Latest / Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast / Jerry Brudos - The Shoe Fetish Slayer - Part 2

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Jerry Brudos - The Shoe Fetish Slayer - Part 2 · Wicked and Grim: A True Crime Podcast

0:07
Speaker 1: Last episode, we began the story of Jerry Brutos, also
0:12
Speaker 1: known as the Shoe Fetish Slayer. Today, we're carrying on
0:17
Speaker 1: with part two, so be sure to check out part
0:19
Speaker 1: one before listening. Today.
0:22
Speaker 2: My name's Ben, I'm Nicole, and you're listening to Wicked and.
0:26
Speaker 1: Grim, a true crime podcast.
0:29
Speaker 2: Warning.
0:30
Speaker 1: The following podcast material intended for a matural audience. Listener
0:37
Speaker 1: discretion is advised. You gotta drink ready, I do you do?
1:00
Speaker 1: Do you guys have a drink ready? I've got a
1:03
Speaker 1: drink ready. We record in the morning. I'm not having
1:06
Speaker 1: whiskey per se, as I promised last episode, because it
1:09
Speaker 1: is eight am. Maybe if we recorded any evening I would,
1:12
Speaker 1: But today I've got coffee and Carolan's. I've irished it up.
1:16
Speaker 1: We good. Make sure you have a comfort drink too,
1:19
Speaker 1: because you're gonna need it today.
1:20
Speaker 2: I have Greens. Is that considered a comfort drink?
1:23
Speaker 1: I think? So? I don't even know what greens is
1:25
Speaker 1: or that's just.
1:26
Speaker 2: Like that like a supplement of Okay, yeah, but it
1:28
Speaker 2: actually doesn't taste terrible, So we're okay, We're okay.
1:31
Speaker 1: Like I say, the point of having a quote drink
1:34
Speaker 1: with us is a comfort drink. It can be water
1:37
Speaker 1: if you need hydrating. It could be coffee, it could
1:39
Speaker 1: be whiskey, it could be beer. It's a drink that
1:42
Speaker 1: you find you can just kind of have your security,
1:45
Speaker 1: blank the edge off and sip away when you need it.
1:48
Speaker 2: You know, distracts you.
1:51
Speaker 1: Yes, distracts you that there you go, distracts you, takes you,
1:55
Speaker 1: snaps you back to the reality of your real world
1:57
Speaker 1: rather than the world you're listening to. So hopefully you
2:00
Speaker 1: have something like that right now that can do that.
2:02
Speaker 1: Maybe you even have I don't know, a little doggle
2:04
Speaker 1: by your side.
2:05
Speaker 2: You can reach out pack man. That is the best
2:09
Speaker 2: of comfort. Really, there's nothing better.
2:11
Speaker 1: Well, we have our one dog, Ripley, who's like an
2:13
Speaker 1: mpath dog. She can sense when you're upset and she'll
2:16
Speaker 1: come over and just like rest your head on your
2:18
Speaker 1: lap and stare at you.
2:19
Speaker 2: Well, in anytime better and I hug she like instantly,
2:24
Speaker 2: she goes right in between our legs, like she joins
2:26
Speaker 2: our hug. It is it is the like, we need
2:28
Speaker 2: to get that on video. It's the sweetest cutest thing
2:31
Speaker 2: I've ever seen.
2:31
Speaker 1: Yeah, She'll be laying there and then we hug and
2:33
Speaker 1: then she'll just stand up and come walk come running
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Speaker 1: over and just like walk in between her legs and
2:37
Speaker 1: put herself in the middle. Oh man, it's adorable, Like who.
2:40
Speaker 2: What kind of dog does that?
2:42
Speaker 1: That is just I know. Anyway, Yeah, we digress, We digress.
2:47
Speaker 1: Are you ready to carry on with part two? Oh?
2:49
Speaker 2: I think so? Yeah, You're gonna give us a little
2:52
Speaker 2: recap there.
2:53
Speaker 1: Okay, I will. Yes. So we started the story of
2:56
Speaker 1: Jerry Brudos, right, a man known as the shoe fetish
2:59
Speaker 1: Slayer also sometimes the lust Killer. There's a few different
3:03
Speaker 1: names he's gone by, but those are the primary ones.
3:06
Speaker 1: And he went through a few attempted abductions that did
3:09
Speaker 1: not go according to his plan. How the remains of
3:13
Speaker 1: some of his victims were discovered. We talked about last
3:15
Speaker 1: time as well and his initial arrest. Then we began
3:20
Speaker 1: talking about who Jerry Brudos was, starting with his upbringing
3:23
Speaker 1: and mentioning the inciting incident that psychologist believes to be
3:27
Speaker 1: when his fetish and tendencies really began.
3:31
Speaker 2: And that's where we left off with his mother kind
3:34
Speaker 2: of thing.
3:34
Speaker 1: Yes, with the incident with his mother and berating him
3:37
Speaker 1: in shoes and women's clothing.
3:39
Speaker 2: And then wishing he was a girl.
3:41
Speaker 1: And then he found a pair of shoes, discarded high
3:44
Speaker 1: heeled shoes, brought them home, and his mother was irate
3:47
Speaker 1: made burn them in front of him, and those were
3:49
Speaker 1: his prize possession sort of thing. Right, So yeah, that's
3:53
Speaker 1: where we left off, and we have a lot more
3:55
Speaker 1: to cover to trust.
3:56
Speaker 2: Me, I'm sure we do. Yeah, okay, So.
3:58
Speaker 1: You ready for this?
3:59
Speaker 2: I am all right.
4:01
Speaker 1: So we're going to start by continuing to look at
4:03
Speaker 1: Jerry in his early life, leading all the way up
4:05
Speaker 1: to his arrest. So here we go. So after that
4:09
Speaker 1: incident with his mother and losing those shoes, life kind
4:12
Speaker 1: of went on for little Jerry. But one day in
4:15
Speaker 1: first grade, Jerry became captivated by his teacher's habit of
4:18
Speaker 1: switching into high heels at the start of each day.
4:22
Speaker 1: She had come in like sneakers or whatever, right, and
4:25
Speaker 1: then switch into high heels for work. Basically okay, and
4:28
Speaker 1: she clearly had a love for fashion, even keeping an
4:31
Speaker 1: extra pair of heels tucked under her desk. Now, whatever
4:34
Speaker 1: the practical reason was for this spared pair of shoes
4:36
Speaker 1: with a fashion or in case a heel breaks, who knows,
4:39
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter, and it didn't matter to Jerry either.
4:41
Speaker 1: What mattered was how badly he wanted those shoes. So
4:45
Speaker 1: that day, Jerry's focus wasn't on his lessons in the classroom,
4:49
Speaker 1: but on the shoes instead. He spent hours staring at them,
4:54
Speaker 1: building up the nerve to try and take them for himself. Finally,
4:58
Speaker 1: when the teacher wasn't looking, did quietly he slipped the
5:02
Speaker 1: high heels into his backpack, thinking he had gotten away
5:06
Speaker 1: with his first heist. But his victory was short lived.
5:09
Speaker 1: Another student noticed Jerry sneaking the shoes away and reported
5:13
Speaker 1: it to the teacher. When he was approached about this
5:18
Speaker 1: by the teacher, he was embarrassed. He was humiliated in
5:21
Speaker 1: front of the class, and he bolted out of the classroom,
5:23
Speaker 1: his face just burning red with shame from what he did.
5:26
Speaker 1: Right So, that failed theft may have been a small incident,
5:31
Speaker 1: but it was a glimpse at the compulsions that were
5:34
Speaker 1: beginning to haunt Jerry.
5:36
Speaker 2: It's so hard I just have to say, for me
5:38
Speaker 2: to even comprehend that, like a little one year old
5:42
Speaker 2: or not one year first grader is six is so
5:46
Speaker 2: fixated on something like that, you know, Like I don't know,
5:49
Speaker 2: I just think back to myself for like other first graders,
5:53
Speaker 2: and I just you're like so care free and you're
5:56
Speaker 2: just all over the place. And but he's just like
5:59
Speaker 2: already has this like obsessive compulsive disorder kind of thing, right, like.
6:03
Speaker 1: Oh, one hundred percent he does.
6:05
Speaker 2: Yeah.
6:05
Speaker 1: But the thing is this isn't naturally developing with him.
6:07
Speaker 1: He was instilled with this from those actions of his mother, right.
6:11
Speaker 2: Yeah, but it just seems like so young to be having,
6:13
Speaker 2: you know, like in this sort of thing.
6:16
Speaker 1: It is. I don't think like at this age, I
6:18
Speaker 1: don't think it's a fetish sort of thing. I don't
6:20
Speaker 1: think it's a sexual thing at least not yet. Yeah,
6:24
Speaker 1: it's just he has this obsession with the shoes.
6:27
Speaker 2: It's almost his comfort I think.
6:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, like he wants to wear them, he enjoys it,
6:32
Speaker 1: you know, that sort of thing, and he was forced
6:34
Speaker 1: to do it behind closed doors. He's forced to be
6:36
Speaker 1: shameful about it. So now it's just like he I mean,
6:42
Speaker 1: if his mother just gave him a fucking pair of
6:44
Speaker 1: high heels, he probably would have played with him for
6:46
Speaker 1: a week a month and then like got bored of them,
6:49
Speaker 1: and that would have been that got it out of
6:50
Speaker 1: his system per se. And that's just me like speculation. Possibly,
6:54
Speaker 1: but it is possible, and maybe he would have moved
6:57
Speaker 1: on with his life, but he didn't. He didn't have
6:59
Speaker 1: that upper tunity. So he's got to sneak around and
7:02
Speaker 1: be careful and do it behind closed doors when no
7:05
Speaker 1: one's looking, and he rarely gets that opportunity, especially at
7:08
Speaker 1: this age. Oh jeez. So during his teenage years, Jerry
7:14
Speaker 1: became a little bit infamous in his neighborhood for his
7:17
Speaker 1: troubling behavior. He was known for sneaking into nearby homes
7:20
Speaker 1: to steal women's underwear, which he hoarded in secret. Every
7:25
Speaker 1: time he was caught, his mother subjected him to harsh punishments, beatings,
7:29
Speaker 1: verbal humiliation, things that only deepened his resentment and shame.
7:34
Speaker 1: As he got older, his actions escalated even further. He
7:37
Speaker 1: began stalking women who walked out alone at night, lurking
7:41
Speaker 1: in the shadows and waiting for that opportunity when he
7:43
Speaker 1: could strike on them. When he found a vulnerable target,
7:47
Speaker 1: Jerry would attack, often strangling the women until they were unconscious.
7:53
Speaker 1: He didn't harm them further after that, but he would
7:56
Speaker 1: steal their shoes as trophies. Before fleeing the scene. Man, Yeah,
8:01
Speaker 1: imagine waking up without your shoes after an attack like that.
8:04
Speaker 2: Well, and I feel like that could easily go wrong
8:06
Speaker 2: though too, Like how does he for sure no one
8:09
Speaker 2: to stop? And you know, like I feel like you
8:12
Speaker 2: could easily he could accidentally kill one of them, even
8:15
Speaker 2: if he wasn't intending to.
8:16
Speaker 1: It's possible if you go too far, for sure. Now,
8:20
Speaker 1: by Jerry's mid teens, his behavior has had caused enough
8:23
Speaker 1: trouble that the family did decide to move to a
8:25
Speaker 1: new town in Oregon. His parents hoped that a fresh
8:28
Speaker 1: start and a new environment might help Jerry leave his
8:30
Speaker 1: troubling reputation behind. Unfortunately, the move did little to curb
8:35
Speaker 1: his escalating behavior, as his obsession and impulsions just followed
8:40
Speaker 1: him wherever he went. Sorry, it's morning. I'm not doing
8:45
Speaker 1: so well with my voice right now. I need more
8:47
Speaker 1: SIPs of coffee. So but just at sixteen years old,
8:51
Speaker 1: Jerry spent an entire weekend out, you know, in this
8:55
Speaker 1: new place in Oregon, digging a deep pit on a hillside,
8:58
Speaker 1: away from prying eyes. He went out here all alone,
9:02
Speaker 1: and he began digging the pit, and he fantasized to
9:04
Speaker 1: himself about imprisoning a woman and having her captive here
9:08
Speaker 1: in this pit. Yes, he pictured having a woman helped
9:12
Speaker 1: captive in a fucking pit, and he's like, oh, just
9:15
Speaker 1: thinking about how she could be begging for freedom and
9:18
Speaker 1: that sort of thing, very silence of the Lamb's esque, which,
9:22
Speaker 1: as I mentioned in episode one, this there is some
9:25
Speaker 1: influence from this case that went into the movie and
9:28
Speaker 1: Buffalo Bill.
9:29
Speaker 2: See when you've were talking about this pit, my first
9:32
Speaker 2: reaction was that he was just going to store some
9:34
Speaker 2: of his stolen shit in there, not like a freaking woman.
9:38
Speaker 1: No, he planned on having a person in there. Okay, Now,
9:42
Speaker 1: thankfully no individual ever saw the inside of this pit.
9:47
Speaker 1: This pit, this pit, this pit.
9:53
Speaker 2: Oh we're really in for this Okay. Yeah, I'm already
9:56
Speaker 2: just like sitting here just shocked by everything.
10:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, you should be, because it's fucked now. When Jerry
10:04
Speaker 1: was seventeen, he put together a plan to get a
10:06
Speaker 1: local girl alone. He took a pair of her underwear,
10:10
Speaker 1: and then he pretended that he knew who was responsible
10:13
Speaker 1: for it, and then he wanted to help this girl
10:15
Speaker 1: get this pair of underwear back. So he's like, I
10:17
Speaker 1: can help you. You know what, I know, who did it?
10:19
Speaker 1: Come over to my place, and we're gonna go through
10:22
Speaker 1: this and we're gonna get figured out for you.
10:23
Speaker 2: Right.
10:24
Speaker 1: So he invited her over to his home, and as
10:26
Speaker 1: soon as she arrived on step inside, he then grabbed
10:29
Speaker 1: her with face mask on so covering his face, and
10:32
Speaker 1: he grabbed her wielding a kitchen knife.
10:34
Speaker 2: Holy shit.
10:36
Speaker 1: He then forced this girl to strip and posed for
10:39
Speaker 1: dozens of photographs before letting her go. What so that's seventeen.
10:45
Speaker 2: Oh man, okay, Yeah.
10:47
Speaker 1: The girl was absolutely terrified. Yeah, and left their home
10:51
Speaker 1: in tears and immediately reported the ordeal to the police,
10:54
Speaker 1: but for one reason or another, no arrests were ever made.
10:59
Speaker 1: What the Yeah, it seems like that's a pretty fucking
11:02
Speaker 1: serious incident. I don't know why that didn't go anywhere.
11:05
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, and did he not imagine that she would
11:07
Speaker 2: go and report this? Like? What the what was he? Oh?
11:11
Speaker 1: God, that's just so gross, I know, right, Like there's
11:14
Speaker 1: there's not understandable when someone attacks, but like I get
11:19
Speaker 1: that they're like trying to cover their face and like
11:21
Speaker 1: they're going through the attack to trying to remain anonymous. Meanwhile,
11:25
Speaker 1: he lured her here and it's his home. You think
11:30
Speaker 1: this isn't gonna like trace back to you? Yeah, you
11:33
Speaker 1: think that face mask is gonna, you know, maybe solve it.
11:36
Speaker 2: He figured that she He's like threatened her enough that
11:39
Speaker 2: she wouldn't say that could be like an option, I guess.
11:43
Speaker 1: But but she's probably like, I know who this fucking was.
11:46
Speaker 2: So yeah, I'm glad she did report it.
11:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, but he did get away with that one. Like
11:51
Speaker 1: I said, no arrests were made, And the following year,
11:54
Speaker 1: Jerry decided to try his luck with a similar plan,
11:58
Speaker 1: so he kidnapped a seventeen year old girl in his car.
12:01
Speaker 1: He then took her to a secluded area with a
12:03
Speaker 1: deserted farmhouse, and he took her to this farmhouse. There
12:07
Speaker 1: he began to beat the girl severely. Now, thankfully, there
12:13
Speaker 1: was a couple that was walking past the property at
12:15
Speaker 1: the time and they heard the girl's screams coming from
12:17
Speaker 1: this abandoned farmhouse and they went to see what was happening.
12:22
Speaker 1: That was when they found Jerry looming over his helpless victim.
12:26
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, okay, the fact that they went and investigated
12:30
Speaker 2: is pretty pretty incredible.
12:32
Speaker 1: It is pretty daring. So put on them. Honestly, they
12:35
Speaker 1: probably saved this girl's life, no kidding, But he was
12:38
Speaker 1: caught red handed, though Jerry did attempt to spin a
12:41
Speaker 1: bizarre kind of claim. He's like, oh, I was just
12:45
Speaker 1: helping this girl. I already scared off the real attacker.
12:48
Speaker 2: All of shit.
12:50
Speaker 1: Yeah. I'm pretty sure that was the couple's reaction too,
12:53
Speaker 1: because they didn't buy his story at all, and they
12:55
Speaker 1: called police pretty much immediately. Oh what an I know,
13:01
Speaker 1: He's just like, oh no, I'm the hero. Yeah, I'm
13:03
Speaker 1: pretty sure this girl is gonna fucking tell that couple otherwise.
13:07
Speaker 1: But when Jerry was confronted, he did confess to everything
13:10
Speaker 1: about it and everything like his perversions, all this sort
13:14
Speaker 1: of stuff. So a subsequent search of his room occurred,
13:17
Speaker 1: and it revealed a hidden stash of stolen women's underwear
13:21
Speaker 1: and of course some non consensual photographs. His now twisted
13:26
Speaker 1: collection lay bare for everyone to see, and it was
13:30
Speaker 1: all taken away from him. He was stripped of his
13:33
Speaker 1: trophies and exposed. Jerry was left humiliated and defeated and
13:39
Speaker 1: forced to face the consequences. Now, it's unclear of exactly
13:46
Speaker 1: what his arrest occurred with this one. I do know
13:50
Speaker 1: that he had an incriminating file after this, but I
13:54
Speaker 1: do know he was not necessarily sent to prison by
13:57
Speaker 1: the sounds of it. He was sent to a psych
13:59
Speaker 1: word in Oregon State Hospital instead. Okay, because here he
14:04
Speaker 1: underwent a battery of psychological evaluations. He was officially diagnosed
14:08
Speaker 1: with borderline schizophrenia, sexual fetishism, and what they euphemistically described
14:14
Speaker 1: as severe psychological mum or sorry, severe pathological mummy issues.
14:19
Speaker 2: Oh wow.
14:20
Speaker 1: Yeah. So, despite his his commitment to the psych ward
14:25
Speaker 1: and trying to get better, Jerry was still allowed to
14:29
Speaker 1: actually attend high school at the same time, and he
14:32
Speaker 1: did manage to graduate in nineteen fifty seven. Now, his
14:36
Speaker 1: nine months in the psych ward didn't cure his disturbing
14:38
Speaker 1: tendencies though. Instead they gave him the tools to suppress them,
14:43
Speaker 1: or at least hide them well enough to convince anyone
14:45
Speaker 1: else that he was in fact cured.
14:49
Speaker 2: Okay, because he probably almost needed longer in there, which Okay,
14:54
Speaker 2: the people that were initially like investigating this and found
14:58
Speaker 2: all this shit, they were probably just like, wow, like,
15:00
Speaker 2: we have a huge problem here. Yeah, and they I
15:04
Speaker 2: don't know, I feel like they could have nipped it
15:06
Speaker 2: in the butt potentially, but they didn't I don't know,
15:11
Speaker 2: didn't have him in there long enough or something. I guess.
15:14
Speaker 1: I see, I disagree. I don't think you.
15:17
Speaker 2: Don't think it's possible.
15:18
Speaker 1: I don't think. I don't think he was reformable. I
15:21
Speaker 1: don't think it was possible to reform Jerry Brutos at
15:24
Speaker 1: all at this point.
15:25
Speaker 2: No, it's far too already too far.
15:27
Speaker 1: Okay, you have to remember at this point, he's what eighteen,
15:31
Speaker 1: He's been going through this for nearly two decades of
15:34
Speaker 1: his life. Remember, his mother was berating him in women's
15:37
Speaker 1: clothing as like as younger than five, because five was
15:41
Speaker 1: the incident with the shoes when he stole them and
15:43
Speaker 1: they burned in front of him. So even if we
15:45
Speaker 1: make that five year old the landing point for all this,
15:50
Speaker 1: that leaves twelve years of this instilled within him.
15:54
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, it's just so interesting though it started
15:57
Speaker 2: just like with women's shoes, and it's sure fricking progress.
16:00
Speaker 1: Yeah. Now, I do want to say, if he was
16:04
Speaker 1: able to be reformed, I think it would have taken
16:07
Speaker 1: several decades, not just like, oh I'll give him a
16:10
Speaker 1: year or two. No, I'm thinking I'm talking like give
16:12
Speaker 1: him fucking twenty thirty years and maybe because I think
16:15
Speaker 1: this is so deep, this is literally who he is.
16:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it would definitely have taken some more time
16:21
Speaker 2: than nine months.
16:22
Speaker 1: Yeah. Now, after his discharge from the hospital, Jerry attempted
16:26
Speaker 1: to turn over a new leaf by joining the military.
16:29
Speaker 1: At the time, his assault conviction and psychological diagnosis weren't
16:33
Speaker 1: flagged as issues because I mean, hey, it is like,
16:35
Speaker 1: what the nineteen sixties, so yeah, or at least almost
16:41
Speaker 1: the nineteen sixties. I think it was still late nineteen fifty,
16:43
Speaker 1: but anyways, I digress. He was accepted without question, but
16:47
Speaker 1: Jerry's time in the service was short lived. He his
16:51
Speaker 1: main ambition during this time, disturbingly, was to be try
16:55
Speaker 1: and get stationed in Korea, where he fantasized about a
16:58
Speaker 1: Korean woman seducing him and fulfilling his dominating fantasies.
17:02
Speaker 2: Jeez, yeah, that is like such a reason to join
17:06
Speaker 2: the military, hey.
17:08
Speaker 1: Right, Instead, he was sent to Fort Gordon, Georgia, where
17:12
Speaker 1: his bizarre behavior quickly drew attention. Jerry was advised to
17:16
Speaker 1: meet with a military psychiatrist, and during their session he
17:19
Speaker 1: spoke openly about his troubling domination fantasies. Not The exact
17:23
Speaker 1: details of the discussion remained unclear, but his military record
17:27
Speaker 1: noted that he was discharged for bizarre obsessions. His brief
17:31
Speaker 1: attempt at military life had ended in utter failure. After discharge,
17:36
Speaker 1: Jerry returned home to Oregon. His parents allowed him to
17:39
Speaker 1: move back, but only under the strict conditions that he
17:42
Speaker 1: wasn't allowed to sleep in the house. Instead, he had
17:44
Speaker 1: to sleep in the farm shed.
17:46
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
17:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, just continuing that shaming beration of their child.
17:53
Speaker 2: Just like parents of the fricking year. Hey yeah, holy shit.
17:58
Speaker 1: Isolated, Jerry's first strations grew. Feeling stripped of all his dignity,
18:03
Speaker 1: all his control, he reverted to his old ways to
18:07
Speaker 1: vent out his anger. Jerry stalked and attacked a random woman,
18:13
Speaker 1: strangling her until she lost consciousness. With the woman incapacitated,
18:17
Speaker 1: Jerry took her shoes and ran back to his bed,
18:21
Speaker 1: curling up to sleep with them held tight in his arms.
18:26
Speaker 1: His violent fantasies were still very much so alive. Jerry's
18:29
Speaker 1: ability to suppress and you know, like hide these perversions
18:34
Speaker 1: had been nothing more than a facade. By the time
18:38
Speaker 1: Jerry Brutos turned twenty two. He had trained as an
18:41
Speaker 1: electrician and appeared to be settling into a conventional lifestyle.
18:45
Speaker 1: He met Darcy Metzler, a seventeen year old girl who
18:49
Speaker 1: would become his wife. Her parents strongly opposed the couple's relationship,
18:54
Speaker 1: probably because they kind of could see Jerry for who
18:57
Speaker 1: he was, A total creep. Yeah, but their disapproval only
19:01
Speaker 1: drove Darcy closer to Jerry.
19:03
Speaker 2: Okay, as it would Yeah, yep.
19:05
Speaker 1: For the first time in his life, Jerry experienced genuine
19:09
Speaker 1: affection from a woman, and it cemented their bond together. Now,
19:13
Speaker 1: to the outside world, Jerry seemed to have transformed finally
19:17
Speaker 1: into a respectable family man. He didn't drink, he didn't
19:21
Speaker 1: smoke or swear, making it seem like he was just normal.
19:26
Speaker 1: But behind closed doors, his devyan tendencies were very much
19:30
Speaker 1: so alive and thriving. Early in their marriage, Jerry imposed
19:34
Speaker 1: strict rules on Darcy, demanding that she serve him absolutely
19:39
Speaker 1: unconditionally as his housewife. She was to wear only high
19:43
Speaker 1: heels around the house.
19:46
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, okay, yeah, holy shit, I would rage.
19:50
Speaker 1: Yeah. Now, I did read some articles talking about how
19:54
Speaker 1: she was told she could wear nothing but high heels,
19:57
Speaker 1: and I read one saying only high heels. So I'm
20:01
Speaker 1: going to assume it's a little bit of a mix
20:02
Speaker 1: because I can't imagine she's just constantly nude stretting about
20:06
Speaker 1: the house, you know what I mean. Yeah, but I mean, hey,
20:08
Speaker 1: it is a possibility.
20:09
Speaker 2: Well, and I think she's so much younger, like not
20:11
Speaker 2: like it's not terrible, but like five years, like that's
20:15
Speaker 2: substantial when they're that age kind of thing.
20:17
Speaker 1: In Yeah, the percentage wise, the age gap is rather
20:21
Speaker 1: it is not like creepy, but it's a bit large. Yeah,
20:24
Speaker 1: I mean technically she was seventeen when they met, not eighteen.
20:28
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, okay, yeah, but yeah, I mean by
20:31
Speaker 1: the time they got married, I'm sure she was well
20:34
Speaker 1: over seventeen eighteen nineteen, who knows, but yeah. Anyways, Over time,
20:39
Speaker 1: Darcy appeared to fall completely under Jerry's control, seemingly brainwashed
20:44
Speaker 1: by his absolute dominance. The couple moved frequently before settling
20:47
Speaker 1: into Portland, Oregon, where Jerry secured a stable job as
20:50
Speaker 1: a radio station technician. They welcomed a daughter in nineteen
20:55
Speaker 1: sixty two and his son, Jason in nineteen sixty seven.
20:59
Speaker 1: For years, it seemed as though this family life and
21:01
Speaker 1: love of his devoted wife kept Jerry's dark urges in check. Mean, yeah, sure,
21:06
Speaker 1: some weird stuff's going on at home. It's consensual stuff. Hey,
21:09
Speaker 1: all the power to you, right, So it seems like
21:12
Speaker 1: everything's in order. However, psychologists have since noted that the
21:15
Speaker 1: birth of his son Jason, marked a critical turning point
21:19
Speaker 1: in Jerry's life. See. During Jason's birth, Darcy barred Jerry
21:23
Speaker 1: from entering the maternity ward for whatever reason she had right,
21:28
Speaker 1: and it's believed that this act triggered a profound sense
21:31
Speaker 1: of betrayal and disempowerment in Jerry. He viewed that moment
21:37
Speaker 1: as a challenge to his control, and it seemed to
21:40
Speaker 1: reignite the deviant compulsions that he had managed to suppress
21:44
Speaker 1: for the past few years.
21:46
Speaker 2: Just like, that's one simple little thing there, exactly. Oh gosh, okay,
21:52
Speaker 2: it's stocking that it didn't come back earlier then.
21:54
Speaker 1: Yeah, so well, I mean that's why I'm sitting here
21:56
Speaker 1: saying I don't think you can reform this individual when
21:58
Speaker 1: things like that, it flips so fast. Yeah, Like there's
22:04
Speaker 1: I talked about it briefly in part one, but Jerry
22:08
Speaker 1: Brutos is a classical, classical, classic psychology case for psych students,
22:15
Speaker 1: because there's so much to unpack here, right, So he
22:18
Speaker 1: is like literally a textbook example of many of these
22:24
Speaker 1: fucked up things that are going on.
22:26
Speaker 2: Yeah, well there's yeah, there's a lot going on there,
22:28
Speaker 2: that's for sure.
22:29
Speaker 1: Yeah. So, not long after Jason's birth, Jerry found himself
22:33
Speaker 1: walking around Portland, and then he spotted a woman wearing
22:37
Speaker 1: a pair of high heels that matched his ideal type
22:41
Speaker 1: in his head perfectly. He was fixated, and he began
22:44
Speaker 1: following her for hours, watching her every move, and he
22:48
Speaker 1: tracked her all the way back to her home. When
22:51
Speaker 1: night fell and she went to sleep, Jerry crept into
22:54
Speaker 1: her house, intending to steal her shoes and leave unnoticed. However,
22:58
Speaker 1: during his heist, the woman woke up and saw him
23:01
Speaker 1: looming over her in her bedroom. Panicked, Jerry pounced, covering
23:06
Speaker 1: her mouth and choking her as she struggled until she
23:09
Speaker 1: fell unconscious. As she lay motionless on the bed, still
23:13
Speaker 1: alive but incapacitated, Jerry paused. In this moment, his deviant
23:19
Speaker 1: fantasies collided with reality, and he took his opportunity sexually
23:24
Speaker 1: assaulting her before he ran away.
23:28
Speaker 2: Oh, okay, with her shoes, I'm assuming, or maybe not.
23:33
Speaker 1: I'm assuming. Yes, with their shoes, I'm not too. I'm
23:35
Speaker 1: not confirmed on every time he steals a pair of
23:38
Speaker 1: shoes or article of clothing. Yeah, but it's a pattern that, yes,
23:41
Speaker 1: he steals shoes or clothing or something, so he I'm
23:43
Speaker 1: sure he ran away with something from this incident. Yes. Now,
23:47
Speaker 1: as I mentioned earlier, Jerry lived out his fantasies behind
23:50
Speaker 1: closed doors, or at least that's why it was at
23:52
Speaker 1: home for the past few years, but ever since moving
23:55
Speaker 1: into their Portland home, he had strict rules regarding his garage,
23:59
Speaker 1: basement and the home attic. Both spaces were completely off
24:04
Speaker 1: limits to his wife and their children. If they needed
24:06
Speaker 1: in there, or if they needed to talk to him
24:09
Speaker 1: while he was inside, they were required to press a
24:12
Speaker 1: buzzer on an intercom system and wait until Jerry would
24:16
Speaker 1: unlock heavy bolts that were securing the doors.
24:19
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.
24:21
Speaker 1: Remember when I said no one found their way inside
24:23
Speaker 1: that pit? Oh no, yeah, this is his adult version.
24:32
Speaker 2: Oh well, I don't know why I didn't go there,
24:35
Speaker 2: but okay, yeah, wow, I'm really naive this morning.
24:40
Speaker 1: So for most of their marriage, these spaces, this garage
24:43
Speaker 1: and the attic and stuff, they served as Jerry's private haven.
24:46
Speaker 1: The garage mostly is where he would indulge in his
24:50
Speaker 1: cross dressing fantasies without fear of judgment from his family. However,
24:54
Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty eight, the garage basement would take on
24:57
Speaker 1: a far darker role. On a cold January night, Linda Slosson,
25:04
Speaker 1: a young Encyclopedia saleswoman, knocked on Jerry's front door. We
25:09
Speaker 1: talked about Linda in part one. Yeah, Now, Jerry just
25:14
Speaker 1: so happened to be home, and he just so happened
25:16
Speaker 1: to be home alone, and the sight of this defenseless
25:21
Speaker 1: young woman standing on his doorstep made his heart race.
25:25
Speaker 1: Linda gave her standard sales pitch, and Jerry pretended he
25:28
Speaker 1: was interested, and then before long he invited her inside,
25:31
Speaker 1: out of the cold, under the pretense of discussing discussing
25:34
Speaker 1: a potential purchase right now. For Linda, this was routine
25:37
Speaker 1: at the time. Like you know, salespeople, they would come inside,
25:40
Speaker 1: they would discuss, you know, show lots of things about it,
25:43
Speaker 1: and talk about their things. Hey, you could even put
25:45
Speaker 1: them over here on this swall you know, make a
25:47
Speaker 1: cup of tea. All these sorts of things were normal
25:49
Speaker 1: for this sales job at the time. Jerry led her
25:52
Speaker 1: into the garage and Linda began setting up her samples
25:54
Speaker 1: and her paperwork, but as her back was turned, Jerry
25:58
Speaker 1: grabbed a plank of wood and swung it, cracking it
26:01
Speaker 1: over her head, knocking her unconscious. He then dragged her
26:06
Speaker 1: downstairs into his locked garage basement area, where he strangled
26:11
Speaker 1: her to death before she could wake up.
26:14
Speaker 2: Holy shit, that escalated real fast. Yep, Oh my gosh.
26:20
Speaker 2: And this is the thought of like that job, that
26:21
Speaker 2: you're just like it's normal to go into people's houses
26:25
Speaker 2: and shit, that is that is freaking terrifying.
26:29
Speaker 1: Says the photographer who does home maternity and newborn shoots.
26:34
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, but it's like a fam. Shit, do you
26:37
Speaker 2: not do that to me? Please right now? Sorry, I
26:44
Speaker 2: don't know, I just oh, ben, okay, just carry on
26:48
Speaker 2: then here all right.
26:50
Speaker 1: What followed was a horrifying glimpse into Jerry's twisted mind
26:54
Speaker 1: alone with the Linda. With Linda's lifeless body, Jerry spent
26:58
Speaker 1: the night dressing her in his collection of high heels
27:00
Speaker 1: and lingerie.
27:02
Speaker 2: Then she's dead. Correct, Oh disturbing, okay.
27:06
Speaker 1: He then dressed himself in Linda's own clothes, revealing more
27:11
Speaker 1: of his sick fantasies. He posed her body in provocative positions,
27:15
Speaker 1: taking photographs to preserve the moment. This lasted for hours. Jerry, however,
27:21
Speaker 1: wasn't satisfied with just photos and a few items of
27:24
Speaker 1: clothing as souvenirs. Wanting something more, a little more permanent,
27:29
Speaker 1: he mutilated Linda's body by severing her left foot to
27:33
Speaker 1: use as a model for his growing woman's shoes collection.
27:37
Speaker 1: Oh boy, yeah, he's He's keeping her foot as a souvenir.
27:42
Speaker 1: So this in itself wasn't about practicality by the sounds
27:45
Speaker 1: of it. To me, It's more about control and indulging
27:48
Speaker 1: in these tendencies. So like this, what's going to rot
27:50
Speaker 1: and look horrible very fast? Right, So it's more so
27:54
Speaker 1: about yeah, like controlling the situation from what I see. So,
28:00
Speaker 1: after satisfying his twisted urges, Jerry set about disposing of
28:03
Speaker 1: Linda's body. He loaded her mutilator remains into his car
28:07
Speaker 1: and drove to a remote bridge and staged a flat
28:09
Speaker 1: tire on the side of the road. Then, once he
28:12
Speaker 1: was sure the coast was clear, Jerry retrieved Linda's body
28:14
Speaker 1: from the trunk and heaved it over the railing into
28:17
Speaker 1: the frigid water below. Jerry had successfully gotten away with
28:22
Speaker 1: his first murder, and it would take another ten months
28:26
Speaker 1: before the opportunity to kill presented itself once again. He
28:31
Speaker 1: was driving along Interstate five somewhere between Salem and Albany
28:35
Speaker 1: when Jerry noticed a young woman whose car was broken
28:38
Speaker 1: down in a rest stop. Her car was parked and
28:40
Speaker 1: she was sitting with a group of men who had
28:42
Speaker 1: stopped to help. The young woman was Jan Whitney, as
28:45
Speaker 1: mentioned in Part one. Jerry pulled over, presenting himself as
28:49
Speaker 1: a kind stranger eager to assist. He offered Jan a
28:52
Speaker 1: ride back to his house to use the phone, adding
28:55
Speaker 1: that he could even grab some tools while there and
28:57
Speaker 1: they can come back and try and fix the car together.
29:00
Speaker 1: He knew how, and hey, if he can't fix it,
29:04
Speaker 1: then you know whoever we phone can come pick pick
29:07
Speaker 1: up your car, pick up you or whatever.
29:08
Speaker 2: Right, He's like, we got this, yeah, like just making
29:11
Speaker 2: himself seem like the nicest of people.
29:13
Speaker 1: Right, like the hero of the situation, basically right, Grateful
29:17
Speaker 1: for his generosity Jane accepted his offer, not realizing that
29:21
Speaker 1: she had unfortunately just sealed her fate. The two drove
29:26
Speaker 1: back to Jerry's house, and when they arrived, Jerry walked
29:29
Speaker 1: up to the front door and pretended that he didn't
29:32
Speaker 1: have his keys. He's the door's locked. I forgot my
29:35
Speaker 1: keep my house keys. My wife she's not gonna be
29:38
Speaker 1: home to it for a little while. She'll she'll be home,
29:41
Speaker 1: you know, later on, like a couple hours. Maybe just
29:43
Speaker 1: wait in the car until she returns, and then she
29:45
Speaker 1: can let us in the house and we can get
29:46
Speaker 1: all this taken care of. So Jan's like, okay, yeah, sure,
29:49
Speaker 1: let's wait in the car. So she climbed back into
29:51
Speaker 1: the passenger seat of the car while Jerry slid into
29:53
Speaker 1: the back seat behind her. Red flag o red flash.
29:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, you'd be like, what the fuck are you doing,
30:00
Speaker 2: but it would probably be so quick before you like
30:03
Speaker 2: fully comprehended what the hell was going on.
30:05
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, for sure, And I mean Jerry did put
30:08
Speaker 1: her at ease, because I mean for a while they did.
30:10
Speaker 1: They just chatted, they talked, they played some like some
30:13
Speaker 1: word games and stuff, you know, and just enjoyed each
30:16
Speaker 1: other's company for a little bit, and then before long,
30:20
Speaker 1: without warning, Jerry leaned forward and wrapped a leather strap
30:23
Speaker 1: around Jan's neck, pulling it tight. He yanked her backward
30:27
Speaker 1: against the headdress and used his knee to brace himself
30:30
Speaker 1: against the seat to give him leverage to pull. Jan struggled,
30:34
Speaker 1: but Jerry pulled relentlessly until she went limp and lifeless
30:39
Speaker 1: sitting in the car.
30:40
Speaker 2: Uh huh. I mean he could have, I guess, just
30:43
Speaker 2: been like, oh, I'm gonna just like lay in the
30:44
Speaker 2: back seat like or whatever, right, and made it seem
30:49
Speaker 2: like it was slightly not super weird.
30:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure, for sure, And I think that's probably
30:54
Speaker 1: what he kind of did.
30:55
Speaker 2: But oh wow, Okay.
30:59
Speaker 1: Now with Jan's bob in his control, Jerry moved her
31:02
Speaker 1: into his garage. He used a pulley system rigged up
31:05
Speaker 1: to the ceiling, and he hoisted her up until her
31:09
Speaker 1: toes barely touched the floor. For Jerry, this grotesque setup
31:13
Speaker 1: was part of a ritual that he had now carefully planned.
31:17
Speaker 1: He spent the entire evening with Jan's body, dressing her
31:20
Speaker 1: in various outfits, indulging his fantasies, just as he had
31:24
Speaker 1: done with his first victim. However, he took things a
31:28
Speaker 1: little bit further this time, and he even engaged in
31:31
Speaker 1: necrophi laic acts. I'll leave it at that.
31:34
Speaker 2: He just like the and they're just like hoisted up. Yeah, like,
31:38
Speaker 2: oh my goodness, this is so disturbing.
31:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's he's basically tying ropes around them and using
31:45
Speaker 1: pulleys to yeah, like string them up. And then from
31:48
Speaker 1: there he's got basically human deceased mannekins that he just
31:54
Speaker 1: does what he wants with.
31:56
Speaker 2: Oh god, Okay, Yeah.
31:59
Speaker 1: Now, after Jerry was finished with Jan, he tied her
32:02
Speaker 1: lifeless body to a railroad iron using copper wire, loaded
32:05
Speaker 1: her into his car, and drove to a nearby river. There,
32:09
Speaker 1: just like before, he discarded her body, right where Linda's
32:12
Speaker 1: sloughson had been discarded as well. By this point, Linda's
32:17
Speaker 1: severed foot was very extensively decayed, so Jerry decided to
32:24
Speaker 1: actually dispose of it as well, throwing it into the
32:26
Speaker 1: water along Jan's remains. For the rest of nineteen sixty eight,
32:31
Speaker 1: Jerry refrained from killing again, likely allowing the heat to
32:34
Speaker 1: die down, but his compulsions hadn't gone away. By the
32:37
Speaker 1: following spring, they resurfaced, and on the morning of March
32:40
Speaker 1: twenty seventh, nineteen sixty nine, Jerry was cruising through downtown Salem,
32:45
Speaker 1: hunting for his next victim, and that's when he noticed
32:48
Speaker 1: a tall, glamorous woman walking down the street in a
32:51
Speaker 1: stunning pair of high heeled shoes, the perfect embodiment of
32:55
Speaker 1: his fantasies. He parked his car real quick and in
32:59
Speaker 1: a panic to go follower in a nearby parking lot. However,
33:02
Speaker 1: he lost sight of her before he could act. Frustrated,
33:06
Speaker 1: Jerry's attention quickly shifted when another woman walked towards her
33:09
Speaker 1: car near the rooftop stairwell of the department store parking lot.
33:15
Speaker 1: This woman didn't quite match his image of the ideal
33:18
Speaker 1: victim like the last woman did, but it didn't matter.
33:21
Speaker 1: She was an opportunity and Jerry wasn't about to pass
33:24
Speaker 1: it up. The young woman was nineteen year old Karen Sprinker,
33:28
Speaker 1: a college student who was about to become Jerry's third
33:31
Speaker 1: victim and the first to enter his torture dungeon alive.
33:37
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, that just gave me the freaking shivers, Just
33:42
Speaker 2: like talk about being in the wrong place at the
33:44
Speaker 2: wrong time too exactly.
33:46
Speaker 1: And notice how something new is happening with every victim.
33:49
Speaker 1: It's getting worse and worse, progressing with every single one.
33:54
Speaker 1: Yeah now. Jerry waited until Karen was close. He then
33:59
Speaker 1: approached from behind with a toy gun that we talked
34:02
Speaker 1: about part one. He kept this in his glove box
34:04
Speaker 1: of his vehicle. Though the gun was fake, Karen didn't
34:07
Speaker 1: know that, and he pressed it against her and ordered
34:10
Speaker 1: for her to stay quiet and follow him, threatening to
34:12
Speaker 1: kill her if she resisted. Terrified, Karen complied, she climbed
34:18
Speaker 1: into the passenger seat of Jerry's car. She likely believed
34:21
Speaker 1: that she was If she's going to cooperate here, she
34:23
Speaker 1: might make it out of this situation a lot. Jerry
34:27
Speaker 1: then drove Karen back to his house and brought her
34:29
Speaker 1: into the garage and basement. There, she continued to comply
34:33
Speaker 1: with his demands, clinging to that hope that her obedience
34:36
Speaker 1: might save her life. He directed her through stage photo shoots,
34:40
Speaker 1: forcing her to pose while he snapped pictures of her,
34:43
Speaker 1: demeaning her, posing her, putting her in different clothes. She
34:47
Speaker 1: just followed his instructions, doing what she could to appease him.
34:52
Speaker 1: After forcing her to comply with this photo shoot, He
34:56
Speaker 1: then raped her before he strung a noose around her neck,
35:00
Speaker 1: running the cord through the pulley system on the roof,
35:03
Speaker 1: and with three hard tugs, he hoisted Karen into the air,
35:07
Speaker 1: leaving her there to hang and die of exphyxiation.
35:11
Speaker 2: Seriously, just like watching her die like that, most likely
35:15
Speaker 2: taking photos of it too. Holy shit, this is just
35:21
Speaker 2: too much. This guy is such a freaking nasty piece
35:25
Speaker 2: of shit.
35:26
Speaker 1: How many warnings did I give you for this case?
35:29
Speaker 1: Like countless at this point I told you, I.
35:32
Speaker 2: Know, but my mind is still just like blown by
35:35
Speaker 2: these like that. Just someone is like this fucked up,
35:38
Speaker 2: I guess.
35:39
Speaker 1: Oh, understandably because he is. And yeah, so he strung
35:44
Speaker 1: her up and she died there, and her body hung
35:47
Speaker 1: in the garage for hours more while Jerry continued his routine,
35:52
Speaker 1: even at one point stepping out to have dinner with
35:53
Speaker 1: his wife and kids, Oh nothing had even happened, and
35:56
Speaker 1: then later returning that night once his family was asleep,
36:01
Speaker 1: he sexually violated Karen's remains and photographed her in different poses,
36:05
Speaker 1: prolonging his sick fantasy. When he was done, he tied
36:09
Speaker 1: her body to a scrap car engine and dispose of
36:11
Speaker 1: it in the river much likely likely had done before.
36:16
Speaker 1: Each murder made Jerry Boulder feeling his twisted sense of
36:19
Speaker 1: control and invulnerability feeding Sorry.
36:22
Speaker 2: These poor women like they're just oh my gosh, I
36:27
Speaker 2: don't know, and it's just like the disrespect to them,
36:29
Speaker 2: and it's just it's just disgusting.
36:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, it really is. And now you understand why his
36:37
Speaker 1: case is so famous for it and why psychology students
36:42
Speaker 1: dive into this case. This is like a big one
36:44
Speaker 1: that they go through in courses and stuff.
36:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, yeah, it makes sense. It's like, especially
36:51
Speaker 2: if you're studying this shit fascinating but also just like
36:55
Speaker 2: so disturbing and terrifying. Yeah, liked it that too.
36:59
Speaker 1: To think that a human mind can operate like this
37:02
Speaker 1: is fucking wild.
37:04
Speaker 2: Yeah. And in between, like he has this literally dead
37:07
Speaker 2: body hanging in his garage and his family isn't allowed
37:10
Speaker 2: to go into it, and then he's just going and like
37:12
Speaker 2: having dinner with them.
37:13
Speaker 1: Yeap, and then back to the body.
37:15
Speaker 2: That is some fucked up shit right there.
37:18
Speaker 1: Right, It's almost like there is two Jerry's. I don't
37:22
Speaker 1: know if he like exactly has like two personas or personalities,
37:27
Speaker 1: but it's very much so it's almost like there are
37:29
Speaker 1: two Jerry's at this point, you know. One I think
37:33
Speaker 1: is more of a mask for him, not like it's
37:35
Speaker 1: a real person. I think it's a mass that he
37:37
Speaker 1: puts on for other people, like the fake Jerry and
37:40
Speaker 1: then the real Jerry.
37:41
Speaker 2: Yeah.
37:42
Speaker 1: So, now, by the spring of nineteen sixty nine, Jerry's
37:46
Speaker 1: confidence had grown exponentially. No longer relying on chance to
37:50
Speaker 1: encounter his victims, he now actively sought out his new victims.
37:55
Speaker 1: He began frequenting campuses of Oregon State University and Portland
37:59
Speaker 1: State Universe, watching and waiting for the woman who fit
38:02
Speaker 1: his ideal profile. He would do so dressed in women's
38:07
Speaker 1: underwear stolen from previous victims, along with other items from
38:11
Speaker 1: his collection. He would just sit in his car, stalk
38:14
Speaker 1: the grounds for hours and wait. His first target was
38:18
Speaker 1: that spring, and was a woman by the name of
38:21
Speaker 1: Sharon Wood, whose harrowing escape we already talked about in
38:26
Speaker 1: Part one. He attacked her, tried to abduct her.
38:30
Speaker 2: Yes she got away, yep, good good.
38:32
Speaker 1: So after the failed abduction of Sharon, Jerry tried again
38:35
Speaker 1: the very next day with a fifteen year old girl,
38:38
Speaker 1: attempting to put her into his car. This too was
38:42
Speaker 1: a botched attempt.
38:43
Speaker 2: It was this one I think was they got the
38:45
Speaker 2: train tracks or some shit, right, Okay Yeah.
38:48
Speaker 1: Frustrated but undeterred, Jerry kept hunting. The next day, on
38:54
Speaker 1: April twenty third, he spotted twenty two year old Linda
38:57
Speaker 1: Saley shopping for a birthday present for her boyfriend. He
39:00
Speaker 1: followed her to a shopping complex, watching as she moved
39:03
Speaker 1: from store to store. When she finally returned to her car,
39:07
Speaker 1: Jerry was there waiting. This time, he used a different tactic,
39:11
Speaker 1: as last two times his tactics weren't working, so he
39:14
Speaker 1: switched it up instead. This time, instead of pulling a
39:17
Speaker 1: fake gun, he pulled a badge. He approached Linda with
39:21
Speaker 1: a counterfeit security badge, posing as a plane closed police officer,
39:27
Speaker 1: and he accused Linda of shoplifting, claiming she needed to
39:30
Speaker 1: come with him to the station to clear up this
39:33
Speaker 1: whole thing. I mean, Linda's confused and she's cooperative, but
39:36
Speaker 1: she's insisting she has receipts for the purchases and everything,
39:39
Speaker 1: and she's just like this is there, but must be
39:42
Speaker 1: some mistake. But Jerry's like, well, we'll figure it out.
39:44
Speaker 1: At the station, like, if you got your receipts, you'll
39:46
Speaker 1: be fine, it won't take too long.
39:47
Speaker 2: Then, well, yeah, and I feel like almost anyone would
39:50
Speaker 2: be like, yeah, let's get this cleared up exactly.
39:53
Speaker 1: So Jerry reassured her it was likely just a mistake,
39:56
Speaker 1: but she needed to straighten these things out, and she was,
39:59
Speaker 1: of course, unaware of his true intentions, and she got
40:02
Speaker 1: into Jerry's car.
40:03
Speaker 2: Oh boy.
40:05
Speaker 1: Now, as they drove, Linda did quickly put some stuff together,
40:09
Speaker 1: realizing that something just wasn't right. She began to reach
40:13
Speaker 1: for the door, but Jerry reached across her and locked
40:16
Speaker 1: the door and drew the fake pistol on her, warning
40:19
Speaker 1: her to stay quiet. Shortly thereafter, they then arrived at
40:24
Speaker 1: Jerry's home. However, a problem arose when he pulled into
40:27
Speaker 1: the driveway. Jerry's wife, Darcy, was home. Her car was
40:32
Speaker 1: parked in the driveway, and as they pulled up, she
40:34
Speaker 1: came out onto the porch calling out that dinner was ready.
40:38
Speaker 2: Oh gosh, okay.
40:40
Speaker 1: Jerry panicked, but maintained his composure, and he forced Linda
40:44
Speaker 1: to duck down in her seat just enough to be
40:47
Speaker 1: in time that Darcy didn't see her He called back Darcy,
40:52
Speaker 1: telling her he'd be inside shortly, and then after she
40:55
Speaker 1: went back into the house, Jerry tied Linda up in
40:57
Speaker 1: the back seat to ensure she couldn't scaree. Then he
41:02
Speaker 1: went inside and ate dinner with his family, all while
41:05
Speaker 1: dreading that Linda might somehow free herself and run for help.
41:09
Speaker 2: M M, I'm sure he was distracted as shit. Now.
41:12
Speaker 1: When Jerry returned to the car later, Linda was still there,
41:16
Speaker 1: tied up. Fortunately for him, Darcy, his wife, had left
41:21
Speaker 1: for the evening to spend some time with some friends,
41:23
Speaker 1: and left only the babysitter at the house watching the children.
41:28
Speaker 1: With the coast clear, Jerry brought Linda into the garage,
41:31
Speaker 1: the nightmare space, I guess, uh huh, where he would
41:34
Speaker 1: carry out his horrifying rituals like before.
41:38
Speaker 2: Okay, here I was, I don't know, I can't remember
41:40
Speaker 2: if you've already like divulged what happened here. But I
41:43
Speaker 2: was like, oh, maybe she'll get away.
41:45
Speaker 1: H No, Linda Sale, just like Karen, would not leave
41:49
Speaker 1: Jerry's torture dungeon alive. Linda, now in the garage, knew
41:55
Speaker 1: she was in a dire situation. She knew that this
41:59
Speaker 1: was basically a fight or flight, like a life or
42:02
Speaker 1: death situation, and she began to fight back with everything
42:06
Speaker 1: she had despite being a at a physical advantage. Though
42:11
Speaker 1: she clawed at Jerry, she bit at Jerry, and Jerry
42:15
Speaker 1: was now put on the defensive. She was trying desperately
42:18
Speaker 1: to escape, but he was trying desperately defend her off. Jerry,
42:22
Speaker 1: now struggling to maintain control, wrestled and managed to wrap
42:26
Speaker 1: a leather strap around her neck, and after an intense struggle,
42:31
Speaker 1: his size and strength gave him the advantage again and
42:34
Speaker 1: he managed to strangle Linda to death.
42:38
Speaker 2: Okay, well, she put up a good fight. I guess
42:40
Speaker 2: ay she did.
42:41
Speaker 1: I guess the only solace in that would be that
42:45
Speaker 1: she didn't have to endure the things inside the dungeon,
42:50
Speaker 1: the posing, the abuse, the.
42:52
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, probably like the rape and everything that he does.
42:57
Speaker 1: Yeah. Now, with Linda's lifeless body, Jerry embarked on his
43:02
Speaker 1: now predictable at this point ritual of sexual abuse and photography,
43:06
Speaker 1: but this time his actions took an even more bizarre
43:09
Speaker 1: In macob turn, he played the role of mad scientists.
43:13
Speaker 1: This time he was curious. He clamped electrical cables to
43:17
Speaker 1: Linda's body and hooked them up to a outlet in
43:20
Speaker 1: his home. He plugged it in and attempted to make
43:23
Speaker 1: her corpse spasm, which apparently was unsuccessful. But yeah, this
43:28
Speaker 1: grotesque experiment added yet another layer to this horrifying, escalating situation.
43:34
Speaker 2: Meanwhile, his kids are literally next door with a babysitter. Yep,
43:40
Speaker 2: oh gosh, that is just so messed.
43:45
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Okay, Now, Linda's murder would ultimately prove to
43:50
Speaker 1: be Jerry's last. As we discussed in part one, investigators
43:56
Speaker 1: had already started connecting the dots. The discovery of the
43:58
Speaker 1: bodies in the Woolm River with similar ligature marks led
44:02
Speaker 1: to identifying patterns on targeted victims, specific victims with a
44:07
Speaker 1: profile pattern. Now, actually I did in part one call
44:10
Speaker 1: it the Long Tom River, which is incorrect, though they
44:13
Speaker 1: are very close in proximity and I think one flows
44:16
Speaker 1: into the other or something, But it's actually the Willamette
44:19
Speaker 1: River where the bodies were being dumped they found. Just clarifying,
44:23
Speaker 1: but yeah, the police, realizing the patterns, began to campus
44:27
Speaker 1: college students, where college campuses, where women were you know,
44:32
Speaker 1: currently being and it's his profile. It's people you know
44:35
Speaker 1: who he's after, So he's sorry. The detectives and investigators
44:40
Speaker 1: they're they're going around, they're asking questions, they're they're interviewing
44:43
Speaker 1: and trying to get a lead, and detectives, you know,
44:46
Speaker 1: struck gold when a young woman came forward reporting that
44:49
Speaker 1: Jerry Brudos had been contacting women and herself included cold
44:54
Speaker 1: calling them in hopes of arranging dates. Using this information,
44:57
Speaker 1: the police worked with the women to set up a
45:00
Speaker 1: or sorry with the woman to set up a sting operation,
45:02
Speaker 1: and they arranged a quote date with Jerry, which allowed
45:05
Speaker 1: them to connect with him and bring him in for questioning.
45:09
Speaker 1: Once detectives began focusing on him, more evidence surfaced. His
45:12
Speaker 1: mother's car, of course, was identified as being a car
45:16
Speaker 1: that was used in abduction attempts, and he also matched
45:21
Speaker 1: the description provided by a survivor, most importantly fifteen year
45:25
Speaker 1: old Gloria Jean, who did positively identify Jerry as the
45:29
Speaker 1: man who tried to abduct her weeks earlier. With this
45:32
Speaker 1: mounting evidence, police raided Jerry's home and arrested him. When
45:37
Speaker 1: detectives forced open the door to Jerry's garage, they found
45:40
Speaker 1: a treasure trove of incriminating evidence. The incriminating cables and
45:44
Speaker 1: wires that they spotted earlier during their initial visited were
45:47
Speaker 1: collected for analysis, and it didn't take long to confirm
45:50
Speaker 1: that the knots tied in the cables and the cables
45:52
Speaker 1: themselves matched everything the legature marks found on the necks
45:55
Speaker 1: of the victims. You name it. Additionally, the ends of
46:00
Speaker 1: the roles of wire showed cuts made with tools found
46:03
Speaker 1: in Jerry's possession. Inside the garage, police discovered the police
46:07
Speaker 1: system that was on this roof. Yeah, the same device
46:11
Speaker 1: that was used to string up as victims. Yeah. There
46:14
Speaker 1: were lockers filled with photography equipment, women's clothes, shoes, piles,
46:21
Speaker 1: and piles of glamour's shoes neatly arranged in a disturbing collection.
46:26
Speaker 1: They also found a list of phone numbers and addresses
46:29
Speaker 1: for sorority houses at University State Sorry Oregon State University,
46:34
Speaker 1: suggesting that Jerry had been systematically planning his next targets
46:37
Speaker 1: at these locations. The attic held even more chilling discoveries.
46:42
Speaker 1: Police found boxes of photographic negatives and prints featuring women
46:47
Speaker 1: in both clothes and nude poses, many of them sexually,
46:51
Speaker 1: suggesting suggestive I guess. Among the photos were several of
46:56
Speaker 1: Jerry himself as well, dressed in women's lingerie, high heel
47:00
Speaker 1: and striking exaggerated poses. Now, I think it goes without
47:06
Speaker 1: saying that many of these photographs were not necessarily of live.
47:11
Speaker 2: Exactly women I was gonna ask, Yeah.
47:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, many of them were of the deceased victims that
47:16
Speaker 1: were found or people like yeah, and you can see
47:20
Speaker 1: like apparently it's like, yeah, it's obvious when you look
47:23
Speaker 1: at these photos these women are dead.
47:25
Speaker 2: I just imagine going in there, hey to like with
47:30
Speaker 2: a warrant or whatever and investigating and just like finding
47:33
Speaker 2: all this shit.
47:34
Speaker 1: And yeah, that's what you uncover. Like oh wow.
47:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think. I don't know. I just don't think
47:40
Speaker 2: anyone could have been like quite prepared for exactly that.
47:43
Speaker 1: Oh. Even just thinking of that situation, like a fucking
47:46
Speaker 1: shiver went up my spine. Oh man, I can't even
47:49
Speaker 1: imagine stepping into his I think garage space.
47:52
Speaker 2: It would be mind blowing.
47:53
Speaker 1: Oh. I don't know if that's something I could ever
47:56
Speaker 1: recover from. And that's just like the most minimal thing
47:59
Speaker 1: of this case, just you know, walking into his space
48:02
Speaker 1: and observing. Okay, thanks for that.
48:07
Speaker 2: Hey, you do that kind of shit to me all
48:08
Speaker 2: the time.
48:09
Speaker 1: So touche, touche. You're right, I deserve that now. The
48:12
Speaker 1: overwhelming evidence left no room for doubt about Jerry's guilt.
48:16
Speaker 1: From the knots and the cables, the Pulley system, the photographs,
48:19
Speaker 1: it all painted the horrific picture of the man who
48:21
Speaker 1: terrorized Oregon for years. The raid in his home marked
48:25
Speaker 1: the end of Jerry Brutos killing spree and led to
48:27
Speaker 1: his arrest, trial, and hopefully eventual conviction.
48:34
Speaker 2: Okay, what the hell? What the face you just gave
48:39
Speaker 2: me made it seem like that's not going to happen.
48:41
Speaker 1: Well, I'm not going to tell you just yet.
48:43
Speaker 2: As it happened, I will like there is something wrong
48:45
Speaker 2: with this well, there already is something wrong in this world.
48:48
Speaker 2: But okay, carry on.
48:50
Speaker 1: Well, like I said, we're in a story here, right.
48:52
Speaker 1: It's called you know, like building, building up to the climax,
48:56
Speaker 1: you know.
48:57
Speaker 2: Yeah, but jeez, there is no way, there's no way
49:00
Speaker 2: that this person can't get convicted. There's no way.
49:04
Speaker 1: I mean, the kind of is which we'll touch on.
49:07
Speaker 1: Don't worry, Well we'll get there. So Jerry's crime, of course,
49:11
Speaker 1: crimes a of course shock the nation, and yeah, people
49:15
Speaker 1: just didn't know how to process it. Forensic investigators and
49:18
Speaker 1: behavioral psychologists have studied this case for years now. During
49:23
Speaker 1: the investigation into his crimes, police discovered an odd maccabb item.
49:28
Speaker 1: Though still, there was one more piece of evidence that
49:31
Speaker 1: they couldn't quite wrap their heads around and initially baffled them.
49:35
Speaker 1: There were these warped domes of hardened resin. It appeared
49:39
Speaker 1: to be homemade, and it wasn't clear what the purpose
49:42
Speaker 1: of these objects were until Jerry confessed. He told investigators
49:48
Speaker 1: that these were resin molds of victim's breasts.
49:52
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, that's exactly where my head was, Oh, really
49:55
Speaker 2: take their boobs.
49:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, But the thing is he had he'd made molds
49:59
Speaker 1: and these resin domes after cutting the breasts off the body.
50:04
Speaker 2: What the shit?
50:06
Speaker 1: Okay, Yes, Jerriet hoped to create a metal paper weight
50:10
Speaker 1: in the shape of one of his victim's breasts, but
50:13
Speaker 1: he never perfected the composition to get it quite right.
50:18
Speaker 2: Okay, here I was like, okay, like I I saw
50:22
Speaker 2: that coming ish, but then I didn't.
50:25
Speaker 1: But then I didn't.
50:26
Speaker 2: Oh wow, okay a metal weight.
50:30
Speaker 1: A metal paper weight? Yeah, So he wanted to basically
50:34
Speaker 1: take a mold and like have a resin cast so
50:39
Speaker 1: then he can like keep it for later to make
50:42
Speaker 1: another mold and make a metal cast. If that makes sense. Yeah,
50:47
Speaker 1: I'm assuming because I do a little bit of resin
50:49
Speaker 1: casting myself, and I'm assuming that I make dice for
50:54
Speaker 1: dungeons and dragons a little different, but yeah, so I'm
50:59
Speaker 1: assuming that's his pro Yeah, and a little fucked up.
51:03
Speaker 1: So as of now, Jerry was sitting in jail on
51:06
Speaker 1: kidnapping charges. Remember that's what he was arrested on. Initially,
51:09
Speaker 1: was the kidnapping charges because he was positively id'd by
51:13
Speaker 1: someone he tried to abduct, right, and then there's some
51:15
Speaker 1: evidence linking him to that kidnapping, thus getting the warrants
51:20
Speaker 1: they opened the house. Now they find all this evidence
51:22
Speaker 1: for murder. So currently he's only being held on kidnapping charges, right, So,
51:28
Speaker 1: the case against him for the murders of form missy
51:31
Speaker 1: women continued to grow. However, because he hadn't kept photographs
51:35
Speaker 1: or souvenirs. Smith's first victim, Linda Slawson, and her body
51:39
Speaker 1: was never recovered. Unfortunately, charges for her murder were excluded.
51:45
Speaker 1: They could only pin three murders on him, and these
51:48
Speaker 1: three murders went to trial. The evidence against Jerry in
51:52
Speaker 1: those three cases were absolutely overwhelming, and as you're saying,
51:55
Speaker 1: you're gonna be pissed if he's not convicted. But proving
51:59
Speaker 1: his guilt wasn't the challenge for his conviction. It was
52:03
Speaker 1: combating the plea of not guilty by reason of insanity.
52:08
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, I was wondering, but still even that you can,
52:12
Speaker 2: I feel like still like go to like a hospital
52:15
Speaker 2: for your life and stuff.
52:17
Speaker 1: For sure, But that's still going to heavily wigh on
52:19
Speaker 1: what you're convicted of. Is he convicted of murder?
52:22
Speaker 2: Right?
52:23
Speaker 1: Is he convicted of manslaughter? You know those sort of things, right,
52:26
Speaker 1: there's a big difference. So in early June, during interrogations
52:31
Speaker 1: with detectives with Detective Jim Stovell, Jerry had been shockingly forthcoming,
52:36
Speaker 1: actually recounting all three s all the grizzly details of
52:39
Speaker 1: his six months sixteen months free. However, just three days
52:43
Speaker 1: before his trial date, Jerry abandoned his insanity defense and
52:48
Speaker 1: pled guilty to all three of the murders that he
52:50
Speaker 1: was being charged with. So, as a result, he was
52:55
Speaker 1: convicted and he was sentenced to three consecutive life terms.
53:00
Speaker 2: Okay, good good.
53:02
Speaker 1: Now, one month later, based on information Jerry provided, the
53:05
Speaker 1: body of Jen Jen Whitney was finally recovered from Wilmette River,
53:11
Speaker 1: still tied to a railroad spike, and tragically, Linda Slawson's
53:16
Speaker 1: remains were never found.
53:19
Speaker 2: So he did actually like divulge of some information then
53:23
Speaker 2: of like where to find them? Yes he did, Oh, okay, yeah,
53:28
Speaker 2: which is it so interesting? Actually when you think about that.
53:31
Speaker 1: Well, when you look back on his life, anytime he
53:35
Speaker 1: was caught, he spilled.
53:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. That's true.
53:40
Speaker 1: So he's he was caught. He did the same thing
53:43
Speaker 1: he always does, and he.
53:44
Speaker 2: Spills, right, But I mean these are like what he's
53:47
Speaker 2: caught for. It's like, oh boy.
53:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, little different than stealing a pair of shoes when
53:53
Speaker 1: you're a kid.
53:53
Speaker 2: Uh huh.
53:54
Speaker 1: So now, Jerry's conviction seemed to close the case. However,
53:59
Speaker 1: there was one question that puzzled investigators. What role had
54:04
Speaker 1: his wife, Darcy played in all this? Could she really
54:07
Speaker 1: have been that oblivious to the fact that her husband
54:10
Speaker 1: was kidnapping and murdering women in their very home right
54:13
Speaker 1: under her nose.
54:15
Speaker 2: I feel like I wasn't I was thinking so, yes,
54:19
Speaker 2: because she was with him from like a really young age, Yeah,
54:23
Speaker 2: and sort of like manipulated her. And he had these
54:26
Speaker 2: private areas and stuff.
54:28
Speaker 1: So aren't you gonna have some red flags with these
54:30
Speaker 1: private areas? Are you know? I hear screams? What about
54:34
Speaker 1: maybe I don't know, seeing some blood once in a while,
54:37
Speaker 1: what about an odd smell? Is there something that would
54:40
Speaker 1: not have set her off that she just even turned
54:43
Speaker 1: a blind eye to.
54:44
Speaker 2: I don't know. I feel like she's innocent, but maybe
54:49
Speaker 2: I'm totally out to launch here.
54:51
Speaker 1: Okay. Well, the following August, after his conviction, a neighbor
54:56
Speaker 1: came forward with a disturbing claim. She art seeing Jerry
55:02
Speaker 1: and Darcy carrying what appeared to be a heavy rug
55:05
Speaker 1: from the house to the car on the same night
55:07
Speaker 1: that Karen Sprinker was killed.
55:10
Speaker 2: What the shit? Seriously?
55:13
Speaker 1: Yeah? Now, it wasn't until the trial's timeline was made
55:18
Speaker 1: public that the neighbor connected the dots on the incident
55:21
Speaker 1: to Karen's murder. Now, based on this testimony, Darcy was
55:26
Speaker 1: arrested and charged with aiding and a betting. However, the
55:31
Speaker 1: court found her not guilty later that year, as there
55:35
Speaker 1: was no concrete evidence to prove that she knew what
55:37
Speaker 1: she was carrying if that event actually occurred.
55:41
Speaker 2: Okay, that's what I was gonna say. Maybe she didn't
55:43
Speaker 2: know what the hell was in there.
55:44
Speaker 1: Yeah. Darcy's defense pointed out that Jerry had pleaded with
55:48
Speaker 1: her to destroy his incriminating stash of women's clothing and
55:51
Speaker 1: photographs after his arrest, a request that she denied.
55:56
Speaker 2: Oh okay, okay, good.
55:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, so prior to the police actually raiding the house,
56:03
Speaker 1: because they just arrested them initially, right, so it would
56:06
Speaker 1: have probably been a couple of days before they actually
56:08
Speaker 1: get a warrant to get in and raid that fucking house.
56:10
Speaker 1: He plead with her burn this shit.
56:13
Speaker 2: And she didn't.
56:14
Speaker 1: She's like, no, why would I do that?
56:17
Speaker 2: Okay? Good? I mean yeah, especially too because they have kids,
56:20
Speaker 2: right that they need their mom if she's like a
56:23
Speaker 2: decent human, I guess right.
56:25
Speaker 1: So, following the trial, Darcy moved to another state, filed
56:28
Speaker 1: for divorce, changed her name, and she secured a court
56:32
Speaker 1: order preventing Jerry from ever having contact with their children
56:35
Speaker 1: if he were ever to.
56:36
Speaker 2: Be released, which should never happen.
56:40
Speaker 1: Correct now. Jerry Brutos remained incarcerated at the Oregon State
56:45
Speaker 1: Penitentiary for the rest of his life. His time in
56:49
Speaker 1: prison was far from easy. Record show he was frequently
56:52
Speaker 1: beaten and sexually assaulted by other inmates who despised him
56:57
Speaker 1: for his heinous crimes and because hey, he was be
57:00
Speaker 1: fucking dude. And Jerry Brutos died on March twenty eighth,
57:04
Speaker 1: two thousand and six, at the age of sixty seven
57:07
Speaker 1: from terminal liver cancer, marking the end of one of
57:11
Speaker 1: Oregon's most notorious criminal cases ever.
57:16
Speaker 2: Yeah. Wow, there's just like so much to unpack about this.
57:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that is the case of Jerry Brutos.
57:26
Speaker 2: Huh, holy shit, the shoe fetish layer. Imagine that being
57:31
Speaker 2: your debt your father, Hey, no, thank you, Like I
57:35
Speaker 2: just couldn't. I can't believe that he has like children,
57:38
Speaker 2: I know. I just feel like that's so sad for them.
57:40
Speaker 1: It's super morbid and super weird. And I can't imagine yeah,
57:44
Speaker 1: growing up thinking that's that's what I'm related to.
57:48
Speaker 2: Like, you'd almost hope they wouldn't know, but they probably do. Yeah, damn, damn. Yeah,
57:55
Speaker 2: that is that is one of the most like intra
58:00
Speaker 2: sting true crime cases out there.
58:02
Speaker 1: I feel like there is so much to this and
58:04
Speaker 1: it is so deep in that psychological aspect. Holy fuck,
58:08
Speaker 1: you can dig, dig, like I bet you. Someone could
58:11
Speaker 1: spend their entire career fully dissecting this and barely even
58:16
Speaker 1: touch the tip of the iceberg. Oh yeah, because there
58:18
Speaker 1: is so much to unpacked, and there's books, there's interviews,
58:22
Speaker 1: there's documentaries, you name it, all about about him and
58:25
Speaker 1: going into the psychiatri or sorry, psychiatric the psychology of
58:29
Speaker 1: him and who he was and yeah, it's it's wild.
58:34
Speaker 2: And here I was just like, this is a total joke.
58:37
Speaker 2: But I was like, oh, I wish you would have
58:38
Speaker 2: foot fetters in a way, because then I'd get feet.
58:40
Speaker 1: Massages, feet massages, foot massages.
58:45
Speaker 2: I do not get foot massages at all.
58:46
Speaker 1: Okay, I don't like feet or gross.
58:49
Speaker 2: They are kind of gross actually.
58:51
Speaker 1: Especially like I don't know, maybe this is something that
58:54
Speaker 1: Hey instilled in me from a young age, because hey,
58:57
Speaker 1: I had inger on tonails as a kid, and I
58:59
Speaker 1: actually have like a couple toenails permanently removed because they
59:02
Speaker 1: kept coming back over and over. So now I'm like, oh,
59:04
Speaker 1: I got ugly feet because I'm missing a couple toenails.
59:07
Speaker 1: So now maybe it's just as an adult, I'm like
59:09
Speaker 1: ew feed er grows because I didn't like my own
59:12
Speaker 1: feet as a kid.
59:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, now your wife is missing out on getting amazing massages.
59:19
Speaker 1: Dang well that sucks for you.
59:20
Speaker 2: That does suck for me anyway. Wow, that is that
59:25
Speaker 2: would be like a doozy of a case to research
59:28
Speaker 2: for sure, Holy shit, but also kind of interesting.
59:31
Speaker 1: It was interesting and yeah, like you say, it's a
59:33
Speaker 1: doozy and that's why I was up till two am
59:35
Speaker 1: last night finishing off part two.
59:37
Speaker 2: Okay, it makes sense, Yeah does it? Well, I was sleeping.
59:41
Speaker 1: Hopefully that sleep helped get you through the story today,
59:45
Speaker 1: and hopefully you guys enjoyed this one, and hopefully you
59:48
Speaker 1: had your your comfort drink and maybe you dogged by
59:51
Speaker 1: your side who can help get you through it and
59:53
Speaker 1: distract you a little bit too.
59:54
Speaker 2: Yeah wow.
59:56
Speaker 1: So to wrap it all up, we have a link
59:59
Speaker 1: in the description for pretty much every social media we got, YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, Hey,
1:00:04
Speaker 1: it's all there, Patreon if you want to sign up
1:00:06
Speaker 1: get behind the scenes and exclusive content. If you're still listening, yeah,
1:00:11
Speaker 1: you're supporting us big time already, and we appreciate that too.
1:00:15
Speaker 2: We sure do.
1:00:15
Speaker 1: We're an indie podcast, right, m hm, so yeah, no, no.
1:00:19
Speaker 2: Puppy master points made it seem like you wanted to cheers.
1:00:22
Speaker 2: I don't know why.
1:00:23
Speaker 1: Well I was kind of pointing at you. I guess
1:00:25
Speaker 1: my cup is what I was doing. But hey, it
1:00:26
Speaker 1: cheers works too.
1:00:27
Speaker 2: We're an indie podcast. Yes, we are, just us. Oh shit,
1:00:31
Speaker 2: I did it.
1:00:32
Speaker 1: You did it.
1:00:32
Speaker 2: You said just the two of us, just the two.
1:00:37
Speaker 1: Not everyone will get that, but I'm pretty sure almost
1:00:40
Speaker 1: everyone will get that. All this is just the singing.
1:00:43
Speaker 2: Part that I, oh, yeah, but you're just I screwed
1:00:47
Speaker 2: up my own advice.
1:00:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, Nicole doesn't like, well, it's not just us. It
1:00:51
Speaker 1: sounds bad, well.
1:00:52
Speaker 2: Because I feel like lots of times people are like,
1:00:54
Speaker 2: I'm I'm just like a stay at home mom, or
1:00:57
Speaker 2: I'm just this, or I'm like and then they're degrading themselves,
1:01:00
Speaker 2: you know, so I yeah, but then I just did it.
1:01:03
Speaker 1: So yeah. But I think just has many meanings, especially
1:01:06
Speaker 1: in the context with when you use it.
1:01:08
Speaker 2: But okay, lots of times when people use it like that,
1:01:10
Speaker 2: or they'll say something about their their job or something,
1:01:14
Speaker 2: but it's like it makes it seem like it's less then.
1:01:17
Speaker 1: You know anyway, I also don't think it makes it
1:01:19
Speaker 1: seem less, and I think it makes it seem simple.
1:01:22
Speaker 1: I guess simple isn't bad. I guess I'm just to
1:01:25
Speaker 1: stay at home mom. That's self explanatory to everybody. That's
1:01:28
Speaker 1: a simple description. Everyone knows how to stay at home
1:01:31
Speaker 1: mom does right, you're raising fucking children. Mm hmm, so boom,
1:01:35
Speaker 1: I'm just to stay at home mom. Simple explanation just
1:01:38
Speaker 1: means simple in my mind. We're just in any podcast,
1:01:41
Speaker 1: meaning we don't have a giant corporation pulling the strings.
1:01:44
Speaker 1: It's the two of us doing it all. It gives
1:01:47
Speaker 1: you a simple explanation, and.
1:01:49
Speaker 2: Stay tuned in three months when we have this conversation again.
1:01:52
Speaker 1: Probably so until then, stay wicked.