Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Did killer use wood chipper & concrete to hide woman's body?

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Did killer use wood chipper & concrete to hide woman's body? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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Speaker 1: zoom dot com, legal zoom dot com Climb stories with
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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph Channel one two. They're
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Speaker 1: working into determine whether the remains of a missing mother
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Speaker 1: were fed through a wood chipper then entombed in the
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Speaker 1: basement of a home. Barbara Miller disappeared in nine Police
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Speaker 1: have been very interested in the walls of a home
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Speaker 1: along North Front Street in Milton investigators say preliminary results
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Speaker 1: show the concrete contained wood chips. Now they're waiting to
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Speaker 1: see if it also holds Barbara Miller's remains. A forensic
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Speaker 1: pathologist is dissecting the walls looking for links to the woman.
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Speaker 1: Experts are now checking for odors left by decomposing human remains.
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Speaker 1: The police dupadity. It's just a matter of time until
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Speaker 1: we get our answers. A three ton cement slab, three
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Speaker 1: tons of cement, I mean that's some back patio, right,
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Speaker 1: three tons of cement. But what is unique about this
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Speaker 1: concrete slab? It may hold the remains of a woman
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Speaker 1: that has been missing, who many believe was fed to
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Speaker 1: a wood chipper. I mean, when I hear the words
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Speaker 1: fed to a wood chipper, I've got to tell you
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Speaker 1: I perk up, all right, But a three ton cement slab,
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Speaker 1: I mean, see, Grace, this is crime stories. Thank you
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Speaker 1: for being with us. You can't put these words three
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Speaker 1: tons cement slab, missing woman, and wood chipper and one
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Speaker 1: sentence without making my head spin around. That's what's happening
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Speaker 1: right now. We're talking about a beautiful young woman, Barbara
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Speaker 1: Elizabeth Miller, last seen on a warm July afternoon, after
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Speaker 1: she attended a wedding. It was four days later that
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Speaker 1: Barbara was reported missing. Okay, Immediately police searched the home
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Speaker 1: where her boyfriend's sister lived. There was construction going on,
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Speaker 1: but that meant nothing. Now we know that that cement
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Speaker 1: flooring was added on and it contained wood chips, and
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Speaker 1: that's what we know right now what happened to Barbara
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Speaker 1: Elizabeth Miller. Sunbury Police Chief Tim Miller has stated that
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Speaker 1: a three ton slab of cement contained wood chips. What
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Speaker 1: else could it hold? I wish you could see this woman,
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Speaker 1: Barbara Elizabeth Miller, just absolutely beautiful, kind of like brownish
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Speaker 1: hair with gold streaks, natural streak, senate, beautiful brown eyes,
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Speaker 1: a gorgeous smile. Why did she go missing? Why did
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Speaker 1: four days pass before she was reported missing? With me
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Speaker 1: investigative reporter Alexis to res Chuck from Radar online dot
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Speaker 1: Com and joining us a brand new guest forensic expert,
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Speaker 1: former major crime scene investigator now Professor Karen Smith. Karen
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Speaker 1: and I have performed many physical forensic experiments together, the
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Speaker 1: two of us, and they were intense. And after I
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Speaker 1: did those recreations or recrease of a crime scene with
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Speaker 1: Karen Smith. I know she's the go to guy. Karen Smith,
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Speaker 1: forensics expert. Thank you for being with us, Alexis to
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Speaker 1: Rest Chuck, my longtime friend and colleague reporter with Radar
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Speaker 1: Online dot Com, Thank you for being with us. First
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Speaker 1: to you, Alexis terrest check. What do we know about
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Speaker 1: this gorgeous girl, Barbara Elizabeth Miller? Why did four days pass?
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Speaker 1: I mean, nobody has been arrested, nobody has been named
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Speaker 1: chief suspect. What do we know about her? Who saw
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Speaker 1: her at the wedding? What happened? She wanted to go
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Speaker 1: to a wedding, actually without her boyfriend. She wanted to
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Speaker 1: go alone, So she went alone to the wedding. She
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Speaker 1: and her right right there. That's a big indicator to me.
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Speaker 1: When you go to a wedding, you know, usually take
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Speaker 1: somebody with you, if you've got anybody to take and
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Speaker 1: I mean it's kind of a joke you meet your
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Speaker 1: future husband at a wedding, right So, she specifically said,
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Speaker 1: I don't want to go with you to the wedding.
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Speaker 1: Now to me, that's a big red flag. Alexis. And
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Speaker 1: apparently she had spent quite a bit of time before
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Speaker 1: she disappeared, telling friends that she was afraid for her life.
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Speaker 1: She she was saying that she was really unhappy in
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Speaker 1: this relationship. So let me understand this, Karen Smith. She
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Speaker 1: goes to a wedding. Now, Alexis and I are, you know,
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Speaker 1: making it anecdotal comparisons. You're the forensics expert. To me,
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Speaker 1: if you've got a gorgeous young girl who's going to
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Speaker 1: a wedding and she specifically says she doesn't want to
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Speaker 1: go with her boyfriend, to me, there's trouble in paradise
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Speaker 1: right there. I agree, I agree wholeheartedly. Who goes to
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Speaker 1: a wedding without your spouse? Now explain to me, Karen Smith.
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Speaker 1: The chief has now said, we know this much that
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Speaker 1: they have found wood chips in the cement. Is that uncommon?
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Speaker 1: And what would it indicate to you as a former
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Speaker 1: major crime scene investigator, wood chips in the cement? What
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Speaker 1: we're dealing with six thousand pounds of concrete, that's that's
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Speaker 1: about seventy eight pound bags. And you know, as as
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Speaker 1: we all know, concrete comes separately in bags. And I
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Speaker 1: seriously doubt there the wood chips in there, and having
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Speaker 1: wood chips in the concrete, highly unusual, very questionable. I'm
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Speaker 1: really wondering what else they're going to find in there.
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Speaker 1: Let's analyze it. Karen Smith. Now, I saw my dad
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Speaker 1: lay uh several things in our backyard, a patio, a walkway,
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Speaker 1: another patio, a front walkway, just you know, he was
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Speaker 1: a railroad man, but he could have lay brick for
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Speaker 1: a living. It's just beautiful. And I remember him mixing
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Speaker 1: the cement himself, and you're right, there wasn't which there
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Speaker 1: were not wood chips in it. Karen Smith. Now here's
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Speaker 1: the other thing. A wood chip, and I'm speaking forensically.
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Speaker 1: It's very different from a piece of wood or a
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Speaker 1: stick or a twig or something that if you're creating
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Speaker 1: the cement outside and you're mixing it yourself, that may
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Speaker 1: have gotten into it, you know, a twig, a stick,
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Speaker 1: something like that. One wood chip would not alarm me,
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Speaker 1: but more than one wood chip because they're uniformly cut
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Speaker 1: if they come out of a wood chipper, and that
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Speaker 1: is significant. That's how you can tell a stick or
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Speaker 1: a twig or branch from a wood chip. Subtle but
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Speaker 1: important difference. Absolutely, we're dealing with with mulch. Mulch mulch wood,
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Speaker 1: which is just square chip, so it would be much different.
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Speaker 1: Uh Visually, this is a subtle but extremely important difference
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Speaker 1: between a twig, stick, a limb versus a wood chip.
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Speaker 1: Now I know I'm getting into deep, deep into details.
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Speaker 1: That's how you win a case, victory or the devil
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Speaker 1: is in the details. Let's analyze the difference between sticks, twigs,
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Speaker 1: branches versus woodchips. Karen Smith joining me, forensics expert, go
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Speaker 1: at it. I agree, Nancy. We're dealing with small, square
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Speaker 1: pieces of wood, and if they're buried in the concrete,
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Speaker 1: there has to be an explanation for that. They didn't
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Speaker 1: just get there on their own. Nothing just happens. Either
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Speaker 1: somebody put them there on purpose to throw off the search,
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Speaker 1: or they were mixed in because there's something else mixed
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Speaker 1: in with that concrete that came in with the wood chips.
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Speaker 1: Let's let's talk about wood chips. Okay, let's talk about
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Speaker 1: a wood chipper. Explain exactly what is a wood chipper?
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Speaker 1: Go ahay, Karen. We're dealing with something that's going to
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Speaker 1: break down large branches, large tree limbs, and it's going
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Speaker 1: to make small pieces out of that. So it's easily
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Speaker 1: disposed or made into mulch. That's what they do. They're
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Speaker 1: very loud, they're very bulky, and they're very powerful. And
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Speaker 1: I have actually seen a case where it was an
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Speaker 1: accidental death where a gentleman got caught into the wood chipper.
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Speaker 1: Um and it wasn't very pretty well. I'm sorry to
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Speaker 1: say that I've covered cases where a wood chipper was
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Speaker 1: used to dispose of a body. A wood chipper or
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Speaker 1: a tree chipper is a machine. It's used for reducing
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Speaker 1: wood tree limbs or trunks into small wood chips. They
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Speaker 1: are often portable, which means they're easy to get or rent.
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Speaker 1: They are mounted, usually on wheels on frames to tow
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Speaker 1: behind a truck or a van or even a car.
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Speaker 1: Really power is provided internal combustion engine all right, which
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Speaker 1: means they're easy to handle. Their mounted and they're powered
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Speaker 1: some of them by separate engine. Um. Now here's the kicker.
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Speaker 1: They're made of a hopper with a collar. Now the
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Speaker 1: chipper mechanism itself is optional, but what happens is you
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Speaker 1: insert the tree limb into the hopper and the collar
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Speaker 1: is just for safety. I think of a collar on
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Speaker 1: a shirt. There's a collar on top of the chipper
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Speaker 1: so you don't fall in. As soon as you put
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Speaker 1: something in a chipper, it immediately tears it to shreds mechanically,
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Speaker 1: and wood chips are used, as you know, for ground
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Speaker 1: cover or fed to a digester for papermaking. I know
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Speaker 1: about that because my mom used to work at Georgia Craft,
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Speaker 1: a papermaking plant. Now, the thing about it is it's
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Speaker 1: covered in blades. The inside is nothing but blades that
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Speaker 1: are mounted onto a flywheel. The flywheel accelerates and it
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Speaker 1: destroys whatever you put inside of it immediately. If they
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Speaker 1: can destroy giant limbs, what will it do to a
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Speaker 1: human body. Now here's another thing for insically to examine
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Speaker 1: Karen Smith. There wasn't just one wood chip. There were
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Speaker 1: multiple wood chips in the cement and this guy's sisters basement.
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Speaker 1: And not only were there multiple wood chips Karen Smith,
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Speaker 1: but the cement was added. It wasn't as if they
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Speaker 1: were just finishing her basement. This was added cement. Right now,
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Speaker 1: a forensic pathologist is literally dissecting the walls piece by
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Speaker 1: piece looking for the smallest of clues. Now, what do
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Speaker 1: you make of the fact that the cement was added
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Speaker 1: on it? Wasn't part of her original basement. Well, certainly
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Speaker 1: that is a huge question that needs to be answered.
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Speaker 1: When was it added and why if we have a
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Speaker 1: finished basement, what is additional concrete being poured down there? For?
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Speaker 1: Not only that, but they said the walls were very thick,
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Speaker 1: the lab was very thick, and there was an exhaust
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Speaker 1: fan installed down there in a small room. I don't
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Speaker 1: understand the need for that either. So this catch this,
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Speaker 1: Karen Smith, It was a rental home. Now, when you
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Speaker 1: go to a rental home, most people don't start making
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Speaker 1: permanent improvements because they're gonna move out of the rental home.
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Speaker 1: They're not there forever. So why would you pour a
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Speaker 1: whole new floor to a basement that already had a
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Speaker 1: cement floor? Why would you do that? Karen? Hide to
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Speaker 1: body you know with me. Also, in addition to forensic
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Speaker 1: expert Kieren Smith, Alexis Torres chuck Uh, investigative reporter with
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Speaker 1: Radar online dot com. You know what else I found out,
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Speaker 1: Alexis is that several people have said over the years
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Speaker 1: that this boyfriend of hers would talk about driving to
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Speaker 1: a sister's home in Milton to quote visit his old
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Speaker 1: lady what exactly he They had a terrible relationship, and
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Speaker 1: as you said, she didn't take him to the wedding.
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Speaker 1: The last time she was seen, she had been telling police.
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Speaker 1: She actually complained to police that she was that he
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Speaker 1: was harassing her. She told friends she was afraid for
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Speaker 1: her life, and her teenage son even said that they
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Speaker 1: got in a fight that night because she didn't want
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Speaker 1: to take him to the wedding. So all these things
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Speaker 1: lead to a lot of suspicion. And then you hear
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Speaker 1: that this guy says, oh, I'm going to visit my
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Speaker 1: old lady, who says that when they drive by a house,
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Speaker 1: it's really very crazy. I don't he's I don't believe
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Speaker 1: he's married. So what does he mean that he's driving
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Speaker 1: by this basement where the cement slab is to quote
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Speaker 1: visit his old lady. Now, this is according to several
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Speaker 1: people that say he has said this overtime. Eddie Miller,
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Speaker 1: her son, as Alexis just told you, said that there
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Speaker 1: was a big fight the night before the wedding that
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Speaker 1: she planned to attend without the boyfriend. The next day,
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Speaker 1: the boyfriend, Egan, was allegedly driving his mother's car. Hey, right,
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Speaker 1: there no offense, guys. But if you're a grown man
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Speaker 1: and you still got to drive your mom's ride, Okay, run, ladies,
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Speaker 1: run as if you had seen a monster. Okay, he's
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Speaker 1: bumming his mom's car. No, n oh, okay, right, that's
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Speaker 1: a whole another cannon worms. But so the next day
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Speaker 1: he's driving his mom's car and the tires alexis to
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Speaker 1: rest truck were covered with yellow clay that he thought
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Speaker 1: was related to cement work. Okay, what about that Alexis well,
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Speaker 1: and that's this this woman's son. I mean, how how
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Speaker 1: much of a better witness can you have? Where he says,
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Speaker 1: it's so suspicious that this building, this this house that
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Speaker 1: his sister rented had some construction work. His mom disappears,
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Speaker 1: and then this boyfriend says, all the time I'm visiting
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Speaker 1: my old lady there. It's it's so sickeningly obvious that
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Speaker 1: this guy had something to do with us. I think,
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Speaker 1: you know, Karen Smith, forensics expert, major crime scene investigator, Karen,
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Speaker 1: if you see this home, it looks like straight out
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Speaker 1: of Andy of Mayberry. Okay, I mean it's a tree
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Speaker 1: line street. It's got the front porch with the wick
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Speaker 1: white wicker chairs sitting on it. It's a two story frame,
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Speaker 1: fresh painted yellow with green and brown trim. It. It
16:15
Speaker 1: was like a Japanese maple on one side, and then
16:18
Speaker 1: it looks like an oak tree, possibly a post oak
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Speaker 1: on the other side. With the shade in the front yard,
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Speaker 1: I mean, a little sidewall, even a fire hydrant. I mean,
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Speaker 1: it looks straight out of Americana. I'm just telling you,
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Speaker 1: you'd never dream looking at from the outside there could
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Speaker 1: be a body buried in the cement in the basement.
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Speaker 1: Oh what a more perfect place than a piece of Americana? Right?
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Speaker 1: Who would suspect? Um? I had so many questions when
16:49
Speaker 1: I read these articles and did some research on this,
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Speaker 1: and a lot of it had to do with that house.
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Speaker 1: Where were the neighbors in, where the houses built around it?
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Speaker 1: Did any buddy here or see anything unusual? Was it
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Speaker 1: unusual to have work done on the house? Um? A
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Speaker 1: lot of a lot of questions. And you know, when
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Speaker 1: he's driving by this house and saying, I'm visiting my
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Speaker 1: old lady, is it out of his way of a drive?
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Speaker 1: Is he going somewhere in particular? These are all questions
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Speaker 1: I'd like to have answers to all I know is
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Speaker 1: that when I look at this photo Barbara Elizabeth Miller,
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Speaker 1: it's at Christmas time, the trees in the background, she
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Speaker 1: looks like she's looking right at me, saying, do something
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Speaker 1: for my son's sake. We're on it right now. We
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Speaker 1: are covering the body of a missing North Dakota woman
17:48
Speaker 1: has just been found wrapped in plastic. Okay, just right
17:52
Speaker 1: off the top of my head. Wrapped in plastic. That
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Speaker 1: means it was not an accident. It wasn't a suicide.
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Speaker 1: It wasn't an accident because what she had an accident
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Speaker 1: and died and then wrapped herself in plastic. No, when
18:05
Speaker 1: a body has found wrapped in plastic, that means it
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Speaker 1: was homicide and someone was staging or covering up the body,
18:11
Speaker 1: staging the scene or covering the body. I'm talking about
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Speaker 1: the body of a beautiful, young North Dakota woman who
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Speaker 1: went missing. We covered it on crime online dot Com.
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Speaker 1: And when I found out this woman, Savannah gray Wind
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Speaker 1: just twenty two, was eight months pregnant when she went missing,
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Speaker 1: I knew right then in my mind, Savannah's dead. Now
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Speaker 1: we learned that Savannah has been found wrapped in plastic.
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Speaker 1: Now Alexis terress Chuck, joining me from Radar online dot
18:50
Speaker 1: Com along with forensics expert Karen Smith. Alexis is my
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Speaker 1: understanding that kayakers were the ones to first spot Savannah's
19:00
Speaker 1: body in the Red River that's just east of Hardwood. Um,
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Speaker 1: what do you make of that? I understand that her body,
19:10
Speaker 1: wrapped in plastic, had gotten hung up on a log.
19:14
Speaker 1: Alexis toures Chuck. So folks are in their boat going
19:20
Speaker 1: down the river and they see a body. It's actually
19:22
Speaker 1: caught up on a log, and it's wrapped in plastic.
19:25
Speaker 1: But it's not just a piece of plastic. They see,
19:27
Speaker 1: they can tell that there's actually a person inside of
19:31
Speaker 1: this plastic. It's not submerged underwater completely. They can see
19:34
Speaker 1: what it is and they call the police immediately. You know,
19:38
Speaker 1: Alexis toures Chuck. Don't laugh. Okay, you might not be
19:41
Speaker 1: to the point where you can take your son on
19:43
Speaker 1: a high kick because he's just a toddler. Well, in
19:45
Speaker 1: my mind, is still a toddler. But Karen Smith, alexis
19:48
Speaker 1: torres Chuck. I just took the children on a long
19:51
Speaker 1: hike along a river, and at one part of the river,
19:58
Speaker 1: I just happened to know there's a drop off from
20:01
Speaker 1: an overhang where several young male bodies were thrown off
20:06
Speaker 1: the bridge, talking might killer serial killer Wayne Williams, and
20:10
Speaker 1: I couldn't help it, Guys. When I was walking along
20:12
Speaker 1: the trail, I kept looking out of the water, thinking,
20:15
Speaker 1: please don't dead body float by, Please don't dead body
20:17
Speaker 1: from the Twins. I mean, it's like your nightmare come true.
20:22
Speaker 1: You're out kayaking or walking along the river and you
20:26
Speaker 1: see Karen Smith, forensics expert, a dead body wrapped in plastic,
20:32
Speaker 1: now explained to me what it means to you, Karen,
20:35
Speaker 1: when you hear a body is wrapped in plastic, caught
20:39
Speaker 1: on a log in a river, it means that somebody
20:44
Speaker 1: had to kill her wrap her in plastic. I would
20:47
Speaker 1: be very curious to know if a tape was used.
20:50
Speaker 1: My my forensic mind goes immediately to the physical evidence
20:53
Speaker 1: that that may be present. You know, any kind of
20:55
Speaker 1: of a prince that may have been deposited on the
20:58
Speaker 1: inside of that bag may still be ei there. Um
21:01
Speaker 1: what her mechanism of death would be. And you know,
21:05
Speaker 1: when bodies are floating, that means they've been there for
21:08
Speaker 1: at least a few days. You know, they'll think at first,
21:10
Speaker 1: and then they'll float back up once the decomposition process starts.
21:14
Speaker 1: So you know, I'm hoping that they will be able
21:16
Speaker 1: to get some forensic evidence off of her body once
21:20
Speaker 1: they have recovered it and take it to the medical
21:22
Speaker 1: examiner's office. Well, speaking of that, the body is at
21:28
Speaker 1: the medical Examiner's office right now there in Ramsey County, Minnesota,
21:33
Speaker 1: awaiting autopsy. This is all just gone down and what
21:36
Speaker 1: forensics expert Karen Smith just said is correct. The body
21:40
Speaker 1: sinks initially, but when the body begins to decompose, it
21:44
Speaker 1: creates gases within the body. Just like when vegetables or
21:49
Speaker 1: fruit in your fridge start getting old, they become pungent,
21:53
Speaker 1: they smell because they are emitting a certain type of
21:56
Speaker 1: gas that goes hand in hand. It is a decompose
22:00
Speaker 1: issian and the body does that as well, just like
22:03
Speaker 1: the vegetables in your fridge. So when the body begins
22:06
Speaker 1: to release those gases as it decomposes within the inside
22:10
Speaker 1: of your body, your body begins to swell up to bloat,
22:14
Speaker 1: and the gases, like a balloon full of gas, floats
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Speaker 1: up in the air. The body floats up in the water.
22:24
Speaker 1: Plastic wrap is not going to contain it. Okay. The
22:28
Speaker 1: other thing that Karen Smith just said, when you're dealing
22:32
Speaker 1: with plastic, like a plastic tarp, okay, that is an
22:37
Speaker 1: excellent source of fingerprints. C s I. Crime Scene Investigation
22:42
Speaker 1: has got to be beside themselves trying to process this
22:48
Speaker 1: piece of tarp. Karen Smith absolutely, and if tape was used,
22:53
Speaker 1: likely it was because the plastic bag is just not
22:55
Speaker 1: going to contain a body. You have to seal it somehow.
22:58
Speaker 1: The sticky side of tape, believe or not, is an
23:00
Speaker 1: outstanding source of forensic evidence. So hopefully they'll be able
23:04
Speaker 1: to pull some ridge detail off of that as well.
23:06
Speaker 1: If not, NA, what's wrong with the three of us?
23:10
Speaker 1: There's Karen Smith, Alexis, Tresa, and myself. Other people see
23:13
Speaker 1: scotch tape and they think, oh, we're wrapping a present.
23:16
Speaker 1: We think, oh, there's fingerprints to catch a murderer. Okay,
23:19
Speaker 1: there's something really wrong with that. Okay, and I know that,
23:22
Speaker 1: but you know, I guess it's like with crazy people,
23:24
Speaker 1: if they know they're crazy, they're really not crazy. At
23:27
Speaker 1: least I recognize this is a way wrong. I want
23:30
Speaker 1: to get back to this this woman. I'm calling her
23:33
Speaker 1: a girl, but she's a grown lady. She's twenty two
23:36
Speaker 1: years old, Savannah, and she is eight months pregnant Alexis. Tresa,
23:44
Speaker 1: I swear I think you were with me one night
23:46
Speaker 1: on h Lynn when I spatted off the stat that
23:52
Speaker 1: this seeing that the number one cause of death amongst
23:56
Speaker 1: pregnant women was homicide. And when I say it, I'm like,
24:01
Speaker 1: I just said something wrong, that can't be right. I
24:03
Speaker 1: looked it up. It was, as I recall, from the
24:06
Speaker 1: New England Journal Medicine, and I was so skeptical. We
24:10
Speaker 1: actually tracked down the woman, the female doctor that wrote it,
24:14
Speaker 1: and she was right. I can't remember the journal, but
24:20
Speaker 1: homicide the number one cause of death amongst pregnant women.
24:26
Speaker 1: And here we have this gorgeous girl, Savannah. I wish
24:31
Speaker 1: you could see the picture of her right now. Um,
24:34
Speaker 1: Savannah gray Wind, eight months pregnant Alexis when she is
24:38
Speaker 1: found dead in the Red River, wrapped in plastic tarp
24:43
Speaker 1: and this was found by a farmhouse. This is not
24:46
Speaker 1: near her apartment where she lives. She lived with her mom,
24:49
Speaker 1: her sixteen year old brother. They said when she disappeared
24:53
Speaker 1: that they had know it she never would have left
24:55
Speaker 1: the house with and not come back. There was pizza
24:58
Speaker 1: that wasn't eaten. She left her keys, they said her
25:00
Speaker 1: anchors ankles were swollen, so she never would have walked
25:03
Speaker 1: that far. They knew that something very bad had happened
25:06
Speaker 1: to her when they couldn't find her. Her ankles were swollen.
25:10
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, what was she doing out by a river?
25:13
Speaker 1: A white water river where people are kayaking? Uh in? Oh,
25:18
Speaker 1: now here's another kick? Or she's eight months pregnant when
25:21
Speaker 1: she disappears. But since then, a newborn baby was found
25:29
Speaker 1: alive in the apartment building where Savannah was last seen alive.
25:35
Speaker 1: What do you know about that, Alexis? Well, she was
25:40
Speaker 1: they her neighbors were police found came to their apartment,
25:44
Speaker 1: they had a two day old baby, and so they
25:48
Speaker 1: were immediately rested because then the police suspected that this
25:51
Speaker 1: was her baby girl. And this seemed just these people.
25:55
Speaker 1: This woman wasn't pregnant, she didn't have a baby. It
25:58
Speaker 1: was just too much of a odd, scary coincidence. So
26:02
Speaker 1: not only do we find a to a two day
26:05
Speaker 1: old newborn baby girl in her apartment building. Needless to say,
26:09
Speaker 1: the two people who had the baby um are being questioned.
26:13
Speaker 1: But in addition to that, a farm and nearby farmstead
26:19
Speaker 1: is being searched. Alexis terres Chuck. Right the river next
26:24
Speaker 1: to where near where the body was found, there is
26:26
Speaker 1: a farmstead and police have phoned in on this and
26:29
Speaker 1: they're searching this and they're saying this maybe the crime scene.
26:33
Speaker 1: So this is separate from her apartment, saying that maybe
26:35
Speaker 1: she wasn't killed at the apartment, she was taken away
26:38
Speaker 1: and as the mom said, she could barely walk eight
26:41
Speaker 1: and a half months pregnant. And so this farmstead near
26:44
Speaker 1: this river where the Kayakers found the body is what
26:46
Speaker 1: police are saying maybe the crime scene. So this may
26:49
Speaker 1: have been where she was possibly murdered. Well, when you
26:52
Speaker 1: say crime scene, we've got the expert Karen Smith with me.
26:55
Speaker 1: What would they be looking for at the at that farmstead? Karen,
26:58
Speaker 1: I hate to go into to gory details, but we're
27:01
Speaker 1: dealing with a two day old baby and she was
27:03
Speaker 1: eight months pregnant. We know that she probably didn't deliver
27:05
Speaker 1: it at the farmstead. Um, how did the baby get
27:09
Speaker 1: removed from its mother? So we're dealing with blood. UM,
27:14
Speaker 1: Certainly the body will give a lot of information to
27:18
Speaker 1: the medical examiner where that's concerned. And you know, was
27:22
Speaker 1: was this woman strangled? Um? Is there evidence of injury
27:25
Speaker 1: to her neck? Um? Did they shoot her? Did they
27:29
Speaker 1: It's hard to tell at this point, but I know
27:31
Speaker 1: that the forensics so definitely blood blood. I mean, it's
27:35
Speaker 1: not going to be difficult to to overcome an eight
27:38
Speaker 1: months pregnant woman. I mean again, I remember when I
27:41
Speaker 1: was heavily pregnant. I could. I tried to walk into
27:44
Speaker 1: a restaurant with my husband. I think it was a
27:46
Speaker 1: Friday night and someone said she better get hurt to
27:50
Speaker 1: the hospital pronto. To my husband, Well, that was Friday night.
27:54
Speaker 1: On Sunday morning, you remember this, Alexis, I was up
27:57
Speaker 1: trying to get ready for church and I started jectile
28:00
Speaker 1: vomiting and my husband came in and said, you're not
28:03
Speaker 1: going to church, You're going to hospital. I'm like, no,
28:06
Speaker 1: I'm going. I'm going. I need to pray about this
28:08
Speaker 1: baby at the babies and um, he went, you're going
28:13
Speaker 1: to the hospital. He said, you're yellow. Your whole self
28:16
Speaker 1: is yellow. Well, needless to say, we he drove me
28:20
Speaker 1: straight to the hospital. We ran every single red light
28:23
Speaker 1: and he there was nowhere to part, so he dropped
28:26
Speaker 1: me at the front door. I was so out of it.
28:31
Speaker 1: I laid down on the floor at in the admissions
28:35
Speaker 1: and the lobby of the hospital. I did have the
28:38
Speaker 1: wherewithal to kind of crawl under a sofa type love
28:42
Speaker 1: seat thing so people wouldn't step on me at least
28:45
Speaker 1: got out of the way, and I laid on the floor.
28:48
Speaker 1: Interesting now that I think about it. Normally hospital tried
28:51
Speaker 1: to help me until my husband gave me, I gotta
28:54
Speaker 1: you help me get off the floor. So you know,
28:58
Speaker 1: this lady's eight months. What we know about those two people,
29:02
Speaker 1: it's brook Lynn Cruz and William Henry Hone were the
29:07
Speaker 1: ones that had the baby. What do we know, Alexis,
29:11
Speaker 1: But we know that they lived in the same apartment
29:14
Speaker 1: building that Savannah lived with her parents and her brother,
29:17
Speaker 1: and they have now been arrested and they were charged
29:21
Speaker 1: with conspiracy to commit kidnapping. Those are the original charges.
29:25
Speaker 1: This was before the body was found, so I imagine
29:28
Speaker 1: that the police are going to be adjusting those charges
29:31
Speaker 1: if they have the evidence. And back to you, Karen Smith,
29:35
Speaker 1: what will we learn from her body? What can we learn? Well,
29:40
Speaker 1: we will definitely learn the mechanism of death. Um, you know,
29:45
Speaker 1: whether or not she was strangled or anything else. Um also,
29:50
Speaker 1: And I hate to be so gory, but you know,
29:52
Speaker 1: we're dealing with facts here. If the baby was forcefully removed,
29:55
Speaker 1: they will certainly be able to tell that from the
29:58
Speaker 1: body now being in a river for some period of time,
30:02
Speaker 1: there is going to be some decomposition. However, injuries like
30:06
Speaker 1: that are not going to just go away. They'll be present,
30:08
Speaker 1: they'll be readily available, and hopefully the pathologist will be
30:11
Speaker 1: able to extrapolate whatever they need to to charge whoever
30:16
Speaker 1: is responsible. If it's these two, then then yeah, the
30:19
Speaker 1: police will definitely be adjusting charges for them. The body
30:22
Speaker 1: of missing North Dakota woman, eight months pregnant when she vanished,
30:25
Speaker 1: has been found wrapped in plastic. Kayakers first spot the
30:30
Speaker 1: body of Savannah gray Wind, just twenty two years old,
30:34
Speaker 1: in the Red River. Police working to try to retrieve
30:38
Speaker 1: her body and process a nearby farmstead. They say, quote
30:43
Speaker 1: suspicious items were found there. We don't know what that
30:46
Speaker 1: means yet, as we look for clues and follow the investigation.
30:54
Speaker 1: We want justice for Savannah gray Wind and let's send
31:00
Speaker 1: up our prayers for her tiny baby and newborn baby
31:03
Speaker 1: girl that will now grow up without her mom. We're
31:08
Speaker 1: on it. A little girl Jackie dead. Why the little girl,
31:16
Speaker 1: as she died took her final breaths? Can somebody explain
31:22
Speaker 1: to me why her older sister Abdulya live strained her
31:29
Speaker 1: sister as she lay there dying, filming her lifeless body
31:35
Speaker 1: covered in blood, actually catching her last breaths. What alexis
31:43
Speaker 1: terres Chuck? How did the little girl Jackie die? What happened?
31:49
Speaker 1: Jackie died? She was in a car accident, horrific accident.
31:52
Speaker 1: She was crushed in the car and as she lay
31:55
Speaker 1: bleeding and dying in the car, her sister was live
31:57
Speaker 1: streaming her death. But the older sister, her Adula, says,
32:02
Speaker 1: she's my mini me, my best friend. She looked just
32:05
Speaker 1: like me. Anytime I look at her, it's like I'm
32:07
Speaker 1: looking at myself. It makes me like, uh, it makes
32:12
Speaker 1: me like really sad that she's gone. So the sister,
32:16
Speaker 1: who is I believe du I drunk at the time
32:19
Speaker 1: she's driving, crashes the car and her sister is thrown
32:24
Speaker 1: out of the car I believe, into a cornfield and
32:26
Speaker 1: as the little girl between sister who just turned fourteen,
32:31
Speaker 1: is lying there covered in blood, dying. She instead of
32:35
Speaker 1: doing CPR on her sister, instead of calling nine one,
32:38
Speaker 1: instead of trying to save her sister's life, grabs her
32:41
Speaker 1: cell phone and starts videoing her little sister as she
32:45
Speaker 1: lies there dying. And that's not all because now Abdulia,
32:52
Speaker 1: the so called big Sister, is claiming that she live
32:57
Speaker 1: streamed her sisters death and dead body after the crash
33:03
Speaker 1: to raise money because she says she deserves to be
33:09
Speaker 1: free to work on her own clothing line. Okay, hold on,
33:15
Speaker 1: let me just get that straight. She live streams her
33:18
Speaker 1: sister's death. What does that mean? Alexis Torres truck radar online.
33:24
Speaker 1: To live stream something, you use stars. She used Facebook Live.
33:30
Speaker 1: You film something, it's live. Your followers, she has over
33:35
Speaker 1: five thousand followers. Friends on Facebook can watch it as
33:38
Speaker 1: it's happening. It's not a video that you took before
33:41
Speaker 1: and then upload. You're actually doing it live and so
33:43
Speaker 1: people can watch it. And people are horrified because she's
33:46
Speaker 1: not calling the police, she's not helping her sister. She's
33:49
Speaker 1: just talking and said, oh, I killed my sister. I'm
33:52
Speaker 1: so sorry. She she's so great, but she's my sister
33:55
Speaker 1: and I love her, but she's dead. It was completely
33:58
Speaker 1: callous and insane. So not only are people seeing it
34:01
Speaker 1: at the time it's happening, is it um curated? I mean,
34:06
Speaker 1: can you go back and look at it again. One
34:08
Speaker 1: of her friends actually copied, took a copy of the video,
34:12
Speaker 1: so recorded it as she was something life and she
34:15
Speaker 1: is the one that also contacted authorities about it. Now
34:17
Speaker 1: it turns out that she's trying to raise money off
34:20
Speaker 1: the video. It sounds like a grave robber, a ghoul.
34:25
Speaker 1: Now we know that she was drunk, and we know
34:31
Speaker 1: that she live streamed her sister as she died. I
34:35
Speaker 1: don't know what this says about the dangers of social media,
34:39
Speaker 1: but I'm not blaming social media for this. Karen Smith
34:42
Speaker 1: with me, forensic expert. What do we know about Jackie's death?
34:46
Speaker 1: A fourteen year old little girl. She was thrown out
34:48
Speaker 1: of the window of her sister's car before her sister
34:52
Speaker 1: right streamed her death. Right, she wasn't the only one.
34:55
Speaker 1: Her sister's friend was also thrown out but survived. So
34:57
Speaker 1: they were both in the back seat and they we're
35:00
Speaker 1: not wearing seatbelts, so when the car rolled, this was
35:03
Speaker 1: a rollover crash. This wasn't just you know, going through
35:05
Speaker 1: a fence into a cornfield. The car flipped. So we're
35:08
Speaker 1: talking about high speeds. We're talking about a lot of
35:10
Speaker 1: energy expenditures and a lot of physics and work here.
35:14
Speaker 1: Her little sister went through the back window and was killed,
35:17
Speaker 1: and her sister's friend was also ejected. But in the
35:21
Speaker 1: video you can see her sister's friend actually trying to
35:23
Speaker 1: flag down someone for help till while ab Julia is
35:27
Speaker 1: live streaming this, the one that was ejected is the
35:30
Speaker 1: one that has the presence of mind to try and
35:32
Speaker 1: get help while she goes ahead and puts this on
35:35
Speaker 1: social media, and she clearly states that she did it
35:39
Speaker 1: and that's not going to help her at trial. But
35:41
Speaker 1: now she says she's trying to raise money from the
35:44
Speaker 1: live streaming to start launts her own clothing line. Hello.
35:50
Speaker 1: Early in the note that she's just written, she writes
35:52
Speaker 1: about an album she wants to record and dedicate it
35:55
Speaker 1: to her dead sister. Okay, and she's sending it to
35:59
Speaker 1: this song Kamala Floor by Selena? What is this about
36:04
Speaker 1: her own clothing line? Help me on this, help me
36:07
Speaker 1: understand this? She says, she wants she has. She's only eighteen,
36:11
Speaker 1: she's she's a whole life ahead of her. She's really young.
36:13
Speaker 1: So one of the things that she wants to do
36:15
Speaker 1: is start a clothing line that she thinks that she
36:18
Speaker 1: could design clothes. And then she also says that she
36:21
Speaker 1: wants to open up a boxing gym, and she wants
36:23
Speaker 1: to put up a statue of her sister so that
36:25
Speaker 1: people can remember her. Okay, take a listen to this girl.
36:30
Speaker 1: She is pleading not guilty. She didn't count one with
36:37
Speaker 1: rose vehicular man slaughter while intoxicated as a felony advanced
36:40
Speaker 1: under PEP all Right, Uh, is that your true and
36:45
Speaker 1: correct name, Miss Sanchez? All Right, you're here today for
36:50
Speaker 1: a Raymond on a felony complaint. You're a charge and
36:54
Speaker 1: count one with rosy vehicular van slaughter intoxicated. That's a
37:01
Speaker 1: felony offense under Penal Code section one ninety one five
37:04
Speaker 1: subdivision A count two charges. You would vehicular manslaughter under
37:10
Speaker 1: one ninety two C subdivision C subdivision one of the
37:12
Speaker 1: Penal Code count three charges. You were driving under the
37:15
Speaker 1: influence of an alcoholic beverage causing injury. That's a felony offense.
37:19
Speaker 1: There's an enhancement, uh special allegation or causing great bodily
37:24
Speaker 1: injury and that is on the victim h m S.
37:30
Speaker 1: Count five charges you were driving under the influence of
37:33
Speaker 1: an alcoholic beverage causing injury of felony on the victim
37:38
Speaker 1: j S. And there's an enhancement for great bodily injury
37:42
Speaker 1: on that charge also, and count six charges you with
37:45
Speaker 1: a felony driving for point oh a blood alcohol causing
37:48
Speaker 1: injury felony offense also on JS with the same enhancement.
37:55
Speaker 1: Do you understand the charges a little bit? Uh? Do
38:00
Speaker 1: you have the funds to hire your own attorney? So
38:06
Speaker 1: I know there you hear the sister of Dulia in
38:09
Speaker 1: court as a judges speaking to her. I wanted you
38:11
Speaker 1: to hear that Kiaren Smith, forensics expert, her defense lawyer,
38:16
Speaker 1: already has the claim. What do you know, Karen. He's
38:19
Speaker 1: saying that there was a problem with a tire tread
38:22
Speaker 1: on one of the wheels of the car. And that's
38:26
Speaker 1: a little curious to me, considering I did some research
38:29
Speaker 1: on two thousand three Buicks, which is what she was driving.
38:33
Speaker 1: There are no recalls, there's no manufacturer problems reported with tires,
38:38
Speaker 1: and frankly, that is an issue, a maintenance issue for
38:42
Speaker 1: the owner. That's not a problem with with the tire itself.
38:45
Speaker 1: So I'm not quite sure where this attorney is going
38:48
Speaker 1: with that. It was just interesting to me that was
38:51
Speaker 1: going to be the defense. You know, don't you just
38:53
Speaker 1: hate it, Alexis Terres write our online dot com when
38:55
Speaker 1: your defense attorney comes up with this great defense about
38:59
Speaker 1: the tires caused the wreck, and hey, don't look at
39:02
Speaker 1: my client, look at these tires. And then you find
39:05
Speaker 1: out there was nothing wrong with the tires. Whoopsie. And
39:08
Speaker 1: not only that, she had been live streaming the whole
39:11
Speaker 1: day up to this, showing herself driving speeding down the road,
39:15
Speaker 1: like almost crashing into a van, and she says, you know, oh,
39:18
Speaker 1: we do that all the time. Everybody snapchats from the car.
39:20
Speaker 1: It's what we do. We're fine, We're young, Like this
39:22
Speaker 1: wasn't This was something she'd been doing all day long,
39:25
Speaker 1: was driving recklessly and filming it at the same time drinking.
39:29
Speaker 1: You left that part out now this end, she says, Okay,
39:32
Speaker 1: this is what she says when people have attacked her
39:35
Speaker 1: verbally attacked her about what happened. Quote, You're only going
39:38
Speaker 1: to make my parents suffer more. You're not going to
39:41
Speaker 1: help anybody. My parents are grieving. They want me back home.
39:45
Speaker 1: The house is super lonely without us. We were like
39:48
Speaker 1: the joy of the house. Okay, she's talking about her
39:51
Speaker 1: and her sister that she killed and live streamed her
39:53
Speaker 1: death while she was drunk. And she is attacking people
39:56
Speaker 1: that have verbally chastised her client that they're just hurting
40:01
Speaker 1: her parents. All right, where is this going to Alexis
40:05
Speaker 1: to risk check what's happening? I mean, this is crazy.
40:09
Speaker 1: Why did her lawyer let her write this letter? I
40:12
Speaker 1: guess you couldn't stop her talking about she needs the
40:15
Speaker 1: money from the video of her dying sister to start
40:17
Speaker 1: her clothing line. Yeah. I don't think that this attorney
40:20
Speaker 1: really has any control over her, because no, I'm not
40:23
Speaker 1: the attorney that's to you. But I wouldn't imagine. And
40:25
Speaker 1: the cases where I've covered, attorneys don't usually tell their
40:28
Speaker 1: clients to write rambling a page letters to news stations.
40:30
Speaker 1: I would like to get them as a reporter, obviously,
40:33
Speaker 1: but this is she He's saying, He's coming up with
40:35
Speaker 1: a lot of excuses. He says, you know, you, this
40:37
Speaker 1: is only just a few minutes of the day that
40:39
Speaker 1: you know about her that you're basing your opinion on.
40:41
Speaker 1: He says she is a victim of child sex trafficking,
40:45
Speaker 1: she has a terrible background, and that this is what's
40:47
Speaker 1: going to come out and to show what a bad
40:49
Speaker 1: life that she had. So he's really setting up an
40:52
Speaker 1: extensive defense. All right, the jury is going to have
40:54
Speaker 1: that letter in their hands. She also says that the
40:57
Speaker 1: reason she did the live streaming is now. This is
41:00
Speaker 1: before her sister died. She started live streaming. In her
41:03
Speaker 1: four page double sided letter to a reporter at kg PE,
41:08
Speaker 1: t V and Fresno, she said, I know I had
41:11
Speaker 1: more than five thousand followers, and it's the only way
41:14
Speaker 1: my sister could get a decent burial. I never exposed
41:17
Speaker 1: my sister like that. I anticipated the public donating money
41:21
Speaker 1: to me because my family is not rich, and oh yes,
41:23
Speaker 1: I'm gonna start I'm gonna launch my own clothing line.
41:26
Speaker 1: That is bad. But then she says, I accomplished my goal.
41:31
Speaker 1: She apparently has raised money. More than twelve thousand dollars
41:35
Speaker 1: was donated to a go fund Me account created by
41:38
Speaker 1: the family to help with the funeral. Wow. She has
41:42
Speaker 1: now charged with half a dozen crimes, including gross vehicular
41:46
Speaker 1: man slaughter, and she said that live streaming was quote
41:51
Speaker 1: like a reflex. Okay, that's where we stand right now.
41:56
Speaker 1: The videos showed Sanchez looking into the camera and singing
42:00
Speaker 1: as she was driving, and the sister and the friend
42:05
Speaker 1: also in the car. As she was recording herself. She
42:08
Speaker 1: loses control over two thousand three buick and crashes. The
42:12
Speaker 1: video stops. She says she called nine one one for
42:15
Speaker 1: help and then started recording. She panned to the body
42:19
Speaker 1: of her sister lying there out in a field, who
42:23
Speaker 1: had suffered major head trauma, and as the video streamed,
42:29
Speaker 1: she says, I killed my sister. Okay, I know I'm
42:33
Speaker 1: going to jail for life. She says that right then,
42:38
Speaker 1: some reports say she said I don't care. I guess
42:41
Speaker 1: we'll find out at trial with me. Alexis terres Chuck,
42:45
Speaker 1: writer on online dot Com, and forensics expert Karen Smith
42:49
Speaker 1: now to Alan Duke, Alan, I want to hear how
42:53
Speaker 1: I can help the victims of Hurricane Harvey right now.
42:56
Speaker 1: I know that there is looting going on. People are homeless,
43:00
Speaker 1: they don't have power. There have been casualties. What can
43:05
Speaker 1: we do to help? Alan? The mayor of Houston, Sylvester Turner,
43:11
Speaker 1: has put out the call. He's got a short list
43:13
Speaker 1: of supplies in Houston that the shelters are in desperate
43:16
Speaker 1: need of right now, including dry clothing for both adults
43:20
Speaker 1: and children. You know, many of them are coming out,
43:22
Speaker 1: they're just soaking wet when they arrive at the shelter.
43:25
Speaker 1: Diapers as a mom, and you know how critical that is.
43:29
Speaker 1: And there's a severe shortage of diapers, baby formula, medical supplies,
43:33
Speaker 1: and food. That is the top list. Now. If you're
43:36
Speaker 1: in the Texas area, there are local organizations you can
43:39
Speaker 1: donate to, but overall authorities are recommending and asking and
43:43
Speaker 1: pleading for you to donate to the American Red Cross
43:47
Speaker 1: and you can reach them at red Cross dot org
43:50
Speaker 1: or one eight hundred help now one three five seven
43:54
Speaker 1: six six nine. Okay one D three five seven six
44:00
Speaker 1: six nine. You can also go to um CORE United
44:06
Speaker 1: Methodist Relief. Of the money that goes to um core
44:11
Speaker 1: U M C o R goes to help the victims
44:14
Speaker 1: one of that or DIALT Like Alan just told you
44:19
Speaker 1: right now, FEMA is expecting more than four hundred and
44:22
Speaker 1: fifty thousand Harvey disaster victims to file for assistance. That's
44:28
Speaker 1: a half a million people. US emergency management officials say
44:34
Speaker 1: they're trying to expedite federal resources. And let me tell you,
44:38
Speaker 1: I know, because um, we went on mission's work immediately
44:42
Speaker 1: following Katrina, and it was devastating. We worked so hard
44:49
Speaker 1: to rebuild. People were out of their homes, out of
44:53
Speaker 1: their apartments. They had nothing, nothing at all. Give me
44:57
Speaker 1: those numbers again, please if you could tell me, Well,
45:01
Speaker 1: the simple thing, of course is to go to Red
45:03
Speaker 1: Cross dot org or if you want to use the phone.
45:07
Speaker 1: Help now three five, seven, six, six nine. Okay, what
45:13
Speaker 1: do we know about the Harvey victims, Alan, Well, we
45:16
Speaker 1: know they're still trying to rescue them and it's going
45:18
Speaker 1: to go on for days and days. You know, with Katrina,
45:21
Speaker 1: it took a long time for them to really realize
45:23
Speaker 1: the magnitude. With this, they've got thousands of people still
45:26
Speaker 1: stranded either on their roofs for the second fourth of
45:29
Speaker 1: their home, some of them in waste, high water, or worse.
45:33
Speaker 1: So it's still a picture that is unfolding. Please join
45:37
Speaker 1: with me and help the victims of Hurricane Harvey. They
45:41
Speaker 1: are our very own here in our backyard, and they
45:45
Speaker 1: are suffering. Please call the Red Cross toll free number
45:49
Speaker 1: eight hundred four three five seven, six, six nine. Also
45:54
Speaker 1: continue to pray for those who are suffering because of
45:59
Speaker 1: Hurricane Harvey. Also let's pray for their early response teams,
46:04
Speaker 1: disaster coordinators and volunteers there who were trying to help.
46:08
Speaker 1: Please dial toll free one eight hundred four three five seven,
46:12
Speaker 1: six six nine for Red Cross assistance to Hurricane Harvey victims,
46:17
Speaker 1: or UM Corps United Methodist Committee on Relief toll free
46:22
Speaker 1: eight hundred five five four, eight five eight three one
46:27
Speaker 1: eight hundred five five four eight five eight three or
46:34
Speaker 1: eight eight eight two five two six one seven four.
46:39
Speaker 1: Please help us help our friends. Nancy Grace Crime Stories
46:45
Speaker 1: signing off, goodbye friend