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Vinegar Valentines - For Valentines Day Haters · Dirt Nap City - History's Most Interesting Dead People

• 0:05
  SPEAKER_02: Hey Alex, how are you?
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_02: I'm doing good, Kelly.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_02: How are you?
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_02: I'm doing great.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we've done a few episodes around holidays, and those have always been very popular.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: I want to talk to you about a dead end that is sort of anti-holiday.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_02: So, have you ever heard of vinegar valentines?
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_02: Vinegar Valentines, well, you know, you're familiar with the whole concept of the Valentine card.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: We talked about that in the St.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: Valentine's episode, and you know, how you would remember we would do that in school when we were little.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: Have those little, you know, in elementary school, you'd have those little cards that you gave to everybody.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_02: Vinegar Valentine were popular in the 18 and early 1900s, and they were vulgar, they were cheeky, they were insulting, and they were designed to actually lampoon Valentine's Day's cards, but they were usually anonymous, and they were something that you could send to somebody to diss on them.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_02: It was like a diss track in rap.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: So it's not flirtatious, but they're actually for people you don't like.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_02: In in in the UK, they called them mock valentines.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_02: Sometimes they were called comic valentines, but they had a very distinctive style.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_02: Like if you were to uh you know to Google vinegar valentines, you'd see what I'm talking about.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_02: They were these kind of um almost like Monty Python style drawings of people, and then the people would have a giant head or they would have exaggerated features, and then they would say something like this.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_02: Um this one was for the sales lady at a department store that you didn't like.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_02: As you wait upon the women with disgust upon your face, the way you snap and bark at them, you'd think you own the place.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_02: So was this on Valentine's Day you'd get this?
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you would send these to people on Valentine's instead of a normal Valentine, and you would um you know, typically these were sold and you could find ones that were specific to your scenario, your situation, or whatever it was.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_02: But the best thing about it was back in those days, um, they they usually cost a penny to buy, and then there was uh postage.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: Well, everything back in the 1840s, 1850s, kind of through the early 1900s before we really established the post office in Europe and the US was COD.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_02: So you would send this, the person would get it, they'd have to pay the postage on it, and then they would read it, and it's an insult.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I don't like this.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_01: I don't like this at all.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_01: I don't like it.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_01: I don't like that if I received one of these on Valentine's Day, it would ruin my day.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't care how many Valentines I got.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like I mean, we have this today, right?
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_01: With trolls, we have this with internet trolls.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um the world needs less of that, not more of that, especially anonymous trolls.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like that seems like right out of today.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: This was this was early anonymous trolling.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: And and they did have a list of the type of people you would send this to.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: You might send it to a drunk, a shrew, a bachelor.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_02: Wait, what's a shrew?
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: An old lady, a dandy, see, that's a good thing.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_02: A flirt, a penny pincher, a mean sales lady, a penny pincher.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_02: All of these were victims of it, you know, and and I think we could almost do a dead end on each one of those people that you saw that you just said, right?
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_02: I think I think the idea behind this was to allow people to um sort of express their frustration anonymously before you could do that.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and now we it's all we can, it's all it's all we do now, right?
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I guess it's and the world's not a better place for it.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: No, I think it all started with vinegar valentines.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_02: They were cheap, they were they were cheaply made.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: So a normal Valentine back then might have lace on it, it might be made from really high quality cardstock and printed with care, multiple layers glued together, it might have uh you know intricate folds.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_02: These were usually just a single piece of paper that cost about a penny.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_02: It was only printed on one side.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_02: Sometimes they would even print on the back of something else just to save money, and it would have these really, really exaggerated drawings that were done.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: And these drawings were pretty unflattering.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_02: Like they actually tried to make people look bad.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: I wonder why you didn't hear about this with telephones.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like we have prank calls, but we didn't have any that I know of, any instances with people back when you could be anonymous on the telephone, back before Star 69 and call ID and all those things.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: You didn't have instances with people saying, Hey, you know what?
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_01: You were really rude to me at the counter yesterday, or you were really you're really uh skin flint or uh I don't remember what you uh cheap or whatever.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: We didn't I don't it seemed like that's a thing you could do.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_01: Shrews.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_02: Shrews.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_02: Shrews Shrews.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_02: Um well this I I disagree with you.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_02: I know you could, you know, back then what you could do is you could call the the manager of the store if if the phone was available there.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_02: You could crank call the store, you know, you could start a campaign to do that.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: Instead of crank calling.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah, I mean they these things were really way ahead of their time.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: They sometimes would target even even upstanding people like doctors or the postman.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: They they would sometimes and the postmen actually hated these because these were often returned without the postage being paid.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: So someone would send it, the person would know what it was, wouldn't pay the postage, and so the postman had to do all this work and it I wonder how they knew what it was.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_01: Did they actually you think like put instead of perfume, they put vinegar on it?
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that I I don't know.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_02: I think the vinegar just has to do with the sourness of it and the maybe that's how they knew.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_01: That could be had a scent to it.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: You know, some people used to put perfume on it.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, a little spray, yeah, a little spray of perfume.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe you spray it with a little vinegar.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_02: Well, one of the one of the um sets of people that were pretty targeted by these were women who were um fighting for the right to vote.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_02: So suffragettes.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_02: These suffragettes often got these vinegar valentines sent to them.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_02: And one of them said, For the suffragette, your vote from me you will not get.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want a preaching suffragette.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_02: And then the suffragettes actually came out with their own vinegar postcards that they would send to the haters, and this would say, No vote, no kiss.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_02: So I I yeah.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_02: There was also um there was also a uh movement by women who didn't feel like women should have the right to vote, where they would send out a one of these that was um you know, kind of look like a vinegar postcard, but it it basically would say um that they don't need the right to vote.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_02: Suffragettes did have their own pro-women's rights valentine to pass around on February 14th.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_02: That was the one that said no vote, no kiss.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_02: But there was another one that said, In these wild days of f suffragant drays, I'm sure you'd ne'er overlook a girl who can't be militant militant because she simply loves to cook.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's a lot of words.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_02: But it made sense back then.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_02: And then there's a picture of a woman cooking.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: I wonder what put an end to the uh vinegar valentine.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you can still find them online.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_02: I think I think a lot of the retro steampunk, you know, these kids that you know watch VHS tapes and listen to vinyl, they still they might send the vinegar valentine.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: They're still doing that.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_02: What one of my favorites was called Skidoo, and it said to my Valentine, tis a lemon that I hand you and I bid you now Skidoo because I love another and there's no chance for you.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: Oh man.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_01: Rotten to the core.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_01: Now that one you couldn't be so anonymous.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_02: I guess I guess they might know who they're who sent it.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_02: They might actually so rude.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_02: Understand.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: So do you think you want them back, don't you?
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_01: You like the you like the vinegar valentine's.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_02: Well, uh here's the thing.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not a big fan of Valentine's Day in general.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like it's um, you know, sort of saying, You tell people you love them.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's it's it's just a little bit contrived and old fashioned.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think I would rather than being mean to people though, maybe I would send them something that um like don't you ever know somebody that maybe always has bad breath or they walk around with their zipper down, or there's something that they need to be told, but they don't you don't want to tell them in person.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: There could be sort of a vinegar valentine for that.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_02: What the world needs now is love, Kelly.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I'll leave you with this one.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um this is called the snake, and it was a uh snake who was um you know a woman snake, and she was um a pretty woman's body, but a a uh snake's head, and it said, I'm not attracted by your glitter, for well I know how bitter my life would be if I should take you for my spouse, you rattlesnake.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no, I'd I'd not accept the ring or evermore.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_02: Two would prove a sting.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_01: Let's put it to music.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_01: You should definitely put that to music.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_02: Uh there was one cop pop culture reference I could find.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know who um Susie Durkins is?
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_02: This is going deep.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_02: She was in the love interest of Calvin from Calvin and Hobbes.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_02: The girl he loved to hate.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_02: And in his uh comic strip, there is one where he's making her a vinegar valentine.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: Really?
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_01: He calls it that.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_01: Is that where you heard about it?
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_02: That's where I heard about it.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_02: Everything goes back to Calvin and Hobbes one way or another.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_02: All right, everybody.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_02: Happy Valentine.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_02: Uh hope you don't get a vinegar one, and we'll see you uh in a week.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: Roses are red, your soul is gray.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: Why do you talk like there's something to say?
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: Your laugh is like nails scraping at night.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_00: How did I end up in this flight?
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_00: You leave your stocks all over the place.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: Your jokes hardly ever raised a face.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: Happy miserable.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_00: Happy happy life.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: Your stories drag on like a straight.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: Repetition drives straight.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: You still like even your promises are wine.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: Your cooking is awful and your taste is plain.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_00: Every day is another mundane store.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: Can't stand another second more.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: Happy vegetable house.