Latest / Rusty's Garage / Alister McRae - Part 1

Transcript

Alister McRae - Part 1 · Rusty's Garage

• 0:02
  A listener production.
• 0:14
  I'm automotive commentator and journalist Greg Rust, and this is Rusty's Garage.
• 0:24
  I'm Rusty's Garage.
• 0:27
  I recorded with this guest in recent weeks before heading overseas.
• 0:31
  I'm in the south of France now and there is a fitting link of sorts.
• 0:36
  Although it's the European summer here at the moment, in January each year the roads nearby play host to the legendary Monte Carlo Rally, which these days signals the start of a new season of the WRC.
• 0:50
  Alistair McRae is from a proper rally family.
• 0:54
  His dad is a legend, particularly here in Europe and in the UK especially.
• 0:59
  His late brother Colin was a superstar who was breathtakingly fast and famously lent his voice and name to video games that helped make rally more mainstream.
• 1:11
  But Alistair didn't ride any coattails as such.
• 1:14
  Nothing was handed to the boys on their rally journey.
• 1:17
  And he did some hard yards which served him well.
• 1:21
  The hands-on time spent prepping gave him a good understanding of the car beneath him, as you'll hear.
• 1:27
  And although he might be a self-described late bloomer, he made it all the way to the WRC, when one of the big-name Korean manufacturers was first putting its toe in the Rally water, so to speak.
• 1:40
  From the iconic cars that inspired him during his dad's time in the British Championship to fighting for production world titles.
• 1:48
  And the next generation McRae rally driver taking on the world.
• 1:54
  Oh, and why West Australia is now home for the proud Scotsman too.
• 1:58
  Plus, getting to drive a special Subaru once campaigned by Possum Bourne
• 2:04
  and a little love of two wheels that you may not know about.
• 2:07
  A quick thanks to those of you who have messaged asking us to get Alistair on in the past year or so.
• 2:13
  Good suggestion.
• 2:15
  It's overdue, but we got there.
• 2:17
  Right, countdown clock has started.
• 2:19
  It's launch time.
• 2:20
  Stage one with Alistair McRae.
• 2:23
  Enjoy the convo.
• 2:27
  Alistair, firstly, welcome to the podcast.
• 2:29
  It's awesome.
• 2:30
  Well overdue that we got you on.
• 2:31
  Thank you.
• 2:32
  Good to be here.
• 2:33
  I am very proud of my Scottish ancestry.
• 2:36
  You are the second Scot to join us in our podcast library after the great John Cleland.
• 2:44
  Tell me about early life for you where you grew up.
• 2:47
  Is it Atlantic?
• 2:48
  Am I saying that right?
• 2:50
  Yeah, Lanark, that's only probably 30 minutes from John Cleland.
• 2:57
  He's now down, I think he's now down further away in Gala Shields, but basically we grew up in Lanark, which my dad actually drove with Bill Cleland, who was John's father.
• 3:11
  Oh, well...
• 3:13
  Bill run the General Motors GM, so the Vauxhall race team, rally team.
• 3:18
  So there's a bit of a connection there, not just the fact that we're Scottish.
• 3:21
  Definitely.
• 3:22
  Now, I mean, on your own side, people know proper, proper rally family upbringing for you.
• 3:29
  We want to get to your son, Max, a little bit later in this conversation.
• 3:33
  But are you now kind of seeing your dad's status, perhaps his achievements, right?
• 3:41
  maybe through his eyes, because I think he's seen the reaction in Europe and the UK to Jimmy, your dad, when he turns up at events.
• 3:50
  And Gramps has done some cool things.
• 3:52
  I think Max is realising that.
• 3:54
  Is that right?
• 3:55
  Yeah, no, for sure.
• 3:56
  I mean, because Max was brought up pretty much here in Perth and Australia, we moved here when he was only just turning three.
• 4:04
  So his kind of motorsport would be go-kart track.
• 4:08
  When we were back in the UK, the odd rally, but not really much.
• 4:12
  He wasn't brought up in a motorsport environment, really, apart from his go-kart or motorbike and whatever.
• 4:17
  And I think we went back to Donegal rally two years ago.
• 4:21
  which would be Max's first event outside of Australia and Donegal's, I would say, one of the biggest events in Ireland for sure.
• 4:29
  We went there.
• 4:31
  I mean, I think that just the fact, the amount of people, the amount of cars, that blows mine.
• 4:34
  But then we were walking down the street and there's cars going everywhere, people everywhere, and there's a cop standing in the middle of the road and we're just kind of walking down the side, had to cross the road, and the cop looked up and went, Jimmy, Jimmy, Jimmy, hold on.
• 4:50
  Stopped the traffic.
• 4:51
  and guided us through.
• 4:53
  So at that point, Max, he's just kind of dropped.
• 4:57
  And I said, see, he's a little royalty here, son.
• 4:59
  He's like, just looking at his gramps going, this is a new level altogether.
• 5:03
  So I think it's not for Max until he went there and see, you know, rallying's a pretty small sport in Australia.
• 5:10
  Yeah.
• 5:11
  But when you go back to the UK and especially to Ireland, then yeah, it's a massive sport.
• 5:16
  And obviously in Ireland, my dad's classed as kind of rallying royalty there.
• 5:20
  Absolutely.
• 5:21
  Now we used to have a sports show in Australia on the weekends.
• 5:24
  It was called Widewater Sports and they would play highlights of the British Rally Championship.
• 5:29
  And I reckon I've got Alistair, some crook VHS is somewhere of the British Rally Championship.
• 5:34
  Jimmy, your dad was probably in a Sierra Cosworth in, what were the cars when you were younger that he was competing in that you went, man, that's cool.
• 5:45
  Yeah, I think there was probably more than one.
• 5:48
  I think the first,
• 5:50
  Probably the first time I actually went and got to sit in a rally car and go to Essendon would be the Vauxhall Chevette.
• 5:55
  So that would be probably the A, 1980 maybe, 1881.
• 6:00
  That was obviously really cool.
• 6:02
  Then you went to the Mantas.
• 6:05
  And then the first time I sat in a Metro 6R4.
• 6:09
  managed to bunk off school as you do to go to test for the Scottish Rally.
• 6:14
  And that was pretty serious.
• 6:16
  Then you get into the Sarah Cosworths.
• 6:20
  And then obviously then from then it was my dad kind of stepped back a bit and Colin and I come through.
• 6:25
  So I think all of these cars, he did have his own, the Chevette of his own.
• 6:30
  He's got a Magnum at the moment of his own.
• 6:31
  So these cars are still about.
• 6:35
  Awesome.
• 6:36
  How old were you when you went for that first ride with him?
• 6:39
  I'd probably be nine, I reckon, maybe nine.
• 6:41
  That's the first one I really remember.
• 6:43
  I could have been in cars before then, but I don't remember that much.
• 6:46
  What effect did it have on you?
• 6:47
  I mean, clearly a very impactful one.
• 6:50
  Yeah, no, I mean, it's, I think...
• 6:52
  because I was brought up, you know, he was always away on events, away on events a lot.
• 6:57
  He did have a plumbing and heating business in, Lanark.
• 6:59
  So when he came back, he was just normal, you know, working dad.
• 7:03
  But then he would disappear off.
• 7:05
  And then when he come back, you know, he'd done the rallies.
• 7:07
  We used to watch it on Sunday Grandstand back in the UK.
• 7:12
  So then, you know, if there was any chance at all of getting on an event to watch or, you know,
• 7:17
  better still getting to a test, then you wanted to do that.
• 7:19
  Mega.
• 7:20
  When I look at your own CV, there was a time, I think, early on in your career where you drove a Sierra Cosworth 2, did you not?
• 7:26
  What was that thing like?
• 7:28
  I know it was a great car.
• 7:29
  Obviously, there's one car that we've still got in the family, which is the Sierra Cosworth.
• 7:35
  Colin drove it, my dad drove it, and then I drove it at an event.
• 7:38
  So Dad used to kind of dangle the car at it.
• 7:40
  I was driving the Vauxhall Nova at the time.
• 7:43
  in the Scottish Championship.
• 7:44
  And the deal was, if you can win the championship before the end of the season, you can get out in the Cosworth for the final round.
• 7:51
  So it was a case of, I've got to get this 1300 Group A championship tied up.
• 7:57
  And then got out in the Sarah.
• 7:58
  So jumping from a 1300 front-wheel drive Nova
• 8:02
  And to rear wheel drive, 330, 340 horsepower Sierra Cosworth was a massive change, but obviously a lot of fun, especially when you're only 18.
• 8:12
  Mega, mega.
• 8:13
  Hey, we've jumped forward a little bit, but in a good way.
• 8:16
  Am I right in saying it's actually two wheels that got things underway for you?
• 8:18
  Was it dirt bikes and things to begin with?
• 8:20
  Yeah, it was trials and then motocross.
• 8:24
  Probably more motocross than trials.
• 8:27
  My dad actually, he did a lot of motocross or scrambles, it was called then, when he was younger.
• 8:32
  And then kind of gave up on that when he bought the plumbing and heating business in case he injured himself.
• 8:38
  So there was always bikes around about.
• 8:40
  But from a young age, I mean, I enjoyed and I still do.
• 8:43
  I still enduro, still go to the motocross track.
• 8:46
  I think bikes are my, probably bikes are actually, believe it or not, my first love and rallying kind of came second to that.
• 8:53
  Did it?
• 8:54
  I mean, that sort of naturally leads me to, you know, often sports people or motivational speakers and so on will talk about no plan B.
• 9:04
  right?
• 9:04
  You only got your plan A and you focus on that and you just put all your eggs in that basket, right?
• 9:08
  Was it always that way for you that you wanted to be a competitive sports person, be it bikes or rallying?
• 9:14
  Or was there another thing you were taking aim at?
• 9:17
  No, for me, I think it was all...
• 9:19
  I didn't go into...
• 9:21
  bikes or into rallying, you know, thinking this is going to be a profession.
• 9:25
  It was more of, I just really, I loved riding bikes.
• 9:28
  And then after a couple of injuries and operations in these, it was my mum convinced me I should maybe try rallying.
• 9:35
  She never liked bikes at all.
• 9:38
  And then because of the family background, because of my dad, because Colin was in it, I was always going to have a go at rallying.
• 9:44
  But when I started rallying, it wasn't like, you know, it wasn't a case of, you know, this is going to be my career.
• 9:48
  I'm going to make a profession of it.
• 9:49
  It was...
• 9:50
  It's a cool thing to do.
• 9:52
  Let's have a go at it.
• 9:54
  Once you get the bug and once you start to get the feel for it and realise that you are reasonably good at it to start with, then you start to think, well, this is maybe better than going to the steelworks every morning at 6.30.
• 10:08
  When was that moment for you when you sort of thought, oh, far out, maybe I can stitch something together here?
• 10:15
  I think probably towards the end of my third year was doing the GSI, the Nova GSI challenge.
• 10:22
  First two years we won the championship, the 1300, moved into the 1600.
• 10:26
  It was the first year of that.
• 10:27
  And there was a lot of problems with the car, with a lot of retirements, mechanical issues.
• 10:33
  So it was a really bad year.
• 10:35
  But off the back of the year, the Shell Scholarship was announced where they trialed.
• 10:41
  There were six of us.
• 10:43
  down to Silverson get invited down and it was a weekend and then it was it wasn't a paid drive the following year but it was a fully supported drive in the British Championship in Group N and I won that there was Richard Byrne was there Mark Higgins Robbie Head Dommy Buckley there were six of us so I won that and I think it was at that point
• 11:06
  I thought there is actually a potential here to make a living of it.
• 11:10
  Colin had signed with, I think it was Subaru at the time.
• 11:14
  So up until then we had been, it was sponsorship, run the cars yourself, put everything you've got into it.
• 11:20
  And then all of a sudden, the car was provided.
• 11:23
  He arrived in the event, he did a proper test prior to it.
• 11:26
  So I think for me at that point, it was like, well, I've been against the best of the young guys in Britain at the time.
• 11:33
  I've won it.
• 11:34
  and I've got this opportunity.
• 11:35
  I think it was probably round about then.
• 11:38
  And then when I ran out of holidays at the steelworks and asked for some more, and he said, no, you've either got to become a man and work or go and play in your cars.
• 11:46
  I decided I would go and play in cars.
• 11:48
  Cars.
• 11:49
  I'm glad you brought up a Shell scholarship there.
• 11:51
  That's a little something that filters through the conversation from time to time.
• 11:55
  It helped.
• 11:55
  a similar style of thing, help Greg Murphy on his way up through the ranks in touring cars and so on.
• 12:01
  How important is that stuff?
• 12:02
  And do you look at that now, particularly with your own son's career and, you know, the need for that kind of, you know, foundational kind of support to help them take that next step?
• 12:13
  Yeah.
• 12:13
  I mean, I think it's very important and I don't think there's probably not as much now as there was back then.
• 12:19
  I think the, the,
• 12:21
  It's like any sport.
• 12:22
  The sport has become more of a business.
• 12:25
  And as it becomes more of a business, the people that get involved, it's all about returning investment.
• 12:30
  I mean, back then, Dave Thomas, who was the head of Shell Motorsport, you know, if my dad was doing an event somewhere, he could phone up Dave and say, you know, but,
• 12:40
  struggling a bit for sponsorship here.
• 12:41
  Is there any chance you can throw a bit of cash in?
• 12:43
  It'll get me to here or it'll get the boys to this event.
• 12:47
  And he was always able to find, he always had to put money somewhere he could find sponsorship.
• 12:51
  I think these days are pretty much gone now.
• 12:55
  And it's definitely, it's harder, I think, for any young guy.
• 13:00
  to get the support into the sport, and there's not so many of the Shell scholarships, or when I started, it was the Vauxhall Bonus Award.
• 13:09
  So when I run the Nova, you know, you won the class, and you got, I think it was £350 for the class.
• 13:15
  If you won Group A, there was another £300 on there, so you could actually go on a weekend on a Scottish Championship event and get a grand, you know, and that's, whatever that is, a long time ago now, 35 years ago.
• 13:27
  So...
• 13:28
  These opportunities made it, it was never easy, but it made it more, my potential to get in the sport was slightly easier.
• 13:35
  Now it is for sure.
• 13:36
  It's a bit more difficult.
• 13:38
  Did the family name and the maybe level of expectation that came with that ever weigh on your shoulders or was it not something you thought about?
• 13:46
  I think it probably didn't weigh in my shoulders.
• 13:51
  It did at certain points in the career.
• 13:53
  It was almost like you wish...
• 13:55
  you weren't the son of Jimmy and the brother of Colin because there were opportunities that you hoped that you would get and you didn't quite get them because I think at one point it was a case of, you know, Alistair Gooden, he's won the British Championship, he's won some Formula 2 in the World Championship, but, you know, what's the chances of two brothers in the same family having the ability to go to that top level in the World Championship?
• 14:17
  So at that point there was a few times...
• 14:20
  where that was a bit of a hindrance.
• 14:22
  And also teammates that Colin had weren't that keen on having me next.
• 14:28
  So there were times for sure.
• 14:31
  If it wasn't for the McRae name, I'd never have got that initial step and got in there.
• 14:36
  But then I think it would have been probably easier not to be McRae later on in my career.
• 14:40
  Gotcha, gotcha.
• 14:41
  You can't change your name.
• 14:43
  Well, I guess you could if you wanted, but...
• 14:46
  I think you should be proud of it, and I know you are.
• 14:48
  Hey, did you both go about it in a different fashion?
• 14:51
  Were you kind of cut the same way in the way you went about your rallying, you and Colin?
• 14:56
  I would say Colin was more – Colin definitely, he was going to be a professional rally driver.
• 15:01
  He, from the very start, that's what he wanted to do.
• 15:04
  So he did bikes the same as me, but as soon as he could get in a car –
• 15:08
  He started in auto tests at 16.
• 15:10
  In the UK, you couldn't actually drive a rally car until you had a road license.
• 15:15
  So there was no starting.
• 15:17
  Now in the Scandinavian countries, you can start at 14.
• 15:20
  But you had to wait until you were 17.
• 15:22
  But you could do autocross, auto tests at 16.
• 15:26
  So Colin was straight in there.
• 15:28
  Whereas I continued on with bikes with his.
• 15:31
  I think he definitely wanted, he had a direction sooner than I did.
• 15:36
  But then as far as once we were in rallying, it was pretty much the same thing.
• 15:40
  You know, you wanted to be, you want to be the best.
• 15:43
  You want to be the best at what you were doing, whether it was in a Formula 2 car, a Group A car, a World Rally car.
• 15:49
  So I think from that side of it, once we were in there at a professional level, it was very much similar.
• 15:55
  As parents, and you're going through this probably now, I mean, you want to always encourage your kids.
• 16:00
  There's that element of letting the kids kind of find their own feet in that way too.
• 16:05
  How did Jimmy approach it with you boys?
• 16:07
  And was it a case of, you know, letting you be hungry and chase it and so on?
• 16:14
  Oh yeah, for sure, you had to chase it.
• 16:15
  There was no...
• 16:16
  I think my first event, or Colin's first event, he organised himself with one of the guys in the car club while we were actually off on a family holiday.
• 16:25
  I would still have been 14 or whatever.
• 16:27
  And Colin actually went to one of the local guys in the car club and said, look, I'll give you some money if I can drive your car.
• 16:34
  It was a single venue event, so you can do, you know, two drivers and you swap back and forward.
• 16:40
  And then for me, it was...
• 16:42
  Once I sold the motocross bike, it was a case of, you know, I really want to try rallying.
• 16:49
  So there was a car there that we could use.
• 16:51
  And I did the same event that Colin did.
• 16:54
  But from then on, it was a case of, you know, if you're serious about it and you want to enjoy this, then you need to get yourself a Nova.
• 17:00
  You need to build the Nova in the garage, put the roll cage in, the seats, the belts.
• 17:04
  You've got to do all that.
• 17:05
  If you're willing to put the effort in, then he would help you.
• 17:07
  But if you didn't put the effort in, then, you know, it was a case of, well, that's all right.
• 17:11
  You don't need to do it.
• 17:13
  But if you put the effort in, then he helped for sure.
• 17:25
  From one seriously fast rally driver to another, make sure you check out the Chris Atkinson episode at some stage too.
• 17:33
  They say 0 to 100 in under 2 seconds.
• 17:36
  Really, it was just over that.
• 17:38
  But with the amount of grip we had, that was still pretty quick.
• 17:42
  And it's more they just keep going.
• 17:43
  You just keep picking gears.
• 17:47
  You could say you pick gears nearly as fast as you can.
• 17:52
  Akko made it to the WRC with Subaru, drove Rallycross and more.
• 17:56
  Meanwhile, our Rusty is hoping to make it to the World Championship for the car noises he perfected as a kid.
• 18:03
  So special.
• 18:04
  I hope there's no Scottish impersonations coming up, we want to keep Alistair McRae in a library.
• 18:12
  What were you like on the mechanical side and what were you like on the business side?
• 18:17
  When, you know, trying to chase a bit of support, calling up Shell for a bit of help, whatever it may have been.
• 18:21
  For the mechanical side, it wasn't a problem.
• 18:23
  You know, I built modern cars for the first few years and actually had...
• 18:27
  When I was turning semi-professional, we had McCray Motorsports.
• 18:31
  We used to build cars and run cars for other people as well.
• 18:34
  So that side of it was not a problem.
• 18:36
  The sponsorship side, for sure, is difficult.
• 18:39
  But you were generally speaking to people that knew the name, that had been in the sport for a long time, knew my dad.
• 18:45
  So that side of it was a little bit easier.
• 18:48
  But for sure, the mechanical side was a lot easier working in a garage than getting into a boardroom.
• 18:52
  Yeah.
• 18:54
  When you look at your CV, there were times along the way, Alistair, too, where you were clearly, based on what you were just talking about there on the mechanical side, where you were actively involved in the development of the cars as well.
• 19:04
  And I immediately think of Hyundai and maybe even Mitsubishi, too.
• 19:08
  Did you enjoy that?
• 19:09
  Were you good at that side of developing and ironing out the cars?
• 19:13
  Yeah, I think very much so.
• 19:15
  When you build your own car, run your own cars, people say they're going testing, but they're really just going for a plane in the rally car.
• 19:21
  Once you get to a level where you're within a professional team and working with engineers and so on in the background, it's a really interesting part of the sport.
• 19:32
  It's sometimes not the most rewarding because you can spend three days,
• 19:37
  in Sweden freezing your nuts off and you don't actually get a lot of running because they're they're wanting to test different diffs or different gearboxes or you have a problem so
• 19:45
  But when you test the car and you're developing it and the car gets quicker, that's the satisfying bit.
• 19:53
  Going to a new event, knowing that you're potentially two tenths a kilometre faster than you were in the previous rally.
• 20:00
  If memory serves, early on in the WRC, you were involved, you talked about it before, the BF2 cars and so on, Hyundai Coupe.
• 20:06
  I reckon Dean Herridge and I can recall you bringing that thing into service, maybe at Rally Australia somewhere, and the tyres, mate, were down to the canvas.
• 20:15
  I mean that was one of the biggest issues with Formula 2 was keeping tyres on.
• 20:22
  On a hot event like Australia I think worst of all would have been in Acropolis in Greece.
• 20:28
  We actually got to the end of one of the stages and we had two punctures because it had actually gone through to the canvas.
• 20:37
  So you changed, you put the spare on one side, you put a rear from the rear onto the other side and then drove it back to service on three tyres just to get back to the service.
• 20:47
  So, you know, when you've got, back then it was kind of 250 horsepower, but just through two front wheels, the tyre wear in these cars is worse than it was in a World Rally car.
• 20:58
  Amazing.
• 20:58
  I mean, WRC is obviously the ultimate goal for anyone, right?
• 21:01
  But what about a front-wheel drive car, that kind of horsepower through the front wheels?
• 21:07
  What was that thing like to drive?
• 21:09
  They were really good.
• 21:10
  I think when the British Championship went Formula 2 in 1994,
• 21:17
  Everybody said it was, you know, the spectators, the people you talk with in motorsport, you know, said it was going to be a failure, it was going to be a disaster.
• 21:24
  That next six, seven years was the best years in the British Championship for probably since the kind of 70s, 80s.
• 21:33
  And the cars, if you went to the right place to watch, if you went and watched a two-wheel drive car out of a hairpin uphill, it's not that exciting.
• 21:40
  But you watch it coming downhill to the hairpin, then the speed you would carry in these cars downhill or on the fast-flowing stuff was... For me, it was still some of my best times in rallying.
• 21:52
  And we had, at that time, I think there were six manufacturers competing...
• 21:56
  two drivers on each team, maybe even three.
• 21:58
  So, you know, it was a seriously competitive time and the cars were real good fun to drive.
• 22:04
  If memory serves too, a bit of success for you in that.
• 22:07
  And I'm talking to you as we record this from New Zealand.
• 22:10
  I've just come back from what they call the Southern Lights rally down on the South Island.
• 22:15
  But you had that thing hooked up pretty well on the North Island roads when you came over.
• 22:20
  And you enjoyed that too, didn't you?
• 22:21
  Yeah, yeah.
• 22:22
  That was the first time in New Zealand that was with a Hyundai with the F2 cars.
• 22:26
  It was myself and Kenneth Erickson.
• 22:29
  And the...
• 22:31
  Coming from Europe and some of the events we'd done and arriving to New Zealand and how smooth the roads are, how great they are to drive on, how fast they are.
• 22:41
  I was having a ball and I think it was maybe the end of the first stage.
• 22:46
  We'd actually taken nearly a second a kilometre out of Kenneth who'd just come from Subaru.
• 22:52
  And I mean, I was, the smile was from year to year.
• 22:55
  And Dave Senior turned around to me and just said, I think we might need to calm it down a bit, Al.
• 23:00
  I was like, why?
• 23:03
  We did later on in that event rip a wheel off.
• 23:05
  We actually ripped two wheels off.
• 23:07
  We still actually won.
• 23:09
  But that was my first taste of these roads in New Zealand.
• 23:13
  And it's still, it's an event.
• 23:15
  When you go down and do an event in New Zealand, it's amazing.
• 23:17
  It's a great experience.
• 23:19
  There's a little bit of continued synergy with you and NZ, which I'll come to in a second.
• 23:23
  But I also, in the bowels of the memory, think of...
• 23:29
  Colin getting that breakthrough win in the legacy there.
• 23:32
  And I think they wanted to ensure that the legacy was a winning car before they moved Subaru to the next B.
• 23:38
  So he got that breakthrough there.
• 23:41
  Were you in a pub in England when this was all?
• 23:44
  Scotland.
• 23:44
  Scotland, come on, get it.
• 23:46
  Sorry, sorry.
• 23:48
  Centre of the known universe.
• 23:49
  You're in a pub.
• 23:51
  We had been at the pub with a few of the boys and then we went back to mate's house.
• 23:56
  And we just kept it going with the time difference to keep on or keep ourself awake, which meant we could have a few more beers until Colin obviously won it.
• 24:04
  And it wasn't this.
• 24:05
  I mean, now you sit and watch it on the Internet and the times come through as it comes through the stages.
• 24:10
  It wasn't quite as sophisticated back then in 94.
• 24:14
  You have, though.
• 24:15
  Yeah.
• 24:16
  Been to NZ on occasion, beyond what you've just talked about in the WRC there.
• 24:21
  You've been entrusted, I think, with an ex-possum-born WRX.
• 24:25
  You and I saw each other at Rod Millen's Leadfoot Festival, among other things.
• 24:29
  You've enjoyed driving that beast too, haven't you?
• 24:32
  Yeah, no, I mean, it's obviously to drive that car that was possums in New Zealand with the history and stuff is great.
• 24:39
  But the fact of the car now, the car is basically, it's a WRC car from 99, and it's identical to what it was then apart from, it's got Riger suspension on it, but it's also got 800 horsepower and can be turned up to 900.
• 24:53
  So...
• 24:55
  the first time I drove it on the race to the sky on the gravel, it was, I think, you couldn't take the smile off my face, but I also couldn't keep my leg from shaking as well because actually at one point there, you were pulling the rev limiter,
• 25:11
  uphill at 150 mile an hour on gravel and it's you still get the feeling of the the sheer speed and the way the car you could make the car dance it's so much horsepower that even in fifth and sixth gear you could you could throw the car in sideways knowing that there's enough power to slide it through the corner it's a it's a pretty amazing car that's wild and that's an incredible piece of road that what was that thing like was i mean you've
• 25:35
  I'm asking for a continued description of it here.
• 25:40
  Is that the most grunt you've had in a rally car?
• 25:42
  That's wild.
• 25:43
  Yeah, but a long way.
• 25:45
  It's a massive mountain.
• 25:46
  The first time we, because I literally arrived, went down there.
• 25:51
  Obviously, I knew Craig from previously, but met some of the boys, the mechanics.
• 25:55
  I knew from events, other events, but I hadn't actually worked with them.
• 25:58
  And then jumped into the car to give it a run down the road.
• 26:02
  And I can still remember the first time we put the anti-lag on.
• 26:05
  And just on the main road, obviously not breaking speed limits, of course.
• 26:09
  and the acceleration and the speed i kind of looked at paul sitting next to him i went i swear are you allowed to swear on here yes you can go for it i was like it was like fucking hell that's quicky that's alistair that that's only in three it goes up to 10 in the boost i went no fucking way so that like they just like some it's unbelievable uh to drive it and then
• 26:32
  obviously to win was great, but then to be asked back and to do, you know, lead foot where you're on asphalt, it's, on the gravel, it was awesome.
• 26:41
  It was amazing fun.
• 26:42
  On asphalt, it's every bit as much fun, but it's actually frightening the places because it gets so much grip and so much horsepower.
• 26:49
  And on that, it's a fairly technical piece of road he's got down there, Rod.
• 26:52
  Yeah, yeah.
• 26:53
  So it's, you've got to keep your wits about you down there.
• 26:56
  I can vividly recall it hooking up immediately, mate.
• 26:58
  Pretty, pretty amazing thing.
• 27:00
  Co-drivers.
• 27:01
  You had a great partnership with David Senior.
• 27:04
  If that strikes a bit, it was like 15 years too or something, wasn't it?
• 27:08
  Yeah.
• 27:09
  David actually sat with me in, I think, my second or third event.
• 27:13
  I did a couple of events.
• 27:16
  I think it was towards the end of 88 and it was actually in Collins, Old Nova.
• 27:21
  Then we built my car for the Scottish Championship for the year after and was looking for a co-driver that would come in and do the championship.
• 27:30
  Dave Senior, south of England, but he's kind of sparked up a friendship with Robert Reid.
• 27:37
  And Robert said, look, there's this English guy
• 27:41
  don't hold that against him.
• 27:42
  An English guy that's keen to sit in.
• 27:44
  So he did the Galloway Hills with me at the end of 88.
• 27:47
  We've gone really well.
• 27:48
  We actually retired.
• 27:49
  The coil packed in, we retired.
• 27:52
  And then, yep, we'll give it a go in the Scorys Championship.
• 27:55
  And that was from 88 right through to 2008.
• 28:00
  really, 2005.
• 28:02
  So, you know, a good number of years.
• 28:05
  Amazing.
• 28:05
  Were you good for your co-drivers?
• 28:07
  I mean, they're typically the most organised human beings I've ever come across.
• 28:11
  Did you do all the right things, turn up on time, et cetera, et cetera?
• 28:15
  I see, I wasn't bad, but I would...
• 28:21
  I was generally pretty punctual, but I would always leave it till the last minute.
• 28:24
  If I came downstairs from the room for breakfast and we were supposed to be there at 7.15, it was actually 7.14.
• 28:30
  I wouldn't go in.
• 28:32
  I would make him wait.
• 28:33
  So he thought I was sleeping in and then go in.
• 28:37
  But I reckon I probably wasn't too bad as far as drivers go.
• 28:48
  That's the end of part one of my feature-length podcast with Alistair McRae, but we're not done yet.
• 28:53
  There's a second stage, a second leg, if you like, all loaded up in our Rusty's Garage library whenever you are ready.
• 29:00
  From working with Hyundai when it first got serious about World Rally...
• 29:04
  to the training business in WA he now drives and the emergence of his son Max, another generation of McRae in rallying, climbing the ladder and rung by rung edging closer to the WRC.
• 29:20
  It's all ahead here on Rusty's Garage.