Bible study. And tomorrow I'm. I'm right now. Tomorrow
32:59
S5: I'm the teacher. So, um, and we're on week two
33:03
S5: and we're going through and, and as we're going through this,
33:07
S5: it's just, you know, I'm thinking about this, uh, as
33:13
S5: when we get to heaven and where heaven is. And
33:17
S5: the one thing that I have struggled with is people
33:21
S5: that I loved who didn't know Christ. And, you know,
33:25
S5: you talked about hell in this week and hell is real.
33:30
S5: And it scares me that people that I love won't
33:35
S5: get to go to heaven and have that amazing gift
33:39
S5: that Christ is giving has given us when he died
33:43
S5: on the cross. And, you know, I'm, I'm excited. I
33:47
S5: have no fear of dying. I know where I'm going. Um,
33:50
S5: I have most of my family, but it's just those
33:53
S5: people that don't know him and have that relationship and
33:57
S5: how I can better that with with others. I don't know.
34:01
S4: Your question, Heather. I love your question.
34:03
S1: Because we had when the two Michaels were on, we
34:05
S1: were talking about the Bible and there was a caller
34:07
S1: about this time of the program. And he called and
34:11
S1: and there was a catch in his voice. He was
34:13
S1: emotional about how can I enjoy heaven when I know
34:18
S1: that there are people who aren't there that I love
34:21
S1: and care about? And how can I, you know, be
34:26
S1: in bliss when that is true? And the Michaels gave
34:30
S1: that answer. So now we turn to Jennifer Rothschild. Jennifer.
34:33
S2: Oh, okay. Well, here's first of all, Heather, thank you
34:36
S2: so much for leading the Heaven Bible study. I appreciate that.
34:39
S2: And you are speaking of something that is a very
34:41
S2: real sorrow we should feel. And so that sorrow, though
34:45
S2: we want to channel it to sharing the hope of Christ.
34:48
S2: But I just had the conversation similar to this with
34:50
S2: the lady who does my nails. She's a good friend.
34:52
S2: She just had a friend, one of her clients pass
34:55
S2: away and she said, I just don't know if she's
34:57
S2: in heaven. And here's what I said to her. And
35:01
S2: I would say it to all of us. First of all,
35:03
S2: we share the love of Jesus. We share that he
35:06
S2: is the way, the truth, and the life. Absolutely. But
35:09
S2: we do not know what happens in those final moments
35:14
S2: of a person's life. God is so merciful. He is
35:18
S2: not willing that any should perish. We don't know what
35:21
S2: happens between Jesus, the Savior of the world, and that
35:25
S2: person whom God created and Jesus died for. We don't
35:29
S2: know the communication that may take place. We don't know.
35:32
S2: So we cannot know for sure whether a person who
35:36
S2: we loved, who has died is in heaven or is
35:38
S2: in hell. Only Jesus knows that. And we do our
35:42
S2: part while we are loving people well on this side
35:45
S2: of eternity by showing Christ and sharing Christ. But ultimately
35:49
S2: we trust that Christ, who is the what is called
35:53
S2: the hound of Heaven. He is always pursuing those whom
35:55
S2: he loves to save them, and we don't even know
35:58
S2: until the last minute till they pass from death to life.
36:01
S2: The kindness of Jesus and how he communicates it to
36:04
S2: each person.
36:05
S1: Heather, does that help you?
36:08
S5: It does, because, you know, it reminds me of Christ
36:11
S5: on the cross, and the two other gentlemen that were
36:17
S5: one was mocking him, and the other one was like,
36:22
S5: take me with you. I believe in you. And he
36:24
S5: was minutes from death. And Christ said to him, you
36:27
S5: will be in heaven with me forever. And so you
36:31
S5: got it.
36:32
S1: Yeah.
36:33
S5: And so I, you know, I just keep that. And
36:35
S5: I hope people hear that. So but.
36:38
S1: Heather, when you get in the in the study tomorrow,
36:41
S1: you say, I was talking with Jennifer Rothschild.
36:43
S2: Yesterday. You tell.
36:44
S1: Her. Yeah.
36:44
S2: Yes. You tell them. I said, hey.
36:48
S5: I will actually a few of my ladies are listening
36:51
S5: right now.
36:51
S6: Yay.
36:53
S1: Well, thank you for doing that study. And if you
36:55
S1: go to chris.org, you can see the new book, which
36:58
S1: is a devotional. It's 60 days, basically 60 devotions on
37:03
S1: how the life to come changes your life right now.
37:06
S1: Heaven for today is the title of it, and you
37:09
S1: can find that at Chris Fabry live.org. Chris dot ORG.
37:16
S1: Jennifer Rothschild is back with us today. Love hearing her voice.
37:20
S1: We're going to get to spend some time together in heaven.
37:22
S1: But one more segment here on the program today will
37:25
S1: continue straight ahead on Moody Radio. I am glad you
37:38
S1: joined us today for Jennifer Rothschild, our guest today at
37:42
S1: the back fence. If you go to chris.org, you'll see
37:45
S1: her new book, Heaven for today 60 devotions on How
37:49
S1: the Life to Come Changes Your life Right Now. You
37:54
S1: said something. I'm going to go down this rabbit trail
37:56
S1: with you, Jennifer. You said you have a friend who
37:58
S1: does nails a manicurist, and you can't see the color
38:05
S1: that she's putting on your fingernails. You, you, you you
38:09
S1: don't see how brightly it's polished. I mean, you could
38:12
S1: feel it. You could touch it and feel that. So
38:15
S1: why do you have your nails done if it's not
38:19
S1: something you can see?
38:21
S2: Oh, because you do not have to see beauty to
38:24
S2: appreciate it, Chris. And so here, I'll give you the
38:28
S2: other side of that equation too. So I still, I
38:31
S2: color my hair and I have a good cut and I,
38:33
S2: I've got some little sassy red streaks in the front
38:36
S2: just for fun. And I will tell you this when
38:39
S2: my hair, which is gray really without me coloring it
38:42
S2: when it is starting to show the gray, I can
38:44
S2: feel it because ugly has a texture and I don't
38:47
S2: want to feel that either. So I appreciate the beauty
38:51
S2: I cannot see. I appreciate the way it feels and
38:53
S2: the way it makes me feel okay.
38:57
S1: So it is. It's not just for other people to
39:00
S1: see the beauty of your fingernails. You feel it on
39:03
S1: the inside.
39:04
S2: I do. And you know what else? Once I. Once
39:08
S2: I make a decision about hair or nails, you know,
39:11
S2: I do it so I can create a non-issue. I
39:13
S2: love not thinking about it again. It's like I have
39:16
S2: made a decision. This is the nail color until I die.
39:19
S2: This is the hair color until I die. And then
39:21
S2: it's just done and it's a non-issue. And I love it.
39:23
S2: I can focus on other things.
39:26
S1: I love the story of the. I think his name
39:28
S1: was Mike, the one who taught you how to use
39:32
S1: the white cane.
39:33
S2: Oh, yes.
39:34
S1: Tell me about Mike.
39:36
S2: So he was my first mobility instructor. I was brand new,
39:40
S2: legally blind. And the reason, by the way, for someone
39:42
S2: who may not know, is because of a degenerative disease
39:45
S2: called retinitis pigmentosa pigmentosa. So it started off just slowly
39:51
S2: losing sight. I became legally blind and then later totally blind.
39:54
S2: So this was right at the beginning with legal blindness.
39:58
S2: And I learned how to walk with a white cane.
40:01
S2: So I received, um, I called him, I said I
40:04
S2: got Mike. Mike is my mobility instructor, and he came
40:08
S2: with a white cane and he came to my house
40:10
S2: and he showed me how to use it. Well, the
40:13
S2: sweetest thing was Chris. He's walking me around my neighborhood
40:17
S2: and he's showing me like, how to tap on the left,
40:19
S2: how to tap on the right, how to trail it,
40:21
S2: to know how to anticipate rough spots and curbs and
40:25
S2: step downs and step up. And I remember we were
40:28
S2: getting almost back to my house and it was stressful,
40:31
S2: you know? So I was sweaty from the from the
40:34
S2: Miami Heat, which is where we lived in Miami. And
40:36
S2: also just because it was so stressful, so many things
40:39
S2: to learn. But as we rounded that corner near my home,
40:43
S2: he paused and he asked me, Jennifer, can you smell that?
40:48
S2: And so I paused and I breathed it in and
40:52
S2: I could it was a a hibiscus bush, and it
40:56
S2: was just brand new blooming. So it was very fragrant.
40:59
S2: And I don't know, usually hibiscus are those bright orange
41:02
S2: and red in my imagination. I could see it. But
41:06
S2: he said to me, when you smell the flowers, you'll
41:10
S2: know you're almost home. Well, clearly he meant when you
41:13
S2: smell these flowers, you're going to know you're turning the
41:16
S2: corner in your house is right there. I've never forgotten that, Chris,
41:19
S2: because as we go through this life, there's going to
41:23
S2: come a time where we're going to just smell the flowers.
41:28
S2: I call it the fragrance of heaven, and we're going
41:30
S2: to know we're almost home. Our father's house. I mean,
41:34
S2: that's what Jesus called heaven in John 14. It's our
41:37
S2: father's house, and it has so many rooms. Why? Because
41:40
S2: it's made for the family and there's plenty of room.
41:44
S2: And so there will come a day. Yes. When we
41:47
S2: inhale this amazing fragrance of heaven and we realize, wow,
41:51
S2: we're almost there. But I am convinced that the fragrance
41:56
S2: of heaven, it wafts through our lives every day, through
42:00
S2: our dark moments, through our beautiful moments. And it's this
42:03
S2: reminder that our true home, our father's house, the place
42:08
S2: where we are safe forever, the place from which we
42:11
S2: gain our sense of groundedness and identity. That reality is
42:15
S2: never far away. It's as close as our heartbeat because
42:19
S2: it's our true home. It's our true country. And so
42:23
S2: I talk about in the book Heaven for today. Let's
42:26
S2: live without awareness. Let's keep breathing in the fragrance of
42:29
S2: heaven because it's everywhere. Yeah.
42:32
S1: Oh, that's really good. I'm so glad you met Mike. Um,
42:35
S1: and I want to get Karen in here because she's
42:38
S1: been through a valley, and there's hope on the end
42:41
S1: of her story, too. This is about your daughter, Karen. Uh,
42:44
S1: go right ahead. What did you want to say?
42:45
S7: Yeah.
42:46
S8: Hi. Can you hear me?
42:48
S2: Yeah.
42:48
S1: Sure can.
42:49
S8: Okay. I just want to make sure. Um. Yeah. My
42:52
S8: my beautiful daughter Mariah was taken, um, back in 2022,
42:57
S8: in May 11th. And, um, she was unfortunately murdered by
43:01
S8: a very jealous girl. And it was very, very bizarre
43:05
S8: and crazy and unexpected because Mariah was one of the
43:09
S8: most liked people and very kind of quiet and humble
43:12
S8: and sweet and was had become a professional cyclist, but
43:17
S8: was very humble through it all. And, um, her dreams
43:21
S8: were all coming true. And, you know, there was so
43:24
S8: much good going on, uh, in her, in her life.
43:27
S8: But when I was told by the police officer that
43:30
S8: she was, she had been murdered, I was in the
43:33
S8: garden and I was making the garden bigger because she
43:36
S8: was going to be moving home from California. And I
43:38
S8: wanted to I wanted to have more fresh food for
43:41
S8: us to cook together. And, and it was just, you know,
43:45
S8: a very, very, very hard, hard moment. And I, um,
43:49
S8: the first thing I did was I just claimed that
43:51
S8: God is in control and that God has a plan
43:54
S8: for all of us and that God is going to
43:57
S8: use this tragedy and do something good with it. And,
44:01
S8: and he truly has answered that, that, um, that, that promise. And, and, uh,
44:07
S8: the other thing I said, um, after my head was
44:11
S8: to the ground and I picked my head up and
44:13
S8: I remember looking up at the trees in our yard
44:16
S8: in Vermont. It's so beautiful here. And, and I just said,
44:19
S8: there's still beauty in the world. Beauty has not left. And,
44:24
S8: and I'm going to claim that I'm going to still
44:28
S8: enjoy the beauty that is here. I'm not going to
44:31
S8: just go into a dark cave and stay there forever.
44:34
S8: And yeah, I have my dark moments and I miss
44:36
S8: her terribly. And, but I, I like to think that
44:40
S8: with each sunset when the sun goes down and this
44:43
S8: helped me a lot in the beginning and my heart
44:46
S8: goes out to, to the man who just lost his son.
44:49
S8: And I just want him to know that it does
44:51
S8: get it does get easier. And, um, but with each sunset, you,
44:57
S8: you can think to yourself, I've just gone up a
45:00
S8: little another staircase closer to heaven because I'm one step
45:03
S8: closer to the day when I. When I get to
45:05
S8: enter into heaven to and and be and see her.
45:08
S8: And so, like, there's all these signs on earth, you know,
45:12
S8: in nature that are signs of heaven. And I feel
45:15
S8: like I do truly experience that God has given us
45:19
S8: a beautiful place on a lake that has got serene
45:22
S8: waters and, and nature all around and the birds and,
45:26
S8: and just I see, I see, uh, rock rocks that
45:30
S8: are shaped like hearts. But she used to like to collect.
45:33
S8: And I know that she's sending me her love. And
45:35
S8: they said.
45:36
S1: That so well said that so well Karen. What, what
45:39
S1: was your, your Moriah was her name. So. Jennifer, respond
45:43
S1: to that.
45:44
S2: Well, Karen, you've given us a gift. Thank you. And
45:47
S2: you know what? It reminds me of something. The poet
45:49
S2: George Herbert once wrote that death used to be an undertaker,
45:52
S2: but now death is a gardener. Planting us as seeds
45:56
S2: that will blossom someday with forever. Beauty in heaven. That's
46:00
S2: your Mariah. Forever beauty in heaven.
46:04
S1: Thank you for your call. And Tim Keller expanded on that.
46:07
S1: He said death used to be able to crush us,
46:10
S1: but now all death can do is plant us in
46:13
S1: God's soil, so we become something extraordinary. And I pray
46:19
S1: that our conversation here today. Karen and Gary and the others,
46:23
S1: you who are listening, that this will be ring in
46:26
S1: your soul, and that this idea of living heaven for
46:31
S1: today can change your life right now. Jennifer Rothschild has
46:35
S1: been with us. The featured resource is at the website.
46:38
S1: Chris Fabry live.org. Chris fabry.org. Aaron Shust is going to
46:44
S1: be here tomorrow right here at the Back fence. Our
46:47
S1: programs for production of Moody Radio, a Ministry of Moody
46:50
S1: Bible Institute.