Latest / Gunther Fehlinger Podcast / Alban Bala: From Breaking Albanian Communism to Building Digital Albania & EU Future

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Alban Bala: From Breaking Albanian Communism to Building Digital Albania & EU Future · Gunther Fehlinger Podcast

0:00
Come to the Gunter Port. I'm so happy to have an
0:02
important guest from Albania here this week, because it's the
0:06
Albanian week and we had the foundation of the Austrian
0:09
Albanian Economic Union. We had the visit of the
0:11
parliament President of Albania here in Austria, and we had also
0:16
the visit of the Austrian Foreign Minister in Albania.
0:19
And now we are getting very real and very serious ahead of the
0:23
National Day of Albania. On the 28th of November to 1912,
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Albania was founded in Flora. And then, of course, every day,
0:32
every year, the 28th of November is the national day of Albania.
0:36
We celebrated it yesterday at the Albanian Embassy, at the
0:39
Diplomatic Academy here in Vienna.
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And that's always a very special day for me because I love
0:44
Albania. And today I'm very honored.
0:47
On a business trip is Alban Bala here in Vienna.
0:50
He's a believer in digital Albania.
0:53
He's now in business, but he has a very interesting story to tell
0:56
about your own pal and your own way of transforming Albania.
1:01
And I'm very happy that you are here this morning with me.
1:04
I'm very happy to be welcoming you at Gunta Gunta Failing a
1:08
podcast. We have now 11,000 subscribers
1:11
on YouTube and we will have more with a famous personality as
1:15
you. And I want to welcome you, Alban
1:18
Bala. Please present yourself and your
1:20
background. Thank you so much Gunta for
1:23
having me and I'm honoured to to being in your podcast.
1:28
Actually. I believe it's very sad when
1:30
people need to celebrate the memory.
1:33
Memory is something you live with.
1:35
You don't celebrate and we have lost the memory, therefore we go
1:40
back to celebrate it. But you should celebrate it.
1:43
Because normally not look the the idea of celebration is has
1:48
to do with achievements and we have to mark them first and then
1:52
celebrate them after so we. Are.
1:56
Let's let's take these steps 1 by 1.
1:58
I mean what I wanted to say is that yes, Albania, I mean had
2:03
its Independence Day thanks to the fact that Austrians
2:09
recognised its independence on that day.
2:12
So basically is. It forgotten in Albania.
2:16
Very few Albanians know about that as we talk and
2:20
unfortunately I believe in this regard, a new cultural diplomacy
2:25
is is required to be in place in order to promote.
2:30
The spirit of 1912 must be promoted.
2:32
Again, I don't believe it's about the spirit of 1912 and I
2:35
don't think the Austrian did it for the sake of 1912 event.
2:39
They did it for the sake of a much longer and much deep rooted
2:44
in history in terms of connection.
2:47
Albanians have only one science. They have let me just let me
2:50
just carry on. I mean, if you cut me with
2:53
questions, basically, I'm I'm losing the the momentum.
2:58
We have one science where we have been excelling and this is
3:01
albinology. Albinology would not have
3:04
existed without the University of Graz or our scholars
3:08
basically were shaped, formed and actually educated in
3:12
Austria. We may never forget that.
3:15
We would never know that well about our past if it were not
3:20
for the excellent, and I mean the most brilliant Austrian
3:26
minds. And I think somehow Albania
3:29
represented to the Germanic kind of body of culture, not only
3:36
thousands years ahead, history of the Aryan race and a presence
3:41
on a continent that belonged to this proud tribe of people, but
3:47
also something more deeper than that.
3:50
Albanians were, let's say, the first ancestors who
3:54
Christianized. And to some extent, in terms of
3:58
civilizations, Albanians were Christianized even before Romans
4:03
did so. So because Saint Paul, St.
4:08
Paul stopped in, in Hillary, I mean in the Illyrian endurance
4:13
actually, before he travelled further down to Italy and moved
4:19
to, to Sicily before then walking up and, and reaching,
4:24
let's say, the rest of the Roman Empire.
4:26
But the the story is that somehow we have been preceding
4:31
the history of the continent as a small nation as we are.
4:35
Unfortunately, we have not been kind of reviewed in much in the
4:38
history. So we got to be well balanced
4:42
between what we may be proud of and what has been our failures
4:46
in order to also understand where are we heading to.
4:50
So in. This European civilization.
4:54
So is Europe as European civilization is a good question
4:58
to pose now, because I'm afraid we are far from any, any kind of
5:04
possibility to any further define European civilisation.
5:08
We are talking about gender agendas.
5:10
We're not talking about European civilisation anymore.
5:13
You're talking about something that dates back in the, in the
5:17
theory of doubt dates back with, I mean the masters of the
5:23
Christian Church, I mean Thomas Aquinas.
5:27
That basically raised the question and said the doubt is
5:30
the foundation of knowledge, right?
5:33
Something that built up. But it was not about agnosticism
5:38
that he was talking about. He was talking about doubt as a
5:42
rational approach to build knowledge in order to use his
5:46
knowledge and hail God. We have lost this.
5:51
We now discuss about even uncertainties in terms of who we
5:55
are, for crying out loud. And therefore I'm saying if we
6:00
are talking about an identity, we got to be really serious.
6:03
And really I mean much deeper than a simple definition of
6:07
flags or political projects that are however very recent.
6:12
If we go back to the establishment of European Union,
6:17
which was a beautiful, maybe the most graceful concept applied
6:22
since the unification of the, the, the, the, let's say the,
6:27
the Pope. You know that in 1350, Europe
6:32
had three popes and they got to have one in order to unify, in
6:37
order to basically regain control and concept on a
6:41
territory that belonged to them. And I do believe that somehow
6:46
bringing back a unified project was aiming.
6:51
And we have to really bow and and, and, and, and be thankful
6:57
to the incredible, I mean, a product of the Christian
7:01
Democrats that have brought to Europe really the light, the
7:05
missing light of a philosophy that was not just how do we
7:10
spread taxes after we collect them?
7:13
It's not about that. Politics is not about that.
7:15
It's how to build a human being to the hate of a virtue, to make
7:20
people love the life by paying the due respect to their nation
7:25
and country and by belonging to a reality that is not just
7:30
terrestrial, that of that goes beyond this.
7:34
That has, of course, a transcendental belonging,
7:38
something that you no longer listen to the European
7:42
narrative. And this is what I believe is
7:47
the most important thing that somehow even countries coming
7:51
from the margins of a territorial, territorial reality
7:57
like Albania can bring in through the wisdom of survival.
8:04
Because of normally the wisdom of survival is what has been
8:08
serving well certain civilizations, turning them into
8:13
everlasting empires of knowledge of, of let's say, of upbringing,
8:23
let's say a new level of awareness.
8:26
If you talk about resilience, I believe behind the survival of
8:31
the Japanese Empire is exactly the the the philosophy of
8:35
resilience. Let me ask you a question.
8:37
Now, OK, sorry, of course. That's the idea of a
8:40
broadcaster. Of course.
8:41
Sorry. Yeah.
8:42
And now you have to disclose a little bit your secrets.
8:44
You're one of the founders of the Democratic Party, of the
8:47
centre right wing, Party of Albania.
8:49
Directly after the transition, you had the wisdom with your
8:52
friends to form a centre right wing, a Christian Democratic
8:55
Party. Tell me about it, how that was.
8:58
How was the transition when you were instrumented as a young
9:01
student to end communism in your native Albania?
9:06
Tell us about this dangerous and courageous activities of yours
9:09
in the year 1990. OK, when you're part of a crowd,
9:13
nothing is dangerous and nothing is so courageous.
9:16
You're part of a crowd, so the Spirit is a massive and
9:21
collective spirit. Therefore, I don't believe
9:25
anybody had the wisdom more than the, let's say, the hunger for
9:32
freedom. We were thirsty for freedom.
9:36
And in the, in the, in the effort to somehow build a new
9:40
level of freedom, we basically moved together and parties
9:46
joined each other. Albanians.
9:48
Actually, funny enough, two or more decades after the fall of
9:52
communism, I realized that Albanians had nothing against
9:56
communism. They simply were tired of being
9:59
poor. And at the moment you face them
10:03
with cows instead of the forced order of communism, they
10:09
basically would more happily choose the order, be it even
10:14
imposed, be it even, you know, dictator driven kind of, you
10:19
know, older rather than the chaos of development that you
10:22
cannot predict, that actually loses the chances of
10:26
predictability. That is one of the precious
10:29
values of life. And somehow I do believe that in
10:33
these countries, the lack of a structured development and the
10:39
lack of a political guidance, proper political guidance has
10:43
really harmed a lot the tissue of the development.
10:46
Because people to some extent are still perplexed between
10:51
dictate. They don't see dictators and
10:53
dictatorship as a massive bad thing.
10:58
They see it, they see it actually as a historic wound.
11:03
And historic wounds, if they are not, I mean they they do not
11:07
kind of a filter, they are not filtered through a self critical
11:11
approach. They risk to repeat themselves
11:14
and, I believe, human history. Explain a little bit our
11:17
listeners the history of Albania, because not everybody
11:21
knows the situation. You were part of the hunger
11:23
strike. Before, yes, of course I was.
11:25
And yeah, this was a 72 hours, let's say, of a hunger strike
11:30
that brought the entire population of Albania to a
11:34
general, let's say. I mean, kind of protest.
11:39
We're talking 1999. This is December 1999.
11:42
The, the, the hunger strike took place in February to 1991.
11:48
The foundation of the Democratic Party dates back in December
11:53
1990. The The thing is that the
11:58
Democratic Party was founded by so we basically were down with
12:02
communism, but Long live the communists.
12:06
So in this funny, funny kind of approach, actually Albania
12:10
developed. This basically was taken down
12:15
only in February 2021 at the end of the hunger strike.
12:20
This marked this marked marked yes, the hunger strike of
12:24
students. I mean was aiming to was the
12:27
first real attack to the image of the dictator to remove the
12:32
name of the dictator from the University of Tirana.
12:36
Were you there when this monument was?
12:38
No, the the removal of the monument basically took place at
12:41
the square. We were inside a closed area
12:44
where a hunger strike was taking place.
12:46
So and that was even surrounded by police.
12:49
There were thousands of of Secret Service, you know, around
12:53
and stuff. We are surrounded by by tanks
12:56
and stuff, yes. It was a dangerous Were you
12:57
afraid for your life? When you're 2020, 20 years old,
13:03
you're not afraid of your life. You start.
13:05
I mean, and this is the problem now, because normally what
13:09
dictatorships do or what kind of, you know, our authoritarian
13:13
leaders do they remove the, the youth out of their, you know,
13:18
countries and let them go because old people never would
13:23
enact a revolution. So, and in this framework,
13:27
actually what Ramiz Aliyah did, he allowed in July of 1990, he
13:33
allowed, I mean, a good number of opponents to jump into the
13:38
on, onto up the fences of the embassies and run away from the
13:43
country. So they, they, they fled the
13:45
country somehow legally, you know, and this was the first
13:49
wave of immigrants leaving Albania, all political
13:53
immigrants. There were thousands of people
13:55
at the embassy compounds. Yes, they were so normally
14:00
following this, following this process.
14:02
I mean they also created room for others to leave Albania.
14:07
And this happened after March, in March 1991, before the 1st, I
14:12
mean, democratic elections kind of took place and still the
14:16
communists warned them because on an infrastructure basis and
14:20
the fear of the population, etcetera.
14:22
So there were a few reasons to have Democrats come into power
14:27
in March 1992. But unfortunately, I mean, the
14:33
opponents of communism never came to power.
14:35
I mean, so basically I believe we have been nourishing the
14:39
dream. We have been we have been
14:41
nourishing the dream so of of fighting communism, but we did
14:46
it are providing an alibi to the communism.
14:51
So basically we remove the communist from the power in
14:55
order to have them keep the power and they privatized most
15:00
of the Albanian economy. They took control of all the
15:03
resources, the Communists, the communists, yes, all, I mean the
15:09
prolongations of the central, let me let me put it
15:13
differently, almost in all commodities.
15:15
You go back today and at the end of the chain you will find a
15:19
family linked to the Politburo of 1990.
15:24
So they were all connected economically with the future of
15:28
Albania. Exactly.
15:30
And somehow the future of Albania, I mean, is an economic
15:33
the future of any country is an is an economic, I mean kind of
15:37
picture. And in this framework, I can't
15:39
believe Albania has been suffering a very long transition
15:42
due to the fact that communism was never removed from power.
15:48
Even the law on properties that the 75 O1 the.
15:53
Famous law that this, great that.
15:56
Actually it was a law brought to the parliament from the
15:59
government of Ramen Zaliya, the last communist that for
16:04
populistic reasons in order not to be hated or counter attacked
16:11
by at that time majority of population.
16:15
I mean the peasants. I mean Sali Barisha decided to
16:18
vote. He did actually an act of
16:21
opportunism. I mean, it was an opportunistic
16:24
choice that somehow killed the future of the country because it
16:29
killed one of the pillars of the development of the country.
16:31
And nowadays we do have even a, a law on strategic investments
16:36
that allows the government to rob any property and have owners
16:41
paid as much as the government wants at this very moment, you
16:45
know, which is actually a, a, a very harmful anti European law
16:50
attitude. I mean, hailed by European
16:53
investors now, how funny is this?
16:57
And therefore, I'm saying if we want to talk about, I mean, the
17:01
preparedness of a country to join the European Union,
17:05
etcetera. I'm glad to see Albania
17:07
endorsing very fast. I mean, all our key community
17:11
are like 70% of it has already been in a way endorsed in the
17:14
country. The problem is bringing some
17:18
laws from the paper to reality. This is the challenge.
17:24
Do you think the present government of Albania is doing
17:26
enough to bring Albania into the European Union fast enough?
17:29
I believe the interest to bring Albania to the European Union is
17:33
more European than Albania. If you.
17:41
The adoption of Euro basically will impoverish Albania.
17:44
At the same time, Albanians are under a strong stress as we
17:48
talk. I mean, the, the Albanians, due
17:51
to the fact that there is a lot of, of, of European currency, I
17:57
mean, entering the country. So the European currency has
18:00
been devolved somehow. I mean, in the Albanian
18:05
environment and this, this has created, no, this has created
18:09
now, I mean, it's kind of pressure.
18:12
So let's say you have to buy the the labour in Albania or the the
18:18
raw materials, you have to buy them in Albanian currency.
18:22
And when you export them, you sell them in euro.
18:25
And euro is weaker and weaker because there is more and more
18:28
euro entering the country from one side due to 10 million plus
18:33
tourists tourists a year. But not only there is a lot,
18:37
there is a lot. 10 billion is historic figure for.
18:42
Albania tourism, it is indeed a historic figure.
18:45
It is indeed very important. I believe countries need to
18:48
somehow balance a bit better. Also the environmental impact
18:52
produced by certain waves of tourism and and turn it it's
18:56
sustainable is a challenge. Albanian tourism is not yet
18:59
sustainable. Albanian tourism to some extent
19:03
is a massive appeal that will lead to a lot of disappointment.
19:10
So if we were to have a 10 to 12 years kind of high profile in
19:15
terms of attraction, we risk to reduce it by 50% if we mismanage
19:20
it as we have been doing it so far.
19:22
You mean the quality of services?
19:24
It's not just the quality of services, it's the overall way,
19:28
how the country in a way is capable to absorb, serve and
19:33
accompany in an Albania that based on numbers,
19:37
demographically speaking, Albanian Albania should be
19:39
having like 4.5 million people and they they are, they appear
19:43
in their registers, but like 1/3 of them already leave since
19:48
decades now in Western Europe as much as in the United States.
19:55
And they're very. Successful.
19:57
That's another pair of shoes. Normally you'd have like 2.8 to
20:02
3,000,000 Albanians living in Albania, but they are not
20:06
because a lot of Albanians are travelling regularly, coming
20:12
over, working few months here and there, making seasonal work,
20:16
you know, a bit in Europe etcetera, in order to earn some,
20:19
some some money. And, and due to this, basically
20:23
Albania's market has been reduced in roughly maybe 1.8
20:28
million all together. You mean permanently people,
20:32
people that yes, exactly. Now out of these 2 million
20:37
people, roughly 700,000 are people that have retired.
20:43
So therefore I'm saying and you can, you got to consider also
20:47
youngsters and children and stuff.
20:49
So basically the working force be reduced.
20:51
I mean the entire systems including the pension system
20:55
etcetera are now in a very strong pressure, you know, and
20:59
somehow the government needs to adopt to new solutions, you
21:06
know, and I believe a lot more needs to be done in turn in
21:11
terms to make Albania sustainable.
21:15
And unfortunately, we don't have a very reliable political
21:20
proposal by any party that relates to the economic future
21:26
and sustainability, I mean, of the development of the country
21:29
by either party. We have committed parties to
21:34
gain power and we have seen, I mean, a strong competition on
21:39
how to mismanage resources by all parties in almost 30
21:44
something years now. So in this framework, I would
21:48
say that yes, Albania is a rich country, is the 6th richest
21:51
country when it comes to waters. Albania is a beautiful it, it,
21:57
it, it has a beautiful, I mean kind of profile both in terms of
22:02
climate as much as heuristically speaking is very attractive.
22:07
Albania has a number of niche sectors that can promise very
22:12
well and I believe organic farming can be one of these as
22:16
much as I believe that it is another sector that really
22:20
promises well because being such a climate friendly with 300 days
22:23
of sun, etcetera, Albania would be a beautiful place for people
22:27
serving remotely their mandates, you know, so they'd be living in
22:31
Albania while working, you know, and this would bring, let's say,
22:35
a higher consumption in terms of capacity, you know, power, power
22:39
purchase capacity, as much as I do believe that we do have, I
22:44
mean, a very rich profile in terms of minerals.
22:47
So we used to be during most of the second, second, I mean
22:53
second-half of 20th century the we were the second exporter of
22:59
Chrome chromium ore from Albania after Russians in a per capita
23:03
basis and Albania still has a large even DCM de Comitalo
23:09
Vienna was there, I mean making. Made investor investing in yes.
23:15
That they they held it now Turks have have replaced them you
23:19
know, and maybe we might discuss a bit about the the fact that I
23:26
mean there is quite some room for Austrian I mean investments
23:31
you. Were yesterday at the conference
23:33
here in the Austrian Parliament. What's your call for the
23:36
Austrian investors community? What is opportunity?
23:38
It's not, it's not about calls. I do believe that there is there
23:42
is one thing joint visions which are built on historic ties, on
23:48
traditional kind of industries as much as in terms of by
23:53
instance you do have maybe the most amazing industries.
23:58
OMV was in Albania. They had a concession, they
24:01
dropped it because they were given an area of little
24:04
interest. Knows the Chinese are using it
24:06
as we talk and now they are under scrutiny for a scandal
24:10
that has been robbing the country for billion dollars.
24:13
Yes, OK, Yeah. But this is the point when you
24:17
choose improper companies to do certain things you may not
24:22
expect, you know, other than especially in a country with
24:25
endemic kind of corruption like Albania.
24:29
Therefore, you'd be happy to see a company like OMV, you know,
24:33
benefiting this thing instead of having, let's say, anyone else,
24:38
The previous ones who developed, let's say Bankers Petroleum that
24:42
was later on acquired by a Chinese group, they were
24:47
Canadians, Canadians, the investors were Canadians, you
24:51
know. So in this framework, I do think
24:54
that yes, Albania is still rich in Chrome, in nickel, in a
24:57
number of heavy metals. So we do have in the northern
25:02
Albania, I mean, some very precious resources.
25:06
We got a manganite, we got, we got quite a few, quite a few
25:12
very important kind of resources that can produce quite well,
25:16
especially if we are talking then about certain marbles and
25:20
certain, you know, veins of of stones.
25:23
We have an incredibly rich kind of potential for the hydraulic
25:32
cement, which is pressures, especially in construction, that
25:38
relate with ports, sports facilities, waters, rivers and
25:41
stuff. You know, and I believe with the
25:44
climate change and these challenges faced today in many
25:48
towns, certain constructions have got to be resilient in
25:52
terms of water kind of attacks. I mean, be it floods or
25:56
whatever, would benefit a lot from this.
26:00
And I think there's been a German interest actually in this
26:03
direction early on. I mean, that was pushed back by
26:07
the corruption and corruptive pressures of the Albanian
26:10
government. We're talking 2003 here.
26:12
So and and therefore I believe that yes, we do promise well in
26:19
terms of growth capacity. We do promise well in terms of
26:24
raw materials. We have increasingly well
26:29
educated, I mean working force that is very easily adoptable to
26:37
join your market here. But you rather hire them in
26:41
Albania. Paying them fairly because of
26:45
the cost of living in Albania is still lower paying them fairly.
26:48
So you still would be saving, but at the same time they will
26:52
be happy because they would, would they would not need to
26:54
change the environment of living.
26:57
And in this framework, I think there is a lot of win win to be
27:01
built out of a vision where not benefits against investment
27:07
prevail, but parties exchange. I mean, a very clear picture on
27:13
their interest and somehow built together rather than, you know,
27:19
in a way steal together. The, the ideology behind the,
27:25
the foreign investment, I mean in invitations has been on the
27:29
concept of come over and let's steal together.
27:33
This is not the way how you develop a country.
27:35
This is not the way how you develop an industry.
27:37
And therefore you may have thousands, thousands by
27:42
thousands, I mean a dozen of thousands of Italian companies,
27:45
but none of them is more than ASME.
27:50
Why? Because they are not there to
27:54
make business. They are there to take whatever
27:56
they can. So this is the vision.
27:59
Let's improve this overall picture.
28:02
So words are most I mean I I would also bring it back on a
28:09
historic point of view. I don't believe any other
28:12
country apart from the Russians, thanks to the communist pass to
28:16
the country, no Albanian, Albanian territories and the
28:19
Balkan territories in terms of resources been better than the
28:22
Austrians do. Thanks to a history that I
28:25
remember myself back in 1995, I've had had the luxury to have
28:30
a, a dinner with Otto from Habsburg, a highly
28:35
distinguished, highly distinguished personality whom
28:38
I, I, I was lucky to meet at Gilead Hotel in in Budapest.
28:44
And he was, and I believe a lot better things, I mean quite a
28:50
few things would have been worked out better if Austria's
28:55
philosophy and the Habsburg concept to arrange in the
29:03
Balkans, I mean, would have been implemented including Macedonia,
29:08
including solutions. By instance, I did not know that
29:12
Autofrom Habsburg has been behind the the concept and his
29:15
his institute, his sponsored institute has been behind the
29:19
concept. To have Macedonia created a
29:21
country like Switzerland with four cantoons, you know that in
29:26
a revolving way it's been quite amazing.
29:29
We all appreciate Otto von Habsuk.
29:30
He's a great personality. Let me ask you about your
29:34
situation in 92. You entered politics after that
29:38
run and. No, I never did.
29:39
I never did. I had to leave Albania because
29:41
they tried to kill me. I left Albania.
29:44
I I've been. Yes.
29:45
Yes. I, I, I suffered.
29:47
I said exactly. Hit by car.
29:49
I had them behind yes. So I I just.
29:52
Left a hitch a kill job on you? The Secret Service, Secret
29:58
police. Secret police, yes.
30:00
So, yeah, there, there, there were friends of mine who
30:03
basically died, who were killed. Yeah, there were.
30:06
Because. Of the.
30:07
Because of the involvement in the, in the political activities
30:10
and yeah, political role. And I was coming from a town
30:15
like leisure. There was a small town.
30:17
So I was a bit more perceived, you know, so they, they wanted
30:22
to also show to the regime that they were braver than the
30:26
others, you know, to killing these political opponents, you
30:30
know, however you escape to I, I left to Italy.
30:33
I've been living in Italy for about 11 months.
30:36
And then I under the seats of a train, I enter Germany and I've
30:40
been sitting in Germany in in Lanka's Ginsburg.
30:44
That's why you speak Italian and German actually quite well.
30:48
So, yeah, and, and I've been living in Germany for about
30:52
quite a good period, actually for about a year and a half.
30:55
My last employment was with the Mark Vansen.
31:00
So Metalvierka, I was ACNC operator.
31:05
And however, I, I left Germany after I understood that I could
31:08
not make any further with my studies.
31:10
I I used to study medicine at the time and by instance
31:14
Bergisha was one of my professors.
31:17
He was a university professor. A university at the medicine,
31:20
yes, So and therefore I, I moved from, I mean I moved from from
31:30
Germany then back after I found out that I had not economic
31:35
resources to make further with my studies.
31:38
I returned to Albania, completed my studies and I've been working
31:41
shortly at the Albanian Parliament for about a year.
31:45
I've been serving a couple of electoral campaigns.
31:48
I mean, I've studied PR and PR and yeah, strategic
31:52
communications. For the Democratic Party.
31:54
I served Democratic Party back back in 1996 into yeah, and then
31:59
I moved to media. I've been serving my last five
32:02
years. Election which was contentious
32:04
and then led to the pyramid scheme collapsing and the.
32:08
Yeah, I I remember, I remember the period quite well actually.
32:13
Yes, there has been some interest behind it.
32:16
And what I can tell now from the distance that, yeah, the the
32:21
leaders of the Democratic Party were not happy to see parties
32:26
disclose the truth. So by instance, I remember a
32:32
former governor of the Albanian National Bank who was in a in a
32:38
visited IMF, you know, at the time and he basically disclosed
32:43
to Voice of America in their studios in Washington about the
32:47
risk of them. And I remember fighting back, of
32:51
immediate fighting back on this truth actually told by someone
32:57
knowledgeable that you cannot say these things before the
33:01
elections. So the populist policy
33:07
prevailed, I mean, on responsible action.
33:11
And I believe the Democrats paid for that, you know?
33:15
So the responsible action would have been to control the
33:17
financial investment schemes. And the control in the financial
33:20
schemes I believe was part of the privatization models
33:24
generated and a lot of money laundering activity was taking
33:29
place at the time. The money laundering was
33:32
necessitated in from 2 directions.
33:35
First were certain foreign secret services, I mean that
33:40
moved money through Albania using these schemes, you know,
33:43
to generate money and provide let's say something like legal
33:47
way of earning. And second was actually the
33:52
money that had been produced out of the contraband that took
33:56
place in Albania in 1995 during the war.
34:00
In Yugoslavia. In for me Yugoslavia.
34:02
So Albania was one of the vectors into.
34:05
Yugoslavia Albanians were partially involved in in the in
34:10
the contraband, especially of of patrols, you know.
34:14
Cigarettes, bananas, petrol. Not necessarily, but petrol was
34:18
the the most wanted thing so and you had you had quite some some
34:23
traffic going on. Prior tourists to yeah to
34:28
Montenegro, which was then. Still part of that.
34:30
Exactly, exactly, exactly. So to some extent, but at the
34:35
same time you had trains entering, I mean, Serbia from
34:38
Romania. So every surrounding country was
34:42
benefiting. So I don't see why the Albanians
34:46
would refrain themselves from doing so as much as politically
34:52
speaking, it was against the Albanian interest to do it.
34:56
So to some, to some extent, yeah, Let's say, let's say
35:00
economic interest prevailed. And this is when you govern a
35:06
country without principles, my friend, you lose control on
35:11
things because normally you never put a principle in place.
35:15
You would just plain interest and interest would betray you at
35:19
any moment. And this is a lesson I believe
35:23
politics has to draw now and again.
35:26
So. You were during the black years.
35:28
You were in Albania? I've been, I've been sitting in
35:30
Albania the whole. It was very dangerous, chaotic
35:33
97. 97 was chaotic, of course, I was a journalist at the time,
35:38
and I was. Journalist for.
35:39
I was working for some local media and in 97 and then 98 I
35:46
got hired by Radio for Europe. So I was reporting for this
35:50
American radio and I spent my last five years I've been
35:55
working with Radio for Europe, serving as well the
35:58
international service. Based in Albania.
36:00
I was serving from Albania. I was serving from Albania, but
36:04
the headquarters were in Prague. So I've been serving also their
36:08
international service and, and I that's.
36:13
Why you learn so good English? Because you speak English like I
36:18
would say better than English. I, I, I have been, I have been
36:21
lucky enough to work for a number of prominent kind of
36:25
organizations, including Best Mosteller, whom I served with,
36:30
the company I created afterwards.
36:33
I, I left the media back in 2003 once I understood that the
36:38
Albanian public had died. It's sensors, it's capacity to
36:42
absorb news, it's capacity to react against injustice was not
36:47
there anymore. And when you do that, I remember
36:52
disclosing a scandal of drug trafficking and I was expecting
36:59
a kind of fight back. Nobody really cared on the truth
37:04
about the truth. I was I was telling publicly and
37:08
when I no, no reaction, neither from the listeners nor from
37:12
those who were harmed by my news.
37:15
And I said, wait a bit, why are you doing that?
37:21
But it was a dangerous activity because you.
37:23
It was a dangerous, it was a dangerous activity.
37:25
It was a dangerous activity being paid $45.00, you know, per
37:30
report, which is nothing. $45 and. $45.00 yes and you'd be
37:35
risking life. Some people might be really
37:38
upset about such. And I and I said it would be
37:41
worth it if people were to be sensitive, but since they're
37:45
not, why should I do it? So I moved out of the media,
37:49
fully convinced that a new approach to building awareness
37:53
to help, let's say, and being in the profession, I moved into
37:57
strategic communications. So I established the very first
38:00
Albanian company in PR and strategic communications and
38:04
started serving the network. I had another opportunity to
38:09
connect with a brilliant Austrian based Vienna based
38:12
company that is Chapter 4 communication.
38:16
And, and I've been working. They were the, the affiliate
38:20
partners of Bursmar Stella and I have been proudly serving this
38:25
wonderful company whom I, I mean, I'm, I'm, I'm still in
38:29
touch with them continuously. Boys.
38:32
Becker is now the CEO, I mean a distinguished, I mean scholar of
38:37
PR and, and however I mean I've been working for person Mostella
38:43
and by the end of 2009 with the arrival in Albania also of a
38:49
number of major investors, it's for the Austrians.
38:52
Big time with the energy companies.
38:55
EVEVNEVN and Fairborn were there two in 2007.
39:00
I've been working with GCMDCM decommitaal.
39:06
You a beautiful company. I mean, I've been assisting NCO
39:10
Enso as well. Another big Austrian energy
39:13
company. And, and I remember, I mean
39:17
supporting also all baiting companies that were in
39:20
competition in a beautiful competition with, I mean
39:24
brilliant company like Androids, you know.
39:26
That's another big. Cost Exactly.
39:28
That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying.
39:31
The presence, the presence is all there.
39:35
What we need to understand is the benefits.
39:39
We cannot treat people like, you know, a, a, a short term
39:45
interest based, you know, prospect.
39:50
And this is what are you if you asked me before what you'd be
39:53
calling for, I'd be calling for a vision that does not puts the
39:58
short term profit in, in, in, in the framework rather than a long
40:05
term presence and somehow grounded.
40:08
So provide all the parties with the feeling that you are there
40:13
to stay. You're not there just to step
40:15
in, bite and leave. You are there to stay.
40:19
You are there to produce More than just a presence.
40:23
Produce, I mean a reality that make everyone feel that they
40:29
belong there. This years of the second Parisha
40:32
man that I myself lived in Albania and it was really a lot
40:35
of Austrian companies moving in. Like you mentioned in 2013 when
40:39
Eddie Rama came, the Socialist Prime Minister is still running.
40:42
He famously said in a comment the great time of the Austrian
40:45
investment is now over and he brought a lot of Italian and
40:49
Turkish investment. The concept of providing
40:53
competition was somehow suggested to him and I believe
41:00
the interest to bring in to views but better paying parties
41:06
somehow prevailed. Is he wrong on bringing in I
41:14
mean competition when it comes to to to investment?
41:17
No, the idea is you need to have a strategic partner and I
41:22
believe Austria is 1. So and going back to why it is a
41:29
strategic partner, you'd say we need to somehow revamp and
41:33
reshuffle a bit the past in order to understand where our
41:39
future belongs. So in this way we have been well
41:45
aware in many years that normally we are a piece of the
41:52
long trunk of a civilization that is of Celtic origin.
42:01
You believe in the I do thousands of years I.
42:04
Do I do believe that somehow we are part of the same tribe trunk
42:12
in I mean that in centuries now, in millennia has been there and
42:19
has been nourishing these stories.
42:22
So and by being the same structural presence, we somehow
42:29
represent both in terms of civilizations, behaviour,
42:33
attitude, what we have been missing.
42:36
You asked me earlier about our history.
42:38
What has changed Albanians? Why Albanians not as vigorously,
42:44
I mean legally oriented or institutionally driven compared
42:50
to Germans or Austrians. Albanians come back from a 3000
42:57
plus years of history demonstrated by cities they have
43:01
been suffering 32 official I mean occupations 3434 thirty in
43:08
the South. Next to Corfu, what's the name
43:11
in the South? This beautiful ancient city
43:13
which. Oh, you're talking about
43:14
Butrint. Butrint.
43:15
Yeah, it's special documentation of the 3000 years of history,
43:21
no? Butrin basically is a former
43:25
Hellenic, then it's a city created by the wife of by
43:32
Olivia, the wife of of Julius Caesar.
43:35
And the foundation of Olivia basically produced built also
43:39
the the aqueduct to the city etcetera.
43:42
And it was rediscovered in 1940 from a famous Italian kind of
43:49
archaeologist. But but no, what I'm, what I'm
43:54
trying to say is we have been, I mean, we, we have been and have
43:58
a presence with cities like Beirat or Eurocaster, etcetera.
44:02
But there are even more ancient towns, you know, that date back
44:07
like 3000 years. Cape.
44:11
And therefore I said language, language wise, I mean, Albanians
44:16
are capable to explain even the names of the Greek gods.
44:20
The ancient Greek gods can be explained through Albanian.
44:24
We have been suffering 32 occupations.
44:28
This means that we have seen the state and and the institution
44:31
always as part of the enemy. Therefore obey to them is an act
44:37
of lack of self respect in the Albanian prehistoric mindset.
44:44
So all right in and and I think this, this cultural palimpsest
44:50
of personality, this ancient trait, OK, of our social and
44:58
political anthropology has brought us nowadays to the
45:04
position that we have found ourselves safe only in the
45:09
structural organisations that were built around the tribe.
45:14
What we did not have enough time to upgrade ourselves with was
45:19
moving from the biological tribe to the political tribes that are
45:24
the political parties. And this thing has in a way not
45:30
hailed or upheld, let's say the virtues, but the opportunistic
45:35
approach. So Albanians are very well
45:39
performing in an environment that operates based on strong
45:43
connections and opportunistic vision, and this makes them very
45:48
competitive in an environment they're somehow control one way
45:53
or another. Alban, you are now in the
45:56
digital tribe because with all your amazing life history, which
46:00
we will maybe in a second post cast also going to more detail,
46:04
you have also joined the digital world and you believe in this
46:08
transformational power of the Internet, of the new technology.
46:12
And now you work for a company, it's called Laconix, It's one of
46:15
the successful new digital companies in this kind of
46:19
Silicon Valley, which is emerging in Tirana, Duras and
46:22
this beautiful surrounding. Tell me about that one, because
46:25
that's also the reason why you're in Vienna.
46:27
Sure. What do you think?
46:28
Can Albania, with the help of this digital technology, be
46:32
ready for the European Union? And this is employment chance
46:36
for the young people. Yes, I mean, thank you for
46:38
mentioning it. Actually, Laconics, yes, is a
46:41
company I, I was working with and I'm in partnership with.
46:45
I direct Friday game based in Leipzig and we source coders and
46:52
software developers from Albania through Laconic, but also other
46:56
companies. While we already have in place a
46:59
network of over 10 companies from Denmark, Sweden, Belgium,
47:05
the Netherlands, UK, Italy and even the United States.
47:10
So to some extent, I mean Friday is an important reality and
47:17
coming down to what I was just talking to you about this shift
47:21
of mindset, this, this, this kind of slight historic
47:25
development, this digitalization poke that we are living through
47:31
producing this atomization of society, this individual
47:36
singling out etcetera. This of course gives now to the
47:40
individuals, I mean, the power to create a future that might be
47:45
individual, individualistic, but it's somehow a much more
47:51
reliable representation of their own value, their their own ego,
47:55
their own. And in this prospective
47:57
Albanians are very strong, are very decisive, I mean to obtain
48:03
more, to move forward, to make, to make a success, etcetera.
48:07
And in this, I believe not simply because GIZ, the German,
48:13
you know, international, I mean support organization identified
48:20
that there are 15,000 reliably, I mean of reliable quality
48:26
software developers based in Albania alone. 15. 1015
48:30
thousand. You can double the number if you
48:32
had to it Kosovo and if you had to it Northern Macedonia.
48:36
Just Albanians. And if I tell you that now
48:40
people more and more are following the trend of learning,
48:44
let's say new languages and German is on top of it, you
48:47
know, being the, the engine of, of Europe.
48:51
As much as I'm happy to see that Austria, by instance, is for
48:55
this group, I mean much, much more accommodating with English.
49:00
So Austria appears to be a country much more oriented
49:04
towards internationalisation of relations, not just keeping it
49:09
as the region generally speaking has been behaving, I mean
49:13
strictly in German and served in German etcetera.
49:16
So the capacity to absorb, let's say professionals that come and
49:21
use English as a language etcetera is in is in Austria
49:25
much more distinctive that you find it in Switzerland or even
49:27
in Germany, you know, especially in the in the in.
49:32
The division which Lucas Wandle has once said a Silicon Valley
49:35
in Kosovo, Albania, Montenegro, Macedonia, Albanian Silicon
49:39
Valley. Is it possible?
49:41
No, I see these are coins. These.
49:46
These are no, no, I mean, this is, this is coining.
49:49
This is coining. I mean, there is one thing for
49:53
sure. I believe time has come for
49:57
Europe to endorse change and this change will somehow start
50:03
to be rolled out from the periphery of, from the ungebung
50:09
of the of the European Union. And this is the Western Balkans.
50:16
The Western Balkans have enough history.
50:18
I mean, quite some wisdom and hopefully also some political, I
50:23
mean, guidance to endorse and lead this change enough to make
50:32
clear and produce this pilot project that I mean by releasing
50:40
somehow the regulations and the strict kind of, you know,
50:43
bureaucracy does not mean to lose control.
50:47
It means to fasten the pace of development.
50:50
And this is exactly what Europe needs.
50:52
Most Europeans need nowadays, I believe, they need to trust
50:58
their future. They start now.
51:01
They have started to lose the confidence in their past.
51:06
They're risked to lose the pride of being who they are and
51:10
somehow also not be so thankful for what they used to be.
51:19
So, and in this framework, I mean faster, we regain
51:23
confidence about our future through revamping the values of
51:28
our past and by also obtaining, let's say, the freedom to
51:34
address. So be not afraid to make
51:37
mistakes, but be ready to somehow, I'd say make them
51:43
happen for the sake of what we believe.
51:47
I mean in in ourselves, this is how I think.
51:52
I mean, Europe will first. I want to wrap it up now.
51:55
I want to thank you very much. You heard this powerful appeal
51:58
for a united Europe from a gentleman from Albania who had
52:02
to the courage to break down communism, was personally
52:06
involved in the fall of communism in his native Albania.
52:10
One of the worst regimes with there ever was in communism and
52:13
you had this courage to do it. You were then chased out by the
52:17
Sigurimi, the secret good service, which tried to kill
52:20
you. You made a living in Germany,
52:22
Italy, UK and other countries. And now you attire as a British
52:26
gentleman, as a fourth leader of your own country, as a digital
52:30
transformer of your own country. And you are full of optimism
52:33
also for the rest of Europe to learn from this model, to have
52:37
courage in Europe. And maybe one last sentence for
52:41
you, because we have to wrap it up because you have to fly back
52:43
to Albania and continue your mission here in Vienna.
52:47
I want to thank you and maybe just a closing statement,
52:50
optimistic 1 here for our young audience.
52:53
Albania will join the European Union.
52:55
Oh, the optimistic is surely, I mean fight again.
52:59
Bihar, together with the Albanian founding member, will
53:03
be having a presence in Vienna very soon.
53:05
Oh, good news. Breaking news we are We are
53:07
happy to invest in Vienna because let me put it
53:11
differently, we believe in you. Albanian investment in Vienna
53:16
coming. Exactly we believe in.
53:17
Interesting turn around now. We believe in you, thank you and
53:21
and I I so hope that the same is valid on the other side.
53:25
I personally believe in Albania and we have to convince the
53:28
Austrian and the European public still, but we will with
53:32
gentlemen like you. I think we show the right and
53:35
the good face of Albania. The reality is much better.
53:39
I want to come you very much at my show.
53:41
Thanks a lot for coming to Vienna and at my show.
53:43
All the best with digital transformation.
53:45
EU future of Albania and please come back.
53:48
We will go also in the 9799 Albania was really one of the
53:53
countries with the most difficult history of, but now it
53:56
has a bright future in the European Union.
53:59
Feeling.