Latest / Coffee People Podcast / S5:E20 - Lily Quiros AKA Lil Coffee Geek, Coffee Consultant

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S5:E20 - Lily Quiros AKA Lil Coffee Geek, Coffee Consultant · Coffee People Podcast

0:00
I like beer, hey, everyone. If you like the roast West Coast
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coffee podcast, you might also appreciate the, I like beer the
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podcast. Listening to these guys is like
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being a fly on the wall of the pub with a few of your favorite
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everything from the mating habits of penguins to there
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behind the scenes Brewery experiences check out the, I
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show about coffee or head. To, I like beer, the Cast.com.
0:31
Hey, good morning everyone. Welcome to episode 20.
0:45
The very last episode of season 5 on the roast West Coast coffee
0:50
podcast. I'm Ryan Walton.
0:52
This is the show where I bring you the stories of coffee
0:55
professionals entrepreneurship and coffee education.
0:58
This is one of the last new episodes.
1:00
I'll be Recording on the road. And I have to say that I miss my
1:04
podcast in closet, I didn't think that I would, but I
1:08
definitely do today. I'll be sharing a rolling
1:11
conversation with you featuring coffee consultant Lily, quiroz
1:15
AKA Lil coffee geek. It wouldn't be the last show of
1:19
the season, if it weren't full of nonsense, technical
1:21
difficulties. In this case, my internet was
1:24
not working properly and it dropped our call a half a dozen
1:28
times forcing Lily, and I to adapt and Start in the middle of
1:32
some really important thoughts. If there is a little bit of
1:35
choppy continuity in the interview, I sincerely
1:37
apologize. I did my best to smooth it out.
1:41
I blame an oversized internet conglomerate whose name.
1:43
I won't share explicitly. It might rhyme with plectrum.
1:48
Maybe probably as a coffee consultant.
1:51
One of the things that Lily does is help her clients work through
1:54
problems. Find those touch points that
1:56
cause hiccups and roasting and operations, but that is just a
2:00
start, I'll let her Tell you more and you can check out her
2:03
new website. Little coffee geek while you're
2:05
listening today to learn. Even more all of course, link to
2:08
that in this shows notes and on roast westcoast.com this podcast
2:14
and myself is still on the road. I'm headed for Minnesota, then
2:17
Montana, and Idaho before hitting the West Coast in
2:20
Vancouver, Canada. I've got our travel and camping
2:23
map, and I've got our coffee map, they don't always overlap.
2:28
So when in doubt were deferring to the coffee man.
2:32
Wherever you are. I encourage you to find a new
2:34
coffee roaster to try this week. It may just change your life,
2:39
and if you happen to bring home a new bag of beans, well, it's
2:42
time to brew them and it's also time for this interview with
2:45
Lily, quiroz AKA Lil coffee geek, coffee consultant on the
2:51
roast West Coast coffee podcast. Anything you wanted to ask me
3:08
before we got started? Um no I don't think so.
3:14
Well then I will welcome you to this podcast the roast West
3:18
Coast coffee podcast and if you wouldn't mind just for the tape.
3:22
And for everyone listening, if you could say, what your name is
3:26
and your business may be what Consider your job title and
3:31
maybe your favorite thing to do, that is not coffee related.
3:35
Hey, everyone. My name is Lily karros and I am
3:39
a coffee consultant. My brand is kind of just Lily,
3:43
quiroz little coffee geek. It's kind of like my Instagram
3:47
social media handle. So thing going by that as a
3:51
coffee consultant, you know, I get to do lots of fun stuff
3:54
helping out, small businesses and the local San Diego area, as
3:58
well as like a larger coffee businesses as well.
4:01
We can kind of get into the, you know, nitty-gritty of the
4:03
details of what I do. Yeah, my favorite thing to do
4:08
outside of coffee. Let's see, I love sports, I love
4:14
playing sports watching sports and also my husband and I are
4:17
really into like superheroes and Marvel and just kind of geeking
4:22
out on stuff like that. So, Nerd at heart.
4:27
Awesome. Yeah.
4:27
I like to let people know that you are that coffee people are
4:31
also human beings. Yes.
4:33
Sometimes they're very intense about coffee and so we want to
4:35
make sure everyone knows also real people.
4:39
We are real people. Yes we are.
4:42
Well let's get started with some backstory then like let's go way
4:45
back in time. I mean, do you remember your
4:48
first coffee experience and or the first time that you thought,
4:52
you know, this is something more than just coffee.
4:55
Oh yeah, absolutely. So when I was in college, I
4:58
studied food science. And I mean, I drank coffee as a
5:02
college student had survived, you know, but I wasn't like into
5:07
coffee so to speak. I knew early on, in my food,
5:11
science career that the beverage industry was kind of the
5:14
direction, I wanted to go with in food.
5:15
Science, wasn't really sure what that looked like.
5:18
I just knew I liked the beverage side more than the food side.
5:22
And then my junior year of college.
5:24
We did a Like study tour as a department to Costa Rica.
5:29
So, we went to a bunch of different places, food places in
5:31
Costa Rica, dairy farms stuff like that.
5:34
And then we went to Cafe Britt, which is like the largest
5:37
commercially owned, coffee Farm production facility with in
5:43
Costa Rica and so we got to see like the whole Farm.
5:46
The picking process, they cuffed for us and we just got to see
5:51
kind of like that side of it and they're like huge.
5:54
So they have like A really big facility and like they do tours
5:58
all the time and stuff like that.
5:59
And so it was that trip that moment where I was like whoa
6:04
coffee is really cool and like so many things go into making it
6:09
what it is and tastes like what it does.
6:12
And so it was kind of at that point where I was like I want to
6:14
do this. This is the direction I want to
6:16
go, like with my degree with my career and there was kind of,
6:20
no, like, looking back, I guess that's really Interesting that
6:26
you found that in college, I feel like that isn't always the
6:29
case, certainly wasn't for me, but I'm also imagining you at
6:33
this coffee factor in Costa Rica experiencing this for the first
6:37
time with a group of other students in a similar track.
6:43
And I'm wondering, you know, if you're if you're having this
6:47
kind of, aha moment if you're also thinking that everyone else
6:50
is having the same moment or if they're just going man, I can't
6:52
wait to get back to the hostel or the hotel.
6:55
Yeah, I mean, everybody enjoyed everybody enjoyed it.
6:58
Just, I mean, it's coffee every, but unless you hate coffee or
7:01
like, oh, this is cool. Let's drink some coffee and
7:04
like, have a good time and especially compared to some of
7:07
the other places we had seen on our trip was kind of the most,
7:11
like, less stressful chill enjoyable to her.
7:17
We weren't making cheese by hand or trying weird popsicles from
7:23
weird facilities, and comes to Pika.
7:26
So, everyone was definitely enjoying themselves, but it was
7:28
definitely a parent as I was talking about it, but I was the
7:31
only one who was like, this is the coolest thing I've ever seen
7:35
and this is where I'm going with my life.
7:40
How did you get started on the food science program to begin
7:43
with? That isn't something I would
7:44
have even known existed even though I grew up in Hospitality.
7:48
Yeah, what, what sent you down that path?
7:51
Yeah, when I was in high school, I loved cooking.
7:54
I like Like loved food. So I was kind of like, okay.
7:58
What can I do with that? Maybe I want to be a chef or
8:01
open like a catering business or something.
8:03
I used to volunteer a lot in high school.
8:06
I used to do these like you know, packaging events or we
8:08
could package up is like rice protein.
8:12
Dehydrated vegetables is having they'd ship them all over the
8:14
world and I was like learning more about the food, we were
8:18
packaging and learned that these meals were developed and created
8:23
by food. And I was like what's a food
8:27
scientist? That sounds fun.
8:30
I like food. I like chemistry and science so
8:33
maybe this is what I want to do. So it was just kind of I don't
8:38
know, fate luck, I don't know. I am I'm just so envious of
8:43
people that get that up that's that.
8:45
See that. So early on, I just I think I
8:48
met with a guidance counselor once in high school and like
8:51
once in college and in both times, it was more of a This is
8:55
where you're at and what you can do is quickly as possible and
8:58
less about what is it you want to do that?
9:00
Just wasn't a question I ever really thought about.
9:03
So I think that's really inspiring that there are people
9:06
that have these moments where they find something that they
9:09
are passionate about and then whether it's for a short time or
9:12
forever, it doesn't matter. But you it was something that
9:15
you followed in and ended up moving into a career.
9:19
So, after you graduate, I'm assuming you've already kind of
9:22
figured that coffee is the track that I'm on.
9:25
What made you think this is actually something that can be a
9:27
career because I don't think even though I've done 100
9:31
episodes or more of the show, I still think people are surprised
9:35
when they find out their careers and coffee that aren't your
9:37
Easter, right? And people just kind of like
9:40
fall into them sometimes. I think it benefited me that I
9:45
went to college in the LA area because I think there was just
9:49
more opportunity there. But once I knew that that was
9:53
kind of the direction I wanted to go, I did kind of learned as
9:57
much as I could about coffee on the food science side of things.
10:01
So if I had a project or a paper, where we got some sort of
10:06
freedom, I would try somehow to relate it to Coffee, whether it
10:12
was, like caffeine or like the lipids and coffee or whatever it
10:17
may be. I was like, how can Relate this.
10:19
How can I make this work so that I could get as much knowledge
10:22
before graduation because I knew it wasn't going to get that from
10:24
my standard curriculum and then we also had to do an internship
10:29
to graduate. So I was like, okay if coffee is
10:33
a direct, I want to go. I need to get a coffee
10:35
internship somehow. So this is where I feel like
10:37
being in La was beneficial because there's A lot of coffee
10:41
companies in the LA area even 10 years ago.
10:45
So I just kind of started Googling and emailing random
10:49
places, literally, any coffee company I could find and it was
10:53
just like, hey I'm a food science student, I need an
10:56
internship. Can I come like help you with
11:00
something and one small company? Facebook messaged me back and
11:07
was like, sure, come hang out with us.
11:10
We roast on these days and do farmers markets on the weekends
11:14
and you're welcome to come hang out with us and I was like, done
11:19
sold. And then I definitely had to
11:21
kind of like stretch how it related to my food science
11:25
internship, so I could get credit for it.
11:28
But that was my kind of star and foot into the door of like, what
11:32
is roasting. They, you know, the first ones
11:35
that taught me how to like be a barista and pull a shot and
11:37
steamed milk and stuff like That in my first experience on like a
11:41
big roasting machine, and what's happening in that process and
11:45
what goes into, you know, our side of the coffee chain versus
11:49
the farm side which I had seen before.
11:53
So, that was really cool. And then when I graduated kind
11:57
of did similar things, but knew there were a couple like larger
12:01
manufacturing facilities in the LA area.
12:06
So it kind of targeted those to try and get like my foot in the
12:09
door. What I was going to ask
12:12
following that was after graduation.
12:15
If we mentioned at the top that you are a coffee consultant.
12:20
But what was the kind of the journey from graduation to
12:24
their? I think that's where we were at
12:26
before the internet kind of which is probably my fault.
12:28
I got my teeth cleaned this morning.
12:30
I think there's some weird you know, I don't know what's going
12:32
on. It's all good.
12:34
Yeah. So when I graduated I kind of
12:36
targeted the like a larger bigger During coffee companies
12:41
in the LA area thinking like, this is where I can actually use
12:43
my degree, whereas, with coffee roasting.
12:46
Like yeah, I have the science back on everything but you don't
12:48
need a degree in food science to roast coffee or be a barista,
12:52
you know. So I ended up working at a
12:55
company called go viña. They make Don Francisco's Jose's
13:00
is there Costco brand, they're a pretty large family owned
13:04
company in the LA area so I did quality assurance for them.
13:09
Where I kind of learned the basics of sample roasting did
13:13
tons of cupping through. Them was where I got my initial
13:17
Q, greater certification. I helped them with developing
13:20
new flavors, new Blends. I did a lot of stuff on the
13:24
production side of kind of overseeing, the quality control
13:29
tests from the back. Item numbers making sure they
13:33
all had the right materials. And you know what not and then I
13:36
also took over their food safety program.
13:39
So I did there, sqf food certifications organic
13:42
certifications can I interrupt for a moment and just ask, what
13:48
is food safety and coffee and tail.
13:51
And is it in just like literally inspecting beans for problems?
13:55
I mean, what kind of things should we be worried?
13:57
That might be unsafe. Yeah.
13:59
So the biggest issue with coffee is physical, contaminants rocks,
14:05
sticks, things like that. So, it's relatively easy in the
14:11
grand scheme of food, safety coffee, especially just like
14:15
whole being and ground, not like, ready to drink stuff.
14:18
That's a whole different thing, whole different beast, but just
14:22
the beans or the grounds is super easy.
14:25
The annoying part is, even though it's so easy.
14:28
You Have to do the hazard analysis, and like everything
14:34
that you have to do for any other food product to get the
14:37
proper certifications. Regardless of the fact that
14:41
literally nothing grows in coffee and even if there is a
14:44
physical contaminant in it, nobody's then going to eat it,
14:48
like then goes in a filter with boiling hot water, you know.
14:54
Unlike the tree branch that I ate in a bowl of Raisin Bran
14:57
last week and that's not a joke. Exactly.
15:00
Right. It's not you're not going to
15:01
like physically consume it even if a stick or Rock ends up in
15:04
your final product but, you know, we still have to do all of
15:08
those things and then also on the third-party certification,
15:11
side like organic fair trade, all of that, that's more of like
15:15
a tracking system, nobility thing of like okay these are the
15:18
beans I've purchased, there's the certification, everything
15:21
from the farm Tracking all the way through to say, okay?
15:24
We purchased 500 pounds of green factor in some weight loss and
15:29
you know, now we've sold 400 pounds of roasted coffee and
15:33
making sure that all of that tracks and matches up so that
15:35
you're not selling, you're not purchasing 500 pounds, in
15:38
selling 600 pounds. Yeah.
15:41
It's a it's a lot of administrative paperwork that I
15:44
think people don't see from the outside.
15:46
When they think about what we would call the Glamorous side of
15:49
coffee roasting, you're not thinking about the tracking in
15:52
the paperwork and even if you're working in thinking something
15:57
else, I like worth a non-profit. You may not be like an
16:01
environmental nonprofit, land manager may not actually be
16:04
working on the land, most of the time, they might be writing
16:06
grants and tracking different species and Through cameras and
16:11
it's a whole process. There's a whole world that
16:13
people don't think of when they are drinking their coffee and
16:16
going, how do you know would be great if I opened a coffee shop?
16:18
Or if I became exactly. And a lot of these people will
16:21
start roasting start doing these things and then want to sell in
16:24
certain stores and realize, oh I need these certifications, I
16:28
need a Hassett plan or I need, you know, whatever it may be and
16:32
then they start looking into it and it's like super complicated
16:35
and you're like, how do I even do this new kind of like are in
16:40
over your Your head so to speak because even though coffee is so
16:43
simple, you still have to understand the entire process of
16:46
what it is, what's being asked of you, and what you need to be
16:50
present, if an auditor comes and looks at everything, you still
16:53
have to have all the documentation and everything
16:56
recorded properly. Like, this is how much we
17:00
roasted this is the weight loss because Auditors, never
17:03
understand coffee. So they're like what do you
17:05
mean? There's less?
17:06
Where the rest of it go like? Well, it's good.
17:09
It loses water. Just yes, it does appear
17:15
dissipated starting at a big company like that.
17:18
Did you have a training program? Did they have a training program
17:22
for you to learn all this stuff or were you kind of learning it
17:24
on the fly as you went a little bit of both?
17:29
I mean they are larger company. So I had some basic training of
17:32
their procedures of like, this is how we test for oxygen.
17:34
This is how we do our grind test, and how this machine works
17:38
and and stuff like that. But And then the food safety
17:41
stuff because of my background, they were kind of just like, are
17:44
you go right? Cool, pick it up.
17:49
But on my show, I wasn't say on the tasting side that was very
17:53
much like a learn as you go of, like, and I, I've had to develop
17:57
training programs for like new people at roasting facilities of
18:01
like, learning how to roast learning, how to Cup, and things
18:03
like that. And it's so hard because so much
18:06
of it is just practice. You know what?
18:09
Yeah, you need to know. Turn this knob or use this much
18:13
water, wait, this long or whatever, but it's just like
18:17
doing it enough times where you feel, confident in your taste
18:20
buds or in your ability, to know what the coffee is doing inside
18:24
the machine. You know, it's all really just
18:27
you just got to do it a million times.
18:30
I think about that, even just when I'm drinking my coffee in
18:32
the morning and trying to make a note to myself of what, maybe I
18:36
was tasting. And I don't That same confidence
18:40
because I half the time I'm drinking coffee.
18:42
I'm not really thinking about the coffee.
18:43
I'm drinking, right? Other half the time.
18:45
I'm trying to be super focused and professional about what I'm
18:47
doing which isn't really, you know, my job.
18:50
My I feel confident that I am the dummy on the show and I
18:53
bring in smart people to teach me about coffee when the thing
18:57
with developing your palate is especially as a company, just
19:02
tasting together. Enough time.
19:05
So that you're all calibrated with each other.
19:09
So, if I'm tasting orange, and you're tasting, lemon, but we as
19:16
a company decide that this is orange, you can then calibrate
19:19
yourself to the learn. Okay, I'm tasting lemon, but we
19:22
are actually, I actually need to interpret that as orange.
19:26
So you can kind of recalibrate your pallor, your taste buds,
19:28
based on who you're tasting with, and what the company is,
19:31
is kind of going for. And that's that's where like the
19:34
Q Certification comes into Q graders are all calibrated to be
19:38
tasting, the same relatively the same, so that a q greater.
19:43
And the States versus Europe, or Asia is going to be tasting the
19:48
same things. So it's really hard to develop
19:51
your palate on your own because you can just make whatever you
19:55
want. And there's no wrong answer,
19:57
right? You're tasting what you're
19:58
tasting? You can't be wrong.
20:01
But it's that, that calibration of creating that like, unity in
20:06
what you're tasting with, the mass, or your company, or the
20:11
people, you know, in your environment.
20:14
Sure. It's like, when a bunch of
20:16
people, witness a crime and they all have a different version of
20:19
what happened. Exactly.
20:20
You gotta find that through line.
20:22
You mentioned Q grading. And we've reached on this this
20:25
season in particular, we've done a lot of discussions about
20:28
curating with different guests. You recently let your Q greater
20:31
certification laps, I saw on the on the sides.
20:34
I'm just wondering what value you found besides this obvious,
20:38
work-related calibration, and now is you're going into
20:42
Consulting, why? Was something that you haven't,
20:45
you didn't keep going with. I think there's a lot of value
20:51
to curating, as a whole like having that calibration because
20:56
coffee comes from all over the world having that calibration of
20:59
tasting and Grading all over the world I think is, is important.
21:05
But for me in my Consulting role, I feel like I already have
21:11
the taste buds and the skills. is to taste the coffee, that the
21:15
certification is just kind of I guess like first show in a
21:20
sense, like, I know so many couples who are phenomenal
21:25
covers have never been a curator and I know people who argue
21:29
graders who are good cuppers because they did it, they were
21:33
certified but there's covers that are better than them, who
21:36
aren't certified who can like taste coffee instantaneously or
21:39
be able to you know differentiate my new show even
21:43
more than somebody who's certified And it's not cheap.
21:47
So now, as a consultant, that's something I have to pay for
21:50
myself and with covid hate to blame everything on covid.
21:56
But with covid, the recertification, like a
21:59
calibration, you just go and recalibrate yourself.
22:02
There's less opportunities, less available like in my general
22:06
area and I now have a family and children and finding the time to
22:12
like fly to another state to do. It's like, you know, full day
22:17
test that I'm having to pay all this money for to just then put
22:22
on my resume so to speak wasn't wasn't worth it I guess.
22:29
Sure. I mean it's not like you lost
22:31
those skills just because that's not on the piece of paper.
22:35
Exactly. And I feel like, unless you're
22:38
actively grading green coffee. It's really not necessary.
22:42
Like, if you're the owner of a business, yeah.
22:45
Having at least Least one person on your staff.
22:47
Husak you greater I think is important because they can
22:49
evaluate the samples coming in and really determine whether the
22:53
price that you're being offered is fair.
22:55
If the coffee is good, if the coffee is not good.
22:58
I think that's where it's super important is evaluating it on
23:00
the green side whereas for me as a consultant.
23:05
Yeah I can I can take your green and evaluate it for you but the
23:09
majority of what I do is kind of that post roast.
23:12
So is your roast a good roast? Do we need to make tweaks?
23:15
So we need to make changes and where the Q greater
23:19
certification. Yeah, it says I can come up and
23:21
I have a good palate. I'm not necessarily using those
23:25
skills to help you do that. It's a different perspective
23:29
because whether I like it or not is irrelevant, it's whether your
23:33
coffee roast is the best that it can be and the best that you
23:38
want it to be. You may want to it taste a
23:40
certain way because of your client or your Market or
23:43
whatever you're going for whether I like like that or not
23:46
is irrelevant, but I'm going to make sure that it tastes exactly
23:49
how you want it to taste and if we can improve it, let's do
23:52
that. Interesting.
23:54
I don't want to lose the thread of, you know, kind of your
23:57
journey to Consulting because I do want to keep thinking more
24:00
questions. I want to ask you about what
24:02
you're doing consulting, but we're going to get there.
24:03
I promise, I don't want to lose that where that thread where you
24:07
are, working out of college at a larger company and you're
24:11
learning all of these kind of corporate skills and corporate
24:14
coffee skills. Where do you go from there?
24:17
Yeah so I definitely learned a lot working there.
24:19
I learned kind of like the backbone of coffee, the whole
24:23
sea. Cut process and their family
24:25
owned business. They've been around a long time.
24:28
So there look there, a little bit more on the second wave
24:30
side. They've definitely now started
24:33
moving towards kind of the third wave Market.
24:35
But when I was there, definitely more of like a second wave, but
24:39
just learning like how green buying is done on a super large
24:42
scale and like what the see Market is and and all of that
24:47
stuff, but doing the food, safety side of things and being,
24:51
as you said, on the non-glamorous side, I was like I
24:54
don't I don't like this, this isn't fun anymore and because it
25:00
was a larger company in the role I was in.
25:01
I knew that there was kind of no way back at that point I was
25:06
kind of like stuck in that role so I quit and I was like okay I
25:13
don't know what I'm going to do. Maybe I'll open my own thing.
25:15
Maybe I'll find somewhere else to go, I don't know, but my
25:19
husband was super supportive. We had recently gotten married
25:21
and he was like, I'm making enough if you want to do it now.
25:23
So To do it. Like we don't have kids just
25:25
just do it. So I did took some time off
25:28
looked into opening a shop and was like, this is not what I
25:32
want. This is way more work than I
25:34
anticipated and way more overhead and you know, hadn't
25:37
hadn't gone all the way there. So ended up as a barista for a
25:41
couple months. And then started working at a
25:44
company called espresso Republic there in Chino, which is just
25:49
outside the Los Angeles area. There, cafes are drip and I
25:53
know, Know, if anybody on here is familiar with drip but
25:56
throughout the Orange County area.
25:57
So I roasted for them for a couple years and that was where
25:59
I truly learned how to like roast I had roasted during my
26:02
internship, but you had been years before and I was just the
26:05
intern. So just kind of learned how to
26:07
press the buttons. So, I learned really how to
26:10
roast kind of what's going on inside The Roaster, the science
26:13
behind what's going on, how to adjust things like that.
26:17
And then I took over as head, roaster, and production manager
26:22
there. So, I learned a lot there
26:24
started learning how to buy green, because it was so small
26:27
that as, you know, the head roaster production manager,
26:30
you've got to employees that you're managing, but then like a
26:32
million other tasks that have to happen in the coffee world.
26:37
And then I'm originally from San Diego.
26:39
So my goal in life was to eventually, move back to San
26:45
Diego, and I told my husband, even when we were dating, like,
26:49
I don't care when it happens, but before I die, we're going,
26:53
we're going back. So I got an opportunity down
26:58
here, in San Diego, to work for Modern Times beer, / coffee, and
27:02
I took it, so move down to San Diego in 2000. 17:18 one of
27:12
those and was the head. Roaster at modern times coffee
27:17
for a while and then also took over production and roasting and
27:22
they're cold brew and all of that there as well and then
27:26
covid happened. So I at the time our son was
27:34
just about 18 months old. And my husband, he already
27:39
worked from home. He works in the tech industry.
27:43
And so he was already working from home.
27:45
And as people were transitioning working from home and
27:48
transitioning to teams he became busier because he was kind of
27:52
working with his company and Microsoft.
27:54
And so he became busier. And since he already worked from
27:57
home, his job was like oh well nothing's new for you nothing's
28:01
changed. So a lot of the childcare fell
28:04
on myself so I was watching myself.
28:07
On and trying to manage production while not being
28:11
there. So managing production remotely
28:14
is really difficult. I was working like weird hours
28:18
felt like I was giving half of myself to my son and half of
28:22
myself to my job and it just wasn't fair to anybody.
28:25
So I took a leave of absence thinking is going to go away,
28:29
right? We all thought covid-19 ago away
28:31
and then my leave ended and it was like okay we need to make
28:35
this decision. I'm either going back to work
28:38
like full-time and our sons going back to day care or Our I
28:43
don't go back and we as hard as it was, we decided that I
28:48
wouldn't go back and that was definitely not an easy decision
28:53
but it was the right decision for us at the time.
28:56
And then so that was like August with 20/20.
29:02
And then about three months later, we found out that I was
29:06
pregnant with twins. So I was like, well, I guess I'm
29:12
not going back to work full time anytime soon.
29:16
So I was like, okay, let's see how this goes.
29:19
Stay at home for now and I just mentally I couldn't do it and
29:24
having Connections in the coffee world and I have a very close
29:27
friend who has his own Consulting business, kind of
29:32
picked his brain and decided like, hey, I think I could do
29:35
this, it allows me to kind of have the hours that I want work
29:38
as much or as little as I want, you know, be home with my
29:41
family, but also still be able to do what I love in the coffee
29:45
industry. And still have that connection
29:48
to that part of me, that I am so passionate, for sure.
29:53
That's a and I don't have the numbers in front of me, but it's
29:57
something to talking point that I've just been in the news
29:59
recently, how in the career field, women have been more
30:06
likely to be the ones to stay home or not, go back to work
30:10
because of the childcare issue and I'm wondering if that was
30:14
something you guys thought about.
30:15
I'm assuming you This decision is a partnership, so I'm not
30:18
asking like if it's fair or not because I know we're being in a
30:21
marriage. We make decisions that sometimes
30:23
are better for the other better, for the for you, and it's all
30:26
about going together in the same direction hopefully, but I'm
30:29
wondering if that was something that you guys were thinking
30:32
about, or that you are feeling that, you know, why should I be
30:35
the one to stay home? And I don't mean to intrude too
30:38
much. You guys tell me to back off,
30:39
but just wondering if that was a thought that came up and
30:42
something that you had to deal with.
30:43
Yeah, thousand percent. Yes.
30:46
Yes, if my husband could be a stay-at-home dad, he absolutely
30:50
would be if we could switch roles and he was the one who
30:53
stayed home and I was the one who went to work every day.
30:55
We would do it in a heartbeat but with the careers that we
30:59
chose and the you know situation that was presented to us he was
31:03
and is making enough money on his own to support our family.
31:07
So that was the direction that we had to go.
31:10
Was that? I was the one that wasn't going
31:12
to work and he was one that would stay home.
31:13
But if I could somehow find a job that pays Me, you know, a
31:18
ton of money then you would put in a second like, I'm out.
31:23
Well, it's, let's hope that his boss isn't listening to the
31:25
show. Well, that get that got you to
31:28
this point now where you are in a role where you are Consulting
31:31
and you have a and you're managing a family and you're
31:34
helping other people with their businesses.
31:37
So I think it's a two-part question and probably a big one.
31:41
But how did you okay, I decide to be a consultant.
31:46
Great. But now, someone has to actually
31:48
decide you are the person they want to consult with.
31:52
How did you find those first clients?
31:54
And then what is it that you are offering them?
31:57
What are you doing for them? I mentioned, I have a friend who
32:01
already had a coffee kind of Consulting business and
32:04
everything and a lot of his business was kind of like
32:08
certifications and seminars and things like that.
32:12
And so a lot of that obviously stopped during covid and He was
32:17
realizing his business wasn't necessarily sustainable, so he
32:20
got a full-time job and so we were kind of chatting and
32:24
different things and so he didn't want his business to like
32:27
die, so to speak. He's like, I don't want to let
32:30
it go, but I'm not going to have time to maintain it the same
32:33
way. And I had mentioned to him that
32:35
I was thinking about going this direction and everything.
32:37
So we kind of made a deal with like he would send me either
32:41
samples to help him with or you know clients that he felt were
32:44
going to be Too much work for him or conflict of interest with
32:49
his new job. So my first kind of like, big
32:53
client that I'm still working with was kind of a referral
32:58
through him and then my other, like second client s ongoing
33:03
client was like, a friend of a friend.
33:06
So that was kind of how I started getting clients and
33:08
getting kind of my name out there a little bit.
33:11
And I've had a couple other people that I've worked with
33:15
that. I've, you know, Acted through on
33:16
LinkedIn or have just known through my coffee Network.
33:20
I've evaluated samples, for a variety of people from instant,
33:24
coffee to roasted coffee flavors different things like that.
33:29
I started working to develop coffee capsules sort of a thing
33:33
for a while. What is that like a cotton
33:37
coffee capsule like a like something you would drop into
33:40
hot water to release is like a coffee flavor.
33:44
The one I was working for what they were trying to do.
33:46
Like a Dolce Gusto style. So the Dulce go snow machine has
33:50
one pod, like almost like a K-Cup but it's it's own like,
33:54
proprietary shape or whatever. One is coffee and then you put a
33:57
second one in and it's like milk and sugar and flavors and so you
34:00
get like a fancy cappuccino or whatever.
34:03
So I was working with them, trying to kind of develop, how
34:06
to make this work with the milk and get good, texture and froth
34:10
and stuff like that. I've also kind of helped some
34:14
people go in the right direction.
34:16
Those food safety has sub certifications like okay.
34:20
What steps do I need to take? It's typically something that
34:23
can be done. Like on your team I can do it
34:26
for somebody if they want as the consultant but most of these
34:30
businesses that are looking for help are small and so they're
34:33
just like, where do I even go? Where do I begin?
34:36
You know, so it's just like, okay, these are this is what you
34:39
need. These are the sites where you
34:41
can be able to find all this information.
34:43
This is where you get your training and just helping guide.
34:46
Them in the direction so that they're, you know, elected
34:49
person can then take over and do it for their company as well.
34:54
Sure your major Foundation Building, right?
34:56
Exactly. And this is my own opinion, but
35:00
like, I was felt like when I was consulting or taking on
35:05
management roles, my job was to get the business to a place
35:09
where I wasn't needed anymore. That's how I knew.
35:12
I had succeeded. And so, but I also found that
35:15
when I did that, then generally those businesses wanted me to
35:18
stick around and do more things. So, yeah, it totally works.
35:23
Child either way you've mentioned a bunch of different
35:26
things. Like if I were out there in the
35:28
world and going, man, I wanted to get into a coffee industry
35:31
related business is there somebody who is kind of like
35:35
your ideal client like, is it coffee roasters?
35:37
Is it coffee shops that are opening?
35:39
Is it people who are on like the maybe trying to do Innovation
35:45
and coffee? What is it?
35:46
That you feel that you like what do you have any sure.
35:49
You just like you know what? If it involves coffee I meant
35:52
right now. I'm kind of just taking what I
35:55
can get because I have a family and I'm not able to work all the
35:59
time. I'm not putting myself out there
36:03
to like, try and get as many clients as I can get because I
36:06
don't have time. I physically, you know, mentally
36:09
cannot take on that many people at once.
36:12
So, at this point, I'm kind of just taking what's falling into
36:15
my lap or what opportunities I'm seeing.
36:19
I'm trying a little bit. I'm not like hiding, you know.
36:22
But if If I could pick a niche and was able to like, really put
36:25
myself out there and Market, myself for a niche, I would
36:29
definitely go towards these, like, small roaster side of
36:32
things, and helping them improve their Rose, how to Rose
36:35
properly, making sure that their roasts are efficient and the
36:40
highest quality that they can be.
36:42
And you know, what are you marketing for?
36:44
So let's make it taste towards. What kind of final product are
36:47
using it for whether it's espresso or a pour-over or Blend
36:50
or whatever it may be. That would be my first choice,
36:55
but I do enjoy, like grading. Green is always fun.
36:58
So, when I get an opportunity to kind of grade samples from
37:02
either a farm or, you know, somebody who's like, hey, I have
37:05
this coffee that's been sitting around for a while.
37:08
Can you evaluate it as it's so good?
37:09
Can I still use it? That's fun too.
37:12
And anything that involves tasting coffee, really, I work
37:16
with one client who was developing a bunch of different
37:19
flavors and trying to infuse it with stuff.
37:21
And so just kind of The the back and forth of okay.
37:25
The, how can we Infuse this better?
37:26
How can we improve this flavor? How can we improve the roast to
37:29
make the flavors meld better anything on that, kind of side
37:34
of tasting and developing the coffee?
37:36
In that sense, I would think that would be a kind of an
37:39
ongoing process to because coffee is a living breathing,
37:42
entity to some extent. And, you know, you were one
37:47
thing I think that is, is maybe a little different from a small
37:50
roaster to the bigger corporate. Benny's has the consistency
37:55
changes somewhat because you're buying smaller batches and you
37:58
are buying maybe the same Farm, but totally different from year
38:01
to year about our season to season.
38:03
And so you are kind of continually in need there, or
38:07
having having a blend where, you know, it's Honduras and Ethiopia
38:13
and the Honduras, you normally buys and available.
38:15
So now, what do you do? Do you get another Honduras?
38:19
Or do you get another origin? Like how do you, you know, how
38:23
do you make that blend still taste?
38:24
What it's supposed to taste like, where do you see kind of
38:27
the, this current moment in coffee going.
38:30
We've been having some major fluctuations in the sea market.
38:34
We've been seeing a push towards higher priced coffees that
38:38
reward farmers in the craft Community.
38:41
We're also seeing large companies, try to get trying to
38:45
get more involved in promoting. Selves on the same level selling
38:50
single origins or organic or direct trade.
38:53
You know where do you see coffee going now?
38:56
Because I see us kind of on this like precipice where we could
39:00
just keep riding this wave with more Roasters, small Roasters
39:03
opening up, but is there going to be some change that you think
39:06
will be Beyond the Horizon? I hope there's a change.
39:12
I actually just read an article in roast magazine that was
39:16
talking about on the farm side, how they feel about like the Q
39:20
grading and the scores that are assigned.
39:23
And you know the perspective of like I work for a year and then
39:28
I turn my work into my boss and then the boss decides how much
39:32
they're going to pay me for the work.
39:33
I did the previous year and, you know, that unknown of how much a
39:38
farmer is going to make or not going to make And because my
39:41
farm is at a lower altitude, then this other Farm.
39:45
My coffee is automatically, you know, not as good even though I
39:49
may have an, you know, really good practices and I'm, you
39:55
know, picking it properly and storing it properly and taking
39:57
care of it and doing all these things correctly, and another
39:59
Farm, isn't there just in a better location.
40:02
So why are they rewarded more? You know, for my, for my ex
40:06
additional hard work and that most farmers Would rather get
40:11
paid less if it meant, they got paid consistently and they knew
40:15
how much they were going to get paid every year.
40:18
And it was a really interesting perspective to read it from that
40:21
side of. Like I never really thought
40:23
about it. That way, you know, like yeah,
40:27
you should get, you know, the coffee has a value better
40:30
coffee. You get more, just like anything
40:32
else has value better quality, it's worth more, but kind of
40:36
who's to tell you what, that quality is, why are we just
40:38
arbitrarily assigning numbers to things because they taste a
40:43
certain way or don't taste a certain way, right?
40:45
Why are certain flavors prized over other flavors?
40:48
And I think kind of with the transparency and a push towards
40:52
sustainability and wanting Help these Farms out.
40:56
I hope that there's a change. I don't, I don't know what that
41:00
would look like, but I hope that we can continue to evolve and
41:05
develop as an industry and make sure that those Farms, but all
41:08
the Farms are taken care of. Not just the ones who have the
41:11
resources to put themselves on social media, right?
41:16
There's tons of farms that aren't able to do that or
41:19
because they don't have the resources or they just don't
41:21
know what they're doing, you know, there's Farms where
41:23
everybody that works on. Farm is 50 plus like they're not
41:28
going to know how to make tick tocks or you know, post on
41:31
Instagram or Twitter or whatever it is.
41:33
So I hope that there's especially for the people who
41:37
are like buying and importing and kind of the main connection
41:41
between our side and the farm side that we can come up with a
41:47
new system of how to make sure that all these farmers are taken
41:50
care of, while still highlighting and giving credit
41:54
to those Farms. At are going above and beyond
41:56
the are creating that new coffee, special coffee different
42:00
coffee. And it's not just like a third,
42:03
what we would call a third world countries that are living year
42:07
to year as Farmers or subsequent subsistence substance.
42:11
I can't say the word I'll get there, but it's not, that's an
42:16
American farming as well. Like you're kind of living on
42:18
the float because you are producing a product and in the
42:22
United States they've developed a system of Government subsidies
42:26
which helped sustain Farms, arguably Better or Worse,
42:30
depending on your perspective on where you are in that chain and
42:34
how sustainable it is for the future.
42:36
Now, that we are so much more connected in the demand for
42:39
coffee is growing, seemingly exponentially year-over-year.
42:43
We're much more aware of and because of social media, true, I
42:47
mean in the internet we are much more aware of the conditions on
42:50
the farms. And so it's like I think this is
42:52
a good thing, but it's becoming more difficult.
42:54
To just blindly drink a cup of coffee and not think about where
42:57
it came from, you know, that people still do.
42:59
But I do think that is more of a challenge.
43:02
I'm wondering before we, we kind of get too far if there's
43:07
anything that I didn't ask you about, I know we had some
43:10
internet troubles, truly apologize for that.
43:12
But is there anything that I didn't ask you about that?
43:14
You want people to know about the business or about you or
43:17
about your journey that we should get two.
43:19
I think just the biggest thing is I'm so passionate about
43:23
coffee and I've always been passionate About helping people.
43:25
And, you know, I used to do those packaging events and
43:29
that's really that mentality and mindset has really stuck with me
43:32
of helping others. And so, being a consultant and
43:36
being able to kind of combine, those two things has been a
43:39
really amazing opportunity and one that I never thought I would
43:43
have an opportunity to do so, you know, if you need help with
43:47
your business, like I'm I'm looking out for you, I want you
43:50
to succeed, I want you to have the best product possible,
43:53
whether you're trying to To improve your roasts or, you
43:57
know, open a shop or whatever it may be.
44:00
Let's do it. Let's get to work.
44:01
Let's do it. Together being a coffee
44:03
consultant, being able to do that and to help people improve
44:07
their business improve their coffee.
44:08
And, you know, succeed is something that I really enjoy
44:11
and really love if there's somebody out there who, you
44:15
know, needs a little bit of guidance or help, like, let me
44:18
help you. Let's work together.
44:19
Let's, you know, whether it's education because you want to
44:23
start roasting or you're roasting and I know more about
44:26
what's going on in The Roaster, the seed to cut process.
44:28
Like I love just chatting about coffee to talking to people and
44:33
learning what they're doing and and stuff like that.
44:35
And I just find it so fun. And so enjoyable, this is like
44:39
my unsolicited thought as we've been talking today, I've been
44:42
thinking about this but you could also be a consultant for
44:47
people who who want to start a business.
44:49
While having a family which is Strat totally different
44:53
challenge, anyone who has a family only those that are so
44:55
much multitasking involved and it's similar to running a small
44:58
business, like you are responsible for a lot of
45:01
different things. If you were to stop at a coffee
45:05
shop somewhere, while you're out in the world, what is it that
45:08
you are ordering for yourself? When you get, what are you going
45:10
to? Get to drink?
45:12
Yeah. If I'm at like a specialty
45:15
coffee shop for the first time I would typically order a
45:19
cappuccino and whatever. If they have pour overs I'll
45:23
order a pour-over as well. If they only do like a drip,
45:27
like house Blends or video. Then I'll just get a cappuccino.
45:30
But if they have, you know, by hand pour overs available, I'll
45:35
get i'll get a partner and a cap.
45:37
How long before your kids try coffee?
45:42
Oh long, my son is now 3 and he thinks coffee is chocolate milk.
45:50
So when we drink our coffee is, I want coffee, okay?
45:54
And I go make him a chocolate milk, my Barista style
45:57
chocolate, milk of of coffee syrup and milk, and a little bit
46:01
of hot water. Very cool why I always ask
46:04
people about their first experience with coffee and some
46:06
of them go back all the way to when they were kids.
46:09
And yeah, I mean my husband is from a Latino Family, and he
46:14
drank coffee as a young kid. And and now, like Cassie does
46:18
nothing to him, okay? To recap Lily had an aha moment
46:29
on a Costa, Rican, coffee farm, that led her down, the path to a
46:32
coffee career. She is also a working mom with a
46:36
set of twins and another young, child covid cause some
46:40
logistical hiccups for Lily and her.
46:42
Lee which led her somewhat unexpectedly to this Consulting,
46:45
opportunity, covid, caused and continues to cause twists and
46:49
turns in all of our Lives. You're not alone out there if
46:52
you're making some big decisions.
46:53
And what you want out of life, work Partnerships and coffee.
46:57
I know that I am Lily was a queue grader and has learned the
47:01
in-depth skills to taste coffee. But something she said during
47:04
the interview is important. What you taste.
47:07
When you taste coffee, is what you taste there.
47:11
Aren't any wrong. Answers not really it kind of
47:14
goes back to the color concept of is the green that I see the
47:18
same as the green that you see. But in this case, do the flavor
47:22
notes of dark chocolate and nectarine taste the same to you
47:25
as they do to me in the end. The best coffee for you, is the
47:29
coffee that you like, so like what you like, and don't worry
47:32
that, that may not be what everyone says, you should like.
47:36
And finally coffee people are real people, too.
47:40
That's probably a good theme for this.
47:42
This entire season coffee, people are real.
47:44
People had two little coffee. Geek.com that is Lil L.
47:49
IL coffee geek to learn more about Lily, and what she offers
47:53
as a coffee consultant. You'll also find links on roast
47:57
westcoast.com which is where I am asking you to subscribe to
48:01
the roast West Coast News letter that accompanies.
48:03
This podcast. I'll email you every episode
48:06
with details on the show links. And while you're there, please
48:11
consider a paid subscription. Russian paid subscribers are
48:14
essential to the continued success of the show.
48:17
And I can't thank all of you enough for being part of my
48:19
coffee journey, and helping the show up, lift and grow the
48:22
coffee community at Large. Also integral to the show,
48:26
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support. Zoom bar, coffee and tea, most
48:31
your coffee company, steady-state coffee, roasting
48:34
Camp Coffee Company, ignite Coffee Company, Ascend Roasters
48:38
Coffee cycle. Roasting first light whiskey,
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Maria coffee, Cape Horn, coffee, importers and Cafe lechera.
48:45
Shout out to Joe from Cape Horn coffee importers.
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I'm not too far from you down the road right now.
48:51
I linked to the roast industry partner websites in every
48:53
newsletter, And roast westcoast.com and those links
48:57
are also right on the front page of the website follow at roast
49:01
West. Coast on Instagram for more of
49:03
my coffee adventures and a follow, my summer coffee
49:06
travels. Season 6 is on the way with an
49:09
all new slate of guests and some awesome returning experts to
49:12
help us break down all of the questions that you have about
49:15
coffee, until then, I'll be releasing some classic episodes
49:19
and updates from the road every week.
49:21
I'll take this last moment to say how grateful I am that.
49:24
I have the opportunity to talk with so many inspiring guests,
49:27
and learn so much about this drink, this product, this way of
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life that I'm passionate about and I hope to continue doing.
49:34
So for a very long time, this episode of the roast West Coast
49:38
coffee podcast is was has been written produced and recorded on
49:43
the road in the basement by me. Ryan Walt.
49:46
I hope this shows found you happy healthy and with, at least
49:50
enough sanity to make it through the day.
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For those of you headed out for a cup of coffee, I'll see you
49:54
this week, please always tip your Baristas and be sure to
49:59
drink. Good coffee.