Latest / Come Back to Love: / Come Back to Love July 22, 2026 Who Are You Becoming

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Come Back to Love July 22, 2026 Who Are You Becoming · Come Back to Love:

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Welcome to come Back to Love with your host, Robin Vogel.
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Each week at this same time, come Back to Love
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: covers an endless array of topics related to relationships, love
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: and intimacy, along with all the reasons you may be
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: keeping love at a distance. Can a shattered heart be
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: your doorway to your greatest love story? Robin will give
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: you practical tools that can be used to heal the
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: past and help you to safely love again. And now
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Today's come back to Love.
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: In a world that feels disconnected, often uncertain, and overwhelming,
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  Speaker 2: there has never been a more important time to come
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: back to love. I'm Robin Vogel, psychotherapist, relationship expert, love
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  Speaker 2: and intimacy coach, and the author of come Back to Love,
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  Speaker 2: a Path to Healing. For over twenty years, I've been
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  Speaker 2: sitting with people in their most tender, courageous moments, the heartbreaks,
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  Speaker 2: the longing, the walls they've built around their hearts, and
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: the quiet hope that real love is still possible. I
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: want to tell you that it is. This show is
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: a sanctuary, a place to heal the past, reconnect with yourself,
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: and fall in love again with your life, with others
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: and most importantly with yourself. Welcome to Come Back to Love.
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: I'm Robin Vogel and we are on KMET, your ABC
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: News radio affiliate station, come Back to Love airs in
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: southern California. I'm kme e T fourteen ninety AM or
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  Speaker 2: ninety eight point one FM. We are here Thursdays one
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  Speaker 2: thirty pm Pacific, which is four thirty pm Eastern time.
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: Now let's begin. I'm excited to be here with you.
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: I'm happy to be here with you every single week.
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: I wanted to do something a little different today. Every
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: week on this show, we talk about love. We talk
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: about healing. We talk about the patterns that keep us
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  Speaker 2: stuck and the practices that help us move forward. And
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: I'm going to keep doing that. That work isn't going anywhere.
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  Speaker 2: But today I want to zoom out. I want to
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  Speaker 2: talk about something I've been sitting with for a long time,
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  Speaker 2: something that has been quietly shifting, and how I understand
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  Speaker 2: this work, and then how I understand what healing actually is.
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  Speaker 2: Because here's something I've been noticing. Many of the people
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  Speaker 2: who come to me, people who have done real work
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  Speaker 2: on themselves, who have been in therapy, who understand their
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  Speaker 2: attachment style, who can name their patterns and their sleep
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  Speaker 2: They are still stuck. If you feel this, If you're
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: in this category, welcome, especially to today's episode. I want
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  Speaker 2: to say it's not because you haven't healed enough. But
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: for those that feel this way, I think perhaps you're
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: asking the wrong question. For years, food myself in this
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: most of us in the healing world have been asking
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  Speaker 2: how do I fix this? How do I heal what's broken?
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  Speaker 2: How do I get over what happens so I can
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  Speaker 2: finally have the relationship I want. Those are real and
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  Speaker 2: important questions, and the work that you're doing really matters.
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: But here's a deeper question underneath those questions that most
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  Speaker 2: people never get to. Instead of how do I heal?
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: How about who am I becoming? I want you to
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  Speaker 2: hold that question through this entire episode. Who am I becoming?
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  Speaker 2: That shift from healing as repair to healing as transformation
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  Speaker 2: is what I want to explore with you today Again.
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  Speaker 2: I've been doing this work for over twenty years, twenty
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  Speaker 2: five I think at this point, I've sat with hundreds
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  Speaker 2: and hundreds of people in their most vulnerable, courageous moments,
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  Speaker 2: and what I've come to understand is that the deepest
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  Speaker 2: healing isn't about getting back to who you were before
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  Speaker 2: the heartbreak, or before the loss, before the divorce, before
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  Speaker 2: the fill in the blank. It's really about becoming someone
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  Speaker 2: you may have never been before. Someone who doesn't just
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  Speaker 2: understand their patterns, but lives differently because of that understanding.
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  Speaker 2: Someone who doesn't just know they're worthy of love, but
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  Speaker 2: actually feels it in their body and how they move
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  Speaker 2: through the world. That is what we're exploring today. Again.
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  Speaker 2: I'm Robin Vogel. This has come back to love on
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  Speaker 2: km E T and today I want to introduce you
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  Speaker 2: to a new way of thinking about your healing journey.
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  Speaker 2: So stay with me. Let's start by reading some questions
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  Speaker 2: that I hear often. See if any of these sound
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  Speaker 2: familiar to you, has therapy failed me? I've done so
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  Speaker 2: much work. I've been in therapy for years. I understand
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  Speaker 2: exactly why I do what I do. I'm still here
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  Speaker 2: and making the same choices, attracting the same people, feeling
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  Speaker 2: the same feelings. What am I missing? Here's another one?
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  Speaker 2: Why do I understand my patterns but still feel so stuck?
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  Speaker 2: I can see it happening in real time. I watch
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  Speaker 2: myself literally watch myself pull away. When someone gets close
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  Speaker 2: or starts to lean in. I see myself leaning back.
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  Speaker 2: I'm watching it in real time. I notice myself choosing
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  Speaker 2: unavailable people over and over again. Why am I attracted
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  Speaker 2: to people who are not available? I know I overgive
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  Speaker 2: to learn love. That's another thing I notice. I know
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  Speaker 2: all of this and I still do it. What is
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  Speaker 2: wrong with me? I want to answer both of those
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  Speaker 2: questions because the answer is the same for both. Nothing
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  Speaker 2: is wrong with you. Nothing is wrong with you. Therapy
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  Speaker 2: hasn't failed you. You haven't failed you. But here is
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  Speaker 2: what's true. Insight alone, no matter how deep, no matter
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  Speaker 2: how hard, one is not enough to change the nervous system.
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  Speaker 2: Let me say that again, because it's really important. Understanding
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  Speaker 2: your patterns is necessary, but it's not sufficient. It's not everything.
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  Speaker 2: The mind can know something completely and the body can
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  Speaker 2: continue acting as if it doesn't, and vice versa. By
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: the way, I had a client I'll call her Sarah,
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  Speaker 2: who came to me after years of therapy. She was brilliant,
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  Speaker 2: self aware, emotionally articulate. She has a pleasure to work with.
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  Speaker 2: She could map her entire relationship relational history in precise detail.
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  Speaker 2: She understood her abandonment wounds, her anxious attachment as a result,
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  Speaker 2: the way her father's emotional unavailability had shaped her relationships,
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  Speaker 2: and yet she was still choosing emotionally unavailable partners every
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  Speaker 2: time when she came to me. She was exhausted not
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  Speaker 2: from knowing, sorry, not from not knowing what was going on,
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  Speaker 2: but from knowing and still not being able to change.
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  Speaker 2: What Sarah needed wasn't more insight. She needed a different
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  Speaker 2: kind of work, work that goes beneath the mind, into
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  Speaker 2: the body, into the nervous system and the deep layers
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  Speaker 2: of who she is. That's the work I want to
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  Speaker 2: talk about today, because here's the truth. Healing isn't just
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  Speaker 2: a mental process. It's not just emotional sharing, and it
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  Speaker 2: isn't just about understanding. It's a full system transformation mind, body, emotions,
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  Speaker 2: and something even deeper than all of this, something I've
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  Speaker 2: come to think of as the soul's journey. And that
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  Speaker 2: brings me to something I want to share with you
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  Speaker 2: today that I've been developing for years. I call the
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  Speaker 2: Comeback to Love framework, the Four Gates. The Four Gates
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  Speaker 2: framework work I want to walk you through today, not
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  Speaker 2: as a lecture, but as an invitation to see your
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  Speaker 2: own healing journey differently. By the way, you can find
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  Speaker 2: this all in my book Come Back to Love, A
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  Speaker 2: Path to Healing. You can find that anywhere you can
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  Speaker 2: buy books online. Thank you to Kohler Books for publishing
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  Speaker 2: the book last February twenty twenty six. I just want
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  Speaker 2: to invite you to take a look at it, because
• 8:49
  Speaker 2: what I'm going to share right now is a snippet
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  Speaker 2: of what's fully expressed in the book. So there's a
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  Speaker 2: little selfless promotion, all right. So I want to walk
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  Speaker 2: you through the four Gates framework and again, like over
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: the twenty five years that I've been working with people
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  Speaker 2: and doing my own work, I've come to understand that deep,
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  Speaker 2: lasting transformation moves through four distinct doorways. I call them,
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  Speaker 2: as I said, the four gates. Each one is a
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  Speaker 2: different layer of who we are, and each one needs
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  Speaker 2: its own kind of attention. Gate one beyond the emotion.
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  Speaker 2: This is where most healing begins and where most healing stops.
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  Speaker 2: Beyond the emotion means learning to feel your feelings fully
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  Speaker 2: without being controlled by them. It means moving through grief, anger, shame,
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  Speaker 2: and fear rather than around them. Most people either suppress
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  Speaker 2: their emotions entirely. I learned to do this as a child,
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  Speaker 2: and you say, you say things I used to say
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  Speaker 2: this all the time. I'm fine, I'm over it, I'm okay,
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  Speaker 2: or the opposite of suppression, completely overwhelm. Neither one of
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  Speaker 2: those things is healing. Actually, so beyond the emotion, the
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  Speaker 2: work that we do, and beyond the emotion is the
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  Speaker 2: capacity to be with the feelings, be with them fully, completely,
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  Speaker 2: and still remain yourself, still choose, still be present. It's
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  Speaker 2: a kind of grief work of processing heartbreak, of letting
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  Speaker 2: yourself feel what you've been avoiding. For Sarah, this meant
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  Speaker 2: actually crying, actually letting herself feel the grief of a
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  Speaker 2: childhood where emotional connection wasn't safe. Not analyzing it, but
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  Speaker 2: actually feeling it. Some words that people are using these
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  Speaker 2: days are productive discomfort, Like it's productive in your own
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  Speaker 2: healing and growth to feel uncomfortable. All right, we're moving
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  Speaker 2: to Gate two, Beyond the mind. This is where neuroplasticity
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  Speaker 2: comes in and the research founded in neuroscience. Beyond the
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  Speaker 2: mind means identifying the beliefs, the deep, often unconscious stories
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  Speaker 2: that your mind has been running on an autopilot. They
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: might sound like this, love isn't safe. I have to
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  Speaker 2: earn love. I'm too much, I'm not enough. Real love
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  Speaker 2: doesn't last. Love is for other people, not me, et cetera,
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  Speaker 2: et cetera, et cetera. These beliefs were formed early, they
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  Speaker 2: made complete sense in the environment where they developed, and
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  Speaker 2: they have been quietly making your relationship decisions for you
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  Speaker 2: ever since. Beyond the Mind is the work of finding
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  Speaker 2: those beliefs, uncovering them, understanding where they came from initially,
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  Speaker 2: and through specific, repeated come back to love practices, beginning
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  Speaker 2: to install new ones, new beliefs, not by deciding to
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  Speaker 2: believe something different, like I believe this, but I'm going
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  Speaker 2: to decide to believe that instead that doesn't actually work,
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  Speaker 2: not fully and completely, but by practicing it in the
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  Speaker 2: body until the nervous system accepts it as true. This
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  Speaker 2: is really really powerful work. Once we've worked with Gate
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  Speaker 2: one and Gate two, we're going to move to Gate three.
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  Speaker 2: Beyond the human, the soul's journey. This is the one
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  Speaker 2: most healing frameworks leave out entirely, and it may be
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  Speaker 2: the most important one. Beyond the human asks what if
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  Speaker 2: your heartbreak was not a punishment but an invitation. What
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  Speaker 2: if the losses and ruptures and painful relationships of your
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  Speaker 2: life were not random, but were actually the exact experiences
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  Speaker 2: your soul needed to crack you open. I know that
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  Speaker 2: might sound like a reach, especially when you're in the
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  Speaker 2: middle of pain, but I've watched it again and again.
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  Speaker 2: I've watched people reach a point in their healing where
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  Speaker 2: the question shifts from why did this happen to me?
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  Speaker 2: To what is this asking me to become? That shift
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  Speaker 2: from victim of your story to author of your story
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  Speaker 2: is what I mean by the soul's journey. It doesn't
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  Speaker 2: mean the pain wasn't real. It doesn't mean that what
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  Speaker 2: happened was even okay. It just means you are larger
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  Speaker 2: than what happened to you. And I actually have a
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  Speaker 2: very specific method that I guide my clients and participants
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  Speaker 2: through that enables them to get some space and distance
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  Speaker 2: from what happened and from the victim mentality and the
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  Speaker 2: victim energy, so they can actually have a much greater
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  Speaker 2: perspective on what happened in their lives. This for me, personally,
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  Speaker 2: was so so healing. It really moved me from oh
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: my goodness, how could I possibly have experienced four? Very specific?
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  Speaker 2: Actually five? Six? I can keep going deaths and losses.
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  Speaker 2: What is it about my life or about me? It's
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  Speaker 2: having the experience all of this. But when I did
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  Speaker 2: the Gate three work myself beyond the human getting to
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  Speaker 2: the soul's journey, Wow, did I have a perspective that
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  Speaker 2: I never had before? And it really shifted everything for me.
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  Speaker 2: I now see the experiences as an invitation to who
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  Speaker 2: I've become and who I'm becoming. It's a massive, massive transformation.
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  Speaker 2: Now we move to Gate fourth, befriending the body. This
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  Speaker 2: is maybe the most underrated gate of all everything We've
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  Speaker 2: talked about, the emotions, the beliefs, the soul's journey, all
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  Speaker 2: of that has to land where in the body, because
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  Speaker 2: the body is where we hold old patterns, it's where
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  Speaker 2: they live. It's the only place new ones can actually
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  Speaker 2: take hold. So befriending the body means learning to listen
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  Speaker 2: to your body signals, to trust wisdom, to use somatic practices, breath, movement,
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  Speaker 2: touch to complete the healing that the mind alone cannot finish.
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  Speaker 2: I just want to say that again, the mind alone
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  Speaker 2: cannot finish the healing. We have to befriend the body
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  Speaker 2: to take another giant step forward. Sarah's breakthrough didn't happen
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  Speaker 2: in a therapy session where she understood something new. It
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  Speaker 2: happened in a moment during a somatic practice we were
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  Speaker 2: doing together, where she felt for the first time in
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  Speaker 2: her body what it's like to be safe, what it's
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  Speaker 2: like to feel safe, not to think about safety, but
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  Speaker 2: to actually feel it on the inside. That's the difference.
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  Speaker 2: That's a huge difference. So these are the four gates.
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  Speaker 2: The four gates approach to come back to love, beyond
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  Speaker 2: the emotion, beyond the mind, beyond the human and befriending
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  Speaker 2: the body. And here's what I want you to hear,
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  Speaker 2: my friends. You may have been doing this work, this
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  Speaker 2: work of one or two of these gates for years,
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  Speaker 2: but if any of the gates remain closed, the transformation
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  Speaker 2: stays incomplete until you open the next gate, and until
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  Speaker 2: you in fact open all four gates and do the work.
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  Speaker 2: That's the complete system. And that's the complete system that
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  Speaker 2: I've developed and that I've documented, and that I've studied
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  Speaker 2: and researched, and that is come back to love. So
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  Speaker 2: it's not a criticism of anything you've done. Before at all.
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  Speaker 2: There's no right, wrong, good or bad, so please don't
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  Speaker 2: hear it that way. This is an invitation for you
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  Speaker 2: to step in more fully, to go further than you've
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  Speaker 2: ever gone before. I invite you to join me and
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: to simply go to come back to love dot com
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: for more information. If you have any questions, you can
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: fill out that contact form on my website. You can
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: also email me, Robin rob ym at comeback to love
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: dot com. All right, I have some listener questions with me.
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  Speaker 2: I wanted to answer a few of them that I
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  Speaker 2: think are alive for a lot of you right now.
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  Speaker 2: The first one that came in is what if my
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: heartbreak is actually not an invitation? Like I hear you say, Robin,
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  Speaker 2: I get it again, but I want to say, after
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  Speaker 2: inviting a deep breath, it almost always is. This isn't
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  Speaker 2: a spiritual bypass or anything like that. This isn't like
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  Speaker 2: everything happens for a reason, said to someone who's still bleeding.
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  Speaker 2: But the deeper sense of the heartbreak that you've experienced,
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  Speaker 2: the loss you've experienced, the grief, the chaos of your past,
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  Speaker 2: whatever it is for you, it all has information in
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  Speaker 2: it for you, for you that's the key. It might
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  Speaker 2: have information about what you've been settling for in your life.
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  Speaker 2: There may be information about the patterns that you've been running,
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  Speaker 2: about the version of love you were willing to accept.
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  Speaker 2: Underneath all of that is an invitation to something new,
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  Speaker 2: something different, something more true. That is an alignment with
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  Speaker 2: who you truly are. That's big. Okay. Another question, can
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  Speaker 2: I stop trying to fix myself? A lot of people
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  Speaker 2: ask that. I want to respond with, yeah, please stop.
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  Speaker 2: Not because the work stops, but because the orientation shifts,
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  Speaker 2: the framework shifts. There is such a profound difference between
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  Speaker 2: healing yourself because you feel like you're broken and need fixing,
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: and growing because you're curious about who you're becoming. One
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  Speaker 2: is driven by shame, the other is driven by love.
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  Speaker 2: The four gates. Work is not about fixing you, it's
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  Speaker 2: about freeing you. That's a huge distinction.
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  Speaker 3: Okay.
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  Speaker 2: Third question, how do I know if I'm awakening instead
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  Speaker 2: of falling apart? This is a big one. I like
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  Speaker 2: to say falling together. I learned it that years ago.
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  Speaker 2: I was kind of a hard concept to to grasp
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  Speaker 2: when I was crying my eyes out at a workshop
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: and couldn't stop crying and said to the facilitator, I
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: can't stop crying, and he said, we don't want you to.
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  Speaker 2: I want you to keep going and going and going
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  Speaker 2: until you can't can't anymore. And that's when I started
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  Speaker 2: learning this language of falling together, because first we have
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: to dismantle and fall apart before we can rebuild. Right
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  Speaker 2: the phoenix rises from the ashes. Here's what I've noticed.
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  Speaker 2: Fly apart can feel like losing yourself. Awakening feels like
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  Speaker 2: finding yourself, even when it's uncomfortable, even when it's disorienting,
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  Speaker 2: even when nothing looks the way you thought it would.
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  Speaker 2: The difference is your orientation, your framework, how you're looking
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  Speaker 2: at it. Falling apart collapses inward. Awakening, even when it's painful,
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  Speaker 2: has a forward direction to it, a sense, however, faint
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  Speaker 2: that something's opening. If you're asking this question, if you're
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: wondering whether you're awakening rather than falling apart, that wondering
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  Speaker 2: in itself is a sign. People who are simply falling
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  Speaker 2: apart don't usually ask that question. And I want to say,
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: when you're falling apart, I invite you to shift the
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: language to falling together, because something is going to rise
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  Speaker 2: from those ashes. Before I let you go today, I
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  Speaker 2: want to give you something to carry into your week,
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  Speaker 2: A practice exactly more of an invitation. At this point,
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  Speaker 2: you really do know that I love that word invitation.
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  Speaker 2: I invite you to find a quiet moment this week,
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  Speaker 2: maybe this weekend, maybe tonight morning, whenever you have a
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  Speaker 2: moment to sit with these two questions. You might want
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  Speaker 2: to write them down. The first is, what if nothing
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  Speaker 2: is wrong with me? Hm, just let that land. What
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: if nothing is wrong with me? What would be different
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  Speaker 2: if you approached your healing and your life from a
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: completely different place of not fixing what's broken anymore, but
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: from a place of genuine curiosity about who you're becoming?
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  Speaker 2: Remember I asked you to hold that question through this
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  Speaker 2: whole episode. Who am I becoming? The second question, what
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: if my life is trying to awaken me rather than
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  Speaker 2: punish me. What if every heartbreak, loss, every painful pattern
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  Speaker 2: was not evidence that you're doing it wrong, but an
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: invitation to go deeper than you've ever gone before. You
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: don't have to have answers right now. These aren't questions
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: to get answered in one sitting. There are questions to
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: hold to breathe with to meditate on, to live into,
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: carry them with you this week. If what we explored
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: today resonated, if you felt something open when we talked
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: about the four Gates, when I asked if nothing is
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: wrong with you, how would your life be, or any
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: of the questions I've asked today, I want to invite
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: you to join me somewhere, someplace really special this August,
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: in about a month, I'll be teaching at the Omega
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: Institute in Rhinebeck, New York. Easy to fly into New
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: York City and quick ride up to Rhinebeck. It's beautiful,
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: one of the most respected personal growth centers in the country.
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: The workshops called come Back to Love, and it's built
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: entirely around what we talked about today, five days together
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: of going through all four gates in a small, intimate,
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: sacred held container in one of the most beautiful settings
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: I know. If something in you is ready for this
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: next level of work, I would love to have you there.
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: The details are at Comeback too Loove dot com. You
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: can also find them on the Omega website. Just search
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: for my name. And if you're not ready for a
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: full retreat yet, start with a free thirty minute phone
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: conversation with me. I just love to talk to people.
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: I love to hear your story. I would love to
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: understand what you're getting from listening to the radio show
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: and answer any questions that you have. You can book
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: your free call at Comeback Too Loove dot com. Again,
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: I'm Robin Vogel and this is kme E T. I
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: invite you to be gentle with yourself. Love is possible,
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: and it starts with coming back to you. I look
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: forward to seeing you next week and every Thursday at
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: one thirty pm Pacific or four thirty pm Eastern time.
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: Have a beautiful day and I look forward to seeing
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: you next week.
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: Hi, this is Robin Vogel, host of come Back to Love.
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: If you are ready to heal the past and open
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: your heart to love again, I want to talk with you.
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: Book a free thirty minute private conversation with me at
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: Comebacktolove dot com. I'll meet you where you are and
• 24:18
  Speaker 3: give you real tools.
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: You can use right now. Because love isn't just possible
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: for you, it's waiting for you. Go to Comeback too
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: Love dot com and book your free thirty minutes.
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: Today you've been listening to come Back to Love with
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: Robin Vogel, a transformative program that covers an endless array
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: of topics related to relationships, love and intimacy, along with
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: all the reasons you may be keeping love at a distance.
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: Tune in each week as Robin gives you practical tools
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: that can be used to heal the past and help
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: you to safely love again. Join Robin again next week
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: at the same time for come Back to Love, I
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: Take Ast