Latest / Play Therapy Parenting: Real Parenting Questions Answered by a Child Therapist / S3E39 - Child "Stealing": Why It Happens and How to Handle It

Transcript

S3E39 - Child "Stealing": Why It Happens and How to Handle It · Play Therapy Parenting: Real Parenting Questions Answered by a Child Therapist

• 0:02
  You're listening to the Play Therapy Parenting Podcast
• 0:06
  with Dr. Brenna Hicks.
• 0:09
  Hi,
• 0:10
  I'm Dr. Brenna Hicks,
• 0:11
  The Kid Counselor.
• 0:11
  This is the Play Therapy Parenting Podcast
• 0:14
  where I give you insight,
• 0:15
  awareness,
• 0:15
  and enlightenment about your parenting
• 0:17
  and your relationship with your kids.
• 0:19
  In today's episode,
• 0:20
  I'm answering a question from Kimberly in British Columbia,
• 0:23
  Canada.
• 0:24
  Hello,
• 0:25
  Canadians.
• 0:27
  Thanks for listening and Kimberly,
• 0:28
  thank you for the question.
• 0:29
  This is about
• 0:32
  a child
• 0:32
  stealing things.
• 0:34
  And I want to tell you,
• 0:37
  maybe to reassure you,
• 0:38
  to normalize,
• 0:39
  just to get this out on the airwaves.
• 0:42
  It's one of the most consistent behaviors that parents really have a hard time with,
• 0:46
  but it's also one of the most consistent behaviors of childhood.
• 0:50
  It is extremely rare for a child to go through their entire developmental years
• 0:56
  and not steal things.
• 0:58
  So we kind of get really
• 1:01
  bothered by this and we feel like this is this massive
• 1:04
  problem and is my child going to become a kleptomaniac and,
• 1:07
  and do I need to be really concerned about the,
• 1:10
  the long term
• 1:11
  possibilities?
• 1:12
  No.
• 1:14
  It's almost always rooted in maladaptive coping.
• 1:17
  I'm going to talk about that in a second,
• 1:19
  and it's
• 1:21
  age and developmentally appropriate.
• 1:23
  So while we do need to set limits on it,
• 1:25
  and while we do need to address it,
• 1:26
  and we need to talk to children
• 1:28
  about
• 1:29
  this concept because
• 1:31
  it is wrong to steal from others,
• 1:33
  they need to understand that.
• 1:35
  We also need to not let our own emotions get in the way
• 1:39
  because this is a pretty standard part of being a kid.
• 1:43
  So,
• 1:44
  let me read parts of the email and then we will dive in.
• 1:47
  I'm hoping to get your thoughts on a behavior
• 1:48
  we've been navigating with our youngest child aged 7.
• 1:52
  We've been trying to apply the strategies we've learned
• 1:54
  from the podcast with both of our kids,
• 1:56
  and we found them really helpful.
• 1:57
  So thank you.
• 1:58
  I'm really glad,
• 1:58
  Kimberly.
• 1:59
  Thanks for letting me know that.
• 2:00
  One area we're still trying to understand is behavior related to stealing.
• 2:04
  Our youngest is taking things frequently.
• 2:06
  For example,
• 2:07
  various items from school,
• 2:08
  lost and found,
• 2:09
  money or small objects around the house,
• 2:11
  occasionally things from the office at school.
• 2:14
  This sometimes shows up with food or snacks.
• 2:17
  We've been trying to respond by validating that she wished she could have the item,
• 2:21
  stated that other people's belongings are not for taking,
• 2:23
  and tried to give her choices like choosing to look at
• 2:25
  an item or choosing to tell me about the item later.
• 2:28
  The choicest part has been tough to come up with.
• 2:31
  When it has continued,
• 2:32
  we moved to another limit,
• 2:33
  which
• 2:34
  we've told her if she chooses to take things,
• 2:36
  she's choosing to have her backpack checked when she gets home.
• 2:39
  Because she goes to daycare after school,
• 2:41
  we decided it made the most sense to do this privately at home.
• 2:44
  When something has been taken,
• 2:45
  we also follow through and have her return the item.
• 2:48
  I'm wondering whether this approach makes sense,
• 2:50
  or if there are other strategies you might suggest.
• 2:52
  I'm also curious how you make sense of taking
• 2:54
  things that don't belong from a needs perspective.
• 2:57
  We want to understand why she might be trying,
• 2:59
  what she might be trying to communicate,
• 3:01
  or what could be driving it,
• 3:02
  but we're at a loss and have obvious concerns.
• 3:05
  On the positive side,
• 3:06
  we've noticed that she's very honest and admits she takes it when asked directly.
• 3:10
  She will also confess where she stashed it.
• 3:12
  Any thoughts or guidance you might have would be really appreciated.
• 3:15
  I want to trust her,
• 3:16
  but I'm unsure how to proceed.
• 3:18
  All right.
• 3:19
  So,
• 3:19
  multiple factors here.
• 3:21
  I think it's important to
• 3:23
  try to
• 3:25
  separate them and make them distinct,
• 3:26
  but then,
• 3:26
  of course,
• 3:27
  they all work in tandem as well.
• 3:28
  So,
• 3:29
  here are my thoughts.
• 3:30
  I think first and foremost,
• 3:32
  we have to understand
• 3:33
  that
• 3:34
  there's a fantasy versus reality component with children.
• 3:37
  It's one of the most powerful components of the child-centered playroom,
• 3:41
  because
• 3:42
  we actually have a phrase,
• 3:44
  grant in fantasy what you can't grant in reality.
• 3:47
  children understand
• 3:49
  that it is wrong to steal.
• 3:51
  Kids have
• 3:53
  an innate sense of right and wrong.
• 3:56
  They have
• 3:57
  a conscience,
• 3:58
  and they know that you're not supposed to take things from other people.
• 4:03
  However,
• 4:04
  It is really hard when you are an emotional being,
• 4:07
  when you are a here and now being,
• 4:10
  and when you have a need,
• 4:11
  a wish,
• 4:11
  a feeling or a desire
• 4:13
  for whatever that is,
• 4:15
  it is really hard to talk yourself out of just
• 4:18
  taking it.
• 4:19
  Because when you want something,
• 4:21
  when you need something,
• 4:22
  when you desire something,
• 4:23
  when something seems irresistible.
• 4:26
  You don't have the logic,
• 4:28
  the reasoning,
• 4:29
  the intellect,
• 4:30
  the verbal capacity.
• 4:31
  You don't have any of the things that we do as adults.
• 4:34
  It's not like we don't look at things as adults and go,
• 4:37
  man,
• 4:37
  I wish I could have that.
• 4:39
  That that's a natural human desire.
• 4:43
  So,
• 4:44
  you know,
• 4:44
  we look at
• 4:45
  something in a store,
• 4:46
  we look at a vehicle,
• 4:47
  we look at a house,
• 4:48
  we look at
• 4:49
  flowers in the yard,
• 4:50
  we look at whatever and we're like,
• 4:52
  dang,
• 4:52
  I want that.
• 4:54
  Now,
• 4:55
  most of us,
• 4:56
  I mean,
• 4:56
  there's plenty of people that still steal as adults,
• 4:58
  but
• 4:59
  most of us.
• 5:01
  Reason abstractly through that,
• 5:02
  and we cognitively say,
• 5:04
  yeah,
• 5:05
  but you can't just take it,
• 5:06
  so we don't.
• 5:07
  But it doesn't mean the desire isn't there,
• 5:09
  it doesn't mean the impulse isn't there.
• 5:11
  Fantasy versus reality.
• 5:13
  Reality is,
• 5:13
  I can't take that,
• 5:14
  it's not mine.
• 5:15
  Fantasy is,
• 5:16
  dang,
• 5:16
  I wish I could,
• 5:17
  I'd go grab it right now.
• 5:19
  OK,
• 5:20
  so we recognize this is a pretty standard process for humans.
• 5:25
  And she doesn't have the ability
• 5:27
  to talk herself out of it.
• 5:30
  So,
• 5:31
  it's a self-control
• 5:32
  scenario.
• 5:34
  It's probably an emotional vocabulary scenario.
• 5:36
  There's a lot of why here
• 5:39
  because
• 5:39
  she doesn't developmentally,
• 5:41
  she's 7,
• 5:42
  so she doesn't developmentally have the capacity
• 5:44
  to reason abstractly.
• 5:47
  Yes,
• 5:48
  you really want that,
• 5:49
  but if you take it,
• 5:50
  you're going to get in trouble,
• 5:51
  and that's not what you want.
• 5:53
  So,
• 5:53
  no,
• 5:54
  don't take it.
• 5:55
  There,
• 5:55
  there's no reasoning that's taking place.
• 5:57
  It's,
• 5:58
  you want it,
• 5:59
  grab it.
• 5:59
  Awesome.
• 6:00
  Now you have it.
• 6:01
  This makes you feel lovely.
• 6:03
  So,
• 6:04
  we're recognizing its development.
• 6:06
  We're recognizing it's
• 6:09
  Lack of self-control.
• 6:10
  We're recognizing it's probably lack of emotional vocabulary because if
• 6:14
  she has a higher emotional vocabulary and IQ,
• 6:18
  she'll say,
• 6:19
  I'm really sad
• 6:20
  that I can't have that,
• 6:21
  or I'm sad that that's not mine,
• 6:24
  or I'm really disappointed that no one's gotten me that item yet.
• 6:29
  OK,
• 6:29
  so you can see how the feelings also play in.
• 6:33
  So the why always matters.
• 6:35
  I mean,
• 6:35
  we,
• 6:36
  we talk about that a lot clinically and
• 6:39
  from a parenting side of things.
• 6:40
  children
• 6:41
  are driven by their feelings.
• 6:44
  And it's not meant to be problematic.
• 6:48
  They just get stuck in patterns.
• 6:50
  So,
• 6:52
  when she's taking things,
• 6:53
  it's likely just because it's the fantasy versus reality concept.
• 6:57
  It's also
• 6:59
  The lack of some of those other things that we've just discussed.
• 7:03
  When you validate that she really wished that she could have had the item,
• 7:07
  that's very powerful.
• 7:08
  Oh,
• 7:09
  you,
• 7:09
  you really would like to have that.
• 7:10
  You really wish that was yours.
• 7:12
  You would love to have that.
• 7:15
  You wish
• 7:16
  so and so.
• 7:16
  We're trying to always validate.
• 7:18
  Then the neutral limit,
• 7:20
  other people's things are never for taking.
• 7:23
  OK,
• 7:23
  so that's very on target as well.
• 7:25
  And then you can choose to look at an item or
• 7:28
  you can choose to tell me about the item later.
• 7:29
  All right,
• 7:30
  here's where it's going a little bit asunder.
• 7:33
  And you would not acknowledged the choicest part has been tough.
• 7:36
  So I understand this is always the hardest part of a limit.
• 7:39
  If
• 7:40
  your daughter really wants.
• 7:43
  I don't know,
• 7:44
  ice cream.
• 7:45
  I don't know what,
• 7:46
  I don't know where she would steal ice cream,
• 7:48
  but
• 7:48
  she really wants a toy.
• 7:50
  She really wants ice cream.
• 7:51
  She really wants a pencil.
• 7:52
  She really wants whatever it is.
• 7:54
  And you say you can choose to look at it,
• 7:56
  or you can choose to tell me about it later.
• 7:59
  That does not meet the need.
• 8:01
  The need is,
• 8:02
  I really want that.
• 8:05
  Looking at it,
• 8:06
  she doesn't get it.
• 8:07
  Telling you about it,
• 8:08
  she doesn't get it.
• 8:10
  And keep in mind this is important for all of us.
• 8:13
  When we give alternatives,
• 8:14
  when we provide choices tied to a limit,
• 8:17
  it goes back to meeting the child's need,
• 8:19
  feeling,
• 8:20
  want,
• 8:20
  desire.
• 8:22
  So if she wants
• 8:24
  a pencil,
• 8:25
  if she wants a toy,
• 8:26
  if she wants ice cream,
• 8:28
  if she wants
• 8:29
  popcorn,
• 8:30
  whatever it is.
• 8:32
  The choices have to map back to that,
• 8:34
  so
• 8:36
  throwing out an option.
• 8:38
  You can choose to
• 8:40
  use some of your allowance money
• 8:42
  and buy.
• 8:44
  That pencil
• 8:46
  Or a pencil like it.
• 8:48
  Or you can choose to wait until the weekend
• 8:51
  and you can choose to
• 8:53
  get ice cream with us on Saturday.
• 8:56
  And I'm throwing out if it was a pencil or ice cream,
• 8:58
  different choices,
• 8:59
  but
• 8:59
  you can understand
• 9:01
  the goal is
• 9:02
  that we're trying as much as possible for her to be able to actually get the item,
• 9:06
  but get it appropriately.
• 9:08
  So she might have to work for it.
• 9:09
  She might have to pay for it.
• 9:10
  She might have to delay
• 9:12
  the instant gratification need.
• 9:14
  You can have ice cream,
• 9:15
  you just can't have ice cream today.
• 9:18
  So,
• 9:19
  the choice is always going to be tied into the need.
• 9:22
  That's really important for it to be effective.
• 9:25
  OK,
• 9:25
  so then you're moving into an ultimate limit.
• 9:27
  Also very appropriate.
• 9:29
  High five,
• 9:29
  Kimberly,
• 9:30
  on,
• 9:30
  on your execution of the CCPT stuff here.
• 9:33
  So,
• 9:33
  it continued.
• 9:34
  You set the limit several times,
• 9:36
  the behavior continued.
• 9:37
  We move to ultimate limit now,
• 9:39
  which is exactly what you did.
• 9:41
  If you choose to continue to take things that don't belong to you,
• 9:43
  you're choosing for us to search your backpack when you get home from school.
• 9:47
  If you choose not to take things that don't belong to you,
• 9:49
  you choose for us not to look in your backpack.
• 9:52
  OK.
• 9:53
  And so now
• 9:55
  we recognize that she has made a choice.
• 9:58
  She has continued to take things,
• 9:59
  so now she's choosing for you to check her bag.
• 10:02
  There's accountability here.
• 10:04
  I think that that is an appropriate
• 10:07
  approach.
• 10:08
  In a temporary
• 10:10
  scenario.
• 10:11
  Here's what I mean.
• 10:13
  Your very last line
• 10:14
  is where I'm
• 10:15
  circling back to.
• 10:16
  I want to trust her.
• 10:19
  She needs to believe that you trust her.
• 10:22
  Because right now
• 10:24
  the implication is
• 10:25
  you've chosen to continue to do this,
• 10:27
  so I don't actually trust you
• 10:29
  and your actions have consequences.
• 10:31
  And so you chose for me to search your bag.
• 10:34
  That is a very powerful lesson.
• 10:36
  She doesn't like that you search her bag.
• 10:37
  I can guarantee it.
• 10:38
  She doesn't like the feeling that you don't trust her.
• 10:41
  I guarantee that too.
• 10:43
  But
• 10:43
  that's the consequence of the choice that she has made.
• 10:46
  So she is living with the natural consequence of her decisions.
• 10:50
  You chose to continue to take things that don't belong to you.
• 10:53
  So now you've chosen for us not to trust you and to search your stuff.
• 10:57
  OK,
• 10:57
  but that has to be a temporary
• 11:00
  scenario.
• 11:01
  It can't be forever
• 11:02
  because she will never learn to self-regulate.
• 11:05
  She will never learn to self-control.
• 11:07
  She will never learn that you do in fact trust her.
• 11:10
  She will never learn to not take things.
• 11:14
  On her own,
• 11:15
  because right now
• 11:17
  she might not take things
• 11:19
  because,
• 11:19
  well,
• 11:20
  I'm gonna get caught because mom's gonna look in my backpack when I get home.
• 11:24
  Well,
• 11:24
  that's external motivation,
• 11:26
  not internal motivation.
• 11:28
  We want her to get to a point where she says,
• 11:31
  I really want that,
• 11:32
  but
• 11:33
  I know better
• 11:34
  and
• 11:35
  I'm going to
• 11:36
  get that need met a different way.
• 11:39
  That's going to come from within,
• 11:41
  not from without.
• 11:43
  So what you've chosen to do can really make sense,
• 11:45
  but it needs to be
• 11:47
  dialed down,
• 11:49
  and I think there's probably going to need to be a conversation in the near future.
• 11:53
  OK,
• 11:54
  for a while,
• 11:54
  you chose to continue to take things and you chose for us to look in your bag
• 11:59
  so that we could make sure that
• 12:00
  something needs to be returned.
• 12:02
  It was going to be returned.
• 12:04
  You know that taking other things from people
• 12:07
  and they don't belong to you.
• 12:09
  is not what we do.
• 12:11
  You know that other people's things are not for taking.
• 12:15
  I'm trusting you
• 12:17
  that
• 12:17
  you're going to choose not to take things that don't belong to you.
• 12:22
  And then
• 12:24
  set that expectation,
• 12:26
  set the tone that you're not going to check the bag
• 12:28
  and see what happens.
• 12:30
  And if you realize at some point that something has been taken again,
• 12:34
  then we revisit the ultimate limit.
• 12:36
  But what we're trying to do
• 12:38
  is express to your daughter,
• 12:41
  I have faith in you.
• 12:42
  I believe in you.
• 12:43
  I trust you,
• 12:45
  and I know you're capable
• 12:47
  of not taking things that aren't yours.
• 12:50
  On the other end of it,
• 12:51
  we're implying,
• 12:52
  I don't trust you.
• 12:53
  I don't think you can handle this.
• 12:54
  I'm going to govern your behavior.
• 12:56
  I'm gonna make sure that things get returned if you take them.
• 12:59
  That's putting all of the onus and responsibility
• 13:01
  and burden for this whole issue on you.
• 13:04
  We want it to be on her.
• 13:06
  That's self responsibility.
• 13:08
  That's the whole premise.
• 13:10
  So Kimberly,
• 13:11
  I hope that that's helpful.
• 13:12
  The fact that she's honest,
• 13:14
  the fact that she admits it,
• 13:15
  the fact that she tells you where it is,
• 13:17
  she's not
• 13:19
  trying to be a thief.
• 13:20
  She's not trying to be
• 13:22
  underhanded and sneaky and like
• 13:25
  this is a pattern of behavior and it's to get a need met,
• 13:28
  but she,
• 13:29
  she doesn't have a burning desire to steal things.
• 13:32
  That's very clearly evidenced by the fact that she says,
• 13:34
  Yeah,
• 13:34
  I took it.
• 13:35
  It's right there,
• 13:36
  and then she gives it back.
• 13:37
  So,
• 13:38
  this is not a big picture dilemma.
• 13:42
  This is a small picture dilemma.
• 13:43
  This is age appropriate.
• 13:45
  And I think the way that you're handling it is on target.
• 13:47
  A couple of tweaks.
• 13:48
  I think it'll make it a little bit more helpful.
• 13:51
  And I hope that that's helpful to everybody
• 13:53
  because there's not a parent on this planet
• 13:55
  that has not known that a child of theirs has taken something at some point,
• 13:59
  and we stay neutral,
• 14:00
  we stay calm,
• 14:02
  we don't react,
• 14:03
  we don't let our emotions get in the way,
• 14:05
  we don't lecture,
• 14:06
  we don't berate,
• 14:07
  we don't get upset.
• 14:09
  We would always choose that our children
• 14:12
  would do the right thing.
• 14:14
  And when a child chooses to do something that they know they're not supposed to do,
• 14:18
  there's a consequence to that,
• 14:19
  but beyond that,
• 14:20
  we don't have skin in the game.
• 14:22
  Like I would have chosen for you not to take it and I
• 14:24
  would have chosen for you not to have to have your backpack searched.
• 14:27
  But that's what you chose,
• 14:29
  and there's neutrality in that.
• 14:32
  So,
• 14:32
  no reaction on our part.
• 14:33
  That will help naturally diffuse it and it will naturally
• 14:36
  sort itself out as you continue to work through it.
• 14:38
  So,
• 14:39
  again,
• 14:39
  Kimberly,
• 14:39
  thank you for the question.
• 14:41
  Thank you for all of you that have emailed me.
• 14:43
  I'm working through the questions,
• 14:44
  I promise.
• 14:44
  If you'd like to reach out,
• 14:45
  please do.renna at the kidcounselor.com.
• 14:48
  I love y'all.
• 14:48
  We'll talk again soon.
• 14:49
  Bye.
• 14:51
  Thank you for listening to
• 14:52
  the Play Therapy Parenting Podcast with Dr. Brenna Hicks.
• 14:56
  For more episodes and just subscribe to our newsletter,
• 14:59
  please go to www.playtherapyparenting.com.