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Parents Dismembered After Son's Web of Lies · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, a beloved mom and dad
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Speaker 1: go missing their young son, anguished, where are they? What
0:20
Speaker 1: happened to Bart and Krista Holderson? I mean, I see Grace.
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Speaker 1: This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us
0:26
Speaker 1: here at Fox Nation and series XM one eleven. Let's
0:31
Speaker 1: kick it off. Take a listen to our friends at
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Speaker 1: three News Now. And so they got picked up and
0:36
Speaker 1: they all went up there by like another couple picked
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Speaker 1: up here, yeah, here a mouse Okay, before I woke up,
0:41
Speaker 1: they had everything packed up and you don't know who
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Speaker 1: they're who geez, that's h I mean that that has
0:50
Speaker 1: happened before where they just kind of head out before
0:53
Speaker 1: I leave or I wake up. You know, I'm a
0:56
Speaker 1: heavy sleeper. I'm on a schedule, and if it's sixty
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Speaker 1: feet dogs and they were out before six, the rush
1:03
Speaker 1: to get to the north, so you were hearing the
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Speaker 1: sun twenty three year old Chandler Halderson describing waking up
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Speaker 1: and his parents already gone that morning with me an
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Speaker 1: all star panel to make sense of what we know
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Speaker 1: right now. First of all, trial lawyer joining us out
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Speaker 1: of North Carolina, Kathleen Murphy at NC Domestic Law dot com.
1:24
Speaker 1: Doctor Jory Crasen, psychologist, faculty Saint Leo University, consultant and
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Speaker 1: author of Operation s O S. Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics,
1:34
Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University and author of Blood Beneath My Feet
1:39
Speaker 1: on Amazon. He's a star of a brand new hit
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Speaker 1: series on iHeart Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. But
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Speaker 1: first I want to go out to Alexis Terrescha Crimalline
1:48
Speaker 1: dot com investigative reporter joining us. You know this couple,
1:53
Speaker 1: Bart and Krista Halderson. Everything seemed just perfect. Have you
1:59
Speaker 1: ever been in those homes? Homes, and I don't mean
2:01
Speaker 1: Alexis that they have to be extravagant or over the top,
2:05
Speaker 1: but everything is in its place. The cars are always
2:09
Speaker 1: perfectly clean. My Mini Man looks like a cyclone headed
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Speaker 1: like I can clean it out and watch it. The
2:15
Speaker 1: twins are in it two days. It looks trashed, totally trashed.
2:19
Speaker 1: But those people that always have their car perfect and
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Speaker 1: their yard is perfect, and the inside of their home
2:25
Speaker 1: is perfect. And if you go there at Christmas, they've
2:29
Speaker 1: got the tree up and you hear Christmas music playing
2:32
Speaker 1: in the background, and it smells like cookies, and everything's
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Speaker 1: all neat and perfect. Have you ever been in a
2:36
Speaker 1: home like that? Yes, And that's is exactly the home
2:40
Speaker 1: that they had. We're not knocking it a little bit,
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Speaker 1: just a cooking. Yeah, but they had They had everything
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Speaker 1: going for them, and their son lived with them. They
2:49
Speaker 1: were very nice parents. They even owned a second home.
2:53
Speaker 1: They were successful. They had to purchased a lake home,
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Speaker 1: a cabin out in the woods where they vacation. What
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Speaker 1: did they do for a living? Were they accountants? Yes? Well, okay,
3:04
Speaker 1: so they managed to scramp and save and they have
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Speaker 1: this main home and then they get a little lake cottage.
3:10
Speaker 1: Is that right correct? Now? Okay? The sun Chandler twenty
3:14
Speaker 1: three years old, got a good job, lives at home
3:17
Speaker 1: with them, and his routine is to get up at
3:20
Speaker 1: six in the morning and take care of the dogs.
3:23
Speaker 1: That was his job at in the home anyway, and
3:26
Speaker 1: they were already gone. Where do they live, windsor Wisconsin?
3:30
Speaker 1: Where is that? What is that? It is a small
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Speaker 1: town in Wisconsin, but they live a couple counties away
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Speaker 1: from where their lakehouse was. So what he said was
3:40
Speaker 1: his parents went away for the weekend. They had another
3:42
Speaker 1: couple some friends for four of them decided to go
3:45
Speaker 1: away for a holiday vacation weekend. The couple picked his
3:48
Speaker 1: parents up and they went out of town. So he
3:50
Speaker 1: gets up in the morning around six thirty to go
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Speaker 1: walk the dogs. His parents aren't there, but he's not
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Speaker 1: worried because they went out of town with some friends.
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Speaker 1: Nothing had all suspicious to him. Now, Okay, I want
4:00
Speaker 1: to circle back to where these people live, because you know,
4:02
Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morgun, that has a big bearing on how
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Speaker 1: we analyze the case. When you've got one person missing,
4:08
Speaker 1: it's one thing. When you have two people missing, it's
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Speaker 1: a whole another animal. When one of those people is
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Speaker 1: a man, that changes things because a you look at
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Speaker 1: the man as a potential purt or b who could
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Speaker 1: overpower a man and a woman and not leave a
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Speaker 1: struggle behind. So Windsor is a village, a former town
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Speaker 1: in Dane County, Wisconsin, population eighty seven hundred at the
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Speaker 1: last census. Then they've got the whole lake house issue.
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Speaker 1: Where's the lake House, Alexus, It's in another county. It's
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Speaker 1: called Dane County, Okay. So essentially much like Windsor, but
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Speaker 1: even less populated. Joe Scott. All right, let's talk about that,
4:55
Speaker 1: Joe Scott. Oh, hey, Joe Scott, before you get started.
4:59
Speaker 1: And I guess doctor Jory's going to jump in on this.
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Speaker 1: You've got this couple and they're going to go do
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Speaker 1: things with friends. I will never forget when I was
5:08
Speaker 1: about to graduate high school and my brother and sister
5:10
Speaker 1: had already gone to college, and I found out my
5:13
Speaker 1: parents were starting square dancing lessons. I'm like, what, they're
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Speaker 1: doing something without me? And my dad, God rest his soul.
5:23
Speaker 1: I miss him so much. He was quite the dancer.
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Speaker 1: I actually found out, Jackie, that my dad, behind everybody's back,
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Speaker 1: went into ballroom dance classes. I just found that out recently,
5:34
Speaker 1: and he and I would dance all the time, but
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Speaker 1: I didn't know he had ever gone to classes in
5:39
Speaker 1: his younger days. So he ropes my mom into got
5:43
Speaker 1: going to square dancing, and he w of course, was great.
5:47
Speaker 1: And I went to one of their dances one time.
5:49
Speaker 1: I had They were calling sound like an auctioneer calling
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Speaker 1: out the steps, and I looked till my mom was
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Speaker 1: just wandering around to the circle and people were leading
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Speaker 1: her around. My dad was such a great dancer, but
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Speaker 1: you know, when you hear Jerry crosson the parents leave
6:05
Speaker 1: the child to go do something on their own. That
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Speaker 1: was practically unheard off from me because we did everything
6:11
Speaker 1: as a family growing up, and we do everything with
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Speaker 1: my family together. We don't split up and to go
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Speaker 1: here and to go here never. But you've got the
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Speaker 1: son who's twenty three. Now, I guess he can stay
6:25
Speaker 1: overnight by himself, right, Jory, Yeah, but it seems like
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Speaker 1: the family still very well connected together, involved in each
6:32
Speaker 1: other's lives. You know. The parents appeared to be professional
6:35
Speaker 1: and they're looking to help their son become that kind
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Speaker 1: of career level, so there's a lot of interaction and
6:42
Speaker 1: connection with them there. So Joe's got Morgan. When I
6:46
Speaker 1: first read, when I was first researching this case that
6:50
Speaker 1: the parents left the son alone, I'm like, what, why
6:54
Speaker 1: would you leave your son? Then I find out the
6:55
Speaker 1: son has his own job, he's twenty three, and they
7:01
Speaker 1: have now started doing things with other couples now that
7:04
Speaker 1: he's grown. But at first that was a red flag.
7:07
Speaker 1: I know no longer find it a red flag. You
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Speaker 1: see where I'm going with this, Joe Scott, Oh, yeah,
7:12
Speaker 1: he bet uh, you know, and reflectively, I think back.
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Speaker 1: You know, I'm twenty three years old. I'm already working
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Speaker 1: as an investigator with the coroner's office, you know. So, yeah,
7:20
Speaker 1: he's he's, you know, arguably a responsible adult at this
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Speaker 1: point in tom. He has control over his life at
7:27
Speaker 1: this point in time. He just still happens to live
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Speaker 1: with his mom and his dad, and he is the
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Speaker 1: focal point relative to from an investigative standpoint, Nancy, as
7:37
Speaker 1: to when they were last seen. You know who, who
7:40
Speaker 1: do they have contact with? And you make a very
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Speaker 1: valid point here, Nancy, this town, I think, would you say,
7:47
Speaker 1: eighty seven hundred is something in that neighborhood? What are
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Speaker 1: the odds in this? With that limited population, you're gonna
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Speaker 1: have two people that suddenly just vanish into thin air.
7:57
Speaker 1: It's It certainly gives you pause as an bust get.
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Speaker 1: I know, seemingly, if it had just been them, and
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Speaker 1: there had not been any prior domestic violence, I would
8:07
Speaker 1: have assumed in this small rural area that maybe they
8:10
Speaker 1: had run off the road somewhere or gone into a lake,
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Speaker 1: that that's why they had gone missing. Okay, this throws
8:18
Speaker 1: a wrench in it. Take a listen to our cut five.
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Speaker 1: This is the sun looking for his parents. Speaking to
8:26
Speaker 1: News Now Channel three, my last message I got from
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Speaker 1: them they were going to White Lake. There's some festivities
8:33
Speaker 1: that go around there, you know, better drink prices at bars,
8:36
Speaker 1: stuff like that. For yeah, White Lake, Wisconsin. And then
8:43
Speaker 1: that their plan or from to my knowledge, they were
8:46
Speaker 1: going to Langland County to a cabin. Their cabin along
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Speaker 1: the way. They could have stopped many places that I
8:55
Speaker 1: wouldn't know all of them. It's about three hours north
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Speaker 1: of Madison or Deane County. And now let's hear more
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Speaker 1: from our friends at W kow Bart and Krista Halderson
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Speaker 1: of Windsor had plans for their plans are going up
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Speaker 1: with their friends and do some minor parents on our cabin.
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Speaker 1: That cabin is some three hours away from Windsor on
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Speaker 1: a lake in a small community in Langlade County. Did
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Speaker 1: you literally see them pulling out of the driveway heading out. No.
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Speaker 1: Their son Chandler Halderson, who asked to be off camera,
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Speaker 1: says whoever his parents were traveling with from this neighborhood
9:32
Speaker 1: were to do the driving. He says he received a
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Speaker 1: text from his mother. She got back to me on Sunday,
9:39
Speaker 1: said they made it safely. That's the last he's heard
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Speaker 1: from his parents, So that means they likely didn't go
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Speaker 1: into a pond or a lake or go off the road.
9:51
Speaker 1: I mean, do we know what the text said alexis Russia.
9:54
Speaker 1: Did it say we made it okay? Or did it
9:56
Speaker 1: say this is where we're going? I believe that he
9:59
Speaker 1: did not reveal way the text set. He just said
10:01
Speaker 1: that he heard a text from his mom that they
10:02
Speaker 1: were there. Now we are hearing a little bit in
10:05
Speaker 1: more detail about that text from the sun Chandler. Take
10:09
Speaker 1: a listen to our cut six again speaking to three Knews. Now,
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Speaker 1: So that would have been the sack INDs right of
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Speaker 1: July when they last and that's the last you'd heard
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Speaker 1: of them. And then was it yesterday that you called
10:23
Speaker 1: the Sheriff's office or someone with your family called the
10:25
Speaker 1: sheriff's office just to show back on the actually got
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Speaker 1: a text from them on Sunday telling me they were
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Speaker 1: going to White Lake Okay. I don't know when the
10:33
Speaker 1: text was sent because of reception issues that they would
10:36
Speaker 1: have and they usually turned their phone off because of
10:39
Speaker 1: pay for roaming. Yeah, they it could have been whenever
10:44
Speaker 1: they sent the message that they made it safely and
10:46
Speaker 1: they're going to White Lake. Kathleen Murphy did not just
10:48
Speaker 1: hear pay for roaming? I mean, what plan is he
10:50
Speaker 1: on unless you're out of the country, you don't like,
10:52
Speaker 1: into Egypt or something, pay for roaming? Who pays for roaming?
10:56
Speaker 1: Do people actually still pay for a yeah? What Yeah,
11:00
Speaker 1: a little birder funds you get at Walmart. Okay, so
11:02
Speaker 1: people do pay for roaming, Okay. I was with him
11:07
Speaker 1: about the bad reception because sometimes, you know, I'll get
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Speaker 1: a whole bundle of emails coming in and I know
11:13
Speaker 1: they didn't all just happen, Okay, So I could see
11:18
Speaker 1: the text being delayed, but I didn't know people still
11:21
Speaker 1: had roaming charges for pizza crime stories with Nancy Grace.
11:37
Speaker 1: It's so often we find ourselves parsing words and trying
11:43
Speaker 1: to determine exactly what happened, because, I mean, the reality
11:47
Speaker 1: is Kathleen Murphy, based on as the son is saying,
11:51
Speaker 1: the bad reception, where the cabin is, he's three hours,
11:54
Speaker 1: three hours away from home. We don't know when the
11:56
Speaker 1: text really came in, We don't know if they had
11:59
Speaker 1: made it to the cabin. And yet bottom line, it
12:02
Speaker 1: really doesn't help us. When I heard that there was
12:05
Speaker 1: a text from the parents, I thought, oh, okay, we
12:07
Speaker 1: can paying it. We can find out what time it was,
12:10
Speaker 1: how far they had gotten. No, we can't. Well, I
12:14
Speaker 1: think this kid is giving good information to the police.
12:18
Speaker 1: He's in college. It seems to be pretty reliable. He's working,
12:21
Speaker 1: he's got a couple of jobs, and so I think, yeah,
12:24
Speaker 1: he's had quite a few jobs, wasn't he alexis in
12:28
Speaker 1: school at Madison Area Technical College. So he had been
12:32
Speaker 1: a student at Madison Area Technical College. Yes, that is true. So,
12:36
Speaker 1: Kathleen Murphy, when you have horrible reception, you can't tell
12:40
Speaker 1: what time the text is coming in. That changes the timeline.
12:44
Speaker 1: You can't really use that text as part of your timeline. Yeah,
12:47
Speaker 1: and you gotta have clear, clear to my mind, and
12:51
Speaker 1: if it's a sketchy kind of information that's coming across,
12:54
Speaker 1: you cannot base your timeline on that in trying to
12:57
Speaker 1: find these people. And I mean the reality is alexis
12:59
Speaker 1: to estat crime online dot Com, timelines can be based
13:04
Speaker 1: on things you would likely not imagine. For instance, remembering
13:07
Speaker 1: the O. J. Simpson double murder where he did murder
13:11
Speaker 1: Nicole Brown and Ron Goldman. They started the timeline when
13:15
Speaker 1: they heard Nicole Brown's dog and they called it a plaintive. Well,
13:20
Speaker 1: you remember that it was early and that's when they
13:24
Speaker 1: started the timeline based on that because the neighbors had
13:26
Speaker 1: never heard that before, so they start really started the
13:30
Speaker 1: timeline right there. So hopefully that's where I started. Case
13:34
Speaker 1: is my timeline. We've already established where our victims are
13:39
Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan. We have established where they were going.
13:43
Speaker 1: I was hoping the text could be used as a
13:44
Speaker 1: building block, but it can't. So what else do we know?
13:47
Speaker 1: Take a look. Chandler says he assumed his parents had
13:49
Speaker 1: turned off their phones to avoid roaming charges, and it
13:52
Speaker 1: wasn't until after the holiday weekend ended that he got nervous.
13:56
Speaker 1: Is this weekend it was packed? I get that packed.
14:00
Speaker 1: Maybe the weather wasn't great for messaging tonight. Dane County
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Speaker 1: Sheriff's office says, there are too many unanswered questions to
14:06
Speaker 1: say anything, But then we find out that the cabin
14:11
Speaker 1: is not as we would have expected. Take a listen
14:14
Speaker 1: to Tony galle Wkow twenty seven. Neighbor Brett Schuster's reaction
14:19
Speaker 1: to the Halderson's disappearance. Wow, wow, you know, my wife
14:23
Speaker 1: has pretty shook up too. I mean, they're very nice couple,
14:25
Speaker 1: very nice family. Detectives now go door to door here,
14:29
Speaker 1: well sheriff's personnel here in Dane County are checking for
14:33
Speaker 1: any and all information. The missing couple's son says law
14:36
Speaker 1: enforcement in Langlade County has checked on the family's cabin there,
14:41
Speaker 1: and he says that visit only adds to the mystery.
14:45
Speaker 1: The sheriff said it looked like there wasn't anyone home.
14:50
Speaker 1: Family and friends hope the Halderson's unexpected extended time away
14:55
Speaker 1: is just that and not assign they're in trouble. How
14:59
Speaker 1: much time had passed alexis terres chuck before I mean,
15:02
Speaker 1: I know that the parents got a what a three
15:05
Speaker 1: day jump on it because they were gone. They were
15:07
Speaker 1: supposed to be gone for a three day weekend. The
15:10
Speaker 1: sun didn't get worried until after I guess that Monday
15:13
Speaker 1: had occurred. So how long have the parents been away
15:17
Speaker 1: from the home. Then he still waited a couple of
15:19
Speaker 1: days before he alerted to the A thirty, so he
15:21
Speaker 1: waited about a week so they he says, he woke
15:24
Speaker 1: up on the weekend, but he didn't. He waited seven
15:26
Speaker 1: days before he contacted the police about them. Okay, I
15:29
Speaker 1: don't like that at all. And I assume he was
15:31
Speaker 1: at work during that time. He may have said that
15:33
Speaker 1: he was at work. Yes, see the way you just
15:35
Speaker 1: said that. You know, do you remember doctor Jerry Crossen, Faculty,
15:44
Speaker 1: Saint Leo University consultant. It goes on a non psychologist.
15:49
Speaker 1: Do you remember Todd mom Casey Anthony, And she actually
15:54
Speaker 1: had a Universal uniform and she had the Universal ID
15:59
Speaker 1: and key card, and she sat her rear end on
16:03
Speaker 1: the family sofa, eating chips and letting her parents take
16:07
Speaker 1: care of Kelly, her daughter, and pay all the bills
16:11
Speaker 1: and the car note and everything. And she just breathe
16:15
Speaker 1: in about six o'clock and say, hey, what's for separate?
16:18
Speaker 1: I remember that very well. Yet they actually thought for years,
16:23
Speaker 1: I think about two years that she was going to
16:26
Speaker 1: work at Universal and then hey, alexis tell jury what
16:31
Speaker 1: happens at the end when they're checking out her job.
16:35
Speaker 1: So she's telling the police that are looking for her
16:37
Speaker 1: missing daughter two years old, that she was at worse,
16:40
Speaker 1: she's been at work at Universal. So they drive over.
16:42
Speaker 1: They say, to take us to where you work. They
16:44
Speaker 1: drive Universal Studios in Orlando. They go, Now, wait a minute,
16:48
Speaker 1: has anybody ever been to Universal. I didn't even know
16:51
Speaker 1: about Universal until I was doing the Top Mom Try,
16:54
Speaker 1: and we were living down there as you wouldcall Alexis,
16:56
Speaker 1: and we would take the children to Disney, you know,
17:00
Speaker 1: and then I found Hey, Universal's right up the street.
17:03
Speaker 1: You have to part way out, just like at Disney.
17:06
Speaker 1: You have to either walk or getting a little bus
17:09
Speaker 1: to get you in. You have to then go these
17:12
Speaker 1: the investigators have to go into the bowels of Universal
17:16
Speaker 1: and then get to the offices, which tourists never see
17:19
Speaker 1: the offices. They're way off somewhere. So with that in mind,
17:23
Speaker 1: Alexis tot Motain gets police investigators. They're in their car.
17:29
Speaker 1: They go to the security gate. The security person says
17:34
Speaker 1: Susie Smith, Yeah, I don't know that person, and so
17:39
Speaker 1: Tot Mom explains her way out of it, and they
17:43
Speaker 1: get through security, and then what happens, So then they're
17:46
Speaker 1: walking through an actual office building. Again, this isn't the ride,
17:49
Speaker 1: this isn't Jurassic Park ride or Harry Potter ride. This
17:52
Speaker 1: is now an office building. And so she's walking them
17:55
Speaker 1: through an actual office building and there's things to take
17:59
Speaker 1: up to your office. She finally gets stops in the
18:02
Speaker 1: middle of the building, stopped and just turns them and
18:04
Speaker 1: then to the door. Okay, I don't I don't really
18:07
Speaker 1: work here. Just short fussed up that she was completely,
18:11
Speaker 1: absolutely one million percent lying about working there. And she
18:14
Speaker 1: had walked the rough she you know, talked her way
18:17
Speaker 1: through the security yard, had two police officers walking through.
18:19
Speaker 1: People are probably just looking here like who is this person?
18:21
Speaker 1: Why are they here? For the police officer, and then
18:23
Speaker 1: she has to just say, well, I don't really work here. Yeah,
18:27
Speaker 1: the front gate couldn't have said it at the office.
18:29
Speaker 1: She actually cooked him. And what about the drive over right,
18:32
Speaker 1: I mean, what does that doctor Jory Alexis Dureschac is
18:37
Speaker 1: absolutely correct that's the way it went down. So they're
18:40
Speaker 1: investigating the disappearance of her two year old little girl, Killy,
18:43
Speaker 1: and she's saying, yeah, well this is where I work.
18:46
Speaker 1: They drive all the way to the location, universal they
18:51
Speaker 1: get through security, they go part the car, they get
18:53
Speaker 1: out of the car, they walk across the parking lot,
18:56
Speaker 1: they get in, then start walking through the lab run
19:00
Speaker 1: the maze of offices they get all the way to
19:03
Speaker 1: a door, they're like, and top Mom goes, okay, yeah,
19:08
Speaker 1: I don't work here. What is that. That's a nice
19:12
Speaker 1: bluff and a denial. But do you notice how she
19:15
Speaker 1: handled and how she recovered from it in the same way.
19:19
Speaker 1: You know, No, you tell me, well, normally I don't
19:22
Speaker 1: work here and let's go, let's go back home. There
19:25
Speaker 1: was no big deal to her at that time to
19:28
Speaker 1: deal to her. No. I mean, you lot of the
19:31
Speaker 1: cops are very often I'm not proud to say you
19:34
Speaker 1: may get a spanking, I mean a booty beating right there.
19:39
Speaker 1: But apparently they did not. U talied against Top Mom
19:43
Speaker 1: for leading them on a another wild Goose Chase Time
19:58
Speaker 1: Stories with Nancy Race. So Alexei's terres shut. Let's talk
20:06
Speaker 1: about as Kathleen Murphy called him a kid. He's almost
20:11
Speaker 1: twenty four years old. I mean, I don't know, do
20:15
Speaker 1: you do you still make up the beds for your children,
20:18
Speaker 1: Kathleen Murphy, even though they some of them were grown.
20:21
Speaker 1: Yeah you know the answer to that one. But you
20:24
Speaker 1: called him a katy. He's almost twenty four years old. Yeah,
20:27
Speaker 1: that's true. Delete that part for me. Yeah, Race, Okay, So,
20:32
Speaker 1: where alexis terres shut. I heard what you said that
20:37
Speaker 1: he says he works at aerospace company space X and
20:42
Speaker 1: as a scuba diver and for American Family Insurance, and
20:48
Speaker 1: he is attending Madison Area Technical College. Did anybody here
20:54
Speaker 1: see Harry Potter? Yeah, you all did. You're laughing, but
20:57
Speaker 1: you saw it right. We also read the books. When
21:01
Speaker 1: Hermione had the little time Changer, she could go back
21:07
Speaker 1: in time and live the same moment or the same
21:09
Speaker 1: period of hours twice. That came in really handy for her,
21:13
Speaker 1: and she was taking all those classes. So is that
21:15
Speaker 1: what he's doing. Alexis to rustchuk because he's working at
21:19
Speaker 1: American Family Assurance. I'm sure they're so proud aerospace company SpaceX. Wow,
21:25
Speaker 1: I would be impressed. And a scuba diver little no,
21:28
Speaker 1: In fact, that's what I wanted to do if I
21:30
Speaker 1: had not become a prosecutor, be a forensic scuba diver.
21:33
Speaker 1: And he's in school to boot at Madison Area Technical College.
21:36
Speaker 1: Alexis rustric? How is he doing all that? So it
21:39
Speaker 1: ends up that the school contacted his parents and there
21:43
Speaker 1: was a meeting with the school, Madison Area Technical College,
21:47
Speaker 1: because Chandler has not been telling his parents the truth.
21:50
Speaker 1: They thought he'd been going to school for the last
21:52
Speaker 1: six months, but he had not been attending classes and
21:56
Speaker 1: they found this out. Okay, that's not the end of
21:58
Speaker 1: the earth. Okay, because I will confess my sister, who
22:01
Speaker 1: was the valedictorian and all that she could never for
22:06
Speaker 1: a period of time, both my brother and sister were
22:08
Speaker 1: going to Mercy University, and they were both living at
22:12
Speaker 1: home at that moment before my sister went away to
22:16
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania to school, and she could never get her grades
22:21
Speaker 1: because my brother did not want our parents to see
22:25
Speaker 1: his grades because they were all fs or incomplain or
22:27
Speaker 1: dropped out. So he would race to the mailbox and
22:31
Speaker 1: he would get the grades and hide them in his
22:34
Speaker 1: glove compartment in his car. My sister, who made all a's,
22:39
Speaker 1: kept wondering she'd have to walk to the registrar's office
22:42
Speaker 1: to find out what her grades were. So lying about
22:46
Speaker 1: your grades or let's just say office getting the truth.
22:49
Speaker 1: Let's don't say lie. That's a little harsh. That's not
22:53
Speaker 1: the end of the world, Alexas So Okay, So he
22:56
Speaker 1: had dropped out of Madison Area Tech and didn't tell
22:58
Speaker 1: his parents. What about his career. He is FACEX. That
23:01
Speaker 1: also was not true. He his parents figured out that
23:04
Speaker 1: he did not work at SpaceX. He is not He
23:07
Speaker 1: was not working for the American Family Entrance Company, and
23:10
Speaker 1: he was not a certified police scuba diver. All live, okay,
23:16
Speaker 1: Kathleen Murphy. You know, at trial the judge is within
23:24
Speaker 1: his or her rights and must follow the law as
23:26
Speaker 1: to whether to instruct the jury regarding credibility at veracity.
23:30
Speaker 1: Who was telling the truth and isn't it true? Kathleen Murphy,
23:34
Speaker 1: That one particular charge says, if you find the defendant
23:38
Speaker 1: or a witness lying in part, you may, at your discretion,
23:44
Speaker 1: throughout all that witnesses testimony, their entire testimony names who
23:50
Speaker 1: have nothing because a lie in part could name a
23:54
Speaker 1: lie and hold that exet It continues day in and
23:59
Speaker 1: day out, and the course really don't prosecute that, nor
24:03
Speaker 1: did they throw out that testimony. Love to see it happen.
24:06
Speaker 1: I'm just telling you I don't like finding out a
24:09
Speaker 1: twenty three year old man now almost twenty four is
24:14
Speaker 1: living at home off the parents doll and he's not working.
24:17
Speaker 1: It brings up taught mom in my mind. Take a
24:21
Speaker 1: listen to our cut toil the Dane County Sheriff, Calvin Barrett.
24:25
Speaker 1: Where were these remains found that you're talking about. They
24:28
Speaker 1: were found approximately July eighth. Do you're aware in rural Wisconsin,
24:35
Speaker 1: rural Dane County, what community sheriff is in a rural
24:39
Speaker 1: area of Dan County. You can't say more specifically than
24:42
Speaker 1: they now. Again, this is an ongoing investigation or we
24:44
Speaker 1: don't want to interrupt what we have going on right now.
24:47
Speaker 1: We want to ensure that the investigation is done thoroughly
24:50
Speaker 1: and is completed to the best of our builds, and
24:53
Speaker 1: there's more. Take a listen to our cut sixteen. They
24:56
Speaker 1: weren't just killed, they were dead membered. Jessica Morgan hold
25:03
Speaker 1: hold Take a listen our cut sixty WKOW twenty seven
25:08
Speaker 1: this afternoon. The Dane County Sheriff's office now considers this
25:11
Speaker 1: to be a homicide investigation. That's because they found the
25:14
Speaker 1: remains of Bart Holderson late last week in a rural
25:17
Speaker 1: area of the town of Cottage Grove. Sheriff Calvin Barrett
25:21
Speaker 1: says Holderson had a gunshot injury and his body was dismembered.
25:24
Speaker 1: Law enforcement found his remains last Thursday and no one
25:27
Speaker 1: has been charged yet in his death. The Sheriff's office
25:30
Speaker 1: still does not know where Bart's wife, Krista Holderson is
25:33
Speaker 1: Jessica Morgan. When I hear dismemberment or staging, which of course,
25:38
Speaker 1: dismemberment is. The staging of a scene could be as
25:40
Speaker 1: simple as covering up the body or covering up the face,
25:43
Speaker 1: moving the body. Dismemberment is certainly disturbing the crime scene.
25:49
Speaker 1: When I hear staging or dismemberment, I know it's not random.
25:53
Speaker 1: Explain no, it's not. And you know, there's two ways
25:57
Speaker 1: you can look at it, Nancy. Either an individual has
26:00
Speaker 1: dismembered a body is attempting to destroy evidence, because the
26:04
Speaker 1: body at that point is in fact the central piece
26:07
Speaker 1: of evidence. Or you've got an attachment of a lot
26:11
Speaker 1: of anger that an individual could destroy an individual down
26:14
Speaker 1: to literally take them down to an elemental level, if
26:17
Speaker 1: you will, you know, by taking them apart. So you've
26:20
Speaker 1: got that convergence there where these two things are coming
26:23
Speaker 1: together and you really have to begin to look at
26:27
Speaker 1: how dark this is. And then you know, the idea
26:31
Speaker 1: is that when you dismember a body like this and
26:36
Speaker 1: you're attempting you know, if you go along with my
26:38
Speaker 1: earlier thought about destruction of evidence, you're dispersing the body
26:43
Speaker 1: or bodies over a large, large area potentially, so it
26:47
Speaker 1: makes the investigation all the more difficult. And to me,
26:51
Speaker 1: this goes to intent, It goes to trying to put
26:55
Speaker 1: the police off the scent, if you will. Absolutely, Yes,
26:58
Speaker 1: I had to digest everything that you were saying, you know,
27:01
Speaker 1: talking to Joe Scott Morgan when we're talking about cases.
27:05
Speaker 1: It takes a minute for us regular people to take
27:08
Speaker 1: in everything that you just expound upon. It's a lot
27:11
Speaker 1: of information at once. But yes, I agree completely. When
27:17
Speaker 1: blood is found near the fireplace, there is an explanation
27:20
Speaker 1: for that, a fairly simple explanation. Take a listen to
27:23
Speaker 1: our cut twenty seven. This is Marcus Oswald at w
27:26
Speaker 1: E A U NBC. Chanler recalls the days leading up
27:30
Speaker 1: to his parent's disappearance. He remembers playing fetch with his
27:34
Speaker 1: dog and breaking the glass fireplace in the home, injuring
27:37
Speaker 1: himself in the process, he says, causing him to bleed up.
27:41
Speaker 1: That one was practically the glasses in there, So I
27:45
Speaker 1: grabbed tweels on a flow it out and then it
27:46
Speaker 1: starts this is spurting out. I got some on a
27:51
Speaker 1: little bit of the rock. It wasn't that bad of
27:53
Speaker 1: the rock, but I think the worst was the floor.
28:01
Speaker 1: So there you have it. You're the forensics expert. Joe
28:03
Speaker 1: Scott Morgan. He says, he's playing with the dog and
28:07
Speaker 1: broke glass, the glass fireplace in the home injuring himself
28:12
Speaker 1: and blood on the floor. Let's think about that. Yeah,
28:15
Speaker 1: let's stay yeah, because you know, with blood, you're going
28:19
Speaker 1: to have a specific identifier. You know, we're beyond the
28:22
Speaker 1: age Nancy in time where we're just simply doing abo grouping. Now,
28:27
Speaker 1: you know, we're back in the day. You know we
28:29
Speaker 1: do av you know o AB. It doesn't work anymore.
28:33
Speaker 1: Now you're saying that this is the point of origin
28:36
Speaker 1: of this blood is from me, and of course you
28:40
Speaker 1: have to be able to stand fast and hold that
28:42
Speaker 1: hold that position if that's what you're putting forth to
28:44
Speaker 1: the cops. Because let me tell you what the cops
28:45
Speaker 1: gonna do. First off, they're going to verify that that
28:47
Speaker 1: is in fact blood, and then once they get it,
28:49
Speaker 1: they're not just gonna type it. They're they're gonna dig
28:52
Speaker 1: into the DNA here and determine who that blood specifically
28:56
Speaker 1: points to. And if you find any other blood around
28:59
Speaker 1: the house and look seen the injury. This kid is
29:01
Speaker 1: talking about Nancy and it's on his big toe. How
29:04
Speaker 1: many of us have cut our big toe or our
29:06
Speaker 1: foot at some point in time. And he's talking about
29:09
Speaker 1: not just the typing or the DNA, but the quantity
29:13
Speaker 1: of blood. Remember in the Jennifer Dulo's case where so
29:17
Speaker 1: much blood was found, the missing Connecticut mom of five,
29:21
Speaker 1: so much blood was found in the garage. They knew
29:25
Speaker 1: from the quantity of blood that she had to be dead.
29:29
Speaker 1: There was no way there could be that much blood
29:31
Speaker 1: outside of her body and her still be alive. Alexis
29:35
Speaker 1: terrest shut crime online describe the home the amount of
29:40
Speaker 1: blood found near the fireplace. So there was a lot
29:43
Speaker 1: of blood in the fireplace. It was also, i believe,
29:46
Speaker 1: in the basement. But that's not all, Alexis. There wasn't
29:50
Speaker 1: just a blood around the fireplace. And as you have
29:54
Speaker 1: accurately stated, in the basement. Take a listen to Eric
30:00
Speaker 1: Frankie at Knees three. It just so happened. Stephen Griber
30:04
Speaker 1: was in his driveway when he says he detected a strong,
30:07
Speaker 1: burning odor odor. He said he thought it was just
30:09
Speaker 1: a fire pit, maybe somebody burning some firewood at first,
30:12
Speaker 1: but then after five minutes or so, Griber says, this
30:15
Speaker 1: smell changed a bit in his words quote more in
30:18
Speaker 1: line with what he thought was someone barbecuing, kind of
30:21
Speaker 1: became strong and kind of like a pungent smell, to
30:26
Speaker 1: the point that I actually walked down my driveway half
30:30
Speaker 1: the distances had looked up and down the street to
30:32
Speaker 1: see if anybody was doing anything like grilling or something
30:36
Speaker 1: else was going on, and I didn't see anything at
30:38
Speaker 1: that point. Later, a special agent from the Department of
30:41
Speaker 1: Justices Arson Bureau said he detected a grilled meat smell
30:44
Speaker 1: from the fireplace. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace Alexis Terrett Chak.
31:03
Speaker 1: That's what we call karma. When your front store neighbor,
31:08
Speaker 1: it's actually a former detective investigator for the District Attorney's
31:12
Speaker 1: office and actually pays attention like a trained observer that
31:17
Speaker 1: smells smoke and goes to look for the time, smells
31:21
Speaker 1: what he believes to be a barbecue. Go ahead, Yeah,
31:23
Speaker 1: he goes to look for the fire. He's not a
31:25
Speaker 1: neighbor who's just well, I smell smoke. But then I
31:28
Speaker 1: just went back to watching TV. He actually started walking
31:30
Speaker 1: around the neighborhood to see where the smell was coming
31:33
Speaker 1: from because it was such an odd smell barbecue, but
31:36
Speaker 1: not as good barbecue, not a sweet barbecue smell. He
31:39
Speaker 1: described it as pungent. So he starts walking around investigating
31:43
Speaker 1: because it's ingrained in him. This is his job. This
31:46
Speaker 1: is just something his brain automatically thought, I have to
31:49
Speaker 1: go figure this out. Jessica Morgan joining us professor forensics.
31:53
Speaker 1: What else was found in and around the fireplace? Yeah, Nancy,
31:58
Speaker 1: it gets really gruesome, very dark, very quickly. And I'll
32:02
Speaker 1: frame it by saying this. The arson investigator actually related
32:06
Speaker 1: that if you're looking at the fireplace on the right
32:08
Speaker 1: hand side, there was kind of a greasy residue. They
32:12
Speaker 1: believe that's consistent with the bodies. Literally, are the bodies
32:16
Speaker 1: literally being rendered down in that area. That's fat coming
32:19
Speaker 1: off the bodies, Nancy, in the fireplace. And then as
32:22
Speaker 1: they duck further and they had to dismantle this thing.
32:25
Speaker 1: What do you mean by that rendering down? Well, as
32:28
Speaker 1: bodies begin as any kind of organic tissue that has
32:31
Speaker 1: fat on it, like this, this tissue it begins to
32:34
Speaker 1: render down. It literally begins to melt, and the only
32:38
Speaker 1: way to describe it is like barbecue. It drips onto
32:41
Speaker 1: this metal surface which holds the wood, and you could
32:44
Speaker 1: actually see in the crime scene images you could see
32:47
Speaker 1: this dark stained area, Nancy, and that was indicative of
32:50
Speaker 1: almost like a grease fire had been created. And that's
32:53
Speaker 1: how that's how horrible this is. And as they went
32:56
Speaker 1: through the evidence there they begin finding fragmented pieces of
32:59
Speaker 1: what they determine or human skulls. Now, what's so important
33:04
Speaker 1: about this is that this skull had burned at such
33:08
Speaker 1: an intense level temperature wise, that you could see the
33:13
Speaker 1: skull had begun to come apart, and you could see
33:15
Speaker 1: the actual matrices or the structure of the bone itself
33:20
Speaker 1: where it had begun to fall apart. This is something
33:22
Speaker 1: that we would see normally in a cremation, just prior
33:25
Speaker 1: to the body being completely pulverized, and just a frame
33:28
Speaker 1: it for you. Cremations actually take a sustained temperature of
33:32
Speaker 1: eighteen hundred degrees fahrenheit. Someone would have had to have
33:37
Speaker 1: sat there intended this fire to get it that hot
33:40
Speaker 1: in an indwelling fireplace in a private residence you know,
33:45
Speaker 1: this reminds me of the process you're describing. Joe. Scott
33:48
Speaker 1: Morgan is the young victim in or twenties, Teresa Hallbock,
33:53
Speaker 1: the photographer that went to go take photos for the
33:57
Speaker 1: auto trader on Stephen Aprey. He went on to be
34:01
Speaker 1: the subject of a huge documentary Calm Making a Murderer,
34:06
Speaker 1: claiming that he avery was innocent but family blood, family
34:12
Speaker 1: and friends. Neighbors saw him tending an outdoor pit fire overnight,
34:19
Speaker 1: burning it overnight all night long, never leaving it, and
34:24
Speaker 1: then investigators later found teeth of Teresa hallbacks and the
34:31
Speaker 1: studs off the back of her days fluente jeans that
34:36
Speaker 1: didn't burn down. Everything else was gone. To Scott Morgan,
34:40
Speaker 1: what you're describing is the constant tending of the fire
34:43
Speaker 1: to maintain that extremely high here, You're absolutely right, and
34:47
Speaker 1: you would have to continue to apply to Nancy, you
34:50
Speaker 1: would have to have a fuel source. The body's not
34:52
Speaker 1: the fuel source. You have to when you say tend,
34:55
Speaker 1: you have to roll the fire over, keep it burning
34:57
Speaker 1: and then add ongoing fuel like paper or certainly would
35:02
Speaker 1: to maintain this. So you'd have to have a constant supply.
35:05
Speaker 1: And this goes to thought, doesn't it, Nancy? You know
35:07
Speaker 1: where you're thinking about somebody sitting there rendering down human
35:10
Speaker 1: remains in a home and they're piling wood on top
35:13
Speaker 1: of it to keep the fire going. Why is the
35:17
Speaker 1: only question? Take a listen now to our friends at
35:20
Speaker 1: w E A U NBC fifteen. Before the jury was
35:24
Speaker 1: sent to deliberate, each side had one last opportunity to
35:27
Speaker 1: prove its case. We know that Bart and Cristal went
35:29
Speaker 1: into that home and never came out at least as
35:32
Speaker 1: whole people, that their bodies were found dismembered, discarded and hidden.
35:38
Speaker 1: Chandra Harlderson killed his parents. Do you know how Bart
35:42
Speaker 1: was killed? Exactly how he was killed? Do you know
35:48
Speaker 1: how Krista was killed? Do you know if it was
35:53
Speaker 1: an awful accident? Do you know if it was intentional?
35:59
Speaker 1: Do you know there was someone else involved? You don't.
36:04
Speaker 1: What if there had been an awful accident, Kathleen Murphy,
36:09
Speaker 1: then I mean think about it, just like it was
36:13
Speaker 1: argued in top Mom Casey Anthony's case. If there had
36:16
Speaker 1: been a horrible accident and little Keeley had died in
36:19
Speaker 1: the family's pool, why would George Anthony I scooped up
36:23
Speaker 1: her body? Put it in a plastic bag after wrapping
36:26
Speaker 1: duct tape around her head, and throw her out in
36:29
Speaker 1: a swampy forest area. No, that wouldn't happen. So if
36:33
Speaker 1: this were an unintentional accident, then why would their bodies
36:38
Speaker 1: be dismembered and rendered down and burned. It wouldn't happen.
36:42
Speaker 1: And you have to think about, how could this person
36:46
Speaker 1: actually rendered down his own parents if there wasn't something
36:52
Speaker 1: significantly wrong with his makeup. So the parents, apparently Alexi's
36:56
Speaker 1: terrest Chuck, had caught him in his lies. Explain what happens?
37:01
Speaker 1: They in front of him. They caught him. They said,
37:02
Speaker 1: you are not working. You're twenty three years old. This
37:05
Speaker 1: isn't You're sixteen years old and you got fired from
37:07
Speaker 1: your first job and you're lying about it. You are
37:08
Speaker 1: twenty three, almost twenty four years old, and you have
37:11
Speaker 1: been lying about where you worked, even lying about going
37:13
Speaker 1: to school, even lying to us about everything. As a
37:16
Speaker 1: matter of fact, Alexas Toreschuk hadn't he constructed an entire
37:20
Speaker 1: web of email lies. He did a whole world where
37:24
Speaker 1: he was creating emails back and forth about these jobs
37:28
Speaker 1: that he supposedly had, like complete fantasy. That he created.
37:31
Speaker 1: What do you mean back and forth about his jobs
37:33
Speaker 1: with different people that he was that he was pretending
37:36
Speaker 1: that he worked for. They would be like an email
37:38
Speaker 1: from a boss, and then he was writing back to them,
37:40
Speaker 1: like showing that he was doing actual work when none
37:43
Speaker 1: of it was actually happening, saying anything like in Kathleen.
37:46
Speaker 1: It's a huge level of deception. I see it every day,
37:49
Speaker 1: every day, and that's why we create these parent portals
37:54
Speaker 1: so I don't have to look at all these lying emails.
37:56
Speaker 1: They're put in a quortal and then that email sticks.
38:00
Speaker 1: You can see it and you can share it. But
38:02
Speaker 1: this is a huge level of deception too, doctor Jorry
38:05
Speaker 1: Crows and joining us psychologist at Saint Leo University's faculty,
38:11
Speaker 1: doctor Joy, I don't get it. You give your child everything,
38:16
Speaker 1: their whole life, and then this I can see where, Yeah,
38:20
Speaker 1: he caught up, was confronted with it, and then you know,
38:23
Speaker 1: made a decision. I don't believe in the insanity roles,
38:27
Speaker 1: but he made a decision to deal with it, and
38:29
Speaker 1: then basically in cutting up the bodies, it became evidence
38:34
Speaker 1: that he had to get rid of. It was just
38:36
Speaker 1: another problem to be solved. It's cold blooded, but you
38:39
Speaker 1: know that's really the way I see it. Why not
38:41
Speaker 1: just confess and get a job? Probably not in his
38:44
Speaker 1: personality makeup. Yeah, he solved different routes, possibly that Hey,
38:49
Speaker 1: if they're gone, I have control of the house, I
38:51
Speaker 1: have this, I got access to their money. You know,
38:55
Speaker 1: it could be all kinds of motivations there. And it's
38:57
Speaker 1: amazing to me, Kathleen Murphy that he managed to keep
39:00
Speaker 1: up his lines like tod Mom did throughout the entire investigation.
39:04
Speaker 1: Listen our cut twenty eight way this point, Chandler doesn't
39:08
Speaker 1: know remains have been discovered, or that he's considered a suspect.
39:12
Speaker 1: That is, until the very end of questioning when he's arrested.
39:17
Speaker 1: I can't tell you what we know, but we know
39:19
Speaker 1: you're not telling us the truth. We know your parents
39:22
Speaker 1: are no longer with us, okay, and we know the
39:24
Speaker 1: reason why. Okay, I need to tell the truth. There's listen, listen.
39:30
Speaker 1: You need to tell the truth about what happened, and
39:33
Speaker 1: just tell us why it happened. Okay, that myself. In
39:37
Speaker 1: the two hours of questioning, Chandler confirms he visited the
39:41
Speaker 1: cottage where were lockery on the fourth of July where
39:44
Speaker 1: the remains were found. Today, we also learned more on
39:47
Speaker 1: how detectives came to find the second set of remains
39:51
Speaker 1: found in the town of Roxbury, belonging to Chandler's mother.
39:54
Speaker 1: Throughout all the questioning, the closest he got was that
39:58
Speaker 1: he had visited the Cottage Grove property around the time
40:03
Speaker 1: his parents went missing. I mean, he stuck to his
40:06
Speaker 1: story till the bitter end. Would a jury believe it?
40:11
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our cut thirty w We the
40:14
Speaker 1: jury find the defendant, Chandler M. Halderson guilty of first
40:18
Speaker 1: degree intentional homicide as to BARDE. Halderson. We the jury
40:22
Speaker 1: find the defendant Chandler M. Halderson guilty of first degree
40:25
Speaker 1: intentional homicide as to CHRISTA R. Halderson. Two hours, thirteen minutes.
40:31
Speaker 1: That's how long it took the jury to decide twenty
40:33
Speaker 1: three year old Chandler Halderson was guilty of killing his parents.
40:37
Speaker 1: Alexis Rushchuk. Has he been sentenced, not yet, but he
40:40
Speaker 1: is facing I believe life in prison for this. We
40:43
Speaker 1: wait as just as on false Nancy grace COM's story
40:47
Speaker 1: signing off Goodbye Friend,