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Terminator or Teammate? The Truth About AI · The Autistic Mile

• speaker-0: Welcome to the Autistic Mile. I'm your host, Jim Gaffney. Today I'm joined by by Derek Krager from Practical AI. Derek is not only app the owner of Practical AI, Practical AI app, but he is also an author book Human First AI. Save your business, save your job. I think that's pretty concise there. How you doing, Derek? speaker-1: I'm doing good, Jim. Thank you for having me and hello to everybody out there. speaker-0: Yeah, glad to have you on today. Derek, tell me a little bit about yourself. I mean, I know a little bit, but tell our audience a little bit about yourself, kind of where you've been, kind of where where you are now, where you're going. speaker-1: Certainly I I'm playing in the world of AI, but I gotta say my path to get here has been a little bit different. I actually came out of high school and attempted to go to college and and work at the same time. It was a little tough living on my own, but I ended up going through apprenticeship and got into skilled trades and I helped build some automotive manufacturing facilities for Ford. Chrysler, General Motors, Subrew, Asuzu, and Asuzu is still around. I've helped build the insulin facility for Eli Lilly Pharmaceutical in Indianapolis. after my time on the building side of things, I went in house and worked directly for automotive manufacturers and worked for two or three of those over time. My last stint is at Amazon, where I built Amazon's highest rated employee training program in their company history. So that's a feather in my cap that I'm proud of. Never mind. During this entire time yeah, thank you. during this entire time I've I've I've technology has been a hobby, but it's never been like a forefront. So once I left Amazon I noticed that AI finally got down to the consumer market where it is now and it's creating all kinds of headlines, right? AI promises this, AI promises that. But according to MIT, about ninety five percent of every instance of where companies are trying to replace humans, they've failed. So I I believe there's a smarter way to to introduce AI and I call it human first AI. That's the philosophy. That's the topic of my book. And that's the what my company follows for every product that we build because let's keep the humans. And it's more about just keeping them in the loop. Let's have AI think with those humans that brought our companies to the great status that they are now. Because AI could do some great things, but it can't replace a big chunk of what humans do. And that's Think outside the box is is the biggest. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah. No, that's it's definitely true. and you and I have discussed this topic before. when we talk about AI, it's you know and and I think you agree, it's you know, in using it to augment our own abilities and to kinda raise ourselves up, the human element is so important in that. It's not just totally, you know, just let I run amuck. you know, there there needs to be there needs to be thinking behind it, you know, there needs to be some process there. and that is really I mean, that's kind of my philosophy. is and we really should we should be using it to in in the ways that that benefit our business and our and our lifestyle. but it's really not not as a a crutch, so to speak, you know, where we let AI do everything for us. speaker-1: Well, and that's where practically AI comes in. We believe in thinking with the human instead of thinking for the human. And you mentioned the term augment or augmentation. And AI certainly does that. It allows us to AI supplies things that that we can't do. I like to focus on the amplification side of things. Humans do some incredible things. And one of the things that humans does humans do well. Boy, I'm saying that out loud. It seems like there's phonetic and my English teacher is coming in my head. I I'm curious if I'm saying this correctly. But one of the things that humans do well is make decisions outside the box. Right? We have a critical point, whether it's in the school day or in a white collar office or on a blue collar production line where we can make decisions if we have information. And AI allows us to make more decisions during the day than without AI. AI can do the research, do the information points and hand it to us. And then we just have to look at it and make decisions. So in a typical day, it may be a teacher, it may be an office worker, it might be a production supervisor, they would have to go out and and assemble their own research and background and check their own dashboards. And they might be able to make, I don't know, three or four decisions in a day. But if we have AI doing all that grunt work, definitely a a professional assistant here, or a teacher's assistant, you could say, in the schoolroom, is we handle all the information gathering behind the scenes and we allow humans to do what they do best, and that's make the right decision points and choices for the good of the group. speaker-0: Yeah, it really can streamline your processing. I know with what I do with with the clinic here and trying to automate some of their processes, I know I it's I use AI on that. I'm a technologist by trade. you know, I did that for close to twenty five years, so I have a technology background. I'm not as fluent in some of the current languages, but you know, I have all that knowledge, you know, the the from a architectural standpoint from It's not it's not always the easiest thing the to to s to see what you have and figure out a way to use that to your advantage, to make something that will either you know hopefully improve the improve the business, make things more functional, make you allow you to do things more quickly, and more efficiently. So you know, it's not it's not as if you know, we sit back and just let AI do everything for us, you know. We're doing a lot of the thinking on how to architect things and and where this best fits in. Does it fit in? and if it does, where how best to use it. And that's from my experience at least recently, that's and that's not including some of the other stuff I do. That's when I use the word augment, that's what I I'm talking about. It's not a a lack of ability. It's you know, you're you're using some of the knowledge you have and you're an AI is kind kind of helping give you a push forward, especially if it's if it's so whether it's a technology or something you may not be adept at but you know as far from an architecture standpoint or from a business standpoint what you're looking for. speaker-1: Yeah, it's well well spoken. speaker-0: I mean and and AI, I mean I I mean there's not a day goes by and I I feel I don't think people really fully understand even even the people that are against AI How much is it's been integrated in our lives to this point. I mean, it's you'd be hard pressed to to go online to any account you have or any you know, whether it's a personal account, a work account, and it's not leveraging AI in some way, shape, or form, even if you're not aware of it, even if it's not not a sticker saying, bang, you're using AI, you're using AI. It's not it doesn't always happen like that, you know. you may be you may be participating. You may be a a a participant and you're being presented with information that's being produced by AI or or or s AI has been part of that is part of that infrastructure. And I don't think people realize that sometimes because it's not always front and center. It's not like you're hitting a button, you're saying, okay, tell me this or do that. And I don't think people truly understand just how deep that rabbit hole goes. speaker-1: Yeah, that's great insight. And we need to understand that AI is just a commodity, really. It's a tool. And it shouldn't be in the forefront. It should be part of the supporting structure based on whatever organization that is. And we can go back a hundred years or more to another new technology at the time. The headlines are reading, hey, this kills people. Hey, this takes people's jobs. But that new technology, lo and behold, it was electricity. And it it took humans three decades to adopt electricity in everyday life, both in I'm talking mostly in the in the commercial business side of things. there's actually probably many reports of homes that didn't have electricity until the nineteen fifties or even after. And if we look back at electricity, Let's look at let's just say something simple that we understand, kind of take a Warren Buffett mentality here. A grocery store. A grocery store that before it had electricity, it was limited to daylight hours, it was limited to what it could stock in the shelves at room temperature. but when they adopted electricity, they didn't suddenly become an electric company. Just like today, companies that adopt AI, they don't suddenly become an AI company. It's just one more tool in the toolbox. And when we look back on things, that's all we're going to see. We're going to get through this, you know? Are there jobs at stake? Sure. That's the microeconomics of it. Individuals will be displaced. But the good thing about it is you can transition to a new role, a better role so much more quickly. And for business wise, we'd see the value of electricity today. So those are the rose colored glasses with which I wear. And Over a hundred years ago, if you were the company, the business, the individual that adopted electricity on day one, you were literally thirty years ahead of your competitors, of your neighbors that didn't adopt electricity until the end of those three decades. And there's risk involved when you try something new. I want to tip my hat to Ford Motor Company, who their CEO was behind. he supported the the layoff of their design team for a car company, an automotive company. And they realized after they were gone that they could not keep up with AI, that they needed the humans. Humans provide creativity. That's another thing that AI cannot do. So what did Ford do? They brought those jobs back. They brought those employees back. And Did they do the right thing or the wrong thing? Did Ford do the right thing or the wrong thing? Well, they're a company, so they need to experiment on how to do things better. And the value that I extract from that, the moral to the story is try new things. And when you're wrong, do like Ford Motor Company did and own up to it. Hey, we made a mistake. We need humans. Let's bring back. And they were pushing the boundaries, which a business has to do in today's environment. And what they're learning is is they're learning that AI can be supported of the employees instead of replacing the employee. And look at that. They never even heard the term human first AI. Lo and behold, they're living it. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah. That's good perspective there. I mean, there's so been so many inventions along the road, that I mean, over the last century, you know, and you think of you think you're talking about electricity and you know, I think about like flash frozen foods and food stabilization. Products, you know, back in the day they they had a a l a very short shelf life. you know, that certain stores couldn't carry certain things or you couldn't have certain things in your home. Because they need to be refrigerated. or or they couldn't or or they couldn't sustain long trips. So some you know, a lot a lot of these advances that happened over over a hundred years, and and you know, these are things we take for granted today. I think, you know, in in in the years to come, we'll look at AI similarly, you know, it's like how did we live without it? but it's like anything else. It's you know, it can be used f i incorrectly. You know, it could be used for notharious purposes, you know. you know, as as much as we rely on technology, we always have to be smart about it and we have to be we ha it has to be done you know, you have to have a moral compass when you're when you're when you're in that environment because like I said, it's it's how you're using it. And again, when you're and when you may and we talk about maybe from a business standpoint about impacting people's livelihoods That's where you have to tread particularly carefully. you you gotta you really gotta tread lightly there. speaker-1: Yeah, that's to agree with you there. Everything in moderation, my grandmother used to tell me, and if we too much of anything becomes a poison. if we go back to an let's let's reference that electrical revolution, the electric revolution over a hundred years ago. A lot of people are unaware that the electric car was invented in the eighteen hundreds. A lot of money was spent to design it and implement it, and it worked. But however, the infrastructure around an electric car from the eighteen hundreds, it wasn't there yet. It wasn't sustainable. So a company I I was told and maybe Porsche that was behind this, the Porsche family way back when, but they implemented the electric vehicle, they spent money on research, designing and building, and in the end they had a takeaway. Hey, it's not for us today. Maybe we'll try again later. And now we have the later and we see electric vehicles, we think nothing of them. But I use that as an example of any new technology, every company, every individual is looking to make money off that new technology, that new invention. And so they're gonna throw it at everything out there just to see if it sticks. And just because you can do something with a new technology doesn't mean that that's the best choice. For a solution. speaker-0: Well, it seems to me now, from what I see, the the climate's a little different now because there's such a fear of of not winning the AI race, you know, from a from a a national and international perspective. So you have countries vying for that superiority. you know, they're vying for that that technology be the first. They don't nobody wants to lag behind that. And I don't know if at any other point, I mean, you you can you can think about things like, you know, being the first country to put a man on the moon. I it's it's a little bit like that, but it's it's it's it's more well actually no, I think it there's a lot of similarities there because there's a fear that's behind it. You know, what if we fall behind? What if we're not the first? What if the what if they're the first to do it and they do it better? Or do we get crushed? You know what mean? there's a lot of economic fear that surrounds not winning the AI race. So I think again, that's just another another piece of the puzzle that goes into the fascination behind it, some of the trust and the mistrust and I I I see I try to see all sides of it. I try to take a a a larger view of the overall picture instead of going all in on something. You know, I try to use things where they're appropriate. but I I think I think politics and things like that and particularly with AI are are playing out on a global scale. And I think that's where it goes I don't know, but I I know that's it's definitely an angle that's that's alive and active here and it's playing out in real time. speaker-1: Yeah, well said, Jim, at the at that government level, country to country. And it's not so much even just the government, but it's the constituents of that country. and you gave getting to the moon, right? America, the United States, got to the moon first, but we weren't the first to put someone in space, right? That was Russia or the Soviet Union. And so that was during a cold war, and a cold war is what happened after World War II. And it it's interesting. Our opponent during the Cold War was our ally during World War II. Now, the United States was the first one, another race, right? Let's the atomic bomb. the U.S. was the first to fine-tune it and use the atomic bomb and because the United States got to that finish line first, they had a major, major say in Peace negotiations, surrender negotiations, who did what and where, how, and when. The the space race was another thing. I'm I'm thinking that the space race, while we've taken a lot of inventions from building things to get us to space, I don't see that as having as direct an impact as what electricity did a hundred years ago or what AI is doing today, but it was very important. from propaganda's position, from points of decision making and diplomacy. And after the arms race, we also have the nuclear race, nuclear power. Nuclear power in the United States was kind of put on pause in the nineteen seventies because they were scared after an exposure incident in Three Mile Island on the east coast of the US. And what had happened was there were two service workers who got exposed to radiation and it made the headlines. and the headlines made it out that hey, nuclear power is bad. Now it's kind of like mimicking with electricity and mimicking AI. nuclear power is bad, it's gonna kill us, yada yada, yada, you know, go down that propaganda waterfall. And looking back, the US stopped building clean, environmentally safe nuclear power because of headlines like that. And what they actually tested, those two humans, those humans were exposed to less radiation, or let's say even an equivalent amount of radiation as a commercial airline pilot that flies full time because airplane pilots they are not protected by the the ozone layers and the atmospheres they're and they're closer to the sun essentially. So imagine if we would have made a better choice back then and really got to the truth if we were educated about nuclear power rather than just accepting the headlines. you know Chicken little, right? The sky is falling, the sky is falling, let's react. And I'm I appreciate you having me on because I believe in education. I'm not here to force anybody to choose AI. I'm saying stick keep your head out of the sand. Learn what AI can do, what it can't do, and be part of the decision making process. Because as soon as you stick your head in the sand, you let somebody else determine your future. And the future of your children and grandchildren. speaker-0: Yeah, that's true. You gotta yeah, we as you know we we all have to always be mindful of of anything that touches our lives. So to bury your head in a stand would you know that wouldn't serve you very well. I believe in knowing even if if something I'm not truly behind or I don't believe in as much, you know, I like to keep tabs on it. I like to know what's going on. I just don't shut it out completely. And that and that goes for Just about anything that I'm exposed to, you know, once I know about it, I wanna know, you know, 'cause it may eventually have an impact on your life. And you just never know. You wanna you just don't wanna wake up one day and be like, I should have paid attention over the last five years. you know, this is coming to fruition. I know nothing about it. so it's it's just one of those things. But you know, with like you said, it really goes back to the humans first. You know, we've all seen Terminator and I think people have that mentality, you know, the Terminator mentality. You know, the machines are gonna take over. you know, as as much as I as many good things I have to say about AI, I know, you know, I've had I think I've had arguments with it as well. It's like, why are you should listen to me? I asked you for ver something very specific, and you're giving me something that's that's very, very very far away from what I was asking for. we have to remember at the end of the day that humans are programming this AI. I mean it's you know, it's these are and that's another slippery slope. We have to remember, and I think it's especially important with AI to always keep in the back of your mind, you know, if it's if it's some if it's something that's more subjective, and I'm I I don't like to be political, and I I won't be now. I we're not gonna start now, but you always have to be careful the source, you know, where's com where this information is coming from. So If you're if you're looking for something that's subjective, maybe it pertains to politics or something cultural, you always have to take it with a grain of salt. because again, it's it it may the potential is there for bias, depending on the creator or creators behind that. And it's it's it's easier, it's there's less of a gray area when you're using it for something that's more fact based. You're using it a business application. You're not using it to write a report on on political history. You're not writing it I think the further the more the further you get away from practical business or or pr just practical applications in general and you move into c culture and politics and and more of that area, that's where you're gonna see some of that. And that's again, it's just I mentioned it because it's something to be mindful. It's just like when you're watching news on the TV, you gotta remember. where you're hearing this from, to know, be able to make your own interpretation. Just don't always take your information from one source either. you know, as you should be open to hearing information from multiple sources, from multiple sides, 'cause I think we become more well rounded at that point. But I think that's just that's just something to point out when you're when you're discussing about AI and what's behind it and what kind of information you may be receiving. it's just something that that I think about in when I'm interacting with AI, speaker-1: I agree with that speaker-0: Yeah, go ahead. speaker-1: Well, I gonna say I agree with your your assessment. I we're much more inundated with news. the internet brought a lot of headlines to us, and I think it's desensitized us emotionally. We still get caught up in it, but I think that we are much better judges of whether information is right or wrong, or at least to stop and think. Now, put yourself five years PI PI PI. Pre internet, before the internet was around, there would speaker-0: You remember you and I are both old enough to remember that. speaker-1: It it's a little tongue in cheek, but it it's also the truth. there were big Bigfoot sightings. There was sightings of Nessie, the Loch Ness monster, there were sightings of Elvis Presley, who had supposedly died in 1977. All this happened before the internet, and there were newspapers that were sold. We were buying headlines because we wanted to read about this stuff. And what happened when the internet came out? Did we finally get Instagram photos of Bigfoot, the Loch Ness monster? Well, it it died down quickly because there were so many the tools allowed us to as a a community to v validate the you know, we're not seeing as many Bigfoots and and Loch Ness monsters. We're a little more understanding of the truth and we We take all headlines with a grain of salt. When it comes to AI, I'm asking people to do the same thing. That's why I wrote my book, Human First AI, to educate. Again, it's not directing people to to accept AI, but educate yourselves and be part of the solution that chooses humans first rather than let a big company make their own decision on who's going to and how they're gonna handle AI. speaker-0: Well in your line of business, and I'm gonna I'm gonna do a little we're gonna do a little exercise here. I'm gonna give you an example of of something very specific of AI for me, and I'm gonna ask you to I'm sure you can to provide a similar example in your experience. so my experience with AI, and this is just one example, I'm just using this. I create I create I write lyrics, I write song lyrics. I I I've written a couple books I enjoy writing, and I've always wanted to trying my hand at songwriting. I do not play an instrument. I I'm a I'm a shower singer at best. you know, so so pr producing music or producing vocals for me is really not an option. So so you sit down and you say, You want to write a song, okay? And then where do you go from there? okay, it looks good on paper. It's gotta s it's gonna sit there. You cannot bring that creation to life by yourself. so AI comes along, and now you have the tools and the ability to and again augment your own abilities. There's you can produce music that corresponds to your lyrics. you're not you're you're interpreting how you want that to sound, how the vocals you want to sound, how the music you want to sound, and you're putting those to your lyrics, to my lyrics. And I've been very h I've been v extremely pleased with the results of that. You know, we we have our songs on the Autistic Mile website. It's the songs are published under the Autistic Mile. They're on available on on many streaming platforms. and hopefully people derive value from those. those are those are songs that they would have sat in a notebook for the rest and for the rest of my life, had it not been for my ability to to bring those forward using AI. And that's just one application. but the downside of that when when people hear the music, they enjoy it. When they hear that it was produced via AI, it kinda kinda loses the luster a little bit. You know, they you know I their opinion changes a little bit. and I I never I never convey to anybody that I I never mis represent the music. so I don't produce the music, I don't produce I mean I produce them via AI, but they ha they're not it's not my voice, it's not me playing, and I I don't misre represent that. but I want the people to to hear the message behind it. and again, a lot of people when they when they write a lot of groups, a lot of singers, you have somebody who'll produce the lyrics and somebody will produce the so i you could have multiple people doing during that whole composition depending on on on the group or the or the makeup of that. So it's not always one person and here you have one person and then you have AI. And it doesn't bother me, but it's just it's something I bring up because it's something I notice. when somebody hears that it was produced via AI, kind of it's like, you you know, you didn't do that yourself. Kinda, you know, it's like, no, I did. You know, yesterday the song didn't exist. Today the song exists. They're my words. you know, all I have is my word that I didn't use AI to create the the lyrics. and my word is my bond. So, but I can't I mean I I'm not gonna try to convince somebody of that. That's and I don't I don't need to. There I know I know I wrote them and that's all that that matters to me. So that's just one example of I don't I don't wanna say the downside, but a little negativity about AI. And I'm sure you probably have multiple stories, but let's hear one from you, from your perspective about maybe one that maybe one that drives home the most with you. speaker-1: Well, I want stick to your creativity, your artist, your creative aspect. I presume that you didn't get paid for your creation. I presume that if you did get paid, you didn't make a lot of money from it. I presume that you enjoyed the process of what you're doing. And I I say that AI today is one more extension of democratizing creativity, democratizing artwork. go if you're listening now. Check in with your your grandparents, your great grandparents, your great great grandparents if they're around, and ask them about the talkies, right? Old movies that were around and they were made in the I don't know, the thirties, the forties, the fifties, and really all the way up through the seventies. artist, and when I say artist in this method, I'm talking actors, actresses, they were owned. by a big corporation and they could only produce and star in movies that the corporation approved of. They had to dress a certain way, say things a certain way, and they couldn't just go do independent stuff. So if you are formalized something like that, you know, hey, there were some great movies. Wizard of Oz, fantastic. But as Prince would say later on when we start talking about the musical artist, Prince talked about the fact he stepped away and changed his name because the big companies kept ninety-five percent of all profits. So what AI is doing today has already been done by Napster in the nineties, by Pandora, one of the earliest streaming services. by allowing people to share music, to be their own DJs, to curate their own music. We've created more art. We really have. Now, you creating what you did, Jim, it did not erase Taylor Swift's song. she did not lose anything. What you did, you added to an already existing creative database that's out there. So you've given people one more choice. And as humans, don't we all love choice? We can create. Yeah, look what YouTube did. YouTube allowed People that that were homeless. We've got those stories. People that were homeless that couldn't find a job, couldn't carry a job, but they know how to entertain, so they use this free service called YouTube and they start spinning their own TV show. And then they get paid for it. What a wonderful world we live in. And if cuter if computers didn't exist, then the internet wouldn't exist and those humans wouldn't be able to do something that they love. Do more art, to do more creativity, to be a valid well, people are buying that creativity through either watching, ad supported, or actually paying money through different services to compensate these artists. And we have more artists today than we've ever had, I would say, post the big dark ages. The dark ages, pre-dark ages, you know, we talk about a lot of information that was lost because it it just didn't get written down. But today we've had to work. everybody had to work. up until the last, I don't know, fifty years. If you didn't have a job, you didn't succeed. I mean when I say job, I mean traditional work. An eight to five, a nine to five, working in the coal mines. Humans have done some horrible stuff. And now we have opportunity today to leverage technology to make our lives better, to make the quality of life better for those around us. And Jim, it it could be you and your family that listens to your music and nobody else. Or you could people start listening to your music and it spreads. You might have people in your house, in your neighborhood, in your city, in your state, and here you are online. As a podcaster. Podcasting didn't exist before the internet. The internet allowed the democratization because I I I would safely say, and I don't think you're going to get mad if I say neither one of us are Walter Cong Cronkite. And back in the day when when TV only had three or four stations, you could a pr a human had very little chance to make an impact on the world. and share stories, but now they do. And AI today allows us to expand that line a little farther and be more creative. Nobody's getting hurt with AI. As long as AI is an outright stealing and and we hold AI to the same considerations that we would a human. Humans aren't allowed to steal, so we slap them on the wrist, say no, fine if we have to. We've done the same thing with AI. it was open AI or it was anthropic that just got beat in court, I think it was a two billion dollar settlement because they used books that were not public domain, books that anybody else, you and I, would need to pay for with hard-earned cash. they trained their models on these books, these works of art without permission of the authors. Now, yes, did it did it hurt sales for some people? Sure it did. But in the end, it's better for everybody that the knowledge is out there And did it was it done right this last time? No, because it was done without permission. But we learned something from it. There's a moral to the story. And now we have a way authors can sign on when they when they let's say somebody uploads their book or they get published, they have an option on whether they allow their book to be sourced by these AI companies out there. It's it's now an author choice, and it's because we've pushed the boundaries and and experimented and even though we've gone too far sometimes, we know enough 'cause we're human and we have morality, we know enough to fix our mistakes, learn from and move forward. speaker-0: Yeah. Well, even though even though it doesn't necessarily tie back to AI specifically, you think just your ability to write a book, my ability to write a book, we could always we always had that ability, but our our ability to distribute those books so that people could derive meaning from those, you can you can do that twenty five years ago. Now the other there's s public cur publication services, you know, you can distribute your book through Amazon as a self published author. again Stephen s Stephen King sleeps well at night. We're not gonna nobody's gonna cut in on his market. You know, you have you have well known authors. the books that we write aren't gonna do them any harm. it's it's it's for a specific audience, you know. They're not and and that's that's the point I think. And and any of these things you're talking about, the world keeps c it w the world keeps spinning. you know, the internet comes and it it brings along some good opportunities. You talk about podcasting YouTube. Again, people didn't stop watching TV because YouTube came along. you know, it's it's selective. You know, they're finding options they may not had that are not available to them on those stations. Any given station can only have so much programming. and there's so many different topics of discussion. I mean you know our primary focus on on this podcast is neurodiversity and autism. and that's something that most people can't get on in a public setting on on regular TV. so it's gives people another outlet, when they want it. It doesn't mean they're stopped watching TV, it doesn't mean they stop watching HBO. you know, the wheel keeps turning, the world keeps spinning. and when you talk about music again, you know, if Taylor Swift is up at night because she's worried about a song that I've published or, you know, that we're gonna take away revenue from them, then they've got bigger problems than than than I got. So again, it's you know, for myself, I I I like the creativity. I mean, you know, my book is I mean it's people have read my book, it's it doesn't make a a ton of money. my music really doesn't make much. you know, I've I've spent more on on these projects out of my own pocket than I have vr received in return. I you know, I what I get in return is satisfaction of having having created something that I think is worth sharing. but that worth is really subjective. it's not based it's that's my own assessment. people have to digest it and see if if they agree with that assessment. but I I believe there's an audience for for everything out there, especially for AI, your book on AI is people want to know more about AI. And I think you have a very good take on this. there's a lot of different w roads, a lot of avenues you can explore with AI. you the f you're talking about the human element aspect of it. and I'm sure your book goes into more specifics, but that's what you focus on. but your ability to do that again, it's not harming anybody monetarily. it allows you to share your perspective and allows people to digest your perspective and it I think that's really what the world's about, having more points of view that you can digest in I mean, it's crazy world out there sometimes. Sometimes you're just looking for some sanity. You're looking for an alternate perspective. Maybe I don't want to hear the perspective of corporate America through through my television set. You know, I I enjoy reading reading books and listening to music by by people who are not on the in the mainstream, because that's where you'll find some of the most interesting reads or some of the most interesting songs to listen to. You'll you'll find it in those going down those paths, you know, not that Not that there's not good programming on T V or there's not good books out there, but you'll you'll find some real gems out there. and that wouldn't otherwise be possible with that without the the movement forward in technology we talk about. speaker-1: Agreed, and my apologies in advance to any Swifties that are out there in your audience right now. speaker-0: I don't know how many of them watching, but well we should apologize so that we're not talking bad about Taylor Swift here. speaker-1: Well I I I wanna say that Taylor Swift took a page out of Prince's notebook and Taylor Swift is is the epitome of using technology to take power away from corporations and put it in her own pocket. She is so good at it and she surrounded herself with beautiful, brilliant people that they use technology. She walked away from her label at the time and and started from scratch and she was able to use the internet, ads, TikTok, YouTube, and all these this technology allows her to get her works out so people hear her and the fans can appreciate her. And there again, it's it's it's a great example of what any technology, whether it's the internet, Napster, YouTube, TikTok, Or now AI can do to empower the individual, humans first. That's what we're fighting for. I think it's important to fight. And so take your heads out of your sand if if you're against AI, 'cause that'll never solve things. Stand up for the right to make a decision on how we utilize AI moving forward. We we lost five decades with nuclear power because we made the wrong decision. We could have been a clean country, a clean world without the environmental negative impact that we have today because we burn coal, if only we made the right decision fifty years ago and the only way we could have done that is if we kept our heads out of the sand, which we didn't, and educated ourselves and spoke up to help make those decisions and contribute in the right direction. speaker-0: Only time we'll tell if we're destined to repeat that mistake. you know, it you know, it's these days, I mean, there's just so much I mean there's just so much out there. you know, and there's there's so many people fighting for or against something. you know, if somebody's for something, you'd probably find at least half is the same number of people that that are against it. I always I always was of the mind if I was against something, it was my own personal opinion. I never rallied against it. that's not my style. You know, if I if I don't like somebody, just leave it alone. I don't I'm not necessarily against it. It's just not it's not for me. but you know, people we live in a polarizing world, you know, people it's like you know, they they really for for no other reason except for maybe that they have the ability to will be negative towards something or or try to bring something down. it's a bad mentality to have, 'cause you know, you know, most people are just trying to raise themselves up or they're trying to raise others up, trying to provide good information or or a good product. so it's just you know, but we live in a polarizing world is and we're bombarded by information. you know, it's Nine to a n a nine to five workday went away a long time ago. You know, it's now we we were all work, you know, seven to six, seven to five or seven to eight. you know, we're working ten, twelve hour days. you know, the days where you you left your house and you were home within eight hours and had an hour for lunch are long gone. so a lot of things have changed in the last fifty years. so this is this is not This is not the country that my parents grew up in is much different. But then again, when they were raising us as kids, their world was very different than the parents that that that raised them. so we always have to we always have to embrace the challenges of our own time and the and the technologies and and advancements or setbacks that come within that time. speaker-1: Agreed. And if we look back and whether it's decisions or which way we vote or parents or grandparents, we're not always going to get the decisions we're looking for. But the world has been on a quality of life improvement trend for quite some time. And yeah, we're all working strange hours today, but y God bless the agricultural revolution because it used to be it took one family to feed two families. And if you work out the math, it means half of everybody in the world was working a farm out there sweating under the sun, hoping that they're picking the right fruits and vegetables. And I've Jim, I'm a strong dude, but I'm not cut out for being out there in the fields for twelve hour days and just to feed myself and and my neighbors. So thank goodness that we're moving in the right direction with the technology. And just know that it's it's all gonna work out. It really is. We have good people around the world. We're gonna have some hiccups and make mistakes. But trust trust the humans. speaker-0: Yeah, I agree. And I think you know, the your book and and the concepts that that you're embracing and communicating to others, I think that goes a long way. because it it does make a difference at the end of the day. You know, one person, their their opinion and their thoughts, they do they do matter. so I'm I'm glad you you wrote the book. I'm glad it's doing well. I'm looking forward to reading it. I've got my Got my copy right here for those at home. I've so I'm we've got it on our book in our bookstore. I'm gonna be reading it. the the I I'm a technology guy by nature, so I I mean I use it every day. so it's it's always been a big part of my life and I and I include music in that. Music is to me is technology based. but even when we think about music and we talk about AI, you know I mean, think of I mean the seventies were the seventies. you know, I mean we think about music today, music's come a long way. I mean that's it's some I mean, and I don't wanna alienate our older audience, but I mean, you know, there's you know, instruments and and recording techniques that come a long way. So the quality of music has vastly improved over the years. But again, that's all technology based, you know, equipment. and again, artists are using equipment to augment their own abilities. So would would we be any less if we didn't use the technology it was available to us to again augment our own abilities? they're doing it in a setting where okay, they know they know how to play an instrument, maybe they're learning a new instrument, or maybe they're learning a a different style. so it's different in that respect. But again, technology is allowing them to augment their own abilities. So they're being benefiting from technology. So to draw a line and say, you know, here's the line, you don't cross it. You know, that Wine doesn't exist. It's it's it's not there. You know, it's technology is technology. whether it's creating a new instrument or creating new whether it's an instrument itself or the technology, the technology recording, anything that associated with that process, you know, technology is technology to say, okay, well, you know, you there's a line you can't cross. Well, we cross that all the time. Every day as as a human race, we cross that. Not only in creation, but in in some of the human endeavors, you know, in and trying to battle disease and and all other aspects that that benefit humanity. We cross that line every day. and it's only through technology that we do that. And this is just a piece of that, you know. so again, we should embrace it. but again, it's just like anything else. Use it correctly, you know, use it wisely. That's that's the best I that's the best example, the best statement that I can make. But it goes for anything else. You know, the internet is the same way. You can use it for nefarious purposes or you can use it for good. It's like it's just like anything. You can you can use a car for that. You can go out and you can, you know, deliver meals to meals on wheels to to people that need it. Or you can go out and you can run somebody over. It doesn't matter what the instrument is, you can mis you can use it correctly or you can misuse it. That's the bottom line. speaker-1: Good words to live by right there. speaker-0: So all right. Well I think that's I think that's gonna do it for us to say. You have any parting words for us, Derek? speaker-1: I I just want to say thank you to you and all your listeners and just make that educated decisions. I think that's the my walk away today. speaker-0: Yeah, I agree totally. and again, human first AI, save your business, save your job. Derek Krager, pick up your copy. We'll have it on our on our website in our bookstore. but Derek, you got some some good points in there and I'm looking forward to sitting down and give it a read this weekend. Hopefully I'll be done with it by the end of the weekend. That's my that's my plan anyway. speaker-1: Well, thank you so much for sharing and hope you have a great weekend to you and all your listeners. speaker-0: It was great having you on. Thanks, Derek. All right, that's gonna do it for here. yeah, we're gonna wrap up another mile. as always, remember every mile