Latest / Gin And Talk / Patty McCord über Ehrlichkeit, Freiheit und Angst

Transcript

Patty McCord über Ehrlichkeit, Freiheit und Angst · Gin And Talk

• 0:00
  Speaker 0: It hurts, but it hurts less for me to say we don't need you anymore.
• 0:05
  Speaker 0: Panic is not good.
• 0:08
  Speaker 0: Fright isn't good.
• 0:10
  Speaker 0: Fear of your job every time you do something new has a terrible place to
• 0:14
  Speaker 0: be.".
• 0:15
  Speaker 0: But... A little bit like... Is actually kind-of fun!
• 0:21
  Speaker 0: Yeah?
• 0:21
  Speaker 0: Doesn't this mean that I have no
• 0:23
  Speaker 0: money?!
• 0:27
  Speaker 0: But also meant if went into hell in handbasket which at the time it possibly could have, he would do it slowly.
• 0:36
  Speaker 0: We wouldn't run out of money like on a Thursday because subscriptions keep coming in for awhile.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: so yeah... The American began her career as a recruiter in large technology companies like Sun Microsystems and C-Gate, and was there after their own statement.
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: above all one thing.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: The staff member who always got annoyed because she said what they thought.
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: That's exactly how you brought the job to Retastings with which they later went to Netflix.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: For fourteen years From the year of which she was chief talent officer there from a long time ago.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: She had the culture of the company.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: From DVD to streaming services worldwide.
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Together with Hastings, Netflix Culture Deck wrote her a PowerPoint presentation about freedom and responsibility that has been called off more than fifteen million times And the one from Sheryl Sandberg, once called as the most important document that ever came out of Silicon Valley.
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: She wrote her experiences and convictions in her book Powerful.
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: I met Patty McCord at Nordic Business Forum in Helsinki right after their appearance on stage.
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: That's why we had a conversation in English.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: I wanted to know from you how radical honesty and empathy fit together, how much freedom people in companies actually hold out.
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: And what are the fears of work that bring us on?
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: If you like this episode by Genantalk then follow us at Spotify, Apple Podcasts or wherever you would like to hear podcasts and leave a good rating behind!
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: You can also find these episodes as a video podcast on our YouTube channel.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: But now have fun listening to it.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: It's nice that you're all back with us!
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: Two people, ice-cold
• 2:40
  Speaker 0: drinks and a lot of
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: time for a personal bar talk.
• 2:46
  Speaker 0: Welcome to our bar trunks!
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: Welcome to another episode of Gin &
• 2:53
  Speaker 0: Talk.
• 2:54
  Speaker 0: Make yourself
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: comfortable,
• 2:56
  Speaker 0: lean back
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: and
• 2:59
  Speaker 0: dive into the
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: madness.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: Pettie, it's so nice to meet you here.
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: After two amazing days of Nordic Business Forum... You've been on stage earlier talking about the legend that you became!
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: That is why I need follow up and ask
• 3:25
  Speaker 0: what does it like be a legend?
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah but how did Petty become Petty?
• 3:36
  Speaker 0: getting in trouble for it.
• 3:39
  Speaker 0: You know what's funny?
• 3:39
  Speaker 0: I'll tell you my story of interviewing with Reed Hastings, who is CEO of Netflix.
• 3:50
  Speaker 0: And then a friend of mine that I had worked with at one of the companies went to this startup and he had a lot about their offers.
• 4:06
  Speaker 0: So, I was helping coaching him.
• 4:08
  Speaker 0: Well why are you choosing this one?
• 4:09
  Speaker 0: He said because I think the CEO is really brilliant guy.
• 4:14
  Speaker 0: It's his first time but I think he has tons of potential and want to work for them on.
• 4:18
  Speaker 0: Michael That's pretty cool!
• 4:19
  Speaker 0: so i called him up and say hey um...I don't wanna work here anymore or where you were can get me job.
• 4:26
  Speaker 0: And he said, no.
• 4:31
  Speaker 0: You told me if I took anybody from this company you'd break both my
• 4:34
  Speaker 0: legs.".
• 4:35
  Speaker 0: He said,"I know but didn't mean me".
• 4:39
  Speaker 0: So he says, No!
• 4:40
  Speaker 0: I'm not going to help
• 4:47
  Speaker 0: you!".
• 4:47
  Speaker 0: called back, Reed's sister answered the phone.
• 4:51
  Speaker 0: I said can i speak to Mr.
• 4:53
  Speaker 0: Hastings?
• 4:53
  Speaker 0: It's like he gets on the phone and says you don't know me but you should be your next head of
• 4:57
  Speaker 0: HR.".
• 4:59
  Speaker 0: I was having a moment right.
• 5:00
  Speaker 0: it just felt.
• 5:01
  Speaker 0: so I went into interview with him.
• 5:03
  Speaker 0: then he said um Can You Tell Me About Your HR Philosophy?
• 5:07
  Speaker 0: And at that point ,I Was A Real Corporate HR Person.
• 5:10
  Speaker 0: I Said Do You Know Reed?
• 5:12
  Speaker 0: I believe that everybody should be able to have the opportunity, take their heart and follow they blah-blah.
• 5:17
  Speaker 0: I just did this whole corporate speak talk and he said what the hell are you talking about?
• 5:23
  Speaker 0: You people don't say anything.
• 5:25
  Speaker 0: it's a bunch of mumbo jumbo like do you have brain in your
• 5:29
  Speaker 0: head?".
• 5:30
  Speaker 0: And then I said how dare you!
• 5:38
  Speaker 0: I kind of pissed off this.
• 5:44
  Speaker 0: and he said to me, you're the breadwinner in this family.
• 5:47
  Speaker 0: You better get it together.
• 5:49
  Speaker 0: You got to learn how to be a professional HR person if your gonna get another
• 5:52
  Speaker 0: job.".
• 5:53
  Speaker 0: And then I thought well, ya know?
• 5:54
  Speaker 0: He's probably right!
• 5:57
  Speaker 0: The reason that I was hired is because i'm the only one who didn't sound like all other HR people... Up until than ,I had spent most my career getting into trouble.
• 6:08
  Speaker 0: Honestly, I mean i can't tell you how many one-on ones that people would say to me.
• 6:13
  Speaker 0: Um...I had a boss once That literally said to me You know uh patty you have a lot of ideas and we've had them And they don't work so We'd prefer that you just stop having them.
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: So what do you say?
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: your an extrovert by nature or training?
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: I
• 6:31
  Speaker 0: think by nature, I moved every two years of my life when i was a kid and I never moved like before school started.
• 6:38
  Speaker 0: It was always in the middle of the year And so-and I never knew when we'd move again.
• 6:44
  Speaker 0: So I had to make friends fast and so I thought myself how be an extrovert?
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: How do you combine radical honesty with empathy?
• 6:58
  Speaker 0: Oh, I think radical honesty is empathy if it's done right.
• 7:02
  Speaker 0: So let's talk about that first of all in order to do real radical honesty.
• 7:09
  Speaker 0: If i'm going to be really honest with you have to trust me and You Have To Trust That i'm gonna tell you something For the good Of you or Me Or In My Case At The Company Right.
• 7:23
  Speaker 0: And and people might know that I might be saying something they didn't want to hear or disagree with, but they knew that i was coming from the right place.
• 7:32
  Speaker 0: And so... The empathy was that ...I really cared about everybody in the work that they did- I still do!
• 7:40
  Speaker 0: But that doesn't mean it's always roses, right?
• 7:45
  Speaker 0: So I think some people confuse empathy with niceness.
• 7:50
  Speaker 0: Right.
• 7:50
  Speaker 0: I'm nice and listen, and nod my
• 7:53
  Speaker 0: head.".
• 7:54
  Speaker 0: And sometimes empathy is saying,"I hear that it's hard for you".
• 7:59
  Speaker 0: You know?
• 8:00
  Speaker 0: And I know that your struggling and thats why we got to talk about because its not working right.
• 8:06
  Speaker 0: so what are going do say both of us?
• 8:08
  Speaker 0: get out this
• 8:08
  Speaker 0: hole?"You're
• 8:12
  Speaker 0: a successful person.
• 8:14
  Speaker 0: again i am allowed be empathetic and the best thing for our organization.
• 8:22
  Speaker 0: And when it doesn't fit, that's the better thing to
• 8:24
  Speaker 0: do.".
• 8:25
  Speaker 0: That's why I'm so visceral about things like...I hate The Performance Improvement Plan.
• 8:33
  Speaker 0: It's called THE PIP in the
• 8:34
  Speaker 0: U.S.,
• 8:35
  Speaker 0: right?
• 8:35
  Speaker 0: And I think is the cruelest process we've ever come up with.
• 8:42
  Speaker 0: for whatever reason, you don't belong here anymore.
• 8:49
  Speaker 0: So now I'm going to spend the next three months proving your incompetent when the truth is that you just don't belongs.
• 8:55
  Speaker 0: and then... You might not belong because i made them hiring mistake!
• 8:58
  Speaker 0: I heard you were wrong guy right?
• 9:00
  Speaker 0: so thats my mistake.
• 9:01
  Speaker 0: but I gotta prove that you're the incompetent one.
• 9:04
  Speaker 0: And it's not only process its exceptionally cruel.
• 9:10
  Speaker 0: It said everybody else watches Right, and that's the side effect.
• 9:15
  Speaker 0: That's the cost of those kind of systems that people never take into account.
• 9:21
  Speaker 0: because when everybody else knows every Wednesday you're gonna have a conversation about my performance And everyone knows I'm on a pip They know they are going to walk out crying.
• 9:31
  Speaker 0: So...and they know your'e gonna walk out upset We'll come in.
• 9:36
  Speaker 0: It is the best show and what everything is internalizing could be me It could be me.
• 9:43
  Speaker 0: This could happening to this person, I know they're not doing their job but... But this is heartless right?
• 9:50
  Speaker 0: And the thing about that system almost always people get right upto the edge and then you do it again!
• 9:59
  Speaker 0: So i just think thats really cruel.
• 10:05
  Speaker 0: I think that being straightforward and honest with empathy, going back to your other question is a much better way.
• 10:14
  Speaker 0: To deal with those things it hurts.
• 10:18
  Speaker 0: but it hurts less for me to say you know we don't need you anymore.
• 10:24
  Speaker 0: That's just the truth right?
• 10:25
  Speaker 0: And You don't like that and We can both sob about It.
• 10:30
  Speaker 0: But its Much Better Than Waiting Until You Fail.
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: A couple of years ago, I had an interview with a historian and we talked about how much freedom societies can handle.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: If you look into companies... You're talking a lot about freedom and responsibility?
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: Do you think there is the limit on freedom people can't...?
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: Like if you go over that, people are not able to handle
• 10:58
  Speaker 0: it?
• 10:58
  Speaker 0: Absolutely!
• 11:00
  Speaker 0: The metaphors don't yell fire in in a theater, right?
• 11:08
  Speaker 0: For sure.
• 11:09
  Speaker 0: And like let's separate it little bit if you're an company that makes medical devices You better follow the rules Right and you better make sure that everything is exactly as It should be and there's much more structure or much more rigidity.
• 11:26
  Speaker 0: In a company like then you don't have As Much freedom because it's going to go in somebody's body, so you have to be careful about.
• 11:36
  Speaker 0: So I would say the level of freedom and organizations depends on A what your organization does And B To Be Honest With You It's How Capable The Management Team Is Of Actually Executing It?
• 11:54
  Speaker 0: to teach people how to do something if you don't know how to it yourself.
• 11:58
  Speaker 0: That's why I'm so passionate about conversations like this, which is look, If we keep going with a workforce full of people who sit there and say tell me what to do?
• 12:10
  Speaker 0: Tell Me What To Do?
• 12:11
  Speaker 0: Tell ME WHAT TO DO?
• 12:12
  Speaker 0: We're all gonna fail!
• 12:15
  Speaker 0: And we just are... So that's why That thing means for us to share as much information as we can and then make good decisions within that envelope of what were trying to do.
• 12:30
  Speaker 0: So, no it's not complete freedom right?
• 12:33
  Speaker 0: You don't you know?
• 12:34
  Speaker 0: somebody asked me this is a good story.
• 12:37
  Speaker 0: Somebody ask one time in an interview at Netflix What I'd Do To Fire Them And i'm like.
• 12:42
  Speaker 0: that was a good question.
• 12:43
  Speaker 0: let see Punching me in the nose, breaching confidentiality.
• 12:48
  Speaker 0: Oh I know what?
• 12:49
  Speaker 0: I'd fire
• 12:49
  Speaker 0: you.".
• 12:50
  Speaker 0: I would fire if we were having a meeting about something that went wrong and you said oh I knew that nobody asked me.
• 12:57
  Speaker 0: I'd have to kill ya right?
• 12:59
  Speaker 0: I ran over into parking lot because that was The Cardinal Sin.
• 13:03
  Speaker 0: That cardinal sin wasn't going along with program.
• 13:07
  Speaker 0: it's not even when you knew it was wrong Right.
• 13:11
  Speaker 0: And that kind of freedom only happens when you can see somebody else doing it and living to tell the tale, right?
• 13:20
  Speaker 0: So that freedom in an organization is somewhat dependent on what people are willing to tolerate.
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: In a formal life I did a lot of consulting with big corporations in terms of strategy culture innovation And i struggled two things almost all companies.
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: First, nobody understands that it's not a transformation.
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: It's an evolution.
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: and the second thing is... ...it doesn't work without proper corporate culture because if you have people who are not motivated they will not change.
• 13:58
  Speaker 0: You know I hear ya man!
• 14:01
  Speaker 0: That was why i kind of gave up consulting too.
• 14:06
  Speaker 0: Was this similar kinda thing?
• 14:07
  Speaker 0: They would buy me in tell to fix it.
• 14:09
  Speaker 0: like I don't work here Like, you have to fix it.
• 14:12
  Speaker 0: You'll do all the work and a lot of times.
• 14:15
  Speaker 0: that's why corporations especially big corporations invite people like you in me into their world which is fixed for me.
• 14:22
  Speaker 0: I don't want to do anything.
• 14:23
  Speaker 0: i just want you to fix tell me what to Do?
• 14:25
  Speaker 0: And then you Tell them What To Do.
• 14:26
  Speaker 0: they're like oh That's too scary right now.
• 14:29
  Speaker 0: you know and I would say that A Lot Of Times Transformations Don't Work Because People Don'T Know How.
• 14:41
  Speaker 0: It's the how, not what.
• 14:42
  Speaker 0: We know what we have to do... Here is another story.
• 14:47
  Speaker 0: I'm consulting with a bank and it's a Bank in Australia.
• 14:54
  Speaker 0: They're going through this huge transformation because they are moving from brick-and-mortar banks To their future as an Australian.
• 15:04
  Speaker 0: Their future is Asia And its online and mobile.
• 15:08
  Speaker 0: That's it.
• 15:09
  Speaker 0: So I go and meet with the top five, the CEO in his direct reports.
• 15:14
  Speaker 0: And let's say I'm a thirty-five year old new employee... ...and you've hired me to put together team to do a mobile app for The Bank….
• 15:25
  Speaker 0: …I have got great idea!
• 15:27
  Speaker 0: I tested it with customers.
• 15:28
  Speaker 0: they're crazy about it.. ..I've got that team of people who can do it.
• 15:32
  Speaker 0: I am ready to roll.
• 15:33
  Speaker 0: what is going take from be able get resources?
• 15:36
  Speaker 0: i need this job done?
• 15:37
  Speaker 0: Right?
• 15:38
  Speaker 0: And the CFO, I mean without breathing goes it's not in a budget.
• 15:41
  Speaker 0: It's not happening.
• 15:43
  Speaker 0: It was February and this COO says to me on.
• 15:50
  Speaker 0: the CEO turns to me.
• 15:51
  Speaker 0: he goes look we're not Netflix but you know We're not that bad at...I don't think- I don't Think would be That hard to do with the COO.
• 15:57
  Speaker 0: She is writing in her moleskin.
• 15:59
  Speaker 0: Yeah, she may get all these little notes.
• 16:00
  Speaker 0: She looks up at me and she goes It's twenty seven It's Twenty Seven levels of approvals you'd have to do before you could even get started.
• 16:10
  Speaker 0: She looks at the CFO and she goes, and ten of them earn finance?
• 16:17
  Speaker 0: I was like just saying!
• 16:21
  Speaker 0: But so those it.
• 16:24
  Speaker 0: for particularly large corporations The barrier is not that eat... Not executives they get.
• 16:32
  Speaker 0: It's not the new people that you hire to implement The Transformation.
• 16:35
  Speaker 0: They get it, You hired them To do it!
• 16:37
  Speaker 0: Its' the fat middle who are like uh-uh.
• 16:41
  Speaker 0: And and That Fat Middle is the passive aggressive workforce Right?
• 16:47
  Speaker 0: Oh sounds great.
• 16:48
  Speaker 0: I'm all for the transformation.
• 16:49
  Speaker 0: Yay let's transform Goes back to their team and goes just don't Just do what you buy stuff Pay no attention.
• 16:55
  Speaker 0: This will blow over.
• 16:59
  Speaker 0: And in many corporations they're absolutely right.
• 17:01
  Speaker 0: They remember last year's transformation and the year before that, The Initiative was whatever.
• 17:07
  Speaker 0: I mean, That is other thing people do.
• 17:09
  Speaker 0: they make it these marketing campaigns.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: Over the last two days we talked a lot about fear on stage And i Do believe especially in corporations.
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: you've got Two different kinds of Fear One that Bad and one that is not so bad.
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: the one That Is Badest The One Where People Are Afraid Of Losing Their Jobs Because There's Like The Next Cost Reduction Plan And Layoffs And So On.
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: And The Other One Is Fear of Doing Something Different And Making A Change For The Better Or For Potential Better
• 17:46
  Speaker 0: It Was.
• 17:46
  Speaker 0: This Is At Netflix.
• 17:48
  Speaker 0: We Had That for a While.
• 17:50
  Speaker 0: it was Called The Culture of Fear And we used to do these quarterly meetings at the end of the quarterly meeting.
• 17:57
  Speaker 0: Reed and I would go to front-of-the-room, ask us anything right?
• 18:01
  Speaker 0: One other executive said... Ted, we've had these conversations for years right?
• 18:13
  Speaker 0: So tell me what you mean.
• 18:13
  Speaker 0: He's like well I think people around here are really nervous and they're really nervous about doing something different And they're scared They might lose their job.
• 18:21
  Speaker 0: You know part of the culture is this high performance thing that people are worried That there aren't gonna perform it.
• 18:25
  Speaker 0: so culture fear culture fear.
• 18:27
  Speaker 0: i mean he must have said at twenty times and Reed said Huh, that's pretty interesting.
• 18:32
  Speaker 0: You just did a presentation to the rest of the company about what your team was going to do and the metaphor he used in his slides with climbing K-two is like this gonna be big!
• 18:44
  Speaker 0: This year we're doing something amazing where it will be same as climbing K
• 18:47
  Speaker 0: two.".
• 18:48
  Speaker 0: He says seriously you have oxygen.
• 18:53
  Speaker 0: if don't do right...you'll die.
• 18:56
  Speaker 0: Right and most people go back to base camp.
• 18:59
  Speaker 0: Most people don't make it.
• 19:00
  Speaker 0: He's like.
• 19:01
  Speaker 0: you think it's scary did to climb mountains?
• 19:03
  Speaker 0: It's freaking scary to climb mountain.
• 19:05
  Speaker 0: so yeah a little bit of fear.
• 19:10
  Speaker 0: You know exactly what he just said.
• 19:13
  Speaker 0: doing new stuff is scary, right.
• 19:16
  Speaker 0: And that's the um I its like today on stage, you know my student helper Tommy says Aren't you scared?
• 19:25
  Speaker 0: I'm like, oh yeah.
• 19:26
  Speaker 0: Of course I
• 19:26
  Speaker 0: am."
• 19:27
  Speaker 0: And he's like well how are you going to do
• 19:28
  Speaker 0: it?".
• 19:28
  Speaker 0: and iI'm like because its exciting all right!
• 19:31
  Speaker 0: It was.
• 19:32
  Speaker 0: just if I pull it off... I'll feel really great.
• 19:36
  Speaker 0: so what I tell myself when im about to something that today- I'm in backstage closing my eyes saying I have some thing say even If blow at least ill said my peace Right, so yeah that I mean.
• 19:57
  Speaker 0: panic is not good.
• 19:59
  Speaker 0: Fright is not Good.
• 20:02
  Speaker 0: Fear for your job every time you do something new.
• 20:04
  Speaker 0: it's a terrible place to be but A little bit of like Is actually kind of fun?
• 20:12
  Speaker 0: You know.
• 20:14
  Speaker 0: and the other thing about fear at work in particular is Sometimes you're fearful And you pull it off.
• 20:21
  Speaker 0: I can do that.
• 20:24
  Speaker 0: I can something better next time, right?
• 20:26
  Speaker 0: The fear gives you confidence when you get through it.
• 20:29
  Speaker 0: sometimes you blow it Right and so then you think Maybe i shouldn't try that again.
• 20:36
  Speaker 0: And So how That is received from management in the rest of your team determines How many risks people are willing to take In future.
• 20:45
  Speaker 0: and thats another part about my whole philosophy About work which Is man.
• 20:50
  Speaker 0: if we dont teach people how to take risks, teach them how.
• 20:55
  Speaker 0: It's not natural.
• 21:00
  Speaker 0: it's like everybody doesn't go out the door in the morning going.
• 21:03
  Speaker 0: I'm gonna walk my dog.
• 21:04
  Speaker 0: maybe i'll dangle him over a cliff Like...it is not normal To Walk Into A Fire.
• 21:11
  Speaker 0: So you have be able Take Small Steps and Teach People.
• 21:14
  Speaker 0: Look at See?
• 21:16
  Speaker 0: We can do it!
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: Today we all know Netflix and it's a big success, but it hasn't been that clear all the way through.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: Was there moment in time where you realized ABR really onto something here?
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: That could actually work out
• 21:37
  Speaker 0: many And they were probably just as many.
• 21:41
  Speaker 0: I would think this is never going to do.
• 21:48
  Speaker 0: We were doing, we're at a company meeting and we had gotten to million customers.
• 21:51
  Speaker 0: And Reed was on stage during his presentation.
• 21:55
  Speaker 0: I have the bar chart.
• 21:56
  Speaker 0: you know where up two million customers?
• 21:58
  Speaker 0: We had invited in our millionth customer.
• 22:00
  Speaker 0: come to our company meeting.
• 22:02
  Speaker 0: In afterwards he goes that's pretty cool high and I said oh yes!
• 22:06
  Speaker 0: I wanna print it make it a rug roll.
• 22:11
  Speaker 0: my favorite story of success is i'm in airport security line T-shirt on or something.
• 22:18
  Speaker 0: And the guy in this security line goes, dude are you from Netflix?
• 22:22
  Speaker 0: I'm like yeah!
• 22:23
  Speaker 0: I work there and he goes... He yells over to that guy who's been at Burger King for a long time saying hey Jose!
• 22:32
  Speaker 0: This chick is from netflix!
• 22:33
  Speaker 0: He says yeah rock on
• 22:36
  Speaker 0: right?!
• 22:37
  Speaker 0: Turn around behind me.
• 22:38
  Speaker 0: the janitor is filling up his trash can.
• 22:40
  Speaker 0: He goes You're from netflix i love
• 22:42
  Speaker 0: netflix!!
• 22:42
  Speaker 0: I get out my phone call read him crying.
• 22:44
  Speaker 0: I
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: was
• 22:51
  Speaker 0: like, you know when people would use the word Netflix isn't Netflix?
• 22:56
  Speaker 0: and chill right?
• 22:57
  Speaker 0: All those adjectives is it's like oh my God look what we've built.
• 23:01
  Speaker 0: Right And...and We created inside of a company Those scary stories..we Would tell them over-and-over against Like um man You Know It's not like.
• 23:13
  Speaker 0: we walked into this and went.
• 23:15
  Speaker 0: We got it!
• 23:15
  Speaker 0: We walked Into it When Reed came up with The subscription Model When we started the company, We ran a DVDs in The Mail just like at Blockbuster.
• 23:26
  Speaker 0: Yeah do dates and late fees.
• 23:28
  Speaker 0: And he said you know I think we should do subscription Like gyms and eventually will get enough revenue that it'll pay off.
• 23:36
  Speaker 0: And literally everybody on the company was like no No people don't understand That they won't do that.
• 23:46
  Speaker 0: He's so passionate.
• 23:47
  Speaker 0: I know you well enough to know that this train has left the station, and your gonna do it anyway.
• 23:54
  Speaker 0: And i'm telling ya right now... You're going piss off a lot of people!
• 23:58
  Speaker 0: ...and imma get my giant pooper scooper.. ..And Im gonna go along behind you because this is not gonna be pretty read.
• 24:04
  Speaker 0: People aren't gonna like it.
• 24:06
  Speaker 0: So we went back- It was one those things that kinda forced into the organization.
• 24:10
  Speaker 0: Whether u agree or disagree We've had our collaboration discussed so were gonna do any ride.
• 24:17
  Speaker 0: So we get down and launch aside, blah-blah-bluh.
• 24:19
  Speaker 0: We're having a post mortem meeting where talking about how the rollout went one of guys stands up.
• 24:24
  Speaker 0: he goes read Hastings I hated this idea!
• 24:28
  Speaker 0: This is dumbest idea you ever had.
• 24:31
  Speaker 0: i had nothing but animosity about it...I didn't want to do that.
• 24:34
  Speaker 0: then he reaches out his hand.
• 24:35
  Speaker 0: he says thanks man right.
• 24:40
  Speaker 0: And he's like, and you didn't do it right.
• 24:41
  Speaker 0: Right?
• 24:42
  Speaker 0: You didn't get our buy-in.
• 24:43
  Speaker 0: here is all the things that could have done
• 24:44
  Speaker 0: differently.".
• 24:46
  Speaker 0: It was great because he was absolutely right about all of his criticism... ...and it was absolutely at the right thing to do.
• 24:55
  Speaker 0: but I gotta tell ya during the execution phase we're just gonna... Because what it meant was think about as a business person.
• 25:07
  Speaker 0: We said were going defer revenue Like, we won't be able to make back our marketing expense for eleven months.
• 25:16
  Speaker 0: It took eleven months for a customer to payback what it cost us to acquire them.
• 25:20
  Speaker 0: so that meant We were gonna run in arrears four years Right?
• 25:27
  Speaker 0: So are.
• 25:28
  Speaker 0: and then we would.
• 25:29
  Speaker 0: every Friday we'd stand out the parking lot We'd hand out a piece of paper That was called The Metrics Meeting And we literally handed out the executive dashboard.
• 25:38
  Speaker 0: Here's how much money we have, here is what salaries cost and rent costs.
• 25:44
  Speaker 0: We literally went through the P&L and taught people to read
• 25:48
  Speaker 0: it.".
• 25:49
  Speaker 0: They were like yeah but doesn't this mean that they don't have any money?
• 25:57
  Speaker 0: It also meant if you went into hell in a handbasket which at the time possibly could've he would do slowly!
• 26:06
  Speaker 0: We wouldn't run out of money like on a Thursday, because the subscriptions would keep coming in for awhile.
• 26:11
  Speaker 0: I
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: briefly met Reid many years ago as we stayed at the same hotel and Berlin when he was on stage from an event.
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: just very briefly but if you look at skill sets people like him have to build something.
• 26:33
  Speaker 1: What's the right balance between being a bit crazy, being naive and also being very serious about doing business?
• 26:42
  Speaker 0: I didn't call Reed Crazy or Naive.
• 26:48
  Speaker 0: Here is why i kept working with him when i went to Netflix.
• 26:52
  Speaker 0: you know i had done another company with them And A really good friend of mine called me up.
• 26:57
  Speaker 0: I just heard that you're going to go do another company with re-tasting.
• 27:01
  Speaker 0: So, yeah she goes the animal and said oh did i call him?
• 27:06
  Speaker 0: She's like repeatedly!
• 27:09
  Speaker 0: You know...you told me working for him is like working under a magnifying glass on fire all day.
• 27:15
  Speaker 0: why would you do
• 27:16
  Speaker 0: that?!
• 27:16
  Speaker 0: And I'm not as good for anybody else.
• 27:21
  Speaker 0: he just expects so much from me and every time I achieve something.
• 27:26
  Speaker 0: great job Patty.
• 27:27
  Speaker 0: okay.
• 27:27
  Speaker 0: next I mean, literally he cannot put a period at the end of Great Job Patty's sentence.
• 27:36
  Speaker 0: He sent me an email once and said... You know?
• 27:38
  Speaker 0: The subject line was about something that I had advised him on And then he said you were right and i was wrong.
• 27:44
  Speaker 0: Read!
• 27:45
  Speaker 0: I printed it and I kept it in my wallet.
• 27:51
  Speaker 0: And like when he would make me crazy and pull it out, right?
• 27:55
  Speaker 0: One time you call him.
• 27:55
  Speaker 0: He's like what are doing?
• 27:56
  Speaker 0: I was right once that really was read went to bed every night wanting To wake up and be a better leader.
• 28:08
  Speaker 0: He is the one person i've known in my life who took leadership Really seriously paid attention to whether or not he was doing it right.
• 28:21
  Speaker 0: Now, I will take credit for some of it...I remember coming in one night and it was late.
• 28:28
  Speaker 0: It was dark like he and i were the only ones left And I walked in.
• 28:32
  Speaker 0: He's behind the computer The glow-of-his-computer.
• 28:34
  Speaker 0: I'm Like hey boss what are you doing?
• 28:35
  Speaker 0: You're getting ready For the presentation tomorrow at a company meeting.
• 28:39
  Speaker 0: Yeah Right!
• 28:40
  Speaker 0: And go behind him like No you're NOT.
• 28:43
  Speaker 0: You're writing code.
• 28:45
  Speaker 0: Well there is bugs In this system.
• 28:47
  Speaker 0: Somebody has got to fix that.
• 28:48
  Speaker 0: Really, you know that would be the hundred and fifty people.
• 28:53
  Speaker 0: I've just busted my ass hiring not this CEO And i said goddammit read.
• 28:59
  Speaker 0: if You want them to follow then?
• 29:00
  Speaker 0: You better lead i'm Not kidding like This is this is bunk.
• 29:06
  Speaker 0: People are counting on you To inspire them and this Is non inspirational for you to Be here.
• 29:11
  Speaker 0: bug fixing he's like any said to me was Like it's time For you.
• 29:14
  Speaker 0: go home now but bye Go Home good night.
• 29:17
  Speaker 0: And the next day I come in, he's in a suit.
• 29:19
  Speaker 0: Now this doesn't
• 29:20
  Speaker 0: happen.".
• 29:21
  Speaker 0: I'm like, do you have an interview?
• 29:25
  Speaker 0: He stood up and it was standing o'—he had stayed up all night... ...and I thought, wow!
• 29:36
  Speaker 0: Really, that is what we need to work with.
• 29:43
  Speaker 0: when he got there people would have followed him off the face of the earth, right?
• 29:49
  Speaker 0: And so together in those early days our yin and yang relationship was really effective.
• 29:59
  Speaker 0: Because let's take that conversation as a great example You got to do the right thing for the company.
• 30:16
  Speaker 0: And, The Right Thing For The Company is not just sit here and write code.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: In the upcoming age of AI being able To Do Almost Anything How do you select the right people to work?
• 30:33
  Speaker 0: I don't know... I think that the People who Think They've Figured it out are the wrong people.
• 30:41
  Speaker 0: That's all i Know Who the Wrong People Are And the wrong people are the people that aren't going to come into the organization and go, yeah I've been using it.
• 30:50
  Speaker 0: Let me...I got
• 30:51
  Speaker 0: this.".
• 30:52
  Speaker 0: Do
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: we have to relearn work?
• 30:55
  Speaker 0: Yeah but we should always relearn Work!
• 30:59
  Speaker 0: That's my philosophy which is like you know i came out here and did a talk with some HR people.
• 31:11
  Speaker 0: pinch their little heads off, as my mama would say.
• 31:14
  Speaker 0: I just wanna paint your little head's off like stop it!
• 31:17
  Speaker 0: Like how come I have to keep coming out here?
• 31:22
  Speaker 0: Where is the... You know what?
• 31:24
  Speaker 0: I heard this interview with Gloria Steinem last week and somebody said to her are you thinking about passing The Torch right?
• 31:35
  Speaker 0: And she said oh well i'm not giving up My Torch And maybe that's my job now, right?
• 31:45
  Speaker 0: I mean we always have to reinvent work because we have to re-invent the world that we're living in.
• 31:51
  Speaker 0: and so That's my frustration particularly with HR people is Really seriously.
• 31:58
  Speaker 0: you can make a case for doing things the way.
• 32:00
  Speaker 0: We've always done it in this world like It's not effective The end whether... So A we don't measure.
• 32:10
  Speaker 0: So that's one thing about HR stuff is people never go, did that work or not?
• 32:14
  Speaker 0: But last year's global HR initiative.
• 32:16
  Speaker 0: And the second thing is we don't ever stop!
• 32:22
  Speaker 0: We just add more and add more...and so it's ...we're a hindrance to the agility of the company.
• 32:31
  Speaker 0: now That's bad-bad things.
• 32:34
  Speaker 0: When people like Don't Invite You To The Seat At The Table It's because you don't deserve to be there.
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: What would you say is the most important lesson someone else taught you?
• 32:47
  Speaker 0: Oh, there's so many.
• 32:53
  Speaker 0: Probably that it's okay to speak my mind even when I'm gonna be met with resistance.
• 33:04
  Speaker 0: and i am saying that because... ...I didn't have the tools to do it better Right, and so the feedback was good because I had to do it better.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: Thank you very much!
• 33:17
  Speaker 0: You're very welcome.
• 33:18
  Speaker 0: It's wonderful to be here.
• 33:19
  Speaker 0: Have a nice time in Helsinki.
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: Enjoy the city.
• 33:22
  Speaker 0: Bye
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: Gin and Talk is a podcast from Forty-Eight Forward, produced in the Forty Eight Forward studios of Munich.