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Finding Beauty Through Pain · Divas That Care Network

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's Divas That Care Radio.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: Stories, strategies, and ideas to inspire positive change.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Divas That Care, a network of women committed to making our world a better place for everyone.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_00: This is a global movement for women, by women engaged in a collaborative effort to create a better world for future generations.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: To find out more about the movement, visit divas that care.com after the show.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: Right now, though, stay tuned for another jolt of inspiration.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_02: Well, hello everyone, and welcome back to the Divas That Care.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: My name is Candace Gish.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_02: If this is your very first time tuning into us, a huge welcome.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_02: We have been doing this now for over 15 years.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_02: We are listened to in over 30 countries around the world, and it's honestly been a blast.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: This journey of mine has been so extraordinary.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_02: I've had the opportunity to meet amazing individuals all around the world, from all these amazing women to honoring men divas that we can welcome into our family, and it has been a blast.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we have a great list of hosts that have been with us over the years, and I do hope that you go and check out all those amazing women.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_02: They have extraordinary shows, and it is just so much fun to be able to support and collaborate with all of our guests.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_02: Here we go.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_02: Today we're gonna be welcoming a brand new DVU to our family.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_02: We're actually working on a new podcasting series right now, the season of shift, women on the edge of reinvention.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_02: So that's gonna be people that are going through different journeys right now and how they've been able to navigate those.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm excited because Alexis Lee is gonna be my amazing guest today.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_02: So welcome to the show, Alexis.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Candace.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: I'm glad to be here.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: I'm really glad that you are able to um chat with me today.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_02: So, Alexis, would you mind introducing yourself to our listeners?
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know, um, we were talking about kind of where where I come from.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm from Texas and I went to school in Pennsylvania, and I, you know, got married um sometime after college, had a we had a son.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: There's all kind of like this great path, good career, all this stuff.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: That's was that's a story I would have told uh maybe six years ago.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: And everything, I had all the pieces that would make somebody happy.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then I had a moment in time that really um stopped me in my tracks.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: And I was walking in the woods one day, and I heard a voice that said, if you die today, your life will have been a tragedy.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: And so it really caused me to look at my life and dig up some childhood pain and really um transform my experience of the world in the last few years.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_02: It's um it sounds like you've had an amazing journey.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_02: I did have an opportunity to go through your websites, and I'm gonna be really honest.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna I'm excited to know how that all came about and how you decided to do that.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: But before we dive into your books, can you tell us a little bit about your past?
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_01: Well, yeah, so I, you know, the the book was kind of a shock to me a couple of years ago.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_01: I was in corporate finance and um I was always a math person, and I actually thought I was a terrible writer.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_01: So um my, you know, I I went through life thinking that I had everything that I could want, but my mom died when I was young, and I never really dealt with that pain.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so it just caught up with me.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_01: And when I was 38, that's when I kind of was forced to confront how sad I was and how lonely I was.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: And it was during a period of deep grief when I started to really face that, that one day I woke up and this book just started coming out of me.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_01: So it was this really surprising turn in my life and a huge gift from going toward my grief to rediscover these parts of myself that had been buried along with the grief, along with the pain, were these parts of me that I just, you know, lost touch with completely for decades.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness.
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  SPEAKER_02: And it's something that we don't really think about, is it?
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_01: Why would you want to go toward your pain?
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_01: And really, it's you know, it's crisis, it's rock bottom.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_01: Those things, those things kind of force you to do it.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: Otherwise, you know, if you're pretty comfortable, it's a little bit like why go rock the boat.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I I've heard that a lot.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_02: Well, the question I do have, honestly, is that I've had a lot of women on our podcasts, and in the five years, I don't know, there's been some type of a crazy shift.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_02: And a lot of people have said they are going through these life-alternating changes.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that's really why I wanted to talk about this specific series because there's been such dramatic change, and a lot of the women have told me that they never would have predicted, you know, either going through this or um almost like that awakening within themselves.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_02: And is kind of that happened to you?
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: It has been an awakening, um, and certainly one that I was not in charge of.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: You know, again, I kind of got hit over the head with this message that that caused me to really be become honest about how I was doing in life.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't, I wasn't doing well.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't happy.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, the the tricky part about that is that if you've if you've built a life around what you think you should be doing, where you, you know, the life you think you should have, then it's something to let go of.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't think everybody has to go through that.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_01: But for me, it was literally letting go of every piece of my life besides my son and letting it be rebuilt for, you know, in a way that was aligned with who I am, who I really am underneath all of that.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, not the picture perfect, you know, person that I tried to portray, even unconsciously, um, but actually the person that I am underneath all of it.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_02: Isn't it crazy how we become authentic?
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_02: We always think we are, but we always kind of hide a bit of ourselves from others because we don't know how others are going to react.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: And when you let it go and you're at your authentic self, I think you become more at peace with yourself.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I feel so much more peaceful than I did before.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_01: And and I'll say, I think for me, I didn't know I wasn't authentic.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_01: Like you said, like I didn't, I didn't know I was hiding.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't until I got to some of this really deep pain where, you know, my mom, my mom was addicted to drugs and um she kind of faded out of my life over years.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_01: And there was this part of me that I didn't discover even until more recently that really thought that my mom didn't love me and she left because of me.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: And so my whole life, unconsciously, I was building a whole life to prove that wrong, right?
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: To I didn't want to get evidence from anyone that I was not lovable.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: But when I finally face that deep pain, then it frees me.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_01: Then I get to be who I am, and it doesn't matter what anybody else thinks because I'm not guarding against it anymore.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_02: I love how you just said that.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_02: I just I think that is so empowering.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_02: And to our listeners out there, I think they're gonna embrace that.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_02: I want to know what is the name of your book?
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_01: So it's pain is a portal to beauty.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_01: And again, it's this notion that I was my whole life, I thought you shouldn't be pained, right?
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like if there's pain, there's something wrong.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: So go change it.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_01: And what I learned from just this naturally, my life kind of unraveling, but also I I did some guided psychedelic journeys.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_01: And in those journeys, it just over and over and over took brought me back to my pain.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, I think that's really scary because it feels like you can get stuck there.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_01: But what happened actually is when I sat with my pain, it then freed it, and then it could I could release it from my body, and then my body was freed up to be in a state that was not pained, that was that's actually, you know, alive and can be in joy and peaceful, like you said earlier.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: So for me, um this journey has been one of accepting pain, honoring it, which really just honors us, right?
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like we went, we went through stuff as kids that was hard.
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_01: And if we don't honor it, those little parts of our of us are inside there and they're trying to protect us, they're trying to do all the things that we did as kids to to survive, but it's not working anymore.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_01: And so we reject these parts of ourselves and really they just need some love for what they went through.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_01: And as soon as they get that love, as soon as these parts feel loved, then they move on and we get to, you know, again, feel less caged, less programmed, and more free in our lives.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness, I agree with you completely.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_02: And isn't it funny?
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_02: We were always told to suck it up or, you know, just move on, everything, you know, everybody goes through things, but we don't really think that we need to do that self-healing.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_02: And when you're talking about that, and did you have a hard time finding the ways to self-heal?
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_02: Because there is so many different modalities out there, there's so many different things, and people give you all these different advices.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: How is it that you were able to navigate through those waters?
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's a great point.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, to me, it is overwhelming because everybody has the answer the three steps, the five steps, the ten steps, whatever it is.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_01: And and so if you look externally, I think it can, for me, it just becomes very confusing and not centered around what works for me.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_01: So over and over, it's I listen to others, right?
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_01: Because people have all sorts of wisdom, but it's my internal wisdom that guides me through.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_01: And that's true for every one of us.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_01: And the more for me, the more pain I can release, the more I can be in my body, and the more I'm in my body, the more I can access that wisdom.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: But it has been a path of trusting myself.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I heard that voice in the woods that was my own guidance telling me, you are not looking at this and you need to look at it now.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I just knew from that moment that I needed to start grieving.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_01: I needed to go on walks and listen to sad music and stop talking to people about my trauma, just go inward.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: I for some somehow I knew that.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_01: And then these psychedelic opportunities, you know, showed up and I I felt it out and it and it resonated with me.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_01: It felt like something I was willing to give a try.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_01: Because frankly, Candace, I tried everything.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: I was in therapy, I was reading all the books, I was doing all the things, and it still wasn't working.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_01: So I very much believe that, you know, we know what's best for us, and it's so unique to each individual.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_01: And and I do now, you know, I think the farther you get on your journey and the more you work on it, also the more practiced you are, right?
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_01: And the more you do know you can trust yourself instead of listening to somebody else.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_02: Can you maybe explain what the psychedelics um and some deep inner work is?
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_02: Because some of our listeners might not know what that is.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I I didn't know what it was.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_01: This was something that, like, I didn't, I didn't know there was more than one kind of psychedelic.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: I was very uh uh uninformed in this way, but ultimately, you know, psychedelics are plant medicines that that you take.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_01: And again, I did mine with, I certainly wouldn't have felt comfortable doing it without a very capable guide there with me.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: So I did mine with guides.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, the first one I did was MDMA, which is also ecstasy, uh also called ecstasy.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: So it is, you know, what that medicine does is it takes you into your body and it lowers your fear response because if you have these big emotions that you've stored away, they're really scary to go look at them.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: So this medicine helps lower that fear response so you can go look at these emotions, you can go look at this pain that's buried with less fear.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so I did that one first, and then the next one I did with psilocybin.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_01: And this one again, what they say is that the medicines just teach show you what you need to see.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, the psilocybin messaging over and over was you have more grief to unpack, you have more work to do.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_01: So they weren't, it wasn't a pleasant experience, but it was really meaningful because it helped me realize what I need to do as a human in my human life after the integration of that.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what I needed to go do grief work proactively.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: And what would happen is if I I felt sad, I would really, you know, clear my plate and really dive into it.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then I'd walk outside and the trees would come alive to me.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's like it releasing the pain, feeling that pain released it and let me experience the world in a again in a more alive way.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_01: So the colors were more vibrant, and I discovered, you know, dahlias, like these flowers that had always been there, but I'd never seen them before.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: So my experience of the world around me shifted when I started doing that.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_01: And then the the most um the the other plant medicine that I worked with was ayahuasca, which is an Amazonian plant.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and that one again was just like a gentle, all-knowing guide who just led me to these childhood moments where I maybe I didn't realize how painful it was or how sad it made me.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_01: And she just was there with me as we sat there and let it, you know, let me understand how that affected me more.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: So it was really for me a lot of unpacking.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: I think, you know, I buried a ton of pain from my childhood because I just couldn't handle it.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_01: It was too much for me.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: And so for me, this has been a big, long unpacking process, but it really has changed the way I experience the world.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, there are things like you I can intellectually understand I should set boundaries, and I can read books, books about boundaries, but after these psychedelic experiences, like, oh, I just know it.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's just in my body.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: So it takes you, these psychedelics take you to your own wisdom in your body.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I love that.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I love that they have people that can help you through it because a lot of people are probably listening.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_02: What is she talking about?
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_02: You can't do that, but it's different now.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_02: Things are changing and evolving so much.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_02: And to have somebody that can help you heal through that process by by obviously working with the plants is a very powerful thing because before you wouldn't hear of anybody that actually does that.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: And it's still in process, but there's more and more of it.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_01: And I think um, and I and I think the neat thing is, you know, we're all going to find our way through our again, our path.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not that everybody needs to go do psychedelics.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_01: It's some of us can do psychedelics and share the wisdom we get from that.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: And some people focus on somatic healing and others on meditation.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, all these things overlap in terms of finding self-love, right?
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: That's what it's all about.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_02: That is beautifully said, and that's exactly right.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_02: But to know that there is other opportunities and other modalities and ways that a person can do it when they've they've struggled.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_02: Like you've said, you know, there's so much out there, and sometimes it's really challenging to navigate those waters.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I, you know, they always think, well, there just one quick fix.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, unfortunately, there is no quick fix for anything.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_02: You you have to find what works for you.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why I'm really excited about this book because it shows your story, and every story is powerful, and every story has a meaning, and every story can help somebody out there.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: And this has just been wonderful.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I thank you so much for that.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thanks, Candace.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: So, where can our listeners get a hold of your book?
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, I'm I'm kind of in process about a couple things.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_01: Right now it's everywhere.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm considering um frankly, I've been struggling with all the AI and fake stuff out there.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a part of me that just wants to pull it to my website and just say, I'll ship everyone a book from, you know, I'll print the books and ship them and you know it's real.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_01: So you can at least go to my website, which is alexislee.com.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: But right now it is available on all the outlets online as well.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_02: So, Alexis, what is next for you?
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, um, it is I'm in a period of quiet.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_01: So there's not the next is still unfolding.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, what I what I experience is that I go through these periods of deep grief and anchoring, and then there's kind of this letting go of the way I held things.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_01: And then you sit there in that spaciousness for a while, and then the next thing starts to blossom.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: So for me, I'm actually in that place of right now, it is just sharing the book and sharing this loving message and doing podcasts with wonderful people like you.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then ultimately it will be, you know, it'll it's just I'm working on trusting that I can take one step at a time and the perfect thing is unfolding.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_01: Instead of having, I've always been the, you know, you plan ahead and you do all the things.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_01: And what I'm learning right now in life is to really let go of that and what and surrender and watch how life unfolds without my trying to direct it because it's so much bigger and more beautiful than I can imagine.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_02: That is wonderfully said.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my gosh.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, this has been so much fun, Alexis.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um, one of the things I ask our amazing guests at the end of the podcast is there any tips, tools, anything else you'd love to share with our listeners to inspire them to maybe nudge them on their extraordinary journeys?
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, for me, I just felt stuck for so long.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I didn't realize how much I was coping and numbing to get through, right?
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_01: Until I had this kind of big moment in life that shifted things for me.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so I would just offer that if anybody feels stuck and if you want to just try some something, just finding quiet in your own life, which can be turning off coping mechanisms.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes we don't even know they're coping mechanisms because they're pretty benign, you know, but having fewer shows or podcasts for a little bit, having a more bland diet, you know, less social interaction.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: If you're wanting to get unstuck, for me, that's the way I do it, is to quiet.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: And then these voices that can't get through to us because we're always kind of distracted or or numbing, these voices will start to get through, and then you can really start to build a sweet relationship with them, and then things just start to shift.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_01: So again, back to your theme of a season of shift.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_02: You know what?
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_02: I've never had anybody say that before, and I really like that.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_02: That was wonderful.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_02: Well, we'll definitely have to have you back on the podcast again, Alexis.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: I think that we could dive into some other amazing topics with you.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that would be fun.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Guinness.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_02: And to all of our amazing listeners, thank you so much for tuning in to today's podcast.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_02: I am going to be sending Alexis' information so that you can go and check out her page there and um perhaps get a copy of her amazing book.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: It is so unique.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_02: It is something that is not out there, and I really think it's going to help so many individuals.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_02: So make sure that you share, uh, like, comment on this podcast.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you again, Alexis.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you to all of our listeners.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for tuning into this amazing podcast series, Season of Shift, Women on the Edge of Reinvention.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_02: Um, remember to go out there and do something kind.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_02: The world needs a lot more kindness.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_02: And it's up to you guys, our tribe out there, to be the Ripple Effect.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you so much for tuning in again, and I hope you all have an amazing day.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: Until next time, everyone.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for listening.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_00: This show was brought to you by Divas That Care.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Connect with us on Facebook, on Instagram, and of course on divas that care.com, where you can subscribe to our newsletter so you don't miss a thing.