Latest / Indie Film Hustle® - A Filmmaking Podcast / IFH 816: From Extras to Director’s Chair: The Filmmaking Journey of Rocky Costanzo

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IFH 816: From Extras to Director’s Chair: The Filmmaking Journey of Rocky Costanzo · Indie Film Hustle® - A Filmmaking Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: You are listening to the ifh podcast Network. For more
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  Speaker 1: amazing filmmaking and screenwriting podcasts, just go to ifhpodcastnetwork dot com.
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  Speaker 2: Welcome to the INDIEILM Muscle Podcast, Episode number eight sixteen
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: Cinema Should Make You Forget. You're sitting in a theater,
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  Speaker 2: Roman Polanski.
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  Speaker 1: Broadcasting from the back alley in Hollywood. It's the Indie
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  Speaker 1: Film Hustle podcast, where we show you how to survive
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  Speaker 1: and thrive as an indie filmmaker in the jungles of
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  Speaker 1: the film biz.
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  Speaker 3: And here's your host, Alex Ferrari.
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  Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Indie Film Huscle podcast.
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  Speaker 2: I am your humble host Alex Ferrari. Today's show is
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  Speaker 2: sponsored by Rise of the Film Entrepreneur How to turn
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  Speaker 2: That's film bizbook dot com. Enjoy today's episode with guest
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: host Dave Bullis.
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  Speaker 3: Hey Rocky, thanks love for coming on the show. Hey Man,
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: thanks for live so Rocky. Just to get started, It's
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  Speaker 3: a question I ask everybody, and that question is Rocky,
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  Speaker 3: how did you get started in the film industry?
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  Speaker 4: Oh wow, let's see, Well this goes back. I've been
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  Speaker 4: a part of it. I've been on the outside, first
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  Speaker 4: of all, for a long time forever. But I started
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  Speaker 4: when I was a kid trying to get into acting.
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  Speaker 4: And stuff. So I started doing some extra work and
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  Speaker 4: got on some some TV shows and stuff, and it
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  Speaker 4: was pretty much on those shows that I found the
• 2:29
  Speaker 4: love for making movies. So I started making like pretty
• 2:36
  Speaker 4: much every h filmmaker, you make your home movies and
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  Speaker 4: stuff starring your family members and friends. And and then
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  Speaker 4: it was around two thousand that I the year two
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  Speaker 4: thousand when I made my attempted to make my first feature.
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  Speaker 3: So you know, your experience of going on those film sets,
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  Speaker 3: you know, you know what were some of the you know,
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  Speaker 3: the moments that you started realize like this is really
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  Speaker 3: connecting with you.
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  Speaker 4: Right, Well, it was I can narrow it down to
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  Speaker 4: one show. I worked as a full time extra on
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  Speaker 4: the On the Wonder Years, which was a pretty popular
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  Speaker 4: show back in the day. I don't know how many
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  Speaker 4: the kids know about it now, but it was that
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  Speaker 4: show that I actually was hired by the production company
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  Speaker 4: and work full time. So there's anyone that knows. Anyone
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  Speaker 4: that's worked as an extra knows that you're on set
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  Speaker 4: and then they kind of kick you off and go
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  Speaker 4: back to your folding area or school when they're setting
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  Speaker 4: up shots. And I would always find a way to
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  Speaker 4: sneak back on set because I was just so fascinated
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  Speaker 4: by watching them setting up the lights and the camera.
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  Speaker 4: And what was interesting is that it actually ended up
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  Speaker 4: I actually ended up getting a stand in gig because
• 3:52
  Speaker 4: I was just hanging around. So I got to be
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  Speaker 4: a stand in for one of the stars on the show.
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  Speaker 4: So that was it, really And then I got I
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  Speaker 4: got to meet Daniel Daniel Stern who was directing he
• 4:09
  Speaker 4: I think he directed a few of the episodes, and
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  Speaker 4: he was also the narrator for the lead character on
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  Speaker 4: the show. And got to meet him and it was
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  Speaker 4: a really awesome thing to meet him because of course
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  Speaker 4: I knew him from the Home Alone series. So just
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  Speaker 4: again leaving that show, I had a whole newfound love
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  Speaker 4: of being to high in the camera instead of in
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  Speaker 4: front of it.
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  Speaker 3: No, it's funny about the stand in story because it
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  Speaker 3: was almost like you were standing around someone was like
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  Speaker 3: it would be a stand in exactly.
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  Speaker 4: That's literally what it was.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I remember the Wonder Years. You know,
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  Speaker 3: it's funny because Kevin who was a star who and
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: whose real name escapes me at the moment, but fred Sava,
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  Speaker 3: that's right. Why did I not remember that. He Actually
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  Speaker 3: I ended up up bumping into him one day at
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  Speaker 3: a on the set of It's Always Something in Philadelphia,
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  Speaker 3: and I was like, oh my god. I was like,
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  Speaker 3: you know, you know, it's Fred Savage and he was like, yeah, yeah, Hi,
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  Speaker 3: it's very nice to meet you. And he's he was
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: a director now and that's why, you know, that's what
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  Speaker 3: he's been doing now these days.
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  Speaker 4: I've heard that I think he's doing some TV stuff
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  Speaker 4: and you know, yeah, that kid was. I mean, during
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  Speaker 4: that time, it was mega. It was you know, being
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  Speaker 4: on set. We would come in a lot of high
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  Speaker 4: schools and stuff, and that kid was like a beatle,
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  Speaker 4: I mean, just hugely famous.
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  Speaker 3: It was.
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  Speaker 4: It was fun to be around.
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  Speaker 3: Well, I mean, that's amazing. I can only imagine, you know.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
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  Speaker 3: What it would be like to be like a kid
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  Speaker 3: actor like that age and just be so popular.
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  Speaker 4: Like that exactly. And that's what I grew up watching.
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  Speaker 4: You know, if you grew up in the eighties like
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  Speaker 4: I did, it was it was all about sitcoms and stuff,
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  Speaker 4: and that's what I always wanted to do. I always
• 6:05
  Speaker 4: wanted to be that that, you know, teen star kid
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  Speaker 4: and everything. But I'm actually happy now that I didn't.
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  Speaker 3: Sort of like the two Coreys Corey Felman and Corey
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  Speaker 3: Haynes exactly. Yeah, but uh yeah, I mean, I mean
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  Speaker 3: those you know, those guys were just all the all
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: the horror stories they have. Yeah, Corey Haym Stauly passed away.
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  Speaker 3: But you know, you worked on another show and that
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  Speaker 3: was popular in the nineties, uh, you know, as an actor,
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  Speaker 3: and that was Beverly Hills, not A two and oh.
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  Speaker 4: I did, yeah, and again very this is all very
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  Speaker 4: like extra stuff, uh uh. And that pretty much any
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  Speaker 4: show that had to do with teens at the time
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  Speaker 4: I did, Uh you know, there was the nine of
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: two and oh and then A Party of Five and
• 6:52
  Speaker 4: again I still remember these life goes on any anything
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  Speaker 4: that had to do with teens I was a part of.
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  Speaker 4: But again I credit it the Wonder Years because that
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  Speaker 4: was the one that I was actually employed full time.
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  Speaker 4: I was, I was. I worked on that show for
• 7:08
  Speaker 4: about three years, so it was that's where I got
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  Speaker 4: the experience. And once I started doing some of these
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  Speaker 4: other uh like the the nine O two one ohs
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  Speaker 4: and stuff, those were just little little gigs here and there.
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  Speaker 4: And that's actually when I started to tune out and
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  Speaker 4: not really want to do that anymore.
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  Speaker 3: So, you know, you made your in your first film
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  Speaker 3: in nineteen onety nine, Godsend, correct.
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  Speaker 4: That was still a short film. My feature debut was
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  Speaker 4: shortly after that with Return to Innocence.
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  Speaker 3: I see. So you know, so when you were making
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  Speaker 3: you know, The Wonder Years to Bible Hills out of
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  Speaker 3: two and oh, you were doing you know, the extra work.
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  Speaker 3: So did you try, you know, start making some attempts
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  Speaker 3: at me, you know, making films like meaning, did you
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  Speaker 3: start making what you know would be quote unquote your
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  Speaker 3: student films?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, because I didn't go to a film school. Again,
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  Speaker 4: I barely went to high school because I was on
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  Speaker 4: set a lot. But so I would credit. What really
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  Speaker 4: happened was I got involved in public access TV, which
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  Speaker 4: I don't know if it's even exists anymore, but that's
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  Speaker 4: kind of that was an avenue back in the day
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  Speaker 4: before the Internet and YouTube, where you can actually go
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  Speaker 4: and borrow equipment from the cable studio and then go
• 8:25
  Speaker 4: out and make your movies. And it was funny because
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  Speaker 4: usually people would make their cooking shows or political shows
• 8:33
  Speaker 4: or interview kind of things. And I was out making
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  Speaker 4: like horror films and stuff, and when it was it
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  Speaker 4: was fun to see it kind of air on TV
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  Speaker 4: and everything. So really I would credit that as almost
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  Speaker 4: being my quote unquote film school. And then of course
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  Speaker 4: just learning learning along the way. You never stopped learning.
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  Speaker 3: Very true, Very true, Rocky. You always got to keep learning.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: So you know when you were when you were you know,
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  Speaker 3: started making your own films, you know, what were some
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  Speaker 3: of the things I mean that that you know, really
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  Speaker 3: shocked and surprised you when you were making your films, Meaning,
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  Speaker 3: were there certain things that like like problems that you
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: didn't anticipate coming out of nowhere. And by the way,
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  Speaker 3: that's kind of a load of question, Rocky, Yah. I
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  Speaker 3: know that's yes, because it happens to us, all right,
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  Speaker 3: it does.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, And you know, and it goes back to what
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  Speaker 4: I said, you're always learning that I take something from
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  Speaker 4: every film. My very first film, the thing that I
• 9:30
  Speaker 4: learned was was lighting. I knew nothing about lighting, and
• 9:34
  Speaker 4: we had a really good dp where the film was
• 9:37
  Speaker 4: well with shot in color, but we wanted we wanted
• 9:39
  Speaker 4: a black and white film. The ark style kind of film.
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  Speaker 4: So this guy knew how to light for black and white,
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  Speaker 4: and so I was watching him and I kind of
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: picked that up. And then sound has always been a problem,
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  Speaker 4: and so I think sound issues. I kind of pick
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  Speaker 4: that up on the second film and wanted to learn
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  Speaker 4: more about that. And I think the storytelling and working
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  Speaker 4: with actors has always kind of been natural for me,
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  Speaker 4: because again I kind of come from that background as
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  Speaker 4: an actor and writing scripts and stuff, so that, you know,
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  Speaker 4: dealing with the actors has never really been an issue
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  Speaker 4: for me, although I've heard other filmmakers say differently.
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  Speaker 3: You know, you know that's that's a question I was
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: going to ask you was about, you know, because you
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: come from an acting background, do you think you're more
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  Speaker 3: comfortable directing actors?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I you know, It's it's strange the more i'm
• 10:39
  Speaker 4: I think. I at first I was completely I was
• 10:43
  Speaker 4: so clueless on the technical side of filmmaking, and I'm
• 10:47
  Speaker 4: still not that much better. But I would really spend
• 10:51
  Speaker 4: a lot of time with the actors, and lately it
• 10:54
  Speaker 4: seems like I want to let the actors kind of
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: play themselves. I don't want to really be the puppeteer
• 11:04
  Speaker 4: and they're just you know, again the puppets on on
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  Speaker 4: my streams or whatever. I like to see them play
• 11:09
  Speaker 4: because I think it brings out a natural thing, natural performance.
• 11:14
  Speaker 4: And you know, when you're in the audition room and
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: you've had callback after callback, you see these people and
• 11:22
  Speaker 4: you've decided that you want this actor or actors for
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  Speaker 4: the role, that means you want them. That means you're
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: happy with them. You're not going to get anything better
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: than what they're giving you. Maybe a little better, but
• 11:36
  Speaker 4: not not much. So you got, You're happy with what
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: you got, and so I like to let them play.
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  Speaker 4: So my focus is actually become a little bit more
• 11:44
  Speaker 4: into the shots and the style and the camera movements
• 11:49
  Speaker 4: and stuff.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I understand it pluly what you mean,
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: because sometimes I think that you know, you hire certain actors,
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: you hire certain crew because for there's a reason for it,
• 12:02
  Speaker 3: you know, And I think, you know, if you do,
• 12:04
  Speaker 3: if you have those people hired, you should, you know,
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: let them do the work that they were hired to do,
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: if you know what I mean exactly, because they, like
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: they say, Rocky, half of directing is casting the right
• 12:17
  Speaker 3: roles right or casting the right people in the right Roles.
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  Speaker 4: Absolutely, It's so true.
• 12:23
  Speaker 3: So you know, Rocky, you know, as we talk about
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: you know, your your directing career, you know, you did
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: God Send, you did Return to Innocence, and in two
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: thousand and five you followed up with Hollowed. Yes, so
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: you know, I wanted to ask, you know, as we
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: talked about your directing style as well, but your writing style,
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: you know, because I believe you've written all of your
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: of your own movies.
• 12:43
  Speaker 4: Correct not not correct. I did write a few of them,
• 12:49
  Speaker 4: and Hallowed is one that I wrote. And also Hallowed
• 12:54
  Speaker 4: is the the feature length version of God Send, which
• 12:59
  Speaker 4: was the short in ninety nine. So and it was
• 13:03
  Speaker 4: that was that film was actually kind of shot out
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: of frustration because see, I grew up on horror films again,
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: and you're in the eighties, you were, you were, you
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: were attacked by horror films. They were everywhere. So I
• 13:15
  Speaker 4: grew up on those. And we were trying to get
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: another film done at the time and it fell apart,
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: and so I was like, you know, I have a camera,
• 13:24
  Speaker 4: I got a couple of lights. I learned a little
• 13:26
  Speaker 4: bit of what to do on my Return to Innocence.
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: So let's just make a crazy slasher movie and so
• 13:34
  Speaker 4: I wrote directed that one, and and yeah.
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  Speaker 3: So you know, I want to ask about your writing style, Rocky,
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: you know, And basically that question is, you know, when
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: you're when you're writing, do you subscribe to any sort
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: of method or anything like that, or like you know
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: what I mean, like the USC sequencing method or save
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: the Cat or anything, or do you just sort of
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: start with a heavy treatment I wanted to I'm just
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: asking you know, how you know you go about writing
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: on your own screenplays?
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  Speaker 4: Sure? Sure? Well again, writing, especially as I'm getting older,
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: writing is not coming easy to me anymore, meaning the
• 14:11
  Speaker 4: actual act of sitting down at a desktop and starting
• 14:16
  Speaker 4: to type. I end the writers that can just sit
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: down and just away they go okay, I don't think
• 14:25
  Speaker 4: I've ever been able to do that. I'm still what
• 14:28
  Speaker 4: I do. As a matter of fact, I just got
• 14:30
  Speaker 4: back from Santa Barbara because I'm softly writing a new product,
• 14:35
  Speaker 4: a new script, and I still have a pad and
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: a pen, and I just I come up with actual
• 14:46
  Speaker 4: not even not even a story. I just come up
• 14:49
  Speaker 4: with ideas like this will be cool, this will be
• 14:52
  Speaker 4: like a cool moment in a movie. I don't know
• 14:54
  Speaker 4: what the movie is, but this will be a cool moment.
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: And then I start think thinking of characters, and really
• 15:03
  Speaker 4: I have everything laid out on paper before I even
• 15:09
  Speaker 4: sit down at a desk and start actually constructing the script.
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: So you know, you still use a pen in a paper.
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: Then do you do to write out everything like a treatment,
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: the outline everything.
• 15:24
  Speaker 4: No, it's really just notes. It just filled with a
• 15:27
  Speaker 4: bunch of different notes. And then in my head that
• 15:30
  Speaker 4: the idea starts to come around. And then I don't
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: really do the treatment first, I just start getting into
• 15:39
  Speaker 4: the script. And I also.
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: Will be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 15:53
  Speaker 4: Right straight through. And if I'm thinking ahead, meaning I
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: start at page one and I literally just go go
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: all the way through. If I come up with an
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: idea something strikes me, then then I go back to
• 16:06
  Speaker 4: the notes and I make some notes, like I might
• 16:10
  Speaker 4: know the ending of the film before I even know
• 16:14
  Speaker 4: anything else, Like I know, I know how I want
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: to end this thing, but I have no idea how
• 16:17
  Speaker 4: we're going to get there. So I will write down
• 16:19
  Speaker 4: the ending, make notes of the ending, and then when
• 16:23
  Speaker 4: I get there, just just you pretty much just put
• 16:25
  Speaker 4: it in.
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I had Al Watt, who runs the
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: l A Writer's Lab, and you know, he actually talked
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: about that where he said, you know, if you know
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: where you're going to begin or where you're going to
• 16:35
  Speaker 3: be end, he said, we have to let our subconscious
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: sort of fill in the gaps, right, and you know,
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: you know, and he would say, you know, just imagine
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: your hero transformed, Imagine you're here, you know what I mean.
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: So that way you can sort of let your subconscious
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: sort of piece all those things together exactly.
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: And again, like I said, I'm not a natural writer,
• 16:53
  Speaker 4: so you know, my way is my way. I started
• 16:57
  Speaker 4: writing mainly because I needed a film to make, so
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: I'm a director first, and so no one I couldn't
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: find a writer. No one else was, you know, doing
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: any writing for me. So it's like I was kind
• 17:10
  Speaker 4: of forced to, well, if I want to make a movie,
• 17:12
  Speaker 4: I got to write the darn thing.
• 17:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know, Rockie, I think that is sort
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: of what I've been noticing is more and more is
• 17:20
  Speaker 3: that you know, there's there's two camps. Either the people
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: who sort of say, well, you know, I'm going to
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: audition for this I'm gonna write this screenplay or I'm
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: going to try to direct this movie or this or that.
• 17:31
  Speaker 3: And then there's the other camp where that says, you
• 17:32
  Speaker 3: know what, if I'm gonna do movies, I'm going to
• 17:35
  Speaker 3: have to write this for myself.
• 17:37
  Speaker 4: Right, And you're also seeing which is it is a
• 17:41
  Speaker 4: way in. But I think a lot of actors that
• 17:43
  Speaker 4: that that try that they realize how how much, how
• 17:47
  Speaker 4: hard is you know, it's not you know, just I'm
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: an actor and I can't get a gig, so I'm
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: just going to write a movie for myself. They don't
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: realize that. Okay, well, now you got to get the
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: thing option. You got to sit around and hope that
• 18:01
  Speaker 4: it goes to production, and and then you've got to
• 18:03
  Speaker 4: fight to make sure that you get the lead in that,
• 18:06
  Speaker 4: in that project or whatever. But to go with more
• 18:09
  Speaker 4: of what you're saying, you're starting to see that a lot.
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: It's almost like everybody is doing everything nowadays. So actors
• 18:19
  Speaker 4: are not just actors. They are actors, producers, directors, you know,
• 18:24
  Speaker 4: they're they're everything. And I've always kind of just been
• 18:27
  Speaker 4: one one thing, like a director and of course writing
• 18:32
  Speaker 4: if I'm if I'm gonna if I don't have a writer,
• 18:34
  Speaker 4: I'll write it and then and then direct. But I'm
• 18:37
  Speaker 4: seeing like it just seems like everybody's doing everything these days.
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah, very true, because I you know, I have all
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: my guests on to prove it. But no, you know,
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: but but no, I know exactly what you mean, because
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: you know, now it's it's a lot easier to make
• 18:51
  Speaker 3: a film. You know, I have an upcoming guest, and
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: you know, he was saying he made his film in
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: the moments making films in the late eighties, early nineties,
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: and what happened was he said, you needed a whole
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: army to make a film. He goes nowadays, you know,
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: with digital, he goes some hees small gorilla crews and
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: they're pulling off stuff that he used to need, like,
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: you know, fifty one hundred people.
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: To do exactly, you know, And it's it's kind of
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: an interesting thing here, is that I feel like almost
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: like a pioneer to this digital phase because I was
• 19:19
  Speaker 4: I was shooting on video when it wasn't cool to
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: shoot on video. You know, it was a time where
• 19:28
  Speaker 4: everybody if you don't shoot on film, then you're you're
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: an amateur. You're not professional, and so it's I I'm
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: used to working like that with a very small crew.
• 19:40
  Speaker 4: The current film that we just did, Ditch Party, that's
• 19:43
  Speaker 4: probably the biggest, probably the biggest crew we had. But
• 19:49
  Speaker 4: I'm used to just my early stuff is I was
• 19:52
  Speaker 4: ever the everything, the camera guy, the you know, the
• 19:55
  Speaker 4: sound guy, the producer, director, editor. In some cases I
• 20:00
  Speaker 4: even lay down some some music. Uh So I'm kind
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: of I'm kind of used to that that mold. Yeah.
• 20:09
  Speaker 3: I you know, there's a there's a book I always
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: talk about. It's by Stut Makovitz called Rebels Rebels DV
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: Guide and it's sort of based off of Robert Riguez's
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: Rebel without a Crew. Uh and I think he know
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: he was again was one of the pioneers too, where
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: he just you know, got a crew well sorry, he
• 20:24
  Speaker 3: had no crew. He got a camera, a minimal cast
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: and went down to Mexico and made a film. You know.
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: And you know, that book has been you know, I
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: think every filmmaker nowadays has that book in their library. Yeah,
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: because it is just so influential, uh you know, and
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: it's just it's always about you know, having that can
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: do attitude and sort of pushing ahead, and uh, you
• 20:44
  Speaker 3: know that's why, you know, that's why I think a
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: lot of this came from we you know, now the
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: sort of paradigm has shifted and we don't need you know,
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: as many people as we needed to as we needed before. Uh,
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: you know, and certain things have changed. Certain things have
• 20:56
  Speaker 3: gotten less expensive, certain things maybe have gotten more expensive. Uh,
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: you know, it just I think, you know, it just
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: depends upon you know, your network and what kind of
• 21:05
  Speaker 3: movie you're making.
• 21:06
  Speaker 4: Exactly, and you know the film should come first too,
• 21:09
  Speaker 4: the thing that's changing now. And first of all, let's
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: go back. You're gonna mention Robert Rodriguez. You know, a
• 21:15
  Speaker 4: director that I think really started that was a Rick
• 21:17
  Speaker 4: wink Later and he was the influence of a lot
• 21:21
  Speaker 4: of those Rodriguez and Kevin Smith's and with this film
• 21:26
  Speaker 4: a slacker. But and then yet you're right that that
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: had the anyone can do this attitude and that was
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: a great time. I missed that boat, that nineties wave,
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: which is definitely not there anymore, of course, but nowadays
• 21:45
  Speaker 4: it seems like what I this is my perspective here
• 21:50
  Speaker 4: is that it seems like it's easier to make a movie.
• 21:53
  Speaker 4: But it's harder to get the thing released. And there's
• 21:57
  Speaker 4: so much content now, and there's the best of those
• 22:00
  Speaker 4: are getting so many submissions, so it's hard to get
• 22:03
  Speaker 4: into festivals, it's hard to get distribution for your films,
• 22:07
  Speaker 4: and so you're you have options now, of course, you
• 22:11
  Speaker 4: can kind of self distribute, and I think that's kind
• 22:14
  Speaker 4: of where we're going. It's really things have changed so
• 22:17
  Speaker 4: much and in such a little short amount of time too.
• 22:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I have had a couple of guests
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: come on who've well, actually more than a couple of
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: guests who've actually said that, you know, they they said,
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: you know, it used to be there was a certain
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: amount of script submissions, certain amount of movie submissions to
• 22:33
  Speaker 3: like Sundance because obviously, you know Rocky, everyone wants to
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: get into Sundance. You know, that's sort of like a dream,
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: and you know, and now he said, that's the new key.
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: He goes, it's almost like movies. It was actually it
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: was Pulpyddo who runs script Gods Must Die, and he
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: actually he actually said something to the effect of, you know,
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: it's it's almost like, you know, movies get you're easier
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: to make, but now getting people to see them as
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: a hard part and gaining distribution. And you know, he
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: was actually asking because I've had a couple of distribution
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: people on here. You know, what is the key? You know,
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: what does it take to get on the front page
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: of iTunes? What does it take to get on the
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: front page of Netflix? Uh? You know, and and is
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: it even worth it? You know what I mean? And
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: by the way, the answer to that is a very
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: long winded answer. But but you know, you know, for
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: everyone listening, Jason Brubaker runs an awesome site of filmmaking
• 23:23
  Speaker 3: stuff dot com and he can help you out. He
• 23:26
  Speaker 3: runs he's actually a head of distribution at the Stripper,
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: which actually is an aggregator and uh, they're they're big
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: into distribution stuff. Yeah, he was.
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: Sorry to interrupt you, but yeah, I don't know if
• 23:36
  Speaker 4: I talked with him as a matter of fact, and
• 23:39
  Speaker 4: we almost did. H we almost did something with him
• 23:44
  Speaker 4: and and still might. So I'm familiar with him. Yeah.
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: Oh cool. Yeah, Jason's a great guy, and you know
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: that that's that's part of the thing, you know, And honestly,
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: you know, you know, last on a couple of weeks ago,
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: on an episode of the podcast and one of the bumpers,
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: Rocky I and said, you know, if if I had
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: no connections, if I had you know what I mean,
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: if I had nothing and I was going to make
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: a movie, right, I would make a movie for you know,
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: try to give one location cinema, Try to you know,
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: make it obviously as cheap as possible. Can my asset list,
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: my actors list, my my location list, make the best
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: film I can with the story first, you know, obviously
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: the story has to be so compelling, so interesting, and
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: from there, I know it sounds crazy, Rocky, but I
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: would almost really, if it cost me it was nothing
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: to make this thing, or maybe even you know, maybe
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: five hundred bucks, I would put it on YouTube for
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: free to build an audience. As crazy as that sounds.
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: I know it might seem crazy to release a move
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: for free, but in a way, if I if that
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: was going to be like maybe a student film or
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: one of my first films or you know, I would
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: just me release it for free and just to see
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: if I get an audience and try to get attention
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: that way. Because Fede Alvarez, who directed the Evil Deed remake,
• 24:56
  Speaker 3: was able to do that because he put up Panic Attack,
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: which was a short film, and then he was able
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: to and he got so much attention through that that
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: they gave him the uh uh I think Universal gave
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: him the go ahead to direct Evil Dead right.
• 25:08
  Speaker 4: And and you're right, there's no wrong way to do it.
• 25:11
  Speaker 4: And uh and and that's the thing is unique and
• 25:15
  Speaker 4: and you said, the key thing there is is cheap.
• 25:17
  Speaker 4: You know, you we have the capability these days. There's
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: there's cameras, cheap cameras out there that you can use.
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: And like you said, story first, everything you're saying is
• 25:26
  Speaker 4: is is absolutely correct. And you make you make something
• 25:29
  Speaker 4: real cheap, you don't it spent a lot of money. Uh.
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: You know, you go back to the film Hallowed, my
• 25:34
  Speaker 4: second film there that was literally almost no budget. I
• 25:39
  Speaker 4: literally just home depot shop lights and stuff.
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 25:53
  Speaker 4: And some gels and it was basically me At some
• 25:56
  Speaker 4: points I was like even on rollerblades to get like
• 25:59
  Speaker 4: Dolly kind of shots and stuff. That that was my
• 26:04
  Speaker 4: That was the one experience I ever got where the
• 26:07
  Speaker 4: film was completely bought outright from a distributor, released on
• 26:11
  Speaker 4: DVD and Uh, so that movie costs nothing, you know,
• 26:18
  Speaker 4: and if you see the film, I mean, i'm i'm
• 26:20
  Speaker 4: I can say this, I'm I can criticize my own
• 26:23
  Speaker 4: work here, but it's not that great, you know. And
• 26:27
  Speaker 4: and it again it costs nothing, but here I get
• 26:30
  Speaker 4: a nice check. So the point is you never know,
• 26:33
  Speaker 4: you know, And so try anything if you can. If
• 26:36
  Speaker 4: you can make a film and put it out there
• 26:37
  Speaker 4: on YouTube and someone discovers it, and you might be
• 26:41
  Speaker 4: able to get a gig off that, you know.
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's you know, and uh, you know, you know,
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: it's like you said, we always keep learning. And that's why,
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: you know, even when I say the lease of film
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: for free. I have friends of mine who got noticed
• 26:54
  Speaker 3: in the early days of YouTube, Like I'm talking two
• 26:56
  Speaker 3: thousand and four. They got noticed on YouTube by Lifegate.
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: Lionsgate actually contacted them and said, hey, what's this zombie
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: movie you're doing? And they thought it was a joke
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: and they ignored it, and then they kept the emailed
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: them back through YouTube and said no, we want to
• 27:11
  Speaker 3: talk to you about buying your film. And you know
• 27:15
  Speaker 3: that's a whole nother story. But yeah, but you know,
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: it's amazing what can happen, you know, especially with social media.
• 27:20
  Speaker 3: You know, the more people I talk to, the more
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: people are adamant that. You know, if you're going to
• 27:24
  Speaker 3: be any if you're going to be in the entertainment business, now,
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: you have to have some kind of social media presence now,
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: you know what I mean. And you have to have
• 27:31
  Speaker 3: a website because if you don't, they kind of look
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: at you like, well, why don't you have a Why
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: don't you on Twitter? You know why if you're a filmmaker,
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: why don't you have YouTube? You know what I mean?
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: Right, It's it's true, and and there's guys like me
• 27:44
  Speaker 4: that that struggle with that. I'm not real big on
• 27:46
  Speaker 4: the social stuff, but you're right, you need to. You've
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: got to get on board.
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: Well, you know, I actually I want to talk to
• 27:53
  Speaker 3: more about, you know, your directing projects. You know, Rocky I.
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: There's a film to ask about. I'm actually interested in
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: knowing myself. But it's it's eleven eleven. Yeah, Uh yeah,
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: I actually, you know, I was actually interested in asking
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: about that project. Uh So for actually for me and
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: everyone listening, can you tell us a little bit about
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: eleven eleven?
• 28:11
  Speaker 4: It's the film that uh yeah, it's kind of a
• 28:16
  Speaker 4: sore subject. Not I'm glad you brought it up. It's
• 28:19
  Speaker 4: just great, but uh, it's the it's the one film
• 28:22
  Speaker 4: I did that uh that we never finished. Uh, and
• 28:26
  Speaker 4: it had so much hype behind it, and so anyway,
• 28:32
  Speaker 4: it was, well, what do you want to know about it?
• 28:36
  Speaker 3: Well, actually, I just want to know, like, you know
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: what what the whole synopsis of the project was all
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: that stuff?
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: Because the reason I asked was because I saw the
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: on IMDb. A lot of people were asking about it,
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: so I figured, you know, I might as well I
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: better ask about it too.
• 28:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Well again it goes back to this film started
• 28:50
  Speaker 4: in four and uh we that was the film that
• 28:55
  Speaker 4: fell apart and we started doing uh how lowed remember
• 28:59
  Speaker 4: right said we didn't hallowed out of frustration because that
• 29:02
  Speaker 4: that film fell apart. It was just a mess all
• 29:05
  Speaker 4: the way all the way through. But the main the
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: main thing was that it started with just like a
• 29:11
  Speaker 4: coming of age type of thing, uh, which we've gotten.
• 29:14
  Speaker 4: Some people said it reminded of like stand by Me
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: and that kind of thing, and I think maybe that
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: might have been what what what the interest was? Uh?
• 29:23
  Speaker 4: And we had some again had some issues. So that
• 29:26
  Speaker 4: script actually was changed, uh to to where we brought
• 29:30
  Speaker 4: the kids back years later, and so I wanted to
• 29:35
  Speaker 4: make something to where we could play off that angle
• 29:38
  Speaker 4: of their kids and then we can pick up the
• 29:42
  Speaker 4: script and pick up the story I mean of them later.
• 29:47
  Speaker 4: And uh, it's actually a long story. It's it gets
• 29:49
  Speaker 4: really complicated the storyline of that film.
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: Uh you know, I I'm I didn't mean to bring
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: up a sore spot, Rockey. I just the reason I
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: asked was because when if you were asked about on IMDb,
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: I thought, you know, it would be you know, I
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: better asked about it too.
• 30:04
  Speaker 4: But yeah, yeah, no, it had no problem at on there.
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: Oh cool? Uh so it is I know you said
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: it wasn't completed, but is there anywhere is it? Is
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: it released ever?
• 30:14
  Speaker 4: Or what we did was there is a documentary that
• 30:17
  Speaker 4: we that we released on it, which is the Rise
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: and Fall of eleven eleven Wells. The shelved is the
• 30:25
  Speaker 4: name of it because we had a we had a
• 30:27
  Speaker 4: camera crew on on set getting behind the scenes footage
• 30:31
  Speaker 4: and so that that ultimately turned out turned into the documentary.
• 30:37
  Speaker 4: So you can you can find that and that actually
• 30:39
  Speaker 4: will answer all your questions. I'm sure on the film.
• 30:42
  Speaker 4: It's a very lengthy documentary and it's kind of cool
• 30:46
  Speaker 4: because it really shows what it's like to be on
• 30:53
  Speaker 4: the set of a of a small independent film with
• 30:56
  Speaker 4: you know, with very little money, and it kind of
• 30:58
  Speaker 4: walks through. It's like a day by day kind of journal,
• 31:02
  Speaker 4: if you will, of the film.
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and I'll definitely link down in the show notes
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: for everyone listening, you know, I you know, I'm always fascinated,
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: you know, because obviously I've been on a ton of
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: film sets as well, and you know, I'm always you know,
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: I always like documentaries because I love Heart of Darkness,
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: which was for you know, the documentary shadowing of Pocops
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: now because I always find stuff like that fascinating.
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: Oh yeah, they're great. I love them too, you know.
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: And just you know, obviously, your next movie after Eleven
• 31:32
  Speaker 3: to eleven was Midnight Cabby. So, you know, for everyone listening,
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: you know, can you just give us a short synopsis
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: of the film.
• 31:39
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Well, I've I always wanted to do a comedy.
• 31:43
  Speaker 4: It's weird. This was like maybe our fifth or fifth
• 31:46
  Speaker 4: film in sixth film in and I realized I haven't
• 31:49
  Speaker 4: even attempted comedy and the kind of filmmaker that am is.
• 31:54
  Speaker 4: I love the challenge of doing something new, a different genre,
• 31:59
  Speaker 4: of doing something different. I've done the horror film thing,
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: I've done a couple of dramas at that point, and
• 32:09
  Speaker 4: so I have an attempted comedy. So the comedy that
• 32:11
  Speaker 4: I grew up on was again the early eighties stuff
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: like Airplane and where you know, political correctness was out
• 32:21
  Speaker 4: out the window, you know. So we wanted to make
• 32:26
  Speaker 4: something like that and just a fun, goofy popcorn movie,
• 32:30
  Speaker 4: and it was it was. It was actually a lot
• 32:32
  Speaker 4: of fun to make, and I'm I'm pretty proud of
• 32:35
  Speaker 4: that one.
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: And so I believe that's the one where the cab
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: driver has one night to raise off money to get
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: his brother out of out of us, sort of Harm's
• 32:46
  Speaker 3: way with I think his was being held captive in
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: a warehouse in my preser.
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's over a gambling debt and the main character, Doug,
• 32:54
  Speaker 4: has to to bail him out, and every place that
• 32:58
  Speaker 4: he tries to get get some cash you can't do it.
• 33:00
  Speaker 4: So pretty much, again, it's a zany comedy. So he
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: the only way to make the money is uh, he
• 33:07
  Speaker 4: gets put in this situation where he has to drive
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: a cab all night and he's constantly just picking up
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: one weirdo after another, uh, you know, to meet his
• 33:17
  Speaker 4: goals still again, Yeah, it's a race against the clock
• 33:20
  Speaker 4: kind of thing again, comedies that I used to watch
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: as a kid. It's it's pretty much what it's what
• 33:26
  Speaker 4: it is.
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, very cool. I actually, uh again, I was looking
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: around your IMDb and I saw that and I actually, uh,
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: that one actually caught my eye, uh because it actually
• 33:37
  Speaker 3: is you know, I saw a race against the clock comedy.
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: But a guy who I started a taxi all night
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: collecting fares to beil his brother who's being out hostage.
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: And that's one I wanted to ask about just because
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: I thought, you know, that was a pretty interesting log line.
• 33:49
  Speaker 4: Yeah it was. And it was fun too. It was
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: a fun film.
• 33:53
  Speaker 3: So, you know, I want to you know, now, you
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: have a new movie coming out called Ditch Party, and
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: I wanted to ask you know obviously, you know, since
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: so we were talking about your earlier works and we
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: were talked about you know, now you have Ditch Party
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: coming out. So basically, has has your writing and changed
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: as well as your as your directing style have has
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: it changed and evolved over time or do you sort
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: of have the same sort of method you used to
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: every project.
• 34:17
  Speaker 4: Okay, well, yeah, Ditch Party is different in almost every way.
• 34:22
  Speaker 4: And I'll start by saying that I did not write
• 34:24
  Speaker 4: Ditch Party. This was a nor was this my quote
• 34:30
  Speaker 4: unquote like my film. This was a film that, like
• 34:34
  Speaker 4: you can say that all the other films was was
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: my creation. I was behind the producing of it and
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: directing and in some cases writing. I did collaborate with
• 34:47
  Speaker 4: the writer on this on Bitch Party, like I do.
• 34:52
  Speaker 4: I love to work with writers. I love to collaborate.
• 34:56
  Speaker 4: But I was not the writer, nor was I the
• 34:59
  Speaker 4: producer on this one. So this was the first film
• 35:02
  Speaker 4: that I was actually approached by Noel j the producer
• 35:09
  Speaker 4: of the film, and his partner David Ramick, who had
• 35:13
  Speaker 4: Entangled Entertainment. It was. It was over a phone call.
• 35:16
  Speaker 4: I was not expected to do anything with them. I
• 35:20
  Speaker 4: was focused on another film that I was still trying
• 35:23
  Speaker 4: to get off the ground, and this was almost like
• 35:26
  Speaker 4: thrown in my lap. So it was a first experience
• 35:29
  Speaker 4: to actually direct something that wasn't completely mine.
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: And now back to the show.
• 35:45
  Speaker 3: So I know you the writer was Richard Mees, you know,
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: and I can see you've worked with him before. So
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: do you have like this working relationship where you know,
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: he sort of you know, you guys sort of collaborate
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: a lot of projects.
• 35:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's starting to turn that way. He we met.
• 36:01
  Speaker 4: He's actually an actor. He's one of the lead actors
• 36:04
  Speaker 4: in my first film, going back to Return to Innocence,
• 36:07
  Speaker 4: and he's just kind of been been hanging around and uh,
• 36:11
  Speaker 4: you know, we brought up the fact that he writes,
• 36:14
  Speaker 4: and so Night Cabby was Yeah, was probably the first
• 36:19
  Speaker 4: collaboration and then a Bitch Party, So yeah, it you know,
• 36:24
  Speaker 4: it's kind of become a thing.
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: And you know that's that goes back to something else
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: that you know we were talking about, is you know
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: some some directors have a certain cast and crew they
• 36:34
  Speaker 3: always work with because the reason is, you know what
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: you're going to get, you know what I mean. That's
• 36:38
  Speaker 3: why I always wonder why Tim Burton always worked with
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: Johnny dept And and I always work with the same people,
• 36:43
  Speaker 3: and John Carpenter as well. Now I get it, you
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: know years later it they've done projects. Now I get
• 36:47
  Speaker 3: why that they those same people always work together for
• 36:50
  Speaker 3: one project to another.
• 36:51
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, Yeah, absolutely.
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: And you know so that way, you know, you know,
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: you know each ose weaknesses and strengths, you know each
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: other's you know everything, and it just and you know
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: this too rocky. You know, making a movie is like
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: seriously being in a relationship, you know, and you're going
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: to be asking yourself. It's like Jenna Edwards and I
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: had her on she said, there's there's two ways that
• 37:13
  Speaker 3: she ever, two criteria she uses to evaluate people for
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: coming on to a project. Can you do your job?
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: And could I live with you for a month? In
• 37:21
  Speaker 3: of course yep.
• 37:23
  Speaker 4: That's that's that sums it up right there, because it's
• 37:26
  Speaker 4: not it's not just the them as the actors. Can
• 37:29
  Speaker 4: you can you tolerate that person?
• 37:31
  Speaker 3: You know?
• 37:31
  Speaker 4: So very true?
• 37:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, and uh, for everyone listening, could you
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: just give us a short log line about Ditch Party? Uh?
• 37:40
  Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, So you know, the plot isn't anything when
• 37:45
  Speaker 4: you look at the when you look at the marketing stuff,
• 37:48
  Speaker 4: the trailer and everything to play, it's it's really not
• 37:50
  Speaker 4: anything that we haven't seen before. You know, kid shows
• 37:54
  Speaker 4: up to school with the gun, and starts, uh, you know,
• 37:58
  Speaker 4: firing away. What I wanted to do again with your
• 38:03
  Speaker 4: initial phone call is we were going to basically do
• 38:07
  Speaker 4: one room set up, kind of what you were talking
• 38:10
  Speaker 4: about before. But what's the reason. You know, you have
• 38:15
  Speaker 4: films like The Breakfast Club where these kids are in
• 38:18
  Speaker 4: the same room. The reason they're there is because they
• 38:21
  Speaker 4: have Saturday detention. So what's the reason? And there's been
• 38:28
  Speaker 4: a lot of documentaries on this subject. There's I mean, heck,
• 38:32
  Speaker 4: it's on TV every other night, you know, another another
• 38:35
  Speaker 4: the saying this problem is still happening, and I wanted something.
• 38:40
  Speaker 4: I haven't seen this. I'm not saying it doesn't exist,
• 38:43
  Speaker 4: but I personally haven't seen a film where the perspective
• 38:46
  Speaker 4: is the kids in the room. So it's the focus
• 38:50
  Speaker 4: is not on the shooter or glorifying what the shooter's doing.
• 38:55
  Speaker 4: It's about the kids that are trapped in a room
• 38:58
  Speaker 4: and what they go through, the drama that they go through,
• 39:02
  Speaker 4: and you can't And I wanted the rule was I
• 39:06
  Speaker 4: want the camera in the room with them. The camera's
• 39:08
  Speaker 4: going to be basically another character. And we started realizing
• 39:14
  Speaker 4: that if you're going to do a feature film and
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: it's set in one room the entire time. That's a
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: challenge and it's tough to keep, especially today's audience compelled,
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: you know, to watch sit through an hour and a
• 39:28
  Speaker 4: half of them in one room. So we started kind
• 39:30
  Speaker 4: of bending the rules and said, okay, if one of
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: the characters leaves the room and we have the green light,
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: that the camera can leave the room. So but anyway,
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: in a nutshell, that it's really the focus. It's the
• 39:45
  Speaker 4: perspective of this film is that it's in the room
• 39:47
  Speaker 4: with the victims.
• 39:51
  Speaker 3: You know, in a way have you seen Green Room?
• 39:54
  Speaker 3: By the way, green Room is kind of like that,
• 39:57
  Speaker 3: you know, Greenom takes place in one location and uh
• 40:01
  Speaker 3: literally you know, and it's it's in the green room obviously.
• 40:04
  Speaker 3: So it's it's about a punk band. They go to
• 40:06
  Speaker 3: this sort of nazi punk bar and as they're leaving,
• 40:10
  Speaker 3: they witness a murder and they they they're hiding out
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: in the green room and they're trying to get out
• 40:15
  Speaker 3: of there and now all this you know, and and
• 40:18
  Speaker 3: it's it's you know, it's it's fascinating. But this is
• 40:20
  Speaker 3: what you know, and we were talking about earlier, is
• 40:22
  Speaker 3: you know, how do you create compelling one location cinema.
• 40:25
  Speaker 3: I think, you know, Green Room does a great job
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: of that. And it's this what you were talking about
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: with with with Ditch Party, you know, I like that
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: idea too, where if the character leaves a room, obviously
• 40:36
  Speaker 3: you know, the camera can find I'm sorry, yeah, I
• 40:38
  Speaker 3: character leaves the room of camera can follow them, you know.
• 40:41
  Speaker 3: And but but this is what I think, Rocky is.
• 40:43
  Speaker 3: I sort of think this is the new sort of
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: hallmark or definition of this era, is you know, making
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: films in one location. And honestly, I think it's it's
• 40:54
  Speaker 3: it's good because it makes you a better storyteller because
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: you have to sort of, you know, push yourself to
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: tell a better story. And I think it was maybe
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: Kevin Smith who said, you know, if the audience, you know,
• 41:06
  Speaker 3: when he was writing Red State, if he knew what
• 41:09
  Speaker 3: was going to happen next, he would completely get rid
• 41:11
  Speaker 3: of it because you figured that's what the audience would
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: we assume as well.
• 41:15
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, yeah, and you're right, and it and it doesn't
• 41:18
  Speaker 4: allow a lot of freedom for your effects or camera
• 41:22
  Speaker 4: team to get all crazy. You know, you're they're stuck
• 41:25
  Speaker 4: in one room, so they can't they can't go wild.
• 41:29
  Speaker 4: And I'm because I'm with you. I'm a story is uh,
• 41:32
  Speaker 4: And it's been said from generation to generation it's story, story, story,
• 41:38
  Speaker 4: And you know, all the young filmmakers out there, that's
• 41:41
  Speaker 4: that's the thing that I feel like, that's not the focus.
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: Everyone keeps saying the greats from the seventies, those great filmmakers,
• 41:49
  Speaker 4: they keep saying story, story, story, And yet with the
• 41:51
  Speaker 4: new technology, everyone's all into these tricky shots and drones
• 41:55
  Speaker 4: and and and everything. So it's, you know, again, if
• 42:00
  Speaker 4: you want, if you want a good movie, it starts
• 42:03
  Speaker 4: with the story.
• 42:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I actually had a friend of mine who shot
• 42:07
  Speaker 3: a film and when I asked them what it was about,
• 42:10
  Speaker 3: his first his first words were, oh, man, we had
• 42:13
  Speaker 3: a four k drone flying over this thing. I go, yeah,
• 42:16
  Speaker 3: I'm sure that looks freaking amazing. Man. But I said,
• 42:19
  Speaker 3: what's it about? And he's like, oh, you know, uh,
• 42:22
  Speaker 3: you know, and we had all this other stuff. I'm like,
• 42:24
  Speaker 3: oh my god. So, yeah, this story has to be key,
• 42:27
  Speaker 3: because you know, audiences are savvy. Honestly, they will notice
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: if there's no substance there, you know what I mean.
• 42:33
  Speaker 3: So that's why when you and I were talking about
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: stories first they're they're always going to be you know,
• 42:38
  Speaker 3: hooking on that story. And I wanted to ask real
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: quick about Ditch Party. Did you know, I you know,
• 42:44
  Speaker 3: five students trapped themselves in the basement of their high
• 42:46
  Speaker 3: school doing all at assault on students and faculty. I
• 42:49
  Speaker 3: wanted to ask, you know, did you actually film in
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: a real high school?
• 42:53
  Speaker 4: We did, Yeah, and that was Uh, that was really
• 42:56
  Speaker 4: fun and also again a different challenge.
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: Uh.
• 43:00
  Speaker 4: We filmed some of it at high school and then
• 43:04
  Speaker 4: we were on set for the actual room. Now, we
• 43:08
  Speaker 4: were planning on shooting this thing in the in the
• 43:11
  Speaker 4: summer before kids got back into the school, but it
• 43:16
  Speaker 4: didn't work that way. That we were waiting on funding
• 43:18
  Speaker 4: to you know happen and everything, so we actually shot
• 43:22
  Speaker 4: during school when school was in session. Now we were
• 43:24
  Speaker 4: on the weekends. But the challenge wasn't so much the filming.
• 43:28
  Speaker 4: The challenge was getting everything because we kind of destroyed
• 43:32
  Speaker 4: that that school and in the sense of like you know,
• 43:34
  Speaker 4: we had we brought in all these props and we
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: set dressed everything, and we had kids that were you
• 43:44
  Speaker 4: know dead on the floor. We had fake blood and stuff,
• 43:47
  Speaker 4: and so we would rip out light fixtures in the
• 43:49
  Speaker 4: classrooms and stuff, and if they're listening right now, they're
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: you know, I'm sorry. But we did all these things
• 43:57
  Speaker 4: and then we had to put everything back at the
• 44:00
  Speaker 4: end of the night and make it in clean up
• 44:02
  Speaker 4: and everything. So it was a It sounded like a
• 44:06
  Speaker 4: good thing and it really was, but at the same time,
• 44:09
  Speaker 4: it was a lot of work.
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, that's amazing at the shoot in real
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: high school, because I couldn't even imagine the obstacles that
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: you would have to go through.
• 44:18
  Speaker 4: I will obviously I was sorry interrupted, I was shocked myself,
• 44:21
  Speaker 4: and that the credit goes to Noel g because he
• 44:25
  Speaker 4: made that happen. I remember we were in the school district.
• 44:32
  Speaker 4: We didn't even go to the school, We had to
• 44:33
  Speaker 4: go to the district and I was with him in
• 44:36
  Speaker 4: that room and I was thinking, how are we going
• 44:40
  Speaker 4: to you know, how are we going to sell this thing?
• 44:42
  Speaker 4: And Nowell went right into it. It was it was hilarious.
• 44:46
  Speaker 4: He said, this is what we're going to do. And
• 44:47
  Speaker 4: there's this kid. He's going to be walking down the
• 44:50
  Speaker 4: hall and he's shooting kids, and we're going to have
• 44:53
  Speaker 4: these squibs with blood splattering. And I'm looking at this
• 44:57
  Speaker 4: guy across the way, and I'm like, well, we might
• 44:59
  Speaker 4: as well just leave, man, because there's no way we're
• 45:02
  Speaker 4: getting this. And the guy just said, yeah, go ahead.
• 45:06
  Speaker 4: So I was I was shocked.
• 45:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that that's that's you know, uh, you know amazing
• 45:13
  Speaker 3: you could get that because see that. You know, that's
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: the other thing too, when I was on my location
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: list earlier. You know, some people have access to to
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: amazing locations or able you know, or like uh, Noel
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: g you know, like you were you know, Uh, he's
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: just good at selling the idea, you know, selling himself,
• 45:30
  Speaker 3: selling the script, selling the project. Uh, you know, and
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: some people just you know, some people, some producers have
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: that gift of charisma and likability and they're just like, oh,
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: everyone's like, oh you know what, you know, well we're
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: gonna work.
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: And now back to the show for this guy.
• 45:53
  Speaker 3: Because I like him, Yeah, and it was bad.
• 45:55
  Speaker 4: You go back to, Uh, I've been pretty lucky on
• 45:57
  Speaker 4: that side to myself. I mean my first you go
• 46:00
  Speaker 4: back to Return to Innocence. Uh. We filmed in a
• 46:04
  Speaker 4: real courthouse because the second half of the movie is
• 46:07
  Speaker 4: is the court trial and that's really the film. And
• 46:11
  Speaker 4: uh we were in a real courtroom in Orange County
• 46:16
  Speaker 4: here where I'm from, and uh we I think we
• 46:20
  Speaker 4: lied on that one and then think we said we
• 46:22
  Speaker 4: were film students or whatever. And that's the other thing.
• 46:24
  Speaker 4: You got to do whatever you can to get your location.
• 46:27
  Speaker 4: But uh, we've been in hospitals, real hospitals, not sets.
• 46:33
  Speaker 4: We've been pretty fortunate when it comes to locations. And
• 46:37
  Speaker 4: I don't know if it's fortunate or lucky, but we've
• 46:40
  Speaker 4: had we've had some luck there.
• 46:45
  Speaker 3: I'm going to say, you're probably fortunate. You know, if
• 46:48
  Speaker 3: you if it happens one time, you know, you're you're
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: you're lucky. If it happens like twice, it's because you
• 46:52
  Speaker 3: have a good team, you know what I mean. It's uh,
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: that's what That's what I've noticed. And you know, just
• 46:58
  Speaker 3: as you know, producing my own stuff, I've noticed that
• 47:00
  Speaker 3: you have to go in there and sell yourself. I
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: actually got an amazing sound stage one time just because
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: I was at the right time, at the right place
• 47:08
  Speaker 3: at the bar and I got to meet the right
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: people and I was like, oh, here we go, so
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: you know, and everything sort of worked out well and
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: you know, it's it's amazing how those things sort of
• 47:19
  Speaker 3: come together.
• 47:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it really is. Man. There's no nothing to high design, man,
• 47:24
  Speaker 4: things You just you just got to have the love,
• 47:26
  Speaker 4: you got to have the passion, got to just want
• 47:29
  Speaker 4: to make movies. And then sometimes there's a lot of
• 47:32
  Speaker 4: there's a lot of roadblocks, man, you know, but every
• 47:36
  Speaker 4: once in a while there's something kind of cool that
• 47:38
  Speaker 4: comes along.
• 47:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah, very true, very true, Rocky. You know, Rocky, you know,
• 47:46
  Speaker 3: we were talking for about forty five minutes. Now, I
• 47:49
  Speaker 3: don't want to eat up. I know you have to run.
• 47:52
  Speaker 3: But you know, in closing, is there anything we didn't
• 47:55
  Speaker 3: talk about that maybe you wanted to discuss, or anything
• 47:57
  Speaker 3: you wanted to say just to point a period at
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: the end of this whole conversation.
• 48:01
  Speaker 4: Absolutely, again. You know, the current film is Ditch Party,
• 48:04
  Speaker 4: and we do have a screening coming up in New
• 48:06
  Speaker 4: York on October twelveth, So I don't know if you've
• 48:11
  Speaker 4: got listeners out there in the New York area, but
• 48:14
  Speaker 4: I'd love to have you guys come out and hang
• 48:16
  Speaker 4: out with us. It's gonna be a fun night. It's
• 48:18
  Speaker 4: at the Anthology Film Archives.
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: Is there a Facebook event pageport.
• 48:26
  Speaker 4: I believe it's we don't have one, but you can
• 48:30
  Speaker 4: find us on Ditch Party and you know Twitter, it's
• 48:34
  Speaker 4: at Ditch Party movie and I think we're on Instagram
• 48:38
  Speaker 4: and everything, so all the information will be leaked out
• 48:40
  Speaker 4: on there.
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: Cool and everyone listening. I will link to all that
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: stuff in the show notes so you can follow Ditch
• 48:48
  Speaker 3: Party and the again, you know, and I'll make sure
• 48:51
  Speaker 3: to put some information about the premiere. Rocky, Rocky Costanzo,
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: I want to say thank you so much for coming
• 48:58
  Speaker 3: on the podcast.
• 49:00
  Speaker 4: Thank you so much, man. It was a lot of fun, uh.
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: My pleasure and Rocky. Where you'll find you on online
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: your you know, your personal uh you know your personal
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: website or Twitter.
• 49:09
  Speaker 4: My production company is Hourglass Pictures, which is a film's
• 49:12
  Speaker 4: at our Glass. I don't know if it's dot com
• 49:15
  Speaker 4: or dot net. I think it's dot net actually, or
• 49:18
  Speaker 4: you can find me on Twitter at Rocky Costanzo and
• 49:22
  Speaker 4: Facebook and all that kind of stuff.
• 49:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Rocky, we just became Facebook friends.
• 49:27
  Speaker 4: We did, man, And I'm actually kind of jealous of you, man,
• 49:31
  Speaker 4: because you're from Philly, which means that you are within
• 49:34
  Speaker 4: striking distance of Pats and Genos.
• 49:38
  Speaker 3: You know, well, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna come clean.
• 49:42
  Speaker 3: Most Philadelphians don't eat a patch of.
• 49:45
  Speaker 4: I had that feeling. I was going to bring it
• 49:47
  Speaker 4: up earlier, and I had that feeling. It's kind of
• 49:49
  Speaker 4: like us out here in California with the in and
• 49:52
  Speaker 4: out Burger. We have our you know, that's like the
• 49:56
  Speaker 4: big Everyone has to come out here. And I've had
• 49:58
  Speaker 4: actors that have going in from like New York or whatever,
• 50:02
  Speaker 4: and they when they just have to eat there. So
• 50:05
  Speaker 4: what what is the best spot? Then?
• 50:08
  Speaker 3: I know, well, there's actually a couple, and it depends
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: what part of phil you come from. Uh there's Ishka Bibbles. Uh,
• 50:15
  Speaker 3: there's my personal favorite, John's ros Pork.
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: Uh.
• 50:19
  Speaker 3: There's also gyms on South Street, and then like the
• 50:22
  Speaker 3: other ones are kind of sort of up in the air.
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: It depends, uh, you know, but but those are the
• 50:27
  Speaker 3: main three that all Philadelphians sort of eat at. So
• 50:30
  Speaker 3: any any one of those, you know, will will be good.
• 50:33
  Speaker 3: And they're all different styles. By the way of cheese steak,
• 50:35
  Speaker 3: those three.
• 50:36
  Speaker 4: Very cool, man, very cool. So I told you learned
• 50:39
  Speaker 4: something every day every day.
• 50:42
  Speaker 3: I'm now going to start a new podcast about cheese
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: steaks in Philadelphia because I can educate everybody about the
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: what what what Philadelphians actually eat. But no, but you know,
• 50:51
  Speaker 3: I honestly I completely understand in and out thing. I
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: actually was asking a friend of mine who moved to
• 50:55
  Speaker 3: LA about that and he was like, he goes, Dave,
• 50:57
  Speaker 3: I I ate there like twice, I eat at places. Now.
• 51:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, absolutely, there's you know, there's there's a lot better
• 51:05
  Speaker 4: out there for you. But but yeah, I get it,
• 51:08
  Speaker 4: you know, I get the appeal.
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: But everyone, it's Dave Bullis dot com. Twitter, It's at
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: dave Underscore Bullets check out ditch Party and I will
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: link to that in the show notes. Rocky again, thank
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: you so much for coming on.
• 51:22
  Speaker 4: Thank you David. It was fun.
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: a great job on this episode. If you want to
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: head over to the show notes at Indie film Muscle
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: dot com Forward slash eight sixteen. If you have it already,
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: please head over to Filmmaking podcast dot com, subscribe and
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: leave a good review.
• 51:41
  Speaker 3: For the show.
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: It really helps us out a lot.
• 51:44
  Speaker 3: Guys.
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: Thank you again so much for listening to guys as always,
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: keep that hustle going, keep that dream alive, Stay safe
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: out there, and I'll talk to you soon.
• 51:52
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Indie Film Hustle podcast at
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: Indie Film hustle dot com. That's I N D I
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: E F I L M h U S T l
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: E dot com