Latest / Drive with John Perlman / How is actionsa tracking in the 2026 Municipal Elections?

Transcript

How is actionsa tracking in the 2026 Municipal Elections? · Drive with John Perlman

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  Speaker 1: A picture. Follow the local government directions on 702 Drive
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  Speaker 1: with John Perlman.
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  Speaker 2: Right, let's focus our attention now on one of the
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  Speaker 2: other parties that is going to have a significant say,
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  Speaker 2: particularly in Gauteng and particularly in the metros, in the
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  Speaker 2: makeup of coalitions and what happens after votes are counted
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  Speaker 2: and the hard talking and horse trading begins. Let's welcome
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  Speaker 2: 2702 Drive, Michael Beaumont, who's National Chairperson of Action SA.
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  Speaker 1: Mr. Beaumont, welcome and thanks very much for giving us
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  Speaker 1: your time.
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  Speaker 3: John, always great to be with you. Please call me Michael,
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  Speaker 3: by the way, otherwise it's going to be Mr. Perlman
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  Speaker 3: in response.
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  Speaker 2: All right.
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  Speaker 1: Well, see how we do. I'm a formal kind of guy.
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  Speaker 2: People always ask me to drop the formality, but I
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  Speaker 2: must admit it's a habit of 28 years.
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  Speaker 1: But let's get into the issues and let me ask
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  Speaker 1: you this.
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  Speaker 2: 16% of the vote so far in Joburg, 16% of
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  Speaker 2: the vote so far in Kuraleni, 23% of the vote
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  Speaker 2: in Tswanes so far, and around 16% across Gauteng. I
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  Speaker 2: know that these numbers don't translate in the direct way
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  Speaker 2: that they would in a national or provincial election, but
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  Speaker 2: you got in Gauteng around 4.2% in Gauteng, as I
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  Speaker 2: recall it, in 2024.
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  Speaker 1: It's a significant, significant turnaround.
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  Speaker 2: Do you know why and are you surprised on the
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  Speaker 2: upside or is this what you thought, yeah, this is
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  Speaker 2: coming confidently down the pipeline?
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  Speaker 3: Well, the turnaround is even bigger than that because a
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  Speaker 3: lot of the numbers that you're seeing reflected on the
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  Speaker 3: screen do not reflect many of the strong vote bases
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  Speaker 3: of Action SA that have not yet been captured into
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  Speaker 3: the system. So we expect that number to continue growing.
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  Speaker 3: And I think it comes down to a few things.
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  Speaker 3: It was very important for Action SA to stand on
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  Speaker 3: its own two feet after we had been associated with
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  Speaker 3: that multi-party charter for South Africa, which was a toxic
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  Speaker 3: association for us. It was very important for us to
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  Speaker 3: gain a municipality where we could demonstrate value and to
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  Speaker 3: be able to unseat a failed mayor in Tswane and
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  Speaker 3: put in place Dr. Nsipi Moya, notwithstanding the challenges that
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  Speaker 3: persist in that municipality we were.
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  Speaker 1: Very alive to, the progress.
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  Speaker 3: that has happened under her mayoralty has very clearly been
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  Speaker 3: spoken of by the residents in their votes in these elections.
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  Speaker 3: And I think importantly as well, it's about doing the
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  Speaker 3: right things consistently over time. I think the way politics
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  Speaker 3: works is it's not a binary whether people support you
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  Speaker 3: or not. There were a lot of people who liked
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  Speaker 3: Action SA and voted for other parties in 2024, but
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  Speaker 3: you don't get points for being someone's second choice. I
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  Speaker 3: think what's happened is that those parties, those people's first choice.
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  Speaker 1: Have driven off a cliff.
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  Speaker 3: To continue this metaphor, and Action SA became their first
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  Speaker 3: choice in these elections by doing the right things consistently
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  Speaker 3: and over time.
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  Speaker 1: People want change.
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  Speaker 2: Let's focus our attention on the metros in Gauteng, just
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  Speaker 2: as a good way of framing the conversation. I know
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  Speaker 2: that you are focused on other parts of the country
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  Speaker 2: as well. But if we keep it to Gauteng and
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  Speaker 2: keep it metro, the voters have voted.
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  Speaker 1: For Action SA.
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  Speaker 2: I would put to you, but they voted for you
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  Speaker 2: as a vehicle for change. They don't want Joburg to
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  Speaker 2: be run in the way it's been run, and they
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  Speaker 2: don't want Joburg to look the way it does. And
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  Speaker 2: that would be true, clearly, of Ikuruleni and Twane, because
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  Speaker 2: they're making those choices, and they're very clear ones. The
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  Speaker 2: difficult part now is how do you actually make that happen?
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  Speaker 2: Because I would think voters who voted for either you or,
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  Speaker 2: for example, the Democratic Alliance... To bring about that change,
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  Speaker 2: if you don't do that and you don't get yourself
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  Speaker 2: in a position where you are not just a vigorous opposition,
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  Speaker 2: but actually where you are controlling budgets, you're making changes,
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  Speaker 2: you're doing stuff, I would think that come 2029, you
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  Speaker 2: may face something of a backlash. What's your response to
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  Speaker 2: the way I framed that?
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  Speaker 3: Well, it's a challenging tightrope we need to walk because
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  Speaker 3: of the same process We do want to be involved
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  Speaker 3: in government. We do want to deliver value.
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  Speaker 1: We've got to be very.
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  Speaker 3: Careful that you don't end up in a toxic coalition
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  Speaker 3: led by one of these other parties that have demonstrated
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  Speaker 3: deficiencies that have really angered the South African people, whether
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  Speaker 3: that be the inclination of the ANC towards maladministration and
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  Speaker 3: corruption or whether that be the inclination of the DA
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  Speaker 3: towards differing levels of service delivery depending on where people live.
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  Speaker 3: That's the risk for Action SA in finding ourselves Toxic
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  Speaker 3: by association with either of those is another tightrope we
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  Speaker 3: have to walk. We have to engage in these negotiations.
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  Speaker 3: We've already begun that process. We've set out our framework
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  Speaker 3: as a party. And the biggest thing that we've come
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  Speaker 3: to learn is that we need to lead in municipalities.
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  Speaker 3: It might not be everywhere, but certainly what is most
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  Speaker 3: important is there needs to be territory in South Africa
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  Speaker 3: where we put a green flag in the ground like
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  Speaker 3: we did the city of Twane and can demonstrate how
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  Speaker 3: we deliver and what brand of government we bring to
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  Speaker 3: the South African people.
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  Speaker 1: Is there a danger, though?
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  Speaker 2: And I take your point about toxic relationships, but many
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  Speaker 2: of our listeners will be saying, well, I have toxic
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  Speaker 2: relationships in the place where I work. But when I
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  Speaker 2: get out of that heads of department meeting, I go
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  Speaker 2: back to that section of our catering business and I
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  Speaker 2: drive for new business and I make sure when I
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  Speaker 2: get new customers, they are highly satisfied. I mean, is
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  Speaker 2: it time for are politicians to be a little less precious?
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  Speaker 1: Without any question.
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  Speaker 3: And please, when I talk about toxicity, I don't mean
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  Speaker 3: to say it's difficult to work with these people and
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  Speaker 3: therefore we are unwilling to. As a matter of fact,
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  Speaker 3: our stance towards coalitions is we must be willing to
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  Speaker 3: negotiate with everyone and to explore which arrangements are going
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  Speaker 3: to produce the best arrangements for our residents in these municipalities.
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  Speaker 3: As a matter of fact, when we talk about toxicity,
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  Speaker 3: we talk about it not in terms of who we're
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  Speaker 3: not willing to work with, but actually in terms of
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  Speaker 3: what kind of agreements can be put in place that
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  Speaker 3: would immunize those coalitions against that toxicity so that it
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  Speaker 3: isn't worn by the residents of those municipalities. And as
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  Speaker 3: a matter of fact, there have been some political parties
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  Speaker 3: that say, well, we're not going to coalesce under these
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  Speaker 3: circumstances or those. The coalitions being served up by South
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  Speaker 3: Africans are messy. That's the reality. And politicians can't turn
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  Speaker 3: around and say, well, we don't like mess. Nobody likes mess.
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  Speaker 3: You've got to get in there and create order and
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  Speaker 3: stability and service delivery out of messes. and that's the
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  Speaker 3: political parties that voters are going to reward long-term.
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  Speaker 1: What do voters say to you when you engage with them?
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  Speaker 2: And I don't just mean you, because obviously in the
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  Speaker 2: position you hold, and alongside the senior colleagues that you
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  Speaker 2: would have daily conversations with, you are sponges absorbing the
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  Speaker 2: mood out there. Is there a risk that you might
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  Speaker 2: underestimate the desperation for Joburg? And let's stay with Joburg,
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  Speaker 2: but we can pick another city if you'd prefer. The
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  Speaker 2: desperation for it not to be run the way it
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  Speaker 2: is and look the way it does.
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  Speaker 1: And that.
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  Speaker 2: Actually is what frames your conversation. And you can say, yeah,
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  Speaker 2: you know, the example you gave. The DA is not
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  Speaker 2: as consistent as we think they should be in equity
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  Speaker 2: and considerations of equity in the decisions they make.
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  Speaker 1: They would disagree with you on that. But you know what?
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  Speaker 2: Suck it up, draw up your skirts or whatever analogy
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  Speaker 2: you want to use, that is a much better alternative
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  Speaker 2: than what we've had so far.
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  Speaker 3: Well, I think if the point goes, any arrangement that
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  Speaker 3: continues with the current level of governance and some of
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  Speaker 3: the current actors who have been responsible for that level
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  Speaker 3: of misgovernance would be unacceptable.
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  Speaker 2: And can I just ask you, are those actors individuals
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  Speaker 2: or are they parties?
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  Speaker 1: Okay.
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  Speaker 3: I think we must recognize that in local government and
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  Speaker 3: in municipalities, the caliber of leaders matters in many instances
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  Speaker 3: more than the color of the T-shirt that they're wearing.
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  Speaker 1: Do you think so?
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  Speaker 3: Without any question. You can have the same group of
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  Speaker 3: political parties deliver very effectively in one space and very
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  Speaker 3: poorly in another because the leaders in one have the capacity, maturity,
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  Speaker 3: and humility to govern well in a coalition environment. And
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  Speaker 3: the leaders and the others simply do not.
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  Speaker 2: Can I just jump in there and press you a
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  Speaker 2: little on that point? What if a particular political party
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  Speaker 2: consistently throws up leaders of the kind you've just described?
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  Speaker 3: Well, certainly that has to be part of the considerations.
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  Speaker 3: And as we go into these coalition negotiations, you must
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  Speaker 3: realize that with every political party, there are shortcomings that
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  Speaker 3: we would have to negotiate to determine whether we could
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  Speaker 3: overcome those shortcomings. In the instance of some political parties,
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  Speaker 3: and let's not make it personal, the time for personal
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  Speaker 3: is done now, but some political parties have a track
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  Speaker 3: record of breaking effective coalitions and bringing instability unnecessarily. Others
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  Speaker 3: have track records of corruption and maladministration. The point is
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  Speaker 3: that you have to govern with political parties that may
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  Speaker 3: not be ideal, per your earlier point about how South
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  Speaker 3: Africans have to grapple with not ideal, and politicians can't
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  Speaker 3: be precious. But you have to build coalition agreements that
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  Speaker 3: immunize the residents of those municipalities from those issues and
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  Speaker 3: don't let them be the ones that suffer as a
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  Speaker 3: consequence of them.
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  Speaker 2: And just finally, who's going to run negotiations for Action SA? Would,
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  Speaker 2: for example, if someone is, let's take Executive Mayor Moyer,
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  Speaker 2: for example, would she be specifically excluded from the direct
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  Speaker 2: negotiation because she is a player in it? Obviously, her
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  Speaker 2: views would be taken into account. There would be consultation.
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  Speaker 2: But have you designated a specific team that doesn't have
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  Speaker 2: individual skin in particular games?
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  Speaker 1: Absolutely.
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  Speaker 3: So our coalition negotiating framework we approved about two weeks
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  Speaker 3: ago anticipating this moment because what we have here, John,
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  Speaker 3: is 105 municipalities, most of which are going to be hung.
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  Speaker 3: They have to be negotiated within 14 days in nine
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  Speaker 3: provinces all at the same time. So it can't be
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  Speaker 3: one team of negotiators.
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  Speaker 1: We have teams for every municipality.
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  Speaker 3: We have always made sure that that team is going
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  Speaker 3: to be led by a person who is not conflicted
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  Speaker 3: in the outcome of that negotiation, but that mayors and
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  Speaker 3: mayoral candidates absolutely have to be part of those negotiating
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  Speaker 3: teams because they're the ones that have the local knowledge.
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  Speaker 3: You can't have a situation where Dr. Masipi Moya is
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  Speaker 3: not there speaking about the importance of a very particular portfolio,
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  Speaker 3: who's the right person for that portfolio, what are the
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  Speaker 3: shortcomings of the political actors involved in those spaces right now.
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  Speaker 3: Without that local knowledge, you'd be having people from Joburg
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  Speaker 3: negotiating about Tswane, and you can't have that as well.
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  Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Michael Beaumont.
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  Speaker 2: We will watch with huge interest the rest of the numbers,
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  Speaker 2: and even greater interest... once all the numbers are in
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  Speaker 2: and the 14-day period of putting coalitions together gets underway, yeah,
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  Speaker 2: it's going to be fascinating stuff.
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  Speaker 1: We appreciate your time.