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One on One: Paul Anka · I Am All In with Scott Patterson

0:00
Speaker 1: I Am all In.
0:08
Speaker 2: I Am all In with Scott Patterson, an iHeartRadio podcast.
0:21
Speaker 1: Hey everybody, Scott Patterson, I Am all In Podcast one.
0:23
Speaker 1: I want to interview one of eleven Production's iHeart Radio,
0:26
Speaker 1: iHeart Media, iHeart Podcast. We have the extreme privilege of
0:31
Speaker 1: talking to one of the biggest legends in the history
0:36
Speaker 1: of the entertainment business, Paul. Mister Paul Anka, And let
0:43
Speaker 1: me tell you something a little bit about this guy
0:46
Speaker 1: and what he has accomplished so far in his life.
0:51
Speaker 1: He is a legendary singer and songwriter who's best known
0:54
Speaker 1: for his signature hit songs Diana, Lonely Boy, put Your
0:58
Speaker 1: Head on My Shoulder. As songwriter, Paul wrote the theme
1:02
Speaker 1: song for The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson, Tom Jones
1:05
Speaker 1: has hit She's a Lady, Frank Sinatra's signature song My Way,
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Speaker 1: and If That isn't enough. With over nine hundred songs
1:14
Speaker 1: to his credit, Paul's songs have also been recorded by
1:17
Speaker 1: Ready for This, Elvis, Presley, Barbers, Streis and Linda Ronstant
1:21
Speaker 1: The Sex Pistols, Nina Simone, Gypsy Kings, and Robbie Williams,
1:25
Speaker 1: to name a few. I am a big fan of
1:29
Speaker 1: all of those people, especially Robbie Williams. Now, Paul has
1:33
Speaker 1: ventured into podcasting with his best friend Skip Bronson in
1:36
Speaker 1: their show Our Way with Paul Ankin Skip Bronson. The
1:40
Speaker 1: series will give listeners a backstage pass to the lives
1:43
Speaker 1: of icons across film, music, television, sports, and technology in
1:47
Speaker 1: a whole new way. Listeners will hear from guests across industry,
1:51
Speaker 1: including Jason Bateman, Mark Burnett, Michael Buble, Bill Burr, Billy Bush,
1:56
Speaker 1: Gail King, and even the President of France Emmanuel So, Paul,
2:01
Speaker 1: let's first start off. We're going to talk a little
2:04
Speaker 1: bit about Gilmore Girls, and we're going to get into
2:05
Speaker 1: your career as a songwriter, and then we're going to
2:08
Speaker 1: talk about your podcast. Let's start off with the Gilmore stuff.
2:10
Speaker 1: When did you first hear about Lorelized dog being named
2:14
Speaker 1: after you?
2:15
Speaker 3: Well, I think it was right from the inception, you know,
2:19
Speaker 3: heartbeat Later, I want to get out there, obviously, and
2:24
Speaker 3: you know, I became a huge fan of the show.
2:26
Speaker 3: Obviously it was a great show, well written, et cetera,
2:28
Speaker 3: et cetera. But from the exception, you know, probably what
2:32
Speaker 3: after the first couple of weeks, everybody came around and
2:36
Speaker 3: I heard about it, and I thought it was cool
2:40
Speaker 3: because it's so international. I've been an international creature, but
2:44
Speaker 3: I was ultimately hearing from everybody all over the world.
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Speaker 1: And so you were aware of the show before you
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Speaker 1: you found out about it.
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Speaker 3: Friends were watching it. I think my kids were watching it. Right,
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Speaker 3: the show, I mean, we're not talking about to something obscure.
3:01
Speaker 3: This show was like everybody loved it. So I was
3:04
Speaker 3: very much aware of the show. Yeah.
3:06
Speaker 1: Right, And then you made a cameo in the cold
3:09
Speaker 1: open of season six, episode eighteen. Tell us how that
3:12
Speaker 1: came about? That Black and White?
3:14
Speaker 3: Well, I have to call and I said, yeah, let's
3:18
Speaker 3: do it. I think we did a couple. When I
3:20
Speaker 3: first got the call, I was very happy to do it,
3:23
Speaker 3: you know, I thought, yeah, natural for me. And they
3:27
Speaker 3: were great to work with. They were just a fun
3:29
Speaker 3: group of people and very bright, knew what they were doing,
3:32
Speaker 3: and that was very comforting to me.
3:33
Speaker 1: Right, do do fans approach you about your appearances on
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Speaker 1: Calor Girls?
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Speaker 3: I'm still do fans. I got friends, I got people
3:46
Speaker 3: who did at parties. It always comes up, and you know,
3:49
Speaker 3: I hate the phrase. It is what it is, but
3:52
Speaker 3: it is what it is, and it was great to
3:54
Speaker 3: be a part of it. You know. It was something
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Speaker 3: that I wore like a badge.
3:59
Speaker 1: I loved it. Right, Let's talk a little bit about
4:02
Speaker 1: your music career, because this is this is a you know,
4:06
Speaker 1: reading your bio and reading about you and listening to
4:09
Speaker 1: all the old songs, it just it's just absolutely fascinating.
4:11
Speaker 1: I'm a songwriter myself, so I'm really eager to hear
4:18
Speaker 1: about your background. I mean, you you sold songs, you write,
4:23
Speaker 1: you were writing songs. You were musical prodigy growing up. Yeah,
4:27
Speaker 1: and you sold songs. You went to New York and
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Speaker 1: sold a song when you were what fifteen, sixteen years old.
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Speaker 3: I was born in Ottawa, Canada, and my dad wanted
4:38
Speaker 3: me to, you know, be a lawyer like my uncle,
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Speaker 3: or a journalist because I had won awards for my
4:44
Speaker 3: short stories in school, so I had kind of a
4:47
Speaker 3: writing way about me. I was typing seventy words a minute,
4:50
Speaker 3: as in a class with forty girls, me and my friend,
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Speaker 3: and I always got drawn to music. You know, back
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Speaker 3: then it was pretty much the R and B rhythm
5:01
Speaker 3: and blues and some country and that pops the vibe.
5:04
Speaker 3: It just kind of integrated itself, but it was primarily
5:08
Speaker 3: you know, it was the black movement in music, like
5:10
Speaker 3: it's been for many decades. Kind of was inspiring. And
5:15
Speaker 3: I fell out a shorthand class. I hated it, and
5:18
Speaker 3: the teacher wasn't too thrilled with me. And you know,
5:21
Speaker 3: when you're a teenager, you think you know everything. But
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Speaker 3: I just said, okay, put me a music out. So
5:27
Speaker 3: I started taking drums and start taking trumpet, and then
5:31
Speaker 3: I wound up with Missus Reese, who was a piano teacher,
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Speaker 3: and she started in. I mean, my dad got me
5:40
Speaker 3: a little old piano that they stuck in a basement.
5:43
Speaker 3: You know, I was writing in this basement. It was
5:46
Speaker 3: not a decked out basement. You know. We was at
5:48
Speaker 3: modest background. So I started in Ottawa and I just
5:53
Speaker 3: started messing around on the piano, you know, and it
5:55
Speaker 3: wasn't until I got kind of inspired with this crush
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Speaker 3: that I had on this girl that was a three
6:02
Speaker 3: years older than me, which you know, back then that
6:04
Speaker 3: was a big deal along with everything else. I'll tall
6:07
Speaker 3: you were at this, you were I'll want you. So
6:10
Speaker 3: I just sat down and you know, I wrote, like
6:13
Speaker 3: a kid, I'm so young you're so old. I don't
6:15
Speaker 3: think I could get away with that today, but you know,
6:18
Speaker 3: I wrote it and it started with that, and ultimately,
6:22
Speaker 3: like any process, I said, okay, now what's the next step?
6:26
Speaker 3: And I started reading at all these record labels. I
6:29
Speaker 3: had that if you'd got to Nashville, LA, or New York,
6:33
Speaker 3: maybe Chicago, somebody would hear you. So, you know, with
6:37
Speaker 3: a couple of you know, songs in my pocket some
6:41
Speaker 3: money i'd saved up on an Eastern vacation. When I
6:43
Speaker 3: got to New York, walked into an office some friends
6:46
Speaker 3: of mine set up an appointment for me and Don Costa.
6:51
Speaker 3: I mean, I attributed, you know, a lot of my
6:54
Speaker 3: success to a team effort. You know, you never want
6:56
Speaker 3: to be the smartest guy, and Don Costa was the guy.
6:59
Speaker 3: He's the one that saw this kid banging away at
7:02
Speaker 3: the piano. And from May when I recorded to August,
7:06
Speaker 3: when I wound up with American band standing at Sullivan,
7:10
Speaker 3: that's when it all took off.
7:13
Speaker 1: How old were you on ed Sullivan.
7:15
Speaker 3: Fifteen or sixteen?
7:17
Speaker 1: Unbelievable and you were singing, and you were writing the
7:23
Speaker 1: songs you were singing and they were big number one hits.
7:27
Speaker 1: Or charting and way up in the charts and you
7:30
Speaker 1: were a teen idol and super famous at fifteen six.
7:34
Speaker 3: Well, ye, kind of freaky, you know. It wasn't really
7:39
Speaker 3: the day and age of young idols or whatever the
7:42
Speaker 3: hell I wanted to call it, right, That all kind
7:44
Speaker 3: of morphed itself with the Philadelphia guys. But it's all timing,
7:49
Speaker 3: you know. I just had the passion and the drive
7:53
Speaker 3: and nothing else, and then you hone your talent, whatever
7:57
Speaker 3: that is. But there was no tell vision in the
8:01
Speaker 3: sense of the programs you see today, right, No, you know,
8:05
Speaker 3: none of these talent contests. And it just happened so
8:10
Speaker 3: quickly because the mere content of what we did and
8:15
Speaker 3: the structure that was around us. You were a hit
8:18
Speaker 3: in one week with radio, You did all of an
8:21
Speaker 3: American bandstand. You went on radio, and within a week
8:24
Speaker 3: the whole country knew who you were. So there I was.
8:27
Speaker 3: I was in the middle of that with people that
8:29
Speaker 3: were twice my age until the others started floating in.
8:33
Speaker 3: And then I started working with Beverly Brothers, Frankie Lineman
8:37
Speaker 3: and Frankie Avalon, all these young artists who had with
8:41
Speaker 3: a young movement. We were traveling together on these buses,
8:45
Speaker 3: each doing two songs through you know, all kinds of
8:48
Speaker 3: weather breakdown with buses that weren't luxurious, and we're all
8:52
Speaker 3: thrown together like little pioneers. And that's where all happened,
8:56
Speaker 3: you know, And you looked up to the rack pack
8:58
Speaker 3: of Las Vegas. That's all. The was the Beatles, which
9:02
Speaker 3: is another story which I think I had a hand
9:04
Speaker 3: in getting them, Warrior because I met them in Europe.
9:07
Speaker 3: But that was the industry until the Beatles, until Hendrix
9:10
Speaker 3: changed it in terms of picking up a guitar. And
9:13
Speaker 3: I just continued honing my craft, knowing I was still
9:17
Speaker 3: a kid, but writing about only what I knew popular
9:20
Speaker 3: love was older money boy, all that kind of stuff,
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Speaker 3: right and loving it, just saying, wow, I'm making two
9:28
Speaker 3: hundred bucks a week. You know, I had a paper out,
9:32
Speaker 3: I was a caddie. I worked at restaurant. I was
9:34
Speaker 3: earning three bucks, spooky, And you know that's when I
9:39
Speaker 3: learned to be focused, you know, because you learned at
9:42
Speaker 3: some point in there that you may not last. You
9:45
Speaker 3: know a lot of the guys I didn't. So until
9:48
Speaker 3: you make each of those evolutions, you keep doing what
9:50
Speaker 3: you're doing, getting better, but it's tonight sholl theme longest day.
9:55
Speaker 3: You know. My big reach out was for Buddy Hawley,
9:58
Speaker 3: who was my friend when it doesn't matter anymore for him.
10:02
Speaker 3: It was the last song unfortunately recorded, because he died
10:06
Speaker 3: on that plane crash on the tour.
10:09
Speaker 1: Tell Us you mentioned two things, how it happened so
10:14
Speaker 1: quickly for you at fifteen, and then your relationship with
10:18
Speaker 1: the Beatles and bringing them over to the United States.
10:22
Speaker 1: Tell Us you get to New York, you have a song,
10:27
Speaker 1: Who hears it? What happens after they hear it? How
10:31
Speaker 1: did they hear it? Who signed you? How did you
10:34
Speaker 1: get on Ed Sullivan? Did an agent come in? Did
10:37
Speaker 1: a record company sign you right away? And then it
10:39
Speaker 1: was just off to the moon for you.
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Speaker 3: Well, as I mentioned, you know, I had saved up
10:45
Speaker 3: some money. It was Easter vacation. I went down in
10:48
Speaker 3: New York. I'd been there prior because I want to
10:52
Speaker 3: contest collecting souper wrappers for Campbell's soup. So I got
10:56
Speaker 3: a feel for New York. Don Costa, as I mentioned,
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Speaker 3: was with this new company, ABC Paramount. I had this appointment.
11:05
Speaker 3: I went up jeans T shirt, you know, walked in
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Speaker 3: scared to death, sat down and played I think, Diana,
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Speaker 3: don't gamble with love and tell me that you love
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Speaker 3: me in.
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Speaker 1: His office, right right there, right there, in his office
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Speaker 1: in New York.
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Speaker 3: Okay, in New York, all twenty minutes and you said, okay,
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Speaker 3: wor's your parents that they're not here? I said, no,
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Speaker 3: I just flew down this little hotel. Blah blah blah.
11:41
Speaker 3: Well I want to sign you, but you're too young.
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Speaker 3: Parents here is signed it. I said, well, call them,
11:48
Speaker 3: so we get on the phone. They call. My parents
11:51
Speaker 3: were stunned, you know. They were saying, let them get
11:54
Speaker 3: them out of his system. Go down, yeah, blah blah blah,
11:56
Speaker 3: right right right, and they fly in. Next day there
12:01
Speaker 3: was Sam Clark, who was the president of the company.
12:06
Speaker 1: And which which company are we talking about? We're talking
12:08
Speaker 1: about a record company.
12:09
Speaker 3: ABC Paramount, which was a new division of the ABC
12:13
Speaker 3: television network.
12:15
Speaker 1: It was starting outble.
12:17
Speaker 3: So now ABC starts a label, ABC Paramount. My parents
12:21
Speaker 3: are in a room less again, six suits all around me,
12:24
Speaker 3: you know, and our people, the press bubble. They're all excited,
12:28
Speaker 3: and I'm sitting there. My dad dot my mom's in shock.
12:33
Speaker 3: And we signed a contract and they gave me hundred
12:36
Speaker 3: dollars a month to write, and I was going to
12:40
Speaker 3: remain there until we recorded. My parents go home. I
12:43
Speaker 3: stay at the President Hotel. I think my uncles down there.
12:46
Speaker 3: Somebody's watching over me. And I got up at two
12:51
Speaker 3: o'clock in the afternoon late. I supposed to be there
12:54
Speaker 3: at one Capital Studios up front, and I'm freaking out,
12:58
Speaker 3: and I will run from forty some street about six
13:01
Speaker 3: blocks to a Capital studio and I walk in. Now
13:06
Speaker 3: you have to understand and try to explain it to
13:09
Speaker 3: somebody of the newer artists, say initially Michael Buble.
13:14
Speaker 1: I love Michael.
13:15
Speaker 3: Therefore, in the beginning, still I am that you're in
13:18
Speaker 3: a room and you're with top session musicians who are
13:25
Speaker 3: looking at these lead sheets and arrangements, and you're in
13:28
Speaker 3: this room. You need to study the arrangement. You rehearse
13:32
Speaker 3: for maybe let's say thirty minutes to get the vibe
13:36
Speaker 3: and where you're going. And you walk into a small
13:39
Speaker 3: studio a booth where they have a one cor inch tape,
13:46
Speaker 3: two reels on a corrage tape, and now you're putting
13:49
Speaker 3: a booth and this tape starts to roll. We're not
13:52
Speaker 3: where we are today with technology and all the stuff
13:55
Speaker 3: that we know is out there. You can cut a
13:58
Speaker 3: hit in your bedroom with your macans whatever, and you
14:01
Speaker 3: start singing, and you're singing with sheer energy, passion and
14:07
Speaker 3: scared of death, trying to adapt to this concept of
14:10
Speaker 3: you'll keep recording till you get what you want or
14:14
Speaker 3: what they want. And I must have done twelve, thirteen, fourteen,
14:18
Speaker 3: fifteen takes and that was it. Now if there was
14:21
Speaker 3: something you want to fix, and I try to tell
14:24
Speaker 3: a lot of people to that, you take a razor blade,
14:26
Speaker 3: we would cut the tape, take a piece of scotch tape,
14:30
Speaker 3: put the scotch tape on the cut and that was
14:32
Speaker 3: your fix. Then you take it from there that you
14:37
Speaker 3: were done. Once you captured it, they put it on
14:39
Speaker 3: a piece of plastic vinyl disc. They walk it over
14:42
Speaker 3: to Alan Freed, send it to a couple of Rarea stations,
14:45
Speaker 3: and you knew in forty eight hours if you had
14:47
Speaker 3: it it so here I am finally get Diana Don't
14:52
Speaker 3: Gamble with Love out Dick Clark wanted Don't Gamble with Love.
14:57
Speaker 3: Somebody turns it over to Diana and within a week
15:01
Speaker 3: you're booked on American Bandstand and you're on ed Solomon
15:05
Speaker 3: that fall, and there's your life.
15:07
Speaker 1: There's your new life.
15:09
Speaker 3: All these guys around you. You've got a new record
15:11
Speaker 3: company with an ABC television company that was not making money.
15:17
Speaker 3: They're just starting, but they were shipping a courier. Would
15:21
Speaker 3: take whatever money they earned off of Diana, which back
15:25
Speaker 3: then was a lot of money. They put it on
15:27
Speaker 3: an airplane with a courier, go out and pay the
15:30
Speaker 3: bills and lot spectus. My life changed right there.
15:34
Speaker 1: I was wow, Wow, Wow.
15:38
Speaker 3: The Slim Show. I'm in a studio where David Letterman
15:43
Speaker 3: right broad with right.
15:45
Speaker 1: I used to study acting on the top floor there,
15:47
Speaker 1: right above that studio.
15:49
Speaker 3: There you go. They say, the day before, Paul, you're
15:55
Speaker 3: going into Madison Square Gardens. We're not going to shoot
15:57
Speaker 3: it at the theater, small theater environment. I go to
16:04
Speaker 3: a rehearsal and I'm in this vast space Madison Square
16:09
Speaker 3: Garden my first big network show. But I used to
16:13
Speaker 3: watch as a kid every Sunday. That's all you did
16:17
Speaker 3: was watch that until Mickey Mouse Club came along and
16:20
Speaker 3: television was that solo. Sure, I'm on the floor and
16:25
Speaker 3: I'm rehearsing and the band was like they could have
16:28
Speaker 3: been a city, and I have to deal with all
16:30
Speaker 3: these elements. What I tell you was I scared. We
16:34
Speaker 3: go on the air and I'm singing Diana in Madison
16:37
Speaker 3: Square Garden on my first of many at Sullivan shows.
16:42
Speaker 1: Tell us now about this Beatles connection. How did you
16:45
Speaker 1: meet them? How did you convince them to come conquer America?
16:51
Speaker 1: Which actually affected your career? Didn't it?
16:54
Speaker 3: Well? After Diana? I have a string of hits, I've
16:58
Speaker 3: got it kind of someone of the foundation of working
17:05
Speaker 3: coming along as an entertainer, and I'm living in an
17:07
Speaker 3: international life. I mean, Japan five HiT's a big parade,
17:14
Speaker 3: and I'm sensing this international career. At seventeen eighteen nineteen,
17:19
Speaker 3: I'm going to Europe. I'm constantly going to Europe, etcetera, etcetera.
17:23
Speaker 3: So I'm in France, the country that I embraced at
17:26
Speaker 3: a young age, loving it, And I go to see
17:29
Speaker 3: a friend of mine who's working in the classic theater
17:31
Speaker 3: of the Olympia Theater been there forever and still there.
17:35
Speaker 3: And I go to see my buddy who's headlining. And
17:38
Speaker 3: as was it was back then, you'd have an opening
17:41
Speaker 3: act or a few opening acts and that was pretty much,
17:44
Speaker 3: you know, the presentation all over the world. So when
17:48
Speaker 3: and I'm waiting for my friend to come on and
17:50
Speaker 3: I hear that is a differments at No Sicknuvau group
17:56
Speaker 3: Lore Engeler and set it does see who plays, and
18:01
Speaker 3: you know, because because people they're watching an these guys
18:08
Speaker 3: come out with the hair and with the thing and
18:11
Speaker 3: suits and shirtain times. But they've got you know, there's
18:14
Speaker 3: that new vibe and I'm looking as a musician, but wow,
18:18
Speaker 3: and they're doing covers. They're a cover band. Okay, I'm saying,
18:24
Speaker 3: look at those guys, man, that's kind of cool. So
18:28
Speaker 3: from that I meet them. Then I go to England
18:32
Speaker 3: and I'm you know, I took Thank god I took pictures.
18:35
Speaker 3: You know, nobody could believe it. And we'd become friendly
18:39
Speaker 3: in the sense of that when I was in England,
18:41
Speaker 3: i'd see them, we hang and you talk and they
18:43
Speaker 3: would tell me, oh, we love this and you know
18:45
Speaker 3: you Chuck Berry and we copied this. And I'm really
18:49
Speaker 3: I'm looking at myself as you know, I'm not toning
18:52
Speaker 3: a guitar. I'm not doing what they were in terms
18:55
Speaker 3: of emulating Americans and and and there was none of those,
18:57
Speaker 3: None of the English bands or artists were on the
18:59
Speaker 3: hit for It was all American American artists. So we
19:04
Speaker 3: get to know each other and they say, we want
19:06
Speaker 3: to do what you're doing, you know, we want to
19:08
Speaker 3: publish and you want to write. And it was a
19:10
Speaker 3: great man because I really like you guys, and you
19:13
Speaker 3: had that energy that you anyway, I come back home
19:16
Speaker 3: from these trips and I talked to my agents in
19:19
Speaker 3: New York, Norman Weiss and Sid Bernston at general artists.
19:23
Speaker 3: I have to remember, we're in a time, in a
19:27
Speaker 3: space then where it wasn't a media driven society. It
19:30
Speaker 3: was radio anything you want to hear from Europe? Yeah,
19:34
Speaker 3: Blenn in a month later, you know, you knew nothing.
19:36
Speaker 3: It was all tell EXAs and you were short on
19:39
Speaker 3: what was happening at the time. And I come home
19:42
Speaker 3: and bring records home and until Weise and Bernstein, these guys,
19:48
Speaker 3: the Beatles, a bit of them, we talk about Beatles
19:52
Speaker 3: still was emerging, that whole English family. Finally, whatever button
19:59
Speaker 3: I pushed your them. They flew to England and met
20:02
Speaker 3: with this guy, Brian Epstein, who was their manager, and
20:06
Speaker 3: one thing led to another. They bring them over and
20:09
Speaker 3: like me, only like me in terms of the only
20:12
Speaker 3: thing you could do. I'm on Sullivan earlier in my life.
20:15
Speaker 3: Their for a show at Sullivan, Well the rest is hitty,
20:19
Speaker 3: won't deliver it. They take off. But it took me
20:23
Speaker 3: a while to convince these guys that this guy, these
20:25
Speaker 3: people are real. So then the floodgates, and I was
20:29
Speaker 3: happy with it because prior to that, you know, we
20:33
Speaker 3: were embraced, we those of us doing the pop music,
20:37
Speaker 3: et cetera, by our friends, and nobody else liked this.
20:40
Speaker 3: Parents didn't like us, Madison Avenue didn't like us, but
20:45
Speaker 3: we had our little following. When the Beatles hit Madison
20:48
Speaker 3: Avenue opened up, everything changed in everybody's mind in terms
20:52
Speaker 3: of pop music. So I call it pop music, and
20:55
Speaker 3: I think that for that. Well, of course, the fritsh
20:58
Speaker 3: Invasion hits, and some of us are off the radio.
21:02
Speaker 3: I'm off of my label. I buy back all my
21:04
Speaker 3: stuff for two hundred and fifty dollars. I go to
21:08
Speaker 3: a Victor and I get into a new group with
21:11
Speaker 3: this company. Because I would travel all over the world
21:14
Speaker 3: and my record company had trouble with distributing. But when
21:16
Speaker 3: i'd walk down the street in Italy or wherever i'd
21:19
Speaker 3: see RCA Victor washing machine. It's dost wherever I live
21:23
Speaker 3: make and so that's all I want to be with.
21:26
Speaker 3: So minute with RCA. And that was the next days
21:28
Speaker 3: of my life.
21:29
Speaker 1: Wow, let's skip ahead now and get into your relationship
21:41
Speaker 1: with the rat Pack and meeting Frank Sinatra and being
21:44
Speaker 1: friends and writing my way.
21:45
Speaker 3: And so there we are, Bobby, Darren, Frank, all of us.
21:53
Speaker 3: We're growing, we're getting ogre. I'm mastering the songwriting thing
21:57
Speaker 3: as best I can. But we're not oblivious to the
22:01
Speaker 3: fact that we may not be around because we had
22:05
Speaker 3: heard and we were pretty much taught that this can't
22:08
Speaker 3: last forever.
22:09
Speaker 1: What year is this now?
22:11
Speaker 3: Late fifties, gotcha, because we all heard of this place
22:15
Speaker 3: called Las Vegas. Elvis went in, didn't like it. I said, okay,
22:22
Speaker 3: I want to I want to be like those guys.
22:24
Speaker 3: I want to learn to be an entertainer. And fifty
22:29
Speaker 3: eight fifty nine they said, look, you can't headline there,
22:33
Speaker 3: but we want you to work with Sophie Tucker. I'd
22:37
Speaker 3: seen her, but I Sophie Tucker, but you know, I
22:39
Speaker 3: admired the fact that she was in veteran and had
22:42
Speaker 3: some good reputation. Long the short, I'm performing with Sophie
22:46
Speaker 3: Tucker in the late fifties Las Vegas. What they'd never
22:50
Speaker 3: seen was there. I am this kid with Sophie Tucker
22:56
Speaker 3: and every kid that was in school in Las Vegas.
23:00
Speaker 3: I guess in this you know city that wasn't the city.
23:03
Speaker 3: Then shows up and they're going nuts in this twelve
23:06
Speaker 3: hundred seat clubroom and purso vi, Tucker's getting pissed. Put
23:10
Speaker 3: in a very gracious manner, where she my boy, I
23:16
Speaker 3: want you to close the show. So they made me
23:18
Speaker 3: close the show. She'd go on first to keep the
23:21
Speaker 3: kids in the room, get me quiet. And that was
23:24
Speaker 3: my first taste of Vegas. Now I had been there.
23:27
Speaker 3: I was like Darren and Avalon. We loved these guys,
23:32
Speaker 3: Frank Sinatra, we'd loved swing. We couldn't do it. So
23:36
Speaker 3: what we did is we'd put acts together with big
23:39
Speaker 3: band and say that's our goal. We got to work
23:41
Speaker 3: the clubs. So I started late sixties at the Copacabana
23:47
Speaker 3: in New York City. That was your kind of your
23:50
Speaker 3: entree to Vegas. Now you're in her environment with a
23:52
Speaker 3: mob whatever you want to call them, the boys, they
23:55
Speaker 3: ran everything. But it was the record business, music cement business,
24:00
Speaker 3: the nightclubs, and they were great to work for, gentlemen
24:03
Speaker 3: right in an industry that was in his infancy stage.
24:08
Speaker 3: So from Sophie Tucker, from the Kopa where everything went
24:13
Speaker 3: well for me, I wind up with these guys that
24:17
Speaker 3: I idolized and antilitated to be around. Call the wrap round,
24:22
Speaker 3: and I'm working in Sansotel. Now here you are. I
24:25
Speaker 3: got this kid still maybe early twenties, sitting in steam rooms, nude,
24:31
Speaker 3: looking at these guys, nude, having trouble with eye contact,
24:36
Speaker 3: not believing I'm in a room with these guys. And
24:40
Speaker 3: it went from there, you know, getting to know them,
24:43
Speaker 3: adoring Sammy Davis who became my friend, Adoring Sinatra, who
24:48
Speaker 3: was very gracious with me teaching me. They're befuddled in
24:52
Speaker 3: a sense on what's this kid doing on our world?
24:55
Speaker 3: You know, kids selling lots of records, making money for
24:58
Speaker 3: the guys. And they sloped me in. And then I'm
25:02
Speaker 3: stepping up. You know, I'm a hit. My act is
25:05
Speaker 3: good and blah blah blah. I'm learning my trade. I'm
25:08
Speaker 3: learning how to be a performance. So all the sixties
25:11
Speaker 3: I'm with these guys, but I'm younger and I don't
25:15
Speaker 3: know how to approach them and go. You know, I
25:17
Speaker 3: got a song for you because I'm still you know,
25:20
Speaker 3: coming off the longest day. You've got tonight chill theme.
25:24
Speaker 3: So the credit is getting broader to one day at
25:28
Speaker 3: the Fox and Blue Hotel, great hotel. You'd work Vegas
25:32
Speaker 3: and then you'd wind up at the Fountain Blue. Nothing
25:34
Speaker 3: like it, that style, it at the class and.
25:36
Speaker 1: Then that's my that's Miami. You're talking about.
25:39
Speaker 3: Miami, Florida. Yeah, so between Vegas and Miami, Florida, that
25:44
Speaker 3: was your hang spot with these guys, and here I
25:46
Speaker 3: am growing up with the rap pack. If you will,
25:50
Speaker 3: do one day when Sinatra was doing a film in Miami,
25:55
Speaker 3: I'm working in the Laurent room at the Fountain Blue.
25:59
Speaker 3: Mid sixties. He's doing a film called Lady and Ice.
26:03
Speaker 3: I think Lady and Ice, which with the guys that
26:07
Speaker 3: we worked for, could have been a documentary. You know,
26:10
Speaker 3: we were still working for the boys. I'm having dinner
26:13
Speaker 3: one night. I think he was married to me at Barrel,
26:17
Speaker 3: who was twenty one, and he was you know, tick
26:20
Speaker 3: a high number. But he's going through that dilemma he's
26:24
Speaker 3: going through, wanting to retire. The rat pack is over,
26:28
Speaker 3: and he's being very open with me as to I
26:31
Speaker 3: think I've had enough, and I'm saying to myself, he's
26:36
Speaker 3: gonna quit. He's gonna do one more album with Don Costa,
26:39
Speaker 3: my guy who I introduced a Sinatra, and I never
26:43
Speaker 3: wrote a song for him. One thing leads to another
26:46
Speaker 3: within that creative process, and this was a spiritual moment
26:50
Speaker 3: for me after hearing that at the Fountain, where we
26:54
Speaker 3: had such great times together. Once I get back to
26:57
Speaker 3: New York, twelve midnight, sitting there in front of my typewriter,
27:00
Speaker 3: got still type from my days of school, seventy words,
27:03
Speaker 3: but I start metaphorically, and now the end is near,
27:06
Speaker 3: and so I faced the final curtain, all about him,
27:09
Speaker 3: as if you were writing it, finish it. At five
27:11
Speaker 3: in the morning, I called him in Vegas. I think
27:14
Speaker 3: it was at Caesar's. One thing leads to another the
27:19
Speaker 3: next night because he said, get out here with it,
27:20
Speaker 3: blah blah blah. I'm in his rest room. I play
27:23
Speaker 3: in my way. A couple of months later, I get
27:25
Speaker 3: a phone call. He's in Los Angeles at a record studio.
27:29
Speaker 3: Kid that was my nickname. Well, we all had nicknames.
27:33
Speaker 3: Sammy was smoking the Bear, Dean was Veno. Everyone that
27:38
Speaker 3: hung around with them on your bathlob in the health clubs.
27:41
Speaker 3: You had your name of that. He says, kid, listen
27:43
Speaker 3: to this, and he took the phone. He put it
27:45
Speaker 3: next to a speaker, and I heard My Way for
27:48
Speaker 3: the first time. Well, the guy that was retiring and
27:51
Speaker 3: quitting now stayed ten more years, changed my life as
27:56
Speaker 3: a writer, my flotos and changed it for him. You
27:59
Speaker 3: know the rest of the story.
28:01
Speaker 1: He recorded your song without you knowing it.
28:03
Speaker 3: Well, I knew he was doing it. I was in
28:05
Speaker 3: the dressing room, played it for him Costa's in bo.
28:11
Speaker 3: Two months later, he calls me from a studio with Costa.
28:16
Speaker 3: They had just recorded it. No one else has heard
28:18
Speaker 3: it yet, and they played it to me over the phone.
28:21
Speaker 1: That famous recording that everybody knows that you You heard
28:25
Speaker 1: that over the phone over the.
28:27
Speaker 3: Phone, LA to New York.
28:29
Speaker 1: Wow.
28:29
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I cried. I had happy tears.
28:33
Speaker 1: I'll bet you how did my Way change your life?
28:39
Speaker 1: Did it change your life immediately? What happened?
28:44
Speaker 3: Well, it changed my life in the moment because I
28:46
Speaker 3: knew I had something. You know I had enough under
28:50
Speaker 3: my feet as a song guy to know this was
28:52
Speaker 3: something pretty special, right. It changed his life that he
28:57
Speaker 3: decided say the business though, he went into retirement and
29:01
Speaker 3: then I wrote let Me Try Again, which was his
29:03
Speaker 3: comeback song. But it changed his you know, I humbly
29:07
Speaker 3: submit it changed mind certainly because you know, everything prior
29:13
Speaker 3: to that was love songs and you know, stuff that
29:16
Speaker 3: was in the growth pattern of working at my craft.
29:19
Speaker 3: It was that unusual and different song that it changed
29:23
Speaker 3: both our lives. Absolutely.
29:26
Speaker 1: You must have been flooded with offers for the top
29:32
Speaker 1: artists in the world to co write with you or
29:34
Speaker 1: for you to write material for them. I'm sure that happened.
29:38
Speaker 1: How did you handle that?
29:43
Speaker 3: Well, yes, all of a sudden it changed, and that
29:47
Speaker 3: everybody wanted to write with you, but they wanted to
29:50
Speaker 3: write another My Way. Does the work like that? You're
29:53
Speaker 3: not going to have fifty My Ways songs? But certainly
29:56
Speaker 3: opened up the the respect in the gravitas because prior
30:03
Speaker 3: to that I was in the niche of writing for
30:05
Speaker 3: my age and the song was so different in the
30:09
Speaker 3: environment of what was making it. Then you know, Hendricks
30:11
Speaker 3: had opened it up. There was rock, there was the
30:15
Speaker 3: folks stuff that was happening, But here was this different
30:19
Speaker 3: type of material for the guy. That was the guy,
30:22
Speaker 3: and nobody else could be Sinatra. He was the guy.
30:26
Speaker 3: So yeah, I started writing with people. That kind of
30:30
Speaker 3: came a little later, but what it did was it
30:35
Speaker 3: gets me. The record deal happened with Jubilation, Skry centered jubilation,
30:42
Speaker 3: Do I Love You with Donna Fargo, number one country record,
30:45
Speaker 3: having My Baby one Man Woman, I don't like to
30:48
Speaker 3: sleep alone, number one records again. So it opened the
30:52
Speaker 3: door and the attention to wait a second, my way,
30:56
Speaker 3: and now the seventies with this stuff, so with writing
31:01
Speaker 3: with others, and with the acceptance, if you will in
31:03
Speaker 3: a very fickle business, well really you learn at an
31:07
Speaker 3: early age nobody really cares each yet and spitch out.
31:10
Speaker 3: That's that what changed my life. It gave me a
31:12
Speaker 3: new CREDENTI m then I'd let me try again with him,
31:17
Speaker 3: and I was writing She's a Lady, and all that
31:20
Speaker 3: stuff started to happen. We Uh.
31:23
Speaker 1: I'm a huge Tom Jones fan, grew up watching his
31:26
Speaker 1: weekly show and he'd come out and go crazy with
31:30
Speaker 1: his dance routines and his great vocals and the girls
31:33
Speaker 1: would go crazy.
31:34
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was there, and.
31:37
Speaker 1: It's not unusual to be loved by anyone. And he
31:40
Speaker 1: would start out the show with that tell us about
31:44
Speaker 1: working with Tom Jones.
31:46
Speaker 3: So I was with the same agency as Tom Joneson
31:49
Speaker 3: and he and the Humperdinck were probably a third of
31:52
Speaker 3: the gross earnings of this agency. And I'm working in Vegas,
31:58
Speaker 3: and of course they were familiar in my way. They're
32:01
Speaker 3: familiar with my career. Like he wanted to meet Presley
32:05
Speaker 3: because you want to meet him. I wanted to meet
32:07
Speaker 3: Tom telling me. So we all got to know each other,
32:10
Speaker 3: and we got to know each other well the way
32:12
Speaker 3: they come to my home. We'd set up and watch
32:15
Speaker 3: movies because I'd get these uh movie reels from the
32:19
Speaker 3: movie companies. Would sit till nine ten in the morning,
32:21
Speaker 3: freaking champagne, having a good time. So we lock in,
32:24
Speaker 3: we're playing tennis together. I'm in England, I'm on Tom's show,
32:28
Speaker 3: and it gets to well, what about me write me
32:31
Speaker 3: a song? That's a lady. I finished the show in England,
32:36
Speaker 3: and I spent a lot of time with him. When
32:38
Speaker 3: I think I started and on the back of a
32:41
Speaker 3: dinner menu on tw away because that was the carrier.
32:44
Speaker 3: We'd go back and forth on so a yets she's
32:46
Speaker 3: a lady out there. I try to capture the vibe
32:49
Speaker 3: of this sex idol. And he never had a number
32:53
Speaker 3: one record in the United States. Never. She's a Lady
32:55
Speaker 3: was his one and only. So we write that, and
32:58
Speaker 3: of course we rock, you know, we lock in, we
33:00
Speaker 3: hang and we're all together. We're friends for many many years.
33:05
Speaker 3: They record a few of my songs, you know, from
33:08
Speaker 3: popoll We made it happen. And I had a great
33:11
Speaker 3: relationship with them and their manager for quite a few years.
33:14
Speaker 3: And Tom's a great sinner.
33:17
Speaker 1: Now she's a fantastic voice.
33:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, and here we are today. He's still doing what
33:23
Speaker 3: he's doing, and I'm doing what I'm doing an ingle.
33:28
Speaker 1: Wow, I'm just overwhelmed. Let me ask you this, Do
33:35
Speaker 1: you prefer being the songwriter or the performer or is
33:40
Speaker 1: it a mix of both for you?
33:42
Speaker 3: From a security standpoint, I like being the writer because
33:48
Speaker 3: it's a fallback position, and I think that the kind
33:51
Speaker 3: of gravitas that comes with it, you know, back to
33:53
Speaker 3: the Beatles. We want to write, you want to that's
33:57
Speaker 3: a stable kind of consciousness that you live in. The
34:02
Speaker 3: performing thing was morphine and morphing. You know, you're constantly
34:08
Speaker 3: learning and you're constantly getting comfort zones. But you in
34:11
Speaker 3: front of people, you're writing, you're by yourself from there,
34:15
Speaker 3: on your own time schedule, if you will, and you
34:18
Speaker 3: can just sit there and take your time and kind
34:21
Speaker 3: of wait for it to happen. But the performing is fun. Right,
34:25
Speaker 3: twenty years, I've enjoyed, you know, feeling that I knew
34:29
Speaker 3: what I was doing, connecting with an audience, with a
34:32
Speaker 3: body of work. So the answer to the question is both.
34:38
Speaker 3: I would venture to guess that if I didn't have
34:42
Speaker 3: the gift of writing, I don't think we'd be talking today. Frankly,
34:47
Speaker 3: I don't think anybody would was interested, nor were they
34:52
Speaker 3: to write for a fifteen year old kid in an
34:54
Speaker 3: industry that was growing. No one would have the state
34:57
Speaker 3: of mind to say, okay here that you're going to
34:58
Speaker 3: say I'm so young and your old, or you're gonna
35:01
Speaker 3: go I had they called in popular or put your
35:04
Speaker 3: head on I'm just a look. Those all came from
35:08
Speaker 3: my feelings as a teenager, right, So the writing world
35:11
Speaker 3: for me was the most important to keep up, right,
35:15
Speaker 3: you know, I didn't really start feeling confident until well
35:18
Speaker 3: this day tonight's your thing where people started looking at
35:22
Speaker 3: me different, you know, kids growing, you know. So the
35:25
Speaker 3: performing thing was the roll of the dice. It was working,
35:30
Speaker 3: but I didn't feel as secure doing that as I
35:33
Speaker 3: did as a writer.
35:43
Speaker 1: Let me ask you this from songwriter to songwriter, and
35:48
Speaker 1: I've never sold anything to anybody, But do you have
35:52
Speaker 1: any control after you give the song to an artist
35:58
Speaker 1: about the final product when you hear it? Do you
36:01
Speaker 1: are you surprised? Are you positive about what you hear?
36:05
Speaker 1: Or are you like, oh, you know, maybe we should
36:08
Speaker 1: edit it and this, you know, give them some direction,
36:11
Speaker 1: or you just give the song away?
36:12
Speaker 3: And good question. Actually, you don't always have control. Once
36:20
Speaker 3: you submitted a demonstration, a demo, we call right field
36:25
Speaker 3: the song depending on the artist Sinatra, I gave him
36:31
Speaker 3: a piano demo. She's a Lady was had some rhythm
36:37
Speaker 3: elements to it. Once you give it to certain established artists,
36:43
Speaker 3: whether it was Skrysander, Jubilation Lady with Tom the Sinatra stuff,
36:50
Speaker 3: you're really trusting and putting it in the hands of professionals, right,
36:55
Speaker 3: You're putting it in the hands people that know how
36:58
Speaker 3: to do good, putting it in the hands of those
37:02
Speaker 3: that have realized there's something great they've been gifted as
37:06
Speaker 3: an artist, and that seems to always work for them.
37:10
Speaker 3: So the answer is there is a wall that once
37:14
Speaker 3: it leads you, you have to trust what their perception
37:17
Speaker 3: is and their talent group that sits down and vibes
37:22
Speaker 3: what fits their artists. Now, I've always approached it as
37:26
Speaker 3: a casting person in a motion picture. You know what
37:29
Speaker 3: you're writing for Tom, you know his capability, his name,
37:33
Speaker 3: you know the way Sinatra sing. So I'm emulating when
37:37
Speaker 3: you're writing. So you're type cast. You're trusting when you
37:42
Speaker 3: give it away, and you sit and wait for the
37:44
Speaker 3: phone call. Now, when I heard Sid Vicious singing my way,
37:48
Speaker 3: Mari Scossia calls that I'm using my film, I was
37:52
Speaker 3: taken aback and I didn't know whether I wanted to
37:55
Speaker 3: relinquish the rights for the usage till I woke up
37:58
Speaker 3: a few days later. I said, what who am I
38:01
Speaker 3: to sit here and judge what someone across the waters
38:06
Speaker 3: was feeling on this song that meant something to do
38:08
Speaker 3: him and realizing he went to Paris and redid an
38:12
Speaker 3: amplifier and had a jazz and he did it. The
38:15
Speaker 3: way he felt it. I didn't judge it. I said,
38:18
Speaker 3: you know what, I did the honesty in that, but
38:21
Speaker 3: I'm going to grant that now. There's no way I
38:24
Speaker 3: could have perceived what he was going to do with it,
38:26
Speaker 3: and ultimately I accepted it. So you're really sitting there
38:30
Speaker 3: hoping that as part of this team, that you're going
38:33
Speaker 3: to hear what comes back to you. In most cases,
38:37
Speaker 3: I like what came back to me. I never you know,
38:40
Speaker 3: when Donnie Osmond was they want to do popul Love,
38:43
Speaker 3: they wanted to do Lonely Boy, and he did a
38:48
Speaker 3: couple of my tunes. I accepted it. You know, I
38:51
Speaker 3: heard it the way that they perceived it. And I
38:54
Speaker 3: can't really tell you that there's ever a large percentage
38:59
Speaker 3: of treatments that I didn't like. You know, I can't
39:04
Speaker 3: really say, and you don't have a say. As I
39:06
Speaker 3: said earlier, to go elbowing around. Everybody said doing this now.
39:11
Speaker 3: When I wound up with Buddy Holly, I had no
39:14
Speaker 3: idea what Jacob's the arrangers producer. The song that started
39:20
Speaker 3: on a kind of guitar. You know, he talked the
39:22
Speaker 3: chords and was simply, you know, very young and there
39:27
Speaker 3: you go and bathing he and I'm embulating him, and
39:32
Speaker 3: hear the guitarist. Now we get to New York. There's
39:37
Speaker 3: this huge string section and a big orchestra. We got here,
39:44
Speaker 3: but do what I was doing? He wanted a big band,
39:48
Speaker 3: he wanted strings, something he'd never done. He was on
39:51
Speaker 3: his solo career now left a bad situation, and this
39:55
Speaker 3: was going to be his new sound. So that threw
39:58
Speaker 3: me at first. But I got it, you know, I
40:01
Speaker 3: got the genius of Jacobson and where they were going
40:04
Speaker 3: with that. But that was a differential from the kind
40:07
Speaker 3: of demo that I.
40:09
Speaker 1: Do you know you're writing a hit? When you're writing
40:12
Speaker 1: a hit, do you know it's a hit? Does it
40:14
Speaker 1: come to you quickly? Does it download from the muse
40:20
Speaker 1: instantly and it's a rush to get it down? Is
40:24
Speaker 1: that how it works for you?
40:26
Speaker 3: We'd all be richer in this business if we knew that.
40:29
Speaker 3: You don't really know other than being a professional. You
40:34
Speaker 3: don't really know other than when you know you've got
40:39
Speaker 3: something special. But the journey ahead is how do you
40:43
Speaker 3: capture it right? Right? I had a feeling on my way,
40:48
Speaker 3: I had a feeling uncheasy, lady, But you don't really know.
40:52
Speaker 3: You know when you've got something you like, you know,
40:54
Speaker 3: something that's has the merit, you know, something that could be.
40:59
Speaker 3: But till the process is finished, you right. I've sat
41:04
Speaker 3: with so many writers, and I've been blessed with all
41:06
Speaker 3: kinds of great writers, and you sit there and you
41:09
Speaker 3: know you've got something you know with it britback Rock,
41:11
Speaker 3: Michael McDonald. I mean, all the guys I live with,
41:14
Speaker 3: you don't know that you get there, you don't know
41:17
Speaker 3: it's finished. No.
41:19
Speaker 1: Interesting. I'm actually going to Nashville the middle of next
41:26
Speaker 1: month to co write with the Warner Chapel artists. They
41:28
Speaker 1: want me to come down and co write with them.
41:30
Speaker 1: I've never co written. Can you give me any advice
41:34
Speaker 1: on how that process is? Because I've never tried to
41:37
Speaker 1: do it, and now I'm getting in the arena with
41:40
Speaker 1: people that are actually known and gifted and all that.
41:44
Speaker 3: So, if the vibe and everything in life is that
41:51
Speaker 3: chemical attachment with someone, well, you're looking for a relationship,
41:56
Speaker 3: you're looking for a business venture. You should know within
42:00
Speaker 3: an hour, hour and a half maybe soon you're feeling
42:04
Speaker 3: for this person. You should know whether there's a compatibility.
42:10
Speaker 3: You should know what you share in terms of music
42:14
Speaker 3: where you're all coming from. Then it could be a
42:17
Speaker 3: great process because now you have this balancing off of
42:21
Speaker 3: each other and mutual respect for each other that you know,
42:26
Speaker 3: what instrument do you play? Your piano player, guitar player.
42:29
Speaker 1: Hi write on guitar.
42:32
Speaker 3: So you're going to the right place Nashville, every three
42:36
Speaker 3: yards probably with guys that have guitars and piano, and
42:41
Speaker 3: you're going to know within that first couple of hours. Okay,
42:47
Speaker 3: you gotta be relaxed and you got to be open
42:49
Speaker 3: minded to sit there and go it. What do we
42:52
Speaker 3: want to write about? Where's the book? What's the key
42:56
Speaker 3: line here? Where are we going with? You need to
42:59
Speaker 3: now morphed with someone that you respect and you have
43:03
Speaker 3: a feeling for to get that initial idea to where
43:07
Speaker 3: you ultimately want to go. Now that may take you
43:10
Speaker 3: a day. You may get it in six hours. You
43:13
Speaker 3: may get it in three days once you've locked into it.
43:16
Speaker 3: But it can be an incredible experience working with someone
43:20
Speaker 3: that brings to the table what you've been to the table,
43:23
Speaker 3: taking the heavy load off of you and having this
43:27
Speaker 3: broad spectrum of creative foundation to work from. So it
43:31
Speaker 3: can be very cool, but the first couple of hours
43:35
Speaker 3: communicating that you know each other is very important. Now
43:38
Speaker 3: you could find also that you're going to go nowhere.
43:41
Speaker 3: You know. It was a different thing for me writing
43:43
Speaker 3: with Michael Jackson because he didn't have an instrument, you know,
43:45
Speaker 3: I had to sit and lay cords and do but
43:48
Speaker 3: I heard the talent with his sounds. But I mean
43:55
Speaker 3: it was a sound with it right right. But I
43:58
Speaker 3: knew within the first couple of hours once we found
44:00
Speaker 3: her kind of place with each other, because something was
44:04
Speaker 3: going to come out of it. And I had his
44:05
Speaker 3: last three HiT's you know this is it? Love never
44:08
Speaker 3: felt so good and the Drake record It Don't Matter
44:11
Speaker 3: to Me. That was the mostable experience I've ever had
44:14
Speaker 3: to write with someone. It was with Michael Jackson.
44:16
Speaker 1: Unbelievable. My wife is going to die when she hears this.
44:20
Speaker 1: She's a huge Michael Jackson fan and she loves those songs.
44:24
Speaker 1: She knew I was talking to you today. She wanted
44:26
Speaker 1: to like sit in and ask you questions, but I said,
44:28
Speaker 1: you know.
44:29
Speaker 3: It was an interesting artist. You know, I knew him
44:31
Speaker 3: as a kid with his family that came to my
44:33
Speaker 3: show in Vegas. They grew up with that whole era
44:37
Speaker 3: of sinopter myself. So when I finally got in a
44:40
Speaker 3: room with him together in my home in Carmel, it
44:44
Speaker 3: was like a heartwarming and it seemed to grow up
44:47
Speaker 3: and see where he's coming from, where he was intellectually
44:51
Speaker 3: dealing with the business. So that was a pretty cool
44:54
Speaker 3: journey for me. What are you than songs?
44:56
Speaker 1: I'll bet let's talk a little bit and about your
44:59
Speaker 1: post cast. How'd that come about? What's it about?
45:03
Speaker 3: Well, you know, for the last few years, do a podcast.
45:08
Speaker 3: You know, you've got great stories, blah blah blah that
45:10
Speaker 3: kind of Yeah. I let my son in law carry it,
45:13
Speaker 3: Jason Bateman, who's very successful in that world. Oh yeah,
45:18
Speaker 3: And I just you know, I didn't have time, you know,
45:21
Speaker 3: I was traveling. I didn't have interest raply, you know.
45:23
Speaker 3: I told my stories and went on Stern and I've
45:26
Speaker 3: done all of them, and I'd like to leave it
45:27
Speaker 3: at that. One thing leads to another. And someone, I
45:32
Speaker 3: think heard me on Bateman and it led to iHeart
45:35
Speaker 3: Radio and my buddy Skip Ronson was a friend. We
45:39
Speaker 3: talked every day. Someone came up with the notion after
45:42
Speaker 3: hearing me on a few of these that yeah, you
45:46
Speaker 3: should do a podcast, and you you know, have to
45:49
Speaker 3: see Skip and I hang out at lunches and what
45:51
Speaker 3: have you. Why don't you guys do it together. When
45:54
Speaker 3: I looked at it, you know, look, I'm not gonna
45:58
Speaker 3: make a zillion dollars. I'm gonna have a lot of fun.
46:01
Speaker 3: And with my buddy, I could take an hour or
46:03
Speaker 3: two out of the day. If I can inspire someone
46:07
Speaker 3: with it, if I can in any way give them
46:09
Speaker 3: some kind of a look into life of writing or whatever, yeah,
46:13
Speaker 3: let's do it. So it was that quick, you know,
46:15
Speaker 3: it was just a bunch of people coming together, putting
46:19
Speaker 3: it together and letting it Skip saying, yeah, I'm going
46:22
Speaker 3: to do it because you know, I don't think that
46:24
Speaker 3: sensing he was thinking of. It came together quickly in
46:28
Speaker 3: an environment where everybody got a podcasts. We're all in
46:33
Speaker 3: the same boat, right, So we knew what we were
46:36
Speaker 3: going to draw from from our friends and everything. And
46:39
Speaker 3: I had some time to do it. You know, I
46:41
Speaker 3: don't work. I don't want to work two hundred days
46:44
Speaker 3: a year like I used to. I tour fifty to
46:46
Speaker 3: seventy or five days. I've got my other stuff and
46:49
Speaker 3: I can fit this thing because I do it from
46:51
Speaker 3: my house where I am. And that was it, and
46:55
Speaker 3: we have good Now we've got Bill Burrow was on
46:58
Speaker 3: the other night. It was a buddy and it was
46:59
Speaker 3: just hilarious. Jason did it. We've got a whole list
47:04
Speaker 3: of great people who know how to talk about their
47:08
Speaker 3: life and their experience and we're having fun with it.
47:10
Speaker 1: You're gonna You're gonna have the President of France on.
47:14
Speaker 3: Uh yeah, the guy I'm talking to that was a
47:16
Speaker 3: pr guy because I was given an award, but it
47:18
Speaker 3: was just quit. So now I've got it. Was a
47:21
Speaker 3: new guy. You know, politicians never that's a whole other world.
47:25
Speaker 3: But I don't want to be a part of which
47:28
Speaker 3: we all have to respect and the fact that I
47:31
Speaker 3: just deal with their lives or not. But yeah, we'll
47:33
Speaker 3: ultimately get him. We've got Carlos Slimp going on from Mexico. Wow.
47:38
Speaker 3: We've got a lot of insent people that Kimmel we got,
47:42
Speaker 3: we get commitments from people.
47:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, well good. I wish you the best of luck
47:47
Speaker 1: with all of that. And it is it is the
47:51
Speaker 1: easiest job and the best job I've had in my
47:54
Speaker 1: life is doing a podcast. It's it's really quite fun
47:58
Speaker 1: and I heart's great and the great support, so I
48:02
Speaker 1: wish I wish you the best with that.
48:07
Speaker 3: What made it easy was the unknown that hits you
48:09
Speaker 3: and then the reality of what you're dealing with and
48:12
Speaker 3: the whole team that I've worked with that are just
48:16
Speaker 3: amazing to work with and makes much. It makes life easier,
48:21
Speaker 3: you know, to get on base right away, that revolving
48:25
Speaker 3: door to get to where you want to.
48:27
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go out on a limb here and ask
48:30
Speaker 1: you if I could send you a song sure that
48:34
Speaker 1: I wrote that I think you would.
48:36
Speaker 3: Like well, I'm sure I would like it. The challenge
48:41
Speaker 3: today for guys like me and everyone in the business
48:45
Speaker 3: is what do you do with them? You know, everybody's
48:47
Speaker 3: writing there on stuff.
48:50
Speaker 1: If you like this song, yeah, we'll figure out what
48:53
Speaker 1: to do with it. But if you like it, if
48:56
Speaker 1: it does something for you, just the thought of you
49:01
Speaker 1: listening to one of my songs.
49:02
Speaker 3: Did it? The butler did it? Now you're back? If
49:07
Speaker 3: I boom, so you go from there. You know what
49:11
Speaker 3: you deal is with clarity, transparency, honestly and go. I
49:17
Speaker 3: can do it. I don't know who can do it.
49:19
Speaker 3: I don't know if I'm doing an album, maybe it
49:21
Speaker 3: should go here, you know, because the music business changed
49:23
Speaker 3: so drastically. I mean, I feel it really has for
49:27
Speaker 3: people out there. He's not like years ago you could
49:30
Speaker 3: get you know where you're going. You get a place.
49:33
Speaker 3: You're probably going to the right place in Nashville because
49:35
Speaker 3: they still have a channel to artists that don't write
49:40
Speaker 3: what most of them do well. This possibility of getting
49:43
Speaker 3: a artist to do a song today, I don't even
49:47
Speaker 3: see a lot of artists wanted to do CDs or
49:51
Speaker 3: to contribute anymore because it's changed. You got these artists
49:55
Speaker 3: that years ago you had a promotion team to make
49:56
Speaker 3: a great album, and I'm excited you do an album.
49:59
Speaker 3: Today there's no promotion team. They're not spending so I
50:02
Speaker 3: could list to a bunch of people to put albums up.
50:05
Speaker 3: They don't do forty thousand CDs not good. No, So
50:09
Speaker 3: with the streaming and everything going on, it's where do
50:12
Speaker 3: you go with a song? Ooh, you give it? You
50:15
Speaker 3: know at the end of the day, who I'm going
50:17
Speaker 3: to give the songs?
50:19
Speaker 1: Right? I think you give them away. I think with
50:22
Speaker 1: the world of social media, it's like you can't really
50:24
Speaker 1: sell them, you know. The money's in the touring. I mean,
50:28
Speaker 1: if you want to earn a living, it's touring and
50:29
Speaker 1: merch and that's it.
50:32
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well I got a song brewing now with Tiger
50:36
Speaker 3: Oh wow. I mean he's got in his studio. I
50:39
Speaker 3: think he likes it. We'll see. But you keep trying,
50:43
Speaker 3: you keep doing. But like you say, all artists make
50:45
Speaker 3: their money on the road. Right, the music you've got,
50:50
Speaker 3: artificial intelligence is going to change our lives so drastically.
50:54
Speaker 3: It's not here, but wait, the grand process next three
50:59
Speaker 3: years change lives in all occupational films, and it's going
51:04
Speaker 3: to change in the music business, film, etc.
51:07
Speaker 1: I think AI is going to I think we're we're
51:09
Speaker 1: looking at massive copyright and infringement issues and lawsuits coming
51:16
Speaker 1: down the pub.
51:17
Speaker 3: Try to prevent that. Right theoretically, okay, but it's too
51:23
Speaker 3: big and there's too many power bases that will sit
51:27
Speaker 3: down with the right people and say, okay, guys, look
51:30
Speaker 3: you can't do this. These are intellectual rights. You can't
51:34
Speaker 3: do that. There's a lot of money that have been made,
51:37
Speaker 3: Let's do the right thing. They don't want two thousand
51:41
Speaker 3: figuratively losses coming out them, you know, just they won't
51:45
Speaker 3: you have to accept change. You have to be optimistic.
51:49
Speaker 3: I live through change all my life. You hang in,
51:54
Speaker 3: you keep on keeping on, you take the clothes. I
51:57
Speaker 3: hope it changes for the best, and it will. I'm
52:00
Speaker 3: worried about the guys that are going to be able
52:02
Speaker 3: to work and other occupations. Forget about collarge. You have
52:06
Speaker 3: people that will lot of jobs, and the governments and
52:08
Speaker 3: the corporations will have to restructure. Tell everybody to stay home,
52:13
Speaker 3: work two days a week. I'm just giving you. We'll
52:16
Speaker 3: give you money. They'll go and then's spend it. And
52:18
Speaker 3: you'll see this globe now with where we have to
52:21
Speaker 3: contend with China and Europe and Russia. There'll be this
52:26
Speaker 3: huge change wrapped around artificial intelligence. Let's hope we use
52:30
Speaker 3: it right and let's hope everybody survives with it. But
52:33
Speaker 3: it's coming. You will. You're seen in medicine. You've got
52:36
Speaker 3: all kinds of new applications with AI and technology. It's
52:41
Speaker 3: unheard of and it's coming and it will happen, and
52:44
Speaker 3: it's a wonderful thing.
52:46
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is why live entertainment will grow in popularity
52:51
Speaker 1: because they won't be able to get it anywhere else.
52:53
Speaker 1: Nothing will be real in their lives except live theater
52:55
Speaker 1: and live music and live this and live that. So
52:59
Speaker 1: I'm hopeful for that. Would you do us the honor
53:12
Speaker 1: of playing rapid fire with us? The thought of playing
53:15
Speaker 1: rapid fire with you. It's something we do with all
53:19
Speaker 1: of our guests, and it's just sort of give basic
53:21
Speaker 1: gilmore questions and I ask you what your preferences are
53:25
Speaker 1: and you can answer if you want to. Would you
53:29
Speaker 1: do that for us?
53:30
Speaker 3: I would love to do it. Yeah, just the questions,
53:34
Speaker 3: but go ahead.
53:35
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, here's the first question. How do you like
53:38
Speaker 1: your coffee?
53:40
Speaker 3: I like my coffee. I have another sugar guy. I
53:44
Speaker 3: use honey, a gabi. I use oat milk and black
53:50
Speaker 3: of course. I like the French press or I put
53:53
Speaker 3: it in. I do the purest form of coffee. I
53:56
Speaker 3: do coffee minimum of four times a day, maybe or
54:00
Speaker 3: because I think when I'm an avid reader on all fronts,
54:04
Speaker 3: that coffee is healthy player. So I drink it right
54:08
Speaker 3: right too. I've spoken to doctors about it because I'm
54:12
Speaker 3: a health free and that's how I like it. I
54:15
Speaker 3: don't generally do shots, but I do cups of black coffee.
54:20
Speaker 3: I done properly out of the right mechanisms.
54:23
Speaker 1: Great. Next question, are you team Logan, Team Jess or
54:28
Speaker 1: team Dean? Do you have any idea what I'm talking about?
54:32
Speaker 3: I can intelligently answer that question.
54:36
Speaker 1: Good. Would you rather work with Michelle or Kirk Michelle? Why?
54:44
Speaker 1: I like Michelle because he's Canadian, He's from Montreal.
54:49
Speaker 3: I feel a chemistry with Michelle.
54:54
Speaker 1: H What would you order at Luke's Diner.
55:00
Speaker 3: Or a Hamburger and a Milkshire?
55:03
Speaker 1: Who would you rather hang out with? Paris or Lane?
55:08
Speaker 3: Paris boy?
55:10
Speaker 1: I like Paris, Harvard or Yale.
55:16
Speaker 3: With the state of those universities today, look, colleges are
55:22
Speaker 3: going through some real transitions. The whole education system to
55:29
Speaker 3: me is little frail. I don't like a few things
55:35
Speaker 3: going on. But they're both great. They're both great going
55:40
Speaker 3: into the legal field obviously, Harvard.
55:43
Speaker 1: Would you rather attend a dar event with Emily or
55:46
Speaker 1: a town meeting with Taylor?
55:50
Speaker 3: I think a town meetings too.
55:53
Speaker 1: Gilmore girls character that you would want as a roommate?
55:58
Speaker 3: Wow, you know, listen, roommate girlfriend, wives, one room. That's
56:08
Speaker 3: a serious.
56:09
Speaker 1: Question, serious man, who do you think?
56:13
Speaker 3: Wow? Give me three choices?
56:16
Speaker 1: Okay, right? No, I know I knew that let me see, Well,
56:23
Speaker 1: you like Paris, So let's say, uh, Paris or Babet
56:28
Speaker 1: or Laurel I Paris, Babet or Laurel I. Sally Strauthers
56:32
Speaker 1: played Babet, Paris, Paris again, Paris for the wind.
56:37
Speaker 3: The city of Paris has been good to me, and
56:40
Speaker 3: I'm going with Paris.
56:41
Speaker 1: Okay, Uh, something in your life you are all in on.
56:48
Speaker 3: I'm all in empathy for others, being non judgmental, and
56:59
Speaker 3: I'm all in in on trying to constantly institute the
57:04
Speaker 3: necessity of love for one another the people. I think
57:08
Speaker 3: there's a some kind of cure based around if everybody
57:15
Speaker 3: can feel more love than they are and empathy and kindness.
57:19
Speaker 3: Now that's traveling through the world where I see all
57:22
Speaker 3: of the adversity, the treatment of people. It's never going
57:28
Speaker 3: to always be perfect, but I think if people could
57:30
Speaker 3: start learning a little more but kind, empathetic, and show
57:35
Speaker 3: some love, it's going to be a little easier on everybody.
57:39
Speaker 3: Because I've never seen the world in this state that
57:42
Speaker 3: it's in right now. I think that there's some pain
57:46
Speaker 3: ahead of us here until certain things are resolved, And
57:49
Speaker 3: the only thing ultimately that's going to inch you ahead
57:55
Speaker 3: is feeling empathy, kindness and love for people. Other than that,
58:01
Speaker 3: it's going to get worse, you know, because it's just
58:03
Speaker 3: too many unresolved things that are going on, you know,
58:07
Speaker 3: for my liking, that are not making it an easy
58:11
Speaker 3: world to live in.
58:13
Speaker 1: I have one last question, and I thank you so
58:16
Speaker 1: much for your time. I really appreciate this. Are you aware,
58:24
Speaker 1: based on just one song that you wrote, My Way,
58:28
Speaker 1: of the impact the positive impact that that has had
58:32
Speaker 1: on literally billions of people since you have written that song,
58:37
Speaker 1: and it will continue to positively impact people in a
58:41
Speaker 1: very positive way so that they can show that empathy
58:44
Speaker 1: and love and get strength from that song. Are you
58:51
Speaker 1: aware of the impact of that song?
58:54
Speaker 3: I learned very early in my creative life. My life
58:59
Speaker 3: is a it's what I do. You sit in the
59:03
Speaker 3: room and you create even when you perform, but you
59:08
Speaker 3: take my way. As you mentioned, there's a large black
59:12
Speaker 3: hole between me sitting here today with you and what
59:18
Speaker 3: people are embracing out there with my Way or whatever song.
59:22
Speaker 3: But let's use my way. You don't fully realize ever,
59:27
Speaker 3: with that black hole in front of you, how you've
59:30
Speaker 3: affected people. Where you get a sense of it when
59:35
Speaker 3: you're performing up there and you hit that song in
59:38
Speaker 3: your lineup, and you see the tears, You see the
59:43
Speaker 3: reaction of people, you see how they react to you
59:46
Speaker 3: at the end of it. Only then do you get
59:48
Speaker 3: a sense. You get a sense someone someone comes up
59:51
Speaker 3: to you. You get a sense when you get a
59:53
Speaker 3: letter from someone that's dealing with someone that does not
59:58
Speaker 3: have the health them, that's their brother is on death
1:00:01
Speaker 3: row in a prison. You eclectically get these responses. But
1:00:06
Speaker 3: to say that I fully get it, No, absolutely not.
1:00:10
Speaker 3: I don't think any of us do it. You know,
1:00:12
Speaker 3: I was at a dinner prior to the other night
1:00:14
Speaker 3: with a top neurosurgeon in the country. I didn't know him,
1:00:20
Speaker 3: he didn't know me, and it came out within the dinner.
1:00:24
Speaker 3: You know how my Way was his song, he said.
1:00:27
Speaker 3: But I'm gonna tell you something. I will tell a
1:00:29
Speaker 3: lot of people. When I was operating in the seventies,
1:00:36
Speaker 3: and I would go in and take a tumor the
1:00:39
Speaker 3: size of an orange or whatever out of someone's head.
1:00:44
Speaker 3: As I would pull it out, I would sing, having
1:00:47
Speaker 3: my Baby. No, you know, I've never heard much about
1:00:54
Speaker 3: my song having my Baby, other than the obvious meeting.
1:00:57
Speaker 3: But it's like pulling a baby, he said absolutely, and
1:01:02
Speaker 3: everyone there was in the court, he said, don't do
1:01:05
Speaker 3: it anymore because they're now younger, they don't know the song.
1:01:08
Speaker 3: But I would be singing having my baby. And you know,
1:01:12
Speaker 3: it's kind of back to what you said that was
1:01:14
Speaker 3: such an impact on me the other day. I'd say,
1:01:17
Speaker 3: I can't get my hair around that. You'd be pulling
1:01:20
Speaker 3: a cancers as someone's edit, you're singing and having my
1:01:23
Speaker 3: baby says, So you never know, you just ever know
1:01:30
Speaker 3: the full impact. Now, you take a country like the
1:01:32
Speaker 3: Philippines where they take their music seriously. I know for
1:01:36
Speaker 3: a fact because they're just an amazing country in terms
1:01:40
Speaker 3: of how they embrace music. Singing. I think three people
1:01:45
Speaker 3: are dead because in a karaoke karaoke bar they sang
1:01:49
Speaker 3: my Way the wrong way and they shot him. If
1:01:52
Speaker 3: you look it up, you actually read the content in
1:01:56
Speaker 3: the event they shoot people for singing my Way the
1:01:59
Speaker 3: wrong way, look at the extreme of that, and it's
1:02:02
Speaker 3: been written up. It's you. Well, we're done. You'll google
1:02:05
Speaker 3: it and you'll see I will who got shot in
1:02:08
Speaker 3: the Philippines and a carrier. That's not the effect that
1:02:13
Speaker 3: I want my song to have. On anyway.
1:02:16
Speaker 1: It has been a pleasure, it really has. I feel
1:02:21
Speaker 1: like I can quit podcasting now because I've done the interview,
1:02:24
Speaker 1: and but I but I won't.
1:02:27
Speaker 3: You'll keep doing it because you do it well, and
1:02:30
Speaker 3: you're going to go to Nashville and you're gonna do
1:02:32
Speaker 3: that well, and you're going to constantly feel what music
1:02:36
Speaker 3: and the magic there has and always see conversations what
1:02:39
Speaker 3: it does for you. Because if you have a passion,
1:02:42
Speaker 3: it's something in life. But you're so ahead of the
1:02:44
Speaker 3: game because most people, no, some people don't have a
1:02:49
Speaker 3: passion and a commitment to what they're doing. And that's
1:02:53
Speaker 3: always sad to me because you have to have that
1:02:56
Speaker 3: in your life to have a fulfilled life. You know,
1:03:00
Speaker 3: I need that. So you're fortunate and I'm fortunate.
1:03:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree. Thank you for sharing your stories. Thank
1:03:08
Speaker 1: you for your time. It has been an honor.
1:03:13
Speaker 3: And just get get Paris in the room with me somewhere.
1:03:16
Speaker 1: I will, I'll see what I can do. I'll send
1:03:20
Speaker 1: you that song. Have a have a great rest of
1:03:22
Speaker 1: your day, Good luck with the podcast. Thank you again.
1:03:26
Speaker 3: Well, I'm at a Broadway show that I'm dealing with
1:03:29
Speaker 3: here today. We got the money and now I have
1:03:34
Speaker 3: to sit and go through the waiting process. They want
1:03:37
Speaker 3: done in six months. So that's that's a new one,
1:03:40
Speaker 3: and that's a huge hurtle. It's a one a one
1:03:43
Speaker 3: time shot. Can't make a mistake there. So that's where
1:03:48
Speaker 3: I'm going from.
1:03:49
Speaker 1: You Broadway show, just just scoring a Broadway show?
1:03:53
Speaker 3: Okay, story my life?
1:03:56
Speaker 1: Oh is that it's going to be about you.
1:03:58
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm starting at fifteen and we're down to the
1:04:02
Speaker 3: list of songs and I'm dealing with writers.
1:04:04
Speaker 1: Now have you seen the Springsteen Broadway Show.
1:04:09
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've saw it on the Netflix.
1:04:12
Speaker 1: I think, Yeah, I'm watching this a full out.
1:04:15
Speaker 3: Show cast, full deal. We've got to get two actors,
1:04:20
Speaker 3: maybe three one. We can add it in at fifteen,
1:04:23
Speaker 3: sixteen and right mid twenties, and then it depends. We'll
1:04:27
Speaker 3: probably end it my way.
1:04:29
Speaker 1: What a great idea, What a great idea.
1:04:32
Speaker 3: We'll see how this idea mars.
1:04:34
Speaker 1: But I mean, just to stage all those big songs,
1:04:36
Speaker 1: what a great idea. Oh man, I wish you luck
1:04:39
Speaker 1: with that one.
1:04:40
Speaker 3: I lived unluck. I'll always take luck.
1:04:44
Speaker 1: All right, Thank you again, ladies and gentlemen. Paul Anka,
1:04:49
Speaker 1: we're talking about one of the giants of the past sixty,
1:04:56
Speaker 1: sixty five, even seventy years in the entertainment field. An
1:05:01
Speaker 1: honor to talk to you all right, Thank you, Take care,
1:05:34
Speaker 1: hey everybody, and talk forget. Follow us on Instagram at
1:05:37
Speaker 1: I Am all In podcast and email us at Gilmore
1:05:41
Speaker 1: at iHeartRadio dot com.