Latest / The Kulturecast / Wrong Is Right (1982) — "The U.S. of A. may not always be right, but God knows we're never wrong."

Transcript

Wrong Is Right (1982) — "The U.S. of A. may not always be right, but God knows we're never wrong." · The Kulturecast

• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Weird way.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: Two one stretched in a moment world War three. But first,
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: a word from our sponsors. Meet TV superstar reporter Patrick Hale.
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: He's onto the most incredible story of his career. Two
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: Adam bomb. The bad news is it involves an Arab terrorist.
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: Why trust me Television, you reach millions, a trigger happy general.
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: Now, mister President hit him first?
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: Good guys, never shoot first?
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: Why not the president of the United States, he's heard
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: a rumor.
• 1:16
  Speaker 4: About the bombs.
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: Well, don't say yes, don't say no, don't say maybe.
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: See you'll call that, but don't I say you stay president?
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: And it may result in World War three. The good
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: news is his ratings are going through the roof. On television,
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: Columbia Pictures presents Wrong Is Right? A very funny look
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: at the world Rated are starts Friday Man's Plaza, Westwood.
• 1:42
  Speaker 5: Hello everyone, and welcome to the Culture Cast. I am
• 1:45
  Speaker 5: your host, Chris Dasher, and I'm joined by my good
• 1:47
  Speaker 5: friend he loves a good war. Who doesn't really? The
• 1:50
  Speaker 5: host of the Projection with Podcasts, Mike White.
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: You call that news. We've pedaled Ti Shashtra.
• 1:55
  Speaker 5: Can I just ask why is it you just like
• 1:57
  Speaker 5: watching movies that are too topical impression for their own good. Hey, hey,
• 2:01
  Speaker 5: let me get this straight. We're in the middle of
• 2:03
  Speaker 5: a war with Iran and you watch a movie about
• 2:06
  Speaker 5: a fake war with Iran for money.
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 2:08
  Speaker 3: Kind of weird, right, Yeah, And an incompetent president and
• 2:13
  Speaker 3: his advisers running everything. Yeah, it's kind of wild, right.
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: Just a tad, Yeah, just a tad.
• 2:19
  Speaker 5: On this episode of the Culture Cast, we are talking
• 2:20
  Speaker 5: about a film that you may have never heard of,
• 2:23
  Speaker 5: but by the end of this episode you may want
• 2:25
  Speaker 5: to take a gander at it. We're talking about nineteen
• 2:27
  Speaker 5: eighty two's satirical film based on the book The Better Angels.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: Wrong is Right?
• 2:33
  Speaker 5: So the film is written and directed by Richard Brooks,
• 2:36
  Speaker 5: based on, like I said, the book The Better Angels
• 2:38
  Speaker 5: by Charles McCarey, and it stars Sean Connery as Patrick Hale,
• 2:43
  Speaker 5: a news reporter with a penchant for covering violence, urder, suicide,
• 2:49
  Speaker 5: and everything in between. He gets embroiled in the an
• 2:53
  Speaker 5: alphabet soup of letter agencies up to no good that
• 2:57
  Speaker 5: may be trying to start war with the Middle East.
• 2:59
  Speaker 5: They might be trying to regime change, It might just
• 3:01
  Speaker 5: be for oil. Who knows It's definitely not the world.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: Mike.
• 3:04
  Speaker 5: I'm kicking it to you first, as always, what did
• 3:07
  Speaker 5: you think of Wrong Is Right?
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: And why did you pick this movie?
• 3:10
  Speaker 5: I mean, I can assume I know why, but I'd
• 3:12
  Speaker 5: love to hear straight for why you.
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: Well, this was a pick for me due to my friend.
• 3:18
  Speaker 3: I believe it was Robert Hubbard recommended this one to
• 3:21
  Speaker 3: me forever ago, and this was I don't want to
• 3:24
  Speaker 3: say this was the tipping point, but this is one
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: of the things that played into the whole idea of
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: us doing this Sean Connery month, just because I had
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: this backlog of Sean Connery films that I wanted to
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: finally sit down and see. And I really didn't know
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: anything about Wrongness right before we started. I looked into
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: it a little bit beforehand to find out that it
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: was based on a book. I downloaded that sort of
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: reading that a little bit, but was not able to
• 3:52
  Speaker 3: get through it as much as I would have liked. Yeah,
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: and I don't remember how Robert sold it to me.
• 3:59
  Speaker 3: I think he just that you need to check this out.
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: And the poster image of Sean Connery standing there with
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: his arms wide open welcoming people and then having this
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: nuclear blast going off behind him. It's like, okay, yeah,
• 4:12
  Speaker 3: whatever this is, I'm in for it, let's do it.
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: And I Yeah, was kind of blown away by the
• 4:18
  Speaker 3: subject matter, like you're saying, very precient. This is nineteen
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: eighty two that this movie comes out, and yeah, really
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: really speaks to a lot of stuff that we are
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: dealing with today. They make a lot of references to
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: things like Nixon, Bay of Pigs, those things, and Yeah,
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: it's amazing just how much those things still resonate today.
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: And even having a president who's kind of in shock
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: when he realizes that if you spell dog backwards it's God.
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: Kind of reminds me of when Trump figured out that
• 4:55
  Speaker 3: US is just like us. Nobody ever thought of that
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: before the they don't have this big a brain.
• 5:02
  Speaker 5: Well it's a whil, a shark, a lion, and a giraffe.
• 5:06
  Speaker 5: And they asked me.
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: Mister president, pick the whale and I said, that's a whale.
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: Clearly it's aware. Let swims in esh it has finned,
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: So that's a bear.
• 5:15
  Speaker 5: Okay, No, you're you're very you're you're Your last couple
• 5:21
  Speaker 5: picks have been a little too close to the last one.
• 5:24
  Speaker 5: The last one I feel like definitely similarly too close
• 5:28
  Speaker 5: to home in terms of like, you know, quote subject
• 5:32
  Speaker 5: material unquote uh, and this one I think similarly maybe
• 5:36
  Speaker 5: not so much subject material, but definitely characters involved in
• 5:40
  Speaker 5: the film are very representative of people, places, and things
• 5:44
  Speaker 5: that are I existing now in a way that I
• 5:48
  Speaker 5: think you and I clearly can like, oh, well this
• 5:52
  Speaker 5: is like that, and this is like that, and this
• 5:53
  Speaker 5: is you know, here's this person.
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: It's like, Okay.
• 5:56
  Speaker 5: The thing I think that's really sad for me as
• 5:58
  Speaker 5: someone who's just like older, and I think this is
• 6:01
  Speaker 5: the other thing that a lot of people my age
• 6:04
  Speaker 5: are always like, well, this is it's never ever been
• 6:06
  Speaker 5: like this before.
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: No, No, it has. It's actually been like this like
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: the whole fucking time.
• 6:11
  Speaker 5: That's that's kind of that's kind of the problem, is
• 6:15
  Speaker 5: that it's been like this the whole time.
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: It's never not been like this. In our political system, there's.
• 6:19
  Speaker 5: Always scheming and power grabs. It's just they're taking place
• 6:24
  Speaker 5: often clandestinely.
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: At least they used to.
• 6:27
  Speaker 5: That was, you know, back in the day when people
• 6:30
  Speaker 5: used to do things clandestinely, when when people were attempting
• 6:34
  Speaker 5: and I'm going to use a word that we were
• 6:35
  Speaker 5: called earlier in the week. When people are attempting to
• 6:38
  Speaker 5: be ideologues in the open is much different than doing
• 6:42
  Speaker 5: it privately, and people don't do it privately. It's like
• 6:44
  Speaker 5: out in the open now if people are even ideologues
• 6:46
  Speaker 5: at all. Frankly, I think we live in a post
• 6:48
  Speaker 5: ideological society where nobody like it used to be we
• 6:52
  Speaker 5: would invade a country for the oil, for whatever. Now
• 6:55
  Speaker 5: it's just well, we're just doing it just because. And
• 6:58
  Speaker 5: it's like, wait a second, like the pre ten of
• 7:00
  Speaker 5: an ideology, I could at least somewhat respect that as
• 7:03
  Speaker 5: an attempt to like OBUs gate why we're doing things.
• 7:06
  Speaker 5: But now it's just like we're just gonna do it
• 7:07
  Speaker 5: for whatever fucking reason we want. That's always been the case.
• 7:10
  Speaker 5: It's just they've never been outwardly you know, engaging that
• 7:14
  Speaker 5: way or openly engaging that way. And this movie is
• 7:17
  Speaker 5: just a you know, satirical look at things. It ain't
• 7:21
  Speaker 5: satirical any it's just that's the thing that's hard with
• 7:24
  Speaker 5: a film like this is like, it's not funny, and
• 7:27
  Speaker 5: I wonder if it was funny then I can't imagine
• 7:29
  Speaker 5: it was super raucous time at the theater. But I
• 7:32
  Speaker 5: think probably then people thought to themselves, well, this could
• 7:35
  Speaker 5: never happen, It would never be like like this, this
• 7:38
  Speaker 5: is just flights of fancy. And now it's like this
• 7:40
  Speaker 5: is so far from being flights of fancy. We are
• 7:43
  Speaker 5: we are devolving into a moral cesspit with the political
• 7:47
  Speaker 5: system in our country further and further every day because
• 7:50
  Speaker 5: there doesn't seem to be a bottom, at least in
• 7:52
  Speaker 5: this film, there's seemingly somewhat of a bottom, which again,
• 7:55
  Speaker 5: like to the film's credit, you should never have thought
• 7:58
  Speaker 5: there was a bottom to the people will go to
• 8:01
  Speaker 5: try and secure power, wealth, and you know, influence for themselves.
• 8:06
  Speaker 5: So I enjoyed. I think I enjoyed what the movie
• 8:08
  Speaker 5: was getting at. I'm not sure how much I enjoyed
• 8:11
  Speaker 5: the movie because it was really like narratively disjointed.
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's definitely way too many. Oh yeah, there's way
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: too many characters. I mean, you can definitely tell that
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: this was based on a book. It really reminds me
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: of the film Winter Kills, where it's very labyrinthine as
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: far as the plotting and just how many characters that
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: we have. I think that one pulls things together a
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: little bit better than this one. This reminds me also
• 8:39
  Speaker 3: a lot of Doctor Strangelove, especially some of the quote
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: unquote funny character names. I mean, you've got Bakuano in
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: the first one, and here you've got General Wombat and
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: here it reminded me a little too of like Whoops Apocalypse.
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: As far as just like all of the different side
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: stories that are going on that kind of to the
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: larger story, I think they could have definitely tightened it
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: up quite a bit, like the opening stuff with the
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: kind of television stuff that they're doing when it comes
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: to like the woman who murders her husband or Jennifer
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: jason Lee super young Jennifer Jason Lee poisoning her parents.
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: But it's all done safely and as a way to
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: kind of have a catharsis and enjoy that. And then
• 9:28
  Speaker 3: also for ratings, you know, it's like, oh, hey, we
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: get to see these people's fantasies of murdering their husbands
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: or getting attacking muggers, those types of things. All that
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: could be completely cut. Like when I looked up the
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: AFI Flat synopsis, because the one on Wikipedia was garbage.
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: They don't even talk about that whole opening of this.
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: They just dip right into the Catherine Ross of it.
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: And that was very surprising too, Like so many of
• 9:55
  Speaker 3: these characters are introduced and only get killed like a
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: few minutes later. I'm like, Oh, cool, it's gonna be
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: showing encountering Catherine Ross and they're going to be, you know,
• 10:02
  Speaker 3: doing this adventure together. No, she's dead with him in
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: just a few minutes.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: He's just dead in the first ten minutes.
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, killed by the terrorist Suzi.
• 10:10
  Speaker 1: Yes for me.
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: But but I will say, Chris kind of going back
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: to this whole like you know, going into countries to
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: uh invade for for oil and stuff. I mean, you
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: forget about all the reasons that we have gone to war.
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: I mean, all those weapons of mass destruction that Iraq had, uh,
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: the you know, all the nuclear weapons that Iran was developing,
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: the way that the president of Venezuela was you know,
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: dancing and mocking our president, as well as just unleashing
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: all of those drug boats that were flooding our country
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: of fentanyl. I mean, you forget about these reasons. And
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: I don't see why, because this is you know, this
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: is as good as you know, bringing democracy to these
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: other countries. We have to do that. We have to
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: import democracy into other countries just so that we can
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: make sure that they are running the right way and
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: that we get their all their oil.
• 11:05
  Speaker 5: And see, that's it's the idea of Like I said,
• 11:08
  Speaker 5: there was an ideological movement where it was like, we're
• 11:12
  Speaker 5: going to bring democracy to the communist countries of the world,
• 11:15
  Speaker 5: and they don't know what they have as a system
• 11:17
  Speaker 5: doesn't work, but we what works for us will work.
• 11:20
  Speaker 5: Forevery like apocracy and capitalism, you know, and it's like,
• 11:24
  Speaker 5: you know what it hasn't actually uh, And the people
• 11:28
  Speaker 5: pushing that were the ones who were benefiting, and the
• 11:30
  Speaker 5: people that were pushing it were also the ones who
• 11:33
  Speaker 5: were going to benefit if other countries had democracy. Because again,
• 11:37
  Speaker 5: a democratic country is able to interface with another democratic
• 11:41
  Speaker 5: country a lot more kind of on the same level
• 11:44
  Speaker 5: than a country that's like an autocracy or a meritocracy,
• 11:48
  Speaker 5: a theocracy. They're dictated by different things. And so this
• 11:51
  Speaker 5: is a you know, we're trying to bring democracy to
• 11:53
  Speaker 5: the world, but what we're really trying to bring to
• 11:55
  Speaker 5: the world is capital We're not it's not really democracy,
• 11:59
  Speaker 5: it's democratic capitalism. We're trying to bring the free market
• 12:02
  Speaker 5: quote free market to the world. It's like that's I mean,
• 12:05
  Speaker 5: when you're having people at the table who are going
• 12:08
  Speaker 5: to make money off of it, pushing it, that's what
• 12:10
  Speaker 5: we call a conflict of interest. And I'm I didn't
• 12:14
  Speaker 5: go to law school. I got about as close as
• 12:15
  Speaker 5: you can without going and even I know what a
• 12:17
  Speaker 5: fuck it of interest is. But again, in a post
• 12:20
  Speaker 5: ideological society, if you don't even claim you're doing anything
• 12:23
  Speaker 5: of value, and you're just doing it just because you
• 12:26
  Speaker 5: don't have to justify anything, We're just doing it because
• 12:28
  Speaker 5: there's no auspices of democracy or anything. It's we're going
• 12:32
  Speaker 5: to go into Venezuela, take their oil, and then the
• 12:34
  Speaker 5: next day we're going to divvy it up among the
• 12:36
  Speaker 5: six biggest oil company.
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: Okay, Yeah, it.
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: Feels like with all that oil, it could have actually
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: gone to the American people and thus we wouldn't be
• 12:44
  Speaker 3: paying seven dollars a gallon these days. So I know,
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: I know it's just temporarily until we.
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: Get pay Yeah, four years.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: I mean, I love this whole thing of There have
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: been so many democratically elected leaders that we have just
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: toppled because we don't like them. So yeah, we've got Chile,
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: we've got Iran way back and I can't remember if
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: it was the fifties or sixties, we just toppled that
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: whole thing. It's just because yeah, we can and we will.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: And then we're not even going to talk about Africa
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: and all the shit that CIA was doing down there.
• 13:15
  Speaker 5: Anyway, it's hard to talk about recent things with this
• 13:20
  Speaker 5: because it's.
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, traffic.
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: Well absolutely, and then just some of the interesting parallels
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: that we have that they have these bombs and it's
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: just like, all right, you know these two suitcases filled
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: with nuclear bombs. All right, great, you know we see
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: that and stuff like, you know, some of all fears
• 13:40
  Speaker 3: price of one. Well that I love that they end
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: up being on the fucking World Trade Center at the
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: end of the movie or that word right word here, Well,
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: it's pretty interesting that they're there. And then also the
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: whole idea of one of them was supposed to go
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: to the US and the other one was supposed to
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: go to Jerusalem. It's almost like the movie new that
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: we were going to be, you know, under Jerusalem's thumb
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: in twenty twenty six.
• 14:03
  Speaker 5: Well, and that's I mean again, it's like, you know,
• 14:05
  Speaker 5: watching this movie in nineteen eighty two when it came
• 14:08
  Speaker 5: out must have felt like, oh, well, they're talking about
• 14:11
  Speaker 5: the times now, and maybe if people in the future
• 14:14
  Speaker 5: see it, things will be different. It's honestly shocking how
• 14:17
  Speaker 5: disappointing it is that things haven't changed that much, you know.
• 14:21
  Speaker 5: I mean there's a scene where it's like they locked
• 14:23
  Speaker 5: the gas station attended in the bathroom so that they
• 14:26
  Speaker 5: could just get gas, and it's.
• 14:28
  Speaker 3: Like, oh, I know, that was wild when people were
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: going nuts. And of course I know this is like
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: a few years after the gas crisis, gas crisis, right, yes, but.
• 14:36
  Speaker 5: It's kind of an elevated version of that, but we're
• 14:39
  Speaker 5: we're barreling towards it once again.
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah. And it's fascinating to me too that this
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: is you know, the Iran contra stuff had just started
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: to happen here, and it's like, when this movie is out,
• 14:53
  Speaker 3: it is actively going on. It's like, right, all right, great, yeah,
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: Like and that for a lot of people, well probably
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: even still today, was much to even believe. It's like,
• 15:04
  Speaker 3: what we got in bed with Iran and we're selling
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: them arms, the same arms that are probably being used
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: against us today. Like, yeah, great. Yeah, that's what we do, folks,
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: that's this is how we play the game. You know,
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: Like there's a reason why those hostages weren't released when
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: they were you know, during Carter's administration. There's a reason
• 15:25
  Speaker 3: why the Actober surprise failed. Here we are and uh
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: yeah it was Reagan interfering and all that stuff and
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: making some behind the scenes steals.
• 15:33
  Speaker 5: I want to I want to start at something that
• 15:35
  Speaker 5: we like you mentioned, you know, a couple of minutes
• 15:37
  Speaker 5: ago about the opening of the movie, and I think
• 15:39
  Speaker 5: it's the maybe the thing that the movie is the
• 15:41
  Speaker 5: most prescient about is the de evolution of our media
• 15:45
  Speaker 5: into nothing but just and again, like I would say,
• 15:49
  Speaker 5: Schlock is maybe being flippant but exploitative to the point
• 15:54
  Speaker 5: of transgressive, and not in a progressively transgressive way, in
• 15:59
  Speaker 5: a like just completely dismantling of what one would consider
• 16:05
  Speaker 5: to be serious journalism. Because Patrick Hale, Sean Connery, I
• 16:10
  Speaker 5: think for me one of the best parts of the
• 16:11
  Speaker 5: movie otherwise kind of jumbled movie, kind of isn't given
• 16:15
  Speaker 5: much to do, but but does a really good job
• 16:18
  Speaker 5: at just reacting to the things and playing I think
• 16:22
  Speaker 5: what one would consider to be like through the eyes
• 16:24
  Speaker 5: of the audience. Is Sean Connery's character a little bit.
• 16:28
  Speaker 5: He's not scuzzy enough, like d to like to have
• 16:32
  Speaker 5: a character like this in this movie. If you were
• 16:34
  Speaker 5: doing this now, he'd be like a he'd be like
• 16:37
  Speaker 5: essentially like a on location Tucker Carlson is kind of
• 16:41
  Speaker 5: what they're getting at, or like a Candace Owens type
• 16:44
  Speaker 5: or a Ben Shapiro, Like he's really trying to like
• 16:46
  Speaker 5: ingratiate himself into the like the inner sanctum of the politics,
• 16:51
  Speaker 5: to the point where at the end of the movie
• 16:52
  Speaker 5: he's literally with the president, like communicating with him. So
• 16:56
  Speaker 5: I don't think they pushed him scuzzy enough, like I
• 16:59
  Speaker 5: you know, having seen the Offense last week and seeing
• 17:02
  Speaker 5: how far Connery can push himself as an actor to
• 17:05
  Speaker 5: really play against type, and then to see him here
• 17:08
  Speaker 5: like being given the opportunity to do that again and
• 17:10
  Speaker 5: just I don't know if it's the script. I don't
• 17:12
  Speaker 5: know if it's him just wanting to like pull it back.
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: A little bit.
• 17:16
  Speaker 5: But he is not scummy enough. I mean, this is
• 17:19
  Speaker 5: what I expect is like TMZ levels, which is why
• 17:22
  Speaker 5: he's going to like harassing people outside of things being
• 17:25
  Speaker 5: present on the scene of like big things happening, like
• 17:28
  Speaker 5: he is that, but he doesn't go far enough. And
• 17:31
  Speaker 5: I think it's interesting because in this day and age,
• 17:34
  Speaker 5: like God, I mean there were people live streaming January.
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: Sixth, you know what I mean, like while they were there.
• 17:39
  Speaker 5: It's like, I don't think in eighty two they could
• 17:42
  Speaker 5: have even contemplated how much further we would get with things,
• 17:46
  Speaker 5: because this is what their take on satire is, like,
• 17:49
  Speaker 5: it's not really Breton circuses yet we haven't gotten that far.
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: He really should have been more of a Dick Thornberg
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: from die Hard type of character, like a William Atherton,
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: because he should Yeah, because you like Connery, but you
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: probably shouldn't like the character that he's playing in this wood.
• 18:09
  Speaker 5: Yeah, this is kind of irascable. He's kind of a
• 18:11
  Speaker 5: piece of shit, Like that's the point. He's he's an
• 18:14
  Speaker 5: ambulance chaser in journalism, right.
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: I mean the stuff that they do at the beginning
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: with him joining the Skydivers, like some of the stories
• 18:26
  Speaker 3: that he's on kind of reminds me of like twenty
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: four hour party people in this whole like, oh yeah,
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: I do all of these things for journalism kind of stuff.
• 18:34
  Speaker 3: And you know, I'm a serious journalist, but I get
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: stuck doing all these things. I don't take him seriously
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: as a journalist, like he is doing all of these
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: like stunt stories. I mean, it's funny because it kind
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: of reminds me a little bit of broadcast news, the
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: other Brooks broadcast news. And then also of course there's
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: a lot of network in here. But yeah, I just
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: don't get this whole like if it bleeds it leads
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: type of personality from Connery. It's almost like he's the
• 19:05
  Speaker 3: wrong person in the right place a lot of this
• 19:08
  Speaker 3: movie and just is chasing down the story. But I
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: don't get like I'm doing this because I'm venal, Like
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: I really would feel that from other people, I think,
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: and and like that I think would make this story
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: stronger as it is. Conor is basically he is what
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: he is. He's basically just here as a surrogate for
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: the audience.
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: He's flat in this movie.
• 19:31
  Speaker 3: He's very flat in this movie, Yeah, which is kind
• 19:33
  Speaker 3: of a shame and.
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: Kind of a shame.
• 19:35
  Speaker 5: I mean for me, it's Connery, Like, contrast that with
• 19:38
  Speaker 5: the offense, That's all I'm saying. Contrast that with the
• 19:42
  Speaker 5: Hill or Anderson tapes, Like we're not even a decade
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: removed from some of those. It's shocking how underplaying he's
• 19:49
  Speaker 5: under He's really playing this like really flat, and I
• 19:54
  Speaker 5: don't understand why, unless it's just the source materials flat.
• 19:57
  Speaker 5: But I can't imagine that that's the case. I think
• 20:00
  Speaker 5: maybe it's just would it be hard to see Connory
• 20:02
  Speaker 5: as a straight up villain. I don't know when the
• 20:03
  Speaker 5: offense got away with it, and like it was obviously
• 20:07
  Speaker 5: like one of the best parts of that movie. If
• 20:09
  Speaker 5: you don't know, go listen to the episode that Mike
• 20:10
  Speaker 5: and I did with Spencer Parsons about it. But like,
• 20:13
  Speaker 5: he played that role so well, like this, just give
• 20:16
  Speaker 5: him the reins, let him go, let him go. He's
• 20:20
  Speaker 5: such a great actor. It's honestly, the biggest disappointment for
• 20:23
  Speaker 5: me with this movie is not the plot. It's not
• 20:26
  Speaker 5: the messiness of the story. It's that Connory is just
• 20:29
  Speaker 5: kind of fair.
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: Right right, And it's not that there's not enough of him.
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: He's in so many of these scenes, but yeah, he
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: doesn't seem to be really bringing I mean, like a Spradlin,
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: who we've talked about before on the show. Many times,
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: and especially like you when we talked about The Godfather,
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: you know, talking about the what no fucking zd of
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: at all? You know, like Spradland a great actor and
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: even like a fucking bean Stockwell, like these guys can
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: play scumbacks still well, and like they surround these characters
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: with these great character actors. But it's like, no, no,
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: let these guys go, like, yeah, let Connery have some
• 21:09
  Speaker 3: room to do this. But yeah, he does seem very
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: I don't know if it's him being disinterested or like
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: you said, just the writing just not capturing like that.
• 21:17
  Speaker 3: He needs to be more of a protagonist because he's
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: just being acted upon rather than being an actor of
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: this stuff. And you get more even from like a
• 21:26
  Speaker 3: like a Leslie Nielsen as this other candidate for president. Yes,
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: well I must, I mean.
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: That's Eastern Texas. I mean you seemed.
• 21:37
  Speaker 3: Like it, yeah, very you know. Also I was getting
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: some bush from him too, And then it was funny.
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: There's a moment, and I'm very curious about the history
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: of this film, there's a moment in the trailer that
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: isn't in the movie, and it's where it's Leslie Nielsen
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: up in front of people at like a campaign speech,
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: and he starts talking about gays and lesbians and just
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: how they, you know, our godless creatures, and it's time
• 22:02
  Speaker 3: for the conservative Christians to come out of the closet.
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: And I'm just like, wow, Like what's that?
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: Where is that in the movie.
• 22:09
  Speaker 5: I saw that as well, and I was like, man,
• 22:11
  Speaker 5: the movie's really going to go for it.
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: No, no, no, And then it's so funny with him
• 22:15
  Speaker 3: being a presidential candidate. All I'm thinking of this scary movie,
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: you know, when he when he's reading the book about
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: the goat and the guy comes in that Alonzo Bowden
• 22:26
  Speaker 3: comes in to tell him, you know, that something bad
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: has happened. I'm like, yeah, yeah, I think that's maybe
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: where I was getting the bush of it. Also a little.
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah Victory Harrison Ford on The Wall, Yeah yeah.
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: A little bit of Lloyd Bridges from Hot Shots as well.
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 22:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, It's it's weird because, you know, this is the
• 22:45
  Speaker 5: first time we've seen Leslie Nielsen in anything in a
• 22:47
  Speaker 5: while together. I actually recently saw Leslie Nielsen in Forbidden Planet,
• 22:54
  Speaker 5: which I had never watched before, and I really enjoyed it.
• 22:58
  Speaker 5: But it was weird to see Leslie new Neilsen in
• 23:00
  Speaker 5: like a seeming lyricous non cook. Yeah yeah, looking. I mean, look,
• 23:06
  Speaker 5: let's just be honest here. I know everybody's like Leslie
• 23:08
  Speaker 5: Nielson always looked old. Leslie Nielsen was like a silver
• 23:11
  Speaker 5: fox from like day one, apparently, like when his hair
• 23:14
  Speaker 5: came in, it was like, it's just gonna be gray, buddy.
• 23:17
  Speaker 5: And look, I have a very close friend who I've
• 23:19
  Speaker 5: known since we were in our early twenties, so like
• 23:21
  Speaker 5: a decade plus now, that also has had gray hair
• 23:25
  Speaker 5: most of his life. So like I just always when
• 23:27
  Speaker 5: I see Leslie Nielsen, just like he looks old. But
• 23:29
  Speaker 5: in this movie he's like younger ish. Like it's like
• 23:32
  Speaker 5: this is around creep Show, right, Like we're a couple
• 23:35
  Speaker 5: like a yeah or two around creep show.
• 23:37
  Speaker 3: So creep Show. We're a little bit north of that
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: Colombo episode where he and Patrick what's his name, we're
• 23:44
  Speaker 3: going back and forth the CIA agents, Yeah, what is it.
• 23:47
  Speaker 5: With you and picking things that are like letter letter agency.
• 23:51
  Speaker 5: Like here, I will say that this is better than
• 23:55
  Speaker 5: that Columbot. This is only like twenty minutes longer, so
• 24:00
  Speaker 5: I think that was like a ninety minute Columbo episode.
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: But it does have a made for TV aesthetic, though,
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: like this movie feels cheap.
• 24:09
  Speaker 5: You know, that might be one of the worst knocks
• 24:11
  Speaker 5: at this movie. Like outside of like the you know,
• 24:14
  Speaker 5: the Connery is not given enough to do, Like.
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: Technically the movie is not.
• 24:18
  Speaker 5: It looks like a TV movie and not like in
• 24:20
  Speaker 5: a endearing way because you know, we're in the we're
• 24:24
  Speaker 5: in the time where TV movies can kind of really
• 24:26
  Speaker 5: have some like high quality value.
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the lighting is super flat, like when whenever they
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: go to the White House or the situation room, it's
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: like you see, you know, one main shadow and one
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: slight slight shadow, and you're just like, okay, we've got
• 24:41
  Speaker 3: our key in our pill, all right, you know, like
• 24:43
  Speaker 3: it's just like TV one oh one kind of stuff,
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: and just all the sets feel like if you knock
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: down them, you'd hear a real hollow sound coming back.
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: You know, one.
• 24:52
  Speaker 5: Corner here, one corner here, nothing in between. But we'll
• 24:55
  Speaker 5: shoot the corners and we're fine, like okay, which.
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: Is ironic because we see Connery on a EV set
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: when he's talking to that woman that you know, quote
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: unquote killed her husband, and he just walks by and
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: you see that it's this flat, and I'm like, Okay,
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: are they going for that for the rest of the
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: movie or are we going to pull out at some
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: point and be like this is you know, the whole world.
• 25:14
  Speaker 3: But like, no, like a movie, even like an Americathon
• 25:17
  Speaker 3: or something had more production value than this, which is
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: crazy because it's like, I don't know what the budget
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: was for this movie, but with all of these actors
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: and everything, they deserve better sets and better costumes than
• 25:30
  Speaker 3: they have. And then just the tonal stuff. You know,
• 25:33
  Speaker 3: I mentioned General Wombat. If you're going to put a
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: character in a General Wombat, what are you doing? Like
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: they got away with it in uh, Doctor Strangelove because
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: they had you know, General Ripper, King Kong. You know,
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: like all of these guys with these crazy names. This
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: movie has one guy with one crazy name, and I'm like, Okay,
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: nobody's going to comment that this guy's name is General Wombat.
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: This seems so off.
• 25:58
  Speaker 5: Not only that, but it's also Robert Conrad who's playing it,
• 26:02
  Speaker 5: of all people, right, so it's like he's on screen
• 26:05
  Speaker 5: a lot a lot. Actually, if anything, he's on screen
• 26:07
  Speaker 5: about as much as Connery in a lot of ways,
• 26:10
  Speaker 5: Like he's probably the second main character of the movie,
• 26:14
  Speaker 5: and it is odd to give him so much leash
• 26:17
  Speaker 5: and never point out anything about it or anything like
• 26:22
  Speaker 5: just okay, sure, I don't know, like that feels plucked
• 26:25
  Speaker 5: out of something else and throw it in here just because.
• 26:28
  Speaker 5: And for me, I'm like, you know, that's fine, but
• 26:31
  Speaker 5: you know it's that's of a piece of things and
• 26:34
  Speaker 5: on its own, it kind of sticks out like a
• 26:36
  Speaker 5: sore thumb. It's of a piece in a strange love
• 26:38
  Speaker 5: like here, it's just what's that supposed.
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: To be funny? Like what about that is funny?
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: I just the name, Yeah, I guess so's it's weird
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: too because they so I didn't realize what Rosalind Cash's
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: name was for a while in this movie. And there's
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: a moment where it's like hey, because they keep saying, like,
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: mister president, you need to step down, and so they keep,
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: you know, going back to the Oval Office, and we've
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: got George Bizzard as President Lockwood Forrest Frosty Lockwood, I
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: think his name is right, And at one point he's
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: just like, well, I don't want you know, if he
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: if he steps down, he goes. I don't want a
• 27:18
  Speaker 3: black Ford as president, and so I'm just like, okay,
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: thinking immediately when he says black Ford, I think of
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: the vehicle, you know, a car, and then I go, oh,
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: it's h He's talking about his vice president, and at
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: the time, obviously very sci fi to have a black
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: woman vice president. Yeah, we can never have a black
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: woman's president. Yes, yes, we can never bridge that gap.
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: Will never have a woman president, thank god, because they
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: are so emotional and they just get so bent out
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: of it, out of shape so easily. Oh god, yeah, man, yeah,
• 27:56
  Speaker 3: the men are always much more calm and well out,
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: well reasoned and everything, so thank goodness. Anyway, when he
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: says I don't want to black Ford, then finally I'm like, oh, okay,
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: he's talking about Gerald Ford because Ford took over for
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: Nixon eventually during Watergate. And then I go, no, no, actually,
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: Ford is her last name in this and I'm like,
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: that's a weird thing that they made the vice president
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: missus Ford. And I don't even know if they ever
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: give her a first name. That she's almost always Missus
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: Ford in this film.
• 28:26
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and boy, talk about an actor who's also barely in.
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: The Yeah, she's fantastic whenever she's on.
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: Screen, right, I don't know why she's not on screen more.
• 28:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I would like to know, Like, what is this
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: world like for you when you are the only person
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: of color in this olival office and you've got just
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: like we had before with like Billy Graham and everything. Here,
• 28:48
  Speaker 3: we've got you know, who is it. It's not Homer Hubbard.
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: They've got these whole you know, alliterative names, but there's
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: like another there's just staying Oh, Billy, Bob Harper. I
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: think it might be the Yeah, the Billy Graham of
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: the group, and who's right there in the White House
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: being the spiritual advisor to the President during this whole time, telling.
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: Him, Hey, build yourself a statue. Yeah, a golden statue.
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: A golden statue.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 29:14
  Speaker 3: Again, the satire of this movie just pales in comparison
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: to the world that we're living in now. Yes, yeah,
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: Like if you had done something like that, had done
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: I'm going to build a golden statue and we're going
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: to have a priest, you know, dedicated and everything, they
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: would have last you right out of the theater. And
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: maybe that's why this movie just tanked at the box office.
• 29:38
  Speaker 5: Some close friends and I before twenty twenty four's election,
• 29:42
  Speaker 5: or after just right after, we made a Trump pool
• 29:46
  Speaker 5: where we all threw in like ten to fifteen ideas
• 29:49
  Speaker 5: of things that would happen in his next president, and
• 29:51
  Speaker 5: then we all kind of like, you know, whoever has
• 29:53
  Speaker 5: the most at the end of it wins like a
• 29:55
  Speaker 5: hundred bucks or whatever. Man, we really underestimated the stupidity
• 29:59
  Speaker 5: of the shit that would be happening. And I think
• 30:01
  Speaker 5: it's I think it speaks to like, you know, because
• 30:03
  Speaker 5: I've heard people say this before. It makes me roll
• 30:05
  Speaker 5: my eyes every time I hear it, only because I
• 30:07
  Speaker 5: think it's people that have like never seen any other
• 30:10
  Speaker 5: satirical films and have only seen like the one most
• 30:13
  Speaker 5: well known and popular one right now, which you correct
• 30:15
  Speaker 5: me if I'm wrong here. Idiocrasy I think is like
• 30:18
  Speaker 5: the satire DuJour for like last maybe ten years in
• 30:22
  Speaker 5: terms of like the times we live in now, even
• 30:25
  Speaker 5: idiocracy hasn't gone far enough, like in comparative to what
• 30:29
  Speaker 5: we are living now. So I think to your point,
• 30:32
  Speaker 5: the thing that's maybe most shocking and kind of horrifying
• 30:35
  Speaker 5: to me is the satire thought that it was going
• 30:39
  Speaker 5: really far and pushing the envelope and it's like, you know,
• 30:42
  Speaker 5: the reality of the world forty five or fifty five
• 30:45
  Speaker 5: years from now or whatever the hell it is is
• 30:47
  Speaker 5: going to be so much starker in what it's actually
• 30:51
  Speaker 5: happening than you could ever even begin to approach in
• 30:54
  Speaker 5: a like. It's it's so much we're living in such
• 30:57
  Speaker 5: truly horrifying times that any satirical writer who was able
• 31:01
  Speaker 5: to open up, look into our world, close it and
• 31:04
  Speaker 5: get back to what they're doing would be like, not
• 31:06
  Speaker 5: even sure I could write satire.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: This like on on the nose, Like, well, that's such
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: a calf, Like it's not a golden calf in.
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: That, I don't even think it was part of the
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: project twenty twenty five. Meanwhile, so many other things were
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: just right there in black and white, and nobody wanted
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: to see it or believe it. And it was a
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: playbook for where we're headed and what we've done.
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: I know, that's crazy. Well, check out Bloody Involved.
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: Check out this description of the original source novel. The
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: novel is said in the year two thousand during an
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: election campaign between former President Franklin Mallory that's the Leslie
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: Nielsen character and the current president Bedford Forrest Frosty Lockwood
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: Franklin Mallory wants to be the first president since Grover
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: Cleveland to have two non consecutive terms. During his first term,
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: he had attempted to a hostile takeover of Canada, incarcerated
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: people for having criminal tendencies on psychological tests, and hired
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: hundreds of thousands out of colleged work graduates to work
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: on the spaceship Humanity, which sent a crew to Ganymede.
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: All of these programs were undone by Lockwood. Yeah, first
• 32:13
  Speaker 3: president since Grover Cleveland to have two non consecutive presidencies.
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: All right, Yeah, are.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: You saying this is like few?
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: I'm saying that it's very prophetic.
• 32:28
  Speaker 5: Let's just say Charles McCarry knew what he was doing
• 32:31
  Speaker 5: as a former CIA.
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: Ah.
• 32:34
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 32:34
  Speaker 5: I think the thing for me is like, did this
• 32:36
  Speaker 5: need to be a funny movie? If you were too,
• 32:39
  Speaker 5: isn't funny?
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: Nah?
• 32:39
  Speaker 5: Well that's the thing, Like, I think it's attempting to
• 32:42
  Speaker 5: be humorous, but I don't think it's trying to be funny.
• 32:45
  Speaker 5: I think it's trying to be satirical, but I don't
• 32:47
  Speaker 5: think it's trying to be comedic. But I think The
• 32:49
  Speaker 5: issue is the way the film exists in terms of
• 32:53
  Speaker 5: the structure and the advertising and the poster is as
• 32:57
  Speaker 5: if it's a traditional comedic film, which I think does
• 33:01
  Speaker 5: not help the case for the film being a success
• 33:04
  Speaker 5: at the box, Like these kinds of films never are,
• 33:07
  Speaker 5: and even the ones that are really good to go
• 33:09
  Speaker 5: back to an idiocracy, which, again, idiocracy is good. It
• 33:12
  Speaker 5: didn't predict much of anything that wasn't already obviously already happening.
• 33:16
  Speaker 5: But idiocracy is good. But even idiocracy in terms of
• 33:20
  Speaker 5: like satire isn't really pushing the emblem any more than this.
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: I don't know. I think the Terry Crew's character really
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: I mean that he was a former wrestler and now
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: we're going to have UFC on the front lawn of
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: the White House.
• 33:35
  Speaker 5: To be fair, I think Trump is in the WWE
• 33:37
  Speaker 5: Hall of Fame, true, and he was at WrestleMania in
• 33:40
  Speaker 5: a hair versus hair match against Vince McMahon, also a
• 33:43
  Speaker 5: sex offending piece of shit. So you know, it's like
• 33:47
  Speaker 5: I said, like it's just you can't you can go far,
• 33:50
  Speaker 5: but nothing feels like it's gone far enough, Like it
• 33:53
  Speaker 5: almost feels like satire at this point. Would be to
• 33:56
  Speaker 5: show a world where none of this is happening. And like,
• 33:59
  Speaker 5: just I don't even know, how do you satirize this
• 34:02
  Speaker 5: when this is ready completely out of control?
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: I don't you know.
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: And going back to what you said as first as
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: being a comedy, like maybe it was a comedy in
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: nineteen eighty two, but me watching it, yeah, black comedy, right,
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: but me watching it today, I'm just like I just
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: keep saying, like, oh, that's just like this, Oh, that's
• 34:23
  Speaker 3: just like this. So I'm not smiling, I'm not laughing.
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: I'm just grinning with a rye grin the entire time.
• 34:31
  Speaker 5: In two thousand and eight, they attempted to remake, like
• 34:34
  Speaker 5: a re kind of assess and revive the novel and
• 34:38
  Speaker 5: the film in two thousand and eight, when they were
• 34:40
  Speaker 5: saying it was prophetic in two thousand and eight, right, right,
• 34:44
  Speaker 5: fucking Bozo's in two thousand and eight, and it's prophetic.
• 34:47
  Speaker 5: Just wait about eight years and then you see how
• 34:50
  Speaker 5: truly prophetic it is, you know, because we're living eighteen
• 34:53
  Speaker 5: years past two thousand and eight now, which is just
• 34:56
  Speaker 5: the worst thing I've had to say all day. What
• 34:59
  Speaker 5: is like I want to ask you genuinely because you
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: and I watch a lot of films, and we watch
• 35:04
  Speaker 5: a very large swath of cinema and television. What is
• 35:08
  Speaker 5: good satire in this day and age If everything that
• 35:12
  Speaker 5: we can see in the world is as insane and
• 35:16
  Speaker 5: like tonally against itself and at odds with what is
• 35:19
  Speaker 5: good reality or good just decent human behavior, which again
• 35:24
  Speaker 5: satire always like pushes in, like humans being terrible to
• 35:26
  Speaker 5: each other or doing stupid, you know, overly stupid things
• 35:29
  Speaker 5: like what is satire in twenty twenty six?
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: Even look like that's a really good point. I think
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: you're on the right track when you say, like, let's
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: just make it more of a utopia where it's just like, well,
• 35:39
  Speaker 3: this can't happen. People can't get along to get her,
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: we can't agree on these things. Yes, everyone lives in harmony.
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: Wouldn't that be amazing? You know, it's almost like a
• 35:52
  Speaker 3: if the Stepford Wives are real kind of a thing,
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: you know, Yeah, very pleasant Ville. Yeah, it's like I think, okay,
• 35:58
  Speaker 3: but then you get you know, somebody like uh Toemy
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: Maguire coming in and just fucking everything up.
• 36:03
  Speaker 5: Right, It would be like an inverted Pleasantville in this
• 36:06
  Speaker 5: day It would be you know what it would be.
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: Here's here's what the film is.
• 36:10
  Speaker 5: You have someone from our universe going into that utopian
• 36:14
  Speaker 5: universe and just being like, why would I ever go back?
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: Right? Right?
• 36:17
  Speaker 5: But then it turns out, of course that the Utopia
• 36:19
  Speaker 5: is not actually Utopia, and it's probably run by secret
• 36:23
  Speaker 5: lizard people in human suits or something like you know,
• 36:26
  Speaker 5: like it Yeah, that's how you lean further into it
• 36:30
  Speaker 5: because like, if it's just if the hook is someone
• 36:33
  Speaker 5: from our universe goes to Utopia, there's no satire now,
• 36:35
  Speaker 5: like there's just oh, I'm just never.
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: Gonna go home. Okay.
• 36:39
  Speaker 5: It's like one of those movies where the character goes
• 36:41
  Speaker 5: back in time and they're like I have to go
• 36:42
  Speaker 5: back to the future to figure out how to like
• 36:44
  Speaker 5: things are different, like I'm good here, I'm fine, I'm
• 36:47
  Speaker 5: not gonna.
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: Be And it's movies.
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: It's Homer when he makes the time machine out of
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: the toaster, you know, and he's sitting there at the
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: end and everything seems to be a lot better, even
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: though March and the kids have lizard tongues that pop
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: out of there, like I'm alright with this, even though
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: he left, yeah, left five minutes before the you know,
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: it's starting to rain again and all the doughnuts falling
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: out of the probably one of the best bits of
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: The Simpsons for me. God or just like that ned
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: that ned Flanders Hell escape with the hooks pulling out
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: your mouth so you smile all the time italy ho.
• 37:28
  Speaker 5: See that's the thing, Like satire now just feels comparative
• 37:33
  Speaker 5: to the world we live in. It feels toothless because
• 37:35
  Speaker 5: the things that we live in is just like ugly
• 37:39
  Speaker 5: and gnashing its teeth at all times, and like it
• 37:41
  Speaker 5: there's never when you have the ag former age of
• 37:45
  Speaker 5: our country screaming at you know, an oversight committee about
• 37:49
  Speaker 5: the dow when her job was to go in and
• 37:53
  Speaker 5: do X, Y and Z and instead she's been doing
• 37:55
  Speaker 5: wing ding symbols one, two, and three. It's like, what
• 37:59
  Speaker 5: do I need to satirize? Like what do I need
• 38:01
  Speaker 5: to poke fun at? Like you know, I just I
• 38:05
  Speaker 5: don't know, Like I think the things that I've seen
• 38:06
  Speaker 5: in terms of satire now are like generational satire. There's
• 38:11
  Speaker 5: a book I read a couple of years ago. I
• 38:12
  Speaker 5: forget the title, but it's like all the like the
• 38:14
  Speaker 5: Boomers all need to die is the kind of the
• 38:18
  Speaker 5: point of the story, and it's like, what if in
• 38:20
  Speaker 5: this world all the boomers were like being put to
• 38:22
  Speaker 5: death or something like something to that effect. It's like,
• 38:25
  Speaker 5: how do we satirize it that way? But like, in
• 38:27
  Speaker 5: terms of political satire, I don't think there's a way
• 38:29
  Speaker 5: to do it, not in a way that doesn't just
• 38:31
  Speaker 5: feel kind of like lesser than what we're dealing with now.
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: There are a few things, like I know, there's a
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: book called trad Wife about a social media influence that
• 38:44
  Speaker 3: has a baby, and it's basically like a Rosemary's Baby
• 38:49
  Speaker 3: type of situation. There's also the one where it's the
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: traad wife who gets sent back in time and has
• 38:55
  Speaker 3: to live the same way that she keeps telling me,
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: like raw milk, all those kind of things things, you know.
• 39:01
  Speaker 3: So it's like, so we can we can satirize that way,
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: But again, those things feel from just those descriptions that
• 39:09
  Speaker 3: I just gave well, but they also sounded like Saturday
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: Night Live skits, you know, or maybe maybe a better
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: television program, maybe a better satire a satire program where
• 39:20
  Speaker 3: you know, they actually do have a little bit of
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: a punch, you know, Like I would love to see
• 39:25
  Speaker 3: those like I think the time travel one was actually
• 39:29
  Speaker 3: just picked up by someone and I can't remember who
• 39:31
  Speaker 3: it is, but it's like, all right, like can you
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: make this last longer than five minutes? I don't know.
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: The book I was talking about.
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: Was Day Boomsday.
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: Nice.
• 39:39
  Speaker 5: Nice, And that's and to your point, like I think,
• 39:43
  Speaker 5: you know, cultural societal satire I think still has a
• 39:47
  Speaker 5: place in the world, like the film with Jeffrey Wright
• 39:50
  Speaker 5: that came out a couple of years ago, where he's
• 39:52
  Speaker 5: a black man who writes, oh yeah white like a
• 39:55
  Speaker 5: white name and it becomes supers like you can still
• 39:57
  Speaker 5: do that because I think societal and culture oficials issues
• 40:00
  Speaker 5: still exists. But in terms of politics, a political satire
• 40:05
  Speaker 5: in this day and age, like, good luck making that
• 40:07
  Speaker 5: movie to begin with, because it's gonna age poorly. We
• 40:10
  Speaker 5: saw that with that Twilight where hey, don't you guys
• 40:14
  Speaker 5: get it? The President is a child like right yeah.
• 40:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, which again done way better by Black Mirror, where
• 40:23
  Speaker 3: it's the whole thing of the President is a cartoon character,
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: which kind of even fits better than a child because
• 40:32
  Speaker 3: some of the things that go on you just simply
• 40:34
  Speaker 3: can't believe them.
• 40:35
  Speaker 5: Right, Well, and maybe that's where this maybe satire has
• 40:38
  Speaker 5: gone less into a feature length format and more kind
• 40:43
  Speaker 5: of back to something like a Twilight Zone or a
• 40:46
  Speaker 5: Black Mirror or an anthology show where you can have
• 40:49
  Speaker 5: these kind of shorter story We have this boom, okay,
• 40:53
  Speaker 5: this and then we got this one, and we're kind
• 40:54
  Speaker 5: of telling a whole story. We're trying to get to
• 40:57
  Speaker 5: a point or a parable or something. And that's but
• 41:00
  Speaker 5: even again, to go back to the Twilight Zone example,
• 41:02
  Speaker 5: that that reboot that came out a couple of years ago,
• 41:04
  Speaker 5: like even that was too topical for its own good.
• 41:07
  Speaker 5: And what's funny is going back and looking at the
• 41:10
  Speaker 5: reviews for Wrong Is Right, they don't talk about the
• 41:13
  Speaker 5: topicality of the satire being an issue. That's not really
• 41:17
  Speaker 5: the problem. They just the critical reviews of this film
• 41:20
  Speaker 5: are just like, the movie's kind of a mess, and
• 41:22
  Speaker 5: it's like, but what about the satire? Is the satire
• 41:25
  Speaker 5: going too far? Is it not going far enough? Nobody
• 41:28
  Speaker 5: really comments on because I think the movie's just too
• 41:30
  Speaker 5: much of a kind of in some ways unfocused mess
• 41:34
  Speaker 5: to really have like a message quote unquote, which I
• 41:37
  Speaker 5: think that's the other problem with satires in general is
• 41:40
  Speaker 5: unless you have a focused point you can kind of
• 41:43
  Speaker 5: like look at eight different things and satirize those things.
• 41:45
  Speaker 5: It's like wait a second, like you need to focus,
• 41:48
  Speaker 5: like focus on one thing. Let's focus on one or
• 41:51
  Speaker 5: two things. Can do link those things together, but don't
• 41:53
  Speaker 5: go on like we're gonna go after the Middle Eastern
• 41:56
  Speaker 5: and we're gonna go after the Europeans, and we're gonna
• 41:58
  Speaker 5: go after the President, We're gonna go after American people.
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: It's like, you know, speak one or two things.
• 42:02
  Speaker 5: Because unless you're gonna do all those things really well
• 42:05
  Speaker 5: and you're really talented and really adept at satirizing efficiently
• 42:10
  Speaker 5: and succinctly, the movie's just got to become bloated and directionless.
• 42:15
  Speaker 5: And I think this movie kind of falls into that camp.
• 42:17
  Speaker 5: Like it it has some interesting points, but it's you know,
• 42:20
  Speaker 5: I think of something in terms of satires like more
• 42:22
  Speaker 5: recent that I really like, like Thank You for Smoking.
• 42:25
  Speaker 5: That's a satirical that I think does it in a
• 42:27
  Speaker 5: way that is interesting, that that feels we're going to
• 42:30
  Speaker 5: go for smoking and that world and like pick a
• 42:33
  Speaker 5: couple things and kind of go with them, but don't
• 42:36
  Speaker 5: like tackle everything, tackle everything, and you kind of just
• 42:38
  Speaker 5: you can't do anything.
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: It's like, you know, Jack of all trades master.
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that book I was trying to think I was
• 42:44
  Speaker 3: called Yesteryear and it's in Hathaway just picked up the
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: rights to it. From what I understand, huh yeah, to
• 42:50
  Speaker 3: be in it or just to produce it. I'm not
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: sure she might be a good person to be in it,
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: because I think you can portray that like vacuous Instagram
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: type of thing where it's just like, oh, I'm the
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: best wife ever because I do this and I do that,
• 43:04
  Speaker 3: you know, that whole tread wife influencer thing where it's
• 43:07
  Speaker 3: just like, what the fuck you know? Oh yeah, I
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: must be here for my husband. I mean talk about
• 43:11
  Speaker 3: you know, the Stepford Wives. I mean it's basically like
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: turning yourself into a Stepford wife willing yes, oh yeah, yeah,
• 43:18
  Speaker 3: just disconnect right there.
• 43:20
  Speaker 5: Well, and that's the other thing in this in this
• 43:22
  Speaker 5: movie that we do again, Like I'm glad that the
• 43:24
  Speaker 5: movie does hammer this point home, like these people are
• 43:27
  Speaker 5: doing any of this stuff unwillingly or against their will.
• 43:31
  Speaker 5: All of most, if not all, of the people in
• 43:33
  Speaker 5: this film, other than I mean, let's say, even Sean
• 43:35
  Speaker 5: Connery really have a level of agency too. There's like
• 43:38
  Speaker 5: a level of autonomy, and that's maybe what's kind of
• 43:41
  Speaker 5: part of the issue with this film is because everybody's
• 43:43
  Speaker 5: kind of just doing whatever, and they all have their
• 43:46
  Speaker 5: own machinations, and some of them are like double secret machinations.
• 43:50
  Speaker 5: It's kind of hard to understand what the fuck is
• 43:53
  Speaker 5: from time to time.
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: In this movie. Like it it It.
• 43:55
  Speaker 5: Doesn't hold your hand, but maybe it should have in
• 43:58
  Speaker 5: some ways, like maybe it should have given more of
• 44:00
  Speaker 5: kind of a framing device to what's going on, or
• 44:03
  Speaker 5: more of like a narrative structure, as opposed to let's
• 44:05
  Speaker 5: just follow Sean Connery around as he goes from scene
• 44:08
  Speaker 5: to scene to scene and essentially is a bystander while
• 44:11
  Speaker 5: other people.
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: I kind of wonder had they And this is going
• 44:15
  Speaker 3: to sound weird because I complained earlier about having too
• 44:18
  Speaker 3: many characters in this book, sorry, in this movie, and
• 44:22
  Speaker 3: I almost wonder if having somebody else working with Connery,
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: you know, I talked about Catherine Ross and how that
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: seemed like it was going to be an interesting thing
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: until she gets ganked right off the bat.
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: Maybe having first ten minutes to the goddamn.
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I mean, maybe give him a crusty editor.
• 44:38
  Speaker 3: Give him a Jason Robards from all the presidents and men.
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: Give him I can't remember, yeah, a Vincenzo or I
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: can't remember, Hume Cronin. I think it was from the
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: Parallax view. Like they have these characters and then towards
• 44:55
  Speaker 3: the end they usually either get compromised or killed, where
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: it's just like, Okay, I have the truth. I'm going
• 45:00
  Speaker 3: to publicize the truth. And that's the thing is, like,
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: there's not a like Connery is definitely not a man
• 45:06
  Speaker 3: on a white horse, nor ski even a man on
• 45:08
  Speaker 3: a black horse who eventually learns to put on a
• 45:11
  Speaker 3: white hat. Like he is pretty steady through this whole thing,
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: and I was really hoping for, like, Okay, yeah he
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: is venal, he is a shit heel and stuff at
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: the beginning, but then by watching all of this stuff,
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: his eyes get open to how the world really works,
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: and then he's like, I'm going to tell the world.
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: I'm going to tell everyone what's going on here. And
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: never happens. He's just like I'm here, I'm reporting, and
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: then I'm over here and i'm reporting. I'm over here
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: and I'm reporting. And occasionally we'll cut back to him
• 45:39
  Speaker 3: in the newsroom delivering some of these reports, but for
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: the most part, it's just him wandering around, and like
• 45:45
  Speaker 3: his cameraman that shows up occasionally isn't a character.
• 45:50
  Speaker 5: It's just not characterized at all.
• 45:52
  Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, it's like I don't even know if the
• 45:54
  Speaker 3: guy's got a name, you know, like those two terrorists
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: that I mentioned Susie earlier, which it's just a funny
• 46:00
  Speaker 3: name for me, that you know, the terrorist Susie, But
• 46:04
  Speaker 3: like this kind of reminds me a little bit of
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: like a Marriette Hartley type of person. And I didn't
• 46:09
  Speaker 3: recognize the actress whatsoever, or her contemporary, And I'm trying
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: to remember his name because it's like, hey, like these
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: guys could have been characters as well, and then that
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: would have probably had it a little bit more. When
• 46:24
  Speaker 3: her and these other terrorists are jumping out of as
• 46:28
  Speaker 3: the airplanes or helicopters and they're blowing themselves up. Yeah
• 46:31
  Speaker 3: it's Abu is the other one. So Tony March and
• 46:34
  Speaker 3: Mary Anne Marx, so Abu and Susie, and they're everywhere
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: in this film, but you apparently get any of their motivation.
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: And again, even if they're quiet through the whole time,
• 46:44
  Speaker 3: but you kind of got to feel for them. Then again,
• 46:47
  Speaker 3: me at the end when she gets machine gun and
• 46:51
  Speaker 3: blows up on a parachute at the end of the film,
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: that would have had a little bit more of a
• 46:56
  Speaker 3: punch other than just this kind of like, oh my god,
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: these people are just you know, suicide bombing themselves right
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: here in Washington.
• 47:04
  Speaker 5: I think it would have been more interesting to even
• 47:06
  Speaker 5: have the Catherine Ross character as a secret terrorist throughout
• 47:09
  Speaker 5: the film, or like a secret sympathizer. Like you, you
• 47:13
  Speaker 5: have all these characters and you just don't do much
• 47:15
  Speaker 5: with them, and like you said, you you then have
• 47:18
  Speaker 5: characters that are interacting with Connery or others that aren't
• 47:20
  Speaker 5: giving anything. We haven't talked about the fact John Saxon
• 47:23
  Speaker 5: is in this.
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: Wee yeah, well really real quick. The I think the
• 47:27
  Speaker 3: Robert Weber character is supposed to Harvey is supposed to
• 47:30
  Speaker 3: be that editor character I was talking about, but no,
• 47:34
  Speaker 3: he's barely in this.
• 47:35
  Speaker 5: He just's in it like three or four times, mate, Yeah, right,
• 47:39
  Speaker 5: And it's always opposite Connery, always opposite Connery, which, by
• 47:42
  Speaker 5: the way, like if you're gonna be opposite Connory, you
• 47:43
  Speaker 5: got to bring your a game.
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: I'm not saying he didn't. I just don't think the script.
• 47:47
  Speaker 3: No, no, And ironically, I'm mostly known Robert Webber from
• 47:51
  Speaker 3: his role in Twelve Angry Men.
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: So how you know what this is Sidney Lumett had
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: directed this.
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: Film would have been better if Sidney la Mett had
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: directed this film, though, I mean, Brooks is not a
• 48:05
  Speaker 3: bad director.
• 48:06
  Speaker 5: A lot of great yeah titles to his name. I mean,
• 48:09
  Speaker 5: my god, you already mentioned no. I guess well you
• 48:12
  Speaker 5: mentioned Network, but I mean like there's I mean in
• 48:14
  Speaker 5: cold Blood, I mean, my god, like come on, so
• 48:17
  Speaker 5: I mean just I mean before that, even Blackboard Jungle,
• 48:19
  Speaker 5: all kinds of stuff like it's not it's not director
• 48:22
  Speaker 5: for hire. It kind of feels like it.
• 48:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah. No, this was a passion project from what I understand,
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: But because this was his penultimate film, he only had
• 48:30
  Speaker 3: one more after this, and he wasn't. I'm trying to
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: think of he was that prolific, but I don't think
• 48:36
  Speaker 3: that he was. He made thirty six films over gosh,
• 48:42
  Speaker 3: he goes all the way back to nineteen forty two.
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: Oh sorry, that's a writer. He only directed twenty six
• 48:50
  Speaker 3: films over that entire period of time. Wow.
• 48:53
  Speaker 5: And this was the penultimate film right after he directed
• 48:56
  Speaker 5: Looking for Mister Goodbar My God.
• 48:58
  Speaker 3: Right, which is a fantastic film. I don't know if
• 49:00
  Speaker 3: you've ever had a chance to see that. Yeah, that's
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: a great One's sorry, I kind of look, no, no,
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: I kind of cut you off about John Saxon, and like,
• 49:10
  Speaker 3: I think he's really good in this film, as he
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: always is.
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: I just don't think he's good enough to do no.
• 49:17
  Speaker 5: Like and that's you know again, as someone who you
• 49:20
  Speaker 5: know came to John Saxon, you know, in their mid
• 49:22
  Speaker 5: teens with Nimara and elm Street and then having seen
• 49:25
  Speaker 5: him in subsequent things since, like I always really love
• 49:28
  Speaker 5: him and stuff. It's such a shame to me that
• 49:30
  Speaker 5: this movie has him in it because when his name
• 49:32
  Speaker 5: came up in the credits, it was like, oh, John Saxon,
• 49:34
  Speaker 5: same with Henry Silvill, like.
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, what the hell are we doing here.
• 49:37
  Speaker 5: With these two, like two of the great character act
• 49:40
  Speaker 5: just kind of being given no room to chew the
• 49:43
  Speaker 5: scenery at all, and they normally that's all they do
• 49:47
  Speaker 5: is chew the scenery, like that's their singular job as
• 49:50
  Speaker 5: character act. And here they're just flat, especially Henry Silvia,
• 49:54
  Speaker 5: Like right disappointed by Henry Silva in this movie, probably
• 49:58
  Speaker 5: more than anybody.
• 49:59
  Speaker 3: Absolutely, And I feel like Patrick Hale is not the
• 50:02
  Speaker 3: character's name from the book, and I feel like by
• 50:05
  Speaker 3: calling him Patrick Hale, they are purposefully calling back to
• 50:09
  Speaker 3: the Founding Fathers. Between Patrick Henry and Nathan Hale, it
• 50:12
  Speaker 3: just but at the same time, it's like, all right,
• 50:14
  Speaker 3: he's not and a real American hero and he's not
• 50:19
  Speaker 3: a super female villain either, so it's like, what, yeah,
• 50:22
  Speaker 3: what are we doing here? We just have like a
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: piece of white toast in the middle of this movie.
• 50:26
  Speaker 5: I don't I don't understand, Yeah, I don't. I don't
• 50:29
  Speaker 5: know why they cast Connory in it is maybe the
• 50:32
  Speaker 5: thing that I'm like trying to figure out every every
• 50:35
  Speaker 5: moment he's in the films, like what what was it
• 50:38
  Speaker 5: about Connery and what he brings to a role that
• 50:40
  Speaker 5: they were like, this is the guy for this, Like
• 50:43
  Speaker 5: I see it in Bond, I understood it in the
• 50:45
  Speaker 5: Offence Anderson tapes. I got it as well.
• 50:48
  Speaker 1: Here.
• 50:48
  Speaker 5: I'm like, this could have been any this could have
• 50:51
  Speaker 5: been any actor. I don't think for me, the fact
• 50:54
  Speaker 5: that it's Connory honestly is more disappointing than it is
• 50:57
  Speaker 5: anything else. Like if it had been anybody else, I
• 50:58
  Speaker 5: might not have expected it is much from them, But
• 51:00
  Speaker 5: given that Connery is just such a great actor, I
• 51:04
  Speaker 5: expect so much more of him on screen because it's
• 51:08
  Speaker 5: so weird to have an actor of Connery's level in
• 51:11
  Speaker 5: a movie, and.
• 51:11
  Speaker 3: It's like, I want more business from him, you know.
• 51:14
  Speaker 3: It's like, I like when there's a moment in the
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: film where he meets with Leslie Nielsen, and Nielsen is
• 51:22
  Speaker 3: the one that's got the tape of the it's basically
• 51:26
  Speaker 3: the Middle Eastern guy, the Middle Eastern king his quote
• 51:32
  Speaker 3: unquote suicide note. But it's the original audio from all that.
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: And I love that kind of shit right where it's like,
• 51:40
  Speaker 3: oh yeah, we took this a little bit here in
• 51:42
  Speaker 3: this little bit here, and then we re recorded it
• 51:44
  Speaker 3: and it sounded like he said this other thing instead.
• 51:47
  Speaker 3: I love those types of things, like whether I'm you know,
• 51:50
  Speaker 3: doing podcast editing or whatever, I love that kind of stuff.
• 51:54
  Speaker 3: They cut through this train that they're on, entering into
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: some dark tery and you see Conrie's got the Mallory.
• 52:05
  Speaker 3: The Lessie Nielsen campaign poster because he's campaigning hard against spread,
• 52:11
  Speaker 3: not Spradland's character, but the Lockwood president Lockwood. And he's
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: got the poster and at one point I thought that
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: he's like drawing a mustache on Leslie Nielsen's poster, but
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: they never really show if he is or anything, and
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: it's just like a real brief moment, I was just like,
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: that's the kind of guy that I want. I want
• 52:28
  Speaker 3: a guy. I want Conry's character to be almost a
• 52:32
  Speaker 3: cynical a hole that just doesn't believe any of these people. Like, yeah,
• 52:36
  Speaker 3: he's trying to get to the bottom of this, but
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: at the same time, I want him to be smarter
• 52:41
  Speaker 3: than everybody else, maybe or maybe he thinks he's smarter
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: than everybody else, and he's also making fun of them
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: all the time. Like had he been sitting there doodling
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: on Leslie Nielsen's campaign poster right fucking in front of
• 52:54
  Speaker 3: him and putting like a Hitler stash or a big
• 52:57
  Speaker 3: old black bart stash on, this guy would have been right, man,
• 53:00
  Speaker 3: like give me some of those types of things. Give
• 53:02
  Speaker 3: me just like, like I said, a little business, Do
• 53:05
  Speaker 3: a little business with what you're doing instead of just
• 53:08
  Speaker 3: kind of sitting there with the coffee cup.
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: I would have preferred he yeah.
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, Kolchak could get to the bottom of anything,
• 53:14
  Speaker 3: and yeah, he needed to use subterfuge, lies, whatever it
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: took to get into places to get these stories.
• 53:22
  Speaker 5: Whereas get to this point again exactly dropped into the
• 53:26
  Speaker 5: story and it's like he just has all these connections
• 53:28
  Speaker 5: has He's.
• 53:29
  Speaker 3: So well known. He is like the the Heraldo Rivera
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: of this era.
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 53:34
  Speaker 3: It's like all right, Like he shouldn't be able to
• 53:37
  Speaker 3: walk into these places. The president shouldn't trust this guy.
• 53:41
  Speaker 5: No, I mean, and neither should the audio, right, you know,
• 53:45
  Speaker 5: in my approximation, I think the film that this film
• 53:49
  Speaker 5: could have or was in kind of in a This
• 53:52
  Speaker 5: movie is kind of in a similar vein to and
• 53:54
  Speaker 5: I thought about it when I was watching it with
• 53:56
  Speaker 5: some of the scenes with the Ardie Krueger is Lord
• 53:59
  Speaker 5: of War. Yes, film I have not watched a very
• 54:03
  Speaker 5: long time. I used to watch it a lot. I
• 54:04
  Speaker 5: remember really enjoying that film quite a bit. But man,
• 54:08
  Speaker 5: I was like, this would be better if this was
• 54:11
  Speaker 5: just Lord of War, Like I just want to watch
• 54:12
  Speaker 5: Lord of War instead, like it you know, you have
• 54:14
  Speaker 5: Cage talking directly to the camera. You have him looking
• 54:17
  Speaker 5: at the audience, you know, kind of you judging him,
• 54:20
  Speaker 5: him judging you. Like there's none of that here, Like
• 54:22
  Speaker 5: there's no you looking into the world in the world's
• 54:25
  Speaker 5: looking back at you. And what does it say about
• 54:27
  Speaker 5: one another in this conversation we're having with each other.
• 54:30
  Speaker 5: It's none of that. It may be just one sly
• 54:33
  Speaker 5: wink to the camera for Connery might have done wonders,
• 54:36
  Speaker 5: but even even that would not have been enough. Like
• 54:39
  Speaker 5: I don't know if Connery looking directly at the camera
• 54:41
  Speaker 5: and talking would have helped, but it might have. Just
• 54:43
  Speaker 5: having to address the audience directly could have been interesting
• 54:46
  Speaker 5: to understand his inner psyche and inner monologue would have
• 54:50
  Speaker 5: allowed us to understand, like you said, because if they're
• 54:52
  Speaker 5: not going to show it outward, just have him doing
• 54:54
  Speaker 5: fucking vo Like, I've never seen a film so in
• 54:57
  Speaker 5: need of vo in my entire life than this one.
• 55:01
  Speaker 5: Just imagine how much of most, if not all, the
• 55:03
  Speaker 5: issues we've had with the film could be clarified with
• 55:05
  Speaker 5: some vo You'd have more Connery than you probably could
• 55:08
  Speaker 5: know what to do. You'd get to understand who and
• 55:10
  Speaker 5: why his character is doing what he's doing, and if
• 55:13
  Speaker 5: he's not going to externally react to things for a
• 55:15
  Speaker 5: whole host of reasons, having him reacting to it through
• 55:18
  Speaker 5: vo is just about as good of anough m.
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: Well, even that poster would lead you to believe like
• 55:23
  Speaker 3: welcome to my world kind of thing that he's doing
• 55:26
  Speaker 3: with his arms and like, yeah, him turning to us
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: and talking to us as it was. There was an
• 55:31
  Speaker 3: alternate poster that was set up to look like a
• 55:34
  Speaker 3: James Bond thing where he's holding a movie camera or
• 55:37
  Speaker 3: a news camera like it's a gun. And then the
• 55:40
  Speaker 3: title of this thing over in the UK was The
• 55:42
  Speaker 3: Man with the Deadly Lens, which I don't think is
• 55:45
  Speaker 3: a reference to the way that the pain it gets poisoned. Yeah,
• 55:50
  Speaker 3: with that little film camera that bricks his finger with that.
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: But yeah, it's like all right, this movie reminded me.
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: Speaking of other things that reminded us of it kind
• 56:01
  Speaker 3: of reminded me of Wag the Dog, and I've only
• 56:05
  Speaker 3: seen Wag the Dog one time. I don't think it's
• 56:08
  Speaker 3: very successful. I mean that was my memory of it,
• 56:11
  Speaker 3: that it's not very successful. I remember just sitting in
• 56:14
  Speaker 3: there kind of shaking my head and being like it's
• 56:17
  Speaker 3: it's again kind of like you could take this satire
• 56:20
  Speaker 3: way farther because it was, you know, the whole thing
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: of like, oh, we're gonna put this crying girl on
• 56:25
  Speaker 3: screen and she's gonna listit, all the sympathy and all
• 56:29
  Speaker 3: this kind of stuff, and I'm like, yeah, this is
• 56:31
  Speaker 3: a reference to the whole taking the babies off of
• 56:34
  Speaker 3: the incubators in the Iraq War, Like I am familiar
• 56:37
  Speaker 3: with that, and like, again, like I love him or
• 56:42
  Speaker 3: hate him, but I think Michael Moore could have done
• 56:44
  Speaker 3: a way better job by making that an actual documentary
• 56:47
  Speaker 3: rather than a fiction film, because it just didn't go
• 56:51
  Speaker 3: far enough when it came to those things like the
• 56:53
  Speaker 3: whole like Willie Nelson singing the Old Shoe song and stuff.
• 56:57
  Speaker 3: I'm like, all right, yeah, Like I almost wonder if
• 57:00
  Speaker 3: Kaufman and de Niro had swapped roles if that would
• 57:03
  Speaker 3: have been a better movie. But yeah, that was the
• 57:06
  Speaker 3: one that that I kept coming back to while I
• 57:08
  Speaker 3: was watching this was just like, okay, man, this is
• 57:10
  Speaker 3: a little bit like that Little Little Wag the Dog,
• 57:14
  Speaker 3: Little Winter Kills, Little Strange Love, And then I am
• 57:18
  Speaker 3: such a bad movie viewer. I've only seen Network once,
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: but when I saw it, I was way too young
• 57:23
  Speaker 3: for it. So I really need to go back and
• 57:25
  Speaker 3: try to see that one again. And because I know
• 57:27
  Speaker 3: that was a big, you know, punch in the face
• 57:30
  Speaker 3: to a lot of people in the seventies.
• 57:32
  Speaker 5: I haven't seen Network in a while either. Man, I
• 57:35
  Speaker 5: think I know what Mike white May is going to
• 57:37
  Speaker 5: be next year. My god, Sidney lunet all month long.
• 57:42
  Speaker 5: Oh god, god it you know, it makes me, It
• 57:46
  Speaker 5: makes me really laugh.
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: Like the idea that the satire doesn't go far and
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: what a.
• 57:51
  Speaker 5: Weird phrase, huh, Like he set out to do something
• 57:55
  Speaker 5: and you didn't push it far enough, Like what were
• 57:58
  Speaker 5: you thinking you were achieving? Like, I guess I don't
• 58:00
  Speaker 5: understand if this is what you think satire is. And again,
• 58:04
  Speaker 5: satire is, you know, a funny.
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: Look at the world per the movie poster, which.
• 58:08
  Speaker 5: Boy, those movie posters are misleading to say the least.
• 58:13
  Speaker 5: I also like to point out Connory doesn't even look
• 58:15
  Speaker 5: like that wrong is right poster where he's like has
• 58:17
  Speaker 5: the two women on his legs, Like that's what he
• 58:20
  Speaker 5: looks like at the movie. He's like ten years younger
• 58:22
  Speaker 5: in the movie that he is on that poster he
• 58:24
  Speaker 5: looks like Sean Connery circa Last Crusade. But I think
• 58:28
  Speaker 5: those posters like are again trying to draw something out
• 58:31
  Speaker 5: of this movie that's not really present, which is like,
• 58:35
  Speaker 5: it's kind of this big, bombastic look at things like
• 58:37
  Speaker 5: this mad cap world and Sean Connery is the crooked
• 58:42
  Speaker 5: ring master, like none of that, none of them. That's
• 58:45
  Speaker 5: what it's advertising though, especially the one where he's like
• 58:48
  Speaker 5: hands out like that, like, man, I want to watch
• 58:50
  Speaker 5: that move or advertising not.
• 58:52
  Speaker 3: Well, it's funny because you know, when we talk again
• 58:56
  Speaker 3: for Sean Connery month, we're gonna be talking about the
• 58:59
  Speaker 3: name of the Row. And I was reading about that
• 59:02
  Speaker 3: the other night and it was, oh, Sean Connery was
• 59:04
  Speaker 3: on a real downturn and people didn't want him to
• 59:08
  Speaker 3: take that role of William of Baskerville. They wanted somebody
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: who is way more bankable. And I'm just like, what
• 59:14
  Speaker 3: are you talking about, Like Sean Connery was on the downswing.
• 59:17
  Speaker 3: I don't get that at all. And I'm like, oh, yeah,
• 59:20
  Speaker 3: he did wrong? Is right? Five days well in summer
• 59:23
  Speaker 3: never say Never again sort of the Valiant where he's
• 59:26
  Speaker 3: barely in sort of the Valiant. He did Highlander, which
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: to me is a wonderful film, but that died at
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: the box office and really only gained second life on
• 59:36
  Speaker 3: VHS and cable. It's like, oh, okay, so I think
• 59:39
  Speaker 3: this whole wrong is right thing was really one of
• 59:42
  Speaker 3: the you know, the parts when they're talking about this
• 59:45
  Speaker 3: downturn of his career.
• 59:47
  Speaker 5: I was going to say, this to me, seems like
• 59:49
  Speaker 5: the first step in a downturn, because Man, eighty two,
• 59:53
  Speaker 5: I think is I think because you know eighty one
• 59:55
  Speaker 5: you've got Time Bandits right before that you have Outland,
• 59:58
  Speaker 5: so you know, like he wasn't going into eighty two
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 5: with you know, poor films. But man eighty two on
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 5: just from like eighty two, like you know, it did
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 5: kind of have this weird thing. I guess the perception
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 5: of Connery was a certain thing. And you'll never say
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 5: never again, which just wrong is right? Never say never
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 5: again back to back. I could see being kind of
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 5: a rough eighty two eighty three for mister Connery because
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 5: you know, you mentioned, uh, Robert.
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: Hubbard as the gentleman picked this movie, yeah, or suggested
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 1: this film too.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 5: This movie's not good, and I think Connory being in
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 5: it actually kind of makes it worse for me because
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 5: we have seen The Offense.
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 1: Which Connor is amazing.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 5: We've seen The Anderson Tapes, which I wasn't like that
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 5: movie's the movie was good. I wouldn't say of the
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 5: movies we watched this month it was my favorite or
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 5: the one that I will return to. I think the
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 5: one that I will return to heads and shoulders about
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 5: any of them is The Offense so far. But I
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 5: think this movie goes further down on the list than
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 5: the Anderson Tapes for me this month, because I think
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 5: this movie, for the most part, is kind of just
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 5: it's prescient about things. But you know, even The Simpsons,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 5: the show that we've already referenced, does more by being
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 5: accidentally prescient than this film does being intentionally prescient, intentionally satirical,
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 5: intentionally forward looking, intentionally navel gazing, like The Simpsons has
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 5: more to say, and The Simpsons is a better satire.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 5: And The Simpsons isn't a satire of politics as much
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 5: as it's just a satire of American culture. But even
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 5: it understood how to push the envelope a little bit.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 5: You know, you talked about Sean Connery like just not
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 5: going far enough as a character us not understanding Hienough
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 5: enough as a character. My pick for something like this,
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 5: if you were to go out and watch a movie
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 5: that kind of leans into that more is Night Crawler
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 5: with Jake Jillano, where it's like, oh, yes, seeing the
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 5: kind of person that is doing these kinds of things
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 5: and why they're doing it and what's motivating them, and honestly,
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 5: the person at the center of this is much more
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 5: important than anything else that's going on. This movie puts
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 5: the heart the horse before the.
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 1: Cart, the car before the horse.
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 5: Frankly, like we should have had a film about Connery
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 5: and why he is the way that he is, and
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 5: what's motivating him to do what he's doing, and why
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 5: is he doing it, not this wacky world of things
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 5: happening around him, Like those things can still be going on,
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 5: but he needs to react to it more. He needs
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 5: to have something to say about it. And if he doesn't, why,
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 5: why are what are we trying to achieve by making
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 5: this week? What are what are we trying to say?
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 5: Cause I think to me it seems like the book
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 5: had a clear angle, and I think the movie maybe
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 5: just kind of abandoned it or softened it for the
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 5: palettes of film audiences, which this is the late seventies,
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 5: early eighties.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 1: What are we softening films? What the hell?
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 5: This is the time of not softening film like at all.
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 5: Like we just talked about the offense that film. Is
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 5: nothing soft about that movie at all.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 3: Well, don't forget. I mean was eighty two et. I
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 3: mean that's the year where we saw Et go against
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 3: the thing and ET obviously won and people thought that
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 3: the thing was And it's like, what, like, was that
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 3: too hard for you? You wanted the cute and cuddly alien.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 3: You wanted an alien that Steven Spielberg could make out
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 3: with in the publicity photos. I yeah, Like maybe this
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 3: is you know, the City on the Hill is coming
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 3: forth with Reagan, and we just don't want anything controversial.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 5: Right now, right well, And that's the thing. I mean,
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 5: if this movie actually really pushed an envelope or made
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 5: a wave or did something truly like pushing of the
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 5: envelope in terms of the satire, then there might have
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 5: been a conversation about it. But it seems, again to
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 5: go back to the critical appraisal of film at the time,
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 5: nobody looked at this movie and said, like, ah, this
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 5: is gonna really age well and this will be a
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 5: pression film. Like people were just like, this is kind
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 5: of all over the place, and it doesn't seem to
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 5: have it doesn't seem to know what point it's making.
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 5: And I think that that is still obvious watching the
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 5: film now, like it, you know, to the point we
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 5: made early on, Like it does hit on things that
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 5: are prescient and topical, intentionally or not, but just to effectively.
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 5: Name drop does not do anything other than prove that
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 5: you read the headlines of the news, but maybe don't
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 5: actually read into the paragraphs to understand the complexity of
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 5: the situation that's going on.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: I think the most.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 5: Pressient thing is the idea that they would start a
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 5: war intentionally, the United States will to give themselves a
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 5: reason to start a war by putting the two nuclear
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 5: briefcases on top of the World Trade Center. I think
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 5: is the most satirical thing the movie does, because it's
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 5: like that's, you know, as close to reality as we
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 5: will ever see a movie going with stuff. You know,
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 5: a nation committing terrorism against its own country for reasons
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 5: exterior to go and invade or oil or other things,
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 5: and you know, many people and again I've heard the arguments,
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 5: and I'm not saying right or wrong. I try not
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 5: to dismiss conspiracy theorists out of hand, like the nine
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 5: to eleven conspiracy. Like that's what this movie kind of
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 5: unintentionally is kind of talking about at the end, Like,
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 5: you know, again it doesn't go granular into it, but
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 5: the idea that I country would commit terrorism or fake
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 5: committing terrorism for political or economic gains. This movie has
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 5: taken a stance at the United States is willing to
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 5: do it.
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 1: Which is a pretty dark thing to say.
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 3: Well, you know, remember in the main you know, it's
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 3: we've done it before, there's no stopping us from doing
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 3: it again. One thing I had to laugh at in
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 3: this movie was at the President when he calls his
• 1:05:25
  Speaker 3: dog into the office and his dog jumps up bottom
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 3: and it becomes this whole like Checkers kind of thing,
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 3: and I'm just like thinking, Yeah, the guy we've got
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 3: now has no dog other than Lindsey Graham and just
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 3: doesn't have the temperament. You know that if there was
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 3: a dog in the White House right now, it would
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 3: potentially take attention away from the toddler who needs all
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 3: of the attention.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: I thought there was a dog in the White House.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 1: A lap dog, well, several plenty.
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 3: There's a lot of lap dogs. Yeah, one of them's
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 3: even got his own bourbon.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 1: There's so many lap dogs. It's like a world of
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: lap dog.
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 5: Like just you know, and they all want one minute
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 5: on dear leader's lap congratulations, but only one minute because
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 5: daddy doesn't love you that much.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 3: So yeah, that they referred to him as daddy is
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 3: really sick.
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 1: I don't even refer to my own dad.
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 3: No, No, there's a leather daddy. I'll refer to as daddy.
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 3: But that's a whole different thing.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 5: Leather daddy, I presume, all right, because he says he's
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 5: on leather daddy, I presume it.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 1: You must be daddy.
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 3: I'm trying to think of the stuff from Arrested Development,
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 3: where Tobias is like, what do you get for a
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 3: father that likes leather? You mean like a leather daddy?
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 5: Yes, yes, man, talk about a show that is still
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 5: satirically funny.
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 1: There we go later like there you.
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 3: Go, like you you there's the satire.
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there's the satire.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 5: And not only that, but like I think for me
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 5: and again, I think this is maybe a question I
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 5: posed to you. Political satire is great, but I find
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 5: it to be more interesting when you include political satire
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 5: in something else, and it's not the point inherently, it's
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 5: not the point. Specifically, it's not the entire point is
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 5: not political satire. You can do it well see Wag
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 5: the Dog, but you can also do it poorly see
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 5: wrong is Right? Right?
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 3: Or what was the Man of the Year?
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 1: Oh my got her? Don't look up?
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 1: Oh Jesus Christ. He reminded me of him, like who
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: I hit this shit? Like?
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 5: Good Lord? Like what are they? They're so clever? Everybody's
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 5: so clever. It's like, I mean, I guess.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 3: But I felt like I was taking crazy pills when
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 3: that movie came out, because I'm just like you guys,
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 3: you really think this is funny, and you think, oh yeah,
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 3: I guess you're right, and I think it was just
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 3: what's on Netflix? Nothing else? Okay, we'll watch this. Jesus,
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 3: that was horrible.
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 5: What was the name of that Peter Capald television movie
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 5: that had or it wasn't It was based on a
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 5: television mini series and the movie had his character in it,
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 5: and it was also like James GANDOLFEENI as well and
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 5: he's playing a character from a British TV show that
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 5: he's like, I mean, you've seen the clips of him
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 5: just like cursing at people and calling them terrible names
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 5: in the Loop. In the Loop, that's how you do
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 5: political satire if you're gonna do it and like lean
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 5: into it and then to go further with the film.
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 5: Like it's just I don't know. For me, I'm always
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 5: you know, I'm always more interested if the satire includes politics,
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 5: but is in politics focus like Arrested Developer and knew
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 5: how to do it with Theishmadest stuff and all the
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 5: iron you know, the Iraq War at the time, you know,
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 5: stuff like that's that's how you do that.
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 1: Like this is just I don't know. Somehow this feels
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 1: like low hanging.
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 3: Even in yeah, yeah, I mean I would rather watch
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 3: what was it Scary Movie five? With Les Nielsen as
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 3: the president rather than or was it three?
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 1: It was three? Yeah, I think Scary Movie five. It's no.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 3: The new one six is coming out, which will not
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 3: be satire. It will just be parody because it'll be
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 3: whatever has been in the news or on TV or
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 3: in the movies for the last three months, just depending
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 3: on you know how long it took to shoot this,
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 3: and then we'll just regurgitate everything back to our It'll
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 3: just regrititate everything back into our mouth.
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 1: I hope not.
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 5: But man, those later scary movie films really became their rank.
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 5: I'm invoking our friend Trevor Gumbel, freiberg Seltzer Joints. They
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 5: really kind of started becoming Drek. And you know, I
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 5: don't want to say that this movie is Direk, but
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 5: it definitely doesn't hold itself as a film to be
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 5: the film really that it's advertising itself as, and that
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 5: I think is such a shame because if ILM had
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 5: lived up to that poster, I think we'd be feeling
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 5: like we did with The Offense, where it's like, why
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 5: haven't people been.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: Talking this week? Exactly?
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 5: Yeah, because it's not great, Like that's that's why, Like
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 5: there are sometimes where things are just kind of like,
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 5: you know what. This really reminds me of Man and
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 5: this is gonna is probably gonna even this is probably
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 5: punching down a little bit. It reminds me of Deal
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 5: of the Center. But I think even to Century might
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 5: have been a better movie.
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 3: I can definitely see that, you know, you mentioned Lord
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 3: of War, which Lord of War is like the good
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 3: version of Deal is century. Yeah, I can see that.
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 3: Like this, it's this movie is so frustrating because it
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 3: isn't the movie that we would like it to be.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 3: And I'm not trying to be a dickhead as far
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 3: as like, oh yeah, we're rewriting the movie. We're saying
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 3: it needs to be this, that and the other thing,
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 3: and that's not what this movie is. It just needed
• 1:10:30
  Speaker 3: to be stronger. Like I am tempted to go read
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 3: The Better Angels and read what the original intention was
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 3: again this. I believe that Brooks wrote this with the author,
• 1:10:40
  Speaker 3: so it might be more of the same, but I
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 3: don't know. I'm I really just wish that this had
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 3: been a stronger thing. Like I even I was reading
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 3: reviews where people are like, Okay, I'm trying to watch
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 3: this as the cult movie and to see what the
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 3: appeal is if it was a cult movie, if it
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 3: is one of these movies that nobody caught on too
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 3: in nineteen eighty two, And here I am all these
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 3: years later trying to watch this and you know, kind
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 3: of get that inside track and be the people that
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 3: are just like, well, why is no one talking about this? Well,
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 3: there's a very good reason why people aren't talking about it,
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 3: which is a shame because I wanted it to be.
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 3: I was hoping, like, oh cool, this is gonna be
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 3: one of those secret hidden gems where it's just like,
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 3: how come nobody sees this and sees how smart this
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 3: was and how prescient it was. Well, because it just
• 1:11:25
  Speaker 3: kind of misses the mark time and.
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 5: Again, yeah it you know, I will go, I will
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 5: go one step further. I kind of, yeah, I kind
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 5: of disliked this movie only because if you're going to
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 5: give Sean Connery time and space to do something interesting
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 5: and you don't give him anything to do, you're gonna, like,
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 5: you say, bring the author in to do an adaptation
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 5: of his novel that was clearly successful, and it's not
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 5: going to go anywhere. Like, I don't know, I honestly
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 5: would just rather watch Lord of War. I tend to
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 5: not be that dismissive about things and say like, well,
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 5: I'd rather watch something else, but with a satire it
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 5: being such a like genrecific thing, and you are like,
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 5: this is a satire. Death of Stalin is a satire. Yes,
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 5: it is a very sun one. Yes, I would rather
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 5: watch something like that than this. And that's the problem.
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 5: It's not like I don't have any other options for
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 5: political satire that are in this same realm. It's just
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 5: none of them have Sean Connery in it.
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 1: That's too dad.
• 1:12:18
  Speaker 5: But the one that does isn't very good because it
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 5: just doesn't It doesn't do enough. And you know what,
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 5: if you're gonna make a satire, you kind of gotta
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 5: give yourself some venom. You gotta be a little poisonous,
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 5: you gotta kinda do something with a little ill intent,
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 5: because the best satire has an edge to it, and
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 5: this movie is a dull spork. It is completely toothless.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 5: It is you know, it's like that dog that growls
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 5: at you and then you notice it doesn't have any teeth,
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 5: and you're just like, well, it's like my dog. My
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 5: dog had passed away last year when he would bark
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 5: at people. And then it's like, dude, guy has no teeth,
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 5: Like what is he gonna gummuna death? Like the same thing,
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 5: It's like, what are what are we going to do
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 5: with a film that's trait trying to be a satire
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 5: that doesn't achieve a at a satirical point or message,
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 5: like it's kind of a failure. You know, it's unfortunate,
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 5: and you know, at least it's not like last year's
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 5: films were they're all bad intentionally. At least there's none
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 5: of that. So is this I guess I want to
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 5: end it on this. Is this better or worse than
• 1:13:17
  Speaker 5: Man of the Year in terms of being satire? Oh gosh,
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 5: shevoked it. I wouldn't have thought about it. And technically,
• 1:13:22
  Speaker 5: second time you've invoked it in as many episodes, because
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 5: I think we talked about it at least publicly or
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 5: maybe off recording with Spencer about me.
• 1:13:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I think it was off Mike, but are offline.
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 3: But yeah, I would say this is better than Man
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 3: of the Year. Yeah, because I Man of the Year
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 3: just had that Maudlin feel and this doesn't get Maudlin
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 3: and I really can't take Maudlin.
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 5: So yeah, I'm gonna say Man of the Year edges
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 5: this out only a little bit. And you're gonna laugh
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 5: because I actually, for whatever reason, Robin Williams and Maudlin
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 5: just kind of goes together for me in a really
• 1:13:58
  Speaker 5: weird way. And maybe I'm wrong, Like, you know.
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 1: The film where he goes to hell. What dreams may
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 1: what may come? Yeah, that's like a maudlin.
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 3: Oh see, I like what where what dreams may come?
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 3: I'm thinking of the my wife is dead from Goodwill Hunting?
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 5: You know, talk about being a bad film critic hashtag
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 5: I've never seen Goodwill Hunting? How about them Apple?
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 3: Well, now you've got your thing for I've never seen Month.
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 1: I don't like them Apples.
• 1:14:32
  Speaker 5: Will May of the Year edges this out just a look,
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 5: but the maudliness of Man of the Year, I can
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 5: see it going either direction for the audience, Like, if
• 1:14:43
  Speaker 5: you're not down with that, it's not going to resonate
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 5: with you. But if you like seeing Robin Williams be
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 5: sad and cry, you know, tune in.
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 2: Hi.
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 6: I'm Susan and I'm Sharon and where are the hosts of.
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 3: Eighties tv Ladies.
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 6: Check us out wherever you find your favorite podcasts, and
• 1:15:23
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• 1:15:27
  Speaker 3: At Eighties tv Ladies.
• 1:15:29
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• 1:15:33
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• 1:15:36
  Speaker 3: Eighties tv Ladies is the place to go.
• 1:15:38
  Speaker 5: Please join us.
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 4: Hi.
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 1: This is HP from noise junkies and this.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker 7: Is follom alone from Dark Destinations.
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 3: Please join us as we examine one of the greatest
• 1:15:51
  Speaker 3: sitcoms in television history. Taxi on Night, mister Walters at
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 3: Taxi Podcast.
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 2: Good night, mister Walters, Good evening, and welcome to Knight's Gallery.
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 7: Thank you, Rod, and I want to welcome everyone to
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 7: Midnight Viewing, where once a month we talk all about
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 7: your follow up to the Twilight Zone, Rod Serling's Night Gallery.
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 2: They say it's Rod Sweling's Night Gallery, and it isn't
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: really Rod Duel's Night Gallery.
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 3: It's somebody else's.
• 1:16:20
  Speaker 7: Oh we know, we talk about it a lot. Your
• 1:16:22
  Speaker 7: curators at Midnight Viewing are the Projection Boots, Mike White.
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 2: What can happen to human beings when trust is wiped
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 2: out by suspicion.
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 7: And culture casts?
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 3: Chris Stashure small boy Incased in the Crystal Ball, and
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 3: I'm Father Malone, the kind.
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 2: Of thing that usually infests nightmares.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 7: Join us monthly at Midnight Viewing the Night Gallery Podcast
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 7: at Weirdingwaymedia dot Com.
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 4: Doesn't remotely belong to me.
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 2: I have no proprietary interest in that at all.
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 4: Within these walls, men come to seek God. He has
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 4: come to seek a killer. We found the body horribly
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 4: mutilated under a window which was which was found closed Sabada,
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 4: a man of reason in a world of blind faith.
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 3: Yes, small blood here you mean that he mitted suicide.
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 4: Elementary and a crime there could not be suppressed in
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 4: states he did not write with his times. Don't like
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 4: this place? I find it more stimulating?
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 2: Should we tell him? No, I am most curudicious in
• 1:18:02
  Speaker 2: the library for myself. May I do so?
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 6: No?
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 4: But what if you should learn it of his uncode
• 1:18:08
  Speaker 4: written with lemon juice?
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 5: Hi?
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 4: Who's that your overestimates?
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 1: Tenants?
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 4: This one I graduate did not commit suicide. When he
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 4: is challenged by a man of cruelty and power, the
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 4: hunter becomes the hunting brother.
• 1:18:27
  Speaker 3: I did you twa matter has occurred of the uttermost gravity.
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 4: Thank some one else not chosen to look in the
• 1:18:37
  Speaker 4: wrong direction.
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 3: Several men of God might still.
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 4: Be with us. Our monk to me that that's here,
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 4: and they also will have blackened fingers and black and cown.
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 1: His thing is back, just as brother William for told, Yes.
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 4: I was right.
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 3: He knew, just as I too would have known had
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 3: I been the murderer. You go that way, lock them up.
• 1:19:00
  Speaker 4: One final murder has been playing pasta pasta how we
• 1:19:07
  Speaker 4: get out what's so difficulty? And it's his Sean Connery,
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 4: f Murray Abraham. The Name of the Rose, a story
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 4: of unholy murder.
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 5: All right, So we'll take a break and we will
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 5: play preview for the next culture. That's right, Like Mike
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 5: and I kind of already talked about a little bit
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 5: with the Name of the Rose, we are gonna be
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 5: talking about the Name of the Rose. It was supposed
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 5: to be this episode, but it's not because Richard had
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 5: him was busy. We love Richard. We move things to
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 5: Richard because we love him. That's what we do for
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 5: the people we love. Folks, you should do something for
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 5: the person in your life that you love, like move
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 5: a podcast recording if that's something you can do. So
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 5: we'll be talking about that with Richard. We will have
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 5: an interview that I did with Ilia Baskin so many
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 5: years ago when I covered the film, probably in like
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 5: twenty seventeen. Uh So we'll have that interview. It'll be
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 5: the three of us talking about Sean Connery as a monk.
• 1:20:02
  Speaker 5: So if you're into that, comeback for that until then, Mike,
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 5: where do people find you and the things that you
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 5: work on?
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 3: Well, pretty much everything that I do is available available
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 3: at Weirdowaymedia dot com, with the exception of the show
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 3: that we do with Richard over on our Patreon, which
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 3: is wrapping up pretty soon. That is ranking on bond
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 3: and you can get that through patreon dot com, slash
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 3: Projection booth and patreon dot com slash culturecast. How about you, Chris.
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 5: Well, like you mentioned, we do do a Patreon exclusive
• 1:20:29
  Speaker 5: show which is coming to an end very quickly.
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 1: Actually, I believe we're two and.
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 5: A half weeks removed from the end of the show,
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 5: almost something like that, maybe a month. We will be
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 5: doing another show afterwards. It will be on a normal feed.
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 5: There will be a Patreon exclusive nature to it, which
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 5: is you'll be able to get it a month early
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 5: ad free if you want to get it for free.
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 5: It will be on a normal feed like all the
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 5: other fantastic Weirdingway Media shows that I'm sure you're listening to,
• 1:20:57
  Speaker 5: and if you're not, like Mike said, you know where
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 5: to find them, like rate and review this show over
• 1:21:02
  Speaker 5: on iTunes or Spotify wherever.
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 3: You're getting it.
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 1: Just make it one of those two. It helps us
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 1: out immensely.
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 5: And yeah, come on back for the next episode where
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 5: we're going to talk a little name of the Rose
• 1:21:11
  Speaker 5: with our dear friend, the Monk Richard had them