Latest / Wrongful Conviction / #197 Jason Flom with Enes Kanter

Transcript

#197 Jason Flom with Enes Kanter · Wrongful Conviction

0:02
Speaker 1: Enna's Canter was a young basketball phena, living and playing
0:05
Speaker 1: professionally in his native Turkey before eventually coming to the
0:08
Speaker 1: United States to play in the NBA. Currently, he plays
0:11
Speaker 1: center for the Portland Trailblazers, and his story would be
0:14
Speaker 1: the stuff of dreams if not for the specter of
0:16
Speaker 1: authoritarian leadership back at home. Turkish President Resep Erduwan's rule
0:21
Speaker 1: in Turkey started off in a promising direction, but soon
0:24
Speaker 1: devolved into corruption and authoritarianism as he shunned his party's
0:29
Speaker 1: political allies in the Gulan Movement, eventually labeling them a
0:32
Speaker 1: terrorist organization bent on taking over the government. Since then,
0:36
Speaker 1: over fifty thousand members of the Ghulan Movement have been
0:39
Speaker 1: arrested for nothing more than their political affiliation. Ennis Canter
0:44
Speaker 1: began using his platform as an NBA player to draw
0:46
Speaker 1: international attention to this dire situation, making him a wanted
0:51
Speaker 1: man in his beloved Turkey. Since efforts to silence ns
0:55
Speaker 1: have failed, Erduwan has brought down his ire instead upon
0:59
Speaker 1: the Ennis's father. In twenty eighteen, doctor Memet Cantor was
1:04
Speaker 1: sent to prison on false charges of terrorism. Ultimately, Sunlight
1:09
Speaker 1: proved to be the best disinfectant when Ennis was able
1:12
Speaker 1: to use his platform as an NBA star to win
1:14
Speaker 1: his father's freedom, but he is keen to remind us
1:17
Speaker 1: that there are so many more political prisoners still suffering
1:20
Speaker 1: through the authoritarian rule of Urtuwan. This is wrongful Conviction
1:25
Speaker 1: with Jason Plott. Welcome back to wrongful Conviction. Today's guest
1:44
Speaker 1: was wrongfully convicted in absentia. His father was also wrongfully convicted.
1:51
Speaker 1: All of this happened in a foreign country, and all
1:54
Speaker 1: of it happened while he was playing in the NBA.
1:58
Speaker 1: So without further ad please allow me to introduce my
2:03
Speaker 1: friend Ennis Cantor and it's welcome to wrongful Conviction.
2:06
Speaker 2: Thank you for having him. I really appreciate it.
2:08
Speaker 1: And Ennis, what a life, short life, I mean, you're
2:12
Speaker 1: all notly born in nineteen ninety two. You're like a
2:14
Speaker 1: kid to me, you know, but what a life you
2:18
Speaker 1: have led and what a courageous person you are. And
2:23
Speaker 1: we're going to get into all of that, but before
2:26
Speaker 1: we do, let's go back to the beginning. First of all,
2:29
Speaker 1: I think most people don't know you were born actually
2:31
Speaker 1: not a Turkey in Switzerland.
2:33
Speaker 2: Right, Yes, I'mor in Switzerland. My dad was doing his
2:36
Speaker 2: master I stayed there for nine months and then I
2:39
Speaker 2: moved back to Turkey.
2:40
Speaker 1: And your father is doctor Mehmet Cantor, a professor of genetics,
2:45
Speaker 1: a medical doctor, right, and you know, well tell us
2:47
Speaker 1: about him.
2:48
Speaker 2: I mean, he's a genetic professor. Obviously, it was all
2:51
Speaker 2: about education. And you know I was tolder than all
2:53
Speaker 2: my classmates. You know, my classmates or my teammates were
2:57
Speaker 2: always making fun of me. I said, hey, your dad,
3:00
Speaker 2: and you know, play with your geens. That's why you're
3:02
Speaker 2: so tall. But he was always all about his education.
3:06
Speaker 2: He actually did not want me to play basketball at all.
3:09
Speaker 1: You know.
3:09
Speaker 2: He was telling me, hey, you know your mom's a nurse.
3:13
Speaker 2: He's a genic professor, so you are going to be
3:16
Speaker 2: a doctor or you're going to be a professor one day.
3:19
Speaker 2: Just stop wasting your time playing basketball. I told him.
3:23
Speaker 2: He was like, listen that you know, I want to
3:24
Speaker 2: play basketball, but you know, go to school same time
3:27
Speaker 2: and I can do both. And he was like, okay,
3:30
Speaker 2: I'll give you a chance. If your grades are not good,
3:33
Speaker 2: your quld in basketball.
3:35
Speaker 1: I think your father and my father would have gotten
3:37
Speaker 1: along great. I wish my dad was still alive to
3:39
Speaker 1: meet him. To understand Ennis's story, you should understand a
3:44
Speaker 1: few things about Turkish history and politics. The Republic of Turkey,
3:48
Speaker 1: formerly the Ottoman Empire, has a very rich and tumultuous history,
3:52
Speaker 1: leaving a varying religious and ethnic identity in its wake.
3:55
Speaker 1: Just before World War One, a coup brought about a
3:58
Speaker 1: constitutional democracy that saw to unite the diverse population under
4:02
Speaker 1: one national Turkish identity. This assertive secularism was problematic for
4:07
Speaker 1: the many faithful, who saw their religious identity shunned in public.
4:10
Speaker 1: Over the last century, this conflict between secularism and religious
4:14
Speaker 1: freedom has given rise to movements rivaling the secular, military,
4:18
Speaker 1: and intellectual elites. One such political group, the Ghulan Movement,
4:22
Speaker 1: found a tactical political ally in the center right Religion Friendly,
4:26
Speaker 1: Justice and Development Party, also known as the AKP of
4:30
Speaker 1: Recep Erduwan. That alliance brought the AKP to power and
4:35
Speaker 1: proved fruitful for the Gulan movement, seeing many Gulan appointments
4:38
Speaker 1: in the judiciary and law enforcement, until Erduwan and the
4:42
Speaker 1: AKP began to consolidate power and devolved into corruption and authoritarianism.
4:48
Speaker 1: Any investigation into that corruption was met with wild accusations
4:52
Speaker 1: of a witch hunt and a judicial coup. The akp
4:55
Speaker 1: and Erduwan has since falsely labeled the Ghulan movement a
4:59
Speaker 1: terrorist organized, purging thousands from their political appointments and arresting
5:04
Speaker 1: and persecuting over fifty thousand members of the peaceful Guland movement.
5:11
Speaker 1: Now what does it mean? I know that you are
5:13
Speaker 1: educated at his met affiliated schools which are part of
5:17
Speaker 1: the Guland movement. Now, can you explain why that's significant?
5:22
Speaker 2: First of all, that he's met. The word itself means
5:25
Speaker 2: like serve. You know, it's a global you know, social
5:29
Speaker 2: movement focuses on three things, secular education, fightam with poverty
5:34
Speaker 2: and social harmony around the globe. And obviously inspired by
5:38
Speaker 2: an Islamic scholar, Fetula Gulan, and he inspired millions of
5:43
Speaker 2: people around the world to open up you know, modern
5:47
Speaker 2: and secular schools and relief organizations. You know, the Gulah
5:51
Speaker 2: Moment school in Turkey was the best schools in the
5:54
Speaker 2: whole country. Even I believe Ardon's kids were going to
5:59
Speaker 2: the schools.
6:00
Speaker 1: You actually became acquainted with Petula Gulin, who's become the
6:04
Speaker 1: focal point of so much international intrigue, and of course
6:07
Speaker 1: your association with him probably was one of the things
6:10
Speaker 1: that put you in the crosshairs.
6:12
Speaker 2: You know, I remember first time meeting him, I believe
6:15
Speaker 2: it was back in twenty thirteen. I was very curious
6:19
Speaker 2: about who this man, you know, behind all this. I
6:23
Speaker 2: took a trip to Pennsylvania to meet him with one
6:26
Speaker 2: of my friends, and you know, I still remember one
6:29
Speaker 2: thing that he told me that still inspires me every day.
6:33
Speaker 2: He is like, it doesn't matter what your background is,
6:36
Speaker 2: It doesn't matter what your belief your religion, your skin
6:38
Speaker 2: color is the most important thing in life is live
6:42
Speaker 2: your differences on the table and trying to find what
6:44
Speaker 2: we have in common. And he believes we have lots
6:46
Speaker 2: of problems are happening around the world because of uneducated people.
6:50
Speaker 2: You know, he's an Islamic scholar. But instead of him
6:53
Speaker 2: going around and build the mosques, he believed in education.
6:57
Speaker 2: And you know, this movement have now schools and cultural centers.
7:01
Speaker 2: I believe, over one hundred and seventy country in the world.
7:05
Speaker 2: And these organizations are not just for Muslim people. You know,
7:09
Speaker 2: you're a Jewish, you're Christian, Catholic, or you're Muslim, you're
7:12
Speaker 2: believe in God, you don't believe in God, you can
7:14
Speaker 2: go to these schools or these organizations and learn about
7:17
Speaker 2: method science or about life, you know.
7:20
Speaker 1: So, the gul And Movement and the currently ruling Justice
7:24
Speaker 1: and Development Party or AKP, that of course is Urdawan's party,
7:28
Speaker 1: were at one point allied, and at that time they
7:31
Speaker 1: championed the American quote unquote style of secularism that supported
7:36
Speaker 1: individual rights to freedom of religion over what we call
7:40
Speaker 1: assertive secularism. And they formed a tactical alliance in order
7:44
Speaker 1: to defeat their common foes through political means, which were
7:48
Speaker 1: the military leaders and the secular elitists. All of that
7:51
Speaker 1: sounds good, right, but then things took a turn in
7:56
Speaker 1: a very dark direction. And can you explain how that
8:01
Speaker 1: happened to this country that you grew up in and
8:04
Speaker 1: that I'm sure you loved and probably still loved to
8:06
Speaker 1: this day.
8:07
Speaker 2: So, actually, mister Gulan and Ardom, you know, they have
8:10
Speaker 2: a couple of pictures together, but they were really never allies.
8:13
Speaker 2: Media wanted to make it look like they were allies,
8:16
Speaker 2: but they were never allies. And also till twenty twelve,
8:20
Speaker 2: Airdron was saying he's going for democracy. He's gone for
8:23
Speaker 2: freedom and all that stuff. And that's why lots of
8:27
Speaker 2: the people from you know, Gulam moments, not Julan himself,
8:30
Speaker 2: but the Yula moment was voted for him. So a
8:33
Speaker 2: lot of people you know from AKP party and Gulam
8:36
Speaker 2: woman to become policemen, judges, or journalists or persecutors and
8:41
Speaker 2: they were running the country really really well. So back
8:45
Speaker 2: in twenty thirteen, there was a big corruption scandle happened
8:48
Speaker 2: in Turkey and President Ardan, his family and some of
8:52
Speaker 2: the congressmans close to Erdoon was involvement. And when they
8:57
Speaker 2: cut his voice, when they cut his tape that he
9:00
Speaker 2: stole from people, it was a huge news because they
9:04
Speaker 2: caught the whole world just so that Adam was a
9:08
Speaker 2: crop leader. You can literally go on YouTube and hear
9:11
Speaker 2: every word when he got cut, and obviously he got
9:15
Speaker 2: so mad he wanted to put everyone in jail who
9:18
Speaker 2: was saying that he stole from people. He's a crop leader,
9:22
Speaker 2: you know, So that's why he started putting people in jail, police, judges,
9:27
Speaker 2: prosecutors or media and started the shutdown media outlets, and
9:32
Speaker 2: he started shouting down prep schools in Turkey who are
9:35
Speaker 2: affiliated with good Moments. And that is the first time
9:38
Speaker 2: I said something. I'm like, I don't care who you are.
9:41
Speaker 2: If you are fighting against education, I'm going to say something.
9:44
Speaker 2: I tweet something about it, and just because of you know,
9:46
Speaker 2: the platform that I have, it became a conversation in
9:49
Speaker 2: Turkey and America, and I was like, wow, I just
9:53
Speaker 2: see an even power of one tweet. So from now on,
9:57
Speaker 2: I'm going to start paying attention what's going on in
9:59
Speaker 2: my country more, because till then I only care about basketball,
10:03
Speaker 2: you know, just make a lot of money, take care
10:05
Speaker 2: of my family, take your people I love, and just
10:08
Speaker 2: represent my country in America. But after that happened, I'm like, okay,
10:13
Speaker 2: I gotta be just more than a basketball player. And
10:16
Speaker 2: that's the first time I said something, and things just started.
10:20
Speaker 1: And you didn't just say something. I mean, you talked
10:23
Speaker 1: about Due as a lunatic dictator and even compared him
10:27
Speaker 1: with Hitler.
10:28
Speaker 2: So after I said something in twenty thirteen, you know,
10:31
Speaker 2: things were getting worse and worse. And twenty fifteen was
10:35
Speaker 2: the last time that I was back in Turkey. I
10:38
Speaker 2: only stayed there for like fourteen days, and I remember
10:41
Speaker 2: whenever I went there. My family were like scared and say,
10:44
Speaker 2: ncl and you don't go out alone. You're going somewhere,
10:47
Speaker 2: Just go with like a couple of your friends. Let
10:49
Speaker 2: us know where you're going and stuff. And then you know,
10:52
Speaker 2: that was the last time I saw them before I
10:54
Speaker 2: left my family. I remember that morning I had to
10:58
Speaker 2: sit down conversation which my family with my mom and dad.
11:01
Speaker 2: I said, listen, there's a path that I'm taking, and
11:04
Speaker 2: whatever happens, I'm not going to back down. And because
11:08
Speaker 2: of the stand that I'm going to take, you guys,
11:11
Speaker 2: we are going to get haressed a lot. You guys
11:14
Speaker 2: might be in jail one day and you guys might
11:18
Speaker 2: be like the most hated family in Turkey. I told him,
11:21
Speaker 2: because I know what the conversation was gone, and I
11:24
Speaker 2: told him. He was like, listen, if you are with me,
11:26
Speaker 2: then you're with me. If not, then tell me now.
11:29
Speaker 2: So I can, you know, make up my mind and say, okay,
11:32
Speaker 2: I'm alone in this. My mom said, if you are
11:35
Speaker 2: you know, standing up for something good, something right, then
11:38
Speaker 2: we are with you. If not, then we are now
11:41
Speaker 2: with you. And I looked at my dad. My dad
11:44
Speaker 2: did not say a word. He didn't say anything, because
11:48
Speaker 2: I'll be honest, all he wanted me to do is
11:50
Speaker 2: play basketball. And then I left. We call a cap
11:54
Speaker 2: and I remember my mom and my sister went to
11:56
Speaker 2: a balcony to like to bade me goodbye, and I
11:59
Speaker 2: get in the cab. I turn around and they were raving,
12:02
Speaker 2: and I told myself, this is the last time I'm
12:04
Speaker 2: seeing them.
12:14
Speaker 1: The Pacers Foundation is a proud supporter of this episode
12:17
Speaker 1: of Rafel Convision with Jason Flam and of the Last
12:20
Speaker 1: Mile organization, which provides business and tech training to help
12:24
Speaker 1: incarcerated individuals successfully and permanently re enter the workforce. The
12:29
Speaker 1: Pacers Foundation is committed to improving the lives of Hoosiers
12:32
Speaker 1: across Indiana, supporting organizations that are dedicated primarily to helping
12:37
Speaker 1: young people and students. For more information on the work
12:40
Speaker 1: of the Pacers Foundation or the Last Mile Program, please
12:44
Speaker 1: visit Pacersfoundation dot org or the Lastmile dot org. This
12:51
Speaker 1: episode is underwritten by the AIG pro Bono Program. AIG
12:55
Speaker 1: is a leading global insurance company, and for over a decade,
12:59
Speaker 1: the AIG Obono program has provided thousands of hours of
13:03
Speaker 1: free legal services and other support to nonprofit organizations and
13:07
Speaker 1: individuals most in need. More recently, the program added criminal
13:11
Speaker 1: and social justice reform as a key pillar of its mission.
13:21
Speaker 1: Maday twenty sixteen is when Urdawan sees the Goulan newspaper
13:26
Speaker 1: It's called Zaman, and then he recategorized the Goulan movement
13:30
Speaker 1: as the Fetula terrorist organization, which is it's gaslighting, right.
13:36
Speaker 1: He was turning into a terrorist state while calling the
13:39
Speaker 1: peace loving people the terrorists. But then again, we see
13:42
Speaker 1: that here in America. Up until you know, January twentieth
13:47
Speaker 1: of this year, it looked like we were going down
13:49
Speaker 1: that road. So there was an attempted coup carried out
13:52
Speaker 1: by a faction of the Turkish armed forces known as
13:54
Speaker 1: the Peace and Home Council, and everything went really crazy.
13:58
Speaker 2: Now many people knows, but the night of the courttempt
14:03
Speaker 2: I was with mister Gillan and he was shot. He
14:06
Speaker 2: couldn't believe it. The first thing he did was call
14:10
Speaker 2: all his friends, all his students to get together and
14:13
Speaker 2: pray for Turkey because that night, over two hundred and
14:16
Speaker 2: fifteen intes of people died. After the quotemp Dan came
14:21
Speaker 2: out and blamed the Guilla moment for the coottempt and
14:26
Speaker 2: that moment, I was like, this is the craziest thing
14:29
Speaker 2: I have ever heard, because I saw what mister Gillan
14:32
Speaker 2: did with my own eyes that night, he sat in
14:35
Speaker 2: his chair and prayed for his country. And when the
14:39
Speaker 2: air Don blamed the Gillen moment and mister Gillan for
14:42
Speaker 2: the quotem, I'm like, I'm gonna do whatever I can
14:45
Speaker 2: to tell this story to the whole world. And the
14:48
Speaker 2: Turkish government got really really mad because there was their plan,
14:52
Speaker 2: you know, the quotemp, and then du one can pretty
14:55
Speaker 2: much become a one man show, put everyone in jail
14:57
Speaker 2: whoever's against them, shut down all the media outlets who
15:01
Speaker 2: are whoever's against them, or just put all the journalists
15:04
Speaker 2: and judges, and changed the military and everything.
15:07
Speaker 1: You know. Since this time, over one hundred thousand Goolan
15:11
Speaker 1: followers have been purged from their civil service jobs and
15:14
Speaker 1: over fifty thousand have been arrested so far, you know,
15:18
Speaker 1: and who knows what's become of them. So after the
15:20
Speaker 1: attempted coup is when things started getting really scary for
15:25
Speaker 1: your family, your immediate family. You know.
15:27
Speaker 2: My dad got fired from his job and my sister
15:31
Speaker 2: went to medical school for six years. She still cannot
15:34
Speaker 2: find a job. My little brother was playing basketball, and
15:38
Speaker 2: you know, he wanted to be an NBA player, but
15:41
Speaker 2: he was literally getting kicked out in every team because
15:43
Speaker 2: of the same last name. So they were getting affected
15:46
Speaker 2: so much. They had to put a statement out there
15:49
Speaker 2: and saying we are disowned an NS. But Turkish government
15:52
Speaker 2: did not believe that. You know, they sent police to
15:55
Speaker 2: my house in Turkey and they raided the whole house
15:57
Speaker 2: and they took a really electronic away, computers, laptops, and
16:01
Speaker 2: iPads because they wanted to see if I am still
16:03
Speaker 2: in contact with my family or not. If they were
16:06
Speaker 2: to see any text message, email, phone call or whatever,
16:09
Speaker 2: they will be all in jail. Which they took my
16:12
Speaker 2: dad in jail for a while. We put so much
16:14
Speaker 2: pressure from here the Turkey they let him go.
16:17
Speaker 1: You know.
16:17
Speaker 2: I asked my brother like after my dad got out,
16:20
Speaker 2: like how's my dad doing? And my brother said, we
16:25
Speaker 2: asked him the questions like what happened in there? What
16:28
Speaker 2: did they ask you? What did they do to you?
16:30
Speaker 2: He never talks about it after, you know, he got
16:32
Speaker 2: out of jail. He was just watching the walls and
16:35
Speaker 2: acting so weird. And stuff. So I don't know what
16:38
Speaker 2: did they do in there to him, but he was
16:42
Speaker 2: just not the same person.
16:44
Speaker 1: And then, of course in twenty seventeen, you know, you
16:48
Speaker 1: were charged with terrorism, convicted in absentia, and you were
16:52
Speaker 1: facing four years in prison, and they came after you.
16:56
Speaker 1: Now this was at a time when and I don't
16:58
Speaker 1: know how. By the way, it's really remarkable to me,
17:00
Speaker 1: maybe basketball is your one place where you can for
17:04
Speaker 1: a couple of hours tune out. Nobody can focus on
17:07
Speaker 1: the bad stuff. Twenty four hours a day ll go insane.
17:10
Speaker 1: So I'm glad that you have basketball, and it's incredible
17:12
Speaker 1: that you're able to focus on it and continue to
17:14
Speaker 1: exceed expectations the way that you do. But twenty seventeen,
17:18
Speaker 1: this is the story that you told me over dinner, right, Yeah,
17:21
Speaker 1: so you were on the tour teaching kids, and then
17:24
Speaker 1: in Indonesia, shit went crazy.
17:28
Speaker 2: So we said, okay, after twenty sixteen, we are definitely
17:31
Speaker 2: not gone back to Turkey, and my managers like, let's
17:34
Speaker 2: do something for kids, and let's just go to these
17:36
Speaker 2: countries do basketball camp. Talk about education, talk about social harmony,
17:41
Speaker 2: healthy lifestyle, with respecting your parents, We talk about universal
17:45
Speaker 2: peace and just do basketball camp because sports is an
17:49
Speaker 2: amazing tool to bring people together. You know, you can
17:52
Speaker 2: be from different countries, different colors, different days and that whatever,
17:57
Speaker 2: different beliefs, but you can cheer for the same team.
18:00
Speaker 2: So in twenty seventeen, we planned to visit seventeen country
18:04
Speaker 2: in like thirty five days. Right, we start with Pacific.
18:08
Speaker 2: Visited Japan, Singapore, Philippines. But the same time, obviously my
18:13
Speaker 2: friends were saying, listen, Turkish government is like octopus. They
18:18
Speaker 2: got arms everywhere, so be careful. We visited the seven
18:21
Speaker 2: countries in pacifics our last one was Indonesia. We held
18:26
Speaker 2: a basketball camp. We were meeting with Turkish communities. We're
18:29
Speaker 2: visiting schools. End of the night, my friend asked me
18:33
Speaker 2: if you want to stay in a school or do
18:35
Speaker 2: you want to stay at the hotel. You know, he
18:37
Speaker 2: showed me a picture of the school. The beds were
18:39
Speaker 2: so small and I'm I'm not going to fit here.
18:42
Speaker 2: So while I was at the hotel, I was sleeping,
18:45
Speaker 2: my manager knocked my door about like two thirty am.
18:48
Speaker 2: Something is that come to my room. We need to talk.
18:51
Speaker 2: We got a phone call from one of our friends
18:54
Speaker 2: in a local in Jakarta. He said, there are some
18:57
Speaker 2: people in the school who just had basketball clinic with
19:00
Speaker 2: They are asking for you, but we have no idea
19:02
Speaker 2: who they are. And she's like, what do you want
19:04
Speaker 2: to do. I was like, I want to stay because
19:06
Speaker 2: next day we have so many things scheduled. He's like,
19:09
Speaker 2: this could be very dangerous. We need to escape the country.
19:12
Speaker 1: You know.
19:13
Speaker 2: It's very scary to be in a country that you
19:17
Speaker 2: don't know the language, you don't know the culture, you
19:19
Speaker 2: don't know the people there, and you are in danger
19:22
Speaker 2: and you literally trying to escape the whole country, you know.
19:26
Speaker 2: And we look at the flights. Our first flight was
19:28
Speaker 2: I believe five thirty AM to Singapore. In fifteen minutes,
19:32
Speaker 2: I pack everything, we get in the cap at the
19:34
Speaker 2: same time. But while we go in the airport, we
19:37
Speaker 2: are taking a video and send it to our lawyers
19:40
Speaker 2: in America, like if something happens, so they can use
19:44
Speaker 2: that as a proof that we are about to get kidnapped.
19:48
Speaker 2: So we came to the airport, I mean obviously Indonesian,
19:51
Speaker 2: you know, people are not that tall, and everyone asking
19:54
Speaker 2: me questions like, hey, I've told you, what are you doing?
19:57
Speaker 2: Why are you here? So my friend just said, just
20:00
Speaker 2: sit down in a chair and do not get up.
20:02
Speaker 2: I'm just going to get the tickets and we are
20:03
Speaker 2: going to leave. We got the tickets and we left
20:07
Speaker 2: the country at five thirty am and we landed in Singapore.
20:11
Speaker 2: My manager's like, let's call our local guy there in
20:14
Speaker 2: Jakarta and see, like, who was those people came to
20:17
Speaker 2: school that asking for you. And our local guy said,
20:20
Speaker 2: you guys are very lucky because those people they were
20:24
Speaker 2: intelligence service and army and wanted to talk to you,
20:27
Speaker 2: and that talk was not going to be just a talk.
20:43
Speaker 2: What usually Turkish government does is work with these countries
20:46
Speaker 2: like Malaysia, Indonesia and some of the other countries.
20:50
Speaker 1: You know.
20:50
Speaker 2: They took people there and put a NetPlane and set
20:53
Speaker 2: it back to a Turkey so if you were to
20:56
Speaker 2: stay there that night, they could ship us back to
20:59
Speaker 2: the Turkey. And then we were like, okay, let's just
21:02
Speaker 2: go to Europe and do our basketball clinics there and
21:04
Speaker 2: do our events there. Our first stop was in Romania.
21:08
Speaker 2: It was my birthday and we had this like huge event.
21:11
Speaker 2: Thousands of people were gonna come and we're gonna do
21:14
Speaker 2: a big event in Romania with some of the Turkish
21:17
Speaker 2: people there, so I gave my passport to this lady.
21:21
Speaker 2: She took like five ten minutes and she said, hold
21:23
Speaker 2: on a second. She went in the back. She came
21:26
Speaker 2: out with the police and said, sir, your passport has
21:29
Speaker 2: been revoked. And I was like, hold on a second,
21:31
Speaker 2: why is my passport revoke? The police said, we are
21:35
Speaker 2: not allowed to tell you, but if you want to
21:37
Speaker 2: learn more about it, you can call the Turkish embassy.
21:40
Speaker 2: And I'm like, those are the people who revoke my passport.
21:42
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna call them. So my marriage is like,
21:45
Speaker 2: we literally have like two three hours to get out
21:48
Speaker 2: Romania because if not, I'm not an American citizen, I
21:51
Speaker 2: still count as a Turkish citizen, so they could have
21:53
Speaker 2: just sent me back to Turkey. So we literally like
21:56
Speaker 2: have two three hours who left the country. So I
21:59
Speaker 2: guess like the best way they just go back to America. Right.
22:02
Speaker 2: We called every person we know, like congressman, senators, we
22:06
Speaker 2: even like texted NBA player association. So we getting up
22:11
Speaker 2: a flight. We were gonna land in London and come
22:14
Speaker 2: back to America. We landed in London and the captain
22:17
Speaker 2: announced and said, nobody gets up and me and my
22:22
Speaker 2: manager's like, what's going on? The plane? Doors are open,
22:25
Speaker 2: and there's this Two police with machine guns came in
22:28
Speaker 2: the plane and they're looking for someone, right, and they
22:35
Speaker 2: took someone behind us. I guess there was like a
22:38
Speaker 2: terrorist or someone in the plane. They took them out,
22:42
Speaker 2: but they took so long that we missed our New
22:46
Speaker 2: York plane. So there's this ticket lady. It's like, listen,
22:49
Speaker 2: there is no more flight to New York. You guys
22:52
Speaker 2: have to stay here. Don't worry. I'm gonna give you
22:54
Speaker 2: guys like a hotel and come back in. So we
22:57
Speaker 2: told the ladies, like we cool, we're going to stay
23:00
Speaker 2: at airport. And she was just so weirded out. It's like,
23:03
Speaker 2: what do you mean you guys could He's like no, no, no,
23:05
Speaker 2: we're cool. We're going to stay at the airport. So
23:07
Speaker 2: that night we stayed at the airport. The next day,
23:10
Speaker 2: front of our plane, there was this gentleman I still
23:13
Speaker 2: remember him, but like glasses jacket, very serious, like he
23:18
Speaker 2: asked for my green card again, my green card. He
23:21
Speaker 2: took some nose call some people and he's like, okay, girl.
23:25
Speaker 2: Later on we learned that he was from Homeland Security.
23:28
Speaker 2: Because I didn't have a passport, so I wasn't going
23:30
Speaker 2: to be able to fly. So like Homeland Security got
23:33
Speaker 2: in and then we came in a plane. I was like, man,
23:36
Speaker 2: this feels home. I am not living here till become
23:39
Speaker 2: an American citizen and then since then I'm here.
23:43
Speaker 1: At any time for however long. It took two days,
23:46
Speaker 1: three days this journey. At any moment, you could have
23:50
Speaker 1: been done and you were facing four years in prison.
23:54
Speaker 1: But we know that that could have turned into very
23:57
Speaker 1: easily a death sentence, torture, or they could have extended
24:00
Speaker 1: it indefinitely because they could do whatever they wanted that country.
24:03
Speaker 1: Right now, I mean, let's face it, so this is
24:05
Speaker 1: a serious, serious thing that you went through. I mean,
24:08
Speaker 1: I hope you have a good therapist, because I feel
24:10
Speaker 1: like I'm going to need a therapist after listen to
24:12
Speaker 1: this story. You know, so you made it out alive
24:16
Speaker 1: and you got back to American soil. You're safe here.
24:19
Speaker 1: It's hard not to mention the fact that you aren't
24:24
Speaker 1: even able to go and play the Toronto Raptors on
24:27
Speaker 1: an away game because you simply can't leave the country
24:30
Speaker 1: without fear of being extradited to face this four year
24:34
Speaker 1: sentence or worse. But the Turkish authorities, after failing miserably
24:40
Speaker 1: to apprehend you, I'm sure there was hell to pay
24:44
Speaker 1: back there for the people who weren't able to capture you.
24:47
Speaker 1: But they weren't done messing with you. And because they
24:51
Speaker 1: couldn't get you, they decided to extract their revenge on
24:56
Speaker 1: your family, on your father specifically, And in June of
24:59
Speaker 1: two thousand eighteen, your dad, doctor Mehmetcantor, was tried, I'm
25:04
Speaker 1: able to call it a sham trial, charged with terrorism
25:08
Speaker 1: charges right again, the gaslighting bullshit, and sentenced to fifteen
25:13
Speaker 1: years in prison. Of course, he appealed to charges, but
25:15
Speaker 1: that went nowhere, I mean even here. Those things usually
25:18
Speaker 1: go nowhere. But somehow or other, and I'm amazed by this,
25:22
Speaker 1: you were able to shine a light on this awful
25:26
Speaker 1: injustice and free your father in June of twenty twenty.
25:30
Speaker 1: I'm amazed that that campaign was successful. But tell me
25:33
Speaker 1: what this is all about and how this affected you
25:36
Speaker 1: and how you were able to get him home?
25:38
Speaker 2: Right, I mean, so he's been going in a lot
25:41
Speaker 2: of jails and in a lot of Turkish courts for
25:44
Speaker 2: years and years, right, so they were so scared of
25:48
Speaker 2: what I was like saying, they banned my Twitter account
25:53
Speaker 2: and Turkey. So if you go to Turkey right now
25:55
Speaker 2: and try to check what I twiteter or anything, you
25:58
Speaker 2: cannot see whatever I'm saying. But I'm like, okay, right now,
26:02
Speaker 2: what can I do to bring more awareness to discount?
26:05
Speaker 2: So that's why I started to work with some of
26:07
Speaker 2: the politicians. And you know, I went to DC many times,
26:11
Speaker 2: and whenever I sit down and have a conversation with
26:14
Speaker 2: it both sides, you know, Republicans and Democrats, and I
26:19
Speaker 2: started to tell them about my story, tell them about
26:22
Speaker 2: the people who are facing the same situation. They were like,
26:26
Speaker 2: we already know these conversation, tell us how can we
26:29
Speaker 2: help you? And that actually gave me so much hope.
26:33
Speaker 2: So I start working with politicians, working with senators, working
26:37
Speaker 2: with congressmens and congresswomen's media really helped us, not just
26:41
Speaker 2: in America, but you know internationally, really really helped us
26:45
Speaker 2: to bring awareness of what's really going on in the Turkey.
26:48
Speaker 2: So and then you know, like we put so much
26:50
Speaker 2: pressure on them every time they touched my father or
26:53
Speaker 2: every time my dad was about to go to jail
26:56
Speaker 2: or go in to a trial. We were bringing so
26:59
Speaker 2: much awareness to it, you know, we were writing opeds
27:01
Speaker 2: about it, we were talking to media about it. And
27:04
Speaker 2: then in twenty twenty, my brother, the one in Greece
27:07
Speaker 2: he plays basketball now, finally texted me and said, my
27:11
Speaker 2: dad is free. They got to a point that were
27:14
Speaker 2: so scared they have to let him go. And you
27:17
Speaker 2: know a lot of people are like a lot of
27:19
Speaker 2: my teammates and friends have texted me and said, hey, man,
27:22
Speaker 2: you can finally relax. Now take a vacation, you can
27:26
Speaker 2: finally focus on yourself. But I was like, no, my
27:30
Speaker 2: fight is just getting started. You know, my family was
27:34
Speaker 2: only one. I never just did this to only free
27:36
Speaker 2: my father. There are so many people out there there.
27:39
Speaker 2: Stretion is way worse than my father's. Turkey is the
27:42
Speaker 2: still number one country in a world that put most
27:45
Speaker 2: journalists in a jail. You know, we are just getting started.
27:48
Speaker 2: We are not going to stop till every innocent person
27:52
Speaker 2: in those prisons are free.
27:54
Speaker 1: Amen to that. It's a nightmare I can't even begin
27:57
Speaker 1: to imagine. And it's going to require people like you,
28:00
Speaker 1: people of good conscience, with courage and conviction is the
28:04
Speaker 1: only word I could think of. Ironically, who are going
28:07
Speaker 1: to ultimately bring about this change. It's the only thing
28:09
Speaker 1: that ever does, and otherwise it's going to say the
28:12
Speaker 1: same and get worse. Of course, we're going to put
28:14
Speaker 1: links in the bio for people to learn more about
28:18
Speaker 1: this fast moving but slow motion nightmare that's taking place
28:21
Speaker 1: for so many people in that beautiful country of Turkey.
28:25
Speaker 1: And now we come to the part of our show,
28:27
Speaker 1: which is a segment that we call closing Arguments. It's
28:30
Speaker 1: the part of the show where first of all, I
28:32
Speaker 1: thank you and a scanter for coming here, taking your
28:37
Speaker 1: time and sharing your remarkable journey, which is still unfolding
28:41
Speaker 1: as we speak. And then I turn my microphone off
28:44
Speaker 1: and leave yours on. This is the part of the
28:47
Speaker 1: show where you get to say whatever you want, anything
28:49
Speaker 1: that's been left unsaid, anything you want to tell people.
28:52
Speaker 1: But please, as part of that offer any advice you
28:55
Speaker 1: can give to people who are listening. Say I'm just
28:58
Speaker 1: one person I want to help. I don't know what
29:00
Speaker 1: to do. What can people do to help?
29:03
Speaker 2: First of all, I think, you know, just there's not
29:05
Speaker 2: just one authoritarian regime in the world. You know, Turkey
29:08
Speaker 2: is not the only one. There are so many of
29:10
Speaker 2: them author in the world that I feel like the
29:12
Speaker 2: best what we can do is just standing up against
29:15
Speaker 2: those regimes. That is the one question I was always getting,
29:18
Speaker 2: like what can we do to help? So that's why
29:21
Speaker 2: we started this initiative call you Are My Hope campaign.
29:24
Speaker 2: We are planning to call like signatures. You can go
29:28
Speaker 2: to you Aremhope dot org and sign the initiative and
29:31
Speaker 2: with those signatures, we are planning to take them to
29:34
Speaker 2: a White House, United Nations Human Rights course, maybe European
29:38
Speaker 2: Parliament and says listen, there are so many human right
29:42
Speaker 2: abuses are happening in Turkey. There are so many political prisoners,
29:45
Speaker 2: and there are so many journalists are in the general
29:47
Speaker 2: right now waiting for help. There are thousands of people
29:50
Speaker 2: are behind this cous There are so many signatures behind
29:53
Speaker 2: these cous So let's take some actions. That is the
29:56
Speaker 2: one thing you guys can to It will take one
29:58
Speaker 2: minute of your day. You are My Hope and sign
30:01
Speaker 2: the initiative. We already got over eighty thousand signatures so far.
30:05
Speaker 2: But other than that, it's like the best way to
30:08
Speaker 2: just beat those regime is just educate yourself, because they
30:11
Speaker 2: are really scared of educated people because they only want
30:14
Speaker 2: the yes men's around them, and people who's not going
30:17
Speaker 2: to ask any questions and do whatever they want them
30:20
Speaker 2: to do. You know, I feel like the education is
30:22
Speaker 2: the best way to just beat those regimes.
30:31
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flamm.
30:35
Speaker 1: Please support your local innocence projects and go to the
30:38
Speaker 1: link in our bio to see how you can help.
30:40
Speaker 1: I'd like to thank our production team Connor Hall, Jeff
30:43
Speaker 1: Cliburn and Kevin Warns. The music on the show, as always,
30:47
Speaker 1: is by three time OSCAR nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be
30:51
Speaker 1: sure to follow us on Instagram at Wrongful Conviction and
30:54
Speaker 1: on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast. Wrongful Conviction with Jason
30:58
Speaker 1: Flamm is a production of Life Off for Good Podcasts
31:01
Speaker 1: in association with Signal Company Number one