Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / ‘Suspected Serial Killer’ of Homeless People Nabbed in Miami: Cops

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‘Suspected Serial Killer’ of Homeless People Nabbed in Miami: Cops · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Fear grips the city of
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Speaker 1: Miami as rumors circulate that a serial killer is stalking
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Speaker 1: its residence. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank
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Speaker 1: you for being with us here at Fox Nation in
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Speaker 1: serious X one eleven. First of all, take a listen
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Speaker 1: to our friends at NBC six. Two men shot two
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Speaker 1: hours apart at two different locations, both victims homeless. The
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Speaker 1: first shot around eight pm near ninety five and Southwest
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Speaker 1: Second Avenue. He is still in the hospital. That individual
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Speaker 1: is an extreme critical condition and is being treated at
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Speaker 1: Jackson Memorial Hospital and Trauma. The second victim shot just
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Speaker 1: before ten near North Miami av And twenty first Street.
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Speaker 1: Please say they got video. A black vehicle had driven
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Speaker 1: up to the location where the victim was laying down
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Speaker 1: on the ground and shot had him several times. Police
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Speaker 1: also believe is responsible for deadly stabbing of a homeless
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Speaker 1: person in October near Edgewater. This is a witness from
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Speaker 1: that day whose car was held up in the crime scene.
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Speaker 1: But it told me I happened a vehicle because it
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Speaker 1: had blood splatter and it had to be fingerprint because
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Speaker 1: there was a fight. There was some type of struggle,
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Speaker 1: and they thought that the car had their hot fingerprints.
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Speaker 1: Now they think it's possible other homeless people may have suffered.
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Speaker 1: Who would drive up and a fancy black car. It'd
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Speaker 1: take pot shots at homeless people, killing them, just shooting
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Speaker 1: them dead, like they're playing one of those games at
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Speaker 1: a carnival where you shoot and shoot and shooting. Didn't
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Speaker 1: you get the big fluffy animals and prize the city
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Speaker 1: of Miami in shock as one after the next person
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Speaker 1: is killed. And as you heard our friend Jamie Grula
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Speaker 1: speaking from NBC, one of the victims was actually lying
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Speaker 1: down asleep on the ground with me in All Star
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Speaker 1: panel to make sense of what we know so far.
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Speaker 1: James shell Nutt twenty seven years metro major case now
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Speaker 1: lawyer with the shell Nutt Law Firm. Dot Com. Doctor
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Speaker 1: Sherry Schwartz, forensic psychologist, author of Criminal Behavior and Where
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Speaker 1: Law and Psychology Intersect. Chris Buyers, former police chief John's Creek,
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Speaker 1: twenty five years on the force, Private investigator and polygrapher
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Speaker 1: at Chris Buyers Investigations and Polygraph dot com. Doctor Tim Gallagher,
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Speaker 1: medical examiner for the entire State off Florida at Pathcremed
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Speaker 1: dot Com, esteemed lecturer at University of Florida Medical School
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Speaker 1: and founder and host of the International Forensic Medicine Death
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Speaker 1: Investigation Conference. But first, I want to go out to
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Speaker 1: a special guest joining us, David Vaya joining us from
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Speaker 1: the Miami Harold. David, I can only imagine, but all
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Speaker 1: the residents of Miami thought, when they wake up in
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Speaker 1: the morning and look on their iPad or read their paper,
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Speaker 1: that yet another person has been shot. Tell me about
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Speaker 1: when you first learn that somebody, typically in a black vehicle,
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Speaker 1: would just drive up and shoot down a homeless person dead. Well,
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Speaker 1: you know, the funny thing was is it was sort
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Speaker 1: of a dead period of news that you know, it's
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Speaker 1: right towards the end of the year, around Christmas time,
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Speaker 1: and so it kind of went on the radar a
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Speaker 1: little bit. Um. You know, It's one of those kind
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Speaker 1: of curiosity type of things like, oh, there's someone's been
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Speaker 1: shot and Winwood. Winwood is like a very tirsty type
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Speaker 1: of area that's uh, you know, wait wait a minute, wait, wait,
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Speaker 1: wait wait wait. You know David A. Vaya with Miami
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Speaker 1: Harold just brought up a really good point that these
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Speaker 1: shootings were in a very ass, he said, touristy. He's right.
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Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of money floating around Miami.
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Speaker 1: David Vay eight because every time I look at the
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Speaker 1: Daily Mail at page six, somebody's having a multimillion dollar
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Speaker 1: house being bought or sold. You have all those stars
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Speaker 1: moving down, their celebrities, they're always throwing all the bashes
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Speaker 1: that you see the Kardashians at I mean, what is
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Speaker 1: the draw of all these rich celebs to Miami. David Well,
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Speaker 1: I think it's it's the the the image of the
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Speaker 1: Miami lifestyle, right, you have the you mean dealers, No,
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Speaker 1: he's all right, that's that's too. That is, of course
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Speaker 1: always one of the major draws here. But I think
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Speaker 1: you have you know, the celebrity scene, the arts scene,
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Speaker 1: the party scene, which is of course it's a huge
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Speaker 1: major draw. Um. And of course the weather right right
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Speaker 1: now it's you know, eighty five degrees out in the
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Speaker 1: middle of January. So um. I think it's just a
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Speaker 1: little bit of a little bit of everything that's captured,
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Speaker 1: you know, the the imaginations of people from all over
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Speaker 1: the world for many years, and so you get here
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Speaker 1: and then you have someone going along taking pot shots
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Speaker 1: at people on the street. It certainly was a disconcerting
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Speaker 1: story in the beginning. You know, David, I got a
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Speaker 1: quick saying pot shots. I said it first because this
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Speaker 1: is a murder. When you stay taking a pot shot,
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Speaker 1: it's kind of airbrushing what's really happening, shooting innocent people
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Speaker 1: that are standing there or lying there dead from your
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Speaker 1: car where you have all the power, you have all
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Speaker 1: the control, like a sniper. Hey, David, of everybody joining me.
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Speaker 1: From one of my favorite publications, the Miami Herald, David,
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Speaker 1: where is Fisher Island as it relates to Miami? For sure?
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Speaker 1: Island is a really wealthy enclave island just off the
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Speaker 1: tip of South Beach. So it's really like you have
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Speaker 1: to have a ferry. You have to take the ferry
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Speaker 1: to get there. Only the richest of the rich live
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Speaker 1: in in Fisher Island. So when you're talking about South Beach,
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Speaker 1: you're talking about how far away is that from downtown
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Speaker 1: Miami or where these shootings are taking place. Well, these
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Speaker 1: shootings took place in the city of Miami. See the
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Speaker 1: city of Miami, which is you know, the sort of
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Speaker 1: iconic um you know, uh, skyscrapers and financial buildings and condos.
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Speaker 1: So that's the sort of like I guess what we
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Speaker 1: call the mainland, and you have to go across the
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Speaker 1: causeway um to the sort of barrier islands, and that's
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Speaker 1: where you have Miami Beach, which is a separate um city,
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Speaker 1: a separate municipality, and that's where you have the really
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Speaker 1: iconic ocean drive with the art deco buildings and the
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Speaker 1: party scene and you know, sort of the the nightclub
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Speaker 1: scene that we've seen depicted in movies and TV shows.
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Speaker 1: So um City of Miami distinct distinct area. But also
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Speaker 1: when you think of like little Havana, little Haiti some
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Speaker 1: you know, of course, the downtown financial district and banking
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Speaker 1: district and all of that, all of that is City
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Speaker 1: of Miami. I love Little haveai Anna there. Do you
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Speaker 1: remember the program Dexter. I never actually watched it, although
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Speaker 1: I have friends that worked on it as police department,
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Speaker 1: you know, advisers. Wasn't that said in Miami? It was?
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Speaker 1: It was said in Miami. It was with the Miami
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Speaker 1: did Police Worthy. I believe that is one of the
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Speaker 1: shows that got me through my pregnancy, along with Mystery Woman.
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Speaker 1: I bened on Dexter to get through my very perilous pregnancy.
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Speaker 1: So there you go, David. So I'm trying to get
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Speaker 1: Wait now, wait a minute, isn't Miami where Scott Dissac's
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Speaker 1: always hanging out with another team girl. There's always there's
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Speaker 1: always a celebrity hanging out with a teen girl or
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Speaker 1: a entourage somewhere. Now, let me clarify, I don't mean
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Speaker 1: Tina is in younger than sixteen. I mean tinas in
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Speaker 1: like nineteen, because I'm imagining Scott Dissoc sprawled out on
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Speaker 1: a lan's share with his new girlfriend, whoever she may be,
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Speaker 1: and then not too far away, this guy gunning down
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Speaker 1: innocent victims. I mean the dichotomy. Let me throw that
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Speaker 1: to you, datter. Sherry Schwartz forensic psychologists joining us data, Sherry,
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Speaker 1: the dichotomy of all that money and all that natural
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Speaker 1: beauty juxtaposed against someone who apparently with no real motives
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Speaker 1: such as revenge or anger or double dealing or bar fight.
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Speaker 1: It's just gunning down innocent people to whom they have
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Speaker 1: no connection. And then you know, a mile over, you've
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Speaker 1: got all of this opulence and all of this beauty.
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Speaker 1: That's kind of a mind twist, right, very much so, Nancy,
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Speaker 1: And as you know, I'm in Miami Beach, so I'm
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Speaker 1: a Miami resident. And what you described is the landscape
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Speaker 1: of Miami perfectly, the wealthy, of the most wealthy of
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Speaker 1: the wealthy, the opulence, the glamour, this idea that it's paradise,
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Speaker 1: and it is in some ways the beautiful, very gritty underbelly. Right.
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Speaker 1: And the thing is with serial killers, the motivation is
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Speaker 1: always psychological gratification of some sort. Okay, doctor Sherry hauled on,
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Speaker 1: hit the brakes, slow down for me because you and
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Speaker 1: Gallagher you get going so fast I can't take it
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Speaker 1: all in. Now, what did you just say about motivation?
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Speaker 1: And look, first of all, let me just say I
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Speaker 1: don't care. I had to learn that the hard way.
9:31
Speaker 1: I spent about the first seven years, five to seven
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Speaker 1: years as a prosecutor, and when the jury wasn't in
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Speaker 1: the room, I'd look over the defendant and think, why
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Speaker 1: would he she do this? Why would they do this?
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Speaker 1: And then after spending a lot of time and an
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Speaker 1: ordinate amount of time trying to figure out why, it
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Speaker 1: just hit me one day in court, why ask why
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Speaker 1: I've got to prove jurisdiction and who did it? That's
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Speaker 1: what I've got to do. That is my duty. But
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Speaker 1: out of just curiosity, occasionally I do wonder why in
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Speaker 1: the world. So what were you saying about motive? Why
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Speaker 1: serial killers do what they do, Doctor Sherry Schwartz. At
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Speaker 1: the base of it, it's all about psychological gratification. That's
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Speaker 1: the motivation. And that's the most terrifying thing because it
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Speaker 1: could be the average person next to you at the supermarket,
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Speaker 1: you know, in line, things like that. But it's all
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Speaker 1: about they have something going on psychologically that murder is
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Speaker 1: the way to satisfy that that needs. Crime stories with
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Speaker 1: Nancy Grace, James Shell not twenty seven years Metro major case.
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Speaker 1: Did you hear what Dave Avay said report with the
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Speaker 1: Miami Herald that this was in a touristy area. It's
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Speaker 1: like opening fire at Disney, for Pete's sake, that's where
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Speaker 1: all the tourists are. Why are you laughing? I take
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Speaker 1: my children to Disney all the time, every time we
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Speaker 1: can afford it. Have you seen how much it costs
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Speaker 1: now ouch? But the fact that there are innocent tourists
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Speaker 1: around that are flooding into the city, pumping money into
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Speaker 1: the economy, and this person, and you know it's a man, right,
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Speaker 1: I mean, how many female cereal snipers have ever gotten caught? Zero?
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Speaker 1: So go ahead with that. I can tell you right
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Speaker 1: now it's a man. But what about that shell? Not
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Speaker 1: the fact that this is going down in a tourist area.
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Speaker 1: You know, if you're not from that area, Okay, you
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Speaker 1: have to think this is not the prime selection point
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Speaker 1: if you don't want to get caught. But a lot
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Speaker 1: of times when people do this, they are doing it
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Speaker 1: in an area that they feel familiar with. The area
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Speaker 1: oftentimes is an anchor point for them. And an anchor
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Speaker 1: point can be an area that they live and they're
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Speaker 1: very familiar with it, where they work, where they've went
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Speaker 1: to school, but they have some connection with that area
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Speaker 1: that makes them comfortable enough to do this in this area.
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Speaker 1: That's a really good point and I always point out,
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Speaker 1: for instance, Scott Peterson, where did he dump his wife,
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Speaker 1: an unborn child, Lacy and Connor at a place there
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Speaker 1: was basically his fishing hole. If you look at crimes
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Speaker 1: and the disposal of bodies as a body of work,
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Speaker 1: you'll see that very often, if not a large majority,
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Speaker 1: of time killers function within an area they are familiar
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Speaker 1: Justice shell Nutt just said, and to you, Chris Buyer's
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Speaker 1: former police chief, John's Creek now at Chris Buyer's investigations
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Speaker 1: in polygraph, Chris, I've dealt with a lot of killers,
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Speaker 1: as have you. I mean literally thousands of killers. A
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Speaker 1: sniper as a whole another can of worms, that's a
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Speaker 1: whole different animal. Somebody that remains out of the fray.
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Speaker 1: It's not up close and personal killing like a stabbing
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Speaker 1: or a point blank shooting, or strangulation, be at ligature
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Speaker 1: or manual. This is somebody that sits back, as in
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Speaker 1: this case, as David Vaya is telling us, sits back
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Speaker 1: in his luxury black sedan and takes shots at innocent
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Speaker 1: people who don't see it coming, one actually lying there
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Speaker 1: asleep in the warm Miami temperature. What kind of a
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Speaker 1: mindset is that this is a special kind of evil
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Speaker 1: in your mind that it takes to do something like
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Speaker 1: this to just innocent people, and you're, you know, homeless
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Speaker 1: people who you know can't really defend themselves, and are
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Speaker 1: you know, some of the weakest in society and you're
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Speaker 1: picking on them, and it just takes a completely depraved
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Speaker 1: evil minds. In my observation, to do something like this,
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Speaker 1: you know, back to you, David Vaya joining US crime
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Speaker 1: reporter with the Miami Harold. You can find them at
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Speaker 1: Miami Herald dot com. David, very often with the homeless,
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Speaker 1: you know, I've worked with for many years, trying to
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Speaker 1: feed them and give them shelter. David, very often, at
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Speaker 1: a distance, you can't tell if you would be shooting
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Speaker 1: a man, a woman, or a teen because even in
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Speaker 1: warm weather, they very often aren't bundled up with layers
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Speaker 1: and layers of clothing and head coverings, sometimes gloves, even
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Speaker 1: in warm weather. So this guy doesn't know if he's
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Speaker 1: shooting a man, woman, or a teen. Right, That's correct.
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Speaker 1: And also what was also challenging was the first people
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Speaker 1: who responded to the scenes. They were unsure exactly what
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Speaker 1: had happened to these victims because they couldn't tell. They
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Speaker 1: could just see some sort of trauma. They didn't know
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Speaker 1: the backstory because they were so random and in public.
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Speaker 1: You know what's interesting, David, vant I just thought of
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Speaker 1: it the other day. I was working on any books,
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Speaker 1: some murder mystery, and my son and my daughter, believe
15:11
Speaker 1: it or not, are always given me ideas. Now that
15:13
Speaker 1: could be scary. But my son said, you know, what
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Speaker 1: would be a perfect thing for serial killer is to
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Speaker 1: shoot people that nobody would notice, or they don't have
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Speaker 1: their family they're talking to every day, like people inside
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Speaker 1: the road, like homeless people, and they could sit out
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Speaker 1: there forever and no one would even know that they
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Speaker 1: had been shot. And that is exactly what you're telling me, David,
15:38
Speaker 1: explain that to me one more time, please, Well, in
15:41
Speaker 1: this case, they believed the victims had no ties to
15:46
Speaker 1: the suspects, so that they were just being sort of
15:48
Speaker 1: shot indiscriminately. I mean, it wasn't as if there was
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Speaker 1: anything that provoked the attacks. So yeah, they believe it
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Speaker 1: would absolutely you know, random and not with any rhymem
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Speaker 1: of reason that we could do. Guys, take a listen
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Speaker 1: to our friend Joel Waldman at CBS Miami. These murders,
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Speaker 1: according to police, happened within two hours on Tuesday night.
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Speaker 1: The first was on the four hundred block of Southwest
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Speaker 1: Second Avenue. The victim there survived. Police say, he is
16:17
Speaker 1: in horrible shape. He's a Jackson memorial and there is
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Speaker 1: a good chance you will not make it. And then
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Speaker 1: about two hours after that person was shot, police say
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Speaker 1: another gentleman was shot in the Windwood area. It turns
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Speaker 1: out of that both victims in this case were homeless,
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Speaker 1: and police say that in at least one of the instances,
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Speaker 1: the shooter fired the weapon from the car without even
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Speaker 1: getting out. Now police are also I'm the shooter in
16:47
Speaker 1: another homicide back on October sixteenth. This was the stabbing
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Speaker 1: of a homeless person. They would not get into details,
16:54
Speaker 1: but say that an investigator working on that case notice
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Speaker 1: something that connected Tuesday nights murder, murder and attempted murder
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Speaker 1: to this stabbing back in October October sixteenth. Okay, right there,
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Speaker 1: to doctor Tim Gallagher, a medical examiner for the entire
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Speaker 1: state of Florida, this is in your backyard, Gallagher. Now,
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Speaker 1: that could throw a lot of people for a loop
17:17
Speaker 1: right there, because many people do not expect a serial
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Speaker 1: killer to change their m O or to stray from
17:26
Speaker 1: their typical modus operandi method of operation. But that is
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Speaker 1: not true. It has been proven over and over again.
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Speaker 1: I mean, look at Ted Bundy. Some people he would strangle,
17:36
Speaker 1: some people he would bludgeon. Yes, a lot of his
17:41
Speaker 1: victims looked very similar, but there were different mos and
17:47
Speaker 1: his method deteriorated over time. So the fact that we've
17:52
Speaker 1: got a couple of people shot and then one stabbed,
17:56
Speaker 1: potentially connected to the same serial killer, that does not
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Speaker 1: phase me at all. I want you to tell us
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Speaker 1: what these people would have endured, doctor Tim Gallagher. The
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Speaker 1: shooting and then sitting out in the open and nobody
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Speaker 1: really understanding what's happened to you. You're bleeding out and
18:18
Speaker 1: nobody around you knows what's happened to you. Well, you know,
18:22
Speaker 1: Miami has a very special spot of my heart. Actually,
18:25
Speaker 1: I did my training in Miami, lived there for many
18:27
Speaker 1: years up and quite familiar with the surrounding areas and
18:32
Speaker 1: the dichotomy of rich versus not so rich there. But
18:36
Speaker 1: after being shot and struck in a couple of major organs,
18:40
Speaker 1: for instance the lungs or the heart, the victim will
18:44
Speaker 1: pass out probably within fifteen to thirty seconds and then
18:47
Speaker 1: expire certainly within three minutes. So they're suffering. How I'm
18:52
Speaker 1: trying to figure out how long they would suffer before
18:54
Speaker 1: they passed away, doctor Gallagher. How typically, you know, we
18:58
Speaker 1: find that thirty seconds. After about thirty seconds or so,
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Speaker 1: they will lose consciousness and then theoretically I guess suffering
19:07
Speaker 1: would end at about that time, but it's a very
19:09
Speaker 1: painful moment up until they lose the point of consciousness.
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Speaker 1: You know, I've heard a lot of people. I've heard
19:16
Speaker 1: a lot of people that have been shot said I
19:18
Speaker 1: didn't even feel it. How is that possible? But depends
19:21
Speaker 1: upon what they're doing at the time. If they have
19:24
Speaker 1: a lot of adrenaline running through their body, that tends
19:27
Speaker 1: to mask pain until they eventually relax a little bit
19:32
Speaker 1: and then the nerve sensation begins to start again. So
19:36
Speaker 1: it just depends on what they're doing at the time
19:38
Speaker 1: they were shot. If they're very active, the adrenaline is
19:41
Speaker 1: coursing through their body, that chemical in their body will
19:46
Speaker 1: dull the pain or stop the nervous impulse of pain,
19:50
Speaker 1: so they can escape or fight that fight or flight syndrome,
19:54
Speaker 1: so they could escape or fight other way out of
19:56
Speaker 1: a situation. Time stories with Nancy Grace, Doctor Gallagher. As
20:18
Speaker 1: I was asking you earlier, again, this is in your
20:20
Speaker 1: backyard regarding a serial killer changing ms. Have you ever
20:25
Speaker 1: seen that before? You know, I have not, but I
20:28
Speaker 1: do tell you there are so many programs on TV
20:31
Speaker 1: now that show how these serial killers are caught using
20:34
Speaker 1: the same MO over and over again. So a learned
20:38
Speaker 1: serial killer might take a note of this and then
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Speaker 1: change with MS. But typically, no, you don't see that
20:44
Speaker 1: at all, especially shooting versus stabbing. You that's to step someone,
20:50
Speaker 1: you really have to be close to them. It's very personal.
20:53
Speaker 1: Whereas shooting, you know you had that distance. It's very impersonal.
20:57
Speaker 1: And what about that shell nutt a serial killer changing MS? Yeah,
21:01
Speaker 1: you know a lot of times, you know, and I agree.
21:04
Speaker 1: I have not worked a case where a serial killer
21:06
Speaker 1: changed anybody, but I will tell you that a lot
21:08
Speaker 1: of times on that first killing. The serial killers are
21:12
Speaker 1: often intelligent people. They look and see and evaluate what
21:16
Speaker 1: went wrong. And if, for instance, in a stabbing, you know,
21:20
Speaker 1: they cut themselves and they thought, hey, I'm leaving evidence
21:23
Speaker 1: at the scene, my own blood, my own DNA at
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Speaker 1: the scene, They're intelligent enough to switch to another method
21:29
Speaker 1: to avoid detection and avoid leaving that evidence. And to you,
21:33
Speaker 1: Chris Buyers, former police chief John's Creek, we ever seen
21:36
Speaker 1: a serial killer changemos? Because I have, But typically I
21:41
Speaker 1: would say they don't. Yeah, No, I would have to say,
21:44
Speaker 1: typically they don't. I've never seen it totally agree with
21:47
Speaker 1: what Shelma is saying that they're intelligent and could make
21:52
Speaker 1: you know changes for what they're doing. But no, I
21:55
Speaker 1: have never personally seen it. I mean, I mentioned Ted Bunny.
21:58
Speaker 1: But then, of course, Israel Keys is one of the
22:01
Speaker 1: worst serial killers there ever was. He strangled, he bludgeoned,
22:07
Speaker 1: he shot. He would have murder kits stashed all around
22:10
Speaker 1: the country, would always pick victims to whom he was
22:15
Speaker 1: not connected in any way, and we still don't know
22:19
Speaker 1: how many people Keys murdered. I first became involved with
22:24
Speaker 1: Israel Keys with the murder of an Alaska and barista
22:29
Speaker 1: named Samantha Koenig, who was kidnapped out of her coffee
22:33
Speaker 1: stand and assaulted, raped, murdered. He actually posed her body,
22:41
Speaker 1: stitching her eyelids open for a ransom note, but he
22:44
Speaker 1: never used a ransom note. In any other case. He
22:48
Speaker 1: would identify his prey. They could be in a home.
22:53
Speaker 1: There was an elderly couple that he attacked kind of
22:56
Speaker 1: in a remote their remote home in rural area. He
22:59
Speaker 1: would hunt in RV camps and campgrounds. I mean, so
23:06
Speaker 1: his mo along with Bundy's, very often change depending on
23:12
Speaker 1: the circumstances surrounding the time when he felt the urge
23:16
Speaker 1: to kill. Sometimes it was sex motivated. He wanted to
23:20
Speaker 1: rape somebody, Sometimes he wanted money. Mostly is for I
23:23
Speaker 1: believe the thrill of killing someone. Let me throw that
23:26
Speaker 1: to you, doctor Sherry Schwartz, because that's more of a
23:30
Speaker 1: mind twist where you have the same emo and then
23:35
Speaker 1: you vary. There could be a number of things underlying that. Psychologically,
23:40
Speaker 1: maybe the person is changing it up because they want
23:44
Speaker 1: to escape detection from law enforcement. It could also be,
23:47
Speaker 1: which is much darker and less satisfying, that the person
23:51
Speaker 1: wants to try different methods of killing because again, in
23:54
Speaker 1: that vein of psychological gratification and getting that gratification from
23:59
Speaker 1: murdering people fall, maybe shooting isn't a satisfying to this person,
24:03
Speaker 1: which is really scary. But one thing you gotta be
24:08
Speaker 1: careful about as a criminal is your vehicle. Take a
24:13
Speaker 1: listen to the Miami PD pressor. The investigation began, Officers
24:20
Speaker 1: quickly connected the two incidents, not only because of the
24:25
Speaker 1: short span of time between the two shootings, but because
24:29
Speaker 1: both incidents involved victims that were homeless. As the investigation continued,
24:34
Speaker 1: the members of our Criminal Investigations Unit, led by a
24:37
Speaker 1: chief agular and major cook from our Criminal Investigation Division,
24:41
Speaker 1: began scouring for not only physical evidence, but electronic evidence,
24:46
Speaker 1: and we're able to discover a video of the shooting
24:48
Speaker 1: of Miami Avenue. Were revealed that a black vehicle had
24:53
Speaker 1: driven up to a location where the victim was laying
24:56
Speaker 1: down on the ground and shot had him of all times. Subsequintly,
25:02
Speaker 1: the investigation revealed the type of vehicle and the tag.
25:07
Speaker 1: There you go. David Vay, a crime reporter with the
25:09
Speaker 1: Miami Herald, why do criminals think they're so smart? Why?
25:16
Speaker 1: I mean the killer is driving in the same vehicle
25:20
Speaker 1: on two of the murders, a black vehicle, and at
25:25
Speaker 1: every red light practically in Miami, you've got a light cam,
25:30
Speaker 1: a red light cam. What was he thinking? It goes
25:33
Speaker 1: beyond that. So this particular area, I think I told
25:35
Speaker 1: you wind is called Winwood, and they actually have a
25:38
Speaker 1: pretty sophisticated CCTV area because it's sort of a high tourist,
25:42
Speaker 1: high traffic area. So I think you were able to
25:45
Speaker 1: use cameras that are really good from from that system
25:49
Speaker 1: to be able to get the tag. The one the
25:52
Speaker 1: one thing that's been a challenge, I know, is. You know,
25:56
Speaker 1: it's his car, it's his weapon, but the cameras aren't
26:00
Speaker 1: quite good enough to put him as the actual shooter.
26:03
Speaker 1: So as of right now, it's a circumstantial case. But
26:07
Speaker 1: they really believe that he is the person behind Well,
26:11
Speaker 1: I mean, there's somebody gunning people down in the Purps
26:15
Speaker 1: car with potentially the Perps weapon. But who would ever
26:19
Speaker 1: have suspected the Miami serial killer is a successful realtor,
26:26
Speaker 1: a young guy that not me, but many people believe
26:30
Speaker 1: is very handsome. And I'm talking about will Willie Messiah
26:37
Speaker 1: hold on, let it sink in. A Miami real estate
26:42
Speaker 1: agent now suspected of being the Miami serial killer Bobshell.
26:50
Speaker 1: So I don't get it. David Avaya joining me Crime
26:54
Speaker 1: reporter with a Miami Harold. Why would a successful realtor
26:59
Speaker 1: want to go around down and gun down innocent homeless people, Nancy,
27:03
Speaker 1: That's the million dollar question. Uh. Willie is not someone
27:06
Speaker 1: that had any real previous interactions with the law other
27:10
Speaker 1: than a couple of traffic tickets. He wasn't had never
27:13
Speaker 1: been arrested. He lived in a pretty suburban, nondescript part
27:18
Speaker 1: of Miami. If you look at his Instagram accounts and
27:22
Speaker 1: his online profiles, and he's sort of almost you know,
27:25
Speaker 1: just sort of a typical Miami young man, right, dabbling
27:29
Speaker 1: in real estate and trying to do get involved in cryptocurrency,
27:33
Speaker 1: and you know, it just sort of all the buzzwords
27:36
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty one, twenty twenty two. Yeah, it's a
27:39
Speaker 1: complete mystery, and it's one that we as at the
27:42
Speaker 1: Miami here we're still trying to understand. Okay, you just
27:44
Speaker 1: said buzzwords? Are you talking about cryptocurrency? Is that the
27:48
Speaker 1: buzzword cryptocurrency? Real estate, all the you know, all the
27:52
Speaker 1: very Miami stuff of our current times. You know, it's
27:56
Speaker 1: just really hard for me to take in what you're saying. Uh, David,
27:59
Speaker 1: if I and I know everything you're saying is correct,
28:02
Speaker 1: take a listen now to our friends at CBS Miami.
28:05
Speaker 1: This is our cut five. On his Facebook page, it
28:08
Speaker 1: shows a man that was interested in real estate he
28:11
Speaker 1: reportedly worked as a real estate agent for Century twenty one,
28:14
Speaker 1: also interested in fast cars, in cryptocurrency, and to that,
28:18
Speaker 1: both the Mayor and the chief says, you can never
28:20
Speaker 1: judge a book by its cover. Police officers are trained
28:24
Speaker 1: to go after the actions, not the person. Not the
28:27
Speaker 1: way they look, but the way that they behave on
28:29
Speaker 1: the actions they take. I have been in law enforcement
28:32
Speaker 1: for twenty eight years with the City of Miami, and
28:33
Speaker 1: I can tell you I have seen criminals that fit
28:36
Speaker 1: every type and every looker. It surprises me anytime someone
28:39
Speaker 1: commits a crime of this kind, I'm surprised. If it's
28:43
Speaker 1: someone who doesn't have a criminal history, or someone who
28:48
Speaker 1: you know, it would be harder to explain. That makes
28:52
Speaker 1: it all the more shocking. Police also say that they
28:55
Speaker 1: recovered a car and a firearm that they believe was
28:58
Speaker 1: used in the commission of these two crimes on Tuesday evening. Meanwhile,
29:02
Speaker 1: it turns out that Suarez Masseo is from Southwest Miami
29:06
Speaker 1: Dade and he attended Miami Sunset Senior High Again, just
29:11
Speaker 1: twenty five years old. Prime Stories with Nancy Grace take
29:28
Speaker 1: listen to er cut eight. This is Janeine Stanwood w PLG.
29:33
Speaker 1: This twenty five year old suspect got his real estate license,
29:35
Speaker 1: according to records, in twenty eighteen and had no prior
29:39
Speaker 1: criminal history, at least not that we could find. At
29:42
Speaker 1: last check, he was still here at the Miami Police
29:44
Speaker 1: Department being investigated homeless individuals for up bearing no reason
29:49
Speaker 1: have been brutally targeted, police announcing they have this man
29:52
Speaker 1: in custody, twenty five year old Willie Suarez Masseo, a
29:56
Speaker 1: licensed South Florida real estate agent who boasts expertise and
30:00
Speaker 1: the stock market, but who detectives are now calling a
30:03
Speaker 1: serial killer whose victims are all homeless. On the eve
30:07
Speaker 1: of Christmas. We have a very dangerous person off of
30:11
Speaker 1: the streets. Now, you know, I don't get it. David
30:13
Speaker 1: Evayer with me, crime reporter with the Miami Herald. This
30:18
Speaker 1: is a really dapper guy. Some would say good looking,
30:24
Speaker 1: not to me because I know he's a serial killer,
30:27
Speaker 1: but some would claim he is very, very handsome, and
30:29
Speaker 1: he's always decked out in slick looking suits. And he's
30:32
Speaker 1: pictured online on a social media sitting on top of
30:36
Speaker 1: speedy sports cars bragging about cryptocurrency and his knowledge of
30:42
Speaker 1: the stock market. How in the hey does that fit
30:45
Speaker 1: in with driving along and you're black sedan shooting at
30:50
Speaker 1: innocent homeless people, some of them asleep, killing them. He
30:54
Speaker 1: shot one guy in the head for Pete's sake. He
30:56
Speaker 1: really is a jarring, contract asked, and given that he
31:02
Speaker 1: had never been arrested before he had a valid concealed
31:07
Speaker 1: weapons permit. I mean, he was legally allowed to have
31:10
Speaker 1: the gun. And also he suspected of a stabbing, which
31:18
Speaker 1: is a very intimate, brutal crime that is accused of.
31:22
Speaker 1: He's believed to have done that a few months prior.
31:25
Speaker 1: So the whole thing is very, very jarring, and we
31:28
Speaker 1: have yet to learn exactly what was going through his head.
31:31
Speaker 1: But I'm sure that's going to play out as the
31:32
Speaker 1: process proceeds in court. David A somebody has got to
31:37
Speaker 1: be speculating about what his motive was. What is the
31:42
Speaker 1: working theory. I mean, my gut, my gut would tell me,
31:48
Speaker 1: you know, there's something uh, you know, screw loose in
31:50
Speaker 1: the guy's head. But you know that's always a fine line,
31:53
Speaker 1: right Because I'm so happy you said that, because now
31:57
Speaker 1: finally you said something I disagree with. A screw loose. Okay,
32:03
Speaker 1: let me torment David Valla for just one moment. David
32:07
Speaker 1: vall a very renowned in his field crime reporter with
32:11
Speaker 1: Miami Herald A screw loose. Now, the legal definition of
32:16
Speaker 1: insanity is not knowing right from wrong at the time
32:19
Speaker 1: of the incident, and the fact that he would pull
32:22
Speaker 1: up and this black car remain virtually hidden, as you
32:27
Speaker 1: pointed out earlier, shoot an innocent victim dead and in speedaway.
32:33
Speaker 1: Suggest to me he knew what he was doing was wrong,
32:37
Speaker 1: David Avaller. I mean it could be argued, David, that
32:42
Speaker 1: everybody on this panel, including me, as a screw loose,
32:45
Speaker 1: all right, but that does not in his sanity defense
32:49
Speaker 1: make would you agree? Correct? And oh darn, I was
32:52
Speaker 1: hoping you disagree with me. I guess I kind of
32:54
Speaker 1: showed up for that. Well here's the thing, right, So
32:58
Speaker 1: so yes, right, you you you to be legally insane.
33:02
Speaker 1: You have to know you have to they have to
33:03
Speaker 1: be able to prove that you didn't know right from wrong.
33:05
Speaker 1: But in this case, not only did he did he
33:08
Speaker 1: flee the scene, did he? But also when he's eventually
33:12
Speaker 1: picked up by the City of Miami Police Department and
33:15
Speaker 1: they want to talk to him about what happens, he
33:17
Speaker 1: immediately asked for a lawyer. Right, So you think someone
33:20
Speaker 1: someone that didn't know right fromm wouldn't really have the
33:24
Speaker 1: capacity to do that. So that's I don't think that's
33:26
Speaker 1: going to be able to fly to the defense. The
33:28
Speaker 1: best defense they have right now is there's no witnesses.
33:31
Speaker 1: You know, it's just really hard for me to take
33:33
Speaker 1: in what you're saying, David Avaya, and I know everything
33:37
Speaker 1: you're saying is correct. Take a listen now to our
33:39
Speaker 1: friends at CBS Miami. This is our cut five. Mister
33:43
Speaker 1: Masseo is never seen carrying out the shooting, but in
33:47
Speaker 1: court the public defender arguing that just because Masseo owned
33:51
Speaker 1: the gun and the car used in the shootings doesn't
33:54
Speaker 1: mean he's the one who did the crime. No it
33:57
Speaker 1: answered at Masso's home in the Kendale Lakes area. No
34:00
Speaker 1: one was at his real estate office off Killian Parkway.
34:04
Speaker 1: If he's guilty of these crimes, and they can prove
34:05
Speaker 1: beyond a reasonable that he has a very very peculiar
34:09
Speaker 1: pattern of fighting unprotected individuals in the streets that are
34:14
Speaker 1: not even a weak and going up to them, and
34:18
Speaker 1: it appears to be an execution style for reasons that
34:21
Speaker 1: are unknown, so he was denied bond. Again, he faced
34:24
Speaker 1: a charge of attempted first degree murder. Those other fatal
34:28
Speaker 1: incidents are still under investigation. Police say charges could be pending.
34:33
Speaker 1: Of course, there is another stabbing that we believe is
34:35
Speaker 1: going to be connected to will Masseo. Also, are there
34:41
Speaker 1: other homeless people that have been killed in the past
34:44
Speaker 1: homicides that have yet remained unsolved. So, David Avaya with
34:50
Speaker 1: the Miami Herald, you accurately pointed out, as the defense
34:53
Speaker 1: echoed your thoughts, that while cameras caught his vehicle, they
34:58
Speaker 1: didn't catch a shot of him. So at any point
35:03
Speaker 1: David Vayer, was his car reported stolen? No, as far
35:07
Speaker 1: as we know, there's been no evidence that his car
35:09
Speaker 1: was ever reported stolen. I assume, and the defense lawyer
35:14
Speaker 1: in that hearing pointed out that there could have been
35:16
Speaker 1: other people that he allowed access to to have to
35:19
Speaker 1: his car, to his gun. Right. Um. The interesting thing
35:23
Speaker 1: so no eye witnesses so far, but in the October murder,
35:27
Speaker 1: they actually have stunningly clear video of the person they
35:30
Speaker 1: believe committed the homicide, and it like it's totally him.
35:34
Speaker 1: It completely looks like him. But you know, in that case,
35:38
Speaker 1: again they need more witnesses, They need more to be
35:40
Speaker 1: able to prove that the person in that video is him.
35:44
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of moving parts. I imagine if
35:46
Speaker 1: I was a good investigator, they would be pulling cell
35:49
Speaker 1: phone records to see if they could try and exact
35:52
Speaker 1: position and put him near the scene, put his cell
35:55
Speaker 1: phone and the vehicle at the time of the shootings,
35:59
Speaker 1: and you pointed out was first they say, oh, there's
36:02
Speaker 1: not a witness, and they say, sir, we've got a witness.
36:05
Speaker 1: And then you say, well they couldn't see it was
36:06
Speaker 1: at night. You don't have video. Well, now we have video,
36:09
Speaker 1: and that's when the defense attorney has to step back
36:12
Speaker 1: and punt and say something like are you going to
36:14
Speaker 1: believe that or your lying eyes? So bottom line, what
36:19
Speaker 1: I'm really curious about David Avaya is if they will
36:22
Speaker 1: connect him to other deaths, other homicides of homeless people
36:27
Speaker 1: or others in the Miami area that have remained unsolved.
36:31
Speaker 1: Do you know if there is an ongoing investigation in
36:34
Speaker 1: that regard? There is absolutely in the City of Miami
36:37
Speaker 1: police chief actually implored fellow law enforcement to come forward
36:40
Speaker 1: with any cases that could be connected. Remember, it doesn't
36:43
Speaker 1: necessarily even have to be a homicide or an attempted
36:46
Speaker 1: I mean, it could just be an attack in which
36:47
Speaker 1: someone survived or wasn't seriously injured. So I'm sure they're
36:52
Speaker 1: getting a lot of tips. Of course, They've kept a
36:55
Speaker 1: lot of that stuff under wraps because of the sensitive
36:57
Speaker 1: nature of the investigation. But yes, they you know, these
37:00
Speaker 1: things don't happen in a vacuum, and so there was
37:02
Speaker 1: a couple of months period between the October homicide and
37:05
Speaker 1: the shootings that ended in his arrest, So they want
37:09
Speaker 1: to know what he was doing in between that time
37:10
Speaker 1: and before that. I mean, very curious to discover whether
37:15
Speaker 1: his murders extended beyond innocent homeless people whose names we
37:20
Speaker 1: have not mentioned. Manuel Pettis, Jerome Antonio Price, one unidentified
37:28
Speaker 1: male who survived. Very often we see just his name
37:34
Speaker 1: and not the names of the homeless, as if they
37:37
Speaker 1: don't have names or families somewhere. What were you saying, David, Yeah,
37:41
Speaker 1: I think that's that's a good point. And yeah, I
37:44
Speaker 1: mean we you know, these other people are lived in
37:47
Speaker 1: on the fringes of society and are marginalized, and it
37:51
Speaker 1: would be wise to definitely memorialize them, because you're right,
37:56
Speaker 1: a lot of times the killer, just the killer, gets
37:58
Speaker 1: the attention, which is all the more reason that they
38:02
Speaker 1: need our protection, the most vulnerable in our society. Yeah,
38:08
Speaker 1: go aheady, yeah, quick question. You know, is there a
38:12
Speaker 1: connection between and he's killing home those people, but he's
38:14
Speaker 1: a real estate agent that sells homes to people. You know,
38:18
Speaker 1: is there a connection there in any way as psychological
38:21
Speaker 1: the connection there and just seems ironic to me. Can
38:24
Speaker 1: you mind to make a connection on that. You know
38:26
Speaker 1: that the common thread is whether they're a sial killer, teacher,
38:28
Speaker 1: or anything else. They've got an antisocial personality and something else.
38:32
Speaker 1: You know that. You know, the average age of a
38:34
Speaker 1: serial killer is twenty seven and a half years old.
38:37
Speaker 1: This guy is twenty five. So if this guy is
38:38
Speaker 1: a serial killer, he's on the front end of his career.
38:41
Speaker 1: And by the police department catching this guy, they may
38:44
Speaker 1: have saved it. Summer Wise, we wait as justice unfoals.
38:48
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace comes story, signing off goodbye friend.