Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #497 Assertiveness for Kids

Transcript

#497 Assertiveness for Kids · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for the
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: time poor parent who just wants answers.
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: Now, I want to encourage every parent to explicitly make
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  Speaker 2: sure that they say to their children, you have a voice,
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  Speaker 2: you have preferences.
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  Speaker 3: And this is your chance to be heard.
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  Speaker 1: And now here's the stars of our show, my mum
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  Speaker 1: and dad.
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  Speaker 3: Hello.
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  Speaker 2: This is doctor Justin Colson. I'm the founder of Happy
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  Speaker 2: Families dot com.
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  Speaker 3: Do you and the host of.
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  Speaker 2: Australia's number one podcast for parenting and family. It's called
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  Speaker 2: The Happy Family's Podcast. That's where you are right now,
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  Speaker 2: and we're so glad that you've chosen to have a listen.
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  Speaker 2: And thanks, thanks so much for being a part of
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: what we do here.
• 0:39
  Speaker 3: I'm here with Kylie. Hi, Kylie, say it, come.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: On, say hello Hello, Look at me like I'm a weirdo,
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: because we've said hello to each other like seven thousand
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: times today we've been together, but no one else has
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  Speaker 2: seen you. Kylie's my wife for those of you who
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  Speaker 2: arekn you the podcast and also mum to our six
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  Speaker 2: kids and podcast co host extraordmir Kylie. I'm not sure
• 0:59
  Speaker 2: if you're aware of this one, but we move into
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: our new house, we get out of the airbnb and
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: finally get into our house. Do you know how many
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  Speaker 2: days it is I'm counting, I am not seventeen days,
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  Speaker 2: seventeen days until we finally get into our new home. Hey,
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  Speaker 2: today we've got to listen to question how do you
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  Speaker 2: support kids? This one comes from Lydia by the way,
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  Speaker 2: how do you support kids to be more assertive with
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  Speaker 2: their peers? Lydia has highlighted that in a recent Q
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  Speaker 2: and A that I did for our Happy Families premium members. So,
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  Speaker 2: if you're a Happy Family's member, a premium member every month,
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  Speaker 2: in fact often every fortnight if I can squeeze it in,
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  Speaker 2: we have an hour long Q and A on zoom
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  Speaker 2: where people can ask what questions they want to ask,
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  Speaker 2: and I'll do my best to give everyone the very
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  Speaker 2: best parenting hacks and shortcuts and tips to get their
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  Speaker 2: parenting in the place that they want, like a shortcut
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  Speaker 2: to get on track. And Lydia said, I want to
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  Speaker 2: help my kids to be more assertive with their peers.
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  Speaker 2: You spoke about kids saying no the other week, like
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  Speaker 2: teaching them to stand up for themselves and say no,
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  Speaker 2: and everyone's saying yes. But I have the opposite problem.
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  Speaker 2: My five year old is very compliant and likes to
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  Speaker 2: please people, which is not something that we've encouraged. I
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  Speaker 2: think it's just innately the way he is because his
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  Speaker 2: sister is the complete opposite. This means that he doesn't
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  Speaker 2: speak up for what he wants or what he doesn't
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  Speaker 2: like with kids at school and be his own person.
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  Speaker 3: How do we help him? They love that question.
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  Speaker 4: I think that, like most things, it starts at home. Yeah,
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  Speaker 4: you know, she's acknowledged she's got two children who are
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  Speaker 4: completely different. Right, This is part of who he is.
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  Speaker 4: His nature is to please people. But there's this powerful
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  Speaker 4: opportunity that we have as parents to help our children
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  Speaker 4: find their voice. And if they can't find it at home,
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  Speaker 4: then they will never find it outside.
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  Speaker 2: It's so important to highlight by what you've just shared,
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  Speaker 2: and that is that. And Litti has pointed out as well,
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  Speaker 2: two kids completely different approaches to life.
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  Speaker 3: There are some kids who are happy to just.
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  Speaker 2: Go along with whatever, and other children who have this
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  Speaker 2: temperament that is really assertive, really willing to say I
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  Speaker 2: have a problem with this, and I don't want to
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  Speaker 2: do that. So, and we've watched it even in our
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  Speaker 2: own family. We've got six children, and some of them
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  Speaker 2: are very very clear on what they want, and others
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  Speaker 2: are like, yeah, I'm pretty cruisy. I'll go along with
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  Speaker 2: just about anything. But it's also worth highlighting here we
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  Speaker 2: are talking about a five year old. We're only talking
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  Speaker 2: about a little kid, and so I would like to
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  Speaker 2: start by just talking about the idea of identity and development,
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  Speaker 2: because Lydia has said, how do I help him to
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  Speaker 2: be his own person? And it's true that innately some
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  Speaker 2: people just are independent thinkers. But in terms of becoming
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  Speaker 2: your own person, can I ask you, Kylie, how old
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  Speaker 2: were you when you finally felt like you were your
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  Speaker 2: own person?
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  Speaker 4: I think, if I'm being completely honest, I think I'm
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  Speaker 4: only just starting.
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  Speaker 3: To get there. Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, Like literally, I'm almost forty five, and I feel
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  Speaker 4: like I'm finally feeling comfortable in my own skin.
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  Speaker 2: I kind of look at being your own person as
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  Speaker 2: being humble enough and willing to be open to take counsel,
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  Speaker 2: advice and ideas from other people, but also not being
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  Speaker 2: worried about how other people ultimately choose to respond to
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  Speaker 2: your decisions. And I reckon I was about forty I mean,
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  Speaker 2: I'd written books, and I'd been on the TV, and
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  Speaker 2: I've done all of these things that would make it
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  Speaker 2: look like I was very much knowing who I was
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  Speaker 2: and what I was about. But I feel like I
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  Speaker 2: was about forty, and you're saying mid forties. In fact,
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  Speaker 2: I distinctly remember in my late thirties or early forties
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  Speaker 2: finally being at a point where I was like, I
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  Speaker 2: love my parents, but I no longer care what they
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  Speaker 2: think about the decisions that I'm making for my life.
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  Speaker 2: I don't feel like I need to check in with it.
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  Speaker 2: I know some people are there when they're sixteen, some
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  Speaker 2: people are there when they're twenty four, But for me,
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  Speaker 2: that's where I was. So I know that Lidy is
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  Speaker 2: not saying until he's got his identity fully established, but
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  Speaker 2: it's worth highlighting the push to help our children to
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  Speaker 2: be their own person shouldn't come too fast and shouldn't
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  Speaker 2: come too strong. In fact, there's something really beautiful about
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  Speaker 2: having them continue to be a little bit dependent, a
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  Speaker 2: little bit wanting to connect more and understand more and
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  Speaker 2: be close more to you and to their peers.
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  Speaker 4: Well, I also think there's there's two sides to every
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  Speaker 4: quality that we can see the negative right to equality,
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  Speaker 4: but there's also positive.
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  Speaker 3: I like the way you said that.
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  Speaker 4: And so often we see what we would consider weaker
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  Speaker 4: qualities to be negative. Right, There is so much good
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  Speaker 4: comes out of some of those more weak, soft qualities
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  Speaker 4: in life. If everybody was so brash and harsh and
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  Speaker 4: so dominating aggressive even yeah, yeah, yeah, we just we
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  Speaker 4: miss out on some beautiful tender moments.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: The only time that this becomes a real problem is
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  Speaker 4: when our children are getting pushed into doing things they
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  Speaker 4: don't want to do.
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  Speaker 3: Right.
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  Speaker 4: There is nothing wrong with a child who's just really
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  Speaker 4: cruisy and happy to go along with everybody else as
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  Speaker 4: long as what's happening is appropriate. It becomes a problem
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  Speaker 4: when the child then finds themselves in a situation they
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  Speaker 4: can't get out of because they don't know how.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, really nicely said.
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  Speaker 1: So.
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  Speaker 3: Right after the break, we're going to share a couple
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  Speaker 3: of ideas that we have.
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  Speaker 2: That could help you if you want to make sure
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  Speaker 2: that your child, even if they're a cruisy, easy to
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  Speaker 2: get along with child who is quite happy to go
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  Speaker 2: with the flow, how they can actually say no or
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  Speaker 2: say yes.
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  Speaker 3: At the times that are appropriate.
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  Speaker 2: To make sure that they are assertive and look after
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  Speaker 2: their own needs when it needs to be done. Imagine
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: a relationship where you felt seen, heard and valued. One
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  Speaker 2: where as your partner enters the front door, they see
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  Speaker 2: you and their eyes light up. A relationship like that
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  Speaker 2: is a gift. If you don't have it now, you can.
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  Speaker 2: The Happy Family's webinar Better Together gives you the insight,
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  Speaker 2: tools and support you need to have a happier relationship,
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  Speaker 2: Available now at the Happy Families webshop.
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  Speaker 4: It's the Happy Famili's podcast, the podcast for a time
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  Speaker 4: poor parent who just wants answers. Now, this is such
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  Speaker 4: an interesting conversation we're having. We've got two kids totally different.
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  Speaker 4: You know. We've got this very assertive, very confident child,
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  Speaker 4: big sister living in the same home, parented the same way.
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  Speaker 4: And then we've got a little boy who is just
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  Speaker 4: so readily compliant and happy to go.
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  Speaker 2: Along and easily swayed and will follow the other kids
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  Speaker 2: down the garden path to places that maybe he shouldn't go.
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  Speaker 2: When you look online and have looked at all the
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  Speaker 2: blogs and all the articles written by all of the
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  Speaker 2: experts about assertiveness training, the typical thing that assertiveness training
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  Speaker 2: teaches is this thing called an I message.
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  Speaker 3: So you're supposed to talk to your kids about boundaries.
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  Speaker 2: You're supposed to talk to them about what's right and wrong,
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  Speaker 2: and what they feel good about and what they don't
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  Speaker 2: feel good about. You're supposed to talk to them about
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  Speaker 2: the power of saying no. And I think that that's
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  Speaker 2: really and that's part of what we need to do
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  Speaker 2: explicitly and in our modeling at home. But the central
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  Speaker 2: element of most assertiveness training, both in business, in schools,
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  Speaker 2: and in parenting, the central element is what they call
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  Speaker 2: the eye message. You've probably heard the eye message. The
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  Speaker 2: eye message is I feel and then you insert your emotion.
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  Speaker 2: I feel upset or I feel bullied, or I feel
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  Speaker 2: frustrated or sad when you and then you say what
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  Speaker 2: they're doing, I feel this when you do that. Instead,
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  Speaker 2: I want you to do this, or instead, I would
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  Speaker 2: prefer to do this. It's like saying, I feel angry
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  Speaker 2: when you tell me that I can't play, and I
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  Speaker 2: want you to let me join in. But no matter
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  Speaker 2: how many times do you repeat that sentence, and no
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  Speaker 2: matter how hard you try to drill that to a
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  Speaker 2: five year old, get them to practice and role play
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  Speaker 2: that sentence over and over and over again. It's never,
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  Speaker 2: never going to feel natural, especially to a kid. And
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  Speaker 2: I think that it's actually kind of unrealistic to expect
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  Speaker 2: that a child is going to use sentences like that
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  Speaker 2: because they're already not assertive. Teaching them to use those sentences,
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  Speaker 2: it's never going to feel natural, it's not going to
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  Speaker 2: be authentic. They probably won't have the confidence to do it.
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  Speaker 2: I don't think that it's actually a helpful thing to
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  Speaker 2: do as a general rule.
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  Speaker 4: Well, and how many children stop in their tracks when
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  Speaker 4: that happens and says, oh, I'm sorry.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah, hey, thanks for telling me
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  Speaker 2: that that's how you feel. Why don't you come and
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  Speaker 2: join it? After all, that's not what five year olds do, folks.
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  Speaker 2: So I just think let's move away from the standard
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  Speaker 2: assertiveness training. It's like nineteen eighties psychology, quite frankly, and
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  Speaker 2: we can do better. And that's what we need to
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  Speaker 2: talk about for the next couple of minutes. This is
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: for parents who want answers on this.
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  Speaker 4: Well, it's interesting we've you know, you asked me the
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  Speaker 4: question when did I start feeling like I came into
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  Speaker 4: my own person? And you know the answer is only
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  Speaker 4: really recently feeling really comfortable and competent in being able
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  Speaker 4: to share how I feel about things without making it
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  Speaker 4: about other people. This is actually my experience, this is
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  Speaker 4: what I'm experiencing. And while the things that you are
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  Speaker 4: doing may evoke emotion in me, at the end of
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  Speaker 4: the day, it's my response, and so kind of trying
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  Speaker 4: to work through that. And so when I think back
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  Speaker 4: to growing up and even our early marriage, recognizing that
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  Speaker 4: I felt I didn't feel confident to use my voice,
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  Speaker 4: and I'm seeing it with my kids.
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  Speaker 3: That's what I wanted to say. I'm so glad you
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  Speaker 3: said that.
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  Speaker 4: And so when I ask our children something now and
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  Speaker 4: they say I don't know or I don't care, I
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  Speaker 4: will actually stop and say I don't accept that answer.
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  Speaker 4: I really want you to tell me what it is
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  Speaker 4: that you want, momm I don't care. You can buy
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  Speaker 4: whatever you know, you choose, just surprise me. It's like
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  Speaker 4: there's one thing, there's this beautiful notion of surprise, but
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  Speaker 4: this isn't a surprise thing because you know what I'm doing.
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  Speaker 4: So I want you to have an opinion.
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  Speaker 2: So it's okay to not have an opinion about a
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  Speaker 2: whole lot of things. It's okay to go up for
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  Speaker 2: dinner and say, you know what, let's just have whatever
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  Speaker 2: we have, and I'm not bothered at all. You choose,
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  Speaker 2: it's fine. But what's important is that voices are brought
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  Speaker 2: to the fore. Now, if somebody can honestly say I
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: don't have an opinion on this, it's not important enough
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  Speaker 2: for me.
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  Speaker 3: To have an opinion, then that's great. Let it go.
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  Speaker 2: But I want to encourage every parent to explicitly make
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  Speaker 2: sure that they say to their children, you have a voice,
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  Speaker 2: like use that sentence. You have a voice, You have preferences,
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  Speaker 2: and this is your chance to be heard. In fact,
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  Speaker 2: you should always be allowed to use your voice. This
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  Speaker 2: is when children learn how to say no. This is
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  Speaker 2: when children learn how to say yes and how to
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  Speaker 2: express themselves. And the only I think the only way
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  Speaker 2: that we can bring this out, especially if it doesn't
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  Speaker 2: come naturally to a child, is to actively and expressly
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  Speaker 2: encourage it at home and then talk about how when
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  Speaker 2: they're at school or with their friends, if we're seeing
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  Speaker 2: this happen, we want to ask them, how does it
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  Speaker 2: feel to not have a voice? Would it be better
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  Speaker 2: or worse to have a voice and in what contexts,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: in what situations.
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  Speaker 4: Sometimes it can be hard for them to see it
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  Speaker 4: when it's happening to them, and I've found often it's
• 12:00
  Speaker 4: more powerful when they can actually see it happening to
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  Speaker 4: someone else. You Know, the girls will come home often
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  Speaker 4: and tell me about things that have happened in the
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  Speaker 4: playground where a child's being bullied or mistreated or being
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  Speaker 4: left out, and asking them how it made them feel,
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  Speaker 4: and watching that unfold before them instead of them actually
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  Speaker 4: living through it sometimes helps significantly.
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  Speaker 2: So the last thing that I think we should mention
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  Speaker 2: is that if we want our children to be assertive,
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  Speaker 2: they need to know that there's a point to it,
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  Speaker 2: that somebody will listen, that somebody will be responsive. And
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  Speaker 2: so in our home, when our children are expressing themselves,
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  Speaker 2: it's important for us to not dismiss their emotions. And
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  Speaker 2: it's important for us to not disapprove of their emotions,
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  Speaker 2: but rather to accept their emotional state and go deep.
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  Speaker 2: I get curious, not furious. So if a child's having
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: a hard time and they do start to express themselves,
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  Speaker 2: this isn't the time for us to say stop it,
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  Speaker 2: be quiet, calm down, go to your room, because what
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  Speaker 2: we do is we teach them not to assert their emotions.
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  Speaker 3: What we need to do instead is we.
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  Speaker 2: Need to move into that emotion and say, how you're
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  Speaker 2: feeling really upset about this?
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  Speaker 3: Tell me more.
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  Speaker 2: It's that active encouragement of them expressing where they are
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  Speaker 2: that will help our children to be assertive. So Lydia,
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  Speaker 2: I hope that's helpful, and I hope you enjoy the conversation.
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  Speaker 2: Maybe we can help more kids to be assertive in healthy,
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  Speaker 2: authentic ways that really builds their sense of value and worth.
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: The Happy Family's podcast is produced by Justin Ruland from
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer. Hey Tomorrow
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: on the podcast, Kylie, you might be with me. In fact,
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: for the next couple of days, you're not going to
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: be with me because we are replaying an interview that
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: I did on Instagram a little over a month ago
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: with somebody that I think is probably the world's best psychologist.
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: I'm just going to say it.
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: She's absolutely brilliant when it comes to kids teens. Her
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: name is doctor Lisa Demore. You can read all of
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: her stuff in the New York Times. She's got a
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: couple of New York Times best Selling Books, and we
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: had a conversation on Instagram a couple of weeks ago
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: about vaping.
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: It was a, I.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: Think, a valuable, valuable conversation, and so we're going to
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: replay an edited version of that conversation tomorrow because when
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: you've got kids in grade four, grade five, grade six
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: and onwards through high school who are nicking off to
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: the toilets and vaping or scooting down to the park
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: and vaping, and we know how dangerous it is, well,
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: this is the conversation we need to have. So that's
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: tomorrow with doctor Lisa Demore. We're talking about vaping. If
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: you like Maro and fol about making your family happier,
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: you can find it all at happy families dot com
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: dot a